¶ Introduction
Okay, Megan, once again, I have hit the record button. What does that mean?
Here we are.
Does that mean that we're going to, we're going to talk about stuff.
And that means the fun is going to begin.
All right, the fun is going to begin. Good. Hello, hello. Hello, my name is Patrick Cadigan. I am one of the hosts for Post-secondary Transition or P2Transition, who is my other host.
And I am Megan Smallwood and welcome back. And thanks for joining us.
Yeah, absolutely. All right. So we are back with an on topic discussion that some one of our listeners had actually asked us to talk about. But before we even go there, one of the things that we try to do at the beginning of every episode is to give a definition to what Post Secondary Transition is. Megan, can you help us out with that?
Right, and there's so many transitions throughout the school years. So post secondary, focuses mostly between ages 14 to 21. And is really trying to answer the question, what do you want for your child to do after they leave school? We're looking to help answer that question. And along with a lot of people that you work with, by asking you the parent to think long term, what kind of milestones research resources, what are your goals for your child?
And how do we define long term? What, what do you want your child to be doing after the school bus stops coming, Which, admittedly, is different for everybody. It's a completely individualized experience. And along with that individuality can come from loneliness, some cases, maybe even a little bit of isolation, because it's, it's like I this is exclusive to me. But there are other families who are going through this and probably at the same time, you are.
Right, and just to give a shout out to one of those families, Colette Jackson, one of my former parents, was one of our first listeners and viewers of our websites, we want to thank her for her feedback as we go along this journey. And along your journey, as a parent, you focus on a lot of the milestones. And some of those milestones are built around timeframes and other cases, those timeframes are helping to determine them. What some milestones you need to
talk about. So using your child's school experience, to help with the research, using the resources at your disposal, including that school transition coordinator or specialists, you might hear both terms, along with their teachers, there's a lot of information, there's a lot to consider. And in many cases, those answers won't immediately present to you.
There's going to be some give and take, there'll be things that you'll do that you don't have that desired outcome, unfortunately, and trying to do all that at once can feel consuming. So we're hoping hoping to help clear away some of that fog for you all.
¶ Defining- Transition Coordinator
Yeah, and in part part of clearing some of the way that fog is to help like, again, with definitions, defining things. So one of the things that we wanted to talk about was in the post secondary transition process, there is someone who is going to help you along the way. And that's going to be your transition coordinator. In fact, Megan is the transition coordinator at her two schools. So, Megan, how how would you define transition
coordinator? Or in other words, like, what does it mean to be a transition coordinator.
And I will say you'll hear it many terms transition coordinator, transition teacher transition specialist, but at all is talking about the same person, that transition coordinator is a resource basically, for that post secondary transition. We're here to help provide that information for you on the post secondary milestones kind of like we're just talking about. We're here to guide you through that transition timeline so that you know what to expect as you
get to 21. And what will be to come after 21 dependent on what you envision for your child. We're here to collaborate with the school team and the parents to best prepare you as you know, weekend for that journey. So there's a lot that goes into it. But the biggest thing is to know we are that one constant with transition to help you navigate from the school side.
¶ Collaboration
Well, and there was a whole lot there one of the terms, one of the terms that you threw out there was collaboration. Now, I will say that as a special education teacher, that's my role. So Megan is a transition coordinator, I'm the special education teacher, who does a transition coordinator collaborate with as it relates to the special education team?
Oh, there's a lot of players. From my standpoint, with the schools that I'm at. I collaborate with everyone, the case manager, the related service providers, which can be the speech pathologist, the occupational therapist, physical therapist, the psychologist, parents, that's a huge piece. Anyone who plays a part in this child's day to prepare for post secondary worlds, there's no one that I don't collaborate with, to be honest.
And then does does that does a level of collaboration change per child?
Absolutely. Because of the one school I met specifically, I have a lot more collaboration for the students who are on that certificate track. Those who are on the diploma track collaboration still happens, but it might be with a smaller team, because they have less players. So the case manager, the guidance counselor, the agenda teachers when needed, and there are, you know, other circumstances to depending on what program they're in.
