Course Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora.
What's Up Everybody? This is unpaid bill. This week's QLs classic is a basis Christian McBride. He recalls attending the same high school as a mere playing on some incredible jazz records and a Miles David story You did not want to miss here. It is episode sixty eight from January twenty fourth, twenty eighteen.
Piece Supremo, Sun Supremo, roll Call, Suprema Sun Sun Subpremo roll call, subdreama Sun Sun Supreme A roll call sub Drama Sun Sun Suprema roll call.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, come on, subram Son Supremeo roll subram So Supreme roll call.
My name is Fante. Yeah, y'all know I'm filling it. Yeah here with two thirds, Yeah, Philadelphia Experiment.
Calm Supreme something something Supremo, role called Suprema, something Upbreme.
A roll where tune Suprema.
Yeah, we set the pace, Yeah, we got them drums, Yeah, we got them face so pray Son so Upbreme.
Roll called Suprama this.
Sub frame roll the Bones and candy ms Yeah, turnips, mother Steak Yeah, grits and gravy man cracking bread.
Son roll.
Supremo rolls em Yeah, no question, that's right, Yeah, yeah McBride.
Supreme Subra this is you seriously got mem freestyling upping roll.
That was the greatest sprovisation of a musician our generation.
Supremea some Suppreme roll call Subra son Son.
Supreme a roll call. Wait.
The biggest surprise of that all was like you not making our guest her third line?
Yeah, you know, christ isn't it? That's that's the standard, like brought my.
Base, you know. Now you know.
Next time, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to another episode of.
Christian McBride Diaries.
This is question of Supreme Uh with Team Suprema. Uh say, hello, guys, how you're doing UH with us today? You know, I'll say that we've had many hip hop debate on the show, but I will still maintain that jazz is probably the most argued and the most debated uh genre of music.
Uh.
It's It's fans are very passionate, and it's you know, all opinions are subjective, but I will as arguments are my favorite. Yes, indeed to watch to watch. Yeah, because you got to have your data, but I I will I will say that, in my opinion, I believe that our guest today is without a doubt, uh, probably the greatest living musician of his generation and prop you know of.
Currently in jazz right now. I mean, I feel as though he is the.
Spiritual epicenter, one foot rooted and the tradition the other foot rooted and experimenting and going outside out of the rim. That's all I can say about one of my favorite people ever, Christian Lee McBride.
Welcome to Question Love Supreme. Another homie. Yeah, how sweet of you. I never knew you felt that way. Come on, bruh, I'm I study you, bro vice versa. I know who I'm messing with. Are y'all the same age? Are y'all the same generation? This is what I'm saying. This is what I'm saying.
Even at the age of fifteen, Christian sounded like a thirty five year old like the way.
That's why I'm excited, because I want to hear all these stories about y'all being young and being the way.
That he talks right now, Like I thought maybe he was a teacher's assistant, like in school he wore like like, right now, he's wearn't sneakers. I don't think I maybe a few times I've seen you wear sneak like he always wore suits. Oh wow, and he was clean, you
know what I mean. So I my first day of Performing Arts school where we went all right, the history of us is that Christian and I went to Creative and Performing Arts High School in Philadelphia at the same time that Boisteroi men went there.
Melue grew theory the same class, same class. He and I are class of. Remember I'm proud of my age eighty nine. Thank you.
I know it was I was looking at Christian.
But yeah, but I'll say that for me, there's a point where where I guess in your teens you got to get serious about about your craft. And you know, I mean pretty much people know the backstory, Like I've been playing with my parents and all stuff since it's
like three, four or five years old, you know. And then my dad was like, well, you know, there's there's going to be a time where it's going to stop being cute, Like you know, you're five, six seven years old behind the drum set, playing on like adult.
Oh that's good, he's so cute. But there's a point where you're actually gonna have to be good.
And I will say that my first day of school at Creative and Performing Arts is probably the biggest wake up call of my life which has me here today. Like I consider that first day of the day where I was like, oh shit, I didn't know that there are other kids that play way better than I do. And you know, cause I didn't know that, I didn't know any kids, and you know, people my age like playing, like I played with a bunch of oldies cats that were like fifteen s.
So meeting Chris, I.
Mean on the first day of school, didn't Miles. Didn't you guys do something with Miles Davis on the That.
Was the I think that was the following year, all this something on Miles Davis. One of them local channel, Bill Boggs. He used to have a talk show on daytime television in Philly. Uh, they had Miles Davis as a guest, and uh they had this overly, this this naive, romantic notion that they would have Miles Davis give a live workshop like a masterclass. And he's mad. Well, I don't I don't know if he was stand office, but
he's he was brutally honest. You know, he's a man that had no filter, not even for a child, because you had an Alice Marcel's moment. I think Miles Davis is thinking, well, like, if you bolted to put me on television with a nine year old kid, you're gonna
have to hear the truth, you know. So they had they had the house band, which was myself, Joey D. Francesco on on keyboard and uh Stacey Dozier on drums, our old buddy and uh they invited four trumpet players from the Philly school system to come and play and get Miles to critique him on live television and uh uh not a good idea.
Please do what do you say about you?
Well he didn't. We weren't featured.
Were they were the master Like that's what I'm saying, Chris, Chris was already at master level.
I don't know about that. But see, we weren't playing. We were just there to back up the trumpet players. They didn't. They didn't, We weren't. Who were some of the casts that were. Fred Goodson was one of the trump players. John Swanna was one of the trumpet players. Uh Dad was one of the trumpet players and Jafar Baron eleven. No, he was. Let me see, I would have been sixteen, so Jafar might have been fifteen. And
I remember Miles pushed him in the chest. Wow, my little Miles gave him a straight left, right and right in the solar plexus. Man, I couldn't believe it. Wait a minute, I know all these years I've never heard. I never told you Miles pushed him in the chest.
Well, why did he punch him in the chest?
Because after it was over, you know, we all went up to Miles to you know, say hello, and the Miles you know, kind of cased everyone up, you know, and he went he saw you far, he went boom, you've been a practice boy. So what year was this? How old was Miles around that time? That would have been eighty eight, so years old? Yeah, right, your Miles was sixty four, maybe sixty two, sixty two. But that was on the second day of eleventh grade, right something
like that. Wasn't that early. I don't know if it was that early in the year, but it was sometime early in the year. I had missed because my parents were on the road. I missed.
Technically, I think the first two days of school. So I came in on day three, Yeah, and I had already gotten word of Oh my god, Bill found it already.
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, Wow. Okay, I wish I could see what I just saw.
Yeah, but it was mad Like for me, the whole experience is mad attimidating because every every high school has this what what what set you claiming moment? I mean, be it an actual what set you claiming moment? Or you gotta choose a click? Yeah, And because you're at performing arts high school, I mean there's different.
You know, there's theater, dance, music.
Creative writing, right, so then once you choose what you gotta do. But even inside those clicks, there are other clicks and clicks.
Yeah. And the thing was on on the right.
