Join us on the Poetic Odyssey, a celebration of voices, cultures, and the power of words. I'm Amanda Ecking. Welcome to the poet Speaks, where every syllable ignites inspiration for get, involve with what stories are on these tracks?
This idea of the Bronx. Now, boogie down Bronx.
That's what people say, right, Don't become someone's subway story.
Medicate me with a lick of the like, I am not afraid to love you.
All of us have a story.
Microphone magnifying.
No one want to listen, So I think that's what made.
Me in writing the writing disco.
You ready amazing poetry always.
Hello everyone, and welcome back to the poet Speaks podcast. Now our next guest is an award winning spoken word poet, artist, educator, and motivational speaker performing in locations such as New Zealand, Mexico, Canada, in thirty six states around the country. Known for his dark Side Towards fromont his first ever poetry chat book, and his Crown Jeweled Deficiency A Tale from My dark Side album, Root and Transparency, as well as healing.
Also the founder and CEO of Called to Move CTM.
And Artistry organization with the pursuit of aiding youth and self actualizing and personally developing.
Through the art of poetry.
Oh and yes, he's also the season fifteen winner of America's Got Talent.
Everybody, Welcome to the Poet.
Speaks podcast, Brandon Leak, Brandon, how are you today?
Ah?
Very well, thank you for the invites. Very happy to be here, very happy to be here.
Absolutely absolutely When you even just now, when you hear someone reading your bio, do you still blush? Do you still you get a little goose mumpy believing all the things that you've been able to do.
Not really fam I'll be honest, I hate my bio. That's just but that's just like a personal thing.
I just hate.
Like I'm trying to get better at being okay with hearing my accolades and like being able to enjoy the.
Hard work I put in.
I'm a real futurist at heart, and so I constantly am just looking forward, very rarely looking back at the things I've already done. Yeah.
No's that's something so futurists. So you look forward, you never look back or stay in the present. Is that what you mean by that?
Yeah, I'm trying. God's really working on you with that though. God's like ao soun like, I gave you a testimony, so you got to you gotta use it. So I'm trying to take a bit more care of that these days. Still a work in progress, for sure.
For sure, let's kind of go back, go back a bit.
You know a lot of people, you know, they know you for your accolades, but you know, tell us a bit about where did you grow up and kind of tell us how your childhood affected your journey to become the writer, the poet that you are today.
So where did you grow up? Were you born and bred anywhere? Tell us?
Yeah, so I'm a Cali kid Worner raised in Stockton, California. That's actually where I still reside now. And yeah, like
writing was never my first love. I enjoyed drawing and like making comic books as a kid because I used to go to the Maya Angelou Library, which is, you know, real poetic considering what I do for a living now, But I used to go to the Maya Angelou Library just up the street from my house, and I would go get these Dragon ball Z manga comics and I would like trace them with trace paper and then add my own words to their speech bubbles. But before that,
it was it was just basketball. Like basketball was the passion, Basketball was the drive. Basketball was the whole dream all the way through my first two years of college. So like, I played basketball for about like sixteen years since I was four, and so that was the whole Like, hey, like, what do you want to be when you grow up? Kobe Bryant? Like that was that was the answer, full and complete.
That's kind of crazy. I mean, so you were you were a baller growing up. That was really the dream. How did you then shift? Because I'm Cali native myself, I'm from Sacramento, I can say Northern California is definitely a place I had. I had dreams of sports, whether it be track, basketball, of course, But I wonder, how then did you make this shift to becoming a writer, becoming a poet spoken word poetry, especially performing.
I wrote poems in like middle school and high school for girls who I thought were cute. But like in my freshman year of college, my best friend, Bernard Daniels, he died due to some gang violence that was happening in the city. He had actually drowned in a levee down the street from where we grew up. And I used to just take them all on my pain out on the court. It used to just be like my one place of solitude. If I was calling through something,
I could just let it all out there. This is one of those pains where releasing it on the court didn't do nothing for me, didn't help me in any way, didn't free me anyway.
And I really prayed.
And I was like, hey, God, like, like Jesus, what are you wanting me to do with this?
Like?
What are you asking me to do with this pain? I saw a sign for an open mic and it was the first time that I had seen and open mic functioning at my school, and I was like, man, maybe that's it. Maybe I write about it. And so I wrote a poem, went and shared it. And that was kind of like the first experience that gave me any inclination that poetry could be like the vessel for me, that it could be a place where me and God could meet for the sake of the healing that I needed to do.
