Closing in on the Wagners

I'm hosting a podcast called The Girlfriends. It's Las Vegas, it's the nineteen nineties, and it is time to find a husband. There were four Jewish doctors who were felt to be eligible bachelors. One of them was of the Baron bat On paper he was perfect, but in reality, this guy's a wacko. He shouted to the point went unconscious. I would call him and I would say, I know you killed my sister. You can listen to The Girlfriends on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get

your podcasts from iHeart Podcasts and Nomadic Engine. The acclaimed dramatic thriller returns after Shock season two. He's like a ghost. We had an agreement to keep each other's secret. None of you are making decisions to keep the rest of us safe, which leaves me. I'm asking for your forgiveness. After Shock season two, starring Sarah Wayne Kelly's, David Harbor and Jeffrey Dean Morgan listened to after Shock on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts? Hi,

I'm free and I'm rthy. We have spent the last twenty years building and working at some of the largest companies in the world. We worked with some remarkable people. Rob mclenny. When I see the people of Wrexham, I grew up exactly like them. Check out the art in Trurom show. That is a R D HI and s R I R a M show. Listen to the arc the Inustry I'm Show on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast Oh,

wherever you get to your podcast? Hey, No Billy sees something like ed Yeah, we're convansoning ads like in sealteen six. When are they going to point to George being part of this conspiracy? Hannah replies, I won't sign papers ever. It won't happen. They will have to kill me first. This is the Piked and Massacre Return to Pike County Season four, episode twelve, Closing in on the Wagners. I'm Courtney Armstrong, a television producer at KATI Studios with Stephanie

Lydecker and Jeff Shane. It's the middle of George Wagner the Fourth trial. It's important to note that George Wagner the Fourth, along with his father Billy Wagner, whose trial is upcoming, deny any wrongdoing and have pleaded not guilty to all charges. So far, there's been hours of testimony by investigators and relatives that have painted a very real

portrait of what the crime scenes look like. But while prosecutors have laid out the grizzly details of the murderers, they have yet to connect George Wagner the Fourth to the killings. We're stake side of the case is to stay ready to call another witness. Special Prosecutor and jaw Kineppa call Special Agent John Jenkins of the Ohio Bureau of Criminal Investigations more commonly known as the BCI. Jenkins sports a trimmed goatee and looks every bit the veteran

investigator he is. In twenty sixteen, just four months after the brutal murders, Jenkins interviewed the Wagner family's father, Billy. You can find Billy Wagner's raw audio of his conversation with special agents on our Apple Plus True Crime subscription. Page to that page is included in this episode's description. But today's attention turned to a police interview with the defendant's father, Billy Wagner. He was best friends with one

of the victims, Chris Roden. I mean his interview, he provide some insights that could not only help the prosecution, but could also be useful for the defense. BCI agents had spent months trying to speak to Billy Wagner. Jenkins

testified that Wagner seemed to be avoiding them. We want to talk to him because of the fact of his relationship with and Hannah, but also weird started to at this time get tips and leaves that there might have been some issues with some custody reference and that task became difficult due to the fact that when we stopped by the house, Billy wasn't always there. In September of twenty sixteen, BCI agents finally checked down Billy Wagner outside

a grocery store. It was this interview with Billy Wagner recording. Yes, it was audio recorded. If this time you runner, I would like to play that recording for the journey. I just want to talk with you about the road murders, okay, and so, um, you know, we've been out talking with people, you know, all kinds of you know, tips get called in our office and all that, and so your name has come up and you know, and tips and things like that. So we just want to tie I find

whatever you want to. Just be honest with us. I'll tell you whatever I can do to help get out. As the audio recordings began, Jenkins, wearing a blue blazer and white shirt, lowered his head and sat listening to the conversation. Billy Wagner was first asked about his relationship with Chris Roden Senior. Wagner insisted he and victim Chris Rodin were very close. You know, Chris was my best friend, all right, man, how you know we run around all the time. But we want to talk about career. Chris

don't talk. He didn't tell nobody nothing. He gave me the business to himself. And I want to take you straight up. I don't care what he done. He was my friend. He he done everything for me. Okay, you know, and Chris growed up hard, I mean scroubs for everything. He had worked his ass off and he worked every day. You know, his shit. They're making him out look at some damn big gangsters, a bunch of shit. Okay, okay, And now I wanted to talk with the other thing.

