And with that for the Sewn Salisbury Show continues. I get to talk to him twice in two days. What a treat this is.
And Clint Hurdle, former Pittsburgh Pirate, taking the playoffs hadn't been in two decades as the manager, longtime player in Major League Baseball and obviously took the Colorado Rockies twenty one to twenty two back in two thousand and seven to get them to the World Series, joins us now and we're grateful to have him on and we'll discuss his new book.
Clint, great to have you on. Brother.
Let me start real quick. This Astros team, Let's hit this one first. They've had a hell of a run the last seven or eight years of you know, dominating divisions and putting themselves in position. People are already starting to panic because they're averaging a run, running a half a game, and they're not driving and runs and leaving people in scoring position. What do you say to somebody five games in do we use the it's early or is it the optics from last year to this year
seemed too obvious and too much the same. How quickly do you know that, oh we got to change something when you're a manager of a team that's struggling offensively.
On Good Morning, Sean. It's a great question, it's a good baseball question, and it's fair, And I think that's when it comes down to, you know, the general manager's feel and the manager's feel, the conversations they're having, what they're seeing. Sometimes, as we've learned through a lot of the analytics that have been brought to the table, what we perceive that we see with our eyes may not be happening the same way when the numbers are presented to us. The fact that it's a short sample size
is something to be taken into consideration. At the same time, you just mentioned if it's the same existing challenges that we're being manifested through the last season, all right, did our adjustments play out over the season? Do we undercorrect? Do we overcorrect? Normally we would look at the season in twenty game increments at least the places I've been
and total evaluation a quarter the way through. So after twenty games is when we would sit down the general manager, myself, his posse, and the coaching staff and say, Okay, what are we doing well? What are we not doing well? What do we need more of what do we need less of and go from there.
Clint, you know this early in the season, you know, manager in his second year, Joe spot of people are trying to make an impact. New players, a new right fielder in Camp Smith, a'l two base move, a lot of changes that we'll get to about this Astros team. But when you're just five games in, is there a tendency or should you as a manager do you micro it or do you say let's let it breathe for
that twenty game increment and then we'll adjust. How do you from immersing yourself too much into it and letting the players think, oh, my manager started to panic as well?
Well, this is where this is where the elite coaches and managers that they make the difference. It's where Andy Reid makes a difference. You know, It's where Joe Tory, Bobby Cox used to make a difference. It's where right now, you know we talked yesterday that Dave Robertson makes a difference. It's that touch and feel of do you go all inclusive. If you're going to give a message, do you give it to the team, not holding a team meeting. But
maybe it's something you prepped before your scout meeting. Hey, here's some observation to watch you guys to think about these give me some feedback. Do you go one on one? Do you deploy your coaches in their areas to have a couple of conversations with maybe a couple of individuals. One of the things that helped our process along the way, especially in Pittsburgh, is we put together what I called it was a you know, as a player leadership council
team whatever. I had the players pick like five guys on the team that would represent the team during challenges and opportunities, and we would meet try me twice a month, and this would be a time where I still wouldn't I still wouln't push too many buttons out five games, then I'd give it. I'd give it some time. I'd give it two weeks and then maybe pull in some of these veteran players and say, what do you see? What do you feel? What's the noise out there? You
don't want to be roam in the halls. You don't want to be in the clubhouse all the time. You got to give these guys space and time to breathe.
Clint Hurdle former manager. He've been to the World Series. Longtime manager, was once labeled the phenom when he was came up with Kansas City Royals and seeing a lot of great baseball and his obviously got his new book out. Hurdleisms went in Wisdom from a lifetime in Baseball. Why I write this book? What was the motivation and the expectations of it?
My man, Well, the motivation, you know, it was number one. It's to try and help. It's gonna be a helper. I spent ten years, in nine years in Pittsburgh and the fingerprints of Fred Rodgers are all over that city. And I'm old enough to have watched the show. And I'm not trying to be sat here sentimental, but Fred Rodgers did a crazy number of things really well. He was all inclusive back when most people were. He was
kind all the time when most people weren't. And I thought, my sharing my experiences, my struggles, my challenges, my you know, my mountains and my valleys, that maybe I could provide some help to somebody else on a similar journey. That was the reason for the book. And now as the feedback i'm getting it is, I'm glad I wrote the book. There are people that are reaching out. Male female, young old. I went and mailed some stuff in the post office
here on the island yesterday. And the young female behind the message the counter goes, I'm sixty pages into your book and I'm like, I didn't. How do you know I wrote a book? You know, this is my way. She goes, well, you've been mailing them out the last two weeks, you know, to the people. And she goes, I just decided to buy one and read it. She goes, this is really, really good. I'm learning so much about you. I didn't know. She goes, Clinn, I'm glad you wrote the book. When they that's just.