So yeah, I would say that that was like probably like.
The capstone marker change for me artistically.
Yeah, and you know, I'm curious, you know, being familiar to someone that grew up in northern California, stock then you know it has such variables in terms of the gang violence, safety that's all around that city. How much of your life was affected, Like you said, you know, you had a friend that you know, may they're so rest in peace that passed away due.
To that violence. How much of your.
Life and your youth was affected by that, by those outer influences of violence and maybe just the community.
That you were of Stockton.
Yeah, I think it's actually highly overstated how violent Stockton is, just because it's not like when I think of any city, like if you go to the wrong neighborhood, then you have the unfortunate opportunity to be met with violence or you know, gangs or drugs or whatever. Like I know Sacramento is being gentrified as we speak, but like there was a period of time where being in oak Park was you know past a certain time would resulting you not being the most safe individual, you know what I mean.
We know what happens in places like Oakland right now you go to certain parts of us, So like it's I think it's overstated, but.
Like, I would say I was fairly shielded.
Interestingly enough, I was at a Bible study yesterday and one of the people was like, man.
Like, like God has really graced.
Your life, Like as I hear your story, like God is really like put a head around you. And I'm like, man like, as I reflect on it, God really has. I didn't go to the public school in my neighborhood. My mom tested me for a magnet school that I was able to go to that you know, was probably about like four or five miles away from my neighborhood, closer to the downtown area, where I got like a
really high quality education. I grew up in a Baptist amme churt where like I had a church family everywhere select no matter where I went, I always had somebody who either had an eye out on me or for me. So yeah, I would say I was fortunate in a lot of ways to avoid the pitfalls of what normally comes especially a lot to a lot of young black men.
Like I've been immensely blessed in that regard. So I would say it's it's impacted me on on the outer scale of like seeing things and witnessing them and like being impacted by people who've been directly hit by them. Like I attended eighteen funerals by eighteen, Right, many of them were like family who were like elderly and older, but like I would say a solid seven to eight of them were people either my age, slightly younger.
Or just slightly older.
And so like that does impact you, you know, like death does touch me differently because I've had so many engagements with it. I would say, God really really blessed me to not have to endure as much as that.
Yeah, my goodness, eighteen funerals by the time you're eighteen is wild. I mean, that is really definitely life changing, and we really appreciate you for sharing that. So tell me a little bit about now, you know, you went from a former athlete to becoming a writer. Tell us about how that kind of evolved for you to now becoming the career that you've had. I mean, tell us about how that trajectory kind of slowly or maybe it
happened fast for you. How did that trajectory happen to now this became a professional life's work.
Yeah, I mean, like I was an English major in college for my first year and a half and What ended up happening was I had a teacher who talked like the viazine man. For all the young folk who are watching this, they have no idea what I'm talking about. But he had a very monotone, boring voice. It was
really really not fun to listen to. I remember falling asleep in this class for like the third time in the same day and just thinking to myself like, oh, yeah, like, I can't I can't stay here, Like I can't stay in this classity board. I am going to lose my mind if I stay here any longer. I went and switched to become a psychology major that same day. I already had enough courses to qualify for an English minor, so I was like, hey, I got my minor. I'm
going to be a psych major. I'm going to become a psychologist, or I'm going to become like a psychiatrist, or I get the chance to like work with people who need mental help. And I quickly realized that that type of one on one relationship where it's only like one person talking, would leave me really drained. And I'm like, oh, I won't be helpy doing this, so let's not do that either. So I'm like, God, what do you want
me to do? And it's around this same time that poetry starts taking a more prevalent place in my life.
I made a poet by the name of Michael Bourney from.
Long Beach, and I'm like, oh, man, like I want to do that, like I want to be a professional artist. And I over spiritualize it, like super deeply. I'm like, yo, God's calling me to be an artist. And then the poet who I looked up to, Micah, He's like, hey, whoa whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa whoa before you put a whole lot on it, do you like it? And I'm like yes. He was like, do you do you hear God telling you no, Mike No, He's like, is it unbiblical?
I'm like no, He's like, and just go for it.
Operate in freedom until you get told otherwise. And so like that happens sophomore year, and from that point on, I was getting my degree because I knew I was going to have to have a regular job at some point. But I had been just like slowly and surely making my way into the idea of like, hey, art is going to be a very big part of my life, I'm going to be doing this. And what ended up happening was after graduating college, I had a whole slew
of issues occur. We can talk about that another time or in another question, but I was a divine intervention brought me back home. I worked a job as a paraprofessional at a school with a student who had a mental disability, and then I got a job working at the county for a group called Black Health.
