What's up, everyone? I'm Nora Princiati. And I'm Nathan Hubbard. And we're coming in like a wrecking ball to announce a brand new series. That's right. It's every single album, Miley Cyrus. Deep dive with us into the career of one of our most creative and confounding pop stars. We're starting, of course, with the best of Hannah Montana.
And ending with her brand new album, Something Beautiful, in June. And don't forget about Miley Cyrus and her dead pets. We certainly will not be doing that. So listen now on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Cold open question of the week, Kaz. What's up, shoes? Did you see Chris App's Porzingis backstage at AEW? Was it last week? I think it was last week. Yeah, I've seen that.
If Chris Stapp's Porzingis went into the world of pro wrestling when we were kids, what would his gimmick have been? I mean, it's real easy to go Latvian giant Gonzalez, right? Like that could be. something, but man, anybody who's known Porzingis as intimately as... us New Yorkers have would have to I know he has a special place in your heart He does. The first time I ever went viral in my entire life is when my New York Knicks drafted Chris Desporzingis, and I was at a party.
And I threw my Knicks hat off the roof of that party. Oh, really? Yeah, because I had never heard of Chris Stapp's Forzingis. Because I wanted Jaleel Okafor so bad. That's why. Well, that's crazy. Go ahead. It would have to be something unicorn themed, right? Like, would he just be a member of the New Day and just be like... Oh, the unicorn. The unicorn Chris Stapps Porzingis. Yeah, the unicorn. Put him in a white leotard, give him a horn on his head.
Right, for sure. He could definitely, like, you know, his finishing move could be a diving headbutt, you know, with a horn on top. Or maybe his spear. You don't call it a spear. It's more of a gore. Yeah, gore. There you go. That thing, it could have worked. It could have worked, especially being 7'3". I would have rocked with it.
Porzingis. Maybe not Nick's Porzingis. By the time he got to the Mavs or maybe even like, you know, the Wizards. Celtics. He's got a little weight on him now. He looks like he could... I'd say, I dare say, bigger than Giant Gonzalez in terms of musculature. I would say he's probably bigger than Giant Gonzalez. But at the same time... We don't acknowledge Porzingis now that he's a member of the Boston Celtics, so we just stop.
I just stopped paying attention to him right after he'd become a Washington wizard. Once he joined the ops, the real ops, not Samoa Joe and those guys. It's just hard for me to wish any success. Who are you more excited to see at AEW TV? Chris Stapps or Master P? Oh, Master P in a long shot. Because first off, Master P ain't new to this. Like, he was my first.
First real like, oh my God, wrestling is cool moment in WCW, even though WCW probably went out of business shortly thereafter. It didn't mean the No Limits Soldiers thing wasn't any less awesome. You know, especially going up against the West Coast Rednecks. He was throwing punches last night like he was new to this. I'll just say that. Hey, hey, he's up there in age, man. The fact that he's even out there getting physical should be applauded, Dave, all right?
Who do you? I'm just saying, I would rather see Chris steps there because it just makes it feel like wrestlers cooler. Not wrestling's cooler. Not like. Not that Chris Stapps is the arbiter of cool, but it's like a new face. And I like basketball better than I like Master P. If Master P woke up one day and somebody told him, hey, you're as cool as Chris Stapps Porzingis right now. He'd probably jump off a bridge. Oh, you're right. That's probably true.
Anyway, no masterpiece. No masterpiece slander will be tolerated. He's a legendary artist. I will not take that away. Anyway, we got a lot to talk about. An entrepreneur, man. An entrepreneur. That's his go-to. He redefined music graphics. For a whole generation. Album covers will never look the same again after the Photoshop department that he had. That's my art director's take. Anyway, we got a lot to talk about. The rock, the roast, the dynamite, whatever. Let's start the show.
How long does your WrestleMania hangover usually last? This is a long one. I felt good. I felt relatively good leaving. I didn't like, you know, party a lot and I didn't. I mean, I generally went to bed at a reasonable time at WrestleMania and now I'm just like finding myself falling asleep in the middle of the day. Like I literally fell asleep two days in a row now with my laptop on my lap. So not usual for me.
Not usual. Well, I actually did party, Dave. And I also did lots of other things throughout the weekend. And I haven't taken more daytime naps in my adult life than I have this week. Vegas. Took a ton out of me. And I think even after that, do you take like a little wrestling break after you come out of WrestleMania? Do you just like not watch?
I mean, the cool thing about they're off to WrestleMania is that it keeps you watching, right? It keeps you invested in the new season premiere or whatever. No, I feel pretty energized. This is an energizing WrestleMania. I'll say that. Are you ready for a break? Are you going to disappear from the show for a while now? I was thinking about it. I was thinking about it. But no, no, I wasn't trying to disappear. I was just saying that, like, man, it feels like every year, especially, you know.
NBA playoffs are happening also. You're not as totally... You still have a working sort of knowledge of what's going on, but you're not totally locked in like you are on the road to WrestleMania. You know what I mean? It has its own... name, The Road to WrestleMania. It's just a... There's usually a natural drop-off for me that usually lasts about a week or two. And then I'm right back in it.
Yeah, no, it's true. I mean, the playoffs are a thing, but we have an obligation to watch that as employees of the ringer. That too, yeah. But yeah, no, no, we'll listen. Wrestling is full steam ahead and we'll keep talking about it. I can't take a break after Monday. I know. Yeah, I was going to say, it doesn't mean we can't keep talking about stuff that's already happened. What do you want to talk about first? I talked to the guys a little bit about Monday night on Worldwide, but we have...
A lot of drama coming out of WWE. The Rock has been out there doing PR. The roast is now becoming a big thing. Do you want to start with the roast? Let's start with the roast. Let's talk about the roast. WWE had a WrestleMania roast. The night after, I mean, after night two of WrestleMania. I don't even know if you mention it on this show. I generally just would rather not discuss.
