Hi, everybody.
Welcome to the Renee Stubbs Tennis Podcast. Caitlin and I are back together. We had a little of sabbatical last week. Hope you didn't mind.
You were on school holiday.
Where were you?
I was a tennis camp with my family.
Oh, that's allowed. I was just chilling.
Actually, that's you deserve that.
I thank you. I do deserve that from time to time. But we are back. We are back in regards to the last couple of weeks. Let's talk about the last couple of weeks. But more importantly, there was a lot of very interesting results this past week, including before we get to anything, the fact that Germany took an entire day off at a tournament for Easter.
Didn't realize Germany was that Catholic. Well, apparently to be off for a good Friday, because I was like, this is your prime time, this is SAMI finals day. They just skipped d Do they always do that? District? I always sky.
I don't remember Easter moves around, right, Great, you don't know remember the whole Biden situation where they had trans Visibility Day and it was on the same day as Easter Sunday, and what the people in the right, lost their money. I lost their mind and their money. Oh I'm losing my money right now looking at the stock market. But yeah, they all lost their mind because they're like, how can Biden do that? It's like, well, Easter, he comes around and changes all the time, and it just
so happens. It was on trans visibility Day, so he honored both, which is what the president is supposed to do.
The normal presidents do that. I was shocked because it was a Monday final, which meant that we did not know the results of Schuecoat until this morning on Monday.
I mean, come on, like, I mean listen, I'm all for it, like celebrating Easter. And I had an amazing event last night that I went to. It was called later Sata. I had my Jewish friends here in New York invited me for this really fun event and it was great. And like everyone like, I'm all for people celebrating way they want to celebrate. You're a party gal, But to take a whole day off a tennis tournament for.
Well, one thing. I was thinking to myself when I was watching Carlos Alcaraz and Holgaruna play in Barcelona in their final, which we will talk about on Sunday. On Sunday is you know I've lived in Spain. I love Spain. They are very very progressive there, but they're also a majority Catholic country. And I played, Oh, this is interesting that they are playing on Easter. They played on good Friday. And Germany, which is not I just think of Germany as like very secular.
Apparently from our very German cohort, Trya Pekovich, Apparently that area Stuttgart is quite Catholic and conservatives.
Yes, okay, that makes more sense because that's why I don't think they were shutting down stuff in Berlin on Friday.
No, but I just don't even remember that happened. I don't think i've ever heard that in a tennis event. And I played a long time, and I played over Easter.
I was shocked to see no tennis on my TV from Stutgart on Friday. Yeah, but I was very happy to.
And I was like, did it rain? And I was like, wait, it's indoors.
Great, it's indoors. I was happy to have a little extra tennis on Monday morning from Stutgart. A final. Usually you just see the beginning rounds of a tournament shall we start with Stugart as a result, and Sugar, let's.
Get to it. Let's get let's get to and then we're going to get to some really sort of funny things that happened also in the tennis world this past week or so. But Elena Alona Osta Penco, like when she's on, forget it seriously, like she's that type of player that you just pray and hope that she has one of those days and just things don't really go her way and then it can be pretty horrendous the tennis that she plays. But when she's on and she's
confident and especially indoors, okay. And also this court suits her because it's a bit of a slippery clay court. It's not great for footing. Like, you know, even even the great movers, and arguably Eagerciante is by far the best mover on clay, and Coco Gough you see them, they're kind of slipping a little bit. They don't really have that same ability to slide and be controlled into the shot and you're a little bit It's kind of like how Charleston as Charleston is also very so brief.
Aus of the hard true being a different.
In particular, it's pretty well. I've played on them both. I did not play on Stuttgart's hard court. It was I played it when I was a hard court tournament, so clearly the footing was much better.
But now that you say that, Sugart has been the scene to some horrific, horrific injuries actually on the women's tour. I'm thinking actually of a friend after a Packvich I think had to pull out of a tournament, had to put out of the tournament a couple of years ago with a high ankle spring. I feel like I was one of the worst injuries I've ever seen. So maybe there is something to the fact that it's slippery in there and indoor clay, I don't know indoor clear I think it strange.
I think what it is is is when you do an indoor clay court like that, that is a they're bringing the clay in and they're laying it down over a certain amount of time and hoping it settles and then they play. Whereas when you're playing outside on a clay court that is like a Barcelona or a Munich or any of these other tournaments, those clay courts are
there all year long. They're being played on all the time, they're getting warded all the time, getting packed down all the time, they're getting you know, rolled all the time. So they're a perfect clay court. So when the ball when you're sliding, it's the same feel, whereas indoors they're sort of laying that down and it's kind of just
like it's not really the same anyway. Having said that, Ostapenko's game lends itself really well to that because she serves big and she hits it into the corners hard, and it's not as easy. Like if Eager was ever going to play on clay court, which most of us would say, if she was going to beat Ostapenko, it would be on a clay.
Court, right absolutely.
But if there was a clay court for her to not.
Play her on, it would be this one.
It would be this wise, And so I think that's why it wasn't that big of a shot that Eager did lose to her on clay. Even though now it's zero and six, it's starting to be a little mental, but it's also that surface that clay court did not suit Eager. It'll be interesting because they're going to play each other if they win their subsequent rounds in Madrid this week again not ideal for Eager. It's a little altitude and Madrid, so that ball does like fly on you.
The serve is important and the biggest issue for me if we go back before Ostapenco beating Saberlenca, etc. The biggest issue for me when Eager plays her is the serve is so vulnerable, and I have talked about this ad nauseum and I will talk about it when it comes to players like Eger, when it comes to players like Coco. The serve is so bloody important, and Eager hits the same serve almost every time on the second serve. It's that kickserve that goes right into Ostapenko's best shot
her backhand. She's deadly on the returns. Eager has got to figure out a better way to get more first serves in the court. Her service motion is so discombobulated, there's no fluidity to it, and you know when she hits it well, she hits it really well. And you've got to serve well against Ostapenco because if you don't, she's crushing returns on you, and she can serve you off the court as well, because indoors, particularly os Penko serves well.