¶ Certificate vs Diploma Track
And one of the things that I want to throw out there for some people who may not know is that when we discuss students who were on a certificate track versus a diploma track, so obviously, the diploma track the students, by the time they are done with their schooling, they are going to have a diploma in hand, the certificate track is different though those are the students who are not seeking a high school diploma, they will receive a certificate when they
are finished. But they usually will go also in their journey in the school system, they will be there for longer, typically 21 That is something that you'll probably hear us talk about a lot now.
¶ Transition in the IEP
Playing off of that, or segwaying into that, how does transition factor into the actual IEP itself? Like what information can parents look for in the IEP as it relates to transition, and if I remember correctly, didn't that change recently?
Yeah, I was gonna say this is the perfect time to discuss that because transition is now becoming a bigger focus. And that's across the state of Maryland MSDE is coming out and saying, We really need to put that focus for transition for all students diploma and certificate. So there's going to be changes coming to the IEP, which embeds transition throughout all throughout at all. So you might see, for example, transition is now on a different page of the
IEP. And it'll be on a bunch of different pages to it's going to flow throughout and align with things like the goals and objectives. And will include continue to include the student interests and the parent input, along with the transition inventory, which the transition coordinator does each year with the students just to gather that information to update what their vision is for after exit.
And my understanding, because we recently just had a meeting about this. And one of the things that they had talked about was is that there's going to be more specific language like you were saying, like, you are recording that data, and it's going into the IEP, but then, as I was listening to it, they were like, no, no, this is this is it's gonna be very specific about what goes in there. And...
It's gonna require a lot more collaboration, I think, which is not a bad thing, because we want everyone to be on the same page for this child as they get ready to leave.
So that is something to look forward to. And I know that some of the teachers were, as we were getting this new information, we're all kind of looking around at each other going okay, but I will tell you that there are others who were like literally shaking their head going, Yes, like, Thank you like, it's about time that I finally got there, because especially now again, I am a middle school teacher. So there may not necessarily be as much of a focus on transition.
However, once the student turns 14, which is usually in middle school, again, there's going to be a renewed emphasis on that. And as soon as it came up, I was like, oh, yeah, this is like, we're talking about this, like I got all excited about it was really silly. And like, again, my coworkers are all looking around me like, dude, you're a nerd.
Glad somebody's excited.
Right. It is definitely something that I plan to go back and look more into. Because just in that meeting alone, there really was a lot, a lot of new information, and it was I gotta go back and really kind of understand that part.
And I think it does change that mindset too. Because, you know, now you're trying to figure out okay, well, how do I embed this for Johnny's goals? You know, Johnny says he wants to be an engineer. Okay, so what can I include to related to transition to piggyback on that, to make sure he's meeting that goal or, you know, striving to get there. How can I best
help him? I think when it comes to the students that certificate, in my mind, maybe it's just because what school schools I work at, I find it a lot easier, because I can naturally just talk to those related service providers to get an idea of okay, what do we want them to be working for? When they leave at 21? How can we best help the family and the child to prepare for, you know, adult service providers? What can we do now to help get ready for that?
¶ CRD vs Transition Coordinator
During my research, I came across an acronym that I was unfamiliar with, and I was hoping that you could help me out with it Career Research Development. What is that? And how are those teachers different from a transition coordinator? Or is there a difference?
Absolutely. So their career research and development is a class that students can take in high school, and the CRD teachers are the teachers who oversee it. It's actually one of the graduation pathways for CTE. Because in high school student has to have a pathway, whether it be two years of oral language or the CTE pathway. So this is a
class that they can take. And it's a great opportunity when I talk to students, and we do our transition interview for those who really are not certain what they want to do after school and they have an idea. But they're, they want to know more information about a career, it's a good opportunity for them to explore those career interests and do some goal setting within this class. A CRD can be a two year class. So the first class is a lot of career exploration.
They work on writing their resumes, they do a little financial literacy, a lot of like functional things. And then the second year they continue the class. But there's also a component of site based work experience, which is when the student is expected to secure employment outside of the school during the school day, typically. But there's a lot of flexibility in that. And they have to work a certain number of hours each for the year in order to meet the requirements for the class.
