Ray Gricar Pt. Two

he would vanish under very strange circumstances. He lived in Bellefonte, and he decided to take the day off from work and told his girlfriend that he was going on a road trip to go antique shopping, but he never turned home, and then the following day, his abandoned car was discovered sixty miles away in the town of Leuisbourg, parked across the street from an antique small but there was no sign of Ray, and there was cigarette ash outside his car,

even though Ray detested smoking and would never let anyone smoke near him, suggesting that someone else may have been driving the vehicle, and there were also unconfirmed sightings of Ray in the presence of another woman, but she was never identified and they never confirmed that she actually existed.

They discovered that Ray's work issued laptop was missing, and it would not be until several months later when they found the laptop in a nearby river which was near a bridge, and sometime after that they found the hard drive, which had been screwed from the laptop, but they were unable to figure out what was on it and if perhaps Ray or someone else tossed it into the river because there was something on there they didn't want to find.

Because it turned out that Ray had made some Google searches on his home computer about how to erase a laptop and stuff like water damage to a laptop, there was speculation that Ray could have disappeared voluntarily, so speculation that he could have been the victim of foul play. He had several years earlier looked into a sexual assault charge against Penn State assistant football coach Jerry Sandusky, but

decided not to press charges. But it was a couple of years after Ray's disappearance when the whole Penn State scandal broke out where it turned out that Sandusky had been sexually abusing a number of boys and that the college had helped cover it up. So people wondered maybe Ray found out something about that and may have been

murdered to keep him silent. And they also looked at the possibility that raised disappearance might have been a suicide, because years earlier, his brother had actually taken his own life by jumping off a bridge into a river, So they looked at the possibility perhaps the Raising he wasn't found is because he did jump off the bridge into the same river where they found the laptop and just

have not found his body. But we recently passed the twenty year anniversary of raised disappearance, and unfortunately, we don't seem to be any closer to solving now than we were back in two thousand and five.

led to him receiving a multiple year prison sentence. The story goes that the biker damaged to raise kneecaps and slid his throat before dumping his body into a mine shaft in rural Pennsylvania, which had since been capped and covered with several feet of dirt. The informant reportedly decided to come forward because he was under the impression that the biker was dead, but soon learned that he was

actually still alive and living in another state. As a result, the informant was reluctant to lead authorities to the location of the mind shaft since it supposedly contained four other bodies and some guns, and since this evidence could have implicated the informant in other crimes, he wanted to arrange full immunity from prosecution. It's unclear how exactly this part of the investigation turned out, but it sounds like this man's story was never substantiated.

became a target as well. But this person who came forward one what would they have to gain by coming forward against such a dangerous organization If he was scared that this person was alive and then said, wait, I think he's dead, I'm going to come forward with information, then finds out he's alive again and withdraws that story, or maybe doesn't follow through with any of the leads

that he had. It could be out of fear. It could also be that he has potential involvement right and brought it forward just to get attention back on it and push the blame on someone he thought was dead, or like you said, could he have also just been involved in nefarious things that maybe then Ray was prosecuting or should have been prosecuting, and was worried about getting in trouble and so just completely drops all of it.

they find out this guy's story wasn't credible. I mean, the idea that right because he was a prosecutor may have angered someone, that's someone he sent to prison, may have wanted to get revenge, is not that far fetched, but it just doesn't sound like there was any evidence to corroborate it, and also doesn't explain why Ray would travel sixty miles to another town and then just happened across paths with this biker who would kill him.

Hall's Angels. According to this informant, while he was incarcerated at this state correctional institution at Camp Hill, a former cellmate told him that he and another man have been contracted to kidnap and murder Ray Greecar because of a drug investigation. Both these men have paid a female acquaintance to Lurerey to the street of shops in Louisbourg with the promise of giving him information of about a drug ring.

