Breadcrumbs

I'm hosting a podcast called The Girlfriends. It's Las Vegas, it's the nineteen nineties, and it is time to find a husband. There were four Jewish doctors who were felt to be eligible bachelors. One of them was of the Baron bat On paper he was perfect, but in reality, this guy's a wacko. He shouted to the point went unconscious. I would call him and I would say, I know you killed my sister. You can listen to The girl Friends on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you

get your podcasts. This is the story of a man who's fascinated me. His name was Sweet Daddy Grace, and that's a name you don't forget. He was a visionary who built a fortune as a black man during Jim Crow during the Depression, but today not many people know about him. The race sort of wiped out, and I wonder if this was done intentionally. Listen to Sweet Daddy Grace on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you

get your podcasts. I'm will daily. For years, I've been on the road playing shows and seeing America through live music. This summer, I'll hit the stage. Who Season two of Sound of Our Town ten cities twelve episodes every other Thursday, we explore the live music venues and culture of a new American city. With each new episode, our tour continues into the kind of venues you want to get to

when you landed in Detroit, Providence, Denver, or Seattle. Listen to Sound of Our Town on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A member of the Wagner family was back in the Pike County courthouse today. His attorneys argued George Wagner the fourth did not shoot and kill any of the Rodent family members. Judge in our emotion. We have asked the court to dismisscounts one through eight and or the accompanying death specifications which make

this case a death penalty. As part of the pleadio Jake Wagner reached with prosecutors neither he nor his brother or their parents will face the death penalty as long as Jake testifies in court. George did not shoot or kill anybody. He did not pull a trigger once. Jake, on the other hand, has admitted to killing at least

five people personally and shooting a sixth. Special Prosecutor Angie Keaneppa argued the murder charges and death penalty specific oci against George Wagner should remain until Jake Wagner testifies on the record in a courtroom. Surviving members of the Rodent family anxiously await for answers to close the case, but won't ever erase the heartache they feel. This is the piked.

In Massacre season three, Episode seven, Breadcrumbs, I'm Courtney arshng, a television producer at Katie's Studios with Stephanie Leidecker and Jeff Shane. In this episode, we follow the trail of breadcrumbs left behind during these hearings, Some of them lead into very dark corners that may only be fully illuminated once the trial begins, and no issue has cast a larger shadow over the case than what Angela and Jake's

testimony may reveal about George and Billy's involvement. When the state has made a bargain what the shooter of at least five people to kill her and at least five people in this case, then we believe it's unconstitutional, improper, and abuse are to pursue the death phone against George when they admitted he didn't shoot anybody. You're not stipulating that George did not shoot anybody, because if you don't know that, we are simply stipulating, supporting to jas proper

George did not shoot anybody, supports distinction. Now, Judge Deering ended up denying the defense motion filed by George Wagner's attorney. Now, we also learned that all four of the suspects were offered the same chance to negotiate a deal if they agreed to tell prosecutors what happened the night the Rodent family members were killed. These murders in Pike County, Ohio.

It's not something they just entered into you know, they're not just you know, sitting around with if you can as a beer open and say let's go slaughter to rodents. That's not what happened. This took planning. You're talking about the murder of eight other human beings. They're gonna go into quite graphic detail about first off, the kids being locked up in this house with the deceased remains of their parents. They're going to talk about all of the

blood stains that were on the children. They're going to talk about how their children were weeping and crying. It's going to be incredibly impactful. It'll be like getting hit in the chest with a ten pound slash hmer. You're not going to have a totality of the execution of this agreement until they get up on the stand and they do what they say that they were going to do, you know, and absent that, then it's a game changer.

