Questlove Supreme: Joan Jett

Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio.

Ladies and gentlemen puts up. This is Quest Love separate way, I believe. Is this our first Quest Love Supreme back together since since what like last April?

Since the oscars, I feel like I've not spoken to me.

Yeah, I think this is the first one. Maybe we did like one episode or something like that. But yeah, I was about to say.

Like this, it's been a long time. We've been doing a bunch of one on ones.

But I'll start off our episode people by saying that because of the ungodly amount of hours that I've spent at the Windwood train station or taking the one of five and the one of three bus to my insurance job to pay for a demo, I feel just a little bit more connected to our guest today than any than any other guest that's.

Been philadelph adjacent. I'll put it that way. Now, I got excited. I get excited when any Philly adjacent guest comes on too. Oh yeah, Quest of Supreme. Uh. And no matter how much New York tries to claim you.

I know for a fact that you did hard time at Montgomery County. You know, once once in Philadelphia, always Philadelphia, AnyWho Philly.

And I lived in Pittsburgh and I lived in Eerie. Oh, yes, lots of different Yes that's us.

Yes, my mother is from Pittsburgh, so yeah, I am definitely a share of fair share.

Family members that you know have have.

Educated edumacated me on just life in Pittsburgh in general. I'll say that our guest today, of course, as a legendary singer, legendary songwriter, producer, let's not forget a kick caass guitarist, a member of two legendary units. First, of course coming to us as a member of the Runaways, a band who pretty much defied all logic and stuck to their guns and pretty much had inspired a generation of musicians and creators around the world.

And of course the second band needs no introduction.

Of course, I'm speaking of her namesake, Joe Jet and the Black Hearts Class of twenty fifteen Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. What can I say without her? You know, I don't even want to limit it to just there's no riot girl movement. There's just there's a whole portion of hard rock and punk and a lot of post late eighties early nineties bands that formed in LA that really want to existed without our guest today. So, without

Were you was fine? Home in New York and on Long Island at the beach. Yeah, well yeah, I live at the beach. Yeah, I'm looking right on the water though.

All right.

You know, I just I discovered I discovered in the pandemic. And I keep telling everyone, especially New york Er, is this and they don't believe me. New York doesn't realize they have their own Mahuland Drive and they have their

Shit it was. It was pretty beat up, like when I moved here in nineteen seventy nine.

Oh so you're like a loyalist. You've been there for everything.

So what do you do right after the Runaways broke pretty much right after the Runaways broke up with seventy nine that I'm not my partner Kenny Waguna.

What do you make of it now?

Because like literally it's like if I didn't have to be in Manhattan at like the drop of a dome, like.

I would actually move out to Long Beach.

Like it's it's they totally I don't want to say just regentified it, but they literally did it.

Yeah, okay, you know they're making it. I don't know what you want to call it? Nice end quote, yeah, nicer.

Yeah. I wasn't. I wasn't ready for that.

So when I moved here, it was they just opened all the mental institutions or something. So when I got here, there were crazy people walking all over the place, and you could I could have bought my apartment for like twenty grand or something. But you know, those days are long.

The price is definitely going up.

So yeah, and now people want places like this so even more so.

Yeah, anyone's like trying to sell their house right now in Long Beach can easily take in high six figures to almost a million.

Definitely, That's that's where it is now. People are like headed out there.

So I start off of each episode with the question, Uh, what do you remember what your first musical memory was?

I can't. I can't be positive, but it would.

Be just one that you remember, not the technical all right, all right, singing Mary had a little lambite eight months what I mean?

But I think of my father playing classical music, or my parents listening to Johnny Mathis or something like that, Rank Sinatra.

Okay, how long did you live in Uh? Well, technically you're born in well Winwood, right, Yeah.

I was born a lack in all Hospital, so wherever that is. Yeah, I moved very early. I moved at like six months old and moved to Pittsburgh. So I can't really say I grew up in Philly. I was just born there.

So when you have memories of your childhood, what's the city you think of?

Maryland?

Oh?

Okay, I moved to Maryland from Erie, Pennsylvania when I was eight. When I was eight, so I moved. I lived in Maryland, Rockville, Maryland from eight to thirteen, so really formative years, you know, when you come into your own I guess, you know, go from being a kid to puberty and you know, all those big changes it happened, i'd say, eight to your teen years.