You know, he wasn't no saying, I say, but Chris never hurt nobody. I'll tell you whatever I can do to help get out. And we're not concerned about anything other than the murders. So you know, we've talked with different people. Different people have different involvement. You know. You know you've you've read the paper. Uh, you know you've seen the news. I'm not worried about all that. I'll

tell you whatever you need to know. Okay. I'm just saying, you know, there was gross down I'm want to take us off and no, right off the bat that you didn't know Chris a right. Most of the shit they're talking about it with a bunch of bullshit life. I mean, Chris he'd give you the shirt off. He's well, we've heard that, you know. He you know, he was absolutely you know, we're what nobody else like him? Oh, Chris,

like I said, he is my best friend. Wagner also said he and Chris Rodin had spoken the night he was killed. Last time my talk came and he's saying, go all right, was the night before all happened, and I said, hey, man, I'll folk he's more. And then next morning, you know, all hell broke. Los BCI agents asked Wagner who he thought committed the murderers. Billy Wagner floated the possibility that Chris Roden Senior might have vowed money to drug dealers. I ain't a bunch of hell

billys do something like that. And well, you know, sorry, never convinced me. You know, hat's like some fielteen to six. Okay, but your bottom feeding funds pitches right, Well yeah, you know, your bottom feeders. I mean every damn one up. I mean they're on that freaking ship. And I mean it killed r Dan Braham off the five up. Sure, and you know I hold Chrid, you know, got to fuck you know, shouldn't suck around fact shit you know, because it just and it ain't too much. You know who cared?

You know what happens to the dumb ass it's doing it, but you know it's a ship that they did. Investigators again press Billy Wagner about his relationship with victim Chris Roden Senior, specifically if they'd gotten into a fight a few weeks prior to the murders. We had heard, uh, someone had called and said and then listen, I'm not trying to I don't care. I don't care what you heard.

What are you play it on me? Day? Is that you or Chris actually got into a fight about a week or two prior to the murders and said that you'd pulled a gun on him. No, absolutely not, didn't happen. Good nap, Okay, Well, no, it's just saying that you've got into an argument with now and then you sort of then you pulled a gun on him now and

you said, yeah, I don't care anything about Chris. Throughout the nearly two hour conversa station, Wagner tried repeatedly to shift the investigator's attention away from himself and his family. You're looking in the wrong damn direction. You need to be going to every way. At one point, Billy Wagner even mentioned he'd heard Hannah Rodin was seeing a sheriff and said someone had seen a sheriff's car parked on Union Hill Road. Somebody said that she was singing a

deput sheriff up here in Waverley. I don't know who he is, and he every time I heard that there was a sheriff sitting at the end of Union Hill all night. So I don't know if that's I don't know, but that's just what I heard. Later, when agents mentioned the marijuana growing on Chris Roden's property, Billy Wagner denied any involvement in the drug business. Now, other people have told us that they thought that you and Chris were business partners. No, now, if Chris you know now, I

don't bullshit Chris. I don't care what Chris asked me to do. Yeah, if he asked me to do something, I'm good for him because he'd do anything for me, right, you know, he You just don't you don't want You can understand that, I understand if you know for he well me Christmas, you know, like I said, we're daylight dark all right, But well, you know pretty much. You know, if he want to go do something, we go. If I want to go do something, he can go with me.

You know, it didn't matter. So but so you never hold any weed for him? No, No, I hold a lot of cars for him, hauld a lot of cars, like would you hold him round go down drear down there and co parks and get him for him and bring him up. Investigators returned to rumors of illegal drugs and a possible drug deal that Chris Roden Senior was potentially involved with, and who Billy Wagner alleged might have

had a reason to kill Chris Roden Senior. It's important to note that George Wagner's allegations against Skid Montgomery are not substantiated. Here's Special Prosecutor Angie Kaneppa picking up her questioning of h and J. Nkins. There's talk in during that conversation between you and mister Wagner, and he keeps referring to a person named Latham. Yes, that's correct, and

can you tell us who Latham is? Sure? So that during that interview, mister Wagner, as you've heard, but would keep referring to an individual name La Latham and basically who he was referring to as an individual named Skid Montgomery.