Defense attorney, former prosecutor, judge, and Fox nineteen legal analyst Mike Allen has been following the Keys closely. We asked them about Angela and Jake's proffers and if their testimonies need to line up closely with the prosecutions, investigative and

forensic findings. The answer to that is yes. I mean, if there's what they call aper made by a defendant where the defendant will say, well, this is what I would testify to, it's got a line up, not absolutely perfectly, but generally it's got to line up with what the prosecutions. They're probably meeting with Angela and Jake regularly. You don't

want to screw this up. You don't want to make some kind of comment to somebody, anybody that you're in jail with, even the prison staff, that you're coming in contact with him the daily basis, anything that could hamper this trial. They want to keep this thing as pristine as they possibly can. Going into what are the prosecution's going to do with George and Billy. Here's producer Chris

Graves speaking with forensic death investigator Joseph Scott Morgan. If those proffers are to be believed, it would seem that Billy did the other three. Yeah, yeah, it would seem that and Jake admitted to these killings. If he facilitated the deaths of five people, which he is admitted to, and we still have three that are unaccounted for it. I think Money's own Billy at this point in time,

he's front runner. I think that the State's going to want their pound of flesh in this case because of everything that has happened relatively, all of the deception, all of this horror that has come down upon this little rural county in southern Ohio. I think the people of Ohio probably are going to demand it. The Rodent family case is going to be that case that eighty years from now, people are going to sit around campfire and

tell stories about. Another motion, Motion seventy six, filed by the defense, deals with the admissibility of specific evidence and expert testimony that the prosecution hopes will seal the deal for convincing the jury of Georgia's involvement. The prosecution quickly filed a memorandum stating that their case for why the evidence should be admissible and why Emotion seventy six should be struck down. Here's Chris Graves speaking with retired prosecutor

and Flann again about the shoeprint evidence. For every motion at the defense filed, there may be a response, or there may be another motion filed by the state that seeks something and in those motions at times that you will glean some additional facts that maybe you have not heard from other sources. It's like finding little breadcrumbs to this puzzle we've all been trying to figure out. We took this new evidence and compared it to some of

the facts already known in the case. Here's Stephanie and Jeff. This is the relevant factual background in the memorandum. Eight members of the road and family were murdered in their homes on the night of April twenty twenty sixteen. Investigators located shoeprints at two properties four oh seven seven Union Hill Road and three one two two Union Hill Road. These shoeprints had pools of dried blood belonging to the victims. Okay,

so let's dig into this just a little deeper. The locations where these prints were found were at the homes of Chris Roden Senior and then Dana Rodin. We've been to this location and their running distance from each other. When we visited Pikedon, we actually did the drive of Union Hill Road to map out the different crime scenes. Union Hill Road lies about twenty minutes west of downtown

piked and off of Route thirty two. You exit the highway, then double back and head into a patchwork of forests and fields, and about half a mile up the road on the right is when you first see three one two two Union Hill Road, the property that Chris road and Senior bought for Dana and the kids just months before the murders, and we talked about this. That's also the location where hannahme Rodin had her baby shower just leading up to the murders. So moving into this home

was a really happy and exciting thing for Dana. Just down the road from that is four oh seven seven Union Hill Road, and that's where Chris Roden Senior was living, and as we know, his cousin Gary was staying with him. This was a very brutal crime scene. There were pools of blood everywhere, and in these pools of blood, what police found were two shoe prints, one a size ten and a half and the other a size eleven. According to the report, a size eleven Walmart Athletic Works brand

shoe left a print. Here's Joseph Scott Morgan. I went back and I thought that brand sounded familiar, and the reason it was familiar to me is that when my son Noah got one of his first jobs, it was at Chick fil A and they require you to wear those non slip shoes. We went to Walmart to buy him a pair, and that's what they were, and I just looked that up. They're primarily athletic works shoes. Their

non slip souls is what they are. They're black in color, they kind of look like athletic shoes, and visiting their website, they go for like thirteen bucks of pair or something like That's something that's easily acquired. The size eleven shoe was actually found in both Christina and Data's home, which is extremely significant because there's been so much speculation about this. Did they divide up and each go to a different location or did they do it together? And that's what