What effect does that have on someone that you know, where you don't have actual roots, like you kind of move every other year, every two or three years, Like what effect does that have on you?

As far as like.

That's a good question. I wonder how much of it I'm doing psychology on myself. I was thinking about this the other day. How much of it is my was my lifestyle from a very early age, from being on the road, you know, just constantly moving and also but growing up that way too, never really being in one place very long longest with Maryland when I lived there five years. So maybe you don't really feel secure and making friendships or any kind of relationships. So you know,

I suppose that's real. Do you have siblings or like, what's the No, it's.

It's well, I'm not good at faking it.

Hey man, I feel you.

I have a brother and I have a sister. They both still live in California. My brother's in San Diego, my sister's in North Hollywood.

Are you the baby in the middle or the oldest?

No, I'm oldest. Okay, I'm the oldest. I'm out here, oh instantly, you know, when I was sixteen pretty much, you know, and and I left and formed the band and not really at home much more after that. I think I see the I think I see the repercussions of that now later. But I don't know if that's my lifestyle or if it's from not really having that connective.

Family thing as the result of moving. Was that because you were an army brat or just my father.

Was you know, my father was an insurance man, so traveling insurance, traveling insurance man in the olden days. That is that a real thing? Or was that at a hostitle.

I went out to Either way, I went out to it to uh when would to sell insurance?

So I don't know, maybe I was like working for your father.

Yeah, yeah, but I guess you know, they have areas and they'd go and I don't know if it was a door to door. I really don't know. I didn't I didn't discuss it with them that much. But that's that's what my mother told me. Anyway, traveling traveling salesman. Okay, so we moved around.

Yeah, do you remember the first album that you purchased with your own money?

I should know this, right, or a single or a single well.

Probably was an Osmond brother's record.

Thank you. You know.

Oftentimes, maybe I shouldn't be that honest.

I was gonna say most most people get stuck with this because I think for a lot of us, the answer is always going to be an uncool answer, you know. I think for the shut up Steve, because no, I'm thinking my owners the coolest. But yeah, well no, you know, I would naturally tell people like, oh yeah, Jackson five or whatever.

But the real answer was Neil saidaka, but how's that going to look in print? You know? Not great?

Could have been the Chaps at five too. I mean you know what, I just I just got done watching the movie that you won thank you towards for I've been. It is so great, and it reminds me of growing up because I feel like the music I grew up listening to was a lot more diversified and a lot a lot blacker than people would I would even no, I suppose it just seemed to be a lot a lot of all those songs, all those bands that were

Thank you.

Yeah, you know, I think for a lot of people, you know, especially with this movie, the kind of the underline or the undertone of it all is basically like this was you know, it was easily lost in history. It's set in basement for fifty years, so you know, for it to get out one was the miracle. But you know, to also just let the world know about, you know, contributions to culture.

But thank you, thank you for absolutely. I appreciate that.

Absolutely, But even more than just the music, I see, you know what they were saying about the change, you know that they wrote upon this this change that was happening in society and just the way people looked at themselves and stuff, and it was you know, really quite poignant, I thought, and really on.

You know, I appreciate that.

Did you come from a musical family like a cousin or any of those things?

I really think everybody, I think if you gave them no to answer your question, no, nobody, not that they actualized. But I believe because my family all tended to be creative but never actualized it. You know, they were too fearful or didn't think it was their place or right.

You know.

Look, I know my dad loved art and he loved the jaw or paint and you should have done that, you know. And you know my mom all those things. My brother I know that he would have liked to play an instrument but didn't pursue it. And I'm sure my sister, you know, she's an artist too, she makes things with her hands. So yeah, they all have that thing, but didn't really get the chance that I kind of just grabbed and took.

All right, So what was the entry of or at least the moment that you felt like, Okay, this is what I want to do, like the curiosity factor?

What was that moment for you?

Hearing songs like the Bangagong by t Rex, just hearing certain songs on the radio all right now by the free because there was something that was a little out of tune with one of the guitars on the rhythm guitar, and something about that made me want to go, I want to make those sounds. It was something that connected with my bones, you know, with my crotch, and even

Everyone starts off with.

