Jake Wagner On the Stand

I'm hosting a podcast called The Girlfriends. It's Las Vegas, it's the nineteen nineties, and it is time to find a husband. There were four Jewish doctors who were felt to be eligible bachelors. One of them was of the Baron bat On paper he was perfect, but in reality, this guy's a wacko. He shouted to the point went unconscious. I would call him and I would say, I know you killed my sister. You can listen to The Girlfriends on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you

get your podcasts. LA is expansive. There's nearly ten million people living here and it comes with a lot of noise, but if you tune those sounds out and listen close, you'll hear the real LA. What a Barjim, I'm going to be your father? You're feeling? This a fiction podcast mixtape about love. Listen to it on the iHeartRadio app,

Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. Toxico respond experiences Fico in First five California Pultuco Lilly said, well, you know, if you kill her, you're gonna have to kill Chris and Frankie because they will know you get it and they will come after you. Jake testified George was in a firing position. Jake said he told him to shoot, but he didn't. Jake takes the rifle from George, and then when Chris shows up in the doorway, he

shoots him. What really stood out to me, it was just the way he talked about killing people like it was no big deal. This is the piked Masacre returned to Pike County season four, episode eighteen. Jake Wagner on the stand. I'm Courtney Armstrong, a television producer at Katie's studio with Stephanie Lydecker and Jeff Shane. It's important to note that George Wagner the Fourth pleaded not guilty to all charges. His father, Billy Wagner, whose trial is upcoming,

also pleaded not guilty to all charges. At the beginning of the eighth week of testimony, I traveled to Ohio to be in the courtroom when jurors heard from the man who seems to be at the center of this trial, Jake Wagner. In April of twenty twenty one, on the five year anniversary of the murders, Jake pled guilty to eight counts of aggravated murder and agreed to testify against

his own family, including his older brother George. In exchange, the prosecution removed the death penalty as a possible punishment for all. Wagner's judge, Randy Deering, allowed Jick Wagner to opt out from having his testimony recorded. That's why we will not hear Jake Wagner's voice in this episode. Still, his testimony is chilling, dramatic testimony in Pike County Today, brother versus Brother Today, Jake Wagner took the stand against

George Wagner the Fourth. When Jake Wagner entered the courtroom, both his hands and feet were shackled with long chain manacles. He wore thick black glasses and a prison issued tan jumpsuit. His hair was slicked back and in a ponytail. I was not surprised to see him in jail clothes. You know, a lot of the reporters had been speculating that, oh, maybe they'll put him in street clothes. And I just thought to myself, I've never seen an inmate testify was

put in street clothes. I mean, the prosecution wanted these people to be seen at least Jake and Angela as criminals. Now twenty nine years old, Jake Wagner has been in the Franklin County jail for nearly four years. The only noticeable change in his appearance as he looked stronger. He looked fitter than the thin, gangly man he was before his arrest. He looks like a different person now you see as a teenager, suddenly you got a con sitting there at the big table there in a a courthouse. It's

an understatement to say Jake Wagner's testimony has been highly anticipated. Unsurprisingly, the courtroom was packed. This is me speaking with Stephanie from Ohio. Was anybody on the Wagner side that you could identify, or was it still a total no show for George. There wasn't a seat to be had completely filled, including extra seats that were put into the aisles, so that was just getting in. So it felt unlike any other day in the trial so far. It was a

real buzz. There appeared to be no one there for George Wagner. A lot of the people outside of the media and victims family members were family members of the attorneys on the prosecution and defense sides. That's interesting because you never would really think that that's who would come, but this is their big moment, so for family members of the lawyer, that does make sense. After Jake took the stand, he looked directly at his brother George from

across the room and smiled. For a brief moment. They made eye contact the first time in years before George looked away. Here's reporter a Jeanette Levy, who was in the courtroom. I was sitting right behind George and George made eye contact with him, but I don't think it was for very long. Was pretty short lived, and Jake just kind of, you know, he kept looking around a little bit like he was very it was almost kind

of like this alert look. He kept turning his head, looking back and forth, and you know, then things started. The questioning started. Prosecutor Angiekaneppa started by asking Jake if it was difficult to testify against his own family. He said it was very difficult. When he was asked, would you love nothing more for your brother, your mother, and your father to be able to go home? And he

said yes. The only other emotion Jake appeared to show that morning was when he mouthed quote, I am sorry, in the direction of the Roden family sitting in the courtroom. Then he calmly and with little emotion, walked Jers through the killings. During more than six hours of detailed testimony, Jake Wagner explained why he wanted to kill Hannah Rodin, the mother of his child. With Jake Wagner, what's fascinating about him is that he's kind of the doorway into

what can be described only as a horror show. It's not just the night of the home songs, it's everything waiting up to it's the life but these people led In the year's proceeding, Jake Wagner detailed how his family's criminal activity began long before they were arrested for the Roden, Manly and Gilly murders. Prosecutor and JIW. Kaneppa asked Jake Wagner about the various homes and vehicles his family owned.