Side of things was Christa McBride and Joey de Francisco, whom I already knew of, like seeing clips on the news local news, and you know, Jazz brought it to these Christmas Vien Joey thirteen fourteen like playing like and I don't mean like, oh they're q for thirteen year old men. Yes, But then on the left side of it, Kurt Rosenwinkle, Kurt Rosenwinkle who worked on Q Tips. He was on the second Abstract Yeah Comala Abstract record. So Kurt Rosenwinkle uh is a year older than us, and
so he has a whole nother click. So basically, I'm trying to choose which fork in the road I'm not going to go because these guys are talking traditional straight ahead jazz. But then Rosenwinkle's trying to unteach me everything that they're teaching me by like hit me to Frank Zappa, Mount Vshu Orchestra, like John mclaugh and and all that stuff. And then on top of that, you know, I got to survive up in the lunch room and Treiek's with the cool kids, you know.
So it's just and his boys and men over there on the side.
Were they hung with them, well, they had their own. They strictly hung with the with the vocal.
When a hear tells a story, you always say they were already likes together, and pat they were together.
They were singing, trying to get girls and all that stuff. But I mean, just as far as what sets you claiming, I definitely, you know, Rosenwinkle was again the jazz argument of do we file tradition in the forties or.
Do we move it ahead to the future. So now, But this is why he was such a saving grace for me when he came to high school, because I had nobody to talk funk with for my first two years of high school. I was just kind of in my own bubble when it came to funk. I mean, I enjoyed living in my own bubble. I could do that. You know, I'm an only child, you know, I'm cool with that. But then he's leaving out a very important part of his first day of school. He was playing
the bass. He was just kind of new, lying around on the upright base. So I knew he was coming. They said we got a new drummer coming in. I'm here Thompson. I was like, oh, cool, solid, And so I walked in the music room and I see somebody on the base and I'm just kind of just kind of laying back, just chilling, like all right, who was this? And he's playing doing it to death? He's playing James Brown on that, and I went, wait a minute. So I kind of walked up to him. I was like, yeah,
what you know about James Brown. He looked at me, he said, no, what you know about James Brown. It was at that point, I man, man, you don't know how much how happy I was that you came around. And for the our last two years of high school, it was great to have that that outlet I could
go and really talk funk with him. Mother. Lowe had come out in the jungle groove on him, James Brown records, and he studied Jabbo and Clyde Stubblefield, all those Al Jackson, all those great R and B and soul drummers the same way I would study Ray Brown or Paul Chambers or Charles Mingus or Ron Carter and uh to the point where till this very day, should I reveal your your nickname? Yeah. So I've called him Clyde ever since the day I met him, because he's the closest to
Clyde Stubblefield. Nobody else has studied Clyde Stubblefield as thoroughly as he as he has and can actually play like Clyde s Doublefield. So I've never called him quest. I mean, you know, I do when what I have have to. You know, I understand circumstances always been Booty and Clyde. Booty and Clyde. That's that's what we call each other, you know. All right, So Chris, there's.
Your Your music vocabulary is so broad that I don't know whether or not to go with your story and your journey in jazz or just your opinions on music period, so we can go wherever you.
Well, we got to find out how he became a child genius, though yes.
He will never admit this. So well, I gotta know how old were you when you first started playing?
Nine? Nine years old? Based on because just like you, you know, uh, my dad b Smith is also a bass player. My great uncle Howard Cooper also a bass player, and uh so it's a family tradition, you know. I h I didn't really want to do anything else, maybe pro football at one point, uh, but it was always about the bass. What did you play ball for a little bit? Street football?
You know?
I want you to be old, get on the j bus. It was upright That's what I started on on electric base. Yeah, and then I started playing the upright base when I was eleven and I was going to Pepper Middle School in Southwest Philly because I had to play in the orchestra. Wait where was Pepper Uh? Now out near the airport? Yeah, you know what I'm saying. That wasn't Yeah, it was past Bartram it was. It was actually like Sharon Hill. It was behind Bartram, like past penn Rose Park. It
was like that. The school the suburbs. Yeah, oh big time. What would you take to get a chartered sefter bus damn yeah.
Thing?
Yeah yeah, well we basically took what was the G bus and but it was specific it went straight to Pepper. Wow. Yeah, I never heard of such a thing. Yeah, man, And so the technical uh, the the exact address was eighty fourth and Lions Avenue. The schools now closed, doesn't exist, but it was this. It was the school built on top of a swamp. There was always a prediction that the school would literally sink at some point. But yeah, it was out there near the airport, near Island Avenue
pass Linburgh Boulevard. It was. It was way out there. But they had a great music program. So that's when I started playing upright base really yep, and this is a public school or yeah? Okay, okay, so then you went there all eight years of your No, I went to Hamilton for for elementary school from first to sixth, and then Pepper seventh and eighth, and then Kappa nine through twelve.
So what when you went to Kappa, especially those two years before, at what point are you, you know, dedicating your life to Jack at least the serious the seriousness level that I saw you ass Like.
What, Well, it's a couple of things that happened. When I was in eighth grade still at Pepper, I met Joey he was there too.
No, but.
My string teacher, you remember, Mss Keith I think she was known as Miss Funk back then. Was yeah, exactly, so I know right. So she was teaching, she was my base teacher at Pepper, and she said, I think you're good enough to go to Settlement for their jazz program. And so I started going to Settlement Music School. And that's where I met Lovin Hines and Joey d. Francesco and Antonio Parker and Donald Ward, all these all the cats.
And they were like, yo, you in eighth grade. You ain't even supposed to be here till till at least next year. But Joey was there, so he was in eighth grade too. So uh, Once I met Joey. We started practicing together. We started calling each other up on the phone every day.
You know.
He you think, look, Joey de Francesco was the real child prodigy because he was gigging. He was making gigs in Philly when he was like nine years old. Yes he was. He was. His feet could barely touch the organ pedals. But I mean he knew like half the real book already.
And the fact that all right, so there's a real book and there's a fake book. Why do y'all use the fake book more than the real book.
It's cheaper, it's easier to get get your hands out, So it's the real book would be the Wikipedia of all jazz songs in book for him.
So when you're a jazz musician coming up a saxophone player, whether were there various books where they just court charts.
Or well they would have uh you know, B flat key, concert key and E flat key, so.
Yeah, like sheet music.
Yeah yeah, but you you basically, if you're a jazz musician, it would be who you to least know at least eighty of this book?
Yeah, because the big is it? It was pretty thick. I would I would say about that big you know, there's two hundred what kind of what songs are? They like it? Standard Autumn, Leaves Misty, you know, take the Train, all those all those standard jazz songs. I mean, because the part of the biggest challenge of being a jazz musician is learning repertoire. You know, because you get on stage with some of those older guys, you know, turn around and say body and soul. They don't want to
hear that. Oh I don't know that. Well what you up here for? Get off the stage, you know. So that's part of the that's the biggest challenge there is, just learning the repertoire. So how were you when you read music? When I started at Pepper, That's when I started learning reading music.
Uh, anybody can put anything, because that's the thing is that I in my experience musicians that are proficient at reading.
I know cats that.
Live on the stage, they look at it, they can play everything, but their feelings off. But then I know cats that have awesome feel they can't read a lit So I mean, at what point.