I mean, at first it was like the Tony Hinchcliffe story. And then, you know, that was just like, it was just so kind of eye rolling to me that I just didn't really care and don't really want to waste my energy like complaining about it. But... You know, there's been a lot of drama now about the roast. You love it? I kind of love it a little bit. I think it's just ridiculous. Well, okay.
I'm not the biggest Kill Tony fan, right? I don't even mind Kill Tony that much. I mean, the speech of the MSG thing. I was going to say, from what I've heard, you know, yeah, obviously the thing at MSG was disgusting, but... And a lot of the things that they've said on the shows is pretty disgusting. But funny enough, from what I've heard, and I haven't listened to everything, but I'll probably...
maybe like the first 15 minutes and a few clips from like, from like Nia Jax and Paul Heyman and a couple of other folks. I like. Tony Hinchcliffe wasn't that bad. I get why they did it. I'll say this. I get why they did it. Then explain it to me. Why did they do it? Well... I would pay to watch wrestlers cut unscripted promos. You know what I mean? When you think about it, I was thinking about like, all right, are they going to be just a bunch of comedians that I've probably never heard of?
are like all of regulars on this show to talk about wrestling or are the wrestlers going to roast each other? Because that would be funny. Or at least that would be interesting to me. I didn't really care much about what the comedians had to say about wrestling or telling Brock Lesnar jokes or telling race Hulk Hogan jokes or any of those taboo things that we hear and watch on the internet. It just was free reign.
I was like, man, you know, these guys are in front of a live crowd every week talking in front of a microphone. Like, I would watch.
You know what I mean? Those guys cut unscripted, like just raw, just kind of vulgar promos against each other. It might be at least entertaining to me. And I guess to everyone else, because all the clips that... got found onto my timeline were just like the cutouts of these WWE superstars just saying stuff that we all will believe will certainly end up in some uncomfortable... conversations are uncomfortable conversations right yeah every time there's like a
I mean, I think we've gotten to the celebrity roast place in our society that we all understand what's going on and people kind of take it all with a grain of salt. And part of the big deal is the people you're making fun of are up there on the stage.
publicly laughing about it you're not just taking shots that's the part of the joke yeah you're not but you're not taking shots of people who aren't there or who aren't like you I mean it's not just being present it's being able to see them laugh right you know like being able to interact
But in terms of all the drama that's come out of this, I think that the biggest thing wasn't even, the biggest weird mistake by WWE wasn't just having the roast. I mean, it wasn't the roast in general, but not realizing that there were like... I'm doing the math here, approximately zero pro wrestlers in the world that can take a joke. You know?
Well, maybe they could. Well, maybe they could, but like, well, they certainly can't tell a joke, right? I mean, there was like, apparently it was like Sami Zayn and that was kind of it. Like even Heyman is getting mixed reviews, right? You'd expect him to do pretty well. Heyman sounded like he was just cutting a shoot promo from like 1999. Yeah. That's what it sounds like. Yes. Yeah. Not as funny. Not as funny as you were. Sammy was up there. Sammy was up there trying to be like.
a real student of the comedy game. You know what I mean? Like really try and like tell jokes from like a level of understanding. Right. And not just like say the lowest hanging fruit. Nia Jax kind of like, I don't know. It was kind of like, she had like a Chelsea Handler thing going on where she was just like, I'm just going to say the meanest thing I could possibly say about people. I mean, listen, that's one. that's one way to do a roast is to just go so hard that like, that then people like,
But she didn't go. All she did was make fun of wrestlers. Right. It's like if you're if you want to sort of if you want to balance it out so that you're the people you make fun of aren't allowed to be upset. You got to go with some like. freaking racist stuff or some you know political stuff or you got to go really hard all over the place so then the people that you're making fun of are just like well
that's not the most problematic thing she said. Whatever. She was just going hard. I thought it was just dumb. I can't imagine how much money they made off of that, but it can't have been worth the amount of money or the amount of headache it's going to cause them. I'll be honest. I thought it was dumb going into it, but after hearing some of it, I'm just like... I'm not as... I'm not as...
I'm not as against it as I was before. It wasn't to me. And maybe I'm part of the problem. I'm not perfect, America. But from what I heard, I was like, oh, it's not as... Not as bad as I was thinking it was going to be. I guess the tone, I guess the cadence and the candor. I mean, obviously we didn't see any of it. I didn't see any of it. I just heard it. And it just seemed like, you know.
It seemed like a burn book, right? Like, I'm just going to just say just the meanest, most, you know, and you got to think of that audience too, right? The audience that spends money to go to a WrestleMania roast.
You know what I mean? You're telling jokes that... insidery but kind of general knowledge so it's like there were no jokes that weren't like like literally like the worst joke that would the worst like and appropriateness aside like the worst joke that would have been made if we had like a watch party for a pay-per-view right i mean it wasn't like there was anything that funny or insightful
No. I don't know, man. I thought it's crazy. They took away everybody's phones. Of course, this was going to leak out. Most comedy shows that aren't streamed. Maybe this is WWE's long game to drive Charlotte Flair out of the company or something. It's just... I mean, it's just nuts, man. I literally don't know why. I don't know what the point was. I don't know what the point was. It was as if to say...
I gotta be honest, Dave, I didn't hate it. I didn't hate it. I didn't hate it as much as I was expecting to hate it. Listen, you have been around WWE guys for a long time. Do you know what the greatest... The happiest night of the year inside of WWE, I'm sure they have happier nights with their families at Christmas or whatever, but it's the night of WrestleMania.
You know, I mean, and they've, and it's, whether it's at the hotel bar, the parties that they throw, like whatever it is, it's like this big communal hug, right? Like these wrestlers are just like, like we finally did it. Like we got through. It's like, we like, it's, it's a celebration.