We found out through Jake Wagner's testimony today that he, his brother, and his father would commit crimes together, including multiple arsons to collect insurance money and stealing high priced item from businesses. Jake admitted that his parents set fire to their own home on Bethelhill Road to collect the insurance benefits. He also testified that the Wagner's torched multiple

vehicles for the same reason. Jake said they would steal everything from fuel, to building materials to livestock, also that he learned to pick a lock at a very young age. Here again is Law on Crime reporter and Gjeanette Levy. She's followed by forensic investigator Joseph Scott Morgan. They were taught these things so that they could get away with crimes, and not necessarily so they could be like good human beings.

I mean, they were raised to be criminals. It's quite sad when you listen to them talk about how their dad would sit them down with like a lock pick set when they were seven, nine years old something like that, and teach them how to pick locks, and weird games about oh, if you were out and about and you

spot a cop, you get a dollar. When you hear about the way that Jake grew up, where he was essentially discipled into a life of crime, Billy described it as he was teaching his boy survival skills, you know, how to essentially steal a car or hot wire car in case he ever got quote unquote kidnapped. And I'm thinking, you know, I don't know if any parent out there that sits around and thinks, well, let me tell my child how to steal a car in case they ever

get kidnapped. I wonder. I wonder where all changes in tire rotations came in, you know, did you at least talk about that first, you know, And he's saying this, he's saving this from the stand, and you're really getting a peek behind the curtain at this life that they led. Jake told the courtroom his relationship with Hannah ma Rodin began when she was just thirteen years old. He said he met Hannah at the Pike County Fair, where she

was showing off her p rabbits. Despite being four years older than Hannah, Jake asked her parents, Dana and Chris Rodin, if he could date her. At times their relationship was violent. Prosecutor Angie Kaneppa asked Jake if he ever choked his young girlfriend, as Hannah May had once claimed, and he said, I never choked her, and he was very like adamant about it, and he said, she was having a fit, and you know, I held her up against the wall and I put my arm on her collar bone, but

I didn't choke her. I just held her there until she calmed down. And after he gave that answer, he kind of, like Angie Kaneppa kind of made a sighing noise, but it was just like he was talking about this like, oh, I didn't choke her. I was just you know, holding her there. It was like this minimization or justification or rationalization for basically holding your ex girlfriend against a wall because she was upset about something. And you know he's

claiming he didn't choke her. Well, Hannah May saying he choked her like that his arm was on her throat. So some of these things were pretty strange to me, the way he would describe them. By age fifteen, Hannahme Rodent was pregnant and gave birth to her daughter she shared with Jake Wagner. Her tumultuous relationship with Jake ended in February of twenty fifteen, a little more than a

year before the murders. Jake Wagner described his family's motive and one of the worst massacres in Ohio's history that led to the death of eight members of the Rodent family. After their relationship broke up, Jake testified that he and his mother, Angela began to have concerns about the safety of his daughter, who was living with the Rodents. This was true in particular after Hannah May started dating Corey Holdron,

who Jake believed was dealing drugs. Jake said he was concerned his daughter wouldn't be safe living with the Rodents, even going as far as saying he was concerned would be molested. Since he said it happened in both his family and Hannah's family, Jake testified that his mother, Angela Wagner,

was monitoring Hannah May's private Facebook conversations. Jake's concern for his daughter only grew when he became aware of an online conversation where Hannah said the only way she would give up custody of their daughter is if the Wagner's killed her First. Wagner said that his father, Billy Wagner, first mentioned a murder plot, but he would not let

it happen. Jake testified he told Hannah he was concerned that their daughter could be molested, and he claims that Hannah was dismissive, saying, quote, if that happens, we'll just have to deal with it. That alleged response, Jake Wagner told the court was the tipping point. Jake Wagner said, by the winter of twenty fifteen and twenty sixteen, he was concerned that his daughter with Hannah Rodin might be molested, so he decided his only choice to protect his daughter

was actually to kill Hannah. The prosecution says basically that that was made up, this fear that the little girl would be molested. The prosecution basically says that was something they kind of whipped up in their heads to justify