But after the woman took Ray to a local motel, the sal MAT's surprise Ray by snapping his neck and putting his body into the trunk of a car. Afterward, the salve Mat and his accomplice dumped Ray's body down an abandoned, flooded mind shaft. By the time the informant shared this story, both the sal mate and the woman

were deceased, though the male accomplice was still alive. Just over two weeks before his disappearance, Ray did hold a press conference in which he announced that the largest drug bust and the history of Central County had taken place, as charges were filed against nine suspected dealers who were involved in a heroin and cocaine trafficking ring. However, the case was mostly handled by another attorney from Ray's office, and his personal involvement was mostly limited to giving statements

to the media. No evidence has ever been found to link the drug bust to raise disappearance, and once again, the informant story has never been substantiated. In spite of all the different theories surrounding this case, we have recently passed the twenty year anniversary when Ray Driecar went missing, but there's still no conclusive answers about what actually happened to him. So I guess you could say the path went Chile.

some sort of investigation. But once again, like I know, it seems like a coincidence that a drug bust just happened to take place so shortly before Ray went missing. But Ray's roll, like I said, was just limited strictly to giving press conferences and he did not actively work on the case, so it seems weird that anyone involved

with this drug organization would decide to target him. So, like I mentioned in the intro to our first episode, I think a big reason that Ray Greekar's disappearance has become one of the most high profile missing person's cases of the modern era is because he was an individual who devoted his career to closing cases and putting criminals behind bars, but found himself at the center of his

own unsolved mystery right before he was scheduled to retire. Yes, people who work in law enforcement for such a long period of time are going to receive threats because of what they do, and sometimes they will even be murdered. But very rarely will you find a situation where the

victim completely vanishes without a trace. And what further complicates this story is that there is no definitive evidence that Ray was murdered or that his disappearance had any connection to his career, as it's entirely possible he was feeling suicidal and made the decision to take his own life.

But to give you an idea of just how out of the ordinary this situation is, Ray Greecar might be the only person who has ever been interviewed on an episode of a true crime show for helping solve the case, but then became the subject of an episode of another true crime show over a decade later because he went missing.

In October of nineteen ninety nine, the Discovery Channel true crime series The FBI Files released an episode titled A Stranger in Town, which chronicled the murder of a seventeen year old runaway named Dawn Marie Bernbaum, whose body was

found alongside Interstate eighty near Belfont, Pennsylvania. A truck driver named James Robert Cruz Junior would be charged and convicted of the murder, and since Ray Gricar was the Center County District Attorney at that time and prosecuted Cruise at his trial, he was extensively interviewed during the FBI Files episode. You can find this episode on YouTube, and needless to say, it's quite easy to watch this interview with Ray knowing that he would go missing five and a half years later.

I know that I first became familiar with Ray's story when it was featured on an episode of Disappeared, which aired in February of twenty eleven. It's very rare that you get to see interview footage with a missing person before they vanished. But during his appearance on the FBI Files,

Ray does come across like everyone described him as. He seems like a decent, straight shooting guy who genuinely cared about getting justice for his victims, but he's also got a pretty reserved and low key personality for.

case where there were some odd things that occurred. But for this Ray, it almost seems like he had to have run into some kind of foul play. It's that smoked cigarette in his car that I just can't buy the idea that he would smoke it as one last act before he took his own life or ran away.

anyone about it. So you are correct that on the surface, he doesn't seem like a guy who was suffering and would choose suicide as an option, But his brother had done the same thing years earlier, so for all we know, maybe something was going on with Ray which nobody knew about.

some new pieces of information which were never made public before. However, the podcast has become a bit of a mystery in its own right, as it had a very erratic release schedule and dropped only six episodes over the course of one year. At one point, Knight mentioned that she'd received a death threat, and it appeared that she experienced lot

of obstacles which caused lengthy delays between episodes. The podcast last episode was released in May twenty twenty two, and if you visit the Final Argument Facebook page, you'll see this final post from Night in April twenty twenty three. Quote, I'm going to release the final episodes in a few weeks. My hiatus was due to having a serious surgery and a long recovery. I'm on the mend and excited about

getting these last episodes out to you. My mission has always been to see a statewide jury convene to investigate the disappearance of Ray Greekar. As we're all seeing now, the mighty and powerful are being held accountable. No one is above the law, and I will be laser focused on exposing shocking information never released to the public that I hope will turn the tide so there'll be justice

for Ray Greecar. They murdered him because he was getting ready to charge who is they Stay tuned, and I promise you will be able to connect the dots just as I have done. End quote. While these final episodes never did get released, and even though numerous comments on the Facebook post have stated that they've tried to contact

Night about this, she's never provided a response. Now, Night has continued to publish articles for such websites as Business Insider, so it's good to know that she's still active and nothing bad happened to her. But it sounds like her reasons were deciding to abandon The Final Argument podcast are a pretty odd mystery within a mystery.

us on this podcast. I always wonder when you have suspects that end up not actually being the person who commits the crime, right, and they've been on on hours and hours of a show about Hey, this was the first suspect, and then all of a sudden it pivots and it's like, oh, it wasn't him, though that person's still living a life somewhere. So could it have been something as simple as someone saying, and if you're going to mention me in this podcast, I've already been clear

to this and I'm going to sue you. Or could it have been something way more sinister of someone saying you're getting too close, you need to back off, or maybe a combination of both.