And instead you get rid of that and you're just like, Hey, let me figure out the best possible way to burn this sense of community down. Right. Is there a way we can get these guys to make fun of each other in front of a crowd of marks and really mean it. Here's the thing, Dave. These wrestlers, they pop the most shit about each other more than we could ever imagine. It's almost like... So this is going to sound crazy, but when I was turning 25 years old,
for my birthday party. You should say that up front. You're apparently a big roast head. I don't mind it. I had a roast for my 25th birthday party. years ago. I had real stand-up comedians. I had people in the music industry. I had artists. Pete Davidson came. Pete Davidson wasn't even of age, but he showed up to show love and stuff and tell a few jokes. or whatever. And I'd say this, there is usually... That long setup to the roast between everybody that's going in there to talk some shit.
Some people want to know what's going to be said. A lot of times, you're having a conversation with the person you're going to crack jokes on to kind of let them know, like, hey, what's the ground rules here? There's usually some sort of ground rules set down there, right? And as much as long as this has been promoted, you got to imagine there was something like that going on. And I don't know. I've been to roasts, and I've been the subject of a roast.
And if you could like mathematically put a number on like what the audience is like, especially a prepared audience for a roast, it's like 90% of the people go in there. willing to laugh at whatever it is. And even if they don't laugh at what it is, they're willing to react to whatever it is. Like, oh my God, you're going to hear some crazy shit. But they all kind of know it's part of the show. They all kind of know this is all just like...
we're all going to just let this roll off our backs after we're all done. But then there's that little 10% left over that does not find it funny, does not find it... Yes, those 10% are called professional wrestlers. I don't know. I'm not sure that that many professional wrestlers that were there were that. I just think it's a wild decision. I don't have a moral argument against this. I just have literally a business argument against this. I'm sure.
Would you do that tonight of all nights? Because you have a captive crowd there. They've already spent a billion dollars. They'll probably spend another $100 million on going to this thing. It's just crazy. It's just crazy. Maybe it's some like pseudo Jedi mind trick. Who do you think decided that they should have a roast?
I'm not going to ask. I was going to say, you don't have to name any names. Were there any Nick Khan jokes at the roast? I'm sure there was. I'm sure there was. I looked at the script. I didn't see that. I don't know. I saw some Nick Khan jokes. I saw some... Everything that you know they would never talk about on TV that is pretty common knowledge between WWE fans was, for the most part, talked about.
um i don't think anybody was really spared and i don't know maybe this is something like jedi mind trick graduation from dusty's promo school or like at the end of your your real uh you know, nighting moment is one day right after the biggest show of your life. You got to go in front of all your fans and have them just... take the absolute piss at you. for two hours. I don't know. I didn't think it was as bad as it was.
going into it. But hey, who am I to judge? Nobody was making fun of me. Yeah, like I said, I'm not morally offended by it. I just think it was really dumb. I don't know why that would, who thought that was a good idea. All it's going to do is piss off your talent, which is your resource. Like the only thing, you know.
Anyway, anyway, anyway, I hope they do it every year. So we have something to talk about next year. I mean, I don't know why people didn't, I mean, they took away your phones and of course everybody knew it was going to leak out. most of the stuff that i heard right afterwards from all the people i knew that were there was just a sort of oh that was bad you know like i don't
I think you could do a WWE roast. I just wouldn't do it the night after WrestleMania. It's just too much. If they ran it back, would you watch it? If they were like, yo, we're doing it again this time. live on Netflix. Are you going to watch it? I think if they did it again, they would have to do it well. So that would make it better. And if they did it live on Netflix, then yeah, because there'd be some expectation of quality.
I don't know, man. I don't know. I don't know how you did your birthday roast, but I assume that, you know, well, I don't know. I'm not going to do any value judgments. Let's just talk about more bad decisions. The Rock went on Pat McAfee this week and explained why he wasn't at WrestleMania. And all the creative decisions that went into his appearances up to this point. Why do you think The Rock went on Pat McAfee's show?
You want to know my real answer? Yeah. I think creatively Triple H and the rock butted head. Like if I had to guess why that was done at all. Wait, and why he was on McAfee? Yeah. Okay. I think creatively at the beginning of the year. or around the time it leaked out that The Rock wasn't coming to WrestleMania or anything like that. I think the two, which I thought was always inevitable, sort of came at a creative crossroads. And it's hard to convince me after last year.
that The Rock wasn't ready to do only what he wanted to do in WrestleMania this year. And... man, you're talking to somebody who is captain. Oh, The Rock's definitely showing up. Oh, The Rock is definitely going to be at WrestleMania because none of it made any sense. And yeah, it did not make any sense. Yeah. Like there was so many things since what war games that really now doesn't make any sense.
Now, all that being said, that's what I think, right? What's also more than likely is that The Rock is... The Rock's probably playing us once again. You know? He kind of does whatever he wants, man. The Rock's playing us once again how? I mean, maybe... I don't see where he goes on McAfee to sort of throw... you know, critiques at a freshly wrapped storyline that's actually happening as we speak. And I got to be honest, right? A lot of the elimination chamber stuff feels kind of weird.
The Travis Scott inclusion feels kind of weird. Yep. Everything about the end of WrestleMania felt weird. And I said it like as it happened. Totally weird. Because the shadow of The Rock. was over this entire build. And he never showed up. So... If I was a betting man, I would say some creative differences happened on the road to WrestleMania between the two most important creative people in that company, which is probably Triple H and probably The Rock.
And I could totally see The Rock being on some like, well. I did what you wanted to do last year. I did what the fans demanded we did last year. Yep. And I only have so many years. And I really do kind of run shit. I really am more important than you are, right? So instead of me flexing those muscles... of just getting done what I want to get done. Maybe he felt the best way he could be, quote unquote, a team player.
What's to just not show up? And just be like, you know what, Triple H? You do it. We'll go with your vision. I was following you up until you said team player. The best way you could be a team player is not to show up. I think that's the way he saw it. Because I think if he wanted to get his way...