And all the while while I was doing this, I was running.
From my city in Stockton up to Sacramento, where you're from like three to four days a week, performing at places like Mahogany, places like Shine Cafe, places like brick House, places like Luna's Cafe, random open mics that would just kind of pop up here and there, and I was just like, Oh, this is it, Like this is what I'm going to do. This is like I'm going to
chase after this. And then I ended up joining the Sacramento Slam team and performing alongside them in the year twenty fifteen, which was really eye opening experience at not just like the quality of poetry, but the dedication required to be able to make that type of quality poetry and all the while I was still working these jobs, got fired from a couple of them because I was doing way too much poetry stuff and you know, took
my ls, learned how to make those under dubs. Yeah, it wasn't until twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen that I really took the plunge to become a full time poet. Traveling touring for my album Deficiencies. I did one hundred and fifty shows over the course of ten months, went to, as you mentioned, like three or four different countries, thirty six states, and that number has just grown over time. Yeah, So that's that's kind of been the trajectory and the road that we've taken to get here so far.
No, that's you know, that is when you really kind of put that into perspective. That is wild, the amount of footwork and the amount of hustle that you've really put in there, especially within that ten months over one hundred shows that you've done. So that's quite a testament to the passion and dedication. Tell us a bit about I do kind of want to hit a point yours.
You seem very rooted in your religion and your spirituality and your religious religionosity, tell us a bit about if you feel comfortable obviously, tell us a bit about how much of that guiding force has been kind of trajecting your career in terms of we'll get into it later,
but you know the industry. Tell us how much of that guiding force of your spirituality and your relationship with a higher power, because you know you've mentioned it several times, how much does that influence so much of where you've taken your life stack?
Yeah, I mean it's a it's the life source behind it all. You know, it's the guiding force behind the decisions I make. I could likely be very much farther in my career if I was willing to sacrifice a lot of the morals, values, and principles by which I hold most ferment deer in my life. But you know, you got a question like, hey, at what cost do you want to go up just for them to tear
you back down? Because that's how society functions, right, Like we build heroes and then make them villains the moment that we feel like they got too high, you know what I mean. Like we see it all the time in sports, you know, like we build up these people like a person like Patrick Mahomes. Everybody loved him on the rise. Everybody was like super happy to see him win the first and the second. But then it's like, oh, you're winning too much now, like let somebody else get there.
Type of a thing.
You see it with celebrity all the time, like with musicians who we prop up and be like oh.
Yo, like look at them, look at all this stuff that's happening.
Then they have their fall from grace and everybody it's like, yeah, they deserved it, and some of it rightfully so, without a question. But no, like my faith informs the art that I make, It informs the decisions I make, It informs the people who I associate with and the things
that I would like to do moving forward. And I can't say I've always made that my priority, because there most certainly been seasons, especially shortly after winning the show, where I allowed my ambition to be my guide versus the guiding principles that I have. Yeah, that was not a good season of life. That was not a good season of life.
Well, first off, I want to hit a point that you just said I think is huge there.
You said I could be much.
Higher if I was if I didn't let kind of my greater core of spirituality.
Lead my life.
I think that's such a big thing to admit. A lot of people wouldn't say that. A lot of people would not admit I could be so much farther in my career, you know, or whatever a career looks like to you, that looks so different for each person. A lot of people just wouldn't admit my success could be maybe more fun, whatever it is, financially, whatever it is. If I would to kind of let go of some of those principles.
What did it take? And I think a lot of people don't admit it because it takes a lot to admit what that means.
What did it take for you to kind of really get to that point where you can only admit that but also still have that integrity and be proud that, hey, I'm still happy where I'm at.
Yeah, humility is part of the call, right, and not just humility and like oh yeah, like I'm humble, I do these things, but humility and the fact that like, oh yeah, like I'm not the MC for all who don't know what that means?
Like main character. And I think in the West, we.