And then my family moved to Los Angeles. So now I'm like, okay, now I'm going with a place where there's gotta be other girls that want to do what I'm doing. It's gotta be in Los Angeles. He's got to be other girls that want to play mock and roll. And you know, I was right, And I'm sure if i'd really looked around Maryland or you know, any of the big cities are going to DC, I would have

Okay for you though, you know how usual or unusual especially you formative years, Like was guitar encouraged or you know oftentimes or was there someone like you might want to do piano or the clarinet or like something that.

I did okay in school, you know, but I wasn't very good at it, and I wasn't I wasn't that interested. And now I wish i'd now, I wish I had paid attention, you know. And then I had learned to play just so I could read music, but you know, just to be able to play other instruments. I was

So did you just learn to play just mainly about ear or you still don't read music?

Now that's just you know, was my records and stuff?

Were you encouraged because I think that yes, no, especially especially with anyone with a woman grabbing an instrument in the sixties and the seventies, hell even eighties, almost like I'm certain that there has to be some sort of figure there that says women can't do that, and women, you.

Know, everybody said that. Nobody encouraged me. Nobody only my parents who told me when I was a little kid that I could be anything I wanted to be. So now they couldn't turn around and say, well, you could be anything except a guitar player. So you know, they just thought I'd grow out of it, that I'd phase out of it and go into something else, which I think I might have happened had I not moved to California and been able to find other other girls, and

What he if, they want you to play acoustic instead? Yeah, like follow Mitchell.

Or yeah, yeah, pretty much, pretty much. But I knew exactly what that meant. Girls don't play rock and roll. So what are you saying to me? You're saying girl, You're not saying girls can't master the guitar, because I'm in school, I'm playing clarinet. There's girls next to me playing violin and cello, playing Beethoven and box So you're not saying that you can't master the instrument. What you're saying is rock and roll is sexual by its nature.

For me.

I want to be able to do this because I want to do it. You know, Mick Jagger rides out on a big inflatable penis. I want to do what the Rolling Stones do? You know what I had nothing to do with with that. It was about fairness. I know it doesn't make sense, but it was about and the right thing. What's right. I mean, I'm not hurting people, you know, I'm playing rock them home for Price's sake, give me a break. So that that's the kind of fire that would fuel me on through through all this stuff.

See, I never I never had the pleasure of having a conversation with anyone who you know, it's pretty much either first out the gate or at least in the pine pioneering stages of starting a movement, to to even ask them what their mind state is, you know, because oftentimes you know, our our greats leave and you know

You're just gonna be one of these local accidents. You know.

I wasn't thinking that deep about my process or anything.

I think he tried to talk me out of like pursuing my career.

So yeah, see, I don't understand that about people. This is what I want to know about people in dreams. You know, you're sitting here shooting the shit with your friends and you say what you said, do you want to play? And someone tries to talk you out of it?

Right?

Why is everyone dear to try to talk you out of it as opposed to saying, yeah, man, that sounds interesting, go for it. At least if you don't make it, you gave it a shot. You give you dream a shot. What is that about people?

I think some people get infent or they get intimidated when they see that your dreams don't include them.

And so they just have to shoot the shit down, you know what I mean.

That's like if I run a Hamburger stand, the last thing I want you to do is become a vegan.

You know what I mean? Don't don't do that, you know what I mean.

But I also think that oftentimes we're just I think in America we often training ourselves to do this safe thing. Like I think hopefully my generation is the last generation. What you're here like fall back on something safe, Like I definitely learned that from every Uncle COVID.

That showed us ain't shit safe because do what you want to know rightly exactly.

So what Okay, so you're a musician in Los Angeles and you're young at the time. Had this been you know, twenty two thousand and seven or whatever, you would have the aide of the Internet to help you. But what is the process of finding what you're specifically looking for, which I assume are women that play instruments and are passionate about it just as you are, Like, so, what's

No, And for the runaways, it was definitely an all women thing because you know, we hadn't hadn't really been done or you know, if it hadn't been done and been done years earlier with full grown women, but not

So Fante right here.