If The Rock wanted to get his way and be at WrestleMania, he would. He absolutely would. There is nothing and nobody that would stop The Rock from being at WrestleMania if he wanted to be at WrestleMania. My whole thing is, I think those two, and I'm just wildly speculating, as always, I think those two came to a creative impasse. I agree. Between January and April. And Rock was just like, ah. You know what, nuts to that.
Here's the thing. No one's going to deny the power of the rock. Just the drawing power, the celebrity, the influence, everything else. Yes. But they already had their creative dispute. It was last year. Triple H won. Like The Rock wanted to be a baby face. He brilliantly played a heel. We all love him and thank him for that. But that was not what The Rock went in there wanting to do. I don't think there's even a revisionist Rock version where he would say that.
So, I mean, I don't know. I think that you're right that there is a creative issue. And he said that Ari Emanuel is the one who called him directly and asked him to be at the Elimination Chamber to help sell tickets. Yeah, it's like, it's almost like The Rock went on Pat McAfee to be like... Yeah, I had nothing to do with that crap you guys watched at the main event last night. Exactly. You know? But here's the thing.
It was Ari Emanuel who supposedly called them to go, I believe this too, to help out with Elimination Chamber, to help sell tickets, whatever. But at that point, if The Rock was like, sure, I'll be there and didn't DM Triple H, then he's creating his own problems, right? And also, you showed up at the Elimination Chamber. You're allowed to show up at WrestleMania. No one was going to stop you. So what's the idea of not showing up? Dave, The Rock is an extremely great talker.
Well, he's kind of a one-way. He is a great talker, but he wears his emotions on his sleeve almost more than Cody Rhodes. I mean, every time... The McAfee interview... And God love him for doing it. Felt like when he used to do those Instagram videos after he'd have a movie that bombed, then he would try to explain why it happened. That's exactly what it felt like. And it was just so...
Those were cringy at the time because one, it was unnecessary. Like nobody doubts The Rock's like success and star power. But two, it's like, like, why do you, how is this helping? How is this helping? You know, The Rock does not. The Rock is not the sort of celebrity that you feel like you have a personal relationship with. I don't know. It's just very strange. I think The Rock is the undeniable, one of the greatest stars of all time, and I love everything that he does.
I'm not sure I needed that peek behind the curtain. And more than anything, I just don't think it helped his case. I think it just made everybody look a little... I don't know if it made everybody look weird, but it definitely put a weird...
staying on a main event that I already thought was a little fishy as it was happening, right? Like, now it's like... Well, now the story that I believe the most, and I think we talked about this on Monday, is that Cena's heel turn was supposed to happen at WrestleMania. Yeah. That the build was supposed to be babyface versus babyface, like whatever. They were going to save the turn itself for Mania.
I kind of buy that. That probably makes a lot of sense now. And they did it at Elimination Chamber because The Rock was there and they wanted to involve him in it and all that stuff. But I just don't think... I mean, it just doesn't make any sense, man. It's just crazy. It's a... I mean, we talked for weeks about how weird the build to WrestleMania was. It makes all the sense. It was a disjointed build.
something that wasn't supposed to like, if we put together all, you know, if we do the autopsy of the road to WrestleMania now, right. With all the new information we have, right. We put in these. We enter these factors. By the way, we should do a roast of the road to WrestleMania. That I could get into. That's a roast that gets support.
Right, right, right. So it's like, you got to think about it like this. If you're John Cena and you're being told that we're saving your big career-defining heel turn for your final WrestleMania in four weeks. And then now you have to, you know, do it tonight. And now you have to make four weeks of heels seeing the material. Yeah, you know, we were joking about the shoes.
It seems like they didn't have anything prepared until WrestleMania. The graphics didn't change until WrestleMania. The outfit didn't change until WrestleMania. They got the shirts printed, but I guess that's something they can pull off. It was just an all-around weird performance. And it's wild because Rock says the emphasis and the... The spotlight should have been on John Cena, and he's absolutely right. If this was the way you were ultimately going to go,
All of the spotlight should have been directly on John Cena. It should have been all about John Cena. It should have been all about his chase to become the GOAT. It should have been all about... you know these two the two baby faces of a generation you know I mean leading up to it and what it takes to be that baby face and then We did the heel turn at WrestleMania. And then...
We start all of those conversations that Cena was having with the crowd. And even on Monday Night Raw, his brand new entrance, just all the all black with, you know, the, you know, I forgot the new ring announcer's name, but. Him doing the extended ring announcement when he comes into the ring and does the pose. That entire presentation is awesome. So now we can finally put all our focus on John Cena. As weird as that Rock McAfee interview was...
I appreciate it for, you know, now being able to compartmentalize. Okay, we don't need to worry about The Rock anymore. He's not coming back. He has nothing to do with this. This is all about John Cena. Now we can put the rock box away. The whole selling your soul thing wasn't a thing. The whole, the rocks freaking stable of people that was going to help with his soul stealing, whatever.
Isn't a thing. All that shit is done for. Now we can properly focus. The Travis Scott of it all too. Like Travis Scott. Travis Scott was there to make The Rock look more douchey, right? That's what I thought. Travis Scott was just a piece. It was a douche magnet. It was so weird. It was like, instead of having Ric Flair make a run in at the end of an old WCW show, it's like letting his robe make a run in, you know? This is not the thing we're mad at, you know?
We don't actually have any investment in Travis Scott. It was a strange booking decision down the line. having seen a win at WrestleMania that we were all sort of prepared for, but how much, like, but it felt like, not just because The Rock wasn't there, it felt a little bit like a fait accompli, like we were all expecting it. I think if he had been a baby face,
I wouldn't have felt like it was a given, you know, but if you could have done the heel turn, Cody would have been booed. Yep. Exactly. I don't think Cody would have been booed either. So it's like now the rocks appearance. That ultimately didn't mean anything when it came to WrestleMania. Maybe it means something down the line. Maybe they retcon it and at Backlash or SummerSlam or whatever, they make it all make sense. Maybe they do that, but...