this evidence would imply. Yeah, so further knock point stuff. What they also found was that the size eleven shoe had a mix of multiple victims blood in it, which again speaks to your point that whoever was wearing that shoe went to multiple road in houses for Joseph Morgan. It brought to mind another infamous family massacre. I urge anybody that has never read in Coobala to go read

this book specifically because of the forensics. Capodi did such a fantastic job and given such a great description of this horrible scene where this family was absolutely butchered, not too dissimilar from what happened and Piked, and only it happened in one single home in Kansas all those years back. They had one piece of evidence that really todd everything together that scene. In Cold Blood is a non fiction novel by author Truman Capote that was published in nineteen

sixty six. It details the nineteen fifty nine murders of the Clutter family in small town, Kansas. And you might have read this book in high school or have heard of it. It's really one of the first true crime stories that people sank their teeth into. And I would surmise that any true crime TV series or podcast or documentary really should give some credit to this one, because without it, I don't think the genre would be what

it is. There are actually a lot of parallels between the piked and massacre and the Clutter of family murders. One the family aspect, also to the brutality three the victims being shot in the head, and just the sheer amount of bloodshed. It's chilling. For those of you who aren't familiar with the story, we'll give you a little

bit of a top line about it. It all started in the fall of nineteen fifty nine when these two x cons named Perry Smith and Richard Hiccock drove across Kansas on a tip they had received from one of their fellow inmates when they were in jail. While the duel was still in jail, they met a man named Floyd Wells, who had claimed to them he had once worked as a farmhand for a man named Herb Clutter, who, according to Floyd, had kept thousands of dollars in a

safe in his basement. And that is all that Smith and Hiccock needed to hear. And eventually, when they got out of jail, they drove four hundred miles to the Clutter residence and snuck into the house as the family was sleeping. They started by tying up mister and Missus Clutter and their two teenage children, Kenyon and Bonnie. It's

every parent's worst nightmare. I can't help being reminded of what the Rodent family must have been feeling the night that they were murdered, Thinking about them in their homes and having a loud banging sound and all a sudden, there's gun in your face. And it turns out there actually was not a safe it was a total lie. Or her rumor and Hiccock, who had a very short temper, flew into a rage. And it's so sad because they must have decided beforehand that they wouldn't leave any witnesses alive.

So all they got away with was a radio in maybe fifty dollars, but still they decided they had to kill the entire family. Yeah, once they made this decision, they kind of went one by one to the family members who were in various points of the home, and they started with mister Clutter, who was bound and gagged on a box spring in the basement. Harry Smith slit

his throat and then shot him in the head. They then went to the teenage son, Kenyon, who was bound in another part of the basement and shot him to death. And then they of course headed upstairs to kill mom Nancy Clutter, and sadly, after hearing both her parents and her brother being murdered, Bonnie Clutter was shot in the head. Her hands were tied in front of her. She was gagged, and get this, they actually he tucked her into her bed. It's almost like they were trying to make her comfortable

in the moments leading up to her murder. Another similarity to the road in case seems to be the sheer violence of all of this. To shoot someone and slip their throat is the definition of overkill. In the same way, shooting members of the Rodan family multiple times in the

face is just violence for violence sake. Something else that we should note that at some point in the night, Perry Smith stepped in mister Clutter's blood in the basement and left a partial footprint that again seems eerially similar to this footprint that we've been discussing in the Rodent homes. A lot of creepy stuff went on in this case. Anyway. He was executed down there, and Perry, who was one of the killers, was wearing a boot that had been

resold in this boot. When you hear this name, this name in forensic parlance, it's a benchmark moment. It's called the kept Paul print. When he stepped on that box, he transferred a print to that box with his boot that had transferred from blood onto the surface, and it left that cat Paul print. Perry Smith's boots were later recovered. Not so and piked In. The defense has struck gold here. Really, I think, so, what makes you think that? Well, guess