So here's a question that we got into it a little bit over the weekend because there's so many people who've been watching the Osta Penco Schiantech matchup for years now and sort of marveling that there is such a lop seted head to head. One thing that's you know, you started the show by saying, you know, if Ostapenko is on watch out, sure, but the truth is Elene
Ostapenko is not on all the time. Otherwise she would be winning more than one Grand Slam and winning more than you know, one tournament a year basically, which is kind of where she's netting out, which is not bad. I take that career in urbeat but well, you know, sure, but there does seem something particular about this matchup if some of us find it sort of comical or nuts
or unexpected. But because you have coached against and with players who have maybe matchups that are certainly unfavorable and at a certain point become a little bit mental, which I have to imagine, you know.
One of the face wife. Yeah.
One of the folks that I that I talk to a lot on the is Anaesthesia from the grounds pass podcast, and she was like, you know, maybe I'm just crazy, but it looked like Ego went out there and was sort of expecting to lose, and the fact that she
got three sets was actually sort of positive. You know, there's so much fraughtness about this particular matchup that, yes, of course youlln ask to pink A one on to beat her innes Abalanca in a pretty you know, close but decided affair today, But like, what is it about that matchup other than you know, the server you know, talking to me about how important sort of matchups are and why this is maybe something that's festered between the two of them.
Yeah, listen, it's it's always going to be a matchup. It's always going to be how someone plays, you know, whether it be myself. In my playing days, you would walk on a certain court against a certain play and just be like, I have their number, I know exactly what they do under pressure, I know exactly what I can do under pressure against them to hurt them. And so there's that sense of comfort level when you walk on the court knowing that your best or your you
know a game will always beat their a game. And that's a good feeling, right, So Ostapenko knows that she is going to take advantage of the second serves. That's for one. She knows that if egg is not controlling the point, she's not a great defender, particular on the forehand side. And so you know, oster Penko uses her flat ball striking and aggressive play. And also Ostapenko and I have coached against her a bunch of times. She is a play that you go, Mmm, what's her strengths
and weaknesses and where does she go under pressure? And a lot of coaches will tell you that they don't really know, you know, because she she has a tendsity like the forehand cross call, there's no question about that. But then she can pop one down the line and you're like, Jesus, where does that come from? And it could be on the biggest point of the match. So the unpredictability of how she plays is actually such a positive thing for her. And it's honestly, it's what I
like about her game. And I realize she has a lot of haters and a lot of sometimes you don't know, I don't even know if she thinks she knows where she's going with it.
Like I like watching her because she's a chaos. She's a chaos agent. That's what I like. I recognize that it's not that you know, enjoyable probably to play against. But also I think you're right, she doesn't necessarily know. Yeah, she doesn't seem that connected to reality in always.
And I want to see eager start producing a little bit of a variety when she plays against her. I didn't see one drop shot. I didn't see one attempted real slice. There's no attempt now it is let me backtrack. It is not easy to do that against Ostapenko. She's hitting the ball so hard and flat immediately. But there were times where I felt she could have done a drop shot, hit a bit of a different shot, and she chose not to. There was a huge point in
the third set to go. I think it may have been to even it up in the third set when she went down that break and she had a second serve backhand, I think it was maybe to go fifteen forty, et cetera. And she chose to go for her backhand down the line, which is a very good shot for her. But every now and again to see her do it on Shaburt just like hit a little drop shot off that return you know, Ostapenko's running backwards. She's not a great mover on plays, She's definitely not a great mover.
So you've got to get her moving. And sometimes you've got to get her moving in uncomfortable areas on the court, like slice the ball, short drop shot once or twice in your life in a match, because when you become predictable, that's predictable for them to be able to read what
you're doing. Offer them return all the things, and Eager made some really bad bad choices of shot and bad errors in the third set, particularly offer a turn like she'd be getting into the third set or getting into the game, it'd be fifteen thirty on Ostabenko serve or fifteen you know, love thirty and she would just miss a return, and it's just like what is that? And that is pressure because she knows if I don't hit
a great shot, she's going to hit a winner. But sometimes you have to force your opponent, particularly in really critical moments, to hit a winner. And it was very similar to what Runa did to Alcharz today. We'll get into that, but I just feel like Eger panics. She doesn't play the ball behind Ostapenco enough. She doesn't play enough variety. She doesn't hit a couple of high balls like Ostabenka loves the ball in her hitting zone, get
it above her shoulder, particularly on the forehand. She doesn't like that shot. But she doesn't try the variety.
So the next time they're projected to play and I don't like doing the like, well, you know, they're probably gonna beat in the quarterfinals. They'll probably, you know, because I feel like tennis, one of the things we like about it, right, I like about it is it's so unpredictable, you don't know, you know, making projections into the semis and finals just feels like an exercise and stupidity. But there's a chance they could play again very soon.
Yeah.
On this surface, which is also Madrid at elevation, is a fast court, which even though it's clay, will probably also favor well, it's certainly what they do play.
It won't be a massive like if it will be the play against Ostapenko on in Rome or in Paris, I think it will be a different result. But if I was coaching her and we got sort of getting to this before we started the pod, is that how do you change that mindset for the player, and it's kind of like a you know, a reset in their own brains. And I would say to her, look all these other times before you've done this, you've done that,
you've tried this. You need to go out there without a doubt in your mind that you're winning this match. And you know, I had a situation where I was coaching Carolina Plushkov and she had lost many, many many times to Petrik Vitevaunt her country rooman. They played a club levels. They weren't exactly great friends. They you know, she didn't necessarily like losing. And I gave Carolina three
things only to think about in that match. I wanted her to cover a certain forehand, I wanted her to cover a certain serve on a big point, and I wanted her to hit it to one spot in particular. And I literally gave her two or three things, and I said, and you're not losing this fucking match today, Like no, And even her husband said to me, what do you think? You know, he would always sort of
say what do you think? And clearly I was always positive with ever whoever she played, But I was like, oh, no, she's winning today. And he looked at me, are you serious. I go, oh, yeah, she's winning today, because I knew that there was two shots that Petra particularly liked. And I think that once you know that, it's sort of like knowing what your opponent's strengths and weaknesses are. When you walk on the court, you know what they're going to do and you think, oh, oh, I've got that.