But she was always very uh on the down low about what she really thought was happened. And unfortunately we may never know, and I do have to wonder did she feel threatened or did she find that she was going down the wrong track and potentially pointing the finger at suspects who were innocent. We just may never know.

the Hell's Angels or something like that. Think about if it was professional people that she was heading at, and the kind of power and control and money that could be behind someone saying hey, you need to back off of this story.

from listening to it. Now the three main theories which have always been pushed forward in this case or that Ray's disappearance was a homicide, suicide, or intentional walk away, though most people would agree that the third theory is far less likely than the first two. One detail which has always been cited as evidence that Ray was murdered and had another person with him at the time he went missing is the presence of cigarette ash on the floor of as Mini Cooper. As Ray detested smoking and

would not allow people to smoke inside his car. Since there were two cigarette butts on the ground near the passenger side of the vehicle, it's possible the ash could have been caused by someone smoking while leaning in through the side window to speak with Ray. But even so, who could this person have been and why were they

chatting with Ray and Louisbourg. Well, according tonight, there was no mention of the ash or a cigarette smell or anything cigarette related in the original police reports, even though many accounts state that the police detected the strong scent of cigarette smoke when they first entered the vehicle. I'm not saying that the detail about the cigarette ash is false, as it's been reported many times by many different sources, and was even specifically mentioned by one of the investigators

during an interview on Disappeared. But perhaps the story about the cigarette smell has been greatly exaggerated for dramatic purposes, you know, and or.

in the car. I mean, if it's on the original police report, it's possible it went from there's two cigarette butts outside the car to then somehow there's evidence of that inside the car, when maybe that wasn't even the case.

Mini Cooper at all, not even Rays. Another detail which has never been reported before. It's very unlikely that anyone who owns and drives a vehicle could avoid leaving their fingerprints behind, which suggests that someone intentionally wiped down the interior of the Mini Cooper. Of course, there doesn't seem to be any logical reason for Ray to do that himself if he was planning suicide, which lends credence to the idea of an unknown third party being inside the

vehicle who did not want their prince being found. As you know, Ray's cell phone was left behind in the Mini Cooper, and final argument does answer the question we've always had about whether or not the phone records were checked. The podcast confirms that the only call made that day was when Ray called Patty at eleven thirty am to let her know that he was going antique shopping, and the only call is the cell phone received was when Patty kept calling Ray's voicemail after he failed return home

that night. But interestingly enough, it turns out that there was also a reported sighting from a Louisbourg store owner who said she saw a man matching Rai's description come into her store on the afternoon of his disappearance. He appeared to be pacing around while holding his hand up to his ear and looked out the window at one point. While the witness could not confirm that the man had a cell phone, this opens up the possibility that he may have had a wireless Bluetooth device in his ear,

which was also a burner phone. When Ray was seen wandering around outside the Packwood House Museum that same afternoon, the witness thought he appeared to be talking to himself, even though he did not have a cell phone in his hand, though they don't discount the possibility that he

had a bluetooth. Ray's cell phone was a county issued one for wark purposes, so if he was secretly communicating with someone and did not want his calls to be tracked, it makes sense that he would use some sort of wireless burner device.

in the car if they had visited. So the idea of not even his fingerprints are there is the is another idea almost like the cigarette ashes, where it says, doesn't that point more towards someone else taking that vehicle?

and how could you discern between the two. If his reality and some type of fantasy had merged in some way, or he was experiencing psychosis, then perhaps if he was going to complete suicide and didn't want people to know that that's what he was indeed doing, then the wiping of the fingerprints was some type of subterfuge where he was trying to confuse whomever was going to find the vehicle, and maybe he would think that it would lead to

evidence that he was indeed killed. In case, he didn't want to upset people in his family given that his brother had completed suicide, maybe he thought that that would be too much for people to grasp.