what they found? They had Perry's boots in this case, they ain't got nothing and piked and they don't have the shoes. They don't have that to compare to in the Clutter case they did. And I'm drawing these conclusions because I think, in my opinion at least, that this case, much like the Clutter case, is going to be a

blood bath. The prosecution is betting that their footprint expert, William bosnia can tie the bloody prints back to the Wagner's without having the actual will footwear for his analysis. Bosniak bought the same Athletic Works model size and shoe at Walmart about a thousand miles away from piked In in his home state of Florida. The defense is trying to raise doubt about the process by which Bosniak determined the match, as well as about Bosniak's actual qualifications as

an expert. To do this, they've requested what's called a Daubard hearing. Here again, and Flanagan. Dalbert is just the name of a case where some guidelines were set forth by US Supreme Court, and it was done with the idea that we don't want junk science going to a jury just because someone was declared an expert and said that this was his expert opinion. And so they gave some guidelines for attorneys and courts, and so some of

the guidelines aren't what would be called Dalbert factors. Some of these does include whether the theory or technique in question can be and has been tested, whether it has been subject to peer review and publication, it's known potential error rate, and whether it has attracted widespread acceptance within the forensic scientific community. One of the attacks that the defense made is that this is not the shoe. The shoe that he compared to the print is a sample

shoe that he bought later. They would want to do that because they see that as very damaging evidence. Understand, the defense's job is to exploit these small little issues along the way. They don't have to destroy the whole case. You know, when you start to talk about you know, well, they've given so much value to this piece of evidence.

They're going to try to paint it that way. If this trial happens down there in southern Ohio and Appalachia, people that inhabit those regions, their ears perk up when they hear an accent from other places, or they see people that don't quite fit in. And all he has to do is say, you know this guy, he's with the fits. Why the hell are you going to go outside of your own law enforcement family and the crime lab there in the state in contract with an outside

expert in this particular case. Ultimately, Judge Jarring ruled for the defense that the Dobbard hearing could go forward. Joseph Scott Morgan explains that if the judge rules in favor of the defense, a jury would never hear any of the evidence about the shoes. Defense is writtenes sing up to state that this gentleman is going to testify to size ten and a half and two size eleventh athletic

works shoes. He's going to testify to those items, and then he's marrying those up to the photographs of the shoe prints that's scene to these individuals, they're saying that this isn't going to hold water forensically, then we can conclude that perhaps that bit of evidence will be excluded. But listen, this is the defense. This is what they do. If I hire a defense attorney, I'm assuming that's their job to basically throw anything against the wall and hope

that it sticks. I would imagine it's a little bit of an upful battle defending someone like George Wagner because there's a lot of evidence against him, and so the defense attorney is just trying to find ways around that and ways to cast reasonable doubt. Because with a jury, you don't need to prove that someone's innocent. All you need to do is poke enough holes in the prosecution story that there is a reasonable doubt that George Wagner

do not murder eight people. We think it's important to go through the different pieces of evidence that the prosecution is allegedly putting forward because it really does play a huge part in this case. The first thing that we think seems very relevant is the shoe receipts. Now As a result of a search warrant executed on the vehicles and the trailers belonging to the Wagner family, investigators located

a Walmart receipt for a location in Waverley, Ohio. The data on the receipt is April seventh, twenty sixteen, which, as we know, is just a couple of weeks before the murders. The receipt was for two pairs of gray men's Walmart branded shoes with velcro straps in sizes ten and a half and eleven. Officials were able to obtain and preserve surveillance photographs and receipts of all recent purchases of that model and those sizes of the shoe in

numerous Walmart stores throughout southern Ohio. At some point, an expert reviewed the photographs obtained from a Walmart in Waverley, Ohio, and it included still images of the customers who purchased athletic work shoes that day, and the customer purchasing those shoes in this particular surveillance shot is none other than Angela Wagner. They actually show her exiting the Waverley Walmart on April seventh, twenty sixteen, at approximately the exact same