You know, that's from nowhere right when they open the book.
I mean, I's got to be great satisfaction, maybe cathartic for you too, in a great feeling of getting this out. I know that, Hell, you're sober. Now, what's it been twenty five years? Clinton, twenty five years sober? Yeah, twenty twenty five years, twenty six years. So when we open this book for somebody who may not know your past or doesn't know where you're going in the future, and they open this book, if you could say there's one thing I want them to learn.
What would it be?
Ask for help? Ask for help. You know, we we see there's images that are created in our daily life, and you know, in the sports scene the images. You see a lot of images at the end where somebody's holding a Super Bowl trophy, somebody's holding a World Serious trophy, and those are good, but not everybody can identify with those. I can't even identify with one of those. Have been a three World Series, it's finished second three times. I
never get to hold the trophy, yep. But what people can I believe, identify with and relate to is authentic challenge, just real disappointments, maybe some hard times along the way, some failures, and then to see somebody that's gotten through them. Because I went from a guy, as we talked about yesterday, I had two divorces, I had two DUIs and tenures. And I'm not bragging, I'm just calling myself out. There
wasn't a lot of trust. There was. You know, this was a guy that well, you hope you catch him on a good day. Later on, I had two major league organizations put me in charge of billion dollar operations to run the team from the dugout, and they're not just gonna do that unless they see something in somebody that's there's influence, there's integrity, there's positivity, you know, there's honesty. So I had to re I had to change myself.
I had to change from the inside out. And I think that's my hope, along with you know, the sharing of the experiences for other people to know that it's never too late to start a new beginning with what's con has.
Gone right With all the players you've been around and not only played, but coached and managed and led all the situations you've been in, is transparency an overwhelming trait to being I guess close to whether it's the players in the seventies or players that times have changed as we well know, is transparency important still or are players even looking past that now?
I think it's still. I think it's a superpower. I think it's probably more more necessary now than ever before, cause there's so many distractions.
Right.
The world's a hard place to live in. You know, you look at your upbringing. We can get on a bike, we could ride down on a park, we could play from nine till five. We could pack about you know about brown bag lunch, you could do things that really
are much harder to do today. And that being said, the authenticity of you being you in front of these people and being vulnerable for day Brown, I've read every one of her books, and who would have thought so, We would have told me, a female is going to crack your shield like you've never had a crack by reading your books. This woman has cracked my shield about vulnerability,
and I think that's a superpower as well. There's no game, there's no leverage, there's no you're not trying to win anything. You're actually just trying to help that person in front of you, who's the most important person in the world. Right then to put them in a position where they can have some success, where they can have some fun.
And find joy in that. Clint Hurdle Hurdleisms is the book Wit and Wisdom from a lifetime in baseball, longtime manager, player in Major League Baseball, been around it for about four or five decades. Joins us here for a couple more minutes. Some baseball stuff is analytics. Do we use it too much?
Now? Have we lost some of the field for baseball?
Yes, sir, I would say not everywhere, but some places, yes, And I think one of the situations I think we all probably picked up on probably five years ago. It was in my d my last year in Pittsburgh. We were on the cutting edge initially in the analytics in eleven and twelve were front runners with a RAIS, but then everybody caught up, and then people with more assets
can obviously do more things right. So everybody's got the same information where you were finding ways to win on the margins, whether there's strength to your coaching staff, the intelligence your coaching staff, your gut feel of your players, your catching positioning, all those things that has all been
struck down where everybody can get the same information. Now it's how you filter it down to your coaches and then finding coaches that can filter it and make it, you know, in small bites for the players, it can be overwhelming. We've taken the heart out of some situations. I believe we don't talk about the art of hitting, the art of pitching anymore. It's it's it's velocity, it's it's rock throwing, and it's spinning, you know, skipping rocks
looking for spin. Adding A guy made a comment the other day, you know, there's times when you need to back off hitting the ball out of the park and look for a little less. I mean when that kind of comment now that becomes revolutionary, that shows you the swing we've made in our game from an offense. That's just common sense, right. You only get three strikes. If you got two in a situation needs a ball in play, you need to do something to put the ball in play.