Well, it was always a myth that, especially speaking to a lot of older jazz musicians, they always had this thing and they were scared to learn how to read because they say, well, if I learned how to read music, I'm not going to be able to get the feeling into it. But I mean, I think that myth was shattered by so many great legendary musicians. I mean, first of all, if you played in a big band, you had to learn how to read, so Dizzy Gillespie, Charlie Parker,
all these great musicians. I mean, obviously they knew how to read music and write music as well. But once I started playing in the orchestra at age eleven, at Pepper started taking private lessons, and I had to learn how to read music. And you know, of course at that time, you read music every day, so I was really good at it. You know. I think I consider myself a moderately good reader now because I don't do it every day. But if I don't want to put
myself on the spot. But there are varying degrees of of of of you know, challenge challenge when it comes to the music that people give you to read. I'm fairly quick still, you know, so just in front of you, blam, can you play this? And you're looking, you know, I give it the once over and I write away. I just try to look for the problem spots, you know, and I'm just like, okay, what is that? Okay, I think I got it, you know, and then nail it. Okay.
Yeah, that's kind of where I got off the train because reading drum charts is boring. Well, no, it's just hard for me. I mean, I'm certain that if I seriously applied it, it wouldn't be anything. But I mean, you know, just reading drum charts and okay, so this is the kick, and that represents the snare and this represents the like, there's so many hours of practice you have to put into that, which I don't think.
And there's so many different kinds of drum charts, like you know, sometimes they'll just give you a lead sheet with just the melody on it and you're left to your own devices on what to figure out what the accents are exactly. You know, some will give you an actual drum part where they have all of the slashes and all the stuff on top and underneath, and like you said, you know, I've seen like drum like that. Shit makes no sense at all.
So when some of the older casts come like Tony Bennett comes through, this guy like gave his rump charts like look at each other.
He just gave his Just give us the NP three brother straight up. Well, you know, speaking of you, you're talking about Kurt Rosenwinkle and he was turning you onto the mound Official New Orchestra. Well, I would say that John McLoughlin and the mon Official New Orchestra where they
had uh, legendarily difficult music. None of it was in four, you know, it was all in nine and eleven, shifting back and forth five four, five eight, eleven, four eleven eight and uh, you know, the I is crossed listening to some of this music right now. Imagine reading it. When I went on tour with with Chick Corea and John McLoughlin, uh in a in an all star group called the five Piece Bad p E A c E.
I was literally scared. I thought Chick Corea and John McLoughlin together, boy, I know I'm gonna be doing some heavy reading on this tour. And Vinnie the Great Vinnie Calu to former Frank Zappa drummer of all people, played on that tour, and uh, John mcgloughlin had this one tune. What was the name of this piece? I can't remember,
but it was so difficult I'll never forget. We had to jump on a conference call with Chick Vinnie Call you to Kenny Garrett, who played saxophone on the tour, and we're all sitting there trying to figure out, now, how are you hearing this? Are you hearing it in five or you hearing it in ten? Or I mean, like what, what?
What?
Where? Where's the down beat? Where's the one The one part of me actually was relieved to hear Chick career of all people, asked the question. You know, he was like, man, I'm having trouble finding out how to count this, and I'm like, Okay, I don't feel so bad. Oh man, what song was it? And Vinnie call was like, uh, yeah, we'll see. Think of the dotted quarter note. It's like that's the actual quarter notes. It's like doom doom, doom, doom, doom,
doom doom. And instead of counting it, uh like like with the eighth note groove and to think of it as like a super slow five. What was the name of that song, Oh, old Blues, New Bruise. That that's the that's the recul that's the name of the song.
Oh yeah, old Blues, new Bruise. Damn. Even even my computer's like, right, yeah, or new Blues, old Bruise, something with blues and bruise in it, and like so it's a slow five and it's got all these accents in the middle of it, and I mean, I'm looking at this, going, bro, I can't feel this, and I'm thinking, well, we got a tour coming up.
I better learn how to feel it and quit. Oh so it wasn't any question of it. Well maybe it's too difficult for you guys, let me.
No, no, no, we had We had to buckle down and figure it out. And I'll tell you the whole time we were on that tour. When we played that song, you can literally see me. I'm gonna stay this going three, four, five or two. I was counting out loud and unashamed. I was like, I ain't getting lost in this tone. Wait, what year was this?
Uh? Eight eight and o nine? We did that tour ten years ago? Yeah, I'm thinking like, oh, post high school?
Oh yeah, no, no, no, this was less than ten years ago. Really, yeah, So how many years did you do at Juilliard? I only stayed for a year. That's because I started gigging pretty much right after school started. As you well know, I got to know when Marcellus toward our last couple of years of high school, and knowing that all my jazz heroes lived in New York, I said, I got to get to New York somehow, some way. So I knew I was going to go to college. And well, I knew I was going to
go to New York. But as cool as my mom is, I knew it wasn't going to be simple as hey, mom, I want to move to New York and become a professional jazz musician. So I went to I applied to the New School, Juilliard and the Manhattan School of Music, and one of those three. If I can get in any one of the schools, at least I'll be here in New York. And I started working with Bobby Watson's Horizon Quintet probably my first month in town. But that wasn't the first gig that actually took me on the road.
The first time I went on the road was like on a steady basis was probably it was both Roy Hargrove's band and Freddie Hubbards band.
And this is after Juliard yeah, So what point did you because I think everyone has that thing like I did like half a semester. Then it's like I got a record deal, I got a gig, So like for you, what was it? I mean, did your mom know? Like, okay, I think she.
Knew because once, I would say, once May rolled around May of ninety, I was working a lot, so I knew the writing was on the wall. I said, my school work's going to suffer because I'm out playing every night. I'm either going to have to make a decision either really focus on studies or go gig. So I called mom from from a payphone exactly on fifty six then, right in front of Worldwide Plaza. I don't know why
I was there, but I called her from there. I said, Mom, I don't think I want to go back to Juliard next year. And it was this long, like minute and a half pause over the phone, and I was like, Mom, you're there. She's like, yeah, I'm here, So what are you going to do? I was like, I was like, but Mom, I'm gigging. You know, I'm working a lot, and you know I'm making money. She said, where are
you going to live? I said, well, my friend, Mark Carrey, Mark Carrey, who was Yeah yeah, he was playing in Betty Carter's band at that time, and he had a place up in Harlem and he had some extra space. He said, I can move in with him. Well, I don't know, Mark, carry, I got meet him, make sure he's cool. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I was is. You were always an adult to me, so seeing you having a yeah, man, well see man again, I'm gonna
go go back to high school. I've always felt that both your parents, you know, even my dad wasn't living with us, you know, when I was growing up. But I'll never forget how much how tightly knit your family was, man, And I always thought of your dad. Both your parents and and my mom the same way. They did not let us get away with too much. Man. They weren't hear none of that, none of that crazy mess, you know.
And my mom always loved you, man. She liked the fact that I think she also liked the fact that I now had a funk brother, you know, you know, she was like, God, finally somebody else you could listen to James Brown with boy. So what was you said? The first gig you did was with Hubbert? Well, I was like, that was like my first major major gig after I left Philly. What is that like?
Like is it intimidating from you know, studying? I know that you guys like I didn't realize the point. You know, you guys are like reciting solos to each other, and I was like, ohh, I gotta now study. There's there's one point when you you enjoy were listening to I'll Never Forget you had Larry Jung's Unity, not Zultron. That was the first that is, but it's the it's the the second song.
Yes, I think it was Monks Dreamy Monk's Dreams moon Train.
But you guys were literally reciting every you know. Now, I know that's common in jazz music, but I'm was like, wait, why did they're studying?
Man? Soul was like that's how far I got to go into this thing, and.