And I think that that helped in the very first game when Petra, you know, hit a certain shot or two and it was almost like Carolina looked at me like, oh, I've got this. So you've got to be very very positive to your player, tell them one or two things and tell them you're not losing this fucking match today, And that's the way you have to be. I would be with Eager. I would give her two or three things.
I would definitely tell her to hit some drop shots more and make her move and hit some angles, get her off the court, and then drive the ball. But if you're going to just try and hit with her, you're not going to win.
Last thing and your serve.
You've got to change your surf.
So yeah, last thing, I need to because some of the things you talked about, and I was asking about, were like a matchup specific strategy. More broadly, you know, I think obviously this is the part of the season that Ega tends to emerge as our dominant. Obviously clay quarter she's got, you know, some competition maybe from the Elena's Fidelina's of the world at the Cocoa Goths. You know, it was nice to see Mukova obviously get to the
French Open final last year. But by and large, like when the clay season goes outdoors to a slower surface, it's egos to lose any concern for you with EGA's play so far this year, this isn't typically when she does that. Well anyway, she doesn't typically have a good
Australia or a good Middle East. She doesn't you know typically, But yeah, like between that hardcourt season, she said, periods in the Sunshine doubles, you'd want her to, I think, be better looking than she has looked so far this year. Well for sure, any.
Look at two three years ago she had a thirty seven match win streak, right, I mean from the Straina Open, the moment esh Body pulled out as number one player in the world, eager one, you know, Indian Wells Miami, every Clay caught tournament, the French Open, she was on fire. So you can't say it is starting to okay. I call it plak on the brain. Right when you have a little bit of you know, where you're not confident, you start there's little things that start getting into your
brain and you got to chip away at them. And so you got to chip away at this eager match up with with Ostar pan Cope in some way. But a lot of it is she now has this like scared feeling of I'm not winning what I should be winning and I'm not getting the wins on Clay. What's happening to me? And so I is there concern? Yeah? Absolutely, I think there's a little bit of concern. Can she get it back and write the Ship in Madrid, Rome
and the French for sure? But if she doesn't, yes, I do worry about her psyche going forward because her game is so predicated on confidence, and that's where I would like to see her get a little bit more variety, because when game plan A is not on, she can start tapping into game plan B and see and it's it's it does It confuses me because she started the year so well, like that match she played against Keys, And I talked about this with Petgirl a couple of
weeks ago. I think that lost to Keys has really hurt her this year. A sliding door moment of that might have been a sliding door of twenty twenty five, the beginning of it, because if she wins that match, maybe even if she loses in the final, I don't think that would have bothered her that much. Losing to Sabalanc in the finals the strain open. Just getting to
the final would have been a thing for her. But having a match point and losing that, I don't know, that has sort of put a little chip or a little park in the brain. Maybe she's lost the confidence to finish matches or I don't know, because.
She's definitely one of the more mental players, you know, and I think, you know, I'm confident Topeka, who just looks like she's literally kind of just hitting balls and whatever happens happens.
It's a different pressure level too, Let's be on.
Yeah, it's easy to go out and take out a one seed when you have no pressure and everyone's sort of you know, you can smile. I mean, even in the Magic against Sablenkaaka had all the pressure then has to pick all with house money for sure, Whereas Ego, I think she has a lot of expectations, you know, and I think compounded by the fact that she's already a player who's like pretty mentally, you know, on or off, and I think that.
Sort of believes that she's going to beat everybody on any day, whether she goes or not.
She doesn't.
She's like, well, it was just me. I played terrible. It's never about her opponent playing well. She's either I played great and I won. Yeah, you know, never never mind the fact that they played like crap. She played great. That type, but she is that type of player, and if she loses, it's because she played terrible.
It's never her string.
It's always on her strings. Wh to be honest with you, a lot of time. But also there are times where you hit a shot that was just so dumb as well, like but she doesn't look at it like that.
So the delusional part of her ballroom dancing career with this amount of delusion public do you think she's like, I am the world's greatest dancer.
Oh yeah, for sure, one hundred pc.
I love that.
I mean, but that, you know, the ego, the ego fesst out in the final today with Sablenca, because let's face it, Arena definitely has her own, like behind the shit kind of feeling, and she should, by the way, beause she's arguably the best play in the world. But at the same time today I think a little bit of horse's mental as well in Stuttgart, having lost in the final so many times there that I actually think that hurt her today.
I was going to say, you know, Arena Sablinka doesn't usually suffer in the self confidence department, until all of a sudden she does, and that's catastrophic. Yeah, so she still has that. I'm really impressed by her in the
last couple of years. You know, we've obviously talked about the yips on the serve and getting over the semi final hurdle, which for a while in Grand Slams was like her big h you know, gating mechanism where she just kind of couldn't get there even if she was superior to the person she was playing on that day.
So I think, yeah, like one of the things that I've hand really endearing about Arena Cblca she's so confident, she's so tough, valkyrie and all this stuff, except sometimes she's not and she's scared and it's a you know, emotional But again, I think that's part of the inherent drama of watching her and being her fan that I kind of like. But it seemed like that was a play today.
One thing I am getting a little bit tired of with Arena and listen, we all love the histrionics and the crazy and the speeches, but I'm really tired of her going after her team when she loses with Suckasm, I'm over it.
She loses, that's funny.
It's just like at that point, at this point, it's like, all right, stop telling your team, hey, guys, great job today. You know, it's just every time it's gotten, it's gotten stale. So we gotta Arena, we got it up that you just got to thank your team or not and just stop giving them ship because it's so passive, aggressive and it's a little annoying.
It's not funny.
It's just not changing. And then she tries to laugh and everyone's like, oh no, it's not funny. You've given guys ship.
Yeah, Also, they're your pete employees like, are they gonna.
