Questlove Supreme: El DeBarge

Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. Ladies and gentlemen, you know the show.

You know the host, you know the co host, Fantakeolo Sugar, Steve Broke, ast Bill say hello, Hey, alright, all right, let's just get this out the way, because this.

Is about this show was invented like this, like this Nephork is once in a blue boon.

What can I say about our guest today, Ladies and gentlemen, I will simply state we do not deserve this guest at all. He possesses what I personally believe to be one of the most flawless tenor voices in modern music, as a songwriter, as an arranger, as a producer, as a performer, as an entertainer. Our guest, I don't believe that he has any singing peer whatsoever.

And if he does, they have his last name. That's all I'm saying.

Even as he approaches the bolden names of sixty this June, he has.

Not lost a step.

He's in fine form since when we first heard him over forty years ago front of his siblings. Please give us the honor of welcoming and giving flowers, Yes flowers, yes, only held your departs the quest love Supreme.

Yes, I can't believe I Saiven, Yes, made it flowers? Hello, Elle, how are you?

I'm great after that? That's that's wonderful. I didn't know. I didn't know I was approaching sixty. Emma, you don't look.

At you don't look at at all, man, for real?

You Yeah, you're not think about it, really, I ever think, but it doesn't feel like it.

Oh good.

I have to get out the habit of acknowledge numbers, like I feel like that is what slows slows us down.

In terms of numbers.

I mean, we've been doing f centuries. We pag people, we design people, we judge people by numbers. Everything.

Yeah, but no, it's it's this is wonderful to speak with you.

You know, I don't know if you know the history of this particular show, but we're really about celebrating your achievements and you know, going through the journey of your life as a creative and and and.

All those things. So I will start at the beginning. No, I'm not asking where he was born because I know you were born in Detroit.

Correct Detroit?

Well, okay, can you because I know that your family moved to Grand Rapids. What is the difference between Grand Rapids and Detroit.

Oh, well, today, not much because Grand Rapids has gotten very, very very seriously, that's just just lot more violence than it was when I was coming up. But in the seventies, my mother wanted us sustaining Grand Rapids Michigan because Detroit. You know, if you know about Detroit, it was kind of rough on us, being half breas, half black and half white. A lot of criticism from actually a lot of gotten a lot of fights from both sides, from whites and the blacks. So was a lot easier on us.

What year did you move to Grand Rapids.

Let me see, I was like eight years old, to see, I was born sixty one, let's do the mass around sixty.

Yeah, So, do you have any memories of like at least Detroit, like post Riot, because you know, not many people understand or know that, I mean a big part of Motown migrating to the West and kind of what Detroit once represented. A lot of that sort of vanished after the Detroit riots that people aren't aware of, even though like a movie was made about it a couple of years ago. But do you have any memories of the time during that period in your life?

Yeah, I was young myself. I think I was roughly around eight or nine years old when riots happened. I remember stepping outside. We used to go outside every chance we got as kids. I stepped outside one day and people were fighting the streets and cars were driving up on the sidewalk trying to run people over. I didn't know what was going on. My brother Bobby grabbed me and pulled me back in the house. He said, it's a riot. Mart Luther King got shot. I remember very well,

Right now hear we can hear it in the intro to Love Me in a special way we heard.

That's true. That's true. Yeah, I mean I was strongly influenced by Andrew Crouch and Walter Hawkins.

Do you remember your first musical memory.

My first musical memory? Actually you want to hear this?

Yes, yes, yes.

We love long drawn out stories on the show, like Okay, there's no such like fireside chat stuff.

That's what we live for.

Okay. Well, my mother every time we moved to a house, my mother had what you call a prayer closet, and she would put one closet in the house and it was hers. Nobody could go in there, and she would re decorated. She had an alter in there, and she would kneel down and pray. My mother prayed from twelve midnight to three in the morning every night, every night, so as long as I can't remember. So, but one particular night she got my brother Bobby out of bed

So you never had formal lessons. It was just.

I tried to take lessons, but by the time I did it, I had my ear had developed so well. Playing by ear. They just sent me home and said, well, he's cheating, he's pretending like he's reading music.

Did Bobby give you another lesson?

Yeah, Bobby gave me many lessons. Bobby. Bobby was like a mentor for me musically, he sharpened, Well, he's shaving my musical taste. He got me into Marvin Gaye, sly Stone, I was George Clinton. It was like that, why right? Yeah? And then he would make me play songs and learn them. And I remember one time I played the song by Hearl from the Fire and I played it exactly perfect, just like it was, and he set me upside my head. I was like, what do you do that for? He said,

You know, were you the first besides your brother Bobby? Were you the first of the family members to really catch onto music?

No? No, no, no, My sister Bunny, Brandy, I'm number seven down the line, Randy, Marty, Tommy, Bunny, deezra Ellie, Shan, Teal, Bobby. Those are older than me. Okay, I see I got it eventually.

Damn I'm so overwhelmed. I literally forgot you.

Wait a minute, I had a good question too, Damn you the first album that you purchased.

Yeah, first all my purchase was Earth Wind and Fire. It was.

All in All album really.

Yeah. The one was a you know, bye bye bye.

Bye bye bye run Running Running, Yeah.

That one. Yeah, that's first all my actually pert, but my brother Bobby kept him and Bunny. They're always I was listening to their albums. It was always buying them.

But the first one that you purchased was definitely All in All that was yours. What is it about you always spoken about Maurice White being a musical hero of yours? Uh, and all of the interviews I've read, even before you worked with him in ninety two, What was it? What was it about his music that spoke to you feeling?

It was just h It was the first time that I had heard any any band of musicians, uh, stretch out like that. They the horns and the and the strings. I mean, it was just pretty quest It was just so pretty good. You know, all the stuff they did in between Maya was picking up all of that, and then he had and then he just wouldn't stop. Each album. He just kept building and building and making everything larger, and it seemed like they were never gonna have a flop.

Can you tell me of I mean, besides your your family group, did you in your high school experiences or in your neighborhood experiences, did you have other groups that you were part of or bands or were you guys just like contained as a family doing stuff together.

Well, No, I've always had other other groups that I was in, other bands that I was in. See my brothers. Basically, to be honest with you, Okay, there's Randy, Marty, James, Chico, all of them. Music was like so natural for us. It was like you had to really make them sit down and practice because it came so easy for him. Like people who who need to develop something, you'll see them spending more time trying to develop it. But it was like with them, you give them a note, they

I'll give it to you. I'll give it to you. I know, yes that. I mean when I say I give it to you, I give it to you. The de Barge clan.

I was curious, however, if other like do you are you the type of creator or musician that like, it's hard for me to listen to some people without offering my notes inside my head or mine. I mean, it's one thing to listen to a song as a fan, but then it's another thing to listen to it and

I've always felt like different. I remember the Silvers we would come up. I remember, of course, the Jackson's. I've always felt like my style was different. I was going somewhere else. But but you know, I know how to pull from this person and that person different groups what I need. I was always thinking somewhere else. I mean, honestly, I just was. It was like I would listen to my peers, people that were my age who were and then the Tamberguinners. But I found myself more so steering

It's like, why why is that the name?

Right? That something that one of the band members came up with. I don't know. I just went with it. But see, I remember I was very young. I started playing at seven years old, so I was by the time I was twelve years old. I was playing in the bars and clubs with my brother Bobby in his groups, but I was in the background. Nobody knew I was there.

How old were you when you gave your first public performance?

Uh? Twelve?

Wow?

Okay, so it was it was mostly just me playing the piano and singing backgrounds behind Bobby and and his groups. But for the most.

Part, as a singer, would you say that as a singer, would you say that your brother Bobby is like your your north star, your at least, and because your vocal textures are the same.

But you know what quests he One thing that Bobby instilled in me, he was to be myself, be me, never get lost, and and whatever influences you, make sure it becomes a part of who you already are and I consume you. So because of that, I mean, I could say Marvin gay and really be honest about it. And and Bobby and Maurice's White hundred Crouch Hawkins Slidestone, the Beg's allow. I made all of these my mentor because I got into every single one of them, just one just as much as the other.

Well, eventually, I know, you guys have to migrate out west. How did the whole process start in getting at least with your your brother, getting Jermaine Jackson's attention, that stuff like, how did I guess the move to Motown? How did how did where was the first step that went out there?

No, I'm sad because you said migrate so many of us. It's like I just see a whole tribe of us.

I still don't have the official count. I was counting on my hands when he was doing it. Now, what is the official number of the Bard's children?

Fifteen?

Wow?

Wait a minute, your mama, your mama, your.

Ma, mama eleven or ten with my mama, We'll see. My daddy was roll right, but he yeah, he was. He was something else. He was having children while he was married to my mother. And check this out, he was bringing them home.

I'm sorry, what now? What was he? What did you mean to bring.

Oh, by the way, meet your new brother. Yeah, he pulled defenses second definitely.

Yeah, Wow, I.

Knew that experience.

I had to meet one of my brothers that way, like when I was nine. Yes, I had two older brothers. Yeah, just one day. Casually meet your brother, different.

Time, different times.

That's a whole school, right. You get shot for doing that nowadays?

Yes, exactly exactly. Now it's like make room for.

Your brother, you make funeral plans right for you, for your father, your mother.

We put them into the singing side of the de Barges too, like the other your father's kids or they just there.

On the singing side that mostly came from my mother.

Is there?

I was just going to say, is there a DeBarge that does not know how to sing? And won't get angry if you agree with that question?

They know it, they know it's.

Yeah.

I think if al de Barges in your family, you know if you can sing or not. I think you have a pretty good benchmark of what's saying and what ain't.

I mean, I was just curious whether or not like that sort of that kind of epigenetics works with talent as well, Like the entire family is blessed with the voice, but only maybe six or seven are blessed with it, and you know the rest are not that lucky.

I always want to know.