Yeah, but you did that man, well see I did for survival because it's like if you can't get respect from I mean, it's like in jail, like you got to hit the biggest motherfucker, Like you see the biggest motherfucker that you.
Hit him, like you had to speak their language. No, I think it's survival on on that on and too, because uh.
Well, y'all used to also if the cat was sad, y'all would y'all would let y'all wouldn't even let him know.
It's like, oh, Man's cat's so sad man. I didn't want to be the sad cat that well, you know what used to crack me up. Do you remember how Joey and Kurt used to see Joey defriend to see I feel bad because Joey's not here to defend himself. But well we were in high school. But Joey used to mess with Kurt like terribly, yes, because Kurt was you know, he was he was super serious and he was not a traditional kind of guy. He was playing
great stuff, but it wasn't like straight traditional jazz. So he'd be in the in the practice room, and you know, he would be on the piano. I actually didn't even know Kurk played guitar because he played a lot of piano in high school. Really yeah, so the first during freshman and well, I knew he played guitar, but I thought that was a secondary instrument because I always just see him on piano all the time. So he would
be on the piano. He be playing all these all these weird kind of you know, polychords and all this stuff, and Joey would come behind and be like, man, what is that ship? Man? Why don't you play some blues? And Kirk get out of here, man, leave me alone, and Joe's that's some bullshit, get out of here, all right. So this leads me to.
I will say that with as far as Winton's concerned, Yeah, you've heard all the arguments.
I'm certain that you've heard both sides. I've been. I've been deep in the eye of that hurricane.
I understand that now. I mean part of me just from where I stand in hip hop. Were we standing hip hop? I mean, like no one wants to be seeing as the grumpy old traditionalists and the guy that's only hanging onto the flag and that sort of thing. And you know, especially with hip hop, you got older cats that need to contextualize their coolness by co sign and something young, right, some progressive like Quincy's the king of that.
Quincy always talked about he has a cough drop in his mouth. Yeah, you know, I love Bro. But it's like.
I've heard everything, and probably the best analogy I heard that Winton.
Has more as far as hip hop comparisons.
I've heard a jazz guy that I respect very much say that Winton is the Puffy of the jazz movement. In other words, there was a point where, I guess in seventy eight where you know, the N Base Collective and all those guys were trying to push forward.
I mean, if you ask a cat like Dave Murray, David Murray, I mean, his thing is like, well, you know, he came in the suit and killed our movement. So but then, but I know that win is about tradition. And then when he did the.
Documentary with on PBS, yeah, that really didn't help his argument.
This is true much. I mean I appreciated it because there's stuff I didn't know about King. People got turned off by that, right, So it's like we're including jazz musicians, right, especially jazz musicians. So where do you stand as far as what he represents. I think when Marcellus was was absolutely necessary for what it was that he did. I do think, well, you know that that old saying about the you know, killing a flow with a rifle, you know, I do think that's deep. I do think that in
his desire to uphold the traditions of jazz. I think he was quite divisive and harsh on a lot of musicians that came before and in some cases after him, came after Yeah, who really didn't see things the same way he did. I do find an interest in that. You know, you look at jazz in the seventies and you look at what was hot at that time. You know, the whole loft scene that was going on in New York. Uh, you know this this sort of I don't know what you would call it, this sort of post online guard
kind of movement. You know, lest the Bowie was hot, Chico Freeman was hot, David Murray was hot, Oliver Lake, the AACM was doing great things. And then a lot of the jazz ledgends you know, your art, Blakie's, your heart silvers, they weren't getting the same kind of attention or the same kind of of respect that they had
been getting in the fifties and sixties. There was this sort of unspoken uh, this, well, these guys are the old school, you know, I mean, they still play good, but they're not really contributing anything fresh to the cannon. And then here comes this young raw kid from New Orleans who can play the hell out of the trumpet like no one's ever heard before. And on top of everything else, he's brashing outspoken that he pretty much came
up and said, wait, ho, hold hold of time. Up all the stuff that y'all think is great, this is all straight bullshit. And even if you didn't agree with him, you had to go, whoa, Yeah, this dude, it's got some balls on him, you know. And he's backing it up with backing it up with his trumpet playing. Now, add that he's got a brother almost more outspoken than him, but he was he in terms of jazz tradition, he
was very much on the same page. And I see it's interesting that my manager and I always talk about this. You really, you do realize who actually changed the course of jazz forever in the eighties was not a jazz musician. It was Sting. When the police broke up and Sting decided to start his dream of the Blue Turtles band. The fact that he took two of Winten Marcellus's band members that caused a riff in jazz that to this day has never really been resolved. I think to think
about something. In nineteen eighty five, Winton Marcellus had already won I think by that time he already won four Grammys. He had already he was already already acknowledged as like the seminal trumpet player of a of a generation, even though he was only like twenty four, a protege of Albert Murray and Stanley Crouch, you know. So like so he was known as an intellectual on top of a great trumpet player, and he was so well celebrated for his you know, embracing of the tradition and sort of
resetting jazz's values. And he's got one of the greatest bands in jazz with his brother, the great Kenny Kirkland Seann at Mafino based on Jeff Taine Watts on drums. Sting comes around and says, hey, Branford, Kenny, y'all come with me. And so this almost seemed very much like a Cane and Abel because like people were like, you left your brother to go play.
On a rock band, what you know, sound fun and right?
And so people were kind of like, but Branford, I thought you how could you do that?
You know?
Branford was like, look, I love straight ahead jazz, but I never said I wouldn't play anything else, you know, so imagine when he did Buck Shot La Funk that. Yeah. So I do know that there was a very very bad split between him for a long time. They've since made up. I know it's been all good, But musically speaking, I really don't believe Winton ever really recovered from that. Really, I don't think so. I think musically because that band was so killing musically, he wasn't going to find anybody
else to replace, somebody like Bradford or Kenny Kirkin. So you're saying, now here's the word thing I just recently found in oral history on Live at Blues Alley. Yeah, and.
To hear Wint and tear that album apart, I'm in an album that I studied.
You know, that's a great album, So I thought, I think so, I thought, but to hear him and then read further.
Because the thing is is that with with rock criticism and hip hop, as far as journalism is concerned, I never delve deep into how jazz records were perceived or you know, got a bunch of downbeat back issues to see how they were, you know, unless it was like looking up on the corner or something, you know by Miles. But I never knew because in my head when Jay Mood and sort of his eighty six to eighty eight period, I thought that.
Period immediately after Branford Kenny went was thinking. See, but I didn't see that as a down period.
But if you're trying to compare it, are you saying that that eighty six eighty eight period of Winton would be the equivalent of post payback James Brown?
Like, No, I wouldn't say that. I would say that just mentally speaking.
Because I thought he was trying to push even further experiment and then when he got to the nineties doing like the Little.
The New Orleans, Yeah, the whole eighty six you know those albums he talked about j Mood live at Blues Alley. I mean, those are virtually only the two albums he made before he turned and kind of went straight traditions and went straight to his New Orleans thing. And you know, he helped build Jazz and Lincoln Center. So I always wonder, like how much of that was because of what happened with Branford and Kenny, Like, had Branford Kenny not left
his band to go with sting. I'm sure Winton's career would have been a lot different different just for for context.
So when jazz music is referred to straight ahead jazz, what is that referring to?