Yeah, They're not gonna say yeah.
They can't put a mental finger up. It's like to see them doing. I like to see them. So you mention Runa and Ochras, should we get to that match?
Yes, let's get to that Barcelona.
Wow.
That was you know, it was interesting because we we sort of talked about a bunch of years ago that Runa sinner al Chirez, we're going to be the next big three, right totally that that was what everyone talked about, Oh this is the next big three. Runa, who was in the top fat he had that amazing couple of weeks being Jocko blah blah blah. Yep, we didn't even write down Jocovic. We got to get to that at one stage. But let me just say, Runa reminds me
so much of our Charaz. When they played earlier on I was like, oh God, these guys are going to go at it for years because they are very similar with the way they play, very unbelievably athletic. That both of them are so quick. They don't have massive serves, but they have great serves. They like to come in, they like to hit that little slidy, little touch fourhand volley like there was a volley today, there was a
There was a point yesterday that Runa played. I think it was four all or five all in the first set, thirty all, and he served and volleyed and he hit it unbelievable, little touch fourhand bolly, which you know hows to be perfect yence outcres because he's going to run it down. But when he hit that, I'm like, man, that was so gutsy of him to do that. And then to see him he was the more disciplined. And
this is the difference because Runa was it. I wouldn't say he wasn't disciplined before, maybe because he was young, but also I think technically he struggled a little. On the forehand, he was a little bit this in way. In this way, I think he's starting to really come into his own. He's had the same guy coaching him now for years. I think he had too many voices in his head. He had this coach and that coach, and he's had that same guy.
And that was his childhood coach. Then he returned to and I think that can't new what he shows. He's it looks like he's getting the same consistent messaging, which for him and I kind of like this about him, like he's kind of been a punk in the past, but he sort of owns it in a.
Way that I've once said famously on this podcast. And sometimes he's got a punchable face because he did act like a douchebag three or four years ago.
And way to go, hul Garuna, for he hasn't been.
Chew it's so much he's he's you know on the court. I mean what he he's display today, particularly in the first look second set, there's no question in my mind that Alcrez was absolutely hampered with that right quad sorry groin area, hip flexa. You could tell, particularly on his serve that he was struggling with and look, Alcrez is not a bullshitter. He's not gonna be like, oh my leg hurts because I lost the first out. He's the type of guy that would love the challenge of playing
in Barcelona winning a match in three sets, yep. So he was definitely hampered, but the first set he wasn't. And that was a difference that Holgar Runa was way more disciplined, particularly in the tiebreak. I mean, alcre has tried to hit that back end drop shot like at three to two up on the MIDI break, and it was a terrible shot, Like there were just choices and his forehand goes off.
His foe hand. He missed some of those five feet. Just basic shit, basic shit. And I think that's sort of, you know, one of the things that's so endearing I think about, Oh God, I loves which everyone loves it. I mean, he moves feathery late like Federer. He's got the you know, battle intensity of Nadal, he's got the flexibility of you know, like he really does have all
the tools. But the one thing he's missing, and this he could really learn from Djokovic, is the mental fortitude and the ability to stay disciplined and stay in because he certainly does not have that, and it doesn't show in a match because he's so good. Well look, he's so fun. But in a match like this where it actually comes down to a tie break and a few
points and a few choices, he's taking mental vacations. He's like doing dumb shit, which I kind of again sort of like about it about him because it makes when he is able to keep it together almost all the much better but you kind of forget, like, oh, this is actually his big hurdle. It's not physical, it's not you know, creative, it's actually he's just you know, spacely too creative.
He's got too many shots, yes, and that's just making dumb noises. Sometimes did better than him in the final yesterday. He was more disciplined fresh line, and you know he was rewarded for it. And for me, I'm super happy about it because I absolutely you know how I feel about Carlos. I love this guy so much. He is so good for the game. He's very nicest kid you could ever meet in your tire life. And when I say, I've not met a nicer young man, he is nice to every single person.
Stuff I did got fun gossip, Oh good, mcgive me so apparently the ladies really love Carlos. Yeah, and he's gotten himself into some hot water among some prominent Spanish business owners because of his prowess. Prowess unless then makes me love him anymore because he's twenty years of age and let him have fun. Yeah, he's got the world.
Doesn't need to be tied down at this point in he's life.
No, he certainly doesn't.
And I'm happy about it, but it.
Is really funny just because you're like, oh, yeah, he's a twenty year old, sort of cultish young talent. But yeah, I can imagine Holgar Muna walking into bunk Sabadel Stadium in Barcelona, Spain, basically the closest thing you get to a home turf. Yeah, for Carlos Alcharz.
But it's interesting because Nadal. They showed Nadal winning that tournament twelve times, and I was like, fucking hell. First of all, what And then I thought the difference with Carlos and Rafa, because you know, everyone wants to compare these two Spanish greats. You know, Carlos is are great. I mean, what he's achieved in his career is phenomenal. Yeah, sure, but like Raff would never pick the shots that Ruff
that Carlos does. You know, even he had an opportunity to actually break back in the maybe it's in the tie break, and he came running in and he just hit he chose a shot that you know, I hate coming in on the forehand cross court. He hit an inside in fourhand in a huge point and ran in
and got pasted. And everyone's like, what a shot from actually, I'm like, actually, the decision looking easiest shot to hit in tennis as a running forehand cross court, so he like, those are mental decisions that someone like Ruffa wouldn't do, which is why Ruffa could win the French Open fourteen times because his discipline was through the roof. But anyway, I'm happy about Runa winning because it adds that little extra spice of you. How about the French Open because
Carlos is by father favorite, So why can't Runa? Why can't Verev? We know Sverev will have a hard time because he chokes when it comes to the finals.
But he didn't choke yesterday. But yes, he did not choke.
To say, but again, he's won that tournament now three times in a row. You feel comfortable and unique?
Is this?