Fante is is probably to his family base, probably most known for being one of the first musicians to really take a take advantage of the i'll say the positive aspect.

Of internet colonization.

One of the one of the bands that he started was a group called Foreign Exchange, in which where where's Nick?

Now?

He's in Wilma's Nick right, but we're like to ask me. At the time, he was in the Netherlands, and uh, we just recorded that. We met on okay player on a meror site, and we just started trading files online back and forth and we'd complete an album.

We didn't meet each other until it was and that was until they didn't.

Even meet yet before they made a classic album, you know what I mean.

And so yeah, so you know what, what is the process.

Of how do you find these these first of a feather if you will?

Yes, in that time, I believe what we did is we put an ad in what was it the La Weekly, Okay maybe, and we went out to a lot of the clubs that I would hang out at and I would just survey the crowd and look for girls.

This is around seventy four or seventy five.

This would have been seventy five, okay, so like from a like after August, after August fifth.

So all right, this is what I have to know. You're in You're in California. Were you a driver? Did you have a car?

Oh?

I didn't drive, no buses. I took a lot of buses. And also my mother was, you know, sort of complicit in all this, so she uh would drive me to rehearsal. She would take me to the club sometimes and pick me up late at night.

Yeah, she So clubs weren't sweating like I mean, of course, now we live in a place where you got to show you know, damn near twelve forms of ID to get in anywhere, or it is your license.

K cull I went to it was it was for teenagers. There was no booze, so to worry about that. So there was no booze there. And I don't think she was really thinking about drugs or anything like that.

Who were your were you're any any of your contemporaries also sort of in that movement that later became names.

Themselves like no not really once.

Like Cherry and Lida, your band members sort of like come in to play.

How did you know that? Okay, this is this is it? They're the ones?

Well, we didn't have that many choices number one, you know what I mean. It was more like do we want to try? Well, first it was it was the drummer myself, Sandy West and I. We missed, yeah, and so we were solid as hell. Sandy and I. I took four buses to her house in Huntington Beach. Four yeah, four bosses, and I set up in her wreck room and we played you know, some just basic Chuck Berry rock and roll progression and said, you know, it was

Who came up with the name of Runaways?

I did?

Okay, so already at your marketing plan?

Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, I've been thinking about this for a little while now, you know, a couple of months at least.

Did you guys have a daily regiment or was just like when every time was free, then we'll rehearse or whatever.

But yeah, I really tell the truth, I can't remember.

Amazing.

How can you be a kid and also start this very adult thing?

Yeah?

All parents involved, like encouraging of this.

Or no, our parents were involved, but a couple of the girls were a year younger than me, so they were like in eleventh grade, so they still had school to deal with. And yeah, not all the parents were throlled about it. But in the end, I don't no. I guess they didn't want to fight their daughters or something. But for school, I got good, pretty good grades, and I took my ged I was already in twelfth grade, but I wanted to get out a little bit early so we could go on the road.

So, okay, I always wanted to know.

I guess in me the the initial incarnation of the Runaways, like why weren't you the lead singer or why didn't you want to be the before?

Yeah, I was way too shy at the time. And you know, I was way too shy. I had no confidence, you know, I just I had no confidence, and it was just really shy. It was amazing that I could do what I wanted, what I was doing, you know, just getting on on stage with the guitar.

But did you have your voice then? You just kept it as a secret or.

I sang back, I sang background vocals. Yeah I could sing. Yeah I could sing. I did wind up singing half of the leads on the first Runaways album because Shari didn't want to sing the rock and roll or the rock and roll harder songs. She felt that she didn't have the voice for it or didn't feel comfortable singing some of them. So the one she didn't feel comfortable singing, I sang the leads and I sang backup on everything else.

Man, gotcha.

So at this point, at this point in developing the band, who are you looking up to? Because again, you guys have ushered in. You guys ushered in an era and you know, pretty much your band's existence just basically starts a domino effect on again people that come ten to fifteen years later. But you know, in seventy five, seventy six, when you guys are doing this band, like who's cool to you? Like are the Stones and Zeppelin? Sort of

Like?

Yeah, I mean, I know I was disappointed with the Stones and they started doing.