It works like that to genetics work the same way. Although I would have to say this, I don't know if you find this interesting or not, but my father, the timber in his voice, mixed with my mom is what helped, is what helped to shape in my tone. Really, because if you ever heard my father talk and sing he used to sing, you would know what I'm talking about. You could hear a mixture of his tone and my mother's to bless two equals what I have.

Wow, I was gonna ask you, lle how do you preserve your voice?

Man?

I saw your the Instagram live concert that you did where you were playing.

You sounded amazing. Man. That was so it was.

It was fantastic and me and my wife we watched it. We put it on the big speakers like everything.

It was great.

And I just want to know how you preserve your voice, man, because you still singing all those songs, still in the same key, still with the same clarity.

How do you preserve yourself?

I will I will have to say water, Yeah, I drink, but I love water. So but ultimately, you know, having gone through what I've been through in life, we all know it was it was the grace of God. You know, God's got his hands on you, man, and he's got his hands on you, and he preserved me. I mean water, what I've been through water with long couldn't have it was It's God, man, you know. And uh, amen, you know what I'm saying. Amen, you could want to pass the off from plate now.

We usually passed to him.

All right, So back to my question, how did the transition to California happened?

Yeah, okay, Well Bobby, he was missing and we didn't know where he was. Honestly, he just walked off one day. I think he was like eighteen years old. Yeah, and a month went by, no Bobby. Two months went by, no Bobby. Come to find out, this whole time he was in California and he was would switch him in a.

Please don't say you saw him on television like, oh there he is, no, not that, but oh okay.

We found this out like a year later. He was going for a year before we even knew where he was. And you know, my mother was hurt, so then, but we did hear it on the radio. Back then, there was no Internet, none of that stuff, so you know, it was kind of hard to figure out where he was. But he just left. I just took off and then next thing you know, Tommy was gone. But he had sent for Tommy, right all this was like his big secret. He wanted to surprise us, but it took him my year.

He was deep a relationship with Greg Williams. Because even now as we speak, you know, members of Switch have reunited to you know, still do trying to figure out how are they doing those songs without Bobby there?

But what you mean?

Yeah, I was like, how does that work? No? I mean, but nothing nothing against nothing, nothing against Philip.

That was Paddy. That was that Caddy.

I mean, but it wasn't a lot.

It wasn't a lot.

It's hard.

I was going to ask, has there ever has there ever ever been a conversation about kind of.

A quasi amalgamation of of de Barge and Switch?

I mean, I mean, whatever you think.

El break that down for me.

Have you in your life ever saying uh, I call your name, it will never be or I call your name, or calling all girls, or I want to get closer and have you Do you have a relationship with Greg Williams where you two have talked about collaborating. I just always wanted to know was there a direct relationship with the Switch camp and the current DeBarge camp.

I'm scared of this question, this question. No, no, I'm just take me serious. I'll try to be a comedian. At times it doesn't and I'll try it anyway, but anyway or to break.

It's a real question. It's a real question. I didn't know that. I didn't know there was one under that bridge to go to the evening.

It's cool, they look funny, but listen, uh Switch it's not. I don't feel some type of way about it or nothing, but I mean, I love I love Gregham just like a brother to me. They're out singing. Okay, put it this way. Sometimes when I'm out doing concerts, m hum. Unbeknownst to me, the promoters do this. So I look up and then they say, I know, Switches opening up for me.

Oh they trying to force it, yeah, oh.

Force the movement. So I did. I did hit up on something.

Okay, yeahs. Matter of fact, it's happened quite a few times. And uh, I don't know whe you think they're trying to say, tell me something. I mean, do you.

Feel do you feel like it would be sacrilegious for you to sing your brother songs?

No?

I do sing my brother's song. See that's that's the cool thing about it. I do it in my show, and it will switch opening up for me.

Oh ship, that's a double oh conflict of.

When I do it. You know I'm gonna bring it right? I don't know.

I mean, so we got talked to grade because he no, no, there's no.

I'm gonna be cool.

You can leave it at that.

Well what do you think? Have you heard him sing your show?

Well, no, it's it's I just recently and shout out to a DJ Soul System for bringing back the the switch movement on Instagram.

Yes, I will. I will say that I.

I saw one clip, but I didn't watch it long enough or I guess I didn't want to watch it long enough to get disappointed.

But this is what I do know.

I do know that Philip Ingram, his voice is in mine for him and maybe eight.

Year old de mirror.

Is this dreaming of the day where that Ingram voice and met the Barge voice meets again at some.

Point in this lifetime? So some way, yeah, that was That was my lofty way of asking. Has that ever come up in the last twenty years, like.

Sometimes you have to be blunt with me as some things go over my head. Yeah, okay, I got you, But no, you know what, that would be great. I would love to sing with Philip. Philip is Phillips, I like, I love his voice.

Yeah, he's a master. He's a master.

So how was how was the door opened so that you guys could also sign the motown In the one.

Bobby, he sort of tricked me into coming out here because I really didn't want to be in the group. I wanted to stay in Grand Rapids and don'tant to ask me why, but I did, you know, I was young man. So he said, well, ell, I need you to come out here and just play for my second album that I call Your Name album. So I was excited then, you know, because first he was saying we could starting this group the Barge. I can't be in the bars because I'm stuck in the contract we switch.

I got you.

Have you ever seen an office? Have you ever seen an office where the walls open up like a door, like the all and then it just opens up.

Now, I've seen that at will Smith South, Yes, So then the rest of us say.

I've seen it in movies, yeah, which is.

So that's where I was in Jermaine's office.

Wow, okay, because.

I didn't even know anybody was in there because all we saw was a wall the office behind the wall. So they were standing there the whole time with the all open. And that's how we auditioned. And so I'm like, okay, he got me, Bobby, and we was on the road, and then everybody made me feel like, hell, you got to do it, Come on, you got to do it. And I've always wanted to just stay in the background. For some reason, I never wanted to be lead singer. I never wanted to be out front.

Why are you so shy about that? Clearly you're the leader.

I'm brave, That's what it is. I'm brave a lot of things that I might be reluctant to do. I'm still brave enough to do it if I know it has to be done. I'm not a person. If it's got to be done, I'll bring it. So I saw the big picture. Then I was like, well, I got to do this for the family. But to be honest with you, I'm glad I did do it because my mind I changed my mind down the line somewhere, and I was happy that that Bobby saw fit to uh trick me into an audition.

When you talk about working on that Switch album, did you do the vocal arrangement for the that.

We are sending you this message to the intro is that you are you playing on it?

No? No, not that one. No, that's Eddie Fluellen in the group. He ranged that. Ah, okay, okay, But I played piano on I Call Your Name and shit, yeah, just a little bit, Bobby. Then Bobby took over and played piano. I love you. Bobby Can really played the piano. It was really he was really good.

It just hit me what I forgot to mention. I was talking to Jimmy Jam right before, about an hour before we did this. He told me that, without no doubt, you know, of course he's worked with literally everyone by now, but he said that, without no doubt, you are probably in his top five favorite clients that he's ever worked with.

And he just said that one of his favorite.

Things as a professional producers is sitting watching you and I guess speaking of like not knowing someone's behind you, watching like Jam would say that often. You know that that was his favorite thing in the world, like watching you do that.

Yeah, that's a big statement from Yeah, that's a big statement coming from Jail.

Yeah. Wow, did you ever play any other instruments like bass, guitar. Was you primarily just focused on.

Piano, saxophone, violin, and uh yeah, that's about it.

Saxophone violin, that's about it.

Ship because everybody played the clarinet in grade school right.

Quarter that I played the clarinet.

Look at you?

Yeah?

Well, and you know what was what was an interesting song that I did? Honestly, I did it because my man Susany Pass and Tony Jones were my managers at the time. Man it thought it would be a good idea. That's the only reason why I did it. But speaking of not doing things, because you can't really see it sometimes I don't see all the way through. And I'm glad I've had direction and I was enough to take it from other people because it was a good move. Remember who's Johnny.

Yes, yes, yes, circuit too, Yeah.

And tried to look the other way.

Yeah. I didn't want to do that song.

I know that I could tell. I just know I can tell. No, you know what, let me explode, let me explore.

I could tell because in my mind I knew el DeBarge. And although I loved that song and my mind, it didn't it just didn't go with.

No but I have questions about that first solo record, but I don't want to skip it yet finished.

Finishing story point.

So for the first solo record, now you go ahead, and I want to hear it.

Now before okay, before you real quick? Did you want to do the Facts of Life episode? Did you want to do that?

Wait a minute first, yes?

Yet to me, I'm here for All This Love conversation.

Okay, we're not even on the first record yet. All right, let's go to the first album. How long did it take you, guys? Did you guys have those songs all ready for your very first record? People tend to think that All This Love is your first record, when actually that's your second album and the the Barges that came out in eighty one, which weird enough, Queen of My Heart and Share My World are originally on that record. Yeah, but what how much time did you guys have to prepare?

Did you even have meetings on like who gets the helmet? Like?

How are decisions made as far as what goes on the album, especially when it's between siblings.

Well, what we did, we had We had a project manager, Iras Gordy Berry Gordy's knees every other day. She was the project manager. She what she would do is she would come in the studio and say, okay, who wrote what? Put your names out on this writer's split sheet? Who wrote this? Who wrote that? So we would all put our names out next to the songs we wrote, and then I would turn into credits whose song what? We had a deadline that we almost never made share my

You put Queen of my Heart on in a Special Way.

And Share my World too, and you put.

Share My World on the Rhythm of the Night, Rhythm of Night.

Okay, wise, because we had a deadline. Now we had another song that needs to be recorded for the Inn Special Way album. But Missus already said, nope, you got a deadline. It's not gonna make it on the album because you you gotta still do the vocals. It's not gonna make it. And he was real strict about it. He said, it's just not gonna make it on the album. But we needed another song, so I said, let me pull my song from from the first records. It's a done, put it on it and just remix it, right.

Always wanted to do that, Okay, I see.