For him to lose to Ben Shelton on clay? That should never happen, correct, Okay, I don't care what you think about no banns game. You should not lose that match, and he showed why he's the better player on clay. But I think Severev and Runa are saying to everyone just hold the phone a little bit. Carlos is not
the overwhelming favorite at the French. So if you want to put a little money on those two players, you should because they're probably well outside the favorite betting and I think that there's an opportunity there for someone to come in and say, Okay, maybe it's my turn this year.
Just like we talked about Eger and like, you know, let's get the worried Index. I am the only person I think who cares about Stephano's teeth buss. But I'm worried about him because he put out with the back injury. And I love him and he's been in years past a pretty solid performer on clay. He's won Monta Carlo, he's gotten to the frontch Open finals. I want him to get better because I like watching his beautiful one
hit of backhand and all of his shenanigans. But a player that I think you're gonna actually feel a little bit more excited about talking about for the Worry Index is Novak Djokovic.
Yeah. I don't know. I don't know what's going on. You know, we cannot overemphasize this is the greatest player of all time. He's won more than anyone else, but he is not getting younger, and at some point when you start getting the scar tissue, which is what I was saying, that pluck on your brain. You have lost the confidence to win matches. Even I don't care how great you are as a player. When you're not winning matches, it is not easy anymore, and everybody starts to think
you're vulnerable. You're making you're making errors that you didn't make before that you are not the discipline player that you used to be, and at some point you do. You're getting older and your legs aren't quite there. You're missing a shot because you're pulling the trigger too early, or you just don't have the discipline. And I just feel like he has won one tournament, one tournament and a year and what four months, five months going into
five months. One tournament that was the Olympics, and he did it over best of three sets, which I can say that I think that was the best tennis I've ever seen him play. But if it was best of five, would he have won that Olympics? I don't know. I don't think so. I mean because I actually mentioned that to Carlos when I saw him two weeks later. I said, oh, you know, bad luck, maybe in five sets you win.
He goes, yeah, I feel like two, you know, and I was like, yeah, because he feels like you can grind those matches out against someone like Novak and best of five.
But which is ironic because what I think has helped Novak Djokovic so much in his career is the quantity of five set matches, and we've seen him vulnerable in three set matches, and the irony now that that's hopefully playing into his favor, although let's see, I mean he's been with neither five set tournaments nor three set tournaments.
He's been when they had tournament outside of the Olympics, which again is a staggering cool achievement, which obviously he was very focused on and I know a lot of his fans were like happy because that completes the trophy case. But it is a little bit of a question mark because usually, I think at this time of the year, we're used to, even in years where he doesn't start well, seeing him be a viable contender. And I think we.
Felt that last year too. Remembers happening last year and we were like, oh, well, he'll turn up at the French and he'll do well.
He'll turn up.
He did it, and then of course he you know, the Olympics was I think it was just meant to be. I just do. I think there was a calm a thing there and it was meant to be. And that Raffle wasn't there at the French You know, he was there at the Olympics, but he wasn't the player that we know he is, and it just there was something serendipitous about it was his time, right, But everything else since then, I don't know. I don't know, And I'm going to go on the record, and I think I
think he might. I think we might. We've seen the best of no that Choko. It's I think he might surprise us with one random tournament win before he retires. But I think that we might not see him next year. Okay, Because I don't care who you are. When you're that great, losing sucks, yeah, And I don't care how much discipline you have to want to be better. Losing sucks. And
when you're used to winning everything, losing sucks. And so you start to it starts to really affect you and your personal life and you and yourself everything, And it's like, why do I want to keep dragging myself away from my kids who are getting older. And I've told you this that the US Open two years ago, it was the first time I interviewed him before he went on the court, and I thought, huh, he doesn't sound overly pumped about going out to this match. It was the first time.
So at where I was shipping the.
Yeah, it was like, you know, how do you get up? I think I asked him along the lines of something like, how do you get up for these You know, what is it about Arthur ash at night or getting up for these matches and putting yourself through this kind of thing? And he was like, yeah, sometimes I wonder myself and
I was It was something along those sides. It wasn't that verbata, But I remember in my brain going, huh, that's the first time I've ever heard him be a little bit sort of like negative and over going on the court. It was weird. And since then he has
not done well. So I'm just I just think that at some point it's hard to keep digging yourself out and keep pretending that you're still this great when you're not having the results, and you know, having Andy maybe was trying to, I don't know, get a little spark dying or get a little of Andy's sort of ideas to make him better. But I just think at some point we all get old.
Well, as you were talking about Novak Djokovic and losing, sucking and not wanting to go out there after, you know, a time of feeling like you know, you're not who you.
Used to be.
The interesting thing about this is I think Andy fought until the bitter end. He did, he didn't, he didn't go out on top.
Yeah, but also Caitlin, Andy was great, but he wasn't Novak. No like and and Andy had gone through his ups and downs. And Andy loved and he loves tennis.
He loves the I think he loves the grist, whereas I think the difference might be I think Novak loves the battle. But I think ultimately he loves prevailing over every type of obstacle, even those he makes himself.
Yeah, happen, I just I mean, listen. I think Wimbledon will tell the story.
Yeah, I think wimbled the French player. The French feels like it's not necessarily an indicator, but I think is the indicator.
Now. Interestingly enough, Sinner will be back and we'll see sin in Rome, so we'll see what Janick Sinner has been up to in his three months.
This is what I'm talking about. These are the storylines that we've needed and been missing. I love it.
And while we're on the subject of Sinner, there was an interesting tweet that John Watline put out and highlight of the fact that the Itia is now having the urine sample people that follow you off the court watch you in the showers, and I'm like, wait a second, that's always been the facts. And people were shocked about that, like what that's that's so you know, that's diving into your privacy and bro blah. It's like, yeah, the moment you lose, you would know as a player, you would
see these people. I was going to say something bad then, but I'm like, they're just people doing their jobs right now. But we would see these people with.
The growth, ladies and gentlemen, the just witness some real growth.