what they wanted to do. And we get earlier in the trial of seeing text messages or Facebook messages where Hanname and Jake were talking about their child, and it was just amazing to me that in some points he would say things like I'll take her even if I have to do it by force, just some really eerie foreshadowing. So it just seemed to me that they for whatever reason, and everybody wants their children to be with them, but this seems to be some type of demand, like, no,

this child is going to be with me. Once he made up as mine that Hannah may had to be killed, Jake testified that the Wagner family began to plan and plot. His first idea was to frame Hannah's boyfriend, Corey Holdron. Here's James Pilcher, longtime investigative reporter in Cincinnati, now with Local twelve. He's followed by Long Crimes and Jeanette Levy.

Jake was convinced that something needed to be done, that they were going to kill Hannah and Corey and make it look like a murder suicide, and Billy said, no, you can't do that either, because they'll figure out it was awesome, they'll come after us. I don't want somebody up there on the hill with a sniper rifle killing us Billy said, well, you know, if you kill her, you're gonna have to kill Chris and Frankie because they will know who you did it and they will come

after you. So it was just this insane like, oh yeah, I mean you're gonna kill well, we're gonna kill her. We got to kill everybody else too. We're going to take a break. We'll be back in a moment. Oh. I'm Carol Fisher, and I'm hosting a podcast called The girl Friends. Back in the nineteen nineties in Las Vegas, a few of us dated the most eligible bachelor in town, Bob. He spoke several languages, he did medical missionary work, and he was Jewish. He was perfect on paper, but he wasn't.

He really wasn't, he shouted into the point she went unconscious. Bob could lie about anything, but only takes the one time when somebody ends up dead. Unfortunately for Bob, us girlfriends know how to fight back. I wanted him to pay for his crime. He needed to be put to justice. I'll be honest with you. If I saw him right now, I'd spit on him. I would call him and I would say, I know you killed my sister. I will

always hound you and haunt you. You can listen to The girl Friends on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. They say history is written by the victors, but you know what they've left out a hell of a lot of juicy stuff. Date Abe Lincoln's assassination. Did you know a young couple was sitting right next to him when he was shot? It haunted the husband so much he later murdered his wife. Ah, we all know who invented that, right, and we'll think again.

Truth is Alexander Graham. Bell stole the idea for the telephone and then claimed it as his own. For every pivotal moment in history, there's always a backstory, and it's usually way more interesting than the big story. From mysterious murders to the baffling sleep schedules of yesteryear to the fascinating lives of those just outside the limelight. Where going to uncover the forgotten pieces of history you didn't know

you need it to know. Listen to the Backstory Rate with Me Patty Steele twice a week on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello, Hello, Malcolm Gladwell here, host of Revisionous History, a show about the overlooked and the misunderstood stories you won't hear anywhere else like our ongoing obsessive campaign to blow up the

world's most focus college ranking system. Why not just throw in a few extra zeros or witness me after years of fancy public speaking, learning that I kind of have to start over. The tone that you had throughout the debate was very similar to some of the students that I do work with, and that's what I teach them

not to do. We're making more revisionous history for you this year than ever from places all across this great country emergency rooms, huge theaters, small towns and shooting righteous and you want to put your thumb up like the US Are you gonna pull the trigger with this finger? Here? Okay, into revisionist history on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm your host, Billy Man, and this is okay. Let's try again, getting closer, guys.

This is my podcast. Yeah, I've set up. I've been a Grammy nominated record producer and entrepreneur for over thirty years, and that has put me in the room with some of the most successful individuals in the world. Kelly Rowland, Jill Cartman, Rinale Scoldsberry, Allie and agent Miss Gillies in here. You want somebody who's a you'll come to the right place. What I wanted to do was have honest conversations with them about their failures. I wasn't just changing jobs. My

life was over. I was so close to getting fired. I was failing so bad, it said Kelly Rowland is no longer a viable artist. That really did a number on me. He said, you're boring, So get that hell out of my club. Even the most successful people deal with feelings of failure. But what they do is they embrace their up and they learn from it. Listen to Yeah, I've that up on the radio app, Apple podcast or

wherever you get your podcasts, Jake said. The Wagner spent three months preparing, buying everything from ammunition to shoes from Walmart to a device to jam phone calls. Jake even order to Captain Americo Winter Soldier mask, specifically for his brother George to wear. Jake Wagner said that his brother George, who's on trial, was with him when he bought a pickup truck and a false truck bed cover for those killings. On the afternoon of April twenty first, Billy Wagner told

his sons this would be the night. Four days earlier, Hannah Rodin had given birth to her second child, so they knew she would be home. Billy Wagner also believed the cloudy weather would prevent surveillance satellites from tracking their movements. Wager said he dyed his hair a dark brown like a character during the movie Boondocks. Saints. Wagner said, before heading out, he watched a clip of the movie to quote psyche myself into what I was about to do next.