The the credits and stuff will get mixed up sometimes, like like, for instance, stay with Me. You know it's my name's not on there as a writer, but I wrote it. Marty's name is.

On there, and I hope that got fixed.

It didn't, wow, okay, because Marty just forward everything.

So at the time, you're thinking like, oh, stay with Me is like some really cool filler and this will be consequential to my life in the next twenty five years, will it?

No, I never think much. I love to stay with Me from the beginning. See Marty, when he came to me, he said, well, I need you to help me write this song, and he had the hook stay with me, Stay with me, Stay with me, Stay with me. I said, okay, right, we gotta got to do more than that though, some variation, right, So he just laughing in my hands, and I started really feeling it. Core chain started. It just started coming

Wow.

I just hope that the publishing was fixed at least that much, because Nope, And at no point was that considered like, hey, this is good enough for a single.

Yeah, I mean I thought so, but you have to remember the Barge was going through a transition with Motown at that time. I was becoming solo and right Garry Gordy was Motown was pushing him to the back. Right started a lot of controversy.

Okay, no, no, you're not ready.

To talk about that yet, not yet.

I think, you know, I actually think it's it should be noted that, uh, there was once a time where a song like stay with Me was just like a regular song, like just yeah, it was like a B side, Yeah, just like a throwaway, which you know, considering the state of music now, you know that's that's amazing to be too much.

Yeah, but you know what, it was treated like a single though it never was right.

Right exactly now, that was my favorite even when I brought when I got that record that that was always my favorite to Bart's song. Side note, guys, side note, as I say this for Silent Treatment, one of those remixes we attempted kind of a stay with me asque attempt with the one and only L won't get this but lie about the mimic about to lose their minds with this with the one and only Richard Nicols singing the hook.

She gets it.

I got No, we were, I mean back in ninety three ninety four, where like you had to have like five remixes on the record, right, yeah, I have.

I have them all.

No, No, but way before before one More.

Chance came out, we we actually stopped it once our boy told us that Big L had.

Used because he used MVP.

He used it right exactly when he told us that, then we like put it to bed. But we did. There is a silent treatment remix completed with Richard Nichols singing in a high false.

And he couldn't sing it.

But our whole, our whole logic was like, well, old thirty bastard can't sing.

So this is hip hop. Like just do any this back where you can just do anything in the name of quote. This is hip hop. So yeah, I have to find yeah, bring it back.

No, not really, not even a beat, not even a beat.

We we we used it for something else, but nah we we we put it to bed. But you know, when Biggie blew up with it, I got salty like damn you know, but it was you know, uh But actually, you know what, I'm glad you mentioned her name because what was Iris's like Iris's role? I know, I know you said she was Barry's niece, but what was her role at Motown?

Because anytime.

Someone from Motown made an appearance on Soul Train, don always figured out a way to shout out Iris Iris Gordy in the audience or watching or whatever. But was she always the product manager?

And and she was?

She basically she was.

She was.

She's very musical. She loved being around music all the time. So I guess that's why Verry Gordy, uh Chapper as a project.

Nepotism in the black people.

Yes, it was.

She did. She she knew what she was doing too. She she she knows she was doing she was.

Was the appearance with Jermaine and anyone the first time you guys were in national television. You guys did Soul Train once before you did it on your own as de Barge.

But kind of ass.

Like, okay, did we do stop? Don't tease me?

You did stop? Don't tease me and you did.

I like it back when that was like maybe a throwaway song or something.

I love it when you remind people of their past. That's my favorite thing. Just in case you forgot, Yeah, you were you were a tuxedo. You were a tuxedo with no jacket.

Wait, okay, this is I hope I don't get trouble for this question.

But I always wanted to know.

So you guys are a family unit, your own motel. Obviously, of course, when you're thinking of the lineage of motown and being a family, of course, the J word is always going to pop up, and you know you're associated with one of those J words, which you're main. But I always wanted to know, like why, because the one thing that you guys rarely did was choreography.

I'm so glad you're not mad at me for asking you this question. No, but like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

I take it back when you when y'all did baby once you come Quick, y'all, y'all had some moves together or whatever.

Yeah, but that's the one.

The one thing that always puzzled me was that I knew that they were putting so much energy behind you guys.

But it's like the one thing you were the first Motown.

Act that I saw presented as a five person group as a family. But you guys never had a choreography like not since uh what's what's the boy band?

Before? What's the boy band? Now?

The one that Harry styles was in one direction? Wonderrec one direction? When I saw one direction on senl init a minute, this feels familiar, I said the barge.

Why you're the first person to draw that comparison.

Absolutely well, no, no, no, no, it's just that I used to seeing I'm used to seeing five people act out upon.

Yeah, doing these intricate things, and you guys never did that.

Wait where y'all y'all in Philadelphia? Booked me a flight to Philadelphia.

In New York right now, about to pull up, about to pull up.

But you know, I'm telling the truth, Like why wasn't why like why didn't you guys go.

Through that that? Uh? I guess you could say Charlie Akins phase of like was that going by Motown by now? Like the whole yeah, all that stuff?

Okay, Well, you know what I was wondering the same thing. I think it's because a lot of us couldn't dash.

Probably I never thought of that.

Left you can move, Yeah, but they brought choreographers in and it was like it was a joke.

It was a joke. Choreographers started crying.

I know, I fell down a rabbit hole where I just looked at every DeBarge clip from even.

The McDonald's commercials. Everything.

Oh yeah, it was so.

I just notice that you guys were just two stepped on your own.

You really think about.

That video, Yeah, you just two stepped on your own. You just screwed, which I mean was cool enough. Your your voices were perfect. You guys made up like no one complained, like I was singing your asses off.

Right, But have you ever have you ever seen any of our live shows? Okay, if you haven't. Back in the day, my brother Marty mm hmm was all over the stage all the time. And I know this had a lot to do with with the core everything because I remember Susany Pass and Berry Gordy saying like this just throwing as up what we did from how we rehearsed.

I'm like, Marty, what yo, I'm so glad you said that, because what.

Are you doing? Mary? You feels Marty good?

Wait wait, well, okay, slight confession. I had part two to that question. I wasn't going to ask the second part unless you answer the first part. The second part was definitely your brother, Marty. Everybody known to do.

Some crazy Well, one thing about what he does his homework.

No, twice twice Marty.

I have two clips of Marty where he will whereever, like, Okay.

There's a Marty wearing the pink shirt and all this love cover on album cover.

It could be Yeah, that's him, he's right in the middle.

I knew that he was wearing.

Yes, that's Marty Okay, got it. I just want to get everybody.

No.

But there's there's a there's a I forget what song it was.

It wasn't you Were It was a song where it tas a guitar solo in it, and it wasn't you Wear It? Well, it might have been baby Once you Come Quick, But he took this like Hendrick's esque guitar solo without without a guitar strap at that So even then I was like, wow, he's doing that without a guitar strap. But he was like on his knees, on his back and everything. You guys were two stepping, like

Yeah when it comes to right.

But in concert were you guys doing, Like was it like that as well? I totally forgot that. When we did the baby Face episode, he told us that you guys opening for Luther and when the deal was on the road with you guys, that that was your your your shows were incredible and his in his words that they were incredible. But I was basically asked about Marty like did he always do those over the top solos in concert as well?

Every show? Every each and every concert. Wow, if it was, it was amazing because he always say that he wasn't gonna do it no more, and then we'll do it. We had to have meetings about it. Group mes serious means all right, listen, Matt, you we made a bruise. We start, You're gonna get it doc all this stuff. He right back out.

Yeah, Oh my god, I've been dying and know this. Okay, this this is what makes the show worth having. I've been dying to know this answer for decades and it happened just like I thought in my head.

Yep, you're right right.

What were those early tours like once all this left came out?

It was our first time out there Motown. They they well, Barry Gordon, he cheated tricked us too. We didn't know you.

Guys got tricked a lot in your career, but.

This was kind of this was kind of a cool one though. Here we didn't we didn't really know that we were that popular because all we did was we got up in the morning at six and the limbo was outside are waiting for us, and we drive up to Barry Gordye's house. We stayed there all day and then the nighttime. Then will take us to the studio and from the studio to home next day, repeat same thing for months and months. So we didn't see anything. We didn't we didn't know what was happening on in

Is this Detroit?

This wash? Yeah?

Yeah, I knew the story.

I read about this and ride on magazine.

But go ahead, go ahead, memory, But is this the one?

Uh?

Simple want to drop something about like fans going crazy almost tearing up.

The place or whatever.

But no, no, not that, not that I know.

Something happened in Detroit.

Not that.

Let you know that you guys were celebrities.

Well what happened was actually it was New York. It was in Detroit. It was New York.

Okay, the snow was.

Real deep, and uh, the limo got stuck in the snow. So we got out of walking because they said, well the in stores only two blocks away. We walked into snow in store and uh, finally the limo pulls up after we get there. He got understuck. So we see all these people and I'm thinking they're for somebody else. We all did. We were like, okay, you just walked up, like who else is here? What other sleepers because they ain't here for us. We ain't that popular.

I tried to walk in the front door.

Yeah okay, and then they we had to get back in the limo real quick.

Oh wow.

And then they start rocking the limo like this, pushit limo going up. This was in the snow, man, now for us not to be popular, so they tried to tell us that, and then we went from not being popular in our minds to having some really really haven't energetic motivated fans because they was rocking that limo. I'm telling you, man, there.

Was was y'all prepared for that, Like had Bobby or anybody prepared Like, no.

We wasn't prepared for that because they told us, you know, you're not doing too good.

But I mean when you finally when you finally realize you're doing good, you got all these fans where y'all prepared for what came about.

We was in the snow. One of them was pulling my hair asking me for an autograph, and I'm looking up at it like it was I literally I was on the ground, I was on the pavement, and then I'm looking for Bunnie. I'm trying to protect her and she's up against the car and then Marty's back there loving it. He's oh, girls, he's hey.

And this is pre security.