hopefully my body will never found. But if I wipe the prints down in my car, then that's going to make everyone assume that I was the victim of foul play and they don't have to live with the stigma knowing that I took my own life. But here's the most surprising revelation from the Final Argument podcast. I'm sure you know that there was a reported sighting of Ray with an unidentified woman inside the street of shops in

Louisbourg on the day he went missing. However, I was surprised to learn that there were other reported sightings of Ray with an unidentified woman in the weeks prior to his disappearance, and they took place at antique shops in other towns besides Louisbourg, some of which were located in entirely different counties, such as Blair County and Clearfield County.

In most of these sightings, the man and the woman were described as quietly talking with each other, though they didn't do anything intimate to give off the impression they were a couple. Now, obviously virtually every missing person's case is going to have all sightings for my witnesses who were mistaken, and it's possible that the witnesses here mistook

another man for Ray. But the issue is that some of these witnesses specifically were called Ray driving and climbing out of a Mini Cooper, which is a very distinct looking vehicle, and there were only a handful of Mini Coopers registered in the state of Pennsylvania in two thousand and five. This would add an extra ore of credibility to these eyewitness accounts, but we can't even be certain if he was meeting up with the same woman in

each of these sidings. Now, since Rebecca Knight got access to the case file, she was able to review his financials, but said she did not turn up any red flags to suggest that Ray was having an affair during this

time period. If you're traveling to other towns to have secret rendezvous with women, unexplained charges for things like motel stays or dinners are probably going to show up in your financial statements, but that doesn't appear to be the case here, and the podcast also confirmed that investigators did check the local hotels and motels around Louisbourg and found nothing to indicate that Ray ever stayed at or visited

one on the day he disappeared. So Knight presents her own potential theory that perhaps Ray was secretly working on his own independent investigation into the allegations that Jerry Sandusky was sexually abusing young boys, but he did so under the radar without telling anyone. These women Ray was seen with could have been the mothers of some of the victims that Sandusky had abused, and Ray wanted to meet up and get their stories in towns outside Center County.

In order to avoid attracting attention. Ray may have chosen various antique shops as his meeting spots, since he had a known interest in antiques, so traveling to other towns to go shopping for them would not have seemed unusual if Ray was collecting information for an investigation. This would explain why he took his county issued laptop to Louisbourg, as it was apparently very unusual for him to bring

his work computer on non work related trips. Now, this theory is all just pure speculation, as no women have ever come forward to admit having any secret meetings with Ray in two thousand and five. I mean, I can understand the being too frightened to say anything after Ray turned up missing, But Jerry Sandusky was tried, convicted, and sent to prison nearly thirteen years ago, and the people who covered up for him have been held accountable, so

there would be no reason to remain silent. As the years have gone on, I get the impression that law enforcement has pretty much dismissed any connection between Ray's disappearance and the Penn State scandal, which is why this new theory took me by surprise, and I only wish that Final Argument had released their final episodes in order to provide more context about it.

he was going. Does it put her at risk if he tells her so? Could he have been going to meet somebody not an affair, simply to gather information about this drug case, about a future case he was working on. Yes, he was getting close to retirement, but I'm assuming he was working right up until he was going to retire.

case I'm working on solved before this happens. So I'm going to use whatever time I can to gather up information, and I'm going to do so under the radars so that it doesn't put anyone else's lives in jeopardy. And You're right, it may not even have been the Penn State scandal. It could have been an unrelated criminal matter where the responsible parties are still alive and out there

free and could potentially be a threat. So if he was meeting up with any women who were informants, that would explain why they never come forward.