Jake Wagner described how he walked barefoot to the truck to avoid tracking any dirt from his home. Here again, forensic expert Joseph Scott Morgan, we had longed to hear about what happened that night, what went into the planning. You know, I was particularly interested in the care that Jake talked about with walking barefoot when he went back to the vehicle. He wanted to prevent any kind of

prints being left behind. He had enough sense about that, and he even knew about soil types, which is fascinating me because you know, there's an entire discipline. He's not a dummy. He was aware of that, he had a sensitivity to it. I think it's another kind of point along the continuum that goes to kill, because that's a premeditative factor. Then Jake described how they went from house

to house killing eight people. Jake described how his father, Billy, as well as George all took part in these murders on that night, and he went into detail, describing that they modified the bed of their truck in order to hide George and himself in the back while his father drove them to the Rodents trailers. Once at the Roden's property on Union Hill Road, Billy Wagner lured Chris Roden outside.

Jake said the plan was to shoot Chris Senior as he and Billy walked back towards the Roden's marijuana grow site, but the shot never came. Prosecutors were asking if George was going to be involved in the killings. Jake said yes. Jake testify the George was actually supposed to kill Chris Roden Senior. Jake testified George was in a firing position. Jake said he told him to shoot, but he didn't.

After a few minutes outside, Chris Senior and Billy Wagner went back into the trailer where Chris's cousin, Gary Roden was. After a few minutes, Billy was able to convince Chris to come to the door one more time, and the killing spree began again. Investigative reporters James Pilcher and an Seinette Levy Jake takes the rifle from George and then when Chris shows up in the doorway, he shoots him with the s cast and he says he missed or

couldn't get a shot. He missed the first shot that went above him, and then he'd lowered it, closed his eyes and just pulled off a bunch of shots. And that's later corroborated by the evidence where you see all of these other bullet holes all around the doorframe where he missed, but then obviously on the line hit Chris in the shoulder, in the belly, in the arm. I'll

never forget seeing that autopsy photo of the arm. What really stood out to me it was just the way he talked about killing people like it was no big deal. You would think after you maybe fired the first shot at somebody's head, you might flinch, but it doesn't sound like there was any flinching on Jake's part. Inside, Billy Wagner killed Gary Rodin and fired several more shots into Chris Senior's body. Jake Wagner said his father came running

out of the house in a quote nervous breakdown. Jake said that Billy came out and was freaking out, and he was like, you can't freak out now, it's too late. There's no turning back. Jake went through Chris Roden's Senior's pockets and grabbed the keys to the marijuana shed so he could remove the hard drive from the security system. When Jake returned to the trailer, he said Chris and Gary Roden's bodies have been moved into the back bedroom.

Jake testified he threw a blanket on top of them, but admitted to the jury that he didn't know why. Throughout his testimony, Jake appeared calm and responsive, and several times throughout it he would even look at his brother George. However, I can say that George would avert his gaze multiple times and appeared to not even want to look at his brother. Next, the Wagners went to Frankie Roden's home. Jake said after he crawled through a window, he let

his brother and father in through the front door. Frankie Roden's three year old was lying on the couch. Jake said he walked past the sleeping child to the back bedroom and shot Frankie Rodin in his head as he slept. He further testified that Frankie's fiance, Hannah Hazel Gilly, began to wake and Jake said he shot her too. Then, for no explained reason, Billie Wagner shot both Frankie and Hannah Hazel Gilly in the head as well. Their six

month old son was sleeping between them. It was quite chilling in a way, and I feel like that word is sometimes overused, but just the matter of fact way in which he described shooting people, it was just very nonchalant, according to Jake. Then he his brother, George, and father Billy Wagner went to Dana Roden's home. She had just arrived home from work. The door was unlocked, and Jake said he just walked in. He was surprised to see

Dana awake in her bed. Here again, investigative reporter Anjeanette Levy. He's literally standing in the hallway, and he said he can see inside Dana's bedroom from where he was standing, and then he could also turn his head and see inside Hannah May's bedroom. He could see that Dana was on her cell phone. He could see the light from her cell phone shining on her face. And she made it.

