Welcome to the Play Based Learning Podcast. I'm your host, Kristen Arby Peterson, and maybe your new teacher, Bestie, that is here to hype you up, maybe give you a motivating kick in the pants, and teach you all I know about play and childhood. I am here to help you challenge old and outdated practices and inspire you to create a truly developmentally appropriate early childhood environment that fosters creativity. Curiosity and joy in the Children that you care for.
Let's set the stage for a lifelong love of learning. Let's get going. Stacey Binge is with me on the podcast today. Welcome, Stacey. Thank you so much for being here. Hey, thanks for having me. Of course. We're talking all about kind of one of the things, I think it's like the number one asked, number one questioned thing in early childhood as far as play based learning goes. Like, how are they gonna learn their alphabet if all they do is play? Stacey wrote a book.
Tell us what the name of the book is. The Whole Child Alphabet, How Young Children Actually Develop Literacy. Amazing. And so, she is here to tell us all about how young children develop literacy skills. So, let's, let's dissect that question. How will they learn the alphabet if all they do is play? So, I think it's like, we have to look at, first of all, the role that alphabet, the alphabet plays in literacy. So, it's necessary but not sufficient on its own.
So, we want to make sure we keep in mind just, all the components that need to be developed for literacy and making sure, um, well, or keeping in mind that play really supports all of that. But then I think we also need to look at alphabet through a different lens, that it's not a matter of teaching, it's a matter of developing. And so what foundational skills have to be there before children can even learn their alphabet.
And it starts with, um, you know, their visual perceptual skills, where they not only the sense of sight, but just really, um, the brain processing and understanding what's coming through the eyes. And when we really understand that, how that, you know, uh, visual constancy, um, Helps with like, you know, recognizing the alphabet and different fonts, uh, visual closure helps when it comes to like sight reading, you know, and these are all things down the line.
Yeah. Um, but distinguishing different letters, uh, that depends on our visual perceptual skills. Well, how does that develop best? Well, through child led play. And then you have phonological awareness. So, you know, once you recognize a letter. You have to recognize that it represents a sound. Well, that hinges on phonological awareness, which culminates with phonemic awareness, which is your brain's ability to hear and produce the smallest, uh, smallest units of sound in language.
Well, how does that develop? Well, hearing, Our friends talk, having conversations, hearing authentic sounds in the environment. And that's best through child led play. And then we have the handwriting aspect of it. Well, that, uh, depends on our entire, entire body developing gross motor skills, support the fine motor. Um, we have the ability to cross midlines.
Uh, we have our internal senses, our vestibular system, which Really is very important for reading, uh, and then, uh, proprioceptive, which is how much strength is needed for a task, which comes into writing the alphabet. Well, that all develops through children outside playing, climbing on the playground, hanging upside down, and then being on the floor, moving around and playing as well. So when we look at it that way, it's really the question is how, how can they learn their alphabet with.
Outplay, you know, and so it's, it's, I think it's just taking a different perspective on it. Yes, I think that oftentimes people in general, like the general public who maybe doesn't understand child development, um, do not understand child development, they may think that learning the alphabet is just. Strictly a brain thing, you know, but with all of those things that you just described, it involves every single part of the body. Exactly. Whole child alphabet. Whole child alphabet, yes.
I get it, now. Yeah. I just put that together. Oh my goodness. And so, like, how can we, what are some tips? Because, like, We need to get people who don't understand this, because, like, I understand this. Anybody who's really, really, um, into providing a play based learning environment for children and really doing the work that falls around that, we know that they're learning these things through play. We've seen it. We've been play detectives.
We've, like, siphoned out all of that learning and we've made it visible to other people. Um, how do we get the outsiders? To understand this information like what is what is your recommendation for that because that's really who we need to get on board with this is like at home caregivers or the admin or the teachers down the hall who don't, you know, understand play as well as we do. Right.
I think it starts with us having the knowledge of being confident in the knowledge like we really need to be. Intricate with child development and be able to explain, you know, um, you know, it's not just the fine motor skills, but it's it's the, you know, crossing the midline. It's like I mentioned earlier, the proprioceptive skills when we can get very detailed with it. I think that helps us with the conversations and helps us explain.
And then I think we just need to get the conversation started. Like we need to find opportunities just to start planting those seeds and just, um, Not pushing back in a way that people are turned off by it, but just really getting the conversation going and explaining and recognizing that people that we're talking to, they're, they're competent, smart individuals, and let's just, you know, share our knowledge with them.