Skid Montgomery lives in around the Lathamrea owns a lot of property in the in the Pike County area, and we'd learned through the investigation that there was always rumor that Skid Montgomery was a big, large scale marijuana dealer and that he would put hits out on people and especial agent Jenkins obviously, Billy talked to you about an alleged business deal where Chris was expected to get a large chunk of marijuana and indicated that it would represent

a lot of money and they would put people out of business. Correct, that's correct, Okay, and specifically indicated that he felt that that would be upsetting to Latham slash Skid mcgomy. That's correct. Yes, here's Stephanie and Jeff. It's very compelling to hear the voice of accused father Billy Wagner. Hearing this interview that has been spoken about so often

was fascinating. Some people say that he was rambling in this interview and trying to lead investigators in a different direction and throw some tidbits at them to get them off his track, but frankly, in listening to it, I thought he felt pretty common cooperative. He was just being stopped outside of a grocery store and cut two. He's

in a two hour interview. Based on what we've heard about the Wagger's movements after the murders, I think it stands to reason that they probably weren't anticipating talking to law enforcement at some point and probably had a bit of a script or a plan for when that did happen.

I mean, because Billy very quickly was throwing out unsubstantiated rumors about nineteen year old victim Hannah may Or, pointing away from himself towards the GROW operation and even bringing up Skid Montgomery like he already had a litany of things that he was going to kind of try to throw at the police to get the scent off of him and his family. Interesting that you should say that,

because yes, you're right. On the one hand, he's saying that Chris Senior was his very best friend and he would do anything for him, and that Chris would do anything for him, and to your point, on the other hand, he's essentially throwing him under the bus by pointing to the Grow operation and denying that there was ever a big fight between them regarding custody and kind of bringing

him again back to Skid Montgomery. Even just hearing the name Latham aka Skid Montgomery, and it legitimately makes the hairs in the back of my next stand up because we've been given this name so many times, both from listeners and people in and around the area. And again, Skid Montgomery is a very prominent landowner in Pike County and now here's Billy basically accusing him. Is this just Billy getting him off his tracks, or is it possible

that there are some truth to that. I have to assume that we're going to hear from Skid Montgomery at some point, and that he'll be a witness. I also thought it was interesting that Billy says there was a sheriff at the bottom of the road that whole night

that he had heard rumors of. That is he referring to Sheriff Reader, And if so, I also have to assume that Sheriff Reader at some point will testify at this trial because his name comes up all the time, and as we know, he's currently serving time for unrelated charges for taking drug money illegally and using it for gambling, again completely unrelated. Nobody has associated him with these murders,

but again these names keep coming up. Well stuff. This is certainly an interesting preview of the trial to come, as we know Billy Wagner has pled not guilty and as a waiting trial, and so this is maybe just a little bit of a sneak peek at his upcoming legal proceedings. Also, even just him saying that me and Chris were best friends and that we were like daylight and dark. I thought that would have such a curious statement,

which one does he see himself as. Despite efforts to shift the focus away from himself and his family, investigators walked away from their conversation with Billy Wagner with more questions than answers. Here's legal analyst Mike Allen. He didn't help himself listening to it. I really don't know what he was trying to do. I mean, obviously he was trying to shift the focus away from him and his family. I don't think he was very successful with it. That

happens all the time. These people, some of them, they deceived themselves into thinking that, you know, they're the smartest criminal in the world. And you know they'll say, well, if I say this to the police, or if I say something else to the police, there, that'll throw him off the trail. Doesn't happen. We're going to take a break. We'll be back in a moment. Oh. I'm Carol Fisher, and I'm hosting a podcast called The Girlfriends. Back in the nineteen nineties in Las Vegas, a few of us

dated the most eligible bachelor in town, Bob. He spoke several languages, he did medical missionary work, and he was Jewish. He was perfect on paper, but he wasn't. He really wasn't. He shouted to the point she went unconscious. Bob could lie about anything, but only takes the one time when somebody ends up dead. Unfortunately for Bob, us girlfriends know how to fight back. I wanted him to pay for his crime. He needed to be put to justice. I'll be honest with you. If I saw him right now,