Like you weren't an exil Lamain steep Stream.

Yeah, I know I wanted them to.

You didn't like something rock and roll.

You know, I didn't like them doing some girls.

Yeah, well it.

Was it was fine, but you know, I don't know. I guess I wanted them to be playing something that I could really rock out to.

You know, whatever, No one stays rebellious forever.

I know. I know that it's a.

Good seven year I.

Get it now, before you start doing your classical record or whatever.

No, I get it now, I believe me. But I think a lot. I think I really started looking to the punk rock stuff right away because the Ramones came out, I believe in nineteen seventy five, late seventy five, very first Ramones album and all the punk's rock stuff I was reading a lot about and I really gravitated very quickly to a lot of those bands because I felt, you know, kinship with a lot of them.

I mean, there's always like groups or artists or albums that are always on someone's cannon, like.

Their top five records of all the time.

You always see the names whatever, and I never sometimes you don't do the investigation of it, and you know, of course I've always seen them Ramon's name everywhere. Finally, I listened down from from top to bottom, like two years ago and realized, like how genius and hard it is to really convey emotion and lyricism in less than two minutes.

Hey, let's go yo a jam though, that's a jam exactly.

So for you, were you seeing that there was a science here, like, you know, the type of rock that you were you were fed as a child is way different than the ideas that you're about to spew into the world. Like for you, it was like, look, we gotta don't boris get to the chorus two minutes.

Right, Well, no, you gotta see. The thing was, it didn't really transfer that much into our music. Might might have translated a little bit to my songwriting, but you know, as a group, as a band, most of the girls weren't really into the punk rock the way I was. You know, they were much more they liked heavier bands, you know, more like you know or yeah, yeah, you know that heavier stuff, Rainbow you know, whichy blackmore that kind of stuff. So, you know, we didn't really see

What was the division of labor as far as the songwriting is concerned and what you're going to cover or who's gonna write what? Like, who's who's the primary songwriter of the group?

Was that your giant?

I think I think it was May For the most part, it was May. I wrote either songs with Kim Valley as a lyricist, or I wrote songs by myself. I think I wrote a couple with some of the other girls, but not too many. And yeah, so I guess I was the primary one.

Back then, Like it was sort of hard for you guys to break out in the States, but yet you know you're the magic's working instantaneously when you go overseas.

Like how much of a mind fuck? Was that too? Kind of because that's very similar to hip hop?

Like, you know, my band had to move to Europe for five years, right, just so that you know, in quote unquote pool of Hendrix and then come back to the Units States like that sort of thing. Like, but in your mind, was it a dream deferred or like, wait, what's going on here?

Or what were your feelings.

On I thought, well, you know, a lot of different a lot of different feelings. Yeah, one part of me had wished that we had the same sort of response in the States, but it was so different around the world. And Japan was like all girls and like the Beatles, like Mania, people fainting, girls fainting, and I think it, I think it kind of scared a couple of the other girls. I was exhilarated, but you know, there were people who were rocking the car, and we'd never really

On particular photo shooters.

No, no, no, no, they were giving us the ideas, you know. But then then in England, you know, England gets you know, they I think they got the runaways of a lot more than Americans did, but they still, you know, the English love to take the piss out of you. So we took a lot of ship, but there were a lot of people I think there that

So retrospect, where would you categorize the genre? You know, are you guys at the forefront of the La punk movement?

Were you just hard rock? Were you you kind of the.

Towards barer for what will eventually become like the glam metal scene that would happen fifteen years later with those groups in LA.

I mean I always just called it rock and roll, and I think what we did. I think what we did was punk rock to its core, you know, just doing dictating what you're gonna do and doing it and not listening to what anybody says, and I mean I thought, and doing that in the context of how society treated you at the time, I think it was the ultimate punk rock stuff. You know, even for the girls it didn't want to play in punk rock. They were being

So you guys pretty dissolved almost as quick as yeah, you came aboard.

Do you remember how eventful or uneventful the last night of the group was before you realize that it's not happening anymore.

I don't remember remember if it was. I know it wasn't a happy time, and we knew it was a

And well, I can assume that leader was one that wanted to do heavier stuff, right.