Now, just out of curiosity, as I'm hearing you explain all of this now, to be specific, is this going to be for like what we had talked about before? Is this going to be for diploma Bound students? Is this going to be for certificate students? Is it both
for the graduation pathway Completer part it that is for the diploma Bound students. However, we have had students on the certificate track who take CRD it's a great opportunity for them. And they obviously have different requirements in terms of graduation, but there's no excluding them from doing the CRD class. In terms of the site experience, site based work
experience. I know in another another podcast, we are intending on talking about some of the work programs and that might be more beneficial for the students with our Career Community Exploration Program, or CCE.
¶ Keeping up
How does a transition coordinator track all that information about their students?
It's a lot of tracking. It's a lot of organization and a lot of time management? Yeah, there is you have to keep track of agency referrals. If a student is working with DORS, the Division of Rehabilitative Services or DDA, Developmental Disabilities Administration. You have to keep track of where they are with them, any coordinators they may be connected with. Because as they get closer to exit, we help coordinate the documentation to send to them for their exit and
invite them to IEP meetings. We have to track transition activities on the IEP and take notes on the progress made, which you know, now that they're going to be embedded with goals. That'll be a whole nother level of coordinating with people at school. We have to keep track of the annual IEP s to make sure that the transition interviews are completed ahead of that and attend annual IEP is for certain
students. And also just knowing the interests that each student has so that you can send that pertinent information information on course registration for students. So, for example, if the student is interested in construction, I want to make sure I get the information out to them about the construction Academy at the ARL or an apprenticeship if that's something they could be
interested in. So it takes a lot of management when you are split between schools like I am, it might take a little more management because I have to make sure I'm aware of what's going on when I'm not in building. And I know each transition coordinator has a large number on their caseload. I mean it varies per school but for my For me for example, I have about 140 150 kids to keep track of. So a lot goes into it.
¶ Coordinators DORS/DDA
And so along those lines, because something that you said earlier sparked a question that I was thinking about. So like you had talked about, like, keeping track of the coordinators, like through DORS or DDA that the students are working with? Do? Can those coordinators changed throughout the process? Or do what what if families get a coordinator from a certain from a certain place that they, they're going to stick with that person? Like, what can they expect? question?
Good question for DORS. Typically, we have one DORS counselor per school, well, DORS counselor has numerous schools, but like for my one school, I have the same DORS counselor, they do change occasionally. So just checking in with them to help with making sure you know, the parents are following through with things or if anyone needs any reminders, anything there for DDA, there is there can be a huge turnover.
And that's what I tell parents, if they are assigned a DDA coordinator, you know, maybe it's 16 or 17, that most likely will not be the same coordinator when they exited 21. Not in all cases, but just in the past few years, we've, I know, parents who have had numerous different coordinators. And it gets tricky when they're getting to 21. And if they get a new coordinator, as they're exiting that year, I know parents get very nervous.
So as the transition coordinator, you know, my role in that is to make sure I keep the parents and the DDA coordinator all informed and give them all the documents and make sure everyone's on the same page. So like I said before, it's kind of like being that constant in the whole grand scheme of things.
Again, sounds like you're juggling a lot of information all at the same time.
Yeah, there's a lot of juggling. And some days, it can get a little tricky, because, you know, there's A, B and C that need to be done. But then E, F and G sneak up on you. So I do like that every day is different, you know, you just roll with it.
¶ Do students need a resume?
Segwaying into something that is a little bit more specific, again, as I've listened to you talk about, you know, like jobs and what students are looking for, and some of the programs that may, you know, are going to be out there for our students. This may be a terrible question, but I figured I'd throw it out there anyway. Do students going through the transition process need a resume? And why?