time on the receipt founds on the Wagner property. And this day is so significant because, as we know, Hannah may Roden was having her baby shower at her new house where she lived with her mom, which we talked about earlier. It is pretty damning evidence, to say the least. We were told at some point that Angela Wagner chose those specific shoes for her boys to wear because they were allegedly the exact same shoes that Dana Roden's brother

wore to work. And it's been speculated that perhaps Angela Wagner was literally trying to set up Dana Roden's brother for these murders. I have a question, what do you think has more weight in the courtroom, the science and the facts of the case or Jake Wagner's version of events. Well, it all depends on what Jake has given them at this point. And Mama, from a friend standpoint, I can't wait to see this. They've already shown their hand to

a certain degree. They're saying, we're going after the forensic evidence right now. We know it's footwear. What else is on the table? Are we gonna talk about ballistics because that's the agency for bringing about death here? You know, we're talking about firing multiple rounds into all of these people. Reporter Angeinette leavs these potential implications for George and Billy

Wagner if the evidence is allowed. I just know from one of the hearings back in August of twenty twenty, they were saying, you have no evidence against George the fourth and the same with Billy. Billy's attorneys said in court documents, you have no evidence against our guy. There's

nothing in the discovery that ties them to this. So when you look at it, if we're looking at shoe impression evidence, those could be things that maybe tie them to the crime scenes because we have that whole issue of the state saying and Angela Wagner at confirming that she purchased these shoes at Walmart them to use, So those items could tie George and Billy to the crimes. Because the Doward hearing could affect both father and son, Judge Deering raised the possibility that they both appear in

court at the same time. I would think that's going to be potentially the most interesting thing to come out of the Doward hearing. So you're going to have the singular hearing about the scientific evidence, and then it's going to be presented at two separate capital murder trials. We're going to take a break. We'll be back in a moment. Oh, I'm Carol Fisher, and I'm hosting a podcast called The Girlfriends.

Back in the nineteen nineties in Las Vegas, a few of us dated the most eligible bachelor in town, Bob. He spoke several languages, he did medical missionary work, and he was Jewish. He was perfect on paper. But he wasn't. He really wasn't. He shouted to the point she went unconscious. Bob could lie about anything, but only takes the one time when somebody ends up dead. Unfortunately for Bob, us girlfriends know how to fight back. I wanted him to pay for his crime. He needed to be put to justice.

I'll be honest with you. If I saw him right now, I'd spit on him. I would call him and I would say, I know you killed my sister. I will always hound you and haunt you. You can listen to The Girlfriends on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. My name's Laverne Cox. I'm an actress, producer, fashionista, and host of The Laverne Cox Show. You may remember my award winning first season. I've been pretty busy. There's

always time to touch incredible guests about important things. People like me have been screaming for years. We've got to watch the Supreme Court. What they're doing is wrong. What they're doing as evil will take things away. And I can only hope that Dobbs is that like Pearl Harbor moment. Girl, You and I both know what it took to just get through the day in New York City and get home in one piece. And so the fact that we're here and what you've achieved and what I've achieved, you know,

that's momentous. It's not just sitting around complaining about some bills. The only reason that you might think, as Chase said, that we're always miserable is because people are constantly attacking us and we're constantly noticing it. Listen to The la Verne Cox Show on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Be sure to subscribe and share. How Rude Tanta Rito's is the full House rewatch podcast

you've been waiting for. Each week, get together with iconic characters Stephanie Tanner and Kimmy Gibbler, also known as actresses Jody Sweeten and Andrea Barber, as they team up to relive every episode of your favorite Friday night comfort show. We spent our entire childhoods on a little show called Full House, playing frenemies but becoming besties whenever the cameras weren't rolling. And now thirty five years later, it's our

biggest adventure yet. Get ready for Jody and Andrea to tell all as they take an in depth book back at life in and around the Tanner Home from the very very beginning. So if you think you know everything there is to know about Full House, How Rude, We'll be reliving every moment with you, and we'll be joined by our Full House family, including all your favorites from one hundred and ninety two episodes. We'll reveal the hidden treasures you may have missed within the show, and we'll

take a trip down memory lane together. Listen to How Rude Tannertos on the iHeartRadio appcable podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello, and welcome to Bad Manners. This is the podcast that takes you inside Britain's stately homes and tells all the tales the guide books don't. My name is Tom Horton and I'll be your host. Britain is riddled with big houses from crumbling castles, massive mansions and stately piles bigger than bucking And as a comedian,