Like, who are some of the artists most of the time they well, they're referring to a style of jazz that is kind of coming out of fifties hard bop, you know, l Heart, Silver, Cannonball, Atterley, danceable quote unquote jazz, you know, like blues based kind of jazz.
Saying not bop as in because I knew that at a point when they started speeding it up right, it was to discourage the dancing, right, So yeah, fastbat was more like, hey just watch us and stop dancing, okay, So they were the DJ of the moment, you know, but they were still called that straight ahead you know.
I think when things started changing, it's like when avant guarde movement started coming around, and it became less about it became less so much about overt or i should say, sort of recognizable traditional melodies or traditional four to four rhythms, you know, like on that Coleman kind of blew it out of the water in the fifties and Cecil Tailor came around, and Charles Mingus's music started getting a little more abstract, to the point where even some jazz fans
were like, well I don't really quite know what this is, you know, Andrew Hill.
And wait you're saying and now I'm like the shape of jazz to come was sort of like met with because now it's considered or at least beneath the under like those records are like considered.
Yeah. No, there were a lot of people who initially, yeah, they felt it was like heroin music. They were like, well, you know, I'm not sure I can get with this on that Coleman dude, you know. Oh yeah, a lot of people felt that way. You know, I think, uh the masses did dig it, uh, but it was definitely a musical shift that it took a lot of people took some time to adjust to it.
You came out as a young lion, like when I knew like, oh this means things some article on Time magazine where they.
Were remember that.
That was like whoa Jesus Christ, Chris this in Time magazine, you know what I mean? So it was like there there was was were young lions only referred.
To as the class of eighty five. Yeah, we were the Winton spin offs. So young Lions were referred to as post Winton jazz. Absolutely, yeah, yeah we were you know, we were considered the uh you know we we were the Jefferson's two Winton's all in the family.
Okay, okay, all right, So then how do you feel about the post generation.
After us, or like the post generation post Winton, or like our generation or.
From from after Europe period. There's probably two generations that have passed right now. I know me personally with musicians again, like the the the universal positioning, the universal quest love positioning of you know, whatever I represent, it's supposed to be all knowing, all accepting, and you know, kind of
diplomatic about the ship. So I haven't like exactly been like there's some bullshit a lot of right, right, But there are a few musicians that are mad at me about my outspokenness of gospel chops.
So in R and B play everything. But how is that in your world?
Because there's some cats that I like, I know not the fall for the okie doke, and the okie doke is like if someone does more fancy ship than they do straight ahead ship, then that might be a problem.
So I think oftentimes, you know, obviously, technique is it's a great thing to have. I think it's something that one has to strive for it if you want to be the best at what you do. Obviously, it's about taste. It's about when, it's about when you decide to pull your your flash card, you know what I mean. I think oftentimes, because not a lot of musicians have a lot of great technique, when you find a few that do,
it can be intimidating. But on the flip side, if that person with the great technique just jams it down your throat all the time, it's gonna make it really bad for the ones that actually have good technique, who have taste, Like for me, Wayne Shorter. Wayne Shorter has just technically speaking on the saxophone. He has the fast He has some of the fastest guns since John Coltrane, probably the fastest since John Coltrane. But Wayne always picks the perfect spot to hit you with that He never
that's never his numb. He doesn't come out here, it never comes out of the gate where you know, you know, it's just you know, you're like, oh, what was that you know what I mean. He makes you want to hear it again, you know what I mean? And I
think the whole thing with the gospel chops. I'm with you all the way, bro, because I mean so many times I always tell young younger musicians, particularly drummers and bass players, Look, that stuff you're doing is great, all right, but do you want to have a million YouTube followers or do you actually want to work and talk about it?
You know?
Do you want somebody to call you for a gig or do you want somebody to just pass around YouTube videos and tell tell you how fast your chops are? I would think in a practical world, you will want to gig. And if you want to gig, you're gonna have to learn to put put them put that shit away, you know what I mean? And I love using you as an example.
Man.
I was like, look, listen to quest Love. I mean, there's a reason why you are who you are. And now I gonna gash you up a little bit. Man.
Uh.
I can honestly say that after having played with so many of my drum heroes just jazz and funk, you know, having played with Bernard Purty, finally got a chance to play with Jabbo and Clyde, Mike Clark, Steve Gadd Yo, man, you are easily like one of the top ten of all time in terms of holding that pocket. Come on, bro, who who else plays that pocket like you? Man? Seriously, he's not good with though, he don't sorry, and I'm a homeboy. Little John Roberts, Little John, he just he
been holding the pocket down. I know how much. I don't know how many chops he's got too, could my my? Okay, So part part he was.
In All City, bab, little John was younger than me, so part of me felt like, okay, as an eleventh.
Grader drummer, foret guys not yeah, yeah right.
It's funny because the first time I met that little John, yeah, back in ninety four, I was like, wait, what happened to your hair?
Like I'm because both of them having to Atlanta, right, John Roberts.
But no, it's funny about John Roberts is because he was I think two years younger than me. So when I got to All City, I mean, he looked like his name was little John Roberts, Like he looked.
Like a kid.
He just so naturally I just thought like, oh, motherfucker's playing the tambourine or something, and you know, I'm on the drum set and he was cool, like I'm on his drum set, but I'm getting aything, tuning stuff up the way I want it, you know. And then who's the the all City Hi?
Yeah, mister Whittaker. I was like, okay, uh, what's what's his name? Am Omar? He was like, yeah, you can play a tambourine on good News or he'll or he gave me throwaways on my Hill with the Lord Hides or yeah, old Maynard ferguson songs whatever, And to.
Watch this little did you have to get your ass up?
Like?
That was my martin pretty ricky what they call it. That was my moment. That's when like I was dead serious. I now have to shed.
Five hours, which is like usually the neighbors would start bitching around ten pm.
Yes, right, so you know that leaves me limited space from like four to ten pm to do.
But even then I'm like, okay, practice on my pad and all right, don't wait that up, hit hit the bet.
You know, the mattress is something silent.
But it was like I gotta get I gotta get some technique and get like that pressure came on me at sixteen seventeen, but little John Roberts was like he when I saw him running, That's when I knew I had to get my ship together and get it right. But the weirdest thing about it is my approach was to actually do less yause I know every drummer, like, there was a point where you know, here's the gospel
group what commissioned? Yeah, oh yeah, so commission Like those cats started get more technique into their playing and stuff, and all, like all Tristate area musicians just started following suit. And you know, and you know, by that point, James Brown like his his music was starting to come alive
more in Hip Hop eighty seven eighty eight. So I mean, it's a lot for you to just what I what I would call use the force and just damn like, all these guys want to show how fancy they are, and I got to play less to get attention.
And it's it was hard. You navigated that brilliantly though, like for the first.
Four years to just do nothing while all these other cats are just dancing around me getting all.
The woo's and and stuff.
And you know, even now like, no, it's the equivalent of in hip hop, the dude that can freestyle and get all the oohs and ah's and whatever.
I can't make a record to save his It's like too short.
It's like too short versus cannabis exactly right in the air. Yeah, man, yeah, so it's But I also feel my dad taught me a trick. Whenever he would audition a musician, He's like, make him play the ballot. Yeah, like the slowest, easiest song ever, and I will watch mini musician trip.
Do you got to go to? Well?
I mean my dad's songs were ballots, so like I would want to do like the fast, funky, you know, stuff to see like how they adjust.
