The Many Faces of George

I'm hosting a podcast called The Girlfriends. It's Las Vegas, it's the nineteen nineties, and it is time to find a husband. There were four Jewish doctors who were felt to be eligible bachelors. One of them was of the Baron bat On paper, he was perfect, but in reality, this guy's a wacko. He shouted to the point went unconscious. I would call him and I would say, I know you killed my sister. You can listen to The Girlfriends on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get

your podcasts. I'm will daily. For years have been on the road playing shows and seeing America through live music this summer, I'll hit the stage who Season two of Sound of Our Town ten cities twelve episodes every other Thursday. We explore the live music venues and culture of a new American city. With each new episode, our tour continues into the kind of venues you want to get to

when you landed in Detroit, Providence, Denver or Seattle. Listen to Sound of Our Town on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Hart, I'm Freedom and I'm Rthie. We have spent the last twenty years building and working at some of the largest companies in the world. We worked with some remarkable people. Rob mcalinney. When I see the people of Wrexham, I grew up exactly like them. Check out the Art and Trurom show. That is a R d Hi and sr Hi r

AM show. Listen to the Arc instry On show on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast or whenever you get to your podcast and can you tell us first of all if you noticed anything about George during that time. He wasn't the same George that I knew. There are Facebook messages between her and Hannah may rodin days before Hannah May was murdered, in which they talked about this issue of custody and how the Wagners wanted Hannah May to sign over custody of her daughter. He was a lifelong

friend of Billy Wagner. He cooperated with the BCI and he actually warned that Chris Senor that if you have trouble with them, they will harm you or kill you. If George would have just let me go outside to cool off with it, then we would probably still be married. All I wanted was five minutes to cry outside alone. This is the Piked and Masaker returned to Pike County season four, episode eleven, The Many Faces of George. I'm Courtney Armstrong, a television producer at KATI Studios, along with

Stephanie Leidecker and Jeff Shane. It's important to note that George Wagner the Fourth, along with his father Billy Wagner, whose child is upcoming, deny any wrongdoing and have pleaded not guilty to all charges. We're picking up where we left off last episode with Prosecutor Angie Kaneppa examining Tabitha Clayton, George Wagner the Fourth's ex wife, on the stand. Can you tell us what time of the day this argument first started, and I don't mean any exact time though.

Was it the afternoon, was it the evening? It was near evening, Yeah, it started to get dark, okay. And did you have any more contact with them while you were still there hiding under George's truck? No? Did you see any of them? They are flashlights? You said they were flashlights plural, more than one flashlight? Yes? And at this point where were you? I was still underneath the George's truck, okay, under the cab basically, okay, okay, in the front tires. Did they find you? Did they eventually

give up looking for you? Yes? And what did you do it? At that point? I got out from underneath of the truck and went to the barn and got my bicycle, and you got on you You got your bicycle, you said, And what did you do? I left? I went to the gas station up the road by McDonald's. And can you tell us at that point was it dark? Yes? Okay, propably, how far is that to the gas station driving? It's about five or ten minutes. And can you tell us why were you hiding from them? I didn't want to

get shot. And did you make it to the gas station? Yes, okay, did you encounter anybody along the way? Yes? Tell us who George and Jake in their red suburban And what did they say to you? They were trying to get me to get in the car so we could go home. Did you agree to get into the car? What, if anything did you say to them? They told him middle isn't going to live with film if they're going to hit me. And what happened then? Or did you tell

them where you were going? I told him that I was going to go to the gas station so I could call her mom so she can come and get me. And is that what you did? Yes. Here's legal analyst Mike Allen, followed by Stephanie and Jeff. This is key testimony for the prosecution because, unlike so many of the other witnesses, this really kind of centers on George, and she's the prosecutors painting a picture of what kind of a person George was, and you know, according to her,

it wasn't a very good person. We've never been able to connect with Tabitha personally. We've spoken to her mother, we've spoken to her sister and hearing her accounts firsthand of something that we've we've heard versions of this story of that night when she had to run out of the house, but really hearing it out of her own mouth was something really powerful. He's living in an event

that is nothing more and nothing less than traumatic. Picturing her even just biking away in the night, trying to escape and then the boys pulling up in that car telling her to get in. You know how tap she must have felt. After the incident that Tabitha described on the stand, the Waggoners ended up filing a domestic violence claim against her, claiming that she dragged her baby across

the floor. Now, they later dropped these charges. Tabitha and George were married, therefore George had automatic rights in the state of Ohio because they were married, so she literally had to write her rights away and did whether she knew what she was signing or not. It was around the same time that Tabitha was becoming close with victim hannahme Rodin, who as we know, was having similar custody

issues with her boyfriend Jake Wagner. Tabitha ran through some of the Facebook messages she and Hannah had shared at the time. She begins by recounting an exchange about being able to share her son with George Wagner. Hannah Rodin asked me if I've gotten to see lately. I said, no, not yet. Every time my set a day to see him, George has something to do or somewhere to go. He tells me he will message me back when he gets home, but then he never messages me back. Hannah says, oh,