Pre scurity was busy. Guess what security was busy doing. He was trying to save there on. You know what, you honestly, you had a whole bunch of New York fans. You know, it is New York, New York, and they tough, and security was trying to keep them back from very gates man. They ate the security for breakfast.

Hell, can I ask you a question because you mentioned this earlier on We were talking about growing up and you were kind of like in Grand Rapids you were fighting like the black folks the white folks, you know, because you were mixed.

I love that you say half read such an error anyway, Uh, but.

My question is like, what does it feel like now that people are looking at you and think, y'all the most beautiful, talented people in the world. These are black people, white people, Like, how do y'all mentally do you just leave at what happened in Grand Rapids?

And you know what, we always wanted to be accepted, especially by black people. We have we have my mother's side of the family it's all black. So we for that reason, we like cleave to them because we just wanted to be accepted by black people, like because we were told you ain't black and uh, and then white people you ain't white either, right, you know, that's how

Really because I was in the black neighborhood.

Yeah, yeah, we had to protect him. But so when we especially when we got with Motown because it was it was predominantly a black label, it was just probably be black man being around among our people, and uh. And then and then to see so many people of color at our concerts and stuff. We we always had a pop up pill. It just came natural for us. So you know, uh, we were crossover anyway.

But a lot they had to do with color too in that way, which is yeah.

Yeah, yeah, like white. What they said, like Brandon almost worried, you know, Oh, don't be hating now.

I'm just laughing because you can't say that in twenty twenty one.

I was like never yeah.

And my brother Chico, he was real adamant about it. He was he was like he's young than me, but he taught me about the word Hugh. You know, Hugh h u e. He's like Q man, different shades of one color, that's what we are. And uh but that was a real man. I seemed like a big thing to some people, but it was a really big thing to us. And so you know, like to be around dark skinned people, man our people, it was like and they accepted us. It was like it wasn't no things.

Wow.

Well, I want to ask a question about physically about the song all this Love. Was that written specifically for Marvin or was it just influenced by Marvin?

It was written for Marvin. I wrote it, my brother read it. You know the way we write, We write off of each other vibes. Randy was just sitting next to me, and I love Randy so much. Man, that's my that's my cat. His personality, his spirit is so beautiful. Man, if you ever be around it, you know what I'm talking about. So just because of that, I just felt

So Marvin never heard it. Jeordan Barry he shot it down. Martyn left by this time.

Also, although I found out that Marvin did hear when I met Marvin. Oh, I found out he did here what Marve's what he saying, Well, he only heard it because somebody at Motown had got it to him. Uh okay, I'm not going to be mission no names. I know who it was. When I'm gonna tell no no, somebody somebody.

Got off to her in.

It's forty years after the fact.

Right right, Well anyway, but by that time it was on our album. And uh so when Marvin, when we did the Motown twenty five, that's when I first Marvin and he picked me up like this. I don't know if you ever seen the pictures of that. He picked me up in air like he.

Was like wow, really, oh wow?

Yeah? And I was shy, man, you should show me that. I was like like a little a little groopie. I have my head. Marv Gaates is ELDI bars. I was like, you know, so he picked me up like this, he said, So this is young man that everybody says, sound like me. You're gonna get me trouble boy.

Wow.

Matter of fact, you see your pictures, they're they're on they're on the internet, right.

I got a search that like him.

He got me like this way up in the air, off my feet.

Wow.

I have a question about the the All This Love record?

You know again this of course in eighty two.

This this could just be like an everyday thing, but I mean, these are monsters that you have on your record, on your record, like, first of all, Benjamin, what was it like working with Benjamin?

Well, even before I.

Get to Benjamin right almost, how did you wind up producing or at the helm of producing this record? I would assume that your brother had a lot to do with the first record. What was the meeting that changed the personnel and the process on All This Love?

That was different from the first record?

You did because I knew what I wanted and it seemed that nobody else did. I tried to work with other producers, but the songs was going in the wrong direction, and and it was it wasn't a problem with them for them, they knew it too. In fact, a couple of producers said, hell, you should do this yourself, as that's the only way the song is going to stay the way it was born and you have your own ideas. And so I wanted to produce it myself then, but

Do at the time, did you know. Okay, So first of all, like Benjamin Wright is doing horn arrangements and stuff. He did like the string arrangements on Michael Jackson's Off the.

Wall justin timber Lake. Yeah, yeah, and yeah and justin timber Lakes.

Right, swag together the others.

But I mean also with like, I mean, it's not often that you see like a.

Like Russell Ferrante's name from.

The Old Jackets or Freddie Washington. Yeah, the you know, the the ready for ready for forgive.

Me, not to forget me?

Not right, even Rick Scott, Daniel Lamel, how did you get all these months? Say, yeah, Ricky Lawson and Ali Brown Richard, you had all the monsters on this record, which I know in eighty two that was like that's whatever everybody was was at the top of their craft.

Yeah, my brother Bobby was responsible for that. He knew all of them. He knew all He got his Ricky Lawson, Oli Brown, Leon and Google Chancellor, right, Harvey Mason, theyd all some stuff.

Lasiana's doing guitar solo and all this love right.

Yeah. Him and Charles Fairing, Yeah, yeah, him and Charles Fairing. To be honest with your childs. Fairing played the solo first.

Okay.

It was Iris's idea to bring Holy Jose Felic on it.

He was on Motown at the time, right, Yeah, he was on Motile Yeah, signing eighty two. Yeah.

She said, let's just try him. Let's try I know we got Charals doing the soulo already, but let's just try and see what Jose could come up with. So we blended the two. A lot of people don't notice we blended them both together. Wow, Charles and Jose planning at the same time at the same time. A lot of good time players find out figure that out when they try to play the solo. Wowkle's easy, but it's not one.

One more question.

So I know the name, I know that either she did well, she's listed under vocal arrangements.

I'm assuming that maybe background or whatever. I don't know. But the Linda Howard that's mentioned here, that was Linda Howard formerly of High Energy. Correct.

Yeah, yeah, what song was it? Thought?

I don't well, just says, uh, vocal arrangements Linda Howard. That's just so random to me. Only asked that Linda Howard is the first person I ever wrote a fan letter to when I that's interesting, U.

No, it's just listed on the album, not not.

Oh okay, I got what. I get what you saying? Yeah, okay, So did you have a did you have a fan crush on her?

I did? Yeah, I mean I was.

I was a high Energy fan actually, speaking of Motown twenty five, even even though some some person sort of ate the energy up in the room for that particular night, I will say that, uh, you know, for a lot of us. Also, our our favorite moment on that show was the kind of de barge high energy mix up of uh, he's a pretender and I forget what song you guys did?

Uh we did can't stop together?

Right? Exactly? What was it like doing Motown twenty five?

Oh? Wow?

Well, besides Marvin No.

No, I know. Can you imagine all of the talent that was there. It was tense too. It was it was tense because we were kind of like almost working on CPE time because.

Because it took five hours almost just.

To get everybody together. Susany Pass is so great, man. I mean, she the relationships, the way she deals with people. People didn't want certain artists didn't even want to come back and do it and be a part of it. But Susanne, with her grace herself, she was able to talk to them into doing it. So because of that, time was getting away from from us, and a lot of them decided to agreed to do it at the last minute. Michael didn't even agree to do it until

This going Were things shot separately or was it shot currently in a row?

Was it straight com currently okay, yep, straight too, man, Yeah.

I got that dance step. And at that time, no ya, I was.

Gonna say that's phiography.

Can I redeem myself with the dance biography? I redeem myself geography?

Yes, you yourself.

Have you seen a real love video, a real love video?

Yes, I've seen it? Yes, No, you you know you got it together? You gotta.

I don't say something, say something.

You got bro. I couldn't dance. I just say, y'all didn't work with the choreographer. That's all A big difference, big difference. We should have mentioned.

I like it.

I mean yes, I don't want any classics.

I like it. And the process of writing that song.

Brandy was playing the bass over and over again, boom boom boom, doom boom boom boom boom, just over and over again, and he kept singing, My brothers they do this to me all the time. They have one part and they sing it over and over again and then tell me too, so Randy, But and I don't mind doing it.

But the lucky number seven.

That's where he lucky number seven. Let's go to Vegas. So anyway, that's what he had. And then you know, I wasn't gonna leave it like that. We had to come up with a verse, and that we did so I didn't thinking about you, you know, it just felt right, man. I love writing with Randy. He's his spirit just makes you want to write. So that's how we came up with it.

Okay, I was going to say that the process, I like, it's one of those songs in which I think there's two totally different verses.

It's almost like the Saturday Love Thing.

Yeah, totally different hooks too.

Right, but it's it's still but it's somehow in my mind, I feel like it's two different hooks, two different verses, but it's just reinterpreted different.

And I actually I actually admire that process, Like.

Oh, I hear what you're saying when we brought back to the first verse to.

Second exactly exactly. I admire that trick, and I wish I could master that.

You know, Chico told me that he was the first one that told me, you said, ell you the only one to know that can do that and pull it off because I did it in All Is Love too.

Wait a minute, yeah, god, you're right. Wow, problem if you just sing it different? Ah? Man, Okay, I didn't notice that tool. Right now, I want.

To ask you about just your writing of creating of Loved Me in a Special Way, because I just I love that song. That was just I had like a lot of memories to that as a kid, like what was that?

What was that like when you made that?

I got good memories of that song. I was driving on Freeway headed west one oh one. I was on my way to Billy Preston's house.

Oh why, it was.

A traffic jam, and that song just hit me. You would you know traffic jams in LA. A song like that's not supposed to hit you. It's something mean is supposed to right, But that song just hit me, man, And the chorus was in my head and I couldn't wait to get to Billy's. I said, I gotta get to a piano. So I remember getting off the freeway and trying to take the streets because he lived way Hull and drive way up in the canyons. And when I got there, I said, Billy, where's the piano? Man?

Wow.

I just looked like this. I remember looking like this, like what happened is like why is he crying? And he said, man, that's beautiful. Man record the man, please record it. But I couldn't.

So as we hear it, well, as we heard it, you played it for Billy the song that we hear it, right.

Yeah. I did the same thing with Time and Reveal. I didn't think it was I thought Time Reveal was too corny. Remember I told you at the beginning of our talk sometimes you can't see all the way through. And because you know, he said, I like it, but ain't nobody don't like it. So Chico said, man, are you serious? Time Reveal? That's the business. I said, it's too corny, man, nobody want to hear. What can I do to make.

It because at the time, yeah.

You know Rick James, you know, give it to me baby and all that stuff. Yeah, So I like, nobody want to hear this? He said, Man, just do me a favor, just recorded for me. I said, okay, let you know.

That you're the a.

I'm sorry, Who's whose decision was it to give James his looks for uh in a special way? Because he got more lead on sid I'm sold on side one. Uh you know what would be my lady and need somebody?

Well, yeah, James h James is always danced to his own beat, march to his own beat. He wasn't in the group at first, you know, on the first al right, on the very first, and I fought for my little brother to get in the group. I worried mister Gordy to death about it. I pestered him every day. I started putting James on songs, let them sing so Mster Goady could hear it, And finally they signed him up. He was buying all the slove he was in the group. He was just I don't know, uh, he just Marshy

Yeah, James, he did a record and I know we'll get to it. James did a record, I mean years ago with DJ Quick called the Divorced Song. Yeah, and I heard the song. I thought it was you because I just heard it. I didn't have the credits in front of me. I was like, Yo, this is I was like, hell killing this. And then when I saw the credits, I was like, oh shit, this is James.

James right right.

So many times I had Baby, I ain't got nothing to fool to you. No, I want not to ease. Sure's nothing home with my keys, so we can get it on.

For the in the Special Way album, especially with touring behind it. I know you guys toured with Luther Vandros.

What was that like?

Amazing? Luther Vandros was like the uncle and the papah he was. He was the coach, he was the principal at school. We was like his little brother said he was like the whole time we were out with Luther, he was disciplining us and teaching us the ropes. I mean we got on stage a minute late one time and he fined us fifteen thousand dollars.

Damn.

Wait what fifteen thousand dollars.

He comes collecting like he looks for that, like after he said he'd come back and be like with my money.

Well yeah, yep. But see the thing is we were in union halls, you know. Oh they was doc him and he said, no, y'all got to pay me. You can't. You can't be on too late, you can't get off too late. And the Union hallsman, and then Radio City Music Hall that's when we got. That was the biggest fine, real.

Time a lot, yeah, metty.

Radio City Music Hall was thirty thousand dollars Jesus because we got on late and went off late and they pulled the plug on us. And then yeah, so we learned our lessons the highway. But Luther was like, he was so cool with us, man. He I'm telling he was like his little brothers. He was cool. He'd take us out to eat every night, make sure we knew the ropes. He taught us everything. Man. He used to give us pointers about our show, and he would tell Marty, now, Marty,

Okay, so a dream uh probably you know, I mean of of your arsenal. I mean, everyone has their favorites, but I know that A dream is is somehow like in most of barges feel like that's always in like their their top three songs. I know that was written by your sister, but what what was the process of putting that together?

Well, Bunny would always again come to me and ask me to do the music to her songs. She always had all of her melodies and and she would even have instrument parts. Sometimes Bunny was amazing. If she could play the panel, she would she would be amazing. But she had this part. But I hear that, I hear that.

Everyone likes everybody translator.

So then she but she had the whole song, the melodies and everything, you know. And then so she said, now this was this part, you know, last night I dream you. And when she got to this part, now here it is right here and a flash, you know. So we figured it out. So I had to write all the music around that. You know. I didn't know back then that music had writing. The music had anything to do with with writers songwriting. I thought, if you wrote the music, you just wrote the music. But it

You're gonna learn. You're gonna learn one way or another.

So I learned. I learned. Well, yeah, man, she's still this day one of my favorite songwriters.

So how shocked or how pleasantly surprised were you when in the next ten years or fifteen years that these songs would find new life to them where it's like, you know, and even though we're talking about just a choice for you with with a Dream, stay with me, I like it and all this love. But I mean, it's been those four songs alone have been utilized at least like by three to five different hip hop.

Classics, like I would love to know what Bunny thinks about I A'm mad at you?

What does Bunny think about that?

Yeah, a lot, I should hope.

So so I like you.

I know, well, I can kick myself anyway and then just give it.

I don't understand.

And they knew you wrote, we wrote others, you know, yeah that's on the next Oprah. Okay, that's not. But I like you. You're very focused, man, question.

I like you well, I mean, at the very least, at the very even at the very least, even if you didn't get to reap.

The the you know, the the monetary highs of what those songs could reap in.

Yeah, then at least it's brought timeless. You can perform those songs, those songs would never die.

You to remember me? You asked me, what did I think people go this fire? Remember me the one who didn't even want to record time and reveal Because I didn't. Right, So you know, I'm shocked of all people because I didn't even think time of reveal was or love me in a special way was with great songs.

I just thought, Man, love me in a special way, that's my one. I mean.

They're like to me, they're like my babies. You feel about your kids, all of them all.

Yeah, Now your vocal arrangement at the end of love Me in a Special way, man, like that ship is.

So that's just a great song.

That was hawkins influence.

Absolutely, you know.

The choir. Yeah.

Actually, okay, So when you're when you're giving these like these mammoth vocal performances in the studio, like how much pressure is it to because it's just hitting me, like from until the day you die, everyone's going to expect you to sing, you know.

So.

Like like at the end of the time, we'll reveal you'll have to hold that note forever, like yeah, how even now it's expect Thank god, your voice is been fine form. But I mean, are there times where it's like a collective eye roll? Like, God, can I do I have to.

Hit this note? Or do you just now? Are you at the place where you just let the audience sing those parts?

Oh? No, I'm never at that place.

Yeah, talk that ship, you know I'm from.

Okay. My voice is cool, it's good. I don't have no problems with at all. So, you know, all glory to God, but beautiful, and I'm glad I don't because I love singing. I love singing every note that I've ever sung on the records. I love singing. My brother Bobby, just to blame for that, he taught me to end the song in a way, go out with a bang, don't end it. Don't act like the song is ending just because he said, keep it going. He said, build a song from beginning to the end. He said. The

Okay.

So for Rhythm of the Night, was there a basic strategy, like, was there a strategy meaning beforehand that okay, we must take them to the next level now, like let's get to that next Yeah, and what was the results of that?

It was with Diana Dyane Warner and I we were good friends. We still are, I mean like that well, and so we were hanging out a lot, and she was always writing songs, speaking of that first first solo album that we never hit talk but so Rhythm of the Night came about, she was just well, Susany Pass and Tony Jones, our manager at the time, they said, we need to take them to another level, just like you said, we need uh, we're trying to build them and do this and that. So Diane, I need you

Yeah.

Why was that the only video that y'all shot? Because that's I think that's the only the barge video there there was no wear it. Well, there's no video for you where well, he's the facts of life.

Mold Town was ready to go out. At that time, Moldtown was declining at well, not declinent.

Well they were there, You're about to sell, yeah, exactly.

So all the budgets was being pulled. And see he saw he knew before he announced that, he already knew during the rhythm of night what he was going to do. But uh, the artist always pays the price.

All right, Well I wanted to know. Okay, So this also starts the period of your career, which now these particular ballots and you know, I can say the same with love always and also with uh like someone where you know, these are more pop ballots, which I ducked them. But it kind of starts with who's holding down?

And now, right, did you did you?

Did you like that? Because you didn't write it? Is it different when you don't write a song and it's just given to you?

Yeah, it is, it's different.

Uh, how did you feel about it then? As opposed to now.

I was paying attention to to the people that I felt knew what they were doing. You know, I was new to this business and I had management and for reasons. So I was listening to him. They said, try this, keep your mind open now, trust me, I know what I'm talking about it. So I did, and I could feel it the whole time that it wasn't where I was at.

You know, But despite it being a hit, despite it being a hit, yeah, and a massive hit at that.

Yeah, despite it being a hit, it wasn't where I was at.

I was just saying, where were you Where the song wasn't like, where were you.

Where I was at. It was a hit, okay, so that's where I was that.

I was with you.

I was with the hitt. No, I was with that, you know. That's where That's where my mentality was. That's where my drive was. But there are there are other there are other kinds of hits. I wanted to write my own hit, and I could have still did. Who's Holding Down and Now? But I was completely ruved from writing period anything on that album. It was like I was discouraged. Two. I wasn't encouraged to write. It was like, just let somebody else write.

Even despite the fact that you you had a great but in their minds it was like those are black hits, those don't count.

Like you're going for pop right now? Yeah, it's crazy. I know that it's crazy.

And if I knew what I know, if I know who what I know now, but I can't say because I yeah, I felt it, but I said, well, maybe they know something I don't know.

And is that song still a part of your repertoire now? Do you still do that song in your.

It's like I feel mixed emotions about it because when I when I, whenever I do it, I'm wondering, is anybody feeling this audience right? And uh, but I know what I do the other songs. You don't have to say anything. I know you feeling it right, But I haven't had the proof because pop to me back then was like a facade. It was like it wasn't real. It was like it was like something that was made up, like pop was I did? Yeah, And it's like and they played a lot of games with the paola and everything.

Speaking truth, that was an error where people was thinking the same thing.

You weren't alone, I mean, because you know black people, it's a lot of us, man, so it can't be the pop means popular, right right.

Well it was. It was just eighty five was definitely a sincre swim moment, and you know it sure was well and a lot of acts were just well, a.

Lot of acts were going on under So it was like the type of black music was sort of like in a titanic position, which.

Either got down with the program or you got.

Ran over exactly exactly.

And so did you feel that way about Rhythm Mother Night? Even though I loved the.

Mother Night Rhythm mother Knight was business. I loved it.

Oh I'm glad you said that. I'm like wow, because.

Memories of Who's hold Down and Now? Who's hold Down and Now is a great song.

I love who was Johnny?

I love Who's Johnny? I just didn't want to do it at that time.

No, I don't know, I do love, but I did. And also I was a little younger too, so it was like a fun song.

And I and.

You got your own weird.

Actually, Peter Wolf, how did Peter Wolf get into the because I know he wrote that.

Yeah, he did. Peter Wolf was Actually it's very instrumental in me doing the song. He talked me into it. Come on, you got I mean he was fake, I know it. I was in mic. Yeah.

When I was singing, I was singing with like a proper tone like Johnny he said, look the other way.

But when you hear it, it's got a lot of energy. That songs got good energy to it. I love listening to it.

You know, you know that weird solo in the middle, Yes, exactly what the solo was that the little scatty I don't know what that.

I don't know.

Was it vote coder or that was you or something? No, I yes, I was. I was a boor for that, even though you know it was.

Love the movie with your boy in Indian Face.

Yeah, I forgot that was associated with short circuit damn. Yeah, okay, okay. So Fante asked you earlier about the facts of life. So that's my sentimental favorite because when I first got a VCR, that's probably the very first thing I recorded was your.

I will never on the facts of what No, it's.

I will never, ever ever have anything bad to say about the facts of Life because I love the girls they were. They were so cool, They're so cute. We were like family. We stay cool even after that for a long time. And plus that was my first time acting with George Kemp.

Was right. Yeah, I was on.

I did I was on. I did something with George Coloney. I acted with George.

That's right.

A lot of people don't know that's colony on there. Oh yeah, I put that in.

So question, Were you guys supposed to have a bigger role in the Last Dragon or did I read that wrong? Were you guys actually supposed to be in it as opposed to just Vanity playing the video? But I could have sworn like I first saw, like uh when they were talking of the movie being made, that you guys were actually in it.

I don't know if that was character or incorrect.

I don't know, it's possible, Okay, okay.

I didn't know.

It wasn't never awkward as Susan the past was management and she was so connected to Motown.

I'm sorry, I just yeah, yeah, it was that a conflict interest at all?

Yeah, it was. It was. I didn't know it at the time, but that's what I was experiencing. I was experiencing a conflict adventures the whole time. Yeah, but I didn't know. I didn't know that's what it was. But that's what I have, huge experiences of conflicts adventures.

In general. Are you in a good place with her now or yeah?

I was then too, Okay, Yeah.

And she's a guess that we would like to get on the show yees. Yeah? So in general, like, what was it like working with her?

An education, a constant reminder of uh, the worth and the value that you have. We never left her presence, and same with her cousin, Tony Jones. They were management together. Both of them never left their presence feeling low. You always felt extremely great about yourself. H You always had a better sense of who you were. I mean this was every time I was with them.

Okay, man, So what was the process that finally ended, at least at the time the lineup that we knew of DeBarge in eighty five that led to your solo career the next year? Like, how did that? Was there a conversation had or was it just.

Like, well, the work ethics were majorly different between me and my siblings, right, I was always in the studio and they were rarely showing up. Okay, so Motown saw that brought up mister Gorge's attention in the eat. You know, I saw more Motown people showing up at a studio that should have been a signed to be there, and they were just always there because they were reporting back every time that the family wasn't there and how many hours I was there. So missr Goury basically made it

Oh see, and the design.

No small I did. Moton had done that. They had already begun their Eldibars solo process. As you hear. They didn't talk to me about it, They didn't talk to anybody about it. They just started doing it. Man, that that cased some pros.

At the time.

It couldn't have been a thing where it's like, Okay, I'm gonna do this one solo record and then we'll come back in eighty seven and make something else together.

And see the thing is when you do a solo album, you know, like groups today, they do a solo album. One of them might do a solo album, but they're still in the group. Right. But it's different when you when you put al DeBarge with the Barge uh and uh, and then my pictures the Vegas and then the rest of theirs are small and it wasn't like that before. It's gonna be some problems.

Who did that? Who did that? Cause the biggest problems with with you and your family? He's funny, put you on the spot.

Who do you take a guess? Was it?

It wasn't Bobby, Bobby, wasn't it was James or.

Remember Blanks?

I mean he righty basically spoke what the rest of them right didn't want to say. But they don't have no problem with speaking in his mind. But we would be doing interviews and he was in the middle of the interview. I don't know where he was saying, this is not L's group, Barge.

And but did he not know that wasn't your decision or design?

About as much as he knew what a good idea to be kicking around.

On stage, it didn't matter. He was gonna do it regardless.

Yeah, wow, you know, And it just got that way, man, And it was inevitable. I had to go solo. It was really became inevitable then because I wasn't just gonna stop because what was happening. But see, I couldn't do anything when when when a record he owns you both collectively and individually, you have to play ball. But you're just gonna be shelved, you know what I mean.

So my number one question about this record is you didn't write not one of these songs, that.

One the first solo as all right.

Yeah, yeah, why did you not? You know, did you not have anything up the pike or.

Like no, No, I had songs written, but I was told but not to do them. We got some songs from other writers that we want you to sing, and.

So does that stifle your creativity?

It put a damper on my spirit and your confidence? Yeah, because I really didn't get no explanation for it. It was just like, let's do.

It, wow, don't you know?

I know, like the average the Bards fan won't maybe not list it, but you know, at least with me, someone in love always are like those I don't know, like I just love I love the ship out of the songs too. Even though you didn't write them those and they got much play on black radio. Still, you know what I mean, Like it's kind of hard to argue with it because I love those songs.

But still, you know, those are the exceptions of what I of my list of likes, and don't like Love Always Someone and even Who's on Down and our Rhythm other Night. And I don't believe that you always have to write a song. You know you can, you can explore other writers. But this was the case where you know, no, don't write, let somebody else do it. That was That's that's a different approach there. But Love Always the great

Really so Burn and Carols specifically they wrote pattern love Always.

After that's some ship.

I'm sorry I can't hear it.

I understand, but they patterned off of his song that he wrote, but he wasn't allowed.

To butt him write the irony Burn.

Them not the bird. I'm burd I'm talking about the lab.

Town, talking about Motown, Yeah, okay, from back and rights ship and I'm not I'm not saying I'm about no Burke.

We see. I don't know whose idea it was, but I don't know. I can't point finger at anybody. I just it is what it is. But it was an honor. These are some of the great things that happened that make up for some of the not so great things happen to have Burt Bacaret sitting in front of me telling me something like that, I mean, you know, I'm a Berrett. I mean, I love all this healthy bars, I love all this love. And I wrote a song Kurl and I and we patterned it after all this love,

There's a texture. There's texture. That's the first year that d X seven came out.

So even though you use the real no, you use the real friend of the roads, but it's it leads.

It leads with the with the well processed road sounding thing.

But you know, era right a mirror like it's not like that that lead ballad from the movie Tap.

But yeah, I love with that song on the first time, Yes, Honey and jameson Bright.

Wait did you did?

Jake Graydon and Peter will produce that first record entirely.

The first album solo album. What el most people Wait a minute, Peter, Who's Johnny was on the Rhythm of the Night?

Now, who's Doohnny? Who's Johnny was on your your first solo record?

It was right?

No, but working with Jay Graydon, who's like, who's the A and R at Motown? That decides like, Okay, this is going to be your producer, And did you at least get.

A I don't like the song, I don't like this song. What else you got? What else you got? That sort of thing, like.

I don't know who. That's the thing about it. When we talked about the conflict of interests right between Tony Jones, Susany Patz and Motown.

Okay, that whole I don't know who?

It was just to let our listeners know, Jake Graydon like wrote everything. Yeah, like just like George Benson that that mid eighties George Benson A right, the Breakaway record and all that stuff exactly.

Yeah, like he was involved in all that. David Foster.

He also wrote After the Love Is Gone for Earth Wind and Fire.

Yeah, David Foster. David.

But Jake Grayden, I do like him though. He's a good producer. Did you know Jay Graydon? Uh? He produced the song on me and the song that Prince wrote that I did with Kenny Rodgers.

You're My Love. Yeah, wait a minute, time out. What's the connection there?

Okay, Prince wrote the song for Kenny Rodgers right and wanted me to sing the ad lives around it and Jay Grayden said, well, he's not gonna do it, and that's you that you sing Oh.

I said, okay, so you're singing on that.

Yeah, I'm singing around him.

I didn't know that, you know, I'm not. I've heard Prince's demo of it.

I've not heard the actual It's beautiful final Kenny Rodgers one.

I got to look that up.

Yeah. I come in halfway through the song and I'm singing around him and Jay Graydon And he did a good job with that one. He did. He did a good job. He's a great producer. Man.

Okay, question, since you mentioned real love is real love? Directed had someone specifically and because you gave in that song.

There's two obvious references.

There's a there's kind of a Janet reference, and what I assume is a Jodie Watley reference.

Was that?

Was it directed to someone specifically? Wait? Did I hit that? I hit a nerve? You wrote the lyrics, you wrote the song.

Look at it? Okay?

You can always say I can't answer that question too, like you're not obligated to answer.

Depends on which part. I don't mind answering this.

Wait, did I hit on something?

Because I don't feel like real I never once felt that Real Love was just a random song based on those lyrics. I was like, wait a minute, that's a reference to Da Da Da Da. That's a reference to data da. This song is about someone? Am I right?

Yeah? Yeah, you're right.

You turned this into a new show. It's like quest Left song Detective.

Right now, people, I just did the radio raheem fist pump in the air after I won.

The radio battle. You're like a friend.

If you cannot if you cannot name the person, what what can you tell us about that song?

It was? Uh? They it was puppy love at first, and uh.

Am I the first person to ask this question.

Yes, yes, it's so obvious, though, like, how come no one has ever bothered to ask you this question?

But it's not my relationship, just about somebody else.

Never mind your brother. Who Oh okay, I I thought you were being intercessory. I thought you're being a kind.

Of for you.

I'm just no, I'm just making it now so obvious. That's okay.

I don't stop talking.

No, no, no, no, not like that, not like that. I'm just I'm making it more mysterious. I don't want to kill the mistiak of it.

It's like talking to a mirror.

This was like, okay, very securitous.

I mean, you know we we haven't really said it yet. So let them figure it out. Okay, you think they will? Oh?

Man, I wish I knew now. I feel like fante no I finkure, I know what it is said?

Who do you think you said? I'll admit they.

Find Take ahead, Janet and James, Jenny, you and your brother. Okay, there it is?

Wow?

All right? So so album, so so, the Gemini album.

Nice sege, thank you, so.

The Jymedi album, you everything you're writing again? Now, how did you get the rains back? I would say, how did you how did you get the rains back? How did you get controlled back again? In terms of writing your own material, Well.

Let me see, in terms of putting it on.

The album, you mean right right right releasing.

Because uh I don't know. Actually, well, you know what Motown. A new staff came into Motown. Actually a new staff did oh under the direction of Devorah Sandrich. She was head of the ANR department at that time, and the ANI department took over all of the recording sessions. So she she came in. She as a fan, so she was like, pro al right, and uh so I was back. The kid was back, baby, it was. And you know you remember that the era that that's when New jack Swing was kicking in real high.

Yeah, you had your two dancers.

Yeah he's kicking.

Here we go again. Here we got you was kicking it. Bring it back.

Let's Judy from Time Life, because you're from life. The duty from Time Life my prerogative microphone.

Noh, I was you know, what's the last time you jumped up from the drug and started dancing. I think I'm not making it fun. He was taking it.

I wasn't Bobby Brown or Michael Jackson. But you know, I did.

Look, what did you do?

Wait?

Speaking of back? Speaking of back, we have to mention back on the block.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, Secret Guard kicked myself.

Yeah, I forgot about it until right now. Can you speak of that as that that whole experience. I think I've seen you guys only perform that song once on the I guess the Soul Traine Awards.

But what was that? What was that process like.

Doing that, doing the song and just working with James and and and Barry White and and Yeah, I'll.

Be sure it was a trip because Quincy, he tricked me.

There seems to be a theme going on your brother trick.

Yeah, you're seriously tricky because I guess you know, just call me a trick.

Okay, are you trying to tell us that you thought this song was all to yourself?

No?

Oh, but I did.

I did think that I was doing a warm up in the mic. I did.

Oh.

No, guys, you we got I don't know. No, but wait, this this is not the first time we heard the story. Besides, besides performing late at night, Quincy is world famous for just like even your warm ups are being recorded.

And okay, is that what?

Alb be sure? Said too.

So two other people said this about Quincy as well. Oh it was. It was great feeling gangs.

He said on the Yes on the one hundred Ways solo, he was sleeping in the studio and Quincy was like, hey, playing come back later, and they just woke him up and he played that line. And that's that's what made it on the record.

Well, you know what, but Quincy said, Quincy himself said that you get a better honest performance when the person doesn't know that they're.

Being Yeah, yeah, but you know. And then again, I'm guilty of being the professions too much. So we probably would have been there all day. I remember we were up for two days though. Before we went in to the studio writing a song. We were at Rob Tipperson's house and I was nervous because he had that all this rock Rollers. They were just walking around. We're trying to write a secret guard to rock Rollers. I'm looking an old boy?

Is that nice?

But and then uh, Me and side Garrett and Quincy we just up, I mean literally two days. We would eat, take a quick nap, and get right back to right because he had a deadline he was trying to beat. Then we went straight to the studio to sing it. I was like, you're kidding me, right, Quincy, We're going straight to the studio to sing. Well, you're playing right?

Paying What was he?

What was he working with Quincy and even Rod? What were they more sticklers of in terms of songwriting? Were they really like big on like melody or.

Was it lyrics?

Like in terms of words, which would be what would they be kind of be more particular about?

No? Everything really everything, every part was equally important because, uh, the wrong word within a verse could throw the vibe off, and then when it came to singing, the wrong expression of it, of that word while you're sing could mask the whole verse up, you know. And it was the same with Quincy. Was like that with musicians too. You have to have a certain personality about your playing. You had to be it had to be a personality when

Did you uh did at the time?

Did you know from the gate that you were writing a song for three other singers in addition to yourself? Did you know that you were writing specifically for Al and for James and for Barry.

White, not not for l because it was supposed to be for Michael. Michael was supposed to do it.

And uh word, yes.

That I did not know.

It was going to be me, Michael, James, and Barry White. And wow, I don't know what happened.

I can't remember, but wow, set up, set up.

I could imagine what happened. We're not on a video.

Wow.

Now, I just had the process process that because if.

You listen to Al's verse, I mean listen to als verse, you know, yeah, yeah.

You know what.

He said he was.

He said he was a stylist.

All right, you know is a great songwriter.

Ain't she talk about it? She's really had her on the show too.

Yeah, yeah, she's she's boss.

Wow.

So was the Soul Train Awards the only time that you guys performed that together as a force for some well sorry as alb sure, James, Ingram, l DeBarge, and Barry White.

Yes, the four of you, like the four horsemen. That even makes it worse.

No, no, it's okay. Yeah, that was the first time. Uh, it was the only time we did the together. Yeah, yeah, okay, never mind.

That was a moment. That was definitely a moment.

Yeah.

So with uh with through the storm, in the storm and in the storm, forgive me in the storm. Yeah, well one you you left Motown and moved to Warner, But what what finally made you decide to go with Maurice White as a production partner on this record?

Lack of confidence and where and where I was trying that in the storm is I wouldn't say it's all over the place, but it's many fastest of my influences. Okay, Honestly, my brother Bobby and Chico had just got locked up and those were.

My uh your yeah, yeah, okay, and.

To this day Chico when I was still like that. But I was lost, man, I was lost, and uh it was like they took him away from me, and uh, not to mention what they were going through being locked up, but you know, I don't want to sound selfish, but I really needed them and uh just just for me. You know, I know how to write, I can write well, but I just needed them for me. And I was hurting because they were hurting because what was happening to him.

Wow, that's what's up.

So we talked to Warner Brothers about it and we started the budget all over again. I was shocked at it was a whole different EPI. He started to budget all over again and we did it. Man and Maurice.

Uh was Benny Medina? Was this the Benny Medina era of ye?

Yeah? And Benny was? That was my man? Thank you, Benny. Man. It was great working with Maurice White. Man. I can't even get into first of all, you know, I admired him so much and uh sit next to him. You know, he really he really did have a know. I would say he really did have a glow. He always had this light his light face. Man, I mean every day he was like he was just his glow was on him talking about wisdom. He was full of wisdom. Man, soft spoken, and he knew what he was doing.

Man, man, you have you probably I don't know if you remember this, but you have inadvertently given me one of the greatest pieces of game about the music business that I don't even you probably don't remember saying this. But a good, real good friend of mine, my brother, my collaborator, Eric Roberson.

He was signed to Warner Brothers at the time.

I guess it was around the time that you were promoting in the Storm and he went out with you on a promo tour. This is I mean, god, man, this has got to be like ninety one, ninety two.

I mean, this is, you know, a forever ago.

But he said that he would just that time working with you and touring with you because he was signed to Warner But I think he just had like a single out, so it wasn't like he was, you know, up on.

The totem pole or whatever.

But you know, he was just out touring with you and he said, man, he picked up so much from you while y'all were out And he said about that album, which is interesting to hear you talk about it now. He said that he told you, like, yeah, well, you know, I like the album. It's a good album. And he said that your reply to him was, well, I mean, yeah, it's it's not just a good album, it's a money album. And we make money albums so that we can get to make good albums.

I was like, God, damn, this shit real.

You know me, so to hear you describe it that way, and like he told me his story and again I have I don't know if you remember this at all, but he was telling me about how y'all were doing the show and it was something with I guess in sound check and the engineer wasn't getting the sound right or whatever, and you know most artists would like be you know, be hollering and just be going off and shit.

And he was amazed that you knew how to work the board like that. He was like, Yo, they don't really knows this shit.

And so he said afterwards, man, you came over to the you came over from the board, and y'all were sitting down and eating dinner, and and he said, he asked you, like yo, well, like you know, how did you learn how to do this?

And he said, you told him.

Listen, man, he said, I could go, I could wild out and be all crazy. He said, but if I did that, I wouldn't be able to sit here and have this meal and have this fellowship with you here, if I was trying to do somebody else's job, you know what I mean. And you know, man, it was just and I mean, this is Eric he told me these stories. I mean, this has got ten eleven years ago. I mean, this is you know, a while back, and

And I just want to thank you for that. Man.

Man, that's that's amazing.

Man.

I really I really thank you for telling me that, because it's good to know that I put some good things out there like that, you know, and you just reminded me of some good values and things. You know, Thank you for that.

Thank you always.

I do want to know, like what have you looking looking back at at your four decades and this career, what have you learned? And like do you have any regrets? Because oftentimes, and you know, I know that you've you've been open and transparent about succumbing to to narcotics and whatnot in your career.

And but the thing is that you know, I also.

Didn't want to paint this as a I don't ever think of your story whatever, as a tragedy story whatever. And I know oftentimes when you're doing press or whatever and news things and like that's the first thing they bring they bring up or whatever. But just in your four decade journey, what what?

What? What?

What can you say that you've learned that you still keep with you today? And are there any regrets in in in your journey and everything that you've went through.

What I've learned is that's very important. It has played a very role in my life. Was this business, this this this show business that we're in. There's life first, there's there's really fans are fans of are borrowed this fa quest love fans, Algiebargs fans, Michael Jackson fans. But fans are borrowed from one city to another, from one show to another.

Uh.

I've seen a lot of entertainers, Yeah, a lot of entertainers. I've seen a lot of entertainers. Sure, you have to they they tripped. They don't know how to handle the thing. They trip. Ah, you could tell they got in it for the wrong reason, you know, right, Uh it it It breeds a lot of jealousy. That's a breeding ground for jealousy right there, and as they call it, hatred and hating.

M But.

Fans are broad but before they're fans of people and every everybody. Everybody needs love, man, everybody needs love. I don't know it. It's hard for me to look at people as fans and groupies because I see I see people, I see souls and Uh, what I've learned is that never never, never get there. I'm trying to explain this, right, we never always always always be on your way. Never arrive where you think this is it. I've arrived, I've

And without those people, you wouldn't be who you are.

I call them bill payers to right.

But there's a need. There's a need, especially now with with you know, so called pandemic going on. There's a need. People have needs, man. And when you're in a position where you can reach a lot of people, what you're gonna do, how are you gonna treat that? You know what you what are you gonna do with that?

You know?

How has the pandemic, like, you know, being kind of being at home and not being able to tour and go out. Uh, how has that affected you and what is that giving you time to kind of reflect going over the past year or so.

Well, But it's good.

It's to save money, listen, sh real, it's like a whole another down income.

It don't hurt. Don't hurt to have something put up.

Away from Amazon, mamason.

But you know, thank god, I haven't gotten you know, the virus, but I know some people that have. But you know, I wear my mask and I stay away from people, you know six feet.

But a large family have like a bi weekly zoom Like how do y'all stay connected?

Which we always want to say with kids now and everything grandkids, Like yeah, we all.

We have our own places. You know, my children they they only man, they only worse than I am.

Dad.

If you don't come over without your.

Mad I just a different question. She go the bars Chico's album A long time.

No, how involved I totally forgot how involved in where you in the production of the album.

That's one album I'm most proud.

Of very I was about to say you were there.

She came and got me. That was during my time of my narcotic situation. And uh, she came and got me and he said, I need you to produce this album with me. I'm scignis Kadar. That's where I'm gonna come up with albu. So it woke me up, man, because you know she was my man. It woke me up, and it gave me something too to do to live for, you know, to a reason to want to come up out of the rut that I was in. Right and

Man.

But yes, loves still Good?

Do we do we go love still Good?

Igging me well, cheek or I.

Can I ask the history of There was always a piano and we always keep a tape running all the time, constant studio, no matter what it's on record, something is so Chico got the studio late this day and I was already there playing these chords.

To egging me. And then when Chica walked in. Uh, I didn't know it, but I heard him in the back of me singing and the microphone was right there in the control room. That was the gist of the lead vocal right there from the control If you notice, you hear me in the background saying yeah and all that stuff. Yeah.

Yeah.

They tried to compress it out, but it's still there. But he wrote that song just standing over my shoulder singing while I was playing on scores. It just it just flowed, man, from the beginning to the end, just like that. And then love Still Good. That was very very personal with him.

About the brother line. I still every time I hear it, I tear up.

Yeah. I didn't even come to the studio that day when he did that. He said, he said, he I want to be in the studio by myself today. I got something something I'm going through.

It was a heavy Marvel influence on that one too, like real kind of trouble man, you know.

But man, that was a great album.

Man.

That's yeah.

When you when you talk about you and your brother, because you know both of y'all have had, you know, your struggles like with addiction, and stuff. Uh, how does it work in terms of you know, at the time, you know, he came and kind of pulled you out, and then is it ever a time like say, if he's down, you know, if if if he's if he's not sober and you are sober, Like, how does that work?

Uh?

In terms of you and your brother, he.

Knows he can come to me anytime. My brothers in terms of the drug situation, the sobriety thing, I'm not really around them that much. I'm kind of doing my own thing, you know. But you know, I love them all, I really do. I love them all and I'm there for him and you know that. But I'm not really I'm not really into that where they where they at?

And is that more of a protection thing for you kind of like a self preservation thing.

It's more people growing apart. It's more people growing apart and their lifestyle and my lifestyle is you know, I'm still pursuing my real They they are they cool?

Right In the industry, who do you count as your your your friends are your inner circle as far as the industry is concerned, Like, who who have you been able to lean on?

Uh?

If it's not your family, like as far as like industry people that are that are you're tight knit with?

Nobody comes to mind right now. And I'm just kidding. Darius McQuary is real good for nobody, real tight uh and uh And I don't have a whole lot of celebrity friends that that I hang out with because you know, we be tripping. I like keeping it on and keeping it real and uh, you know when I go home, I look in the mirror and I see a real person, and you know, you feel me right, I feel you, And it's hard for me to be wrong people that look in the mirror and still see somebody else celebrity.

You know.

You know what I'm saying, questions, you know, and uh, quest that's one of the guests that I hang out with.

Are you in Quick? Do y'all still y'all still really deal with each other?

Quickly school quick?

Uh?

He's been doing some touring and uh, especially with this pandemic. Man, I ain't hardly seeing nobody. Yeah, me and Quick are cool man.

Okay, Yeah, So I guess my last question is what is your next statement or when will your Well, first of all, congrats on we didn't really get to stay that much or talk at all about second Chance. But even with your you know, the nominations and whatnot and.

And making a fine record. Was it was a great record. Uh, what are your playing? As far as doing any more music material.

I'm going to you know what, i'ma have to put something out soon because I'm in the studio all the time. I'm always recording. I'm not recording an album, you know what I'm saying. I'm just recording songs.

Don't matter.

I know I'm saying.

Right, you could just put out one jam well too. Yeah, right, it's whatever now it's perfectionist.

Thing to me is hold me back. I gotta let I gotta loosen up.

It's hard to reprogram.

I got songs, man, I mean recent songs, and uh they're bad too. They're bad too. They're bad man, you're like them.

Let's let's go yo.

Ell.

It's never a time when we're not waiting on songs from you, like never.

Okay, exactly here comes, I'm coming with it. I'm gonna come with it. Get over then I'm gonna do Uh, I'm I'm gonna do some touring as soon as the world back up.

Yeah, I was gonna say, how were you pleasantly surprised by the kind of feedback that you got over that that clip of.

I was? I was? It was a last minute decision for me. I said, Okay, I'm gonna do it.

And where was that done? It was in a record shop? Where was it? Was it in California or ye?

And he's done the record shop, record shop, slash studio, slash entrepreneur's right here, it's placed.

I'm in right now, Okay, okay, curious. Yeah, I loved Yeah that clip?

Was that? Was that?

That really real rap? Like no bullshit? That concert? That just you know, that imprompted things you did? I was versus it's the Shane Oh really wow, man, you.

Did do versus?

How about I did verses with Jett?

Stop playing.

Jack? I mean, the catalog is is different and it hurts much, but hey, how many? I mean it'd be interesting.

It will be interesting now, But y'all I have to tell some stories already.

Yeah, we gotta have some stories.

You can't be like, well, I mean, I'm just trying to think of something interesting.

You know, right, but yeah, but even more than versus, I think.

Just you at offend the roads, just singing man like and then the way that you know, especially with you know, Prince's very last concerts were in that way, was just him and the piano. It was something really intimate about that. And I feel like it's something that's like super needed right now. So I hope that when this world opens up, you know, eldbares, you can that's interesting do that.

No background singers off for real to pull off, you gotta have real chops to do. You gotta be able to play.

Honestly, I didn't know anybody would be interested in that, dude.

Yeah, and we love this with you one when you have a catalog and you could do cover songs and you could do your brothers, like, yeah, I beg of you.

Be a long show. I beg of you.

Whoever talks you into the comeback thing and all right, let's audition band members and no, I need my background singers. No, I'm telling you there's something so magician you alone.

Think about how low that overhead is. Bro think about.

Yes, I was on a on a on a computer or something.

No, we singing. We will be singing.

For free.

I was singing all the harmony. You did all this, man, I was singing all the harmonies. Bro what not only not only will the audience sing it? They'll pay this, like they'll pay trust me, you get to keep all the money trust.

Me on this.

But yeah, we're all trust me sing along with elder bars. That's man. Come on, this is great.

My assister able, she always tells me that all the time, and and other people tell me that too.

But you're just getting here, Like, how long have you been on social media?

Now?

You said how long?

Yeah? Oh about three four months?

Oh, child, that's why he feeled his way.

He got to get his gotta get his legs.

He don't know how much he loved me off here if he have the account.

I just it was just there, right, yeah, I yeah.

I beg of you when when this world opens up, just you by yourself at a piano, just do a limited run.

See how the trust me? Okay, that's what the world needs right now.

Look, we can keep you here for twelve hours, man, but you know we've had you for the longest and you're in the studio right now, so we'll let you create your magic. But I thank you from the bottom of my heart for even real considering this when you when you d md me, I thought I still even though I knew it was you, I still thought it was fake. Like I had to ask a couple of people like, wait, it's just a real elder barge, this can't be.

Thank you, man, Thank you for everything. You're truly like one of my favorite signats.

Man, I thank you on behalf of me and my father and all the sundays we spent listening to all this love like you have no ideas the soundtrack of this whole life, Like just thank you and everything afterwards.

But thank you told me to tell you that.

Yeah, man, just your story.

Man, it's just you know the way that you just you know, keep persevering, and you know you just keep surfacing and keep coming back and still sounding great, and you know, you know you fall down, you get up, you keep it pushing, and you know we love you and appreciate you.

Brother. Just thank you for all that you've contributed. Man, Thanks you real, thank you.

Com one of these flowers and your face flowers.

More flowers, Bill all flowers, greenhouse, Let's do it. I bought the Rhythm of the Night forty five when it came out. Steve, if we let you out of this, I'm.

Sorry he's been talking the whole time. He talks too much.

I was on mute. Yeah, shut up, Steve.

All right on behalf of the team Supremelo Broke Bill and Sugar Steve. I'm quest Love. Thank you very much, El DeBarge. We're definitely gonna work together to bro.

Hey, I can't insist. Thank you very much. I appreciate it all right. If this is another classic episode of Quest Love Supreme, yall. We'll see in the.

Next round another one.

Hey, this is Sugar Steve.

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