And Dad was like, no, you're you're.
Gonna find out the truth about a musician. Always make him play the ballot. You give him the simplest things ever, and they will always mess up because discipline.
Is one to be hardest things.
Absolutely, So okay, And I'm not lying about you being technically proficient as far as in my opinion, one of the greatest musicians.
Working right now music.
How do you, I mean, what's the conversation in your head? Because a lot of times, I'll hear references like it's like you still have hip hop techniques to your soloing, right in terms of like I'll hear references like oh, okay, that was the theme that the Jeffersons.
Right right, right right, or whatever.
But it's like, what's in your head? Because for me, the pressure of soloing is one of the hardest things. It still gives me anxiety to this value. But like, do you get anxiety to solo or is it just.
Like it depends depends on the song, it depends on the whole whatever circumstances that happened at that time. I still have head trips about playing the electric bass and I shouldn't. And I'll tell you why I have hit well because even after all these years, I still get the I didn't know you played electric bass, you know.
I'm like, damn, so uh wait, even after nine albums absolutely yeah yeah, yeah, yeah no, people still see me with an electric bass and they're like what really, I'm just like, oh yeah, totally and so like, and I see like because I don't play the electric bass every day like on GAT.
I mean, I play enough electric bass where I think my technique is still respectable, But I know that you get like some cats out here, like our homie Derek Hodge, who really does it. Uh, you know, all these legends like Victor Wooton and Marcus Miller and cats who really, really really do it on a regular basis. And I
don't know. Every now and then I put the electric base on, I'm thinking somebody out there and the audience is going, he's not as good as Marcus Miller, which is true, But I still get really uptight about playing the electric bass now now houses for irony, except when me and you were playing together.
Well, that's weird though, because of the gazillion times I've seen you. Most of the times it's like you're electric, like when your Family Fair project came out, right, I've seen you a lot, like I always felt that you You've devoted half of your projects to That's what I've tried to do, tradition and right pushing forward, you know.
You know, speaking of that that recording a family Affair, I think that was when there was a couple of things that happened between ninety eight and two thousand and one. That was when I started to and in retrospect, I wonder if this was wrong of me to have, or if it was reactionary. But by ninety seven it was kind of like, oh, the young lion Christian McBride, Ray Brown protege went Marcella's you know, little brother club. You know, it's just like you wanted to be your old man.
I'm like, come on, you all, damn. I mean, obviously I loved Ray Brown, you know, Ray Brown. For me, it was like the Muhammad Ali of jazz bass of all time went Marcella's great you know mentor big brother to have. But I knew my musical view was a lot wider than that. So I thought, wow, I'm getting painted into this corner. I want to do this other stuff, and I think they're going to start tripping once I
decided to do that. So ninety eight I knew that I see, I want to do something a little more, a little more electric, a little more on this side, you know. And so I hooked up with George duke Man. A lot of people in the jazz world they were like, I took it. Took it like this, Christian, we really love you, so we're just gonna let you have this one. We're not even going to acknowledge we're just gonna be like.
Because when I saw the fonts, when I okay, so the day the album usually on the first week of your album's coming out, Yeah, I'm buying it. And when I see in it and saw the font at first, I was like, wait, didn't do a funk record and not call me, I mean my feeling. So you knew from the font it was it was from the front, right.
But then I was like, because I know, I figured that your entry into the music world was the same as my entry in high school, right, And I was like, okay, because I know that you got a side of you that wants to reference Bootsy and James Jamerson and Jacobin Stores and all these you know, Lewis Johnson, Like there's a whole other side.
Of you that you have you have to express.
I mean, you'll, you'll, you'll salt and pepper, some ship and a cut or two with with with your record.
But then when I saw that, I was like, Okay, he's this is going to be his his flag planting right now. I never read the reviews of that record. There were none. What was the general because again like.
And what was the name of the record, what was the family which is weird because you you swung and I love that interpretation of it. He did a swing interpretation of of of Fair of a slyest song, so it's.
Also wait, I forgot to tell you. Is that the one that opened Sesame? Dude?
You ever talked to Ronald Bell about that? He loves you forever for that? Really yes, because he in his head he envisioned all that stuff as serious jazz. For you to interpret open Sesame the way that you did, Oh, man, that made it. That made I always wanted to know if you ever knew that you made his life with that.
I'll tell you what. After the family Affair, I got a call from verdein white and uh, I'll never forget, like like almost being frozen for a couple of days, you know, like, man, we just wanted to tell you we got your we got family, we got getting to it and family affair on the tour bus and we're checking you out. Man, we love I'll write a song for you. Yeah.
I was like, oh, Elizabeth, wait, I know, I know you have crazy stories. Uh, I know that if she's on your record, you have a crazy vested story. I was about to ask, I.
Actually don't man.
She was.
She was pretty mellow. Man. I actually didn't know her. George Duke knew her. I brought in these songs that I wanted to record, and uh now Shaka was originally singing, okay, stands.
Walked famously and then she'll send her best girls.
Though that was.
Supposed to do don't look any further real you mean with with Dennis Edward, Yes, no, kidding him up.
Was supposed to do the power with snap them up. She's famous, bless her. Penny Ford didn't pretty.
She said, I'll send the best girls.
Yes. I met Penny Ford through Shaka. She was singing background at that time. Yes, like so, George, So I brought in these songs, a couple of vocal tunes and uh, George said, well who you want? I said, uh, well I want to get Shaka. He was like, you want to make the call or you want me to make the all. I was like, well, you know I know Shaka, but your George du you know, so you make the call. So uh he said, all right, I'll call her. He's like, uh, shock us down. You know she wants to do it.
I guess maybe a week later he said, man, something went down shock ain't gonna be able to make it now, all right. Uh, He's like, how do you feel about Vesta? I was like, oh ship, yeah great. So Vester came in and and nailed it. And Will Downing came in. Uh George dude gave him the greatest nickname I've ever heard for Will Downing. Just take a while. I guess what he called him based on his initials w W D forty.
What was the story behind your tribute for James Brown and the aftermath of that?
Yeah, I was gonna say, give it us the tribute. Yeah, it was your James Brown story is the k Yeah. So getting to you finally working with working with Yeah Brown. Oh man, you got to let our audience here. I know the story, but I'll do my best to give you a condensed version because it's long. But the gist of it is, we got today, all right, we got today. Right on the gist of it is that you know, as this man knows. Uh, you know, James Brown has
been like my bone marrow. So by the time I leave Philly to move New York, James Brown was in jail, and so I'm writing James Brown letters like once a month. You know, I know he's not getting them, you know, because I'm sure he's getting hundreds of them per day.
I was like, it's all good. I just want him to know that I love him, you know. So, Uh, nineteen ninety three, that's a very CHRISTI and so Uh in nineteen ninety three, I'm on my first tour with Pat mctheeny and uh, We're playing the Montreal Jazz Festival and I'm backstage and I'm walking around and I didn't look at the schedule. So I walked by one of the production doors and it says James Brown stage plot what So I knocked on the door. I was like,
excuse me, Uh, is James Brown performing? It's like, yeah, when tonight It's like what he said, Yeah, he's coming on after y'all. Oh shit. And so that's how you know you're a busy jazz musician. I am. We were opening for James Brown. So uh that night, Uh, yeah, I see Saint Clair Pinckney and Danny Ray and Martha High all the jazz Brown.