Cause I think most of the time when we start to share that people are like, Oh, wait, that does make sense. I didn't think of it that way. I don't think anything's going to happen overnight either, but I think it's just a matter of us just. Continually planting those seeds and just all, you know, it'll eventually grow into something at some point. Absolutely.
Okay, so for those who are just kind of tippy toeing into the world of play, child led play, do you have any, like, examples of what the ways are that children are learning through play? Learning the alphabet and, like, alphabet knowledge through play.
You know, um, I think one of the Best examples I can give, which is maybe just kind of a generic one, is, you know, if we provide blank paper and crayons alongside children's play, just throughout the environment, a lot of times we find that children will go and they will want to, um, Put something on paper to convey a message and, you know, it might be something that connects directly to their place scenario.
It might be something that they just want to share, but what will happen is over time, you know, that mark making turns into scribbling, turns into pictures, turns into stories, and eventually we see, uh, letters start to emerge on the paper and then.
When we as the adults, if we're available for children to bring that to us and go, Oh, you know, look at what I, what I drew or whatever I did and as having the conversation, you know, that a lot of times might lead into us talking about the letter, or maybe the child wants us to write something and we can. you know, verbally spells or writing out what connects to their drawing. But I think that is just kind of a great example of just how child led play.
It's not us giving them a prompt to go on the paper. It's just them taking that paper and using it. In their place scenario for whatever reason, they, they want to use it for, and that's just kind of being available to kind of, you know, guide along. I think what's very important to remember is our role during play is to stay out of the way. And I think especially when it comes to stuff like that, and we see letters emerge, we want to jump in and go, Oh, well, what letter is that?
Or what does that start with?
And we need to not do that because that's that stop that learning by trying to teach because we might interrupt an experience Absolutely, and that is so hard to do as an adult when we've been so it's like so ingrained in us that we need to be like teaching at the children and and like Scaffolding and building upon everything to make the learning greater than it is And sometimes it's just nice to just let that learning rest And like, marinate a little bit, you know what I mean?
Right. And I think too, you know, specifically on, on the alphabet, when we kind of go back to those fundamentals we were talking about earlier, um, I write an example in my book where I was with my great niece and we were playing with a, uh, Peppa the Pig. Purple picnic play set and we kept saying that over and over. She was probably like three or four, but we were laughing and I felt this need to go, what letters to start with?
And I remember her looking at me like that's not the, that's not what we're playing. Like why? And I was like, okay, let me back that up a little bit. Let me put those words back in my mouth. Yeah. And I was reflecting later on. I was like. You know what? She was still hearing all those phonemes. We were still, we still, you know, had language going on. We still had tracking. You know, we were tracking with our eyes as we were moving the pieces around.
So it's all still supporting alphabet knowledge, and I did not need to step in and directly connect it there. Oh, I love that. I love how you noticed, here's the other things that we were, we were already playing around with, and it didn't, we didn't have to take it to that next step yet. Right. That's good.
That, and that's like the sign of somebody who has a reflective practice, who's actually like noticing those things and saying, okay, what can I, what can I do now with this information moving forward? I love that. Yes. Okay. What in your career made you decide this is the book that I need to write? So, um, I've always been passionate about language and literacy. Um, actually my original major in college was speech and language pathology and extremely long. story.
I ended up like switching to child development and getting my master's in that, but I was gravitated towards the language and literacy aspect. And, um, I used to do a lot of classroom observations when I started doing more consulting work. Um, and I would notice going in to classrooms that there was a lot of letter of the week, a lot of emphasis on the alphabet. And so when I would have kind of a reflective dialogue afterwards, After the observation, you know, I would say, okay.
We should be doing some other things that are been letter of the week. And then I found that everybody was asking, but what, what do we do instead? So I created a training like seven or eight years ago, that really is the basis for this book. And everybody kept going, you should write a book. You should write a book. And then 2020, we became empty nesters and it was COVID. And my husband looked at me and said, this is your time. So he was right. And it all kind of evolved.
Then. Yeah, here we are. So, yes. Okay, so you touched on, um, the, oh, now I lost my train of thought. It was so good! Okay, let's go here. Can you give people ideas of things they can add to their environment? Oh, I know! Let's back up, because now I know the question, and then we'll move on to that one.