I'd spit on him. I would call him and I would say, I know you killed my sister. I will always hound you and haunt you. You can listen to The Girlfriends on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello, Hello, Malcolm Glabell here, host of Revisionist History, a show about the overlooked and the misunderstood stories you won't hear anywhere else, like our ongoing obsessive campaign to blow up the world's most focus college

ranking system. Why not just throw in a few extras or witness me after years of fancy public speaking, learning that I kind of have to start over. The tone that you had throughout the debate was very similar to some of the students that I do work with, and that's what I teach them not to do. We're making more revisionist history for you this year than ever from places all across this great country emergency rooms, huge theaters, small towns, and shooting righteous and you want to put

your thumb up like the US. Are you gonna pull the trigger with this finger here? Okay? Listen to Revisionist History on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts from iHeart podcasts. Whitney, Hell is going on here? Everyone has their limits. I never confronted a situation like this. I just thought it was just a really terrible immoral thing align they won't cross. I was stunned.

And I just said, no, we're killing people. You may never have to face that decision when you find yourself at that line out ricin ars ricin, and somebody needs to just for once give everybody the whole truth. I'm like, this is evil and the only person who can sound the alarm is you. I wasn't just going to sit silently. Buy from iHeart Podcasts. These are the whistleblowers. If you are disloyal thinks are going to happen to this week out disgrace to our gun. Evil place should be prosecute.

When power corrupts, conscience is the last line of defense. I'm Miles Taylor. Listen to the Whistleblowers on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. My name's Laverne Cox. I'm an actress, producer, fashionista, and host of The Laverne Cox Show. You may remember my award winning first season. I've been pretty busy. There's always time to touch incredible about important things. People like me have been screaming for years. We've got to watch the Supreme Court.

What they're doing is wrong, what they're doing is evil. They will take things away and I can only hope that Dobbs is that like Pearl Harbor moment, girl, you and I both know what it took to just get through the day in New York City and get home in one piece. And so the fact that we're here and what you've achieved and what I've achieved, you know, that's momentous. It's not just sitting around complaining about some bills.

The only reason that you might think, as Chase said, that we're always miserable is because people are constantly attacking us and we're constantly noticing it. Listen to the Laverne Cox Show on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Be sure to subscribe and share. The investigative trail was beginning to point directly to the

Wagner family, though not necessarily to defendant George Wagner. Here's longtime investigative reporter James Pilcher and Cincinnati Now with Local twelve. When are they going to point to George being part of this conspiracy? Because none of the physical evidence that they presented early on had any of the Wagners to any of these crime scenes. Outside the courtroom, questions were being asked about the prosecution's ability to link George Wagner

to the murders. That to me is the major issue here, right. I've been going for days in this trial, lots of evidence, lots of witnesses, but honestly, we have yet to hear any connection of George the fourth to these crimes. Following Special Agent John Jenkins testimony, the defense requested for the third time in the trial there should be a mistrial. The defense argued the tapes of Special Agent jenkins interview with Billy Wagner should never have been played before the jury.

The defense argued the tapes had nothing to do with George Wagner and that the interview did not establish any proof of a CONSPI years to commit aggravated murder. Special Prosecutor Angiekuneppa said that wasn't why the state played the interview with Billy Wagner at his son George's trial. Instead, she wanted the jury to see how BCI investigators ended

up focusing on the Wagner family. Of course, he's a really emotions previously made on the record for miss trial and to include the tape or to strike the tape, is defense council and the state ready to bring the jury up. Judge during ruled against the motion for a mistrial, and the prosecution called for the second time. BCI analyst Julia Evislage. The agent has long brown hair and is wearing a maroon red jacket. Evislage is sworn in and

questioned by Special Prosecutor Angie Kaneppa. Good afternoon. How are you good afternoon? If you want to go ahead and state your name again just for the record, Julia Evislage, okay, And you previously testified in this case. Correct, that's correct, okay. And we've already discussed with you your current role at the Bureau of Criminal Investigations and your work in this case, specifically in analyzing records and other things that came that

were obtained personnant to both subpoenas and search warrants. Correct, yes, okay. And can you tell us when you go through records and such, is that information that you then share with the investigative team, yes, okay, and in your experiences that then inform their investigation in people that they're willing in or willing out. Yes, okay. And can you tell us, miss visual agent in this case, did you guys obtain