But it's gonna get worse. Here are these people sitting there in the corner with their fucking what do you call those things? Clipboards? You see the clipboard people. You just know I'm not showering alone. How even if you win a match or lose a match. You know, the clip people are there and they're going to clip you and make your pee. And so the moment you walk off the court, they are literally behind you like they are velco on you. They're like a hemorrhoid. They just
follow you into the locker room. Clearly you have women. So the women come into the locker rooms.
You're just doing your jobs.
They come it. You just turn your jobs, go into the locker room. You take your clothes off. You want to shower. Now, a lot of people shower, including myself, because you know, when the water starts in the shower, you're like, oh my god, I gotta go to the toilet's so bad, right, Yeah, And some people pee in the shower, okay, and those that deny it are lying, okay, because everyone pee's in the shower, so fuck off. For those that you don't pee in the shower, you're not normal. Okay.
So I would go and have a shower because I'm like, oh my god, I've got a peace so bad. But i would hang on to it. I would hang on to it, Caitlin, and then I would come out of that shower.
This is TMO accepted.
It's not tears because it's important, and I would go okay, I would tell off, I put my clothes on, I go to okay, let's go pee. And I would go pee right, because when you come off the court, you dehydrate it. You've been out there for an hour, two hours, three hours, you're not hydrated. So it's really hard to pee immediately off the court. And some people pee during the match. I never did that because I wasn't a person that went off the fucking tennis court like everybody
else does on tour now, which is so annoying. And so now they're saying, well, they're going to be looking at you. I was like they were always looking at us in the shower. So why is this all of a sudden used to everybody.
I don't know. I've been trying to figure out exactly what is new about this to people, but I don't think there is anything now.
Caitlin, there was one time, right, just so people out there know how invasive it is. I was peeing in the cup, okay, and we ladies, you know, it's not that easy to get it into that cup right, because the stream sometimes doesn't go the way you want it to. Okay, I know, we get into TMI, but this is a fact.
And I've got the cup underneath me and I'm trying to find it, and literally the lady is standing three feet from me, right in front of me, okay, and she looks at me and she goes, I can't see the cup.
I excuse me. That makes two of us.
She goes, I can't see the cup. I can't see if the if And I go, well, lady, I'm sorry. If you want to see the cup, then you wouldn't have to test me because I'd be a dude. You'd be in here, okay, you would see my you know what going into the cup. I'm like, it's impossible to like, what do you want to stand up and do it? Like it's so invasive. So people that say, you know, tennis is the most tested sport in the world.
It's insane. I wanna perhaps suggest because I think you're right from what I can tell, it's not necessarily new. Maybe they just they definitely reissued the rules. So maybe people outside of the sport were surprised by it. Sounds like no player were surprised by Yeah. But also the thing that I think was new that that Warthimes tweet.
Maybe it was illustrating is that the agency clarified that showering is not an entitlement, which sort of is an ominous threat, which is basically like, if you guys don't follow the rules, we're not even gonna we're gonna make it outside the rules for you to shower eat at all, which maybe is me reading into it, but I think the emphasis on showering not being an entitlement, therefore, the implication is you could lose your It's.
So preposterous because you're going into the shower, you're not you have seb Look.
Here's the thing. I think, maybe not to get to go down this rabbit hole too much, but I think maybe the issue here is not necessarily about showers and people peeing in the shower. I think maybe it is if you were using a cream or topical substance on your body. Maybe the rule emphasis or they're going to wash it off is that they were going to wash off. I'm not an expert. I'm not and you and alling know about absorption.
Of you have just come off a tennis court.
Cause with you know, with Todd Blakes what you're saying. But I think maybe that's sort of again, I'm reading to some.
Of us at a certain age might be putting testosterone cream on them.
Would they oh okay, yeah, man.
Of pause, this is what happens. Oh but here's the thing, Caitlin. It absorbs in like five seconds. Second of all, you're on a tennis court for two fucking hours playing a tennis match where you're sweating and telling yourself off all the time. Yeah. So if they think you're coming off a tennis court to wash off your your your test cream, your creams, you are out of your mind. So the fact that they're putting that out there is just to make everybody think, oh, we're so stringent. You guys have
been stringent on the fucking players forever. So it's just nonsense that they put that out anyway, different subjects.
I think the one conclusion we can clearly draw is that, I.
Mean, did people not watch Icarus?
People should watch Icarus. What a great film Icarus.
Is, and they we're passing the p under the door.
Yes, that's for anybody who doesn't know. Is about a man who sets out to because he is a recreational cyclist, take advantage of the fact that he's a recreational cyclist and begin a doping program. And again this begins as a recreational.
Innocence like you taking Meldonia.
Exactly like me taking Maldonia, which is like, well it's technically not illegal. I'm a recreational level player. Maybe this will help, Will it help? Let me find out? Meets the guy. The guy who's helping him turns out to be helping the entire Soviet uh and I guess later Russian They went to Soviet, the entire Russian Olympic team skirt doping protocols, and he like set up the whole system. And then it becomes this expos a on which results
even way too much. People need to realize what they're in for it, which is amazing anyways, a great films. One thing we can be sure about, which is the tennis is doping protocols, agencies and approach still leaves a lot to be desired.
It is, but also trust me, they're not doing anything nefarious in the bloody shower because people are staring at you. Can we talk about little Harriet.
Dart and how the showering sort of factors under this as well, speaking of showering, Speaking of showering Harriet Dirt, the British player losing a match in the first or second round.
She was not happy with her opponents body odor on the tennis court. Now, listen, we've all been there. I've all been there. I've had opponents that didn't smell good and it wasn't fun. But the fact that she said something.
To the umpire, can you make this girl weird odorant?
Like, if you're going to be that person and listen, let me just say, Harriet Dart is great, she's funny, she's a sweetheart. She lost her mind a little bit here and she did apologize and it wasn't a great look. The opponent her name are skipping me. But she put out are opponent Instagram later for a Dove commercial, which I thought was hilarious.
Yeah, she would basically said, hey, Dove, sounds like I need a sponsorship.