Okay. So if we're not doing Letter of the Week, because Letter of the Week is everywhere, and it's, like, all around the themes, and we try to, like, connect the letters of the week to the theme that we're doing for the week. Why is Letter of the Week maybe not the best approach for early childhood? So I think everything begins with the child and, uh, and, and alphabet knowledge begins with the interest in the connection of the child.
So think of every child as having their own ecosystem, and they're the center of it, and the next layer is their family, and then their friends. And if you look at alphabet knowledge, it starts with, they're going to begin with The first letter of their first name and then the next letters they tend to learn are those of their family and then those are their friends. So it has to connect to their environment.
So if we're introducing and spending a whole week on a letter that has absolutely nothing to do with that child's life, they're not going to connect with it. So, I mean, they can, they can do all the things we have planned, but it's really not going to result in that knowledge. If I have a new brother named Thomas and all of a sudden the letter T is the most important letter in my life and That takes me two seconds to learn.
So, um, and I think again, we have to go back to, or any of those foundational skills there either, you know, but, you know, it doesn't take a child to learn a week to learn a letter that's important to them. And if the letter serves no purpose in their life, we're not going to see it like evolve in their play a lot. So it's just. It has to connect all back to the child.
Absolutely. Okay, I, I don't know if you've seen this, but for some reason, two videos yesterday popped up on my, like, for you thing on the algorithm on Instagram. And they were of, like, maybe a parent, caregiver, I'm not really sure, sitting on the floor crisscross applesauce with a child with letter, big letter flashcards.
Like, A, B, C. Okay. And they were, and I didn't really read the caption or anything, but I want to just see if you've seen this and like what purpose this would serve if they're like three years old. Um, so it was them trying to do like an action with the letter sound, um, to teach the child sounds the letters make. So it was like, A would be, Ah! And then you'd like pretend like you have a big, like a big apple in front of your face and you're like biting into it, kind of. And then I was eh!
And then you like make a little like dot, like the I on the top of the dot. Like it was very, it was like that, but they were trying to get children to memorize these sounds using actions to reinforce. What are your thoughts on that style of learning the alphabet? Like the, the sounds of the alphabet. I'm like, you're going to have to send me the video. I don't think I've seen that. Oh, okay. Well, I'm sure now that I'm talking about it, it will show up even more on my algorithm.
You know, I think it kind of comes back to children are capable of memorizing a lot of things. Yeah, they are. Um, and they can kind of have a little short term memory with it. But again, if it's not connecting, uh, to their world. Yeah. It's only going to be just a temporary thing, and you know, I think that it kind of comes back to also, um, that those, those visual perceptual skills, the phonological awareness, um, you know, are those fully developed?
Are those, you know, if that phonemic awareness is not quite there, I'm not sure. If the actions that you're saying are in the videos, if that would really help them read them forward to that or not, you know, not anything like just hearing authentic conversations over and over and over again, I think would be like way more, uh, way more effective. So, yeah. Hmm. Okay. Awesome. I don't know. I'm very curious about that.
But yeah, I think it's kind of too like, you know, I, I've seen a lot of teachers doing flashcards where they're like apple set or a says, ah, you know, or B says, and it's like, we can do this over and over and over. Yeah. And the kids can memorize it, but is it really getting that in depth? Right. I call it sticky learning. Yeah. Is it the sticky learning? The learning that, like, actually sticks with you forever? Like, yeah.
Opposed to just that surface learning, kind of, we kind of keep it for a few days, but then it just kind of goes away because it's not in our everyday life and, and, uh, serving a purpose. Absolutely. Okay, so in these play based, child led environments, what are some things that we can add to our spaces to encourage children to develop these skills that are necessary for learning the alphabet?
Well, I think, first of all, just remember that, um, an experience and activity material doesn't have to be labeled literacy based to support literacy.
Yeah. So, and when you kind of, again, look at it with that different lens, pretty much I think anything that is open ended, uh, that, that the children can move around, manipulate, that they can play with, with their friends, is going to support, uh, Literacy and alphabet knowledge, you know, and I do think when children do start to show an interest in letters when it's an authentic child led thing, which I, like I said, you'll start to see, um, you'll start to see the letters
emerge on their, uh, on their drawings, or they might actually start to ask you about it, then we can maybe start bringing in some, um, letter based materials. Maybe it's like alphabet cookie cutters or, or the magnetic letters. Bye. Bye. But I don't think we have to do, like, the entire alphabet. I would bring in letters that they are connected to, that are purposeful in their life, that they can experience if they choose to do so. And they can pull it into their play if they would like.