Facebook records of the victims. Yes. One of our cyber crimes agents obtained a search warrant for all of the Facebook accounts of the victims, and we review those once the responses came in from Facebook. On the screen above evislage, prosecutors pull up a spreadsheet of messages taken from Hannah Roden's Facebook account. Each entry is labeled with the time and date of the exchange. During that review of those Facebook records, did you find information in the Facebook account

belonging to Hannah May Roden? Yes? And can you tell

us why were they noteworthy to you? When we first started looking at Hannah's Facebook, we found some statements in there and some of her messages that seemed to be in direct conflict with things that we had heard and interviews, particularly with Jake Wagner's interview, and we noted just different different statements about abuse in the relationship, issues with the Wagner's being controlling, things like that, and then just her kind of sense of discomfort with the situation with the

custody of Okay and fears that they were trying to take here again Stephanie and Jeff. Last episode, we heard, among others, Tabitha Clayton, George Wagner's ex wife's testimony and her correspondence between Hannah May Rodin and herself before she

was murdered. Well, yeah, what's interesting about this is the messages between Hannah May and Tabitha, Georgia's ex wife talk about the fears of losing custody and the Wagner family making the young women signed documents that they don't want to be signed, kind of basically being coerced into signing. Attempted guardianship fraud was uncovered in the Pine County murder trial. Take a closer look at your screen here. I want

to show you something that's on that document. At the bottom of it, you can see a u RL to a website and there's a date on the paper. It shows someone ripped this document off a Texas government website in April of twenty sixteen, the same month someone murdered Hannah May and seven of her family members. Investigators say

they've found that in the Wagner's belongings. While the Wagner's told investigators there were no issues over custody of Jake and Hannah's daughter, analyst Julia Evislage pointed to additional Facebook messages that showed Hannah was scared of the Wagner's attempts to win custody of her daughter. One Facebook message stood out. It's the often spoken about conversation from December of twenty fifteen that was between Hannahme Roden and George Wagner, the

Fourth's ex mother in law. It's where hannahme swears she will never sign papers to give up custody of her daughter. As for those Facebook messages to Hannah Wagner, one of those exchanges between Tabitha and Hannah Roden actually took place on the very day that Hannah Rodin was killed. Billy Wagner's interview and the Facebook messages showing the brewing custody battle between Hannah and Jake convinced investigators in late twenty sixteen they needed to shift their focus to the Wagner family.

You need to investigate that. That's important. That's a lead, that's something that we ran down, especially Agent Ryan Scheiderer of the BCI led the two year investigation into the brutal killings. Scheiderer testified that he visited the Wagner's home on Peterson Road in May of twenty seventeen, just before the Wagners are set to move to Alaska. Here's Angie Kneppa speaking with Agent Scheiderer, who is on the stand. When you arrived, you said Jake and Angela and George

were outside packing along as in a trailer. Did all three of those individuals remain outside, No, they did not. George excused himself on one side, and Jake and Angela remained outside. Yes, okay. And during that time did you observe anything in the driveway that was of interest to you? Yes? Why? Speaking with Angela and Jake, they were willing to speak with us. They didn't ask us to leave. I just casually observed there was numerous fired cartridge casnes about the driveway.

All over the place. There was hundreds of months thousands of cartridges laying around casings. And can you tell us, a special agent scheider did you were you able to pick those items up and examine them closely? No? Okay? And were you able to tell from your vantage point not bending over and picking them up or examined them closely? Did any of them appear to be of interest? Yes?

So the crime scenes, we were aware that there was a forty caliber used a forty caliber cartridge casing was found at one of the crime scenes you guys heard about that. We also knew that there was potentially a thirty caliber rifle that was used and twenty two long rifle. What I observed that day I saw cartridge casings that appeared to be from a rifle. They weren't like a twenty two caliber rifles, so they weren't twenty two room fires, but they definitely weren't like two two threes or five

five sixes. I just couldn't tell what caliber they were. And then I also saw cartiage cases that were or casings that were consistent with pistol calibers. Specifically, to me, it looked like they were nine millimeters or forty caliber. I couldn't tell from my vantage point. Obviously, I'm standing up and I did not examine them. And can you tell us? Was there also a conversation with Jake regarding various punishments for this kind of a crime. Yes. One of the one of the things that I like to do.