Good question. Absolutely. So thinking about those students on the diploma track, they if they were to take CRD resumes are developed in that class, and they have an opportunity called Passport to the Future during that CRD one class where they will go and use that resume and do some practice interviews for a day. But uh, for all juniors on the diploma track, they do complete resumes in English 11. For the World of Work component, which is another graduation requirement. Or
certificate track. I've had certificate students who have participated in the English 11 class and completed them there as well. But our certificate students also work on them while they're in that Career Community Experience in their class. And I know we'll talk we plan to discuss that in more another
podcast. But just to kind of touch on it, we help them develop their resume is while in CCE because if a student was to move to work study, it really can come in handy, you know, while they go for the interview process and presenting that employer with their experiences on their resume when they leave or exit the school system. Along
with the resume. We've also been working on digital portfolios for our students involved in work programs, their CCE and that is something that has just developed over the last few years. But the idea is this digital portfolio will include a lot more information about the student and their work experiences and the student plays a part in completing it. So they can add in their interests in input as well.
¶ Digital Portfolios
Digital portfolio so of course, you know that I'm going to zoom in on that one.
I saw. I saw your face.
So, like what I have so many questions rolling around in my head right now.
That one needs a whole nother podcast. Okay.
All right. Just to satisfy my curiosity, get what is basic information that we're going to find on a digital portfolio?
Okay, so basic digital portfolio. It has a lot of parts, but it's it is individualized for the student. So it includes like their basic information, their interests, what clubs they might have been part of at tivities they've done
at school. But most importantly, what they've been working on in CCE, they will record all the work sites, what kind of jobs or responsibilities they've had, we can include pictures of them while at the worksite, to show you know, firsthand, and a lot of times, that's a great talking point. Because, you know, you ask the student, what did you like doing at the job? And they might not be able to tell you but show them a picture. And that might just get the ball
rolling. Yeah, it's a great tool to help, you know, as they exit show what they've been working on all these years.
Very cool. I had no idea. So yeah, I'm excited to learn more about that. So that'll definitely be a topic.
Yes, we will, we will definitely discuss that more in length. And it would be great to have some feedback or questions from parents, too, that, you know, have heard about it and want to know what what does this mean?
¶ Best part of being a Transition Coordinator
I figure the best way to end this off, as far as I'm concerned, a burning question, in my mind is what is the best part about being a transition coordinator?
Well, it's funny, because after I went through my master's program, and learned about secondary transition, it really became just, and I think I talked about this in our initial podcasts, it was really like just the focus, that's where I wanted to be, I think just being able to help so many families, and trying to just make such an overwhelming, daunting task of the transition a little easier for them, you know, I can't do everything for the parents, you know, when they
leave at 21, it's going to be on the parent. And it's hard, because they've had so much help before that. So I really want to work with them, to get them comfortable when they leave at 21 that they feel like they've got this you know, it might not be, you know, black and white, it's going to be a little messy, but at least you feel like you know the information, because we've talked about it and you feel a little more confident
with what's ahead of you. I just want the parents to know that they have a constant to help them through all this. And I'm, if I don't know the answer to something, I am happy to go and help research and explore with you because I love building up that, you know, resource bag that I have with all that stuff.
¶ Resource: P2Transition website
As far as I'm concerned, that's a perfect segue into the resource that we've put together, which is www.postsecondarytransition.com It is a website that we are continuing to build add on to we've had some nice feedback over the last couple of weeks about it. So again, we are continuing to work on it. But again, yeah, I agree with like resource, you know, resources. That's what, that's what we're
about sharing. Uh, one of the things that I wanted to do before we take off is you got to name drop somebody that was helpful for you, and I'm going to name drop somebody that was helpful for me, I'm going to give a shout out to Lee Wilkinson, a friend of mine who I reached out through to Facebook, and I asked him to listen to I think like what one of the first episodes that we did, yeah. And he, he gave me some really valuable notes. I
put them in a checklist. I just wanted to throw it out there. Thank you. Thank you, thank you. But in general like and follow our podcast, if you know families if you know, there's someone that you think you know, that could benefit from the information that we're trying to share. Please let them know about us and feedback. You can send us feedback through our website, you can send feedback through our Facebook page. You can send us feedback on Twitter, we feed back we're good with it
so well. All right. I think we nailed it. Our goal for our next episode, we are going to do a nother interview with a family or in this case a parent and this is another one that we're really looking forward to. So please like and follow and come back and we are done with Megan.
Sounds good. Hope to see you again.
All right, bye bye.