As it stands right now, The Rock showing up to pump some tickets for Elimination Chamber ultimately curtailed this John Cena. Which, why? Why are we worried about Elimination Chamber ticket sales? It's Toronto. Yay. That's where we live. That's why. I guarantee whatever the difference is in tickets, they could have sold that many more for WrestleMania at 400 bucks a pop if they had just told you that The Rock was going to be there.
So now I'm getting really deep into the weeds because they definitely... advertised how much John Cena was going to be there, how this was his last Elimination Chamber. They said it right after Royal Rumble, like, hey, John Cena will be in the Elimination Chamber. And now you got The Rock going on McAfee saying, like, hey. John Cena being in the elimination chamber wasn't selling enough tickets, so they had to call me in to help pump it up. So that...
slows down a little bit of John Cena's momentum. Them standing next to each other kind of seems even more like... weird now because it was like it really didn't mean anything in the grand scheme of things or maybe it will down the line but on top of that an unforeseen sort of circumstance is that Cody got booed out the building at WrestleMania. It's true. He got booed out the building. By the way, there was a...
Yeah, go ahead. Finish your... Cody got booed out the building because John Cena is an unstoppable charisma monster. He is the most popular dude on the card. Apparently not in Canada, but go on. Not in Canada, but you know. we were ready to see John Cena make history at WrestleMania on Sunday. And if they were both going in there babyface, babyface,
maybe you get more of a split crowd. Maybe you get more Hogan Rock from WrestleMania X8. Okay. But it wasn't that at all. It was like 80% Cena, maybe 20% Cody. in that crowd that was cheering for him. And man, if you're Cody or Cena now, That dynamic, I mean, you're team players and you're doing what's best for the storyline of the company at all times.
You kind of got to blame The Rock if things didn't go as great as you probably envisioned it when you first said, hey, Cena and Cody Rhodes is your main event for WrestleMania 41. Yeah, correct. The road to WrestleMania was a little shaky. The match itself was shaky. And now even the post-match, you got the most famous dude on earth explaining why this shit was so shaky. It's just...
I don't know. I don't know how you sort of like candle that. If you're the talent, if you're, you know, trying to build a story, I think. the grand scheme of things like I said before the best thing to come about this is now we can compartmentalize the rock we can put him the bloodline storyline all that shit in a nice little box put it away and I'll put all our focus on John Cena and this run and him being the guy and not worrying about the final boss of it all. Yes.
Meltzer had a thing today. Did you see this? Where he said that somebody who remains nameless told him to report that The Rock wasn't going to be there. Somebody at WWE. in an effort to try to kind of mind game the rock into going. Probably almost worked. Must have almost worked. My gosh. I just don't understand why he wasn't there. No matter what the dispute was or whatever else.
The week before WrestleMania, is there any world in which Triple H would prefer The Rock? We're not at WrestleMania. No. Unless it was some creative differences between the two. At that point, it was what it was. The creative was done. Basically, does The Rock appear in the main event or not? Does he stand outside the ring? It would have been crazy. Well, who knows? I don't know if The Rock is showing up just to... I don't think The Rock is showing up to not do what he wants to do.
You know, I think he'll be malleable and be a team player for, you know, so long. But at the end of the day, like, the buck kind of stops with him. For all things WWE. What did he not want to do? That's what I'm asking. I don't know. I do not know. I do not know. I'm just wildly speculating because that's the only... The only person who can oppose him...
on doing what he wants to do is Triple H. Creatively, at least, right? Like, that's the only person. So, if there's something creatively that was being done... And then all of a sudden wasn't done. Yeah. I can only assume it was because of something creatively and who's at the top of creative. All this being said, now I just want to see Triple H versus The Rock.
which will never happen but this is it pro wrestling when you're when you're building up storylines that nobody that are you can't actually deliver you know it's that's that's a problem um but no no here's the thing I guess I would assume, putting all these pieces together, that The Rock showed up as a favorite Ari Emanuel, sort of messed with the creative.
you know, decided to not show up at WrestleMania because he didn't feel appreciated for helping, even though it was, you know, help is in the eye of the beholder. But... I think they were ready to make the most of it. And The Rock just didn't show. It's just weird. It's just a deeply weird situation. I literally...
It was very telling that they never mentioned The Rock leading into WrestleMania. Yeah, never said his name. I mean, it didn't stop them from selling shirts at the Superstore that said finally The Rock has come back to Las Vegas. But... I don't know. I mean... It was just a strange, strange situation. I was going to say, I feel like I understand wrestling about as well as anybody, and I was literally stunned.
I was just standing there at the end of the match, waiting for the rock to come out for 15 minutes. Everybody was leaving their seats. And I'm like, these idiots don't know what they're doing, you know, and still not, I mean, and. And it was crazy. Just absolutely crazy. So yeah, so that's where we are. A lot of people getting dramatic about the Triple H rock relationship and the comments. And so, I mean, it's just all, it's just.
It's a real fucking mess, bro. Well, good for them. They managed to make WrestleMania interesting. We got Backlash coming up. What was your favorite? Oh, dude. Can we do Rock vs. Triple H at Backlash? Is that going to work? Oh, man. I'm telling you, man. All this hullabaloo. Hullabaloo. It only makes you want to watch.
Triple H versus The Rock one of these days. And it's never going to happen, though. Unfortunately, it never will happen. But man, that's the money match now after this. All these years later, these two lifelong rivals still... Going about it now instead of doing it in the ring They do it behind the scenes. Damn, that's a Netflix special for your ass. If we're doing a Netflix show on the writer's room, the next docuseries needs to be...
Rock and Triple H, the feud that never ended. They should have a main event. They should do a main event for one of these big shows. Maybe save it for WrestleMania. Where they just have cameras following them for the rest of the year and the main event is we're going to air a 30-minute documentary that's just them negotiating with Ari Emanuel and Nick Khan.