When I'm talking to somebody that I suspect is involved in a crime I'm investigating, there's oftentimes I will ask that person, what do you think the appropriate punishment is for somebody that's accused of this crime to elicit their response. So I did ask him that, okay, and what was his response. It depended on whether or not they were a trigger person. Following the visit, investigators got a warrant

to search the Wagner property and their cell phones. Among the many communications they found were text messages between George Wagner and his father, Billy. One message was sent while BCI investigators were at the Wagner's home. Can you tell us if you saw anything of interest on Billy's phone? There was interesting text messages from George. Message number four is an inbox, which means it's a message to Billy and it is from George, his son, and it says,

don't come down till I text you got company. Here's Stephanie. None of this ties George Wagner to the crimes. I also thought it was interesting that when police arrived to their home and George went inside, and they later took Billy's phone and he had texted to George to stay inside. Was he protecting him from police? Was Jake protecting his brother when he said, what should happen to the people who committed this crime, and he said depends on who

the trigger puller was. But again a strange answer retrospectively, since he has now taken a plea agreement saying that he was in fact a trigger puller, is that a way of protecting George? Because so far compelling as all of this is, none of it really does tie George to the crime. But Jake Wagner's phone included far more incriminating evidence. Once again, the messages were displayed on a large TV screen above the witness box. Did you also look at Jake's phone and did you find anything of

interest on that phone? Yes? And can you tell us what you thought. One of the most interesting things that we found on Jake's phone at that time was under the note section, and it was a list of guns owned by the Wagners were purported to be. So basically, there's a list with each Wagner name and then a

list of guns underneath each of those names. Jurors and Wagner's murder trial learned his brother Jake kept a list of guns that investigators think both men, along with their parents Billy and Angela owned on that list an SK seven six two by thirty nine and Accult nineteen eleven twenty two pistol. The search of the Wagner property also produced valuable evidence linking the Wagner's weapons to the murders. This included hundreds of shell casings from the Wagner family farm.

BCI firearms expert Matthew White delivered what could turn out to be damning testimony in the State of Ohio's case against George Wagner. Today, let's stop here for another break. I'm Carol Fisher, and I'm hosting a podcast called The Girl Friends. Back in the nineteen nineties in Las Vegas, a few of us dated the most eligible bachelor in town, Bob. He's several languages, he did medical missionary work, and he was Jewish. He was perfect on paper, but he wasn't.

He really wasn't. He shouted and to the point she went unconscious. Bob could lie about anything, but only takes the one time when somebody ends up dead. Unfortunately for Bob, us girlfriends know how to fight back. I wanted him to pay for his crime. He needed to be put to justice. I'll be honest with you. If I saw him right now, I'd spit on him. I would call him and I would say, I know you killed my sister.

I will always hound you and haunt you. You can listen to the Girlfriends on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello, Hello, Malcolm Glabell here, host of Revisionist History, a show about the overlooked and the misunderstood stories you won't hear anywhere else, like our ongoing obsessive campaign to blow up the world it's most

focused college ranking system. Why not just throw in a few extra zeros or witness me after years of fancy public speaking, learning that I kind of have to start over. The tone that you had throughout the debate was very similar to some of the students that I do work with,

and that's what I teach them not to do. We're making more revisionist history for you this year than ever from places all across this great country, emergency rooms, huge theaters, small towns, and shooting righteous and you want to put your thumb up like theos. Are you gonna pull the trigger with this finger? Here? Okay? Listen to Revisionist History on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts from iHeart podcasts, Whitney hell is going on here.

Everyone has their limits. I'd never confronted a situation like this. I just thought it was just a really terrible, immoral thing. Aligned they won't cross. I was stunned, and I just said, no, we're killing people. You may never have to face that decision when you find yourself at that line. Thout ricin, arn't ricin, And somebody needs to just for once give everybody the whole truth, like this is evil and the only person who can sound the alarm is you. I

wasn't just going to sit silently. Buy from iHeart Podcasts. These are the whistleblowers. If you are disloyal, things are going to happen to speak out disgrace through our good. Evil po should be prosecuted when power corrupts. Conscience is the last line of defense. I'm Miles Taylor. Listen to the Whistleblowers on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. My name's Laverne Cox. I'm an actress, producer, fashionista,

and host of The Laverne Cox Show. You may remember my award winning Verse season. I've been pretty busy. There's always time to touch incredible guests about important things. People like me have been screaming for years. We've got to watch the Supreme Court. What they're doing is wrong, what they're doing is evil. They will take things away. And I can only hope that Dobbs is that like Pearl Harbor moment. Girl, You and I both know what it took to just get through the day in New York

