81 - Macha Schiavone

So at the last very south . But I can't tell you much because when I was 19 , I moved out to England , to UK , and I moved out to London . I've been living like 12 years there and then I moved out to Spain . I can't tell you much , to be honest , because you know like I've been living like 12 years there and then I moved out to Spain .

I can't tell you much , to be honest , because you know like I've been . I remember like seven , eight year max . You know I just enjoyed with motorbikes and having fun with that with friends at school , but not much , to be honest you know , when was the real fun ?

when the 19 years old , I moved out , I went to UK and was like I used to grew up in a small village down in Italy and I couldn't see much to be honest , like 10 000 people living here , which now I'm living in . I came back to be honest and so for me it was like a blow on my mind when I went to live in london .

Really , then that's when I discovered basically my , my passion for tattoos , you know yeah , awesome , everything came together in london .

You know , it's a kind of funny , a strange situation , because I used to be I used to be a general manager in a sushi place , in a sushi restaurant in london , and I remember in soho , I was in in Broadway Street in Soho and I remember like every single night there was a guy , was a man , a guy , whatever , he used to come and buy those you know sushi

from us and this guy had a unique style . It was so cool . It was , you know , it had that aura that he had . It was amazing . So then I discovered it was . It was Dante , which is . I discovered he was uh , uh , it was dante which is the owner from free street , uh , in london you know the studio , free street . Yeah , yeah . So it was dante .

This guy was coming to . It was , and I wanted to know what is this guy doing . And then , you know , talking and chatting , he said you know , I own a studio just around the corner , blah , blah , blah .

So I went there and stefano from free street tattooed me the first flesh of sailor jerry , which is , and then from from that time it was just like no stop . I started getting flesh of sailor jerry flashes all over and I just fell in love , you know , and that's it nice .

jerry and it's out now as of the airing of this podcast . It is out um incredible book uh you know just some amazing stories and photos in here . You obviously got a love for , say , the jerry . Yeah . What do you think about his legacy when it comes to traditional tattoos ?

to

respect

as much as I can and giving opinion . You know , for for as much as I as I breathe and leave the tattoo world and Sailor Jerry within , I think Sailor Jerry is what made tattoos and traditional tattoos known all around the world .

It was that the spark that said , you know , like traditional tattoos are cool and everybody started getting tattooed because you know , when he came up with those , uh , I don't know how many flesh sheets , uh , those were the first tattoos . They were , you know , pretty much aesthetically very nice and liked by anyone .

I mean nobody could say you know , I don't like it , you know because before that it was different , different style and you know , it was really good at really really good at drawing and painting . So it was like boom . It was like , I think , like he upgraded like a thousand percent what was done before . He made it for everyone and worldwide known .

So that was the . That was the thing , I think it's an interesting conversation we're having .

like it . You know what I mean's . It's , it's , it's so fucking cool man absolutely

, and I think .

You know , I mean , you see , like trends come and go , but traditional tattoos are always there because they are like they are forever . You know , like , I don't know , it's just something about it that keeps them alive all the time .

Um , so , kind of you know , tell us about the , the account and how it all came together so , yeah , I have much to say to be honest , but I'll try to be quick .

tool , that was my phone . So I start digging on instagram and , of course , the first things that came up they were those big names of tattooing . You know , I remember chad koplinger and me , mike rubendahl , all those guys , they were killing it already .

But then , you know , as I start digging , I've seen so many uh , younger guys and new guys that they were . They were putting like some very cool uh tattoos , but you know they had no fame or you know they weren't known because at the time it was not easy to to , to stand out from the crowd because there was no instagram .

I mean , instagram was at those early stages , they were only magazine and it was a different way of growing uh , within the time . So I said you know what I'm gonna ? I'm gonna start sharing tattoos . And then once I shared a tattoo of a very big , uh , big tattoo , like big , uh , big name and he said you know what ?

I don't like my , my tattoos to being on other people's page . Just please don't share it anymore . So I said you know what ? I'm gonna start sharing tattoos from those guys . They deserve some , you know , like they do they .

They put in like very nice work , but they don't have their recognition at the moment and you know that that from that time it just picked up and starting to start growing non-stop . To be honest , nice , you know funny things . At the beginning it used to be I used Nice , you know funny things .

At the beginning I used to kind of get , I used to get a lot of hate because at the beginning with me and with my page , there were so many pages that started with me but all those pages they were charging tattooers to post tattoos on those platforms . Really yeah , yeah yeah , and I never done that . So the tattoo industry was a little bit upset .