Um, they might pull it into their play and it has nothing to do with it being the alphabet, but, you know, it's still there. Um, but I think that's when it's appropriate to kind of start Bringing it into the environment, but not saturating your environment with it.
Um, and like I mentioned earlier, I think opportunities for children just to have that open ended drawing, uh, anything where they can have a dramatic play scenario where they're, you know, telling stories, you know, that's literacy based. I just think really any child led play is going to support. All the goals that we're all kind of looking at it and hoping for.
Absolutely. Okay, so when I travel around the world and speak, a big question that I often get is, okay, so we have to follow, like, teaching strategy, strategies gold, or we have the head start alignment, and they have to know a certain amount of letters and letter sounds by the time they leave for kindergarten.
What would you say to those people who are trying to embrace more child led play, but still have those really strict things that are put down on them from the higher ups that they need to follow. I think, first of all, get the conversation going as to, you know, why that's not the most developmentally appropriate approach, um, and so at least kind of plant those seeds.
But then You know, I, I think if that is something you're absolutely required to do, you're required to follow a certain, you know, structure, just find, you know, if it's a worksheet, can we find a way to make it hands on?
Um, and then I think maybe kind of analyze it too, you know, for part of the conversations of, okay, they have to know these sounds, well, they can't know these sounds unless they've developed phonemic awareness, and that doesn't develop unless children are playing, so I am putting this in place to help support it. So maybe kind of bringing more of that play in, but.
Then actually connecting it and showing how it connects, um, how it connects to those goals that the curriculum has put forth or that the program has put forth. But, and I know, and I know that's a very hard situation where you're kind of stuck between what you believe and you know, but then you have.
It's something that's put upon you that you don't agree with, so I think it's just try and find that happy medium, but keep having the conversation, um, because that's the only way anything's going to change. Oh, it's, it is such a tough position. And the thing that I have noticed too, because one of the trainings that I do is we get all of the, we have people bring in their, their state's standards or benchmarks for early childhood education.
And one of the things that I do is I'm like, go through your state's. Benchmarks, and see if it actually says somewhere that they need to know every single letter of the alphabet, because I can guarantee it doesn't, like, I don't think that there is any state out there, and if I'm wrong, please let me know, um, that says they need to know every single letter of the alphabet, recognize it, and know all of the alphabet, like, all of the sounds.
Yeah. And I think that we just have this, like, Perception that they order to be ready for kindergarten, and I do that in air quotes, ready for kindergarten, is that they need to know all the ABCs. You know, and I think like Texas are like at 20, like, I think a lot of them maybe kind of hover a little bit below, but one of the things when I was writing my book is I, I kind of like shut down a little bit. Like I was like, I don't want to look at any state standards.
I don't want to look at, you know, I had a couple people ask me about science of reading or if I align all these things and, and, My goal was to not let that influence what I knew. Yes. As just solid child development. I was like, my goal was to look at development first. Yes. And, and so that's, you know, um, hopefully that helps in the conversation. But, you know, I, like I said, the standards and stuff, I think we as. Early childhood professionals working with children birth to five.
We just have to keep advocating and just keep bringing the evidence, bringing the research, and just kind of keep pushing back the best that we can. Hmm. I love that so much. Okay, this was Phenomenal. I think it was like the perfect little like intro to the whole child alphabet. Where can people learn more? So, um, if you would like to learn more about me, uh, Stacy, you can go to my website, website stacybinge. com.
And then if you'd like to purchase the whole child alphabet, it is published by Exchange Press. So if you go to exchangepress. com slash ABC, that will take you directly to the webpage with uh, with my book, or just go to Exchange's website and you can find it, uh, easily there. And we'll link it all below, too. We'll link both your website and exchangepress slash ABC down below so you can quickly find it there. Thank you so much, Stacy, for being here.
I appreciate The work, like the hard work that you poured into that book so that we could all learn from you. It is so appreciated in our industry. So thank you for being here. Thank you. Thanks for having me. If you liked what you heard today, share this podcast with your coworkers, admin, or maybe even your partner. And I love getting five star reviews so more people can embrace play. Hit follow or subscribe so you never miss an episode.
Or connect with me on Instagram or my website, KristenRBPeterson. com. Until next time.