I would be really upset. I would say I'm scared to death that they are going to try and take I said, all I am, and it kills me. Well, you know, since y'all was not married, she goes to you automatically, and he is the one that gets to see her every other weekend or whatever. Hannah says, yeah, I know, but they could fight that. I said, yeah, but they judge ain't gonna take her away from you. You have a good home and people to help take

care of her. She says, I know. I'm trying to get me a place as soon as possible in a job. I said, I mean, if George would have just let me go outside to cool off of it, then we would probably still be married. All I wanted was five minutes to cry outside alone. Then there was an incident in twenty sixteen, right before the murders, during a visit with her son at the Wagner's, Tabitha's newborn daughter was seemingly poisoned. Was there another time that something happened after

you had visited your son at the Wagner residence? Yes? And can you tell us do you recall when that would have been? Was around most day or Easter? And what year would that have been? Do we call twenty and sixteen and can you tell us what happened? My six month little daughter became unresponsive, so we took her to the emergency room where they did tests and found the drugs in her system. Tell me, first of all, this was a child of horse. Yes, she was six

months old in the time. Yes. And had she been with you at the Wagon residence that day? Yes? And tell us what kinds of interactions she had with the other people in the home. She had stayed on my hip for a while until Angela had asked to see her, and so I gave her to rorists so she could see her while I went and use to the restaurant. Other than that time period where you win the restroom. Was your daughter out of your view while you were

at the blackness? And did you make it back home before you noticed that about your daughter as far as her physical condition, yeah, I had made it home, okay. And when you say she was unresponsive, what do you mean by that? She was just laying there staring out into space. I went to pick her up and she

was as limber as a new one. And what did you do as a result about I had both my husband and we took it in the emergency room okay, and dremmy hall where you went the SMC and you indicated that they did some tests And do you know what driveway found in her system? Zan X? Were you prescribed xanax your husband? No? Do you have any xanax in your home at all? You know? And have you been anywhere else that day? No? And as a result of that, was there a Children's Service investigation? Yes? Okay?

And did both you and your husband submit to drug tests? We did, but they did not do them at the hospital okay. Did you volunteer to do them at the hospital, yes, but you didn't take tests later about a week later okay. And were those negative? Yes? It was all very shocking testimony for the prosecution, showing that George might have had violent tendencies and was also tightly bound to his family,

but the defense mounted a strong cross examination. They began with Tabitha's affair with her friend Whitney's father Jay, and the trust issues are created in her marriage. And who's Whitney's father? Do you know? Yes? Who is your father? Cecil Smith? Cecil Smith? And how do you know? How well do you know Cecil Smith? Very well? Okay? And Cecil also goes by the name Jay. Is that right? Yes? Okay? And at some point you had some revelation to tell

George about Jay, right? Yes? What was that? What was the reason? Well? Yeah, what was the revelation? What did you have to tell him? I had told him that I cheated on him? Okay? With with Jay? Right? And in pactas was more than just one occasion, right? Yes? And how old is Jay? Not twenty five? Thirty years older? You were about seventeen maybe other time. No. I didn't get back with George until I was about eighteen ninety.

Defense attorney Richard Nash also points out that Tabitha and her siblings had been sexually abused by her mother's husband, Dave. The defense side of this as a quite reasonable reason why the Wagners did not want Tabitha bringing their grandchild around to family. The perpetrator, the person who victimized you. That's Day right, Yes, And Day is your mother's husband. Was he's dead? Now he's dead? And when did he die? About five years ago? I think, okay. And your mother

was aware of the things that Day did to you. Yes, And not only did he do these awful things to you, but he did him to your sisters. Yes. Now, when you left the Wagner home, we'll get to this more in depth, but that's where you went, was the home with Day right, Yes, And George did not want his little boy living in the same home on his day. Is that what he told you? Yes, okay, that seems like a pretty rational thing to not want your child