They were hating on those pages . They were benefiting whatever they were making money out of the tattooers . So yeah , I kind of got a lot of hate for that because I wasn't posting like I'm not charging guys , whatever . I don't sell posts . I think I did sometimes , but the truth was that people were thinking about my page like everybody else was doing .

You know , yeah . But then you know , after you know , after some years , I even thought , like you know , those were the same people that used to pay magazine to be advertising those magazines , you know . So then you know , I don't know , it's a strange world , I can't have a proper opinion about it . But you know .

There's people who are like-minded , like you , who get it , and it's all about the art and the trade and the craft and the promotion and the

collaboration . And then there's people who might not necessarily get it and promote it from like uh , you know , like the way a major label would pay a radio station to put their band on yeah , you know what I mean . It's like .

It's like there's people who just don't get it , who are always just gonna try that like hey , maybe I can buy my way into this , yeah yeah , yeah , I mean , I understand .

Um , then you get it , you get it and you get why you know so many things are like this . They are meant to be like that and are not meant to be , to be changed . You know , and sometimes it's not about gatekeeping , sometimes it's about the love and passion for the craft and you don't want that to go away .

The magic behind tattooing , you know , and , yeah , if you know it , you know it . Magic behind tattooing , you know . Yeah , if you know it , you know it . And not many people get to know that and get to understand and they just , you know , they see what they see and they say you know that's gatekeeping and it's not like that . You know .

right now .

You know diving into , you know a specific style , loving the style , doing the research of why a style is like that . You know , not just taking it and copying it and paste . You know it's a . It's a very deep conversation , but I think I think it's important to make some differences . You know , again , my opinion .

I would think , if I mean if I would have to do , I would do my research . I would think about you know all the , if I have any studio around that I can go and get an apprenticeship or how you call that , and you know I would do things in the right way .

I mean it's , it's if , at the end of the day , if you want to tattoo , if you want to put a design on the skin , you can do that , you know . But there's much more about that . You know you want to be a tattoo artist or you want to be a tattooer , whatever . But if you really fell in love with tattoos and you it's you can't avoid that , you know .

Because if you fell in love with the craft , you're gonna go through the history . It's impossible not to go .

If you fell in love with the first thing you're gonna do , you're gonna start digging into history and then you're gonna start thinking about coloman , bob , showbert green , you know , like a bar chef and all the sailors , and then it's impossible not to fall in love . And then , when you're gonna fall in love , I think it's like it's mad , it's gonna come , it's .

It's a , it's a path that you're gonna . You don't know it , you're gonna take it . You know't know it , you're going to take it , you know . Then there is another way . If you don't fall in love with tattoo , I think , and the only thing you want is to look cool and to get some tattoos and make a couple of bucks here and there .

Then , of course , you know your path is the one to go on Amazon , buy a machine and start scratching people inside the kitchen . You know , yeah , yeah yeah . It's organic . You know the good way , the good path . I think it's organic , you don't think about it , and the love and passion I think it will feed your path and you can't avoid that , you know .

You know a lot of like NBA players , you know football players , stuff like that , that can kind of you know , basically afford to do a process like that . But there's also , you know , kind of going into what we're talking about with gatekeeping .

There's that whole kind of old school mentality of you know you should be present when you're getting tattooed , so where do you , where do you sit on on that ?

Then you go to Spain , you go to Madrid , you get it from Vara , and then you jump to Barcelona , you get it from Rafa , and then you know Ferrara and whatever . So then you collect those .

So there is no point for me to each day , but it's no point for me to just sit on a chair and get on the stage and get all the boys because you know that's the good thing is to you know . I can tell you , I remember when I've done this one that I was there and there and there , and then you know when I've done this .

So you collect tattoos and at same time , experience , and with different tattoo artists , different experience , know . So that's a good thing . It's not just drawing on your body , it's not that .

here , is , I thought , since we have you on , you've obviously got your ear to the ground , you've got the platform , You've got the page .

You know , you know a lot of great tattooers out there and you know with know a lot of great tattooers out there and you know , with Sailor Jerry and their platform and the book coming out , I just thought it would be a really cool thing to maybe highlight like five traditional tattooers that are doing some work that you think is great or that people should know

about and follow , and if they've got an Instagram , we'll make sure to link it in the episode bio . So who are some some tattoo artists out there that you really that you really like ? I mean ?

it . I mean it's just you , friend Francesco Ferraro , who's killing it . Yeah , completely killing it . I mean it's just you know . Go watch on Instagram and see what he's doing . You know he's worth his picks by himself . You know , like Sailor Jerry used to say , he's a badass .

uh , you know , multiple things going at once and it's a really cool follow . So absolutely , that's , that's a great one . Francesco is no ipad .