City and get home in one piece. And so the fact that we're here and what you've achieved and what I've achieved, you know, that's momentous. It's not just sitting around complaining about some bills. The only reason that you might think, as Chase said, that we're always miserable, is because people are constantly attacking us and we're constantly noticing it. Listen to The Laverne Cox Show on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Be sure

to subscribe and share. During Special Prosecutor Andy Wilson's questioning of BCI agent Matthew White, prosecutors showed hundreds of photos of shell casings on the overhead screen. Jurors were seen taking notes and at times sketching doodle drawings. During the

long and often technical testimony. Were you able based on your knowledge, you're training, your experience, and the work that you had done in this case examining both the shell casings and the projectiles, were you able to wring you an opinion as to whether or not any guns listed on that list could have been responsible for the evidence recover pies from the scenes. I did, and could you

tell the jury what that opinion was? I felt the most likely candidates for firearms that could have been used for the SKS seven sixty two by thirty nine and the CULT nineteen eleven twenty two pistol. But based on your review of this you determine that the SKAS seven six two by thirty nine and the COLT nineteen eleven twenty two could be contributors to the guns that were used. It could be the guns that were used in this case. Yes,

are that is correct? Matthewitt was also asked if any of the shell casings found on the Wagner's property matched any of the cartridge casings collected at the crime scenes and when you did those comparisons, were you able to a reasonable degree of scientific certainty to reach a conclusion as to whether or not those exhibits that were recovered from Peterson Road were fired from the same firearm that fired the shell casings recovered from scene two Scene three.

I was and can you tell the jury what that opinion was. I saw my microsoftic comparison of the two fire twenty too long rifle cartridge cases compared to the other fired twenty too long rifle cartridge cases. I was able to conclude that all of the fired twenty two long rifle cartridge cases had been fired in the same firearm. The defense, however, tried to blunt the testimony linking the Wagner's family's weapons to the murder scenes. The cross examination

lasted less than ten seconds. You don't know who fired that weapon, No, sir, I cannot say that. Thank you, Jeff. More on that next time. For more information on the case and relevant photos, follow us on Instagram at Katie Underscore Studios. The Piked and Masker is produced by Stephanie Lydecker, Jeff Shane, Connor Powell Andrew Arnow, Gabriel Castillo and me Courtney Armstrong. Editing and sound designed by Jeff Tui, Music by Jared Aston. The Piked and Masker is a production

of iHeartRadio and Katie Studios. For more podcast from my Heart Radio, visit the Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. I'm Carol Fisher and I'm hosting a podcast called The girl Friends. It's Las Vegas, it's the nineteen nineties, and it is time to find a husband. There were four Jewish doctors who were felt to be eligible bachelors. One of them was Spob Baron Bout. On paper, he was perfect, but in reality, this guy's a wacko. He choked and to the point

she went unconscious. I would call him and I would say, I know you killed my sister. You can listen to The girl Friends on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm will Daily. For years have been on the road playing shows and seeing America through live music. This summer, I'll hit the stage. Who Season two of Sound of Our Town ten Cities twelve episodes every other Thursday, we explore the live music venues

in culture of a new American city. With each new episode, our tour continues into the kind of venues you want to get to when you land in Detroit, Providence, Denver or Seattle. Listen to Sound of Our Town on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is the story of a man who's fascinated me. His name was Sweet Daddy Grace, and that's a name you don't forget. He was a visionary who built a fortune as a black man during Jim Crow during the Depression.

But today not many people know about him. The race sort of wiped out, and I wonder if this was done intentionally. Listen to Sweet Daddy Grace on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Freedom and I'm Marthy. We have spent the last twenty years building and working at some of the largest companies in the world. We worked with some remarkable people Rob mcalinney. When I see the people of Wrexham, I grew up

exactly like them. Check out the R. T Instre Ram Show. That is a R T H I and s R I R A M Show. Listen to the Art Instree Ram Show on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.