It was not animosity, It was not you know, it was not an anger or anything. We weren't going fuck you, fuck you, right, you know, it was just like because we had been friendly, we didn't want it to be weird and it's just like, just let me, I'll just go. You guys do your thing.

You know, it's weird before I got admit that in watching the documentary, I didn't realize that quote that Leader Ford was the Leader Ford and the Runaways, because I guess my my dealings with leaders any anytime, there was always a person that wanted to give I'm not even making any nugent comparisons, but if there was anyone that ever wanted to give like hip hop the middle finger with a quote.

It was always Leader. For I knew her more for her disdain of hip hop than I lived for like what she actually did.

Yeah, no, for real, Like I guess I should say I'm not surprised, but yeah, like I know her.

For her quotes of like why she ateed hip hop? So I always knew that. Whenever I hear the name Leader for it, I'm like, what happened now? But then you know, But then when I started the thing, I was like, oh, she was a runaway.

I get it now.

So I don't want no guilt by association though, because.

Hey man, we all know you made Light a Day.

I used to watch that movie every day after school when I was in like third grade, So we.

As a twenty one year old, are you feeling like Okay? Well, I did that? What do I do now? For you? It's just like on to the next, Like.

Did you know I was feeling like it was time to die? It is what I was feeling like. I was feeling like the whole city of LA was laughing, going we told you it wouldn't work. We told you girls can't play rock and roll, you know, and I just was I was not taking care of myself. I was drinking too much. My dreams were crushed, you know, and I had no friends. You know. It was like

So how long did the sort of the feeling of funk last before you started your I assume that, you know, starting the Black Hearts was your eventual Yeah.

Well, actually I met my partner, Kenny Luduna, my songwriting partner and my producer. He became my producer and manager because nobody else wanted to deal with me. We met to write songs for a movie that I had contracted

So it took about two years. First of all, whose idea was it to recover or to redo?

I Love rock and Roll? I don't think many people know that that's a cover song.

Yes, yes, I saw that song when I was in England with the Runaways and I saw this band on top of the Pops, the Arrows, and they were playing the B side to their hit, and the B side to their hit was I Love rock and Roll. I don't know what their hit was. The B side was I Love rock and Roll. And I'm like, wow, that sounds like a hit to me. And I went out to the record shop and bought the forty five, thinking, you know, the Runaways, maybe we could do this and

Go see life lesson you gotta go with your gut.

Yep, that's the second time you learned that lesson.

So how different does life turn for you once that song makes you pretty much a household name?

Well, just I think the the fame level rose, and we had more people at our gigs and stuff and made a little bit more money. Finally it could make a little bit more money. So those things change a little bit. But you know, for the most part.

But is that also a scarier feeling?

Because I think oftentimes when someone gets a success, the first thing in their head is, Oh God, how am I going to sustain this?

How am I going to make it last? What's the next single?

Yeah, there was part of that, but I wasn't like so far up there that it was. You know, when you're number one and you're I don't know, I guess you know on one level you can't stay there forever, and I guess you know, you know you have to have your next one. I guess initially we knew what that next one was going to be, which was Crimson and Clothes, right, And what was.

It about that song that made you want to choose that? Damn it? My my only question of the day. Okay, it's a great you want to say it? What made you want to cover? How change in the Shandals? Answer the question, I turned a light on.

Good and when I when I you know, when I met Kenny and I knew that he played those songs, and I'm like, so you played the money Mooney. He's like yeah, and I'm like, okay, so I want to cover Crimson Clover. I just thought, you know, it'd be weird because I didn't want to change the lyrics, and that was just the way I was. I wanted to, you know, push the envelope a little bit because I just wanted to.

The original recording. So so I guess psychedelic and so what was you guys?

Just my reason for different, I mean because Tommy's Tommy's like when they's I guess. Kenny told me when he was asked what is it about? You know, it was about LSD, you know, Glover, So it wasn't about really her so specifically, So when people ask people what I'm singing about, it's like, well, I mean, I guess I'm

So at that particular point, coming into the early part of the eighties and whatnot, are do you have a peer group? Are there is there a trusted circle that you can howl around with, like normally you know, birds of a feather flock together as far as like people liking each other's music whatnot?