He owns the studio Chica Pantera . I think Rafa , it's my age , I guess he's 35 years old , and , like Francesco , he already has done so much and he has his own twist of traditional tattooing and it's special man , like he's got something . I mean he's got like an extra . I think he's got an extra . I don't know how he does it .

He always comes up with the flesh and design that are like they make you go like whoa . You know where did he come from you ?

Well , I mean barra in madrid Madrid , I think , is the big boss , absolutely . Do you know Bara from Madrid ? No , so I think Bara is like I don't know if it's 50 now , 50 or 48 , I don't know how old is he ? but he's definitely older than me , pretty much . So it's an absolute master .

Really , go check him out , because that guy it's a , it's a I don't know .

I love what he does and uh , you know that when you told to people like , at least in europe and even in um in the states , when I told to my friend , if , when you go like , tell me one tattooer who , I mean if you would have to say one tattooer at the moment , like that's traditionally they all go like barra , barra , barra , barra , barra .

So , and you know what , and it's um , as rafa , and uh , and francesco barrett's another guy that is always charming , he's always smiling , he's always happy to help . It's like an amazing person . So I consider that too . When I , when you know , when I have to name someone so and I got tattooed with him , it's always an amazing person .

So I consider that too . When I , when you know , when I have to name someone so and I got tattooed with him , it's always a nice experience too . So ,

yeah , top .

You know , traditional tattooing used to be something that people considered to be American , you know like .

You go walking in Rome and you see angels , you see eagles , you see stuff , and then , if you're a traditional tattooer , it's impossible not to get inspired by that . You know like people go walk in Phoenix and they see I don't know skyscrapers . If you go walk in Rome , you see everywhere like art .

You know , angels , eagles , you name it so so yeah uh , you name it .

You know I actually got a tattoo from uh the Queen logo when I was 16 or 17 , I don't remember , I was um , I was pretty in love with Freddie Mercury and Queen . But I listen pretty much everything you know , even like Italian shitty music . You know , at the end of the day I they put it .

You know they push it in my head with radio and when I go to the gym and then you know I like it , I listen . And then you know you , if you go through my phone , you're going to go from music from South Italy like popular music to , you know , lady Writer on Dire Street , to Tupac .

Along with that is the music aware of and present of , and along with that is the music Like I always love when you go into a tattoo shop , how music plays such a big role and it's like you know whoever's , whoever's fucking phone is playing or whoever's got you know whoever's taking turns , djing , or this person's playlist is going today , or they have one big

playlist for the shop that everybody adds to . Music is such a it's such a cool part of the tattooing experience for me .

Uh , I always just love what's playing in the shop and there's , you know , sometimes it's classics and sometimes like you're saying it's , it's , you know shit you haven't heard before , and that's like a double whammy for me , where I can go in and get a bad-ass tattoo and come out and be like fuck , like what band was that that's ?

awesome yeah , you know because tattooers have great taste in music , usually because they listen to it all fucking day , so they hear . They hear a lot of stuff . You know whether it's like oh , that sucks , change it , or that's awesome . You know who is that . So I like how music and tattooing merges that way , you know absolutely .

Yes , I don't know if it makes sense what I'm saying , but for me a memory is always connected to like . The best memories are always connected to music because they just complemented the experience . Funny enough , I've never been to a proper concert and next year I'm going to offspring concert . My mother just give me the tickets and you know what ?

As I said , you know we talked about dire street queen , you know italian music and now I'm going to the offspring concert , yeah , so I like everything yeah , that's awesome .

It's gonna be a moment that you won't forget and and that's what it's all about , you know , absolutely , I mean yes , it's you .

But it's true , you know , like I listen to a lot of kind of music , but there are some , you know some bands and some song that whenever I listen to them it gets me , you know like you go like , wow , you know , that's , that's what I really like . You know that , what really gets me , you know yeah , yeah , uh , tell us about tiger spit .

, I was in london doing , uh , I was general manager for , you know I was doing hospitality and stuff and , uh , as the page started to grow , grow , I started to get to , you know , many tattooers that became my friend and I

was like man . Everybody , all my friends , they were like man , you should do something , you should try to , should do something and try to work and do something that could be related to tattoo . Because you're doing it already , supporting so many projects , because at the time I was like supporting any project I could within my page .