Have a lot of people who deal with like main character syndrome, who feel like the world revolves around them everything needs to be about them. You'll see it in the way people think or talk, Like I know in my own inner head. I've had to really work on this voice where I hear where I think that people are constantly looking at me, perceiving what I'm doing, perceiving what I like, what I'm wearing, or all these other things, and by humbling myself from that stature to being like, oh, yeah,
like I am just continuing. I am just another part of this ongoing story that's already happening, and everybody else is just as busy and involved in not thinking about me as I am about them. It really helped me be able to not care about the status because I think most people don't share it because they're afraid of what that would do to the status that they feel. People think of the ass they think about their highest point and they're like, oh, people still look at me there,
and it's like, Oh, who cares? Who cares what they say? Who cares how they feel? Who cares what they see? At the end of the day, are you Are you proud of the decisions you've made. Are you proud of the life you've built? In my worst season where I was like so hell bent on trying to prove something, my mentor he was like Brandon considered is people who win shows like these are usually bankrupt within two years after winning the show. People who win the lottery are
usually bankrupt within two years. And you have built a lasting career that is still ongoing with still more story to tell. How awesome is that?
Yeah?
When all you see are the things that have gone wrong, you are ignoring all the things that have been built up right for you. So yeah, I think that answers the question.
Sorry, no, you're good for sure.
Well, you know, Brandon, let's get into it. You know, we've already made hints to it. You know, winning America's Got Talent obviously, you know that was such a huge achievement.
What was it?
You were the first person as a spoken word poet artist to win a show. When that talent show tell us about how that experience changed your life, you know, both good, both bad and what are still those ripple effects that you have, maybe whether it be career wise but also mentally emotionally.
Was as we've kind of hinted that a little bit too.
Yeah, tell us the process. What was the process to even audition? Most people? I don't even know how does someone even get that in their viewpoint to even get into TV like that to audition for a show.
So I actually auditioned back in twenty seventeen. Originally, my homegirl, Courtney was like, Hey, Agt's coming to San Jose.
They never go to the Bay Area. This is our time. We need to go.
And I'm like, hey, you said no but a word. So I went and picked her up, but she wasn't there, she wasn't at her house. I was super mad at her. She was like, I'm too afraid. I can't go, like, just just go without me. And I'm like, Bam, you're the one who gave me the idea. I don't want to go do this whole thing solo, but I go do it. And this is the moment where I realized that like I loved poetry, I just did not respect poetry. And the reason why I learned that was they clearly
gave me rules. They told me that you have ninety seconds to be able to share a whatever work of art that you're going to be sharing in this ninety seconds. You're not going to get any more time, and you're not going to get any less time, right. I showed up prideful, like, man, I have this really good three minute poem. It kills every time I go perform it. Everybody loves it, so they're gonna love it and then they're gonna let me finish it. And that's how I
know I'll make the show. And what I learned was if you don't prepare for the call that you've been given, you can miss it. Because they for sure stopped me, they for sure stopped be it, told me, hey, yeah, thank you, You're all good, and then I had to make my way back and go sit down with the rest of the acts who were waiting for an opportunity to get on the show. And I realized in that moment, I'm like, oh, I didn't make it. I didn't get the call to go do that this time. And it
really sat with me that I had messed up. And that's actually what sparked my tour in twenty eighteen for deficiencies to be able to like dedicate myself to the craft, to learn it, to be able to like practice and prepare for the moment. And then twenty nineteen rolls around and my wife is pregnant, and I'm like.
Oh, I got to go back to a regular.
Job because this doesn't come with health insurance. And so I go work the regular job, go back to being a full time teacher, and then AGT pops back up on my Facebook feed and I'm like, you know what, I'm gonna try it, Like, let's use this as a litmus test, because I was already going to a poetry competition called Eyewhips, and I was like, Hey, I'm going to use this to test and see how much better I've gotten, and we'll see how I do. So I'll
use AGT as a similar thing. So I go try out, but this time I have a poem that I've worked on for two months. I had taken it to fifteen or twenty different open mics. I had edited it, reworked it, worked on the performance of it, and I was ready, and I showed up to Los Angeles at this random casino in the middle of the desert. I remember I was the tenth act to perform in my group of ten, and I looked not only at the acts who were performing, but the person who was judging us, and I said,
he's checking out after ten seconds. After ten seconds, if they're not gathering his attention, he's gone. So I'm like, I only got ten seconds to catch him, so let's make sure we catch the poem. I did capture his attention in those ten seconds, and from there it's all history.
Absolutely absolutely. I love what you said there.
You said sometimes you know, when you're not ready for your call, you can miss the opportunity.
Of your life. And that is very, very.
True, and that's very factual, and it's a great thing. You know that second call and you were able to catch it.
So take us through that.