Yes, which I thought apparently probably does. But I thought that if you're going to do that, Harriet, just say it to your opponent. Just go, you stink. I don't like if you're going to do something on the court out just because then nobody hears it, right, you just say it to her and maybe you get under a skin no pun all right, but I did. I did. It's not a good look, but I did have a laugh about it. It wasn't great, but.
I think because it ended well with Harriet apologizing and the frenchwoman making a joke about it, it is.
All fair in love and war.
I guess so.
And I do feel like sometimes we lose our mind on the tennis court because people lose reminds we've all done some crazy shit.
Should we talk about a player who is losing your mind at the WTA right now? The Senko let's see a Serenko, one of the Ukrainian players who has been very, very vocal about feeling like the Ukrainian players have not been supported enough. And this is not the first time she's made a statement about this. She's being very vocal from has been very vocal. She's one of the players. And to be clear, the Ukrainian players who have refused to shake the hands of Russian and Bella Russian players.
She's not alone in this. It's also Elena's Felina. I mean not I'm blaming them Marta Kostiak. Yeah, but Lesio Cerenko has pulled out and withdrawn and uh had give overs to her opponents, she's the one who sort of stands out as being the most sort of intense about this.
I'm not saying she's wrong to be intense about it, but now she issuing the WTA for essentially it sounds like kind of a combination of creating a hostile work environment and not supporting the Ukrainian players enough against She's.
Claiming that Steve Simon, the former CEO of the WTA, was not in essentially not supportive of her and very flippant towards her. That's how she felt. If you read the complaint and basically sort of going after Steve in a lot of ways and the WTA and is saying you weren't supportive of us, etc. Etc. And you said things that made me feel uncomfortable that all might be well and truly, and I'm sure, I'm sure that she felt that way. But listen, what I do know Steve.
You know, think what you think about him as a CEO or some of the things that he did as a CEO, But he's a good man. He's a good man, and he I would find very unusual for him to be not caring or not empathetic towards someone like Lisa Lisia Cerenko. I just can't imagine him being just, you know, kind of like dismiss bugger off like kind of thing. I can't imagine that at all.
What do you think is behind this?
I don't understand this.
Bring this into the courts.
I don't understand this at all. I don't understand this at all. Look, Lisia Cerenko is a little bit of a drama cointy. Any player will tell you that. Any person on the tour will tell you that she sometimes pulls some like drama stuff on the court, whether injuries or sicknesses or whatever's going on.
It's just like, oh, I think she possesses one of there's a stat oh the most defaults, defaults and withdrawals for a reason for all things, all things, So you know, unfortunately, it's kind of like the boy that crows wolf.
At some point people are going to be like, I don't believe you, yeah kind of thing.
So where is this coming from Ukraine? Or is this about your mental state or is this about something else?
Or and again, what the Ukrainian players are going through?
And believe I.
Cannot even fathom what they're going through. What Switzerlina has been able to do over the last couple of years and highlighting Ukraine talking about all the time, but going out there and winning for her country like that to me is incredible, and she talks about it openly all the time. Now, why isn't she saying or standing up
and saying I feel the same way. It feels a little bit unusual and a little bit it doesn't feel like you would think that all the Ukrainian players would be more supportive of this situation.
It is odd that and sort of maybe indicative of what's motivating this to your point that the most dramatic, the most sort of uh possessing of other stuff that's
going on player. I mean, to me, it's hard not to draw some comparisons between this and the PTPA, which is like, hey, have you know in the case of the PTPA law, so it's like, hey, have the players gotten short tripted by the tournament with regards to prize money and like the scheduling and stuffing like this, Like, yeah, there's some valid points here, like has it been extremely hard for the Ukrainian players to you know, play even after the governing bodies not just you the WTA, but also,
you know, the slam countries and the international competitions like the BJK Cup and David's Cup have stripped the Russian and bell Russian players of being able to play their own flag. Ye, like you know, nobody's playing the Russian or beller Russian anthems. Like, but I agree, like there's you know, it's shitty, but it's kind of like, hey, is this the format? What there is a lawsuit doing? What is the point of this?
And you can't single out she singled out a couple of particular tennis players.
Steve Simon is named in this suit. Some of the Russian players specifically are named in this suit. And it's just kind of like it's the same thing to me with the PTBA, which is like, hey, you guys, there might be some validity here, but like, why didn't you go and get some other support from other people? So this feels like it's more of a player movement. Similarly, if it was all the Ukrainian players, men and women, you'd kind of be like, oh, this seems like it's
a systematic issue as opposed to an individual grievance. Yeah, And I think that's kind of what both boils down to it to me, Yeah, and I mean it feels a little bit more individual grievance than it does maybe systematic problem that should be dissolved through the court of law.
Yeah, I mean what I'm going to enjoy seeing is Sitelena playing against Daria Kasakina and getting to shake her hand now because she sins Australia, and that is indicative of Derek Kina, who clearly has spoken up against you know, the laws in Russia and Houten and.
The government feels a little bit.
But you know, some of these Russian players probably do feel very anti war and but you but also at the same time, it's an independent contracting sport. They've made stipulations that clearly you can't come in with a Russian flag and all that sort of stuff. But these are individuals, and yeah, you can have a word to them. And look, I just think I just think it's it's a shame. I feel sorry for her because clearly she's going through something and this is to spend the money she's going
to have to spend to fight a lawsuit. It's crazy. I don't think she's going to even remotely come close to winning. But you know, I feel sorry for Porscha, the new WTA CEO, because she's coming a serious shit between Rebaka in her and now this situation. It's just like, oh my god.
Well, let's let's end the segment. Well, we're talking about Ukrainian players. To give a big shout out to a Linus Videlina who won the title in Ruin against a very exciting young player in Uga Danilovich, who I think like she's always been a hard hitter and she's somebody who I think is like kind of exciting to watch because she's kind of a dynamic player. But she's getting better,
she's getting closer, she's maturing. But Elena's Ferdelina, you know, at mid thirties, is still winning titles and getting to give victory speeches and shout out her beloved husband who we all love. Gay I'm on feast in a final, Like that's awesome, that's a great outcome.