We sit them down right now. We tell them both. We get them both to say what they want to do at WrestleMania next year. And then the main event is who won. It should be like Hard Knocks front office for the Giants. Yeah, exactly. They should just have meetings between Rock and Hunter just to see who gets what and what plans are. So this time at the end of the year, when WrestleMania happens or the Super Bowl happens, we can look back and be like, wow.
that was a Saquon Barkley-like move or wow, they'll never let cameras be back here again because this is so insane that this is how things like this are decided. The most powerful thing in wrestling is is the is the plausible plausible deniability of the creative of creative the card subject to change the you know like guys just wait just bear with us you're not taking in the whole story you know like whatever like there's just No one's giving that up. No one's giving that up.
Anyway. So, so interesting. It's something to monitor, though. I think it's definitely going to be something to monitor, especially if The Rock ever comes back. What does it look like? What do we have to do? We're essentially being asked to... give the final ball storyline a clean slate, right? He was like, we can come back to that at any time. Yeah, I guess we can. I guess we can. I mean, sure, theoretically you can. But him saying it.
On like the most podcast on earth. It's like, well, I expected we could come back to this. You didn't have to tell me that. I'm sorry. Can you tell me whether or not The Rock is the owner of John Cena's soul? Is that the question we need to ask? No, that's what I want to know. Because that's what the storyline presumably was. That's what was happening at Elimination Chamber. He wanted Cody's soul and he didn't get it. So he had John Cena turn off.
So does The Rock own John Cena's soul? Or do we not know? I don't know. I guess it was... That's a really basic question. We got 15 promos about soul stealing. Soul snatching. We don't know if his soul was snatched. We don't know what the storyline is. No, we have no idea, and that's what makes it... That's what makes this weird. I'm very much team just...
I'll only comment on stuff that is put on my TV screen. So just for the sake of making sense. But this whole thing just kind of makes no sense now. So I don't know what to tell you guys. I really don't. Anyway, Rock vs. Triple H, book it. I mean, I'm sure that's not... Nothing's ever that simple. But there's something there. You got to admit, there's something there between those two.
It's kind of wild. I mean, it's pretty freaking wild. It's not the most smooth, you know, what's the word I'm looking for? Kumbaya relationship. It can't be. It has to have its contentiousness. And it goes back. Like, it's not even like, you know, that's what makes it interesting. If they clashed, it's like not the first time. They've kind of had this cold war between each other. This working relationship cold war for maybe like, what, 1998?
If you read The Rock's book, you read what he said about people that... weren't too kind to him when he first got into the business that were sort of picking on him that had a lot of power i mean certain people could probably you know put pieces together and say he was talking about HBK. You know what I mean? There's something there, man. There's something there that has been unspoken between those two.
Definitely, if I was betting my money, came into play on the road to WrestleMania. Somebody put their nuts on the table and dared one of them to move. The Rock probably moved. Somebody played chicken. And they were like, all right, go ahead. Maybe that's why we got a roast and a concert and the after party and all these other things to take away from the fact that like... Did anybody talk about The Rock at the roast?
I'm sure they did. You said I'm sure they did. I mean, we have all the audio, don't we? Yeah, I'm just seeing tweets that have clips of... people mentioned and they'll just like have names of each wrestler and I haven't seen The Rock yet but I've definitely seen Brock Lesnar I've definitely seen Vince McMahon I've definitely seen Freddie Prinze Jr.'s dad, which is pretty crazy. There's some stuff in there. So I'm willing to bet The Rock was talked about in this room.
If I'm wrong, I'm sure someone in the comments will tell me I'm wrong. We'll find out. My guess is that nobody's making fun of The Rock, which automatically ruins the concept of any roast. Anyway. Did you ever see Black Adam, by the way? Unfortunately, yes. Oh, unfortunately. Yeah. It's not a great movie. It's not a great movie. The end credit scene was like the best part of the movie, but nothing else was. It was alright. Anyway.
What a way to end WrestleMania. Did you watch Dynamite last night? I caught bits and pieces of it. It was a good show. It was a good show. I don't know. Do we talk about the AEW? I know we didn't talk a lot of AEW and Collision. I was hanging out with a well-placed person on Thursday. No, Friday in Las Vegas. and i was waiting for them when i was waiting for them to show up i threw on uh um the athena mercedes match and i was just like you know like
Just mark it down. I might have already seen the best match of the week. You know, like that match was so good. And I think I already said this in a podcast. It was so good, but there's this weird thing with some of these AEW matches. The first time two incredible wrestlers wrestle, you know you haven't seen the best version of their match. Somehow it's a five-star match, but you know there's room to improve. God, those two together were so good.
And now we're going to get Mercedes versus Jamie Hayter in the finals of the Owen tournament, which is going to be sick too. The Jamie Hayter-Chris Tatlander match last night was a lot of fun. I'm very excited to see Hayter and Mercedes. Big win for the Women's Owen Cup. I'm very excited about that. What else? I mean, but there was a lot of fun stuff last night. Where are you on the MJF Hurt Syndicate stuff? Because I feel like I'm...
I'm betting low on this thing. I get it. I think it's kind of funny, but I feel like they're continually missing the mark. Maybe I'm just not enjoying it as much because it's a lot of people that I'm seeing just like love it. Dave, I love it. I love it. Every week between MJF and the Hurt Syndicate, they're winning me over more and more.
And one thing I'm starting to realize is that a lot of my favorite stuff of MJF came when he wasn't champion, when he was just doing this great character work, this wrestling character work. that he seems to get more than anybody, certainly anybody in his age range. But the comic relief he's brought out of the super serious Hurt Syndicate. has been definitely a welcome change of pace to the shows. And just MJF trying things every week just to get their approval, I think is really funny.
