Harry and Megan Tooze Pt Two

they seemingly disappeared from their farmhouse. But shortly after the police launched an investigation, they wound up discovering Harry and Meghan's bodies inside a cowshd on the property, and they had both been shot once in the head with a shotgun, and it seemed apparent that because there were no signs of forest entry, that they invited the killer into their home and were probably in the midst of serving them tea when for one reason or another, the couple were

taken out to the cowshd and both fatally shot. The police immediately focused on Jonathan Jones, as they thought he didn't seem emotional enough about the death of his in laws, and they wound up finding a thumbprint on a saucer beneath the tea cup that was found on the Tuesdays dining table, But Jonathan argued that because he frequently visited the house that he could have left the thumb print there on a previous occasion, or when he arrived at the murder scene, he may have been in such a

state of shock that he could have touched the saucer without even realizing it and has no recollection of it. The police still felt that he wanted to kill Harry and Meghan because Cheryl stood to inherit their one hundred and fifty thousand pound estate and Jonathan really wanted the money, so they argued that even though they lived in a district of London, that Jonathan made the two hundred male trip from London to lo Hari and killed the Twoses

before coming back without his wife even noticing. He didn't really have a strong alibi, but there was also no evidence placing Jonathan and lan Hari either other than the thumb print on the saucer, and the murder weapon was also never found. But in spite of this, the police still charged him with a double homicide and Jonathan went on trial and was found guilty by majority of ten

to two. But immediately after the trial, the judge expressed his concern about the conviction, saying that he had doubts about Jonathan's guilt and even wrote a letter about that expressing his concerns, and Jonathan was in prison for about a year before his case was heard before the Court of Appeal and they decided to overturn his conviction and

he was finally released from prison. So, for the longest time, the police still maintained that Jonathan was the killer and they didn't decide to look at any other suspects or any other potential leads. But in recent years they have finally changed this mindset, and in December of twenty twenty five, just a few weeks before we recorded this episode, they announced that they had arrested an eighty six year old

man on suspicion of murder in this case. By at the time of this recording, they still haven't revealed this man's name. They haven't said anything about what new evidence led to this arrest, and he has also been released on bail. He has not been formally charged yet, and thus far the police are being very secretive about this case, and we still don't know at this point if this man will ever be formally charged or if we'll ever learned information about who he is and what led him

to becoming a suspect on the police's radars. So we're going to spend the second part of this series talking about the case and these new implications. So I've covered a number of cases on this podcast which have never reached definitive conclusion because the authorities initially arrested or convicted the wrong person. And some of those cases you get the impression that investigators developed serious tunnel vision and ignored

obvious leads to focus on the wrong individual. But in the case of Harry and Megan TWS, it seems like there was very little to work with at all. I definitely believe that on the basis of the evidence against him, Jonathan Jones never should have gone to trial for these murders, let alone been convicted. But at the same time, I can understand why the South Wales police would have zeroed in on him as a potential suspect, since nothing about

this crime makes any sense. It's sound as like investigators had reached a complete dead end, so when they discovered Jonathan's thumb print on the saucer on the twos's dinner table, they decided to focus all their energies on him, even though there was really no other evidence to implicate Jonathan

or place him at the murder scene. I guess on the surface, the idea of him murdering his in laws to cash in on his girlfriends one hundred and fifty thousand pounds inheritance might not seem like an implausible motive, especially when you consider that there doesn't seem to be a discernible motive for anyone else to have committed this crime. This seemed like the work of some cold calculated assassin, as both Harry and Meghan were shot in the back

of the head execution style. Who would want to target this seemingly harmless elderly couple. While Jonathan had his conviction quashed and was released from prison, he technically was an exonerated per se and declared to be factually innocent. It's not like there was some slam dunk DNA evidence to clear him. But as we're going to talk about a bit later, the recent arrest of another suspect on suspicion of murder might finally lead to Jonathan receiving full vindication.

I hate to refer to any wrongfully imprisoned individual as lucky, but Jonathan actually lucked out better than most people in his situation, since he was released only a year after he was originally convicted. However, this was still an extremely traumatic ordeal for Jonathan and his loved ones, and I don't think they've ever really recovered.

get go. Once he was released, the police told Jonathan and Cheryl, guess what we're not hunting for anyone else because we're convinced we got the right man. So that wait for anyone, much less two new parents, people who had just lost their parents. All of that has to be so heartbreaking. And to think they were a strange from a lot of their other family that could have been support for them as well.

taking you to trial. Now we're a lot more discerning when we look at these cases because we've seen so many wrongful convictions where police got tunnel vision, the prosecutor got it wrong, and these people are actually innocent, and some of them are still in prison, like Tommy Ziegeler Robin's pat case. So I think when you look at it through the lens of nineteen ninety three, or when the trial happened, originally in nineteen ninety five, you have

these family members going he did it. Maybe they didn't have the evidence, but otherwise they wouldn't have brought him to trial.