around the child molester. Right. Yes, you don't fault George for not wanting his son to be there, right, that was a no. Yes, that was a no. I don't blame him. And your mother was an enabler to these things that had happened to you and your sisters. Yes. The defense also killed Tabitha on her mental health and

whether she was doing enough to tend to him. Now that I have refreshed her recollection, do you recall telling David Jenkins you had a perfect life with your husband, yes, and who you're referring to as George, right, Yes, Okay. Now back to George and living with him, He had various jobs, right, Yes, For a while he worked at Bennetts and Medford, yes okay, And then for some time he was hauling cattle right, yes. And when he would haul cattle he would be gone for like a week

on or a week off. Yes, okay. Now back to that situation where you had cut your arms? Did you ever seek any help for that? The only reason I done it was because George and Angela won't shut up the many I learned about getting back on zoloft, even though I told him the last time I was on zooloft it didn't end well. Zolo Okay. So you have been prescribed zoloft, is what you're telling us? Yes? And for what reason? Or do you prescribed zoloft depression by poland? Right?

And you have said you would agree with me that you've said that you don't like taking medication, right, Not that one enough, okay, any other medication you didn't like taking a Ldelino. Then there were the continued claims of different ways that George had been abusive, But the defense took this moment to dissect and try and undercut Tabitha's testimony.

You ask you about that incident when you had left the Wager home, if I'm not mistaken, Well, first off, you had discussed that incident with the BCI agents, right about me? Leading about me got in my arm about the incident when you left. You've been questioned about that, and you and you told them what happened, right, Yes? Would you agree with me though, that when you talked to the BCI agents you with him that you and George were horse playing, playing around with the belt? Yes, okay,

and it's Michault. I don't hear that. Well you said, what now with the belt? Yes, with the belt? But okay, Now, you would agree with me that you never told any BCI agent that there was playing with a belt? Right? What? You never mentioned a belt to a BCI agent, right, I'm it's part of that night. I'm pretty sure I did. Okay, all right, But you've always said that it was just the two of you horse plane or plane around? Right? Yes?

At first it was okay, So maybe I misunderstood your testimony on direct examination, but it sounded to me as if you were saying that he was like assaulting you with a belt. That's not true, right, That's not what I said, okay, And I may be wrong, but I'm just making sure that I understand you correctly. You weren't testifying that he was assaulting you with a belt, right, No. I did not say he was assaulting me with belt, okay. And it was just you guys were playing around right

in the beginning, yes, okay. And then Angela, I guess I wanted you guys to stop, yes, because I yelled at her precious baby. Okay, Um, all right. And you wanted to leave the house, right, yes, And when you went to leave, George had put his arm on the door so you couldn't leave, yes, okay. Now this was in November, right, yes, okay. And when you left on

your bicycle it was dark, right, yes, okay. And so how much time went by from when you're trying to leave and when you actually fled on your bicycle it was dark? I don't know, maybe an hour. No, I'm not clear about this disagreement you went into You had to go into a courtroom in front of a judge before you could divorce or dissolve your marriage, right yes. And when you stood in front of that judge, the judge trained you that you were agreeing to George being

the sole customer, right yes. And the judge also made sure you understood that all visits would be supervised, right yes. And you were asked if you understood that, and you said yes, yes, okay, And there was nothing in there about changing these things at a later time, right now, okay. And so it's fair to say those were your wishes, right exactly what the judge had made sure you understood. No,

that's not my wishes. George told me that it was only temporary, that's what was supposed to have been done. And whenever I got my own place, in my own job, then I could have him back and would do the fifty. I think that if we moved out then we would probably still be together, because I still love him, I really do. I always have and always will. But I couldn't hank having to ask to do something with my own son. We're going to take a break. We'll be

back in a moment. As the defensive cross examination continued to pay Tabitha in a more uncertain light, it was hard to know exactly what to make of her accusations. Here's long crime reporter and Jeanette Levy, she has been through a lot. And also you know the fact that there are Facebook messages between her and Hannon A. Rudin days before Hannah May was murdered, in which they talked about this issue of custody and how the Wagners wanted Hannah May to sign over custody of her daughter that

she had with Jake. And it was kind of sad to hear Tabitha say that, literally, she still loves George. I mean this was back in twenty sixteen, of course, but it sounded like she still loved him and if they had ever been able to move out on their own, they probably would have still been together. She said she had told George she wanted them to move out and to get their own place. She thought it would help their relationship. And she said that George said, we're a