Like was there a tight.

Knit community in the sort of the la rock community by this point for you at least?

Or were you still like.

Oh, I was gone isolated out there. I was out of there. But in seventy nine.

I came back to New York, Okay, into New York. So even in New York, like for that is there it was?

I mean, no, I didn't hang out. I didn't really you know.

I was also going to say, like everyone was sort of going new wave in New York and you're going straight rock and roll, Like were you a fish out of water?

And like were you sort of upholding.

A tradition that you felt would soon sort of take a back seat?

You know, I don't know that I thought I had that much. Could I planned it out or thought about you know, what's the future of rock and roll? Or a lot scentthier. You know that there was a lot of sense music going on.

Well, I mean, were you going to the Lower East Side and in the early eighties to see groups like Bad Brains or any like. Were you at all interested in the movement that was happening in the Lower East Side right?

I was, Yes, I was interested, but I was working too much to be I was on the road the whole time. I don't even know if I was around most of the time. I mean literally on the road all the time, pretty much in nineteen eighty five, pretty much, I mean at least through November and then you know, depending on what the tour was, we were always working and then be off through January and then start working

Yeah, that's that's real life. Like, yeah, real people have two to three people. Wait. I always wanted to know this.

Okay, so from my from my point of view as a record collector, all right, I'll explain to you Fonte, Well you probably know already, but like for me, Boardwalk Records is almost akin to like Malaco Records.

Oh wow, so.

Exactly what you mean that said?

I always wanted to know what was it about Boardwalk Records that made you choose that as your label, because I knew that sort of as kind of as as a second tier label for acts that were pop.

It in the seventies for soul music.

I know that Ohio players wound up on Boardwalk Records for like their eighties catalog.

I remember the Five Stare.

Steps morphed into Wow, the Invisible Man's Band, uh for the eighties or whatnot.

Kenny would know so much about this because he, you know, I think he knew Neil Bogart before we got oh wow, wow, you know, so Kenny knew him pre pre Boardwalk.

I didn't know that Neil boat Guard started Boardwalk Records.

Yes, that Costa Blanco, Yeah right, and yeah, and he just liked me and wanted he really liked me a lot and wanted me to be able to put out my record. So he said, you know, we'll put it out and he and he did, and he died like the week before when number one and never got to see if the number one, which really bums me out because he was such he.

Died in eighty one.

But yeah, I.

Did not know that.

But yeah, he was a real believer and you know, one of those guys that it always looked great. It was all sharply dressed and just you know, believed in me and believed in Kenny, I think more than anything.

Yeah, everyone that describes Neil Burgard describes it as like the last true like one of the last creatives.

And that was a.

Suit at least, I mean, I know the suit's a suit, but whatever.

Yeah, But I don't know.

For me though, I would say that, like you were so ahead of your time, was it weird to sort of have not a comebackup source but just to see well no, no, no, I'm just saying that a lot of these bands that started popping in the mid nineties late nineties started name checking like Jones, Jen Black Cars like or even with your work with the Runaways, like for you, did you not ever think that the day would come on which you would see.

Kind of flowers the affects of.

Your people that like grew up on your music or well especially like when the Riot girl uh with with Kathleen and yeah.

Yeah, because they totally did tip their hat to me and I and I knew it so because you know, they told me so, and it was it was great. It was great to see that. I mean, I always knew that there, whether or not people admitted it, that we'd have some influence you know, in life and too music and and that, and it's really nice to see it confirmed and see people say it, you know, and not just girl bands but some guys too, and that's really nice.

So yeah, I was going to say plenty of times where like Kirk has has name dropped you or you know or I know that role that was definitely a big fan.

I was there at night and at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame when he want.

What a night?

Yeah, So how did how did you know?

Was that was that surprising to you when you got the news or you know, I know oftentimes every every person I know that gets inducted.

In the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame has the same sort of like.

Neilistic if it happens, it happens whatever, you know, that sort of thing. But for you, was it when you got the news of you getting in, like what was the feeling behind it? No?