I'm not really bothered about the facts and figures. I just want the juicy stuff. So I'm on a mission to find out the frightening, filthy and downright jaw dropping stories of these stately homes and the people in them. This podcast ventures deep inside some of Britain's most incredible and outrageous buildings to spill the tea on the scandalous, scary,

shocking and hilarious tales. So if you want to get historically horrid, royally raucus and downtum dirty, look note that listen to Bad Manners on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Judge Daring decided to have two separate darboard cases for George and Billy Wagner, avoiding a father son faced face for the first time since their arrests almost four years ago. Here's Joseph Morgan. What if they come to a conclusion, Let's just say

it has to do with footwear. They come to the conclusion X relative to the findings in George's case and the validity of the evidence and how was examined, collected and analyzed. You've got the dynamic of a separate legal team there. They might have a completely different view of this. When you're accused of something, and I'm just speaking strictly about forensics here, you have to be able to hold forth against the entire might of the state and what

they bring to bear their forensic resources. George's team is there to save George. They're not there to save Billy. The morning of the trial, William Bosniak arrived early and took a seat while the defense and prosecution organized their arguments. Bosniak is fit with a head of silver hair. You might guess he's ten years younger than his actual age

of seventy six. Swear or a firm the Professimony were about to give into the truth whole trees and nothing about the truth, Michelanga, and you've got I gave a few concedes. Can you tell us what your vocation is. I'm a forensic consultant and examiner. I specialize in footwear, entire impression evidence. And can you tell us how abong

you see big doing that? Since nineteen seventy three, George the Fourth avoids eye contact with Bosniak, Angie Kneppa goes through the very standard procedure of having an expert describe his resume to the court. He speaks for a full hour and a half on his qualifications. Bosniak has done thousands of footwear impression examinations during his career with the FBI and in the twenty plus years of consulting since his retirement in nineteen ninety eight. Footwear shoes of people

leave impressions. Some of these are on two dimensional surfaces, where shoes acquire material like dust, dirt, mud, blood, and so forth, and then they read deposited in subsequent steps, typically the few step in a pool of blood. The first few steps are pretty heavy and messy. I have a lot of blood, and then eventually each step someone that blood is transferred to the floor and consumed, so

the next step doesn't have as much. Bosniak explains that he can identify specific brands, models, and sizes of shoes even if they aren't recovered. He does this by comparing or recovered prints to the molds used by manufacturers to make the soles of any given shoe. In shoes that are not popular, a manufacturer may only make one mold for most or all sizes. The basic design will be

the same. It's computer generated, it has been for years, so it's overall design, and it's whole size of that design from all of those molds will virtually be indistinguishable. But in some shoe designs they also add something that is known as generically as texture. At this point, Bosniac fires up a video he narrated. Texture is broadly defined as a shallow pattern sometimes found on selective surfaces of a footwear outshole. Adding texture to a mold is a

separate process. The video shows two workers in Southeast Asia. They each sit at their own workbench with a small hammer and all they're punching little divots into the shoe molds that will later be used to cast rubber soles. During the molding process, there are two predominant methods of adding texture to a mold surface. One of those shown here involves mechanically striking a pattern into the surface using a steel dye or similar tool. This is known as

hand stiffing. Believe it or not, those little patterns of the fine detail on the bottom of your shoes are mostly hand carved, and no two are alike. A size eleven mold created by one person will have minute differences from a size eleven created by another person. This goes even for the same brand and model shoe. It creates

a very specific footprint. What's great about this evidence is that it's what we call it demonstrable, And when you have demonstrable evidence, that's a big, big test of its reliability. If you live with Florida and you're asked to do an examination pers with Florida, how can you make a comparison to an impression was left? Because manufacturers sell their shoes all over the country, so if they're sold at one mold mark, you're probably sold at the majority of them.