I just really like their dynamic right now, you know? And I don't know where it's going to eventually land. I don't know if it's going to eventually land on an MJF-Lashley match or, you know, MJF's really going to have the Hurt Syndicate holding him down, but... I can't act like what I've seen so far isn't some top-tier MJF work, right? People have always...
said Lashley and Shelton are ass kickers, but nobody would ever confuse them with being the best promo cutters or the best storytellers or anything like that. They're just ass kickers. That's why you put them with MVP. But you put MJF next to him and there's almost this dynamic of like... I don't know, ever see Nelson Bunce and Ralph Wiggum when he has the bully that's looking out for him and is doing all that stuff? There's just always something about getting those dudes to crack.
that I always think is great. I think, and this is reaching as far as comparisons are concerned, but I think that's a real same formula, but different characters. The OG bloodline stuff worked so well because you had this, you know, variable in Sami Zayn making these super serious ass kickers in the Usos and Roman Reigns and Solo Sokoa cracking every week.
Where, you know, whether it's Sammy trying to be a part of the bloodline and doing all these things, like MJF is kind of doing the same sort of thing, you know, and I like it. I like it. I think it's been entertaining. Lowest of keys, maybe it's really us discovering that MJF is most entertaining when he's not.
chasing a title when he's not you know in the title picture like he's a dude yeah okay a great utility player and he's doing a great work with this no and I enjoy I enjoy MJF just kind of about whatever he does but Maybe you're right. Maybe making me laugh at a Hurt Syndicate segment is a... is a powerful move in some way. I think for me, it's like, I would rather MJF get serious than the Hurt Business get funny.
Does it hurt syndicate get funny? Does that make sense? Yeah. Yeah, I can see that. But we see that MJF be serious. He ends every feud as serious as a heart attack and then he takes two months off and he comes back joking around again. You know, like, why not let him, what is the value for him in kayfabe of joining the herd center?
To look cool at parties and to have a bad, you know, a tougher crew in wrestling, right? It's to help him in his wrestling career. Like, why are you being silly about this? I don't know. I think the reason why I love it is I love the daringness of it because you spend... Maybe a half of the beginning of the Hurt Syndicate's run in AEW, teasing all of these potential additions to the Hurt Syndicate. Yes. And wouldn't you know it...
All the potential additions, all the people that MJF gave business cards to happen to be black. Which seems like something that the MVP gave to all happened to be black. Every time we go online, people fantasy book other black talent with the hurt syndicate. It's always black people trying to be with the hurt syndicate. That's what everyone always wants to see. MJF being the guy that ends up joining it.
It's funny on a number of levels to me because of being aware of those pro wrestling stable tropes where all the black guys. have to be in one group with all the other black guys okay yeah no no i get i i listen i appreciate that i do yeah uh Wouldn't it have been a better punchline or at least a better moment if they had just teased all these black dudes and then they just said, welcome the new member of the Hurt Syndicate, it's MJF?
Well, they could have. They could have. But, like, him trying to win them over, I think, is funny. No, it's good. It is apparently funny. Yeah. Maybe I'm the only one. Maybe I'm the only one is giving this. an extra turn or whatever. Is the payoff him joining the Hurt Syndicate or is the payoff him feuding with Bobby Lashley? I think him joining the Hurt Syndicate is... is the big payoff.
I think what they're eventually building towards is obviously Bobby Lashley saving MJF from certain doom or something like that, where they finally come together and he likes and whatnot. And MJF's got this... He kind of did the same thing with Adam Cole where every week we just expected him to turn it on each other. Like every single week we're like, all right, this is the week it's going to happen. But they got so good together. You kind of didn't want to see it anymore. You know? Exactly.
You can kind of see that happen with the Hurt Syndicate because MJ has done it before. I don't know, but I don't know. I personally really like it. what the group has been doing. Because of you, I'll give it an extra chance. Give it a shot, man. I love Josh Alexander in AEW. I like... The Cowes family... at times has risked getting like so big that it just seems redundant. But I don't know. This is sort of the best way in AEW to make use of like eight people at the same time.
And everybody in the Don Callis family has a distinct personality and a different sort of role there. I love the giant Don Callis family. I love it. And I love Josh Alexander in that spot too. I mean, he's one of my favorite wrestlers, so that's, you know, it's good to see him. But he needs some time to get his footing in AEW, so that's great. I love... I mean, uh...
I like the Kevin Knight ricochet stuff. I like Mike Bailey, obviously. Speedball is one of the best ever. There's just a lot of good stuff. I love Swerve and Omega coming down to confront the Bucks from different sides at the same time. There was a lot of good stuff last night. You definitely loved Master P last night. Why was Master P there?
They were in New Orleans. Right, but was it... No, no, no. I mean, on a deeper level. Was it just because Master P has a connection to pro wrestling? That's why Tony Khan was like, yeah, let's get Master P out of here? I think he was promoting... One of the HBCUs, I want to say, around there, he's proposing some NIL joint. I mean, you got to admit, Master P is one of the OG wrestling influencers from like...
you know, the mainstream world, you know, he's up there with like Cindy Lauper and, uh, you know, who else? Like Cindy Lauper, Master P, fricking. Cindy Lauper and Master P. Is Master P going in the WWE Hall of Fame? No. No. I mean, if WCW was still alive, absolutely. He's in there. Without a doubt. But you got to bring Master P back for at least two, minimum two more Monday Night Raw segments. And then you can put them in the Hall of Fame. And then you're officially qualified to join.
It's just so funny. Well, whatever. I'm not going to complain about Master P. as much as I might like to. Samoa Joe choking out the champ. One more time. I love it. Is Samoa Joe the, I mean, he's a recent AEW champion, but if you're like actively going after the trios championships and then you win them. Does it make sense that you're suddenly in position to be the number one contender, or does that just feel like they just sort of made it up on the fly?