Luna was a prosecutor who worked as an assistant United States Attorney in Baltimore and Maryland, but on the evening of December third, two thousand and three, he inexplicably decided to leave his office at the Federal District Court Building and went on an all night tri state road trip in which he drove hundreds of miles through Maryland, Delaware, and Pennsylvania. Early the following morning, Luna's car was discovered in a rural creek in Lancaster County, and his body

was lying in the water next to it. Luna had been stabbed thirty six times all over his body with his own pen night, But even though the FBI believed the wounds were self inflicted and his death was a suicide, the local Lancaster County authorities disagreed and thought he was the victim of foul play. The whole thing is one hell of a baffling mystery, and if you want to hear more details, we suggest you go back and listen

to our previous podcast episodes about it. Even though ray Greek Car has never been found, it's incredibly odd that we have two separate cold cases which took place only sixteen months apart and involved prosecutors who traveled to a rural affection of Pennsylvania before their vehicles were discovered near a body of water. Investigators have never found anything to indicate that the two cases are linked, and they probably aren't,

but it's still a pretty odd coincidence. Another cold case which has been mentioned in conjunction with this one is the unsolved disappearance of forty seven year old mel Wylie, who was the police chief in Hinckley Township, Ohio, before he vanished in July nineteen eighty five. Wiley's abandoned car would be discovered in a park near Lake Erie, and while it was initially assumed that he drowned, his body was never found and evidence was uncovered to suggest that

he staged his own disappearance and took off voluntarily. It's been reported that Ray Greecar had interest in this case and made mention of it, as Hinckley Township is in fairly close proximity to Cleveland, and it's possible, though never confirmed, that Ray might have crossed paths with Wiley back Wiley was still working as a prosecutor in Ohio before has

moved to Pennsylvania. I'm sure you've seen the parallels between these two cases, since both involved missing law enforcement officials whose abandoned car was found near a body of water. So if you believe that Ray staged his disappearance, it's possible that he used Wiley's cases inspiration. Otherwise, there's nothing to really link these stories, though. The disappearance of mel Wiley is a pretty intriguing mystery in its own right,

and if you want to learn more details. Robin released a bonus episode about this case on his Trail Went Cold Patreon page three years ago.

similar case facts. Really, the only thing we know are those basic case facts, and yes, it's incredibly bizarre, but linking them, like you said, without further information, you know, is nearly impossible. I mean, do we have some serial killer going around doing vigilanti justice to get prosecutors who put people away and you know they are trying to, I don't know, make a name for themselves. Maybe not.

But interestingly enough, when you look at this case, the idea that his computer was thrown over into the water, it makes sense if he was going out to actually work a case and someone followed him because they were paranoid or were thinking he's onto them, he meets with this informant, they get into his car after they abduct him, hurt him, and then they go in discard of his work computer so that nothing he was working on could

be discovered. All of that makes sense way more than I think him walking away from a life that was just about to be calm and relaxing and full of time with his family. Yes, change is stressful, but he was excited and they had plans, and the biggest plan he had was spending a lot of time with his daughter,

who was his pride and joy. So I just am leaning towards the idea that something was going on behind the scenes that his wife didn't know about, and it got him into trouble where someone killed him and then said, Okay, not only are we going to get rid of him, but we need to make sure we get rid of any device that could possibly have information about this case on there.

in the campus library. West was certain she knew the killer's identity, but didn't think she could publish his name without being sued. She wanted to raise advice on how to handle the situation, and he told her to keep investigating before she went public with her belief. Well. West ultimately got around the situation by publishing a science fiction

novel titled twenty twenty Vision Who Done It? Where the details of the crime were loosely based on the Betsy Aridzma murder, and the plot involves a detective traveling back in time in order to solve the case. The reason's people attempt to tie this book to Ray Greecar's case is because the lead character is a veteran who was close to retirement, much like Ray was, and the book's murder takes place on April to fifteenth, the same date

Ray went missing. In addition, the detective character drives a car with a personalized vanity plate, and Ray's Mini Cooper had a vanity plate which read e FO, a reference to his girlfriend Patti Foornicola. Some other loose parallels have been made between the plot and Raised disappearance, such as ashes from an urn being a vital clue to solve the fictional case, and the presence of cigarette ash and

the Mini Cooper. Long story short, it has been theorized that Ray may have used twenty twenty Vision as inspiration to stage his own disappearance, though I personally think that's a major stretch. By Pamela Wes's own admission, even though she had consulted with Ray for advice about her book, she never sent him a copy and as no idea

if he even read it. Indeed, they never found a copy of twenty twenty Vision and Raised Belongings following his disappearance, and Wes said that she had not spoken to him for many years. The book came out in nineteen ninety, and I don't think it made a big splash, as it looks like it is long out of print. So I had my doubts that Ray would decide to use the book as inspiration to stage a cryptic disappearance fifteen