farm family. We have to live together here again, Jeff and Stephanie during cross exam, it really painted a picture of Tabitha versus the Wagoners, which, as we know at the time, Tabitha was a young woman in her late teens early twenties, and the Wagoners were kind of a force to be reckoned with. It seems like she kind of just wanted all of the turmoil end and just be a mom to her son, and somehow signing this paperwork and doing what the Wagner's want it seemed like

the path of least resistance to her. I think this testimony seems relevant to the charges that George Wagner the fourth is facing, because not only does it paint a picture of George as someone who is abusive and cruel, but also the fact that he really moved in a unit with his family, which then, as we know, is what the prosecution is saying, happened with the planning and execution of these murders. And it also speaks to a bit of a pattern, a pattern in custody. Correct, does

that mean it's a pattern in murder? I'm assuming those links are still to come. Aside from Tabitha, the jury also heard from two other key witnesses, both of whom opted out of being recorded on the stand. The first was Frankie Rowden's ex girlfriend who he shared a child with.

Here's Anteinette with insight into that testimony. I think the jury seemed really interested in testimony since she had a relationship with Frankie Roden, she is the mother of his oldest son, and you know, she had some things that were interesting that she was able to tuttle the jury. You know, she talked about getting a phone call from

Hannah May in twenty fourteen which sounded terrifying. That she said that Angela Wagner ran out of the house and chased Tabitha out of the house with a shotgun, and that Jake and George and Hannah all followed, and that Jake told her not to leave the house. If she did, he would chop off her legs. I mean, that's terrifying. After a meeting in his chambers, Judge Daring emerged to tell the jury that the phone call between Hannah and

Frankie Roden's ex girlfriend was probative evidence only. This is to say, it's meant to prove a relevant fact in the case, but can not be used to cast a shadow over the Wagner's character. The second witness is Jeff Tackett, a one time friend of Billy Wagner's. The pair became friends when they were just thirteen years old. Jeff worked at the Wagner family's Flying w Farms and once went

hunting with the entire Wagner family. According to Tackett, George Wagner flew into a rage when his father killed a deer. Before he did, George went home early. Tackett testified that George was moody and erratic due to the pain pills he took. These were pills that Angela allegedly plied him with. Tackett was also with Billy in the days leading up to the murders. After the massacre, Tackett believed Billy had something to do with it and started working with the BCI.

He agreed to wear a wire and inform on the Wagner's Mike Allen. He was a lifelong friend of Billy Wagner. He cooperated with the PCI, and he actually wore a wire. He saw Billy Wagner days before the murder in a room filled with weapons, and that is I think very relevant, again a peripheral relevance maybe to Georgie's guilt or innocence, but in telling the tale and telling the story of

the Wagner family, it's important. He worked sometimes at the Flying w Farm, which was the family farm, because he was helping to break some horses. He knew Chris Senior, Frankie Hannah May, and Chris Junior and said that he warned Chris Senior that if you have trouble with them, they will harm you or kill you. Here again, Anjeanette Jeff Teckett described the Wagners as being very close, like a cult. He's been around the Wagners a lot. He's

been around Frederica Wagner a lot. He talked about Frederica Wagner even gave him a percocet for pain one time because he was having an issue, and he said it made him feel dizzy, and he told her never to give him something like that again. So he didn't want anything to do with that. But he did provide a lot of interesting information about the Wagners and the fact that he believed that Billy Wagner was involved in these homicides after seeing all of those items in his bedroom.

Let's stop here for another break. Here's Angie Kneppa examining the next witness Samantha's Staley. Samantha is a longtime friend of both Jake and George Wagner's. She has appeared on the podcast before and has a history with Jake Wagner. Was there a time when you were intimate with Jake Wagner? Yes? Okay? And can you tell us who's who initiated that he did? Okay? And if you can just tell us what his purpose was.

So one summer I got a phone call he did not know how to have in a course, I guess he asked me if I could help him out, Being young and dumb, I guess, I said sure, why not? And it was a one time plan. So we just did what we did, okay. And do you recall approximately when that would have been, I know, a summer, I'm guessing around two twelve, but that one night stand aside, Samantha felt more drawn to George in comparison to Jake.