No, she's so awesome, And it's just.
Like another fun indicator of like tennis is being played all over the world and all sorts of interesting people places with great and interesting outcomes simultaneously. You know, Like yesterday I was trying to watch the finals, and they were all on at the same time, and I was like, Ah, which one of these are? Yeah? What am I doing?
Only forty two ten TVs? You need to be that person going into a kind of a good problem. Now, we've got a good bar across the street from me now called thirty Love.
Let's go check it out.
We should go check it out. Apparently they've got some booths. We'll check that out. But anyway, we do want to give a shout out to the teams that made the Bachk Cup finals. It's going to be in Shenzhen in September, after the US Open, which is playing. Frankly, I think is better. I think it's a better time to have it right after the US seven November instead of November, because everyone is absolutely tapped and after the US Open.
I've you know how I feel about this. I'm always like, let's just get rid of tournaments after the US Open, like the US Open.
Should be and Serrien Williams agree about that, one hundred.
It should be the pun ultimate event and then it should be this is the way I would do it, the WTA finals and then Billy Jean kin Cup like do it big time, you know, and have the home and away ties.
They should have it at the same time at the same venue tennis festival.
That certainly could be possible. That certainly could be possible.
Certainly, it's like they do Ncuba's uh not for basketball an certainly because it's only team, but like tennis sort of culminates like the team and the individual competition are like pretty condensed.
Yeah, that could be an idea.
I mean a lot of times it's the same player.
There's too many tournaments. There's too many they play too late and the w you know, the WT schedule finishes super late, as as does the ATP and then you have the Davis Cup and the BJK Cup are at the end, and it's just like, oh my god, everyone's like an end Togo. I need to have a holiday because I got to be back in Australia in three weeks. So it's just like, you know, anyway, So the teams that qualified were a Great Britain, Japan, Kazakhstan, Spain, Ukraine,
so congrats to them. Can't be cool if they want it. Actually, USA Italy because they are the defending champions, and of course the host nation is China, so they are in there.
As well, so there's some.
Great there's gonna be some great matchups there. Unfortunately, the Old Aussie's lost to Kazakhstan in Australia because Ribakina went down there and played, so that was a big help for them. And so yeah, so some great teams going to be in the girl and I do really.
Like BJK Cup. I've never been to a single match.
I have been to Shenzen.
I've been to Shenzen as well.
You lived in China, so good to see that. Obviously, we want to see the support there. And so the money for Billy Jean King Cup is so big, Like I'm really happy for them. And of course I'm not going to bitch about this because Billy won like two thousand dollars when she won Wimbledon singles. But they're winning millions of dollars. It's crazy how much money they're winning at Bella Jean Kin Cup. Like the team is making so much money and so good.
I love to you.
We should be yeah, you know how I feel like about But god damn, I played twenty two years.
To make sure they didn't get that backed.
I didn't get that prize money. So all these players should be out there busting their ass for their country because there's huge money on the line there.
But anyway, anything that we're looking forward to, I'm going to look forward to watching Madrid, which is a Master's one thousand, and I'm going to use this opportunity to once again call for the cowards who run it to bring back the blue clay.
No, it's too slippery.
It was terrible. It was a beauty.
I know it looked good, but it's one person. I do want to see how she's going to go over the next couple of weeks. Is Coca golf as well, just kind of lost away a lot this year losing to Paolini.
You we're going to add her to the worry index.
I'm I'm adding her to the worry index a little bit, just because the serve and forehand again broke down against Paolini.
So it was fun to see PERLINI yeah, it was very way fund of your back.
She's got some serious points finals Paris and finals and Wimbledon. She has a new coach in her coaching box.
Find is your palain with But yes, Clark Lopez, I cain't of expected to win.
That match, Mark Lopez, Yeah, yeah, I was a little bit surprised there. Coca got up in the first set and then lost her serve, and then again at four or five in the first set down love fifteen. No big deal, right, it's four five love fifteen, No big deal. Double fault, double fault yep to go Love forty and then missus a easy back end white by mile and I was like, what the.
Hell is that? So, you know, technically pressure mental.
As soon as the pressure really gets on her, the double faults, and that should not be happening indoors, and it should definitely not be happening on clay because on clay you can get away with hitting an average serve because you can run the ball down better. So those things are a little bit of a concern. And you know, the service motion, she gets on the front foot too early. Oh god, I could go on forever about it, but I won't. There is a con and yeah, there's there
is a concern. I would like to see her and Eager playing against each other at the French at some point and maybe quarters of Semis and see who can battle there their their brain plock away, the battle of the brain black. Yeah, But but anyway, all right, guys, It's been a great couple of weeks.
Spring is really here. I'm excited about the just preponderance and comments. It's still called here, although we had a couple of nice days. I'm really excited about Center coming back. I'm excited Runa, as you said, ascending back up into the injuries. Okay, yeah, are nursing. I'm going to give a shout out to Pas because I love him. Silly backhand and it's silly whole.
She's silly backhand, He's got beautiful back He's going to be Slice needs to work.
But yeah, I'm.
Sabalanc Is still out there being crazy.
Oh one last call out. Nike just fatably gets a lot of ship on this podcast because they've basically ignored tennis for what Likeim Kardashian like get out here. But the Lilac Springtime Easter basket color that Sablanca and Carlos Akar has played in over the weekend, It looks so good on that red clay Do you love it?
Yeah? That looks great. I will say I really like new Balances looks on Coco.
Yeah, she's they don't kill us, they don't mess with, they don't miss And also I think on the men's side, Tommy part they don't mess with him either. Yeah, they well, I mean both of them are beautiful attraction, which a great parties and the whole thing. But the god they're succeed with their kids. I think they both almost always look phenomenal and even if they don't look their best,
they look great. You know which I think we should all be so lucky is to walk out on to the court with a great kit shout look, good play.
Because you know, if you don't look good, you can still play well. There are some players that do that really well, they will remain nameless.
Thanks.
Thanks for joining us, everybody. We'll see you next week.
Bye.