Now, Okay, you go through the ranks of America's got talent. Obviously it's a couple a couple of rounds. Here you do and you're now you're at your final. I mean you, I believe they do the gold buzzer. Right, You passed through all that and now you get to the final.
That final night. Tell us what's your stomach like, what's your mental health?
Like?
Most people can't even process something like that. That night you win? What is that hole leading up to everything?
What was that feeling like to find out you became the winner.
Man, I'll give you kind of like the brief run through of it all.
So like the day that I get my golden buzzer is the day that California shuts down due.
To COVID.
Wow no way wow wow.
So like they had called me because I was working and I was supposed to I was supposed to come down on a Monday, and I'd already gotten the day off of work and out They're like, hey, if you're not here tomorrow by eight am, then you can't perform. So I my wife just had our first child thirteen days before.
So I was like, hey, babe, if you say.
No, I completely understand, like you are still recouping from like giving birth. But my mother in law came down, took care of my wife, and I went down. So I get my golden buzzer that day, and I'm like, oh my god, like what am I going to do? I get my call to come back, so that way I can go back down to LA but my family can't come because I have to be quarantined in a hotel for the next four months to be a part of the show for as long as I'm on the show.
The next poem I do is a poem called Pooky. And the way that like my poems were.
Selected for the show was I had to like send the poem ahead of time, or send them two poems ahead of time, and then they selected which one they wanted. And so I sent them a poem about my wife and I sent them Pooky. And I was like, Hey, they're going to pick the poem about my wife because Pooky's a little edgy, not really, but like for national television, I don't know how they'll do. And when they picked Pooky, I'm like, oh, I'm gonna get eliminated.
Dog.
Like we already got all the Black Lives Matter protests going on. The main people who watch this show are middle of americle, white folks that is not going to like this com right, And so I'm like damn. But then I make it to the next round. I'm like, oh, snap, let's go, and then I have my worst mental breakdown
of the entire show during this portion. My daughter's like six months old at this point, yeah, and I haven't been home in a couple months because I've been here at the show, quarantine in the hotel and everything.
And I'm like, man, what is going on?
Like I want to go home, and they tell me I can't go home, even when they promised that I would be able to. And I'm in the middle of an interview and I'm like, yo, I'm really done with this, and I just take off all my stuff and they try to get me to stay, and I just walk up to my room and I kind of just I shed my tears, send up my prayer, and I fall asleep.
And then I don't know how long I was out, but then I hear the banging on my door and it's my producer, who's technically not allowed in the hotel, but he was there, and he's like, Brandon, I talked to the team. If you drive, you can go home, but you can only go straight home and straight back. You can't go see anybody else. You can't go to grocery stores, you can't stop for food, you can't do anything. And I'm like, no, it's three days ago is when I needed to go home. I'm locked in to get
this performance done now. So no, like, if I make it to the next round, I'm going home for a week and then I will be back a week before I need to be on stage.
And so that was the agreement, and then that's when I did my.
Poem Letters to my Father, which was super nerve wracking because that poem was originally six and a half minutes and then I had to condense it down to three and a half minutes. So the hardest part was not reverting back to the old version of the poems. I rocked that poem out. The next day they announced the winners and who's going to the final They announced my name.
I walk off stage.
I walked clear past the like the interview part portion where they're trying to, like, you know, get to like talk with the media. I just point to my producer and he's like, oh, yeah, no, no, no, he doesn't have media.
He's good.
And I walk straight to my rental car and go home. And then I do my final poem for my daughter. And then the day that they're announcing the winner, I didn't think I won. I did not think I want because I remember the producers being like, are you sure you want to do a poem for your daughter as your last piece. I'm like yeah, I mean, like, I just did a poem about being a fatherless child. What better way than to show that the fatherless kid became
the better father. I was like, yo, I'll be top five, but I'm not gonna win. And so I'm like thinking about all these things in my head, kind of plotting it out. And then when i make it to top three, I'm like, okay, Christina raised next to me and Broken Roots are next to me. I know Broken Roots did not win, but Christina Rays she was killer, so she
probably picked up the win. And then when they knocked Christina Ray off at third, I'm like, I just want I just won this show, and like you'll see it on my face while I go like, that's me realize what just happened. When they announced my name, I just dropped to my knees. The confetti rains.
Yeah it was. It was amazing.
Yeah yeah.