If I know they're Walmart shoes, then that's the obvious place that I would go to first. Angie can up arrests. Now it's time for defense attorney Rob Junk to convince the judge that Bosniak is not a reliable expert. So what I'm hearing from you, then, in doing this test, you're required to have a mold standard from the batteries. No, in some cases I just simply go to the store and buy some or get permission to make photographs and take standards of the shoes they have, and why not

go to the main fact That's not always possible. They're in other countries mostly. But unless you have obtained all of the molds, how do you know or how can you be certain that the impression you have is a one particular mold or shoe that you have purchased from the store. I mean, this is just through your experience, is it right? You don't know this to be I know this to be certain because I've observed it. I've worked cases like this. I've interacted with manufacturers, numerous manufacturers.

I've been in factories asking questions like this, and I've observed it over and over again and used this process over and over again. And it's a certain as anything can be. The defense works tirelessly to see if Bosniak will slip up. The defense then moves on to the issue of not having the actual shoes used in the crime. Can you explain to the quarters, if we're looking at a Walmarch, how reliable it is to make a comparison ring match between a Walmart store and Florida and a

shoe that a Walmart store maybe in California. Sure they came from the same hold they just got distributed to all over the country. Although the impression corresponded with the shoe that you purchase from Walmart, you cannot say that that impression came from the athletic workshoe the athletic porches. All right, Yes, it's it's an athletic workshoe that has the texture that I purchased and that I compared, and they corresponds with the crime scene. After three hours of questioning,

Judge Deering has heard enough. I think I'm just going to rule an emotion. I mean I could include. The court concludes that the footwear impression evidence has explained and testified too. But William buds the act satisfies the criteria of evident rules Element two and Dallart Merrill for the admissibility of expert testimony. Let's stop here for another break. I'm Carrol Fisher, and I'm hosting a podcast called The

Girl Friends. Back in the Night ten nineties in Las Vegas, a few of us dated the most eligible bachelor in town, Bob. He spoke several languages, he did medical missionary work, and he was Jewish. He was perfect on paper, but he wasn't he really wasn't he choked and to the point she went unconscious. Bob could lie about anything, but only takes the one time when somebody ends up dead. Unfortunately for Bob, us girlfriends know how to fight back. I wanted him to pay for his crime. He needed to

be put to justice. I'll be honest with you. If I saw him right now, I'd spit on him. I would call him and I would say, I know you killed my sister. I will always hound you and haunt you. You can listen to the Girlfriends on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. My name's Laverne Cox. I'm an actress, producer, fashionista, and host of The Laverne Cox Show. You may remember my award winning

first season. I've been pretty busy. There's always time to touch incredible guests about important things people like me have been screaming for years. We've got to watch the Supreme Court. What they're doing is wrong, what they're doing is evil. They will take things away and I can only hope that Dobbs is that like Pearl Harbor moment. Girl, you and I both know what it to just get through the day in New York City and get home in

one piece. And so the fact that we're here and what you've achieved and what I've achieved, you know, that's momentous. It's not just sitting around complaining about some bills. The only reason that you might think, as Chase said, that we're always miserable is because people are constantly attacking us and we're constantly noticing it. Listen to the Laverne Cox Show on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Be sure to subscribe and share. This

is the unbelievable but true story of George Ramus. You might know him as a character from Boardwalk Empire or as the inspiration for Jay Gatsby. He was an eccentric and genius lawyer who figured out how to game the system during Prohibition. Remus is in the whiskey business, and Remus is the biggest man in the business, while living the life of luxury with his clamorous and ambitious wife Imogene. Daddy,