years later. While the idea of a voluntary disappearance has not been completely ruled out, most people do not believe that's what happened here, as it's an extremely difficult thing to pull off in the twenty first century, particularly if you're a prominent figure looked like Ray Ricar whose face

has been plastered everywhere. One theory which has been pushed forward is that Ray could have taken off to Slovenia, as he was fluent in the language and had traveled to the country in the past and had relatives living

over there. Interpol has actually gone so far as to distribute missing Persons flyers for Ray and Slovenia, but they've never turned up anything in two thousand and five, and American would not be able to leave the country and travel internationally without a passport, So unless Ray was somehow able to pain a fake one, I don't see this as a viable option.

on in a story of telephone. And then oh, if there's cigarette ash, maybe it's the same as the ashes from the urn. I mean, it's starting to get a little bit ridiculous.

one thousand and fifty seven dollars in eighty six cents. However, the Disappeared episode stated that Ray had a bank account containing around one hundred thousand, which was never touched after he went missing. Given that Ray was drawing a yearly salary of one hundred and twenty nine thousand at that point and was not known for living a frivolous lifestyle, having just over one thousand dollars worth of assets does

seem unusual. This has led to speculation that perhaps Raised secretly moved or withdrew a lot of money in order to plan his escape. But I know that his finances seemed to have been investigated very thoroughly, as they never found any large, unexplained sum of money suddenly appearing or disappearing from his account, or any improprieties with the Center

County District Attorney's office financial account. Everyone has said that Ray was looking forward to retirement and spending more time with his family, and even if he didn't have a great deal of money saved up, his job still entitled him a pretty good pension which would keep him financially secure. Given the circumstances, there really is no logical reason for

him to run away on his own accord. Ray's loved ones also don't believe that he would have caused a great pain for them by intentionally disappearing and not letting them know what happened, particularly when it came to his daughter, Laura, whom he was very close to. As someone who devoted his life to practicing criminal law, I'm sure Ray had a pretty good idea about how a missing person's investigation would be handled and the type of questioning his friends

and family would face. Theoretically, if Ray wanted to disappear, he could have secretly contacted the people that he cared about, such as his daughter, to say, quote, Hey, just wanted to let you know that I'm alive and well, but I needed to get away, so please don't tell anyone

you heard from me. End quote. But we know that Laura was extensively questioned and passed a polygraph, and I doubt Ray would have wanted to put her into a position where she was forced to lie to law enforcement and perhaps even perjure herself in order to protect him. An additional theory which has been pushed forward is it Ray entered the witness Protection program, but this has pretty much been debunked as it seems unlikely that his case would keep receiving so much attention in the media. If

the authorities already knew where he was. When you look at the big picture, I do not believe that Ray lived much longer after he arrived in Louisbourg. But the big question is was his death suicide or murder.

probably invested in things he has real estate. Now, when you're starting to talk about taxes and you know, being accountable for the things that you do have, it's not abnormal for wealthy people or people that are pretty stable to access an accountant or a financial advisor or things like that to help you move things around or put them in you know, trust for other people or things

like that so that you're not taxed on it. And so it's possible too that he was just intelligently moving money around so that oh shucks, my total assets are one thousand dollars. Good luck, if you want to come after me, if you want to assume me in civil court, all of those things, and so I wouldn't be shocked if it's something that has a very, i don't know, intelligent explanation behind it, where he's protecting his family's assets by showing that he doesn't have much of anything.

having financial problems, or that he was embezzling money. It just seemed like everything was completely ordinary. So I think they're just kind of stretching things when they're saying that, oh, yeah, he had so little assets that he must have moved it to some Swiss bank account and he's over in Europe somewhere living a new life.

We have our three part series Joy and Us next week for part three, as we conclude our analysis about the disappearance of Free.

ten dollars tier. One of the features we offer is a audio commentary track over classic episodes of Unsolved Mysteries, where you can download an audio file and then boot up the original Unsolved Mysteries episode on Amazon Prime or YouTube and play it with my audio commentary playing in the background, where I just provide trivia and factoids about the cases featured in this episode. And incidentally, the very first episode that I did a commentary track over was

the episode featuring this case. So if you want to download a commentary track in which I make more smart ass remarks about Jewel Kaylor, then be sure to join Tier three.