George seemed to have more of his own personality. She found him to be effusive and always cracking jokes, whereas Jake was always plotting and devious. At one point during his battle with Hanname Rodin, Jake guess Samantha to dig up dirt on Hannah to help his case for soul custody. Samantha refused. George, Samantha says, was much kinder, nicer, and in her words, more pubbly. So in my opinion, my eyes outlook, George would always go out and do his

own thing. Jake would always have to get Angela's opinion before he would go do anything Angela didn't approve. Jake never did. George, on the other hand, would just do his own thing. And as I understand it, when you were very young, you felt like your mother and Angela would kind of pushing you over towards being with Jake, yes, and that you really didn't care for too much, is that right? Yeah? And actually as the years wore on, you were more attracted to George. Is that fair to say?

He actually made me feel like I was wanted? Honestly? It was nice to you, right, yes, And that continued into a donut right yes. And in fact, I think you just told us a story that when you were kind of on a rough spot around Christmas time, I think you described it, he came over and brought toys for your trial, yes, and gave you cash money to help you pay with the bills. Yes, how would you describe him when he was very young? He's bubbly. Here

again a Jeanette. Samantha Staley said some things that were actually helpful to George Wagner. She painted George Wagner out to be somebody who was very nice to her. She said that, you know, there was a Christmas where she didn't have money to buy Christmas gifts for her children, and so George Wagner met her somewhere and gave her the presents and gave her money to pay her electric bills.

She said things nice things about the Wagners. Her father had had a medical issue, and she said, Frederica, you know, paid to keep utilities on. But after the road and murders, Samantha said, George's demeanor markedly changed. Frankie Roden was her first love, so she was already shaken by the news of his death, but George was less than consoling. Can you tell us after the homicide occurred, did you ever have contact with Jake or George or Angela or Billy

after the homicide murders? I got my car in May of twenty sixteen. I had went fishing with George a couple days later after getting my car, maybe a week after that, I'm sure if it was a couple of days for a week, okay, so approximately a month after the murders had happened. Yes, he went fishing. Yes? And who went fishing with you? Myself, my husband, and George? And can you tell us, first of all, if you noticed anything about George during that time? He wasn't the

same George that I knew. He looked very sad, very hurt, very lost, very dead inside. He didn't have the crooked smile that he always had, so you knew him to be more Joe vile or happy or bubbly bubbly? Yes, and how did that strike you? That night when we were fishing, we were going to stay there all night. It actually started a lightning, and he said, I don't fish in a lightning, So we honestly started to pack up. I had said something Frankie had popped in my mind.

I don't remember exactly what I had said, and I just started ramdingle and started questioning, you know, can you believe this has happened? They're gone, They're never coming back. I was pretty much told to shock a half up more on that next time. For more information on the case and relevant photos, follow us on Instagram at Katie Underscore Studios. The Piked and Masker is produced by Stephanie Lydecker, Jeff Shane, Alan Wieterer, Andrew Arnow, Gabriel Castillo and me

Courtney Armstrong. Editing and sound designed by Jeff Tua. Music by Jared Aston. The Piked and Masker is a production of iHeartRadio and Kati Studios. For more podcasts from my Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. I'm Carol Fisher and I'm hosting a podcast called The girl Friends. It's Las Vegas, it's the nineteen nineties, and it is time to find a husband. There were four Jewish doctors

who were felt to be eligible batch. One of them was up Barrenmout. On paper, he was perfect, but in reality, this guy's a wacko. He choked it to the point she went unconscious. I would call him and I would say, I know you killed my sister. You can listen to The Girlfriends on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. This is the story of a man who's fascinated me. His name was Sweet Daddy Grace,

and that's a name you don't forget. He was a visionary who built a fortune as a black man during Jim Crow during the Depression. But today not many people know about him. The race sort of wiped out, and I wonder if this was done intentionally. Listen to Sweet Daddy Grace on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Free and I'm Rthie. We have spent the last twenty years building and working at some of the largest companies in the world. We

worked with some remarkable people Rob mclenny. When I see the people of Wrexham, I grew up exactly like them. Check out the R the Intrarm Show. That is a R D HI and s R I R A M Show. Listen to The Art instry M Show on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts from iHeart Podcasts and Nomadic Engine. The acclaimed dramatic thriller returns after Shock season two. She's like a Ghost. We

had an agreement to keep each other's secret. None of you are making decisions to keep the rest of us safe, which leaves me I'm asking for your forgiveness. After Shock season two, starring Sarah Wayne Kelly's David Harbor and Jeffrey Dean Morgan. Listen to after Shock on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.