You know what I mean? Man, you choke out the world champion. You need to get a shot at the title. No, I agree after tonight, but why is he a trios champ? Like, give him another buddy to take the trios champion. I don't know. Maybe I'm crazy. I mean, you know. Well, we'll see. I love Samoa Joe in that spot. I just can't imagine anybody, despite him being a recent champion for AEW, I can't imagine a less compelling threat to take Moxley's title.
Anyway, why am I so downbeat today? I'm having a great day. WWE, everybody. The roast fucked you up, man. The roast in the main event. We're doing a roast next week. We're going to do a roast of... What should we do? Let's do our own roast of WrestleMania. All right. I'll call Dan St. Germain. We'll get some real roasters in here. See, yeah, that's what it should have been. Just a roast of the show that just happened.
And not a whole bunch of like Jinder Mahal is a terrorist jokes, which is just like, so like just, just completely confused. yeah that was rough i just want to say i didn't listen to any of the i didn't listen to the other comics stuff on the roast yet i'm just I'm literally only commenting on the wrestlers, like the Sammies, the Nia Jaxons, Miz. I guess Tony Hinchcliffe as well, but McAfee, Heyman, those, I heard those, but the other guys, like, oh my God. Didn't hear it yet.
I reserve the right to change my mind about how I feel about this roast after I fully give it a full listen to, which I have it. Good. Just clips. Great. So we have to keep talking about the roast is what you're saying. All right. Yes, we do. We'll be back with a roast of the roast next week on the Masked Man Show. Who's going to say no to that? Anyway. Yo, what you think about the return of Stokely Hathaway, man?
The agents of FTR. Uh, it could be, that's another like peanut butter and chocolate thing. Like I'm not sure how the comedy is totally is going to fit with the sort of seriousness of FTR, but I'll go with it. That's fine. I'm okay with it. You know that segment did more for it more than anything for me is just reinforce how tiny all the dudes in there were because I have met Ricky Morton in public and Ricky Morton is roughly five foot one.
And he was taller than both members of FTR and Stokely in that segment. Just a weird... I'm not sure if that did anybody any favor. i'm when i say five foot one i'm exaggerating guys just so you know but it's a but yeah not a big guy anyway um yeah no i really actually like that i think that could be a good pairing so uh
WWE bought AAA. We've talked about this. They broke this news while we were having our meet and greet and we were all watching the pre-show on mute trying to figure out what the hell was going on. John Oron from Puck has reported on it now, says they're hoping it'll increase ticket sales. I'm not exactly sure what he meant by that, except, I mean, I guess you're selling tickets in Mexico, but AAA was already selling tickets in Mexico, so I don't...
I'm a little bit perplexed, but about what he meant. But yeah, I mean, there's a lot of people who are suddenly not super excited about this WWE AAA thing, and I totally get it. I think that it's... I think that it'll be interesting to see. I mean... I'm not as bonkers about the fears about the homogenization of pro wrestling as some people, although I do understand, mostly because I don't think it'll happen. I mean, I think that there was...
That fear would have been well-founded at some point, but I don't know. I don't know. I think it's a little bit of wait and see. I said before, this is a... This is too big of an acquisition for it to be just like some of the things WWE's done in the past. And I think that they have to be cognizant of this. And I'm going to just...
Hope for the best for now. I don't know. I don't know. But there's a lot of people in the comments that are like, I'm done watching wrestling if WWE just takes over the wrestling world. I don't know. They're doing a pretty good job. Yeah, we'll see. I mean, this is not going to be like, there's a chance, I guess, that this is a replay of the Saturday Night Massacre where Vince like bought.
georgia championship wrestling to get their tv time slot and everyone's like oh it's still gonna be good old georgia wrestling and then vince showed up and put on and played like old matches old new york matches you know for the tv show people lost their minds
If they try to pull that shit in Mexico, that's obviously going to be a problem. If all of a sudden it's just like... like Triple H in Mexico saying, here's some stuff we think you'll like better and it's just like Evolve matches or like stuff from, you know, just whatever, then I'm guessing that will be absolutely terrible.
We'll see, man. I mean, we see what they did in the UK. Well, they really messed with the NDC there, you know, and now they're gone. I mean, I guess I don't know if they probably wouldn't be gone if Triple H had been in charge the whole time, but who knows? Who knows? Anyway, um... We're going to be back here on Monday. We're going to have a roast of the WrestleMania roast.
No, we each got to come with one WrestleMania joke, one WrestleMania roast joke, and one rock joke. So the rock, the roast, the WrestleMania. And then we'll just, we'll move on. But it's a roast, so we can be as mean as we want, and no one can be mad. That's the rules. I guess those are the rules. I guess that's it, man. Do you want to get your plugs in? Yeah, man. Catch me on 7 p.m. in Brooklyn. Brand new episode today with the wonderful JB Smooth. It'll be out right now. Also, just...
A special thank you to everybody who came out to Wale Mania and had such a great time. Shout out to everybody. Jey Uso, Naomi, Ricochet. Carmelo Hayes, Big Omos, our hosts, Big Swole, Samantha Irvin. Now, is Big Swole related to Swole of No Limit Soldiers fame? Is there any connection there? I think there might be a, they got probably some related cousins down there in that family tree on some Fatu stuff.
It might be there. Zillofatu, everybody who came through. It was a great time. Thanks, everybody, for the kind words. And just stay tuned, y'all. That's all I'll say. Stay tuned. Stay tuned. Say two. Oh, like the future of Wale Mania? We'll see. We'll see. We'll see. I'll just say we'll see, guys. But I would just say stay tuned. I love being cryptic. Did The Rock have anything to do with the end of Wale Mania? Did he involve himself somehow?
Funny enough, he did kind of involve himself last year. It's all an energy drink. Oh, yeah, that's true. possible surprise appearance. Anyway, we'll tell those stories another day. 10 years, amazing. Thank you, everybody. Catch you next week, man. I am going to sleep, Dave. Yeah, me too. Guys, thank you for listening. Thanks to our producer, Brian H. Waters. Thanks to our EP, Ben Cruz.