My goodness though, oh my gosh, that journey to get there, that is that is a lot. I mean, the birth of a child, you know, shout outs to your wife, that is no joke, My goodness to get there, the kind of toll and stress of that, you know, so honoring that is so key. So now okay, so you win, that is that is huge? Tell us again, what was the kind of winner? What does that package now look like? You know, especially you wake up the next day after you win something as big as that.
You're You're on GMA, You're on all the morning talk shows. You know, isn't it you? Really?
You win like a show in Vegas, you win money? Obviously, what is that next day, the day after, after that huge dopamine that's just been put on you, But it's also that huge kind of release of energy from what you had to do to finally get there.
What is thou when you wake up the next day? What does that look like?
Well? No interviews actually, at least in terms of in person simply because it was still COVID, so like nothing like that was happening. That I had probably about like wenty phone to zoom interviews, like just back to back to back to back, you know, signing paperword, clearing myself out of the hotel because one thing that they for sure did was get us out that hotel by noon the next day.
Wow, So we d am They like, hey, dog, we appreciate you. Head on home.
We've been paying for this hotel and your food for the last three and a half four months. You're gonna have to get up out of here. And so but my family was there with me. We kind of illegally snuck them in, which was fun, but no, it was it was like for me, the biggest part was just saying goodbye to all of my fellow acts, who I
built like real friendships with. It a point because we had been going through this really unique experience of being trapped in a hotel together when we were the only ones in the hotel, and week after week it becomes less and less people. Yeah, that was kind of the weirdest part. It was like being in college again. But you know that, like come next week, twelve, we y'all aren't going to be here next week.
Yeah, so you okay, So now we're at that stage.
So you you've won it.
It's a billion in one interviews. Obviously we're still in the pandemic. Tell us now, kind of what has been the kind of after you achieve something like that, winning America's Got Talent, What now what happens to you then? How was your career Did you see like an immediate.
Just overnight trajectory upwards?
What was that like in terms of your career now that long lasting effects? How did that experience of winning truly change your life?
Well, even before Ringing.
Things change fairly dramatically off the strength that like had way more opportunities, so that that would probably be the most significant change is just visibility and people being willing to accept like, oh, yeah, like he's really good, because it's like you, what's fort did you play?
Right?
So you and I both played basketball, You and I understand what that is. And so like when somebody tell you like, oh yeah, Daul like they nice, you'd be like, yeah, they might be.
I gotta see it though. I got to see that they're good.
And then when you see that they're good, now it's like, oh, respect Like I feel it.
I feel like that was kind of what happened with the show.
Was like I had always been nice, but folks now are like, oh, like I can respect it because like I didn't seen it up close.
I didn't seen it for real.
And so like people in the industry, businesses and corporations, like making believers of people who you know, didn't always see poetry as a as a valuable art form then became the goal in the and the reach that we pulled off, which was beautiful. I'm still longing for the day where America's got talent le's another poet back on their stage, because lord knows it's a it's about time that another one gets a shot at it.
Sure short, No, that's such a huge point.
The idea of poetry, spoken word, the art oral traditions, that's.
Still not a valued art form. So it is that idea of being able.
To win such a huge on a huge platform like that, being able to bring that to the world, that that makes a difference, just even even in your presence. Still, you know, I kind of want to move on a bit, tell us about I mean, do you still face challenges in the industry, Like you said, spoken word poetry.
You were the first and still only person.
Especially on a public platform, to really to win a show like that. But also, you know, I think about obviously HBO had that Deaf Jam poetry. You know, we have the Posts Speaks, podcasts of Demand to Acha on Archaeology Channel. You know, we do have a lot of there's still a bit of a lacking of poetry in public spaces.
I mean, do you still face challenges in the industry.
You know, obviously you won an Emmy, did right You want to tell you you know, you've really expanded your reach with poetry. But do you still feel like there's still a challenge for you in this industry as a spoken word artist?
Oh?
Big time.
I mean the reality is you get up there and you realize, oh, the work that it took to get here is less work than it is to stay here, and way less work than it is to continue to go up. So yeah, like Hollywood, or you know, the industry as people want to call it, it has short memories.
They have short memories, you know, Like I was on the show four years ago now, and that's a lifetime ago for this industry, right, Like somebody who started a movie four years ago, people may not really remember them anymore now, simply because you're out of sight, out of mind. Not to you know, throw shade on nobody's career or nothing like that, because I actually really like this actress. But like the woman who started the diver Urgent films
went through a very similar thing. People thought that she was going to go on this like massive run, similar to Jennifer.
Lawrence after she got done with a.