She looked at him and made a gasp, and he said he took a step and he shot her like I think twice, and then he took and then he pivoted. He said he was at a pivot point. He moved into Hannah May's bedroom. She made a noise, she saw him, and he shot her in the head. And then he went back and he shot Dana again. There was no hesitation on his part. It was just really disturbing. Before leaving, Jake said he realized Hannah's forty old newborn was in

the room and was concerned she might starve. He said, you know, I know it doesn't really makes sense, but I didn't want to starve. I thought that if you know, it took too long for them to find the bodies, he might starve. So I moved Hannah so she could breastfeed. I mean, it's a newborn baby. Newborn babies are helpless as can be. And just that weird thought that you thought a four or five day old baby is going to nurse off her dead mother. It's just so crazy.

Jake Wagner then walked into Chris Roden Junior's bedroom and shot him point blank. Jake said then that he, his brother George, and father Billy drove to Kenneth Roden's home where his father Billy killed him. He was the final victim, and he was murdered with one gunshot. According to Jake's testimony, the Wagner's collected shell casings, cell phones and returned to their home on Peterson Road. Here's Jeff speaking with attorney and legal analyst Mike Allen on the impact of Jake

Wagner's chilling testimony. I'm just curious, like what your take on those impactful moments are and how they kind of changed the course of this trial moving forward. His testimony appeared credible to me. It didn't sound like he was puffing it up or exaggerating it to a great degree. And I just think he was believable. And do you think that level of gory detail like Hannah Rodan's last moments. Does that move the jury in a way that none

of the other stuff has probably up until this moment. Absolutely, absolutely, I'm sure those jurors were riveted hearing that testimony, because, I mean, you know, that's the guts of the whole thing. Again, you know, that's why everyone is there, the judge, the jurors, the prosecutor, the defense lawyer is because of what he did, what Jake did at that time, and it's just a real,

real important part of the trial. In the aftermath of Jake Wagner's first day of testimony, the media pool filed with Judge Randy Deering to allow cameras in the courtroom for the rest of Jake's testimony. The media argued that the public had a right to see and hear all of the testimony in the most expensive murder investigation in their state's history. Under Ohio law, witnesses can object to

being filmed or recorded. In early October, an Ohio Court of Appeal sided with the media outlets who challenged the law, striking down parts of it, but Judge Deering continued to allow witnesses to opt out, as is his Right after Jake Wagner's first day of testimony, a coalition of media groups hired a first Amendment rights lawyer to visit the issue. A hearing was scheduled for the next day. Here's James Pilcher.

Another eventful day here in Waverley as Jake Wagner, the younger brother of defendant George Wagner, took the stand for the second straight day to testify against his brother. Inside the courtroom, prosecutor angiw Kinneppa asked Jake Wagner to describe what he and his family did after arriving at home immediately following the murders. Today's testimony were picked up right where they left off Monday, where Jake, Billy, and George had returned home from the killings at about four to

thirty am on April twenty second. Now, he says on that night they actually drove back to their family barn and began burning their clothes to get rid of any evidence on them. Jake also says he took each of their guns and began cutting them in half with power tools, and even went so far as to try burning them with a torch. However, Jake said he was unable to melt down the weapons, so instead he burnt off the

serial numbers and then hit them. Then he admitted to burying pieces of the guns in the barn underneath the support beam, which he dug up with help from George. Once they were done cleaning up, they went inside to change clothes. Jake said he saw his mother, Angelo Agner, in the kitchen, but did not speak with her. Later in the morning, friend Andrew Carson called Jake and asked if he'd heard what happened. Jake said he had seen

it on the news. Once news of the rodent's death began to spread, Jake says he refused to speak about it with his family while in private, and even tried to forget about it completely out of guilt. Let's stop here for another break. Several weeks after the murder, as Jake said, BCI agents came to the Wagner's home. It was after this visit that the Wagners began to worry

they were under surveillance. Billy Wagner decided they should dig up the weapons and place them into a concrete bucket and drop them into a lake on his parents' property. The weapons remained underwater until the Wagners were arrested in twenty eighteen. The best plead bargain in the state of Ohio. It is how the defense described the deal that Jake Wagner made to avoid the death penalty. On the third day of Jake Wagner's testimony, the defense took over questioning immediately.