So we have used them. I think some teams have used them better than others. Some teams are using them better than us, and I think some teams are still in that vacuum where it's a short space and it's a screen and you're just cutting the heart out of the game and the player.
Okay, So I walk up to you and I say, this torpedo bat, what the hell is going on? What's your answer?
I would say, give it a try. One thing I always we every year, Sean, we have bat companies that come through the clubhouse. And I saw these guys this spring and the guy grabbed me. He goes, hey, you've always been one to ask questions. He goes, want you to look in our bat. I said, I've heard about the bat, I've never grabbed one, so I felt it and he goes, you know, here's the design. There was
a young physicist. He's now coach with the Yankees. He told me the whole story, and he goes, we're just trying to find a way to pack more wood in the area where the player individually hits.
The ball most.
And I go, what a concept. Yeah, you know, it's one thing we've never changed with the bat, really is the barrel. We've changed knobs, all different kind of knobs available, but we've done much with the bat other than maybe the barrel's a little slender, it's a little thicker. But this is revolutionary. He told me the reason why. I go, that's interesting. And I encouraged some of our guys that were there in the Major League clubhouse. He grab some of those bets. You get your hand, give it a shot,
just trying to get none to lose. Right, here's the hard part. Vision, I mean, tradition can be a vision killer. When I picked it up, it was different. Okay, a matter of fact, you know, ten years ago I said, this is weird. Weird isn't the good word he used. This is different because of the distribution of the weight. Even I think Bellinger said the more weight. There was more weight towards closer the barrel, so the bat felt lighter, which in my mind makes it better. The bat feels lighter,
I can get it through quicker. There's been a lot of comments made. The specifications are all major league, you know, regulated, they're fine. I also still believe give this time to play out. The numbers are kind of crazy hot coming out. But Pat Murphy, the master the Brewers, the guy that I love. I got that I I you know, I can identify with, He says, I don't care what kind of wand you got. It's the magician that makes the wand work. So there's got to be some hit ability.
These guys that are doing some things now they've shown you a believe to do the best. But it's an interesting concept. I tipped my hat to the young man that came up with a thought for the Yankees were putting them in play, and now some of the other teams giving a shot.
You were taken, and that one that they use.
If you got a pitcher that's got pressed, the digitation, a little slide of hand, it's tough to put the battle the ball lithmatics.
Well, we're going to find out.
We're gonna find this week schemes I hope will pitch against the Yankees at Pittsburgh. That will be a high end lit assess.
Okay, right, we'll see what happens to that on both sides, no doubt about it. Before I let you go, my man, what if? What if somebody calls you up fifty games in and wants you to go manage? Are you is that door closed or you still open to it? Because you have been a fixer and hugely impactful on teams you've been with. Is the ship sailed or is it still open? Like Tito, like Bruce? Are you still open to it the ship?
The ship hasn't sailed. I would never say never. I've just learned in my life experiences that you know the next opportunity. You know. Kelly McGregor, we talked about Kelly right, yep, yesterday. Kelly mcgrave was a president of Rockies. He told me one thing. When I set in the manager's desk the first time he goes plan as lung. As God wants you in that chair, no man can move you out. And when God doesn't like you that chair, no man can keep you there. So I'm wide open shop the
phone range and it doesn't. I'm pretty good right here. I'm loving life. But I would I would answer.
The call so I can stand on a mountaintop and say, Clint Hurdles available. So that's a good thing. Ed he can still write books. Will there be a second book?
Clint? You thinking about working on number two?
I've already just started scribbling again. We'll see.
Well that means there'll be a number two, and we can't wait. Brother, keep sending those emails and keeps sending that motivation, and you're always welcome here, my man. Enjoy your day. Appreciate you going back to back with me, and we'll do it plenty more times. Thanks, my man. The book is Hurdleism's wit and wisdom from a lifetime in baseball. You get it on Amazon dot com or wherever you find your books, and it is awesome.
I appreciate you, brother, Thank.
You, Thank you. Sean.
I'm go with you two.
One of my favorite dudes on the planet, similar stories in different ways.
He is a special man.