I am so glad you are here. But George Remus's wild existence took a dark and shocking turn, leading to betrayal. She had Remus just exactly where she wanted him revenge. Feel this muscle. I got this for Remus. I could crush him like an egg. And one of the most sensational murder trials in American history. We the jury, find the defendant, Join me Abbott kaylor As we traced George

Remus's transformation from bootleg King to alleged madman. Listen to Remus the Mad Bootleg King, every Tuesday on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. She's a Hollywood Western She's Jack Harrowac but in a nap dress with braids. She is one of the most important American children's authors of the twentieth century. She's the basis for a television show still watched around the world. Somebody somewhere is watching a Little as the Bird. She's been called

a hero, a racist, a feminist, and a propagandist. I think the harm is too great because it's just one more thing that Native children have to endure. She is Laura Ingles Wilder, author of the book series Little House on the Prairie. As a kid, I idolized Laura, and last summer I went on the road in search of the real Laura. We're literally on the prairie. What I found was a complicated person alongside the complicated country she represents.

I'm Glennis McNicol and this is wilder. Listen to on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. With the Dobbard hearing over and motion seventy six denied, It's guaranteed the jury will hear the testimony of William Bosniak, his positive identification linking the shoes bought at Walmart by Angela Wagner and the footprints at the crime scene containing the blood of multiple victims. This may have far ridge

in consequences for the entire Wagner family. Regardless, jurors will still see Jake's plea correct, and that would have its own narrative in and of itself, and maybe then the defense would poke holes in that. You're gonna get more than that from Jake. He's gonna be on stand. He's got to stand and deliver. That's the only way they made to steal him and Mama gonna be on stand. Man, You're gonna have a five Tom murderer all to stand

given testimony against his debt. I guess his brother. I don't ever recall that I've ever heard of a case like this, not in my memory, not in recent history, at least anywhere in America. The stakes at this point are so incredibly high it's unimaginable. More on that next time. If you're enjoying The Pikes and Massacre, listen to our other hit series, Crazy and Love. New episodes there every

Tuesday wherever you get your podcasts. For more information and case photos, follow us on Instagram at Katie Underscore Studios. The Piked and Massacre is produced by Stephanie Lydecker, Jeff Shane, Chris Greaves, Scott de Graw, and me Courtney Armstrong. Editing and sound designed by Jeff Tis, Music by Jared Aston. The Piked and Massacre is a production of Kati Studios

and iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. I'm Carol Fisher and I'm hosting a podcast called The Girlfriends. It's Las Vegas, it's the nineteen nineties, and it is time to find a husband. There were four Jewish doctors who were felt to be eligible bachelors. One of them was a spot Barrenmout. On paper he was perfect, but in reality, this guy's a wacko. He choked and to

the point she went unconscious. I would call him and I would say, I know you killed my sister. You can listen to the Girlfriends on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm free and I'm Rthie. We have spent the last twenty years building and working at some of the largest companies in the world. We worked with some remarkable people, Rob Mcalinney. When I see the people of Wrexham, I grew up exactly like them.

Check out the Arthie and Fear I'm show. That is a R D HI and s R I R A M Show. Listen to the Arcadianstrieum Show on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast oh, wherever you get your podcast I'm will daily. For years, I've been on the road playing shows and seeing America through live music. This summer I'll hit the stage. Who Season two of Sound of Our Town ten Cities twelve episodes every other Thursday. We explore the live music

venues and culture of a new American city. With each new episode, our tour continues into the kind of venues you want to get to when you land in Detroit, Providence, Denver, or Seattle. Listen to Sound of Our Town on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is the story of a man who's fascinated me. His name was Sweet Daddy Grace, and that's a name you don't forget. He was a visionary who built a fortune as a black man during Jim Crow during the Depression.

But today not many people know about him. He race sort of wiped out, and I wonder if this was done intentionally. Listen to Sweet Daddy Grace on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.