George Wagner's attorney, John Parker, tried to paint Jake as a liar who turned on his own brother to avoid the death penalty. Many and the jury were poised in their seats. As a defense attorney, John Parker said, you got off the hook for the death penalty for killing the Rodents, yet your brother, who you admit did not kill any of them, is still facing death. Parker quickly asked him question after question to poke holes in Jake's

account of the massacre. The defense argued during its cross examination that Jake Wagner murdered everyone and that George tried to stop the murders. The defense read quotes from Jake's statements to investigators that said George didn't like the idea whatsoever. He thought of Hannah as a sister. He said he didn't want to do it. Don't trust Dad. He decided to go because he was thinking Dad was trying to

set me up. Then the defense led Jake through each step of the massacre as he smiled at the strangest times. After the second day of Jake Wagner's testimony, I spoke with Jeff and Stephanie. Something that really struck me from Jake's first day of testimony was his attempted interaction with the Roden family, mouthing I'm sorry, or trying to make eye contact with George. Did you see any of that and what was that like in person? If you did, No,

there really wasn't any of that. Upon cross examination, I believe the attorney mentioned did three or four times because it was so pronounced. Was Jake's smiling slash smirking, the same thing that we all noticed and commented on when he pled guilty, specifically when he was asked about killing Hannah Rodin and he kind of smirked. And what Jake did was acknowledge. He said, I know this is a very serious matter. It's not funny. It's just something happened.

Anyone who knows me knows that I smile at the worst moments, right like when they're watching the Bundac Saints clip in court. He's smiling, at least that's what I read the defense attorney. He had an interesting way of getting to say stuff, And what it appeared to be was that the defense attorney was kind of doing everything he could to get Jake to contradict himself, even in

small ways from what he has laid out. So as an example, he said, oh, so you shot Hannah rode In, the mother of your child, in the back of the head. He said, no, I shot her in the front of the head and was smiling. So is he just a sociopath or just as horrible social skills? I mean, what's your Obviously can't diagnose him, but I hadn't realized the extent of just how long everything took. For example, and here are a couple of things that came to light today.

They actually stopped. They being Billy, Jake, and George. They made a stop on the way to Chris Roden's house. What and Billy was driving, Jake was under he had constructed in the back bed of the car. He had constructed a wooden platform and put bales of hay under it, and was underneath that to hide. So he could lie in wait to then sniper under the car. On the drive there, Billy pulled over and said, are you sure

you want to go through at this? You know now the time to turnaround if dot And the answer was to just continue on shocking. Later, the courtroom was shown some of the graphic crime scene photos. Jake admitted that he had tried to block the gruesome images from his mind. Can you imagine having to look at those photos now with distance, knowing that you were the perpetrator, But it's a different perspective you're seeing it in a photograph. Has

he seen crime photos yet? Yes? On cross examination, the attorney was reminding Jake. He said, you have seen pictures of Kenneth Roden, who was shot one time in the eye, the similarity of just as Hannah Gilly was shot straight through the eye. And Jake said, oh, when I look at the photos, I try I don't want to look at any of the wounds. I try not to. Tony said why, and he said, because I don't want that to be in my memory, you know. Tony said, well,

that must be really nice. Hanname Rowden's final moment was him smiling at her. Can you imagine She's waking up, maybe allegedly in her bed, nursing her child, and you see your ex smiling at you. Those are her final moments. At the end of Jake Wagner's testimony, George Wagner's defense attorney John Parker once again asked Jake if he was a stone cold killer. Jake said yes. Parker accused Jake Wagner of selling his testimony to the State of Ohio

and implicating George to save his own life. Jake insisted he had provided truthful testimony. Parker then said, while waving his hand, dismissively. Take him away, Judge, no further question here again. Legal analyst Mike Allen on the impact of George Wagner's three days of testimony. Nobody was contending, not the defense certainly, and not the prosecution, that George shot anyone. That was never the case. I mean, the closest he got, according to the testimony, was he was supposed to pull

the trigger on one of them, but he couldn't. And then Jake had to do it. What the State of Ohio had to show, and I watched this closely. They had to show that George was a part of the preparation for the murder murders. He was a part of the execution, although somewhat a small part in the execution of the murders, but he was a really big part in the aftermath with respect to disposing of evidence and things like that, and the state showed that. More on

that next time for Warren. For me on the case and relevant photos, follow us on Instagram at Katie Underscore Studios. The Piked and Masaker is produced by Stephanie Lydecker, Jeff Shane, Connor Powell, Andrew Arnow, Gabriel Castillo and me Courtney Armstrong. Editing and sound designed by Jeff ti Music by Jared Aston. The Piked and Masker is a production of iHeartRadio and

Katie Studios. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.