You know , I'm giving my platform to whatever was at the time a good idea to do so . Then I said you know what ? I was very shitty at drawing and I said tattooing is not gonna be my thing .

So I was with with my wife , andrea , we , we talked about creating an aftercare and it's been really tough because it was self-funded we never borrow money for anyone or bank and stuff . And then you know , slowly , slowly , I remember I , samuel preganti , drew my logo . I said I got in touch with him . I said , man , I need to .

I want to make an aftercare cream , a tattoo balm and stuff and I need a logo . So he sat down there and made a logo and I was ready to start working on it . It's been tough because it was very difficult . I mean , I didn't know anything about cosmetic and stuff . So I started studying , me and my wife .

We studied a lot and then slowly picked up , and thanks to the help of all my friends you know all the friends I made within tattooing I was able to get to this point . You know , and I give that's why I'm trying all the time .

I feel like I own tattooing something and I always try to give back to tattooing because thanks to tattooing now I can make a living , you know , and I try to make it in a respectful way , not to cross the line . I keep in mind all the time I'm not a tattooer , someone outsider , and I live off tattooing .

keep , you know , promoting people within the within the industry man who give a shit about what's going on . So , absolutely , um , let's do a little , uh , a little flash battle here , okay I'm gonna name . I'm gonna name some , uh , some kind of traditional flash , uh , and you tell me which , which image you prefer . Okay , uh , let's go . Let's go .

Snake versus dragon Dragon Dragon . What about tiger versus panther ? Tiger Wizard versus Grim Reaper .

What do you go ? Rock of ages , yeah , yeah , yeah , rock of ages is tight , uh , okay , just a couple more questions here . Uh , let's do a hypothetical for you , masha . Uh , a time machine , okay . Uh , we're gonna have a time machine show up outside of your place .

Uh , you know , someone awesome gets out of it and says hey , you know , here's the deal , masha , you go anywhere in history , okay , anytime . Where are you going to go first and why ?

because if I would go back in time , I would go back in time , you know , when Bitcoin first started . You know I would buy like 10K of Bitcoin . I would go back in time . I would go back in time , you know , when Bitcoin first started . You know I would buy like 10K of Bitcoins a million today . But you know , to be romantic , I think I always get so .

I'm always fascinated . When I saw those movies , you know like I remember when I watched , you know , john Dillinger , the Public Enemy with Johnny Depp , and have you watched that movie ? Yeah , when I see those kind of movies , when I see all this style and you know those years , everything was different , even music .

When you went to the pub or you went to listen to music , it was a different , you know , a different environment . Everything was a little bit more chilled . You were taking time to enjoy everything you know , a different environment . Everything was a little bit more chilled . You were taking time to enjoy everything you know and there was not .

This now you have . I mean , the input of content and music and imagery is like pushed into your mouth and your head constantly . At the time it was everything had a time . You went to the pub , you enjoyed your drink and you listened to the music and you had this conversation and you were on the spot every time .

So I wish I could have tried that kind of living and see what's the difference , because as far as I'm concerned for myself , I'm never in one place at the same time . You know , I'm always like two phones , speaking with someone reading this , thinking another thing , and you know I wish I could ever try that one .

You know the way they picture it in the movie even uh , it's , it's different , it's like romantic , I don't know it's . Uh , it gives me .

You know , in Italy we say I'm going gonna translate it be good and forget about it , be bad and think you know . In other words , you know , be kind to people and just don't expect anything from others

and be bad and always remember what you , what you've done , you know . So I think that's the mission try the best version of yourself awesome

man .

We don't speak like we don't have spaghetti meatball . It doesn't exist , man , it's not . We don't have it in Italy . They , I don't have it in italy . They , they like , I don't know , like even the , the accent , you know , they , just you know , I think it's something , it's something different . You know , it's true , we talk with our hands .

You know like I'm listen , this man I'm managing in london used to . When I first went to london manager I had manager . So this manager used to do this to me . It was coming to me blocking my hands , like that , and it was like speak now and I couldn't . I felt so wrong man , because if I couldn't move my hand I couldn't talk .

But yeah , they did this thing like forget about it .

Jerry podcast . Thank you for having me Homeward Bound is out now , ladies and gentlemen , traditional tattoos , go get the book , give Masha a follow , support everything he's doing . Yeah , man , just thank you so much for your time today , really appreciate it , brother , thanks for having me .