I thought I was very happy, you know, of course I thought, but I see, I'm used. I'm kind of used to not being up for awards my whole life. It's not really been what my career has been about, like nominated for a lot of different things, you know, it's not what's happened. So just the fact that got nominated I thought, was it was really nice? But I thought, you know, I don't know, I don't know if I'm

I'll say this much because you know, I'm I'm part of that. I've been part of that.

Well you know, I call the recreation of the twelve angry Men scene, but there's like thirty five of us arguing back and forth. You know, your name has definitely been at least for my first year there, which I think was like twenty eleven, has constantly been like champion and argued and and well that's well, you know, we were joking about it's only a matter of time before you do your classical record for your your soft album.

That feel for you? Like for you is it a thing where you need a new challenge?

And no, it was really it was a way to just we wanted to give the fans something different. I'd never looked because I had had such a weird relationship with guys telling me my guitar teacher saying girls can't play rock and roll. I always kept acoustic guitarists really at range length. I never owned one. I never wanted to own one until about you know, maybe ten years ago, maybe a little.

Bit, but you mean ten years ago. You like finally like gave in was like all right, let me try acoustic guitar.

Let me just have it, because I can't always hear my electric guitar, you know, if you're trying to write a riff and you really need to hear something right, you know. So I just had it, but not a good one. Little shitty wanted to be. Then a couple of years ago, we did a documentary called Bad Reputation.

Yes, it came out.

It was all about my career and my life and stuff. And when we did the premiere, they wanted us in LA. They wanted to see if we could perform a couple of the songs in the theater, and I knew we couldn't set up electric, and it suggested that maybe we tried some acousticsuff. So we did it, but with the whole band. So it was myself, my guitar player, acoustic bass, and our drummer, and we you know, played Bad Reputation

Listen to that? How do you? How do you feel about it?

Like your I feel good about it. I feel it's fun. It's different. We play some on stage, like we'll do our electric show and then come and then do instead of an encore, do like three or four acoustic songs that has been going over. Just started like a month ago and a half ago doing doing it, and see how we go over live, because you know, I don't know, listen in front of people, so they seem to like it. So we'll see what happens, and we'll see what happens

And if it doesn't, what are those guys like now, like Mottley Crue And I don't know.

We we played with def lepper before and okay, uh, but I've never played with Motley Cruz, so I don't know. I have no idea what to expect, but it should be interesting.

I learned this with Blue Oyster Call Deaf Lepperd's album covers were more scarier than def Lepperd was.

The thing is like if Mutt Lane you know, Likett.

Is too he's too Yeah, he's too polished in to really like I'm telling you people exactly if you listen to the love Bites whatever, like fucking harmonies like it's it's it's just more enhanced California harmonies to me, you know what I mean? And so I don't know. It's where I never truly saw. I mean, of course, you know they they create one anthem that will probably play in every gentleman's club.

Now to the end of time.

I just meant, you know, Sugar has has a kick ass rift to it, but I've never considered definitely.

I mean I don't.

I don't consider def lever metal the same way I don't consider the Police hard rock, you know what I mean?

Well, people are loose with their terminology now, you know, don't you find? Well?

Yeah, sometimes you were just find yeah exactly right now? Like where with his storied career and is there is there anything that you have yet to achieve or yet to you accomplished that you.

Oh, I'm you know, I wouldn't know who who to say specifically, but I'm always interested in doing newing different things. I just actually did something. Did I mention that with Trombone Shorty?

Yeah?

So you know it's it's it's new for me. I'm not always great with that because I'm good with knowing, you know, and being comfortable and doing what I know and that kind of stuff. So I have to try to get better with, you know, just jumping into the unknown and not being so.

Getting out of comfort zone.

Yeah yeah, but being okay with that and and being you know, you're gonna live, You're gonna be okay, don't worry. I don't know. I think I'm ready for my R and B album now, let's go there.

It is there, it is, let's go.

But Joe, thank you very much, uh yeah, for for for joining us and and and doing this with us.

And you know, we appreciate your work. I've been a longtime fan of yours.

Oh, thank you all. It's been a real pleasure, definitely for sure.

Thank you.

Yeah, Jon, you guys take care of.

Turn on Court Love Supreme. We will see you guys on the next cover round, all right, Thank you.

M H.

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