Series and she took a break, and that break afterwards, momentum died down. People kind of forgot and then all of a sudden she was now doing television versus doing movies, which some people perceive as a downgrade, may have been exactly what she wanted to do instead. I couldn't tell you, but I know this. Two years of distance between your most successful film and the next project will do a lot against you unless you've built a fan base that will find you the way that like you know, like
for comparison's sake, let's use comedy. Dave Chappelle can disappear for years and then reappear and nothing happened because his fan base is built for that.
He made that.
Kevin Hart can't do that, and that's why Kevin Hart stays in the face of everybody all the time, Similark, like Drake and Kendrick Lamar. If Drake disappeared for five years, like Kendrick, people would be like what now? Would they be exciting when Drake reappeared? Sure, but there'd be some people who had been lost in the shuffle. Hendrick does not have that problem. But that's because he's built and
trained his fan base for that. So in our modern time where quick fast media is the norm, you have to learn how to be able to adjust to that.
No, yeah, you make such a good point.
Yeah. One of my heroes, heroes, favorite artists of all time is Shade.
Remember she did an interview back in the day and.
She said, and she has one of those fan bases, right, she could go away for years, people will still celebrate Shade as one of the greatest. And I remember she gave a quote one day, she said, you know, people are scared to go away.
People as artists.
They're scared to not be in everyone's face all the time. They're scared to take time off to go away to recoup and create something better. But do I understand where you're coming from a lot of the modern gust that we live in art artists. Unfortunately, you know the world we live in with money, money making, you can't go away.
You have to be there twenty four to seven.
You know, it really does take a true artist, creating from just the heart and soul to say I'm going to step away to create even better. So for you, I mean, being in the industry like this, it's very competitive, it's very highly competitive.
How much does the.
Competition versus cooperation and community building do you kind of seek out in terms of you know, your craft as a spoken word artist, do you find yourself being in more competition or creating community with your words, obviously with the work you do with the youth. How much do you see yourself now competition versus community building through poetry.
Yeah.
So I'm a highly competitive dude, and it's to my detriment at times, solely because I can unintentionally burn bridges just off the strength of like wanting to fuel my own desire to be great. I feel God really has called me in this season to like be the bridge instead of being the fire. And so, yeah, I think competition has a place because it can fuel people's capacity to be better, their drive to be better. It can give them the boost that they need to be able
to chase after excellence. But it can't come at the cost of being able to build with the people alongside. You can't come at that cost. Like, I love the people in my craft who take it seriously, who are trying to pursue excellence, who are trying to be great, and who are continuing to push our culture forward predominantly in healthy ways, not just like oh yeah, like great penmans, but like great people, because I think great people can produce the best art. But yeah, in my modern time,
I'm trying to be more community oriented. I'm I'm trying to be a better steward of the gift that I have to be able to build people upstead of saying like, oh yeah, watch how I can break you down so I can be seen as higher.
Sure sure, No, absolutely absolutely, And that's a.
Path that takes a lifetime to still understand what community and community building is.
Now.
Thank you for sharing no moving gears here a bit.
You know, you've been a poet on an international scale that you know most poets could only dream of having that type of success, so quite naturally, you've touched a lot of lives.
All throughout the globe.
Is there a story you could share, maybe even a moment where you realize the impact your words of spoken word of the word had on another human being.
There's a seventy two year old white woman in Iowa who reached out to me after my poem Pooky, and she told me, Brandon, thank you for opening my eyes because I hated Black Lives Matter. I used to you know, protest against you know, all these all this vandalism and all this all these you know, all these things I thought people were making. These police brutality stories up and then I heard your story and I realized I'm a mother of three young boys, and I would burn a
city down if something like that happened to them. Another story of a young lady in Brazil. She told me she never met her father. She didn't know the man, and he had recently reached out to her, and from my time on the show, she had always contemplated, because she had had this letter for about a year, on whether or not she should actually reach out and be
able to go meet him. And my poem about my father and I encouraged her to actually go meet the man, and now they have a I won't say a thriving relationship, but they are at least cordial and he has a role in not only his daughter's life, but his granddaughter's life too. There's a young man who is in Australia who told me, man, becoming a father is the scariest thing because I don't want to make the same mistakes
that my father made with me. And I'm only nineteen, but when I hear you talk about your daughter, I want to be that guy.
So those are just a few instances.
Wow, No, that is amazing.