By all accounts, Cheryl was usually a shy, quiet woman, but Jonathan's wrongful incarceration turned her into a fighter, and her loyalty to him helped insure his release. This alienated her from the rest of her extended family, who were very outspoken about their belief that Cheryl was helping get

a killer out of prison. However, Cheryl maintained that she and Jonathan both had a very close relationship with her parents, whereas those other family members barely saw Harry and Meghan while they were alive, and only started coming out of the woodwork when their murders received national headlines. Of course, fe ordeal pretty much caused Cheryl and Jonathan to lose

all faith in the justice system. And during a two thousand and eight interview with Wales Online, Jonathan stated, quote, we may be walking down the street and I'm eating a Mars bar, for example, and I will put a rapper in the bin and Cheryl will pull it out in case the crime is committed nearby and the police would come along and find my DNA. That's the sort of paranoia that's still with both of us to some extent.

that because she thinks there's any guilt there. She's doing it because it is this PTSD or complex post traumatic stress disorder where she truly lives in fear that another bungle is going to happen in some kind of investigation and her husband's going to be taken away from her again, and so that speaks to kind of the emotional weight that she's under even decades later. But think about this.

That emotional weight is what's killing her body. It's that stress and that trauma that is physically eating her and changing the way that her body's able to function. And so it's you see physically on Cheryl the weight that this case had on them. And like she said, you know, those two were very close to her mom and dad. But when the trial came, and when she was being an advocate for her future husband and the father of her child and for a person that her parents loved,

then these people start coming out. They're like, you know, that's an uncle I haven't seen in four years. This guy hadn't talked to my parents in ten years, and yet here he is the biggest advocate against my husband, and you know, my parents number one advocate in fan to make sure justice is done. I can't imagine what the estrangements, plus this kind of almost false affection for her parents must have felt.

prior to the murders. Cordatively, Jonathan could have touched the saucer when he traveled to the farmhouse after the murders and not even realized it without the thumb print. The other alleged evidence against Jonathan was incredibly weak, such as him supposedly not reacting much when he learned that Harry's body had been found. It seemed like the prosecution's case was based around discrediting Jonathan's alibi that he was in

Orpington on the day of the crime. But the problem is that they didn't actually offer much evidence which proved that Jonathan was in Longhi committing the crime during that time period. Remember, traveling from Orpington to Long Harian back is a nearly four hundred mile round trip and it would be pretty difficult to do so without being seen by any eye witnesses or leaving a paper trail or

physical evidence behind. It's one thing if no witnesses were called seeing Jonathan in Orpington, a section of Greater London which has a population of around ninety thousand, but in a small village like on Hai. I think that a distinctive six foot five individual like Jonathan would have stood out a lot more. Yet no one reported seeing him there that day.

very tall. I just I don't see it. I don't see how he's going to love on Cheryl, tell her goodbye, go murder her parents when his wife's expecting a baby, their first baby. No way, there's just no way. They were more valuable to them alive than they were deceased. Even when you look at the financial support, when you think about my parents could help us with daycare. My parents could help us each year. You know, my parents could long term be you know, caregivers for him when

we're at work, whatever it is. They could have made plans with their parents to be far more profitable to them than a one time inheritance that wasn't even you know, it was a lot of money, don't get me wrong, but you know, two hundred thousand dollars back in nineteen ninety three. But is it worth killing them over And when you look at the idea that Cheryl had a business plan, she was a very motivated individual, that Jonathan was super supportive, that they seem to really have their

life put together. I say absolutely not.

in his flat. Jonathan said that he briefly spoke to some lift engine years in his building around the approximate time period his in laws were likely murdered, and if they'd been able to corroborate his story, this would have

proven that Jonathan couldn't have committed the crime. When these lift engineers were called upon to testify at the trial, they did not recall speaking to Jonathan that day, But keep in mind that this was years after the facts, so it's not surprising that they may not have been able to recall such a mundane event from an ordinary day.

I know that the trial judge, Justice Richard Rugier helped pave the path from the quashing of Jonathan's