This is the first time you're seeing them? Yeah, how do you even well, enter give me first time? I well, I mean I'm sure that in your travel you saw like macy O and hearing that right right because of your level of stand them, how do you how do you approach? How do you nuance the approach to let them know right without freaking them out?
I got lucky, and I'll tell you why. Because, out of all them guys that were standing in the wings ron last year, I knew I knew them all. They're standing in the wings and they're watching us, and I'm thinking, oh, man, this is my shot. There was one brother who I didn't recognize. He was a young dude. It turns out he had just joined James Brown's band like three months before, and it was obvious that, you know, he had that
rookie look about him. You know, he was kind of like standing by himself and you know, kind of with the band but not really you know. And he was like, man, you sound great, man, you know, pleasure to meet you. I said, yeah, man, you too. What's your name? Brother? He said his name was Robert Thompson, also known as
MOUSEI Molsie Thompson is his name? He said, y'all just started playing drums with mister Brown a couple of months ago, and so I think he was relieved to meet somebody close to his age that he could kind of roll with. So me and mouse started rolling that night. We started hanging and talking and I found a little bit of his history. He played with Chuck Brown, He's from DC. He played with Chuck Brown, he played with Wilson Pickett before he got with James Brown. Uh, only because James
made him. But he is very funky. And so I got into the James Brown crew initially through Mouseie.
Uh.
So Mousie was kind of, you know, metaphorically, kind of took my hand and said, hey, guys, this is Christian McBride. Is the brother y'all just saw and said, oh, Christians. I met Saint Clair and Danny Rain and I started kind of working my way in and the the final straw came the next year in ninety four, when James played the Apollo and he did his final would turn out of his final live at the Apollo Record. Uh, that's where I met Martha High. Martha High was the
mother hen of the entire James Brown crew. And so Mousey introduced me into Miss High. And then once I met Miss High, that was pretty much you know, here's your VIP pass, you know. And then do they know you're Christian Bride? They did shortly after the Apollo gig Getting to It came out, and so then they started putting two and two together. They were like, well, wait a minute, Oh, that's that's who that is, you know. So ninety five, I'm on tour with this Verve Records
All Star band with Jimmy Smith. Would you say stand up my level? So I knew that one of James Brown's jazz heroes was Jimmy Smith, great jazz organist. Jimmy Smith was on this Verve All Star our tour. So I said, uh uh, James Brown. We were all playing the Vienna Jazz Festival and James Brown was staying in the same hotel. And I said, if I ever get to meet James Brown today, I'm a drop that I'm playing with Jimmy Smith. And so by that time I
knew mister Brown's bodyguards. And he says, hey, man, you just plotted yeah, oh man, dude, slow and methodical. I knew it was a little smooke SI don't like all right, right, and then once you heard the track, you were like, wait a minute, that's good at it right? Right exactly exactly, So Uh yeah, So Reginald Simmons was his name. Mister Simmons introduced me to James Brown and uh, it's mister Brown. How you doing. I briefly met you at the Apollo
last year. I'm friends with Mouses and A oh that's right son. Yeah, yeah, you're the bass player, Yes, sir said, I'm playing with Jimmy smith tonight. Like what, well, you know, I love Jimmy smith Man and so, uh, you know, we just he just sat there and wrapped and just talked about jazz and still then it was still not like you know, just I was just geeking out. We didn't really have any real meaningful conversation. So I think
everything finally took shape. Uh. Right after that, I said, okay, I got to stop all this all this fan stuff and actually come up with something. What do I want to do with James Brown? What's my dream? I said? Well, I know I'm not going to ever be in his band. He's not going to ask me to do that. I'm not sure do it. I don't know, man, just just I've heard too much. Yeah, I mean I'm like, you know, I mean it was almost like you told me, because I remember once asking you had you ever met MJ.
And You're like, yeah, nah, I'd rather just right. Well, I thought, if I have, If James Brown actually ever in the in the unlikely event he actually did call me to join his band, I'm thinking, what would I do. I was like, I just don't know, man, I don't want to be putting on them red red tails every night and in blue times and uh ms High asked me that one time, and she said, would you join the band of James Brown? Asked you? And I went,
she said you better not yes, ma'am Okay. So anyhow, I said, I want to do a jazz project with James Brown because I know how much he loved jazz. He's always name dropping the jazz cats. Uh, maybe we could do that soul on top record live he did this really uh with it soulo and something. Yeah, because I figured I would. I figured he wouldn't do it
unless I let him do that. You know, that's right, no matter what song on the actual key is in you know, so down, I said, let me ask James Brown if he'll be interested in doing soul on top with a big band. You know, I would write new arrangements of his favorite jazz standards and he could play organ and sing, you know, and uh, it would be like a soul on top two point. Oh. You know, so I'll go back to writing letters. You know, so
writing on these letters, send them to his office. I'm thinking, okay, yeah, I know letters are kind of kind of effective, but not really, you know, keep sending the letters, keep sending them letters. And uh, finally he came to New York. This is in ninety seven, and mister Simmons sees me again. I'm backstage head Radio City and uh, mister Simmons says, oh, mister Brown, mister McBride is here. You remember mister McBride, right, And James Brown said, yes, I do, mister soul on top.
And that's when I realized he had started getting these letters, and so he invited, uh, he invited me out to dinner with his entourage that night. So now now the rubber's hitting the hitting the ground, you know.
Uh.
Oxtails, that's right, the oxtails and Champagne. I love it, I love it, I love it. We went to Victor's Cafe on fifty second and Broadway. He ordered oxtails all around. He ain't ask anybody what they want everybody that's the song say. Oh man. So uh, that night we actually started talking about maybe doing the Soul on Top project and uh. A couple of months later, actually a couple of weeks later, because this was Thanksgiving, Thanksgiving to ninety seven,
I'm sorry ninety six. He invited me down to Augusta for his Christmas party and I said, oh man, I can't believe how good this is going. I'm like, I'm in the James Brown crew. This is trippy. And things went really bad at the Christmas party. Wait, let me get it ready right there you go. Yeah. So I'm sitting there at the party hanging with Mouseie because that was my dog. He was my entry into the James Brown What year is this? This was? This was Christmas
of ninety ninety six. Oh wow. And I'm sitting there at this table with Mousie and Martha Hyde and Danny Ray all these people sitting at the table and James was he was cool. You know. When I got there, he was like, Miss McBride, wasn't an Augusta glad to have you his son? Love everything you do. You know, thank you, sir. Get to the end of the party. We're all taking pictures and I'm sitting there posing with mister Brown and Miss High and just before the camera clicks,
James Brown leans over. He says, so, I'm empty you son. I know what you're doing. You can't fool me. I said, what are you talking about, mister Brown? Nah, I don't get me that. I know what you're doing. I got my eye. You trying to infiltrate my organization. Oh you trying to take Miss High and my drummer from me. Mister Brown, what you're talking about? You know? And then he like kind of walks off like pisted right, and
I thought he was playing right. And so I looked at Martha How I was like, uh, you want to help me out? You know. She was like, I don't. Don't pay him no mind. You know, he's just tripping. I was like, I don't know, he looks he looks really mad. And so, uh, I tell Malsie what happened. I'm freaked out, like my childhood heroes pissed at me, right, and so uh he was like, oh, man, don't worry about Brown. You know, see you're just getting in too close.
I said, yeah, apparently, so you know, And so I call him on the phone a couple of weeks later. We're in the new year now, and uh, I said, mister Brown, you know, I just wanted to check back in make sure everything was cool about that incident at the party, and you know about those letters I sent you with the sold on top thing. He's like, uh so, let me explain something to you. I was like, oh, I could just feel it coming. I was like his voice was tense, you know. He was like, first of all,
I ain't making no record with you. He's like, I think you got some mixed up son. If we're gonna make a record, that it's gonna be my record. I don't make no guest appearances on nobody's record. You understand this's gonna be a James Brown record. I ain't singing on your record. Who you think you are?
I was like, what your stomach feel like at this moment? Like you on the phone, what do you I.
Was like, I was well, I was I was too shocked to feel anything, you know. And he was just like, uh uh, you think you're gonna write some arrangements for me? So I don't need nobody write no arrangements for me. I ain't doing no record with you. Secondly, bullet yeah, he was like, I listened to your record all the way through, and uh, that record ain't nothing. No, no, no, you can't play you can't play no bass. You got everybody telling you a great bass player. You can't play
no bass. In fact, I'm gonna sue you forgetting to it. I would have well. I was about to break out in tears until he until he went here he says, uh. He said, you just like everybody else, you're stealing my music and and and trying to get rich. And then I was like I had the audacity to stand up for myself. I was like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait a minute, mister Brown, he said. I said, sir, do you have the CD? Because he was like rambling, you know, I was like, sir, do you have the
CD handy. He's like, nah, I don't have it nearby. I said, look, when you get the CD, will you please open up the liner notes and read the entire paragraph I wrote about you. And you know how much you've been in inspiration to me and how much Get It Together inspired this tune, and you know all this other stuff. And it's weird because he paused he went, you wrote about me in the line of notes. I said, mister Brown, all you have to do is read it.
He was like, he was like, well, in that case, I still love you, but I ain't making no record with you. So but see, all of this is so strange because a couple of days later, I get a call saying mister Brown wants you to perform at his birthday bash. And I'm like, Yo, this is trippy, and I'm thinking I should say no because I don't want this drama, you know, but I'm an idiot. So I took the gig, right. I said, I'm gonna go down and play with James Brown for his birthday bash because
he asked me, right, and so I go this. This is May of ninety seven. He had me play with some house band down there and at the Bell Auditorium where the Sex Machine album was made. And so when I get there, Mossie, you know it was it was funny because like the whole band was like, yo, man, we heard what happened. Sorry, you know, we told you he's crazy man, you know. And so Mossie said, man, Brown is backstage, you want to say hi, wish you may happy birthday. I was like, all right, I guess
I'll go with torture. I know, right, So I go back to say say hello and wish my happy birthday. I was like, happy birthday, mister Brown, Miss McBride, great to see you. So what song you're gonna play tonight? You're gonna play that song you stole from me? And so I was just like, you know what, I should go to the airport right now, but no, but no, right, I gotta I gotta be loyal. And so h I played my one little song. And at the end of
the night, James Brown up on stage. He says, uh, ladies, y'all want you to give a big round clause all of the performance this evening. Uh let's hear it for the Blues Brothers. Uh, let's hear it for Kenny Wayne Shepherd. Uh Kenny Wynd and the Blues Brothers. Is here for Eddie Floyd, brother Eddie Floyd. Uh let's hear for mother of two? Uh what Yeah, it was out. Let's hear for my daughter Yama. Uh let's hear for Roosevelt Johnson.
And so he left me out. And so this is when I knew that Martha Hyde and and Mousie were real friends. Mousie I was waving the sticks like even as herd as I am at this point like beyond insulted, like I donet got cussed out by the man, threatened to be sued, told me I couldn't play. Toy wasn't shit. Even with Mouseie going like this, I'm backstage looking at Mousie like, don't don't you get yourself fired? No, stop it.
So Molseie's playing, He's like mister Brown, mister Brown. Martha High physically walks up to James Brown in the middle of his ranting and like James b said, oh Lord, have mercy, I forgot How could I forget the great Christian McBride, Oh please forgive me the fugus bass player in the world. And and Martha Hyde looks back, She's like, you know, I got you. I was like all crazy, and so at that point I had no contact with
James Brown for nine years. I ran into him on the road somewhere and I was just kind of like, yo, what's happening? You know, kept walking. But in two thousand and five I was named the creative chair for the La Philharmonic for their Jazz series my job was to curate twelve jazz concerts every season, eight at the Hollywood Bowl and for at Walt Disney Concert Hall. And so I said, with this new position, I got to at least see if I can make this happen. I said,
nine years should be long enough. And so I called Charles Bobbitt, the late Charles Bobbitt, and I said, mister Bobbitt, you know I'm doing this thing with the La phil Harmonic. I'm curating shows at the Hollywood Bowl. And you know, I won't know if mister Brown would be interested in doing a jazz big band concert. And he's like, oh yeah, I don't know. You know, it might be hard to make that happen, but let me put the word in. See what happens. By the week later, Charles Bobbitt called
me back. He said, mister Brown said it's a green light. What did you believe it? I actually did believe it because when he came to New York, mister bob says, we want to meet with you at at our hotel. It's hard for me to say what hotel they stayed at. It starts with a T, but uh he said, yeah, you know that that guy in the White House. Yeah, but yeah, come by there and uh and we'll talk about it. So that's when I knew serious. I said, man,
James Brown, we're actually going to do this. So on September sixth, two thousand and six, three months before, months before he died, yep, we played at the Hollywood Bowl.
James Brown, how much rehearsal went into that. We had pretty much just one one full day of rehearsals at Center staging out in Burbank, and we only wound up doing I think he sang five songs, five or six songs with the big band, and then he did Man's World, I Feel Good and Sex Machine with his own So it was the stage was was packed because his entire band was on this side of the stage. The big
band was on this side of the stage. A string section was in the middle, and we had a drum perch for Louis Belson because we had him come out and play one song with us since he was on the original song on top album. So you love Risks, man, There's there's a risk with older cats that you know, Lord knows I know that. I mean, you got a nuance it perfectly. It's not hurt their feelings even when they're wrong, they're right, that's so. And he never sued you though he never you didn't even remember.
The angels talking, all right, So I nominate Chris the second to h d N used to be repeat guests because I knew you got yeah, this is this is gotta be it fifty more we have not yeah, we even cracked the surface.
Well see bro, you first of all, I will always say it on the record and off the record, but man, so proud to call you my homeboy and my friend.
Man.
You you breaking barriers left and right. Man, so proud of you. I'm trying to keep up with you. Man, and I still and I still remember. One of my favorite slang terminologies was one of his dad coined, uh, and that was cake cake. I never heard anybody use cake for money.
Money before that was that was your pop can white man. I got nineteen jobs, Man, you're going and get some cake, yo, Chris.
I thank you for coming on the show man, Thanks for having me.
Man.
Yo, Man, this only beginning. I got shared on my freestyle and next time next go around, you.
Would have it yes or v apple font tickeloaf, unpaid and uh Boss Bill. Yes, I wanted to say very paid Bill and Sugar Steve. This is Questlove Quest Love Supreme and we'll see you on the next go round.
Thank you, West.
Love Supreme is a production of My Heart Radio. This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora. For more podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.