It gives you goosebumps for you as the person on the receiving end, Do you even have the bandwidth to even understand what that means that you've had that great effect on someone's life?
Can it even be can you even process it fully?
You know? No, especially at the time being the futurist, I've always been Yeah, I never really allow myself to kind of just sit with it and to just be like, oh, yeah, like I did really awesome work. Like I'll be there in the moment as I'm messaging them back, but then as soon as the message is gone, then I'm away from it all.
Yeah.
So I'm trying better.
Yeah, absolutely so, Brandon. I mean, you've shared so many gems. We really appreciate you and your time on the show today. One of the things that this show really seeks to do is give advice for the next generation of poets. Anyone for their closet poets. They've been in the game for a while, maybe they don't have to start. I mean, what is just from your you know, give us some
free game. What advice do you give to aspiring poets to look up to you and want to follow in your footsteps of really making spoken word and poetry life's work.
Three pieces of advice, I'll try to make them quick.
One.
Be a healthy person before you're an awesome poet. It's far more valuable that way. Lesson to write the bad poem.
It doesn't.
All of the work you make does not have to be amazing. All of it does not have to be beautiful. Some of it can be trash, some of it can be just awful, And you will find that writing the bad stuff will give you the chance to be able to then write the good stuff you're hoping to get out of it. And then, last, but not least, don't ask for success without being willing to pay the costs
that it requires. Many people will get jealous, get frustrated, get upset that they haven't reached the heights that they desire to reach, not realizing that in order to get that high, in order to get that success, there was
a lot of imbalance that was required. I can't tell you the number of hours I sacrificed from family, from friends, from people who I love and practice in my backyard or in the car or at some random park, the number of hours I spent on the road to go to an open mic in another city so I can try out and find a new scene just to get there, share my poem for three minutes, and then have to take another three hour drive home so I can make it to work the next day on time. It's going
to require imbalance for a season. And if you desire excellence, then go get excellent, but you also have to give it. So yeah, those would be my three pieces of advice.
We appreciate it now. Those are excellent. Those are amazing, Thank you so much. Brandon. What legacy do you hope to behind through your poetry? Brandon?
Honestly, these days, I just want to be known as somebody who loves Jesus and loved people.
And so if I can do those two.
Things really well and have people be like yo, man, like he loved God well and he loved us well, then I feel like I did a good job.
Thank absolutely all right, Brandon, last question we have for you on the Post Speaks podcast today, Brandon, why do you need to get your words out?
I get these words out, because if I did, I'd probably probably go kill some of y'all from what y'all be doing out here in these streets.
I'm just gonna be honest. So I choose a I choose words instead of violence.
There we go, all right, y'all he would out if he could shoot. All right, he chooses words my violence.
We love it.
We love it, all right, Brandon. Well, thank you so much for being guest today.
Now before we wrap up, wrap up, just tell the folks out there what's next for you in the year twenty twenty five.
And above and beyond?
And where can folks find all of your amazing work at any social media websites that you.
Want to drop For January twenty twenty five, my short film Complexity, which won fifty six awards internationally and nationally, will be debuting online on my YouTube page just Brandon Leak.
You will see me when you type it in. It's my I channel.
I have about almost twenty thousand followers there, So yeah, that'll be debuting in January. February of twenty twenty six will be my return back to poetry. For all who don't know, I've been on sabbatical for about a year and a half now. God called me home to be able to take a break, be with my family, to rest and to reconnect with Him, and in that I have been preparing for this next album entitled Intimacy, and we will be putting on three live shows in my
city and then potentially a very small tour. But it's me with a sixty piece orchestra, a band, and a choir, so it is not just branding up there on stage. You're gonna get a full on performance. You will find me at Brandon l E a k E on all platforms. I'm the only Brandon Leak with a check mark next to his name on all these platforms, so I'm pretty easy to find. Hit me up on YouTube, most importantly Instagram. You'll see me every day. So yeah, just come highlight
a brother. I'll be around awesome. Thanks so much, Brandon.
Everyone.
Brandon's links will be down below no matter where you're listening to this podcast, no matter the platform, check out the detailed box detail sections below for Brandon's all his links.
All right, well, Brandon, we really appreciate you.
Thank you so much for being a guest on the Polts Speaks podcast today.
Thank y'all.
Absolutely all right, everyone again, Brandon's links. Brandon Links links will be down below in the description box below.
Everyone, thanks so much.
Check out the Polks Speak podcast no matter where you listen to your podcast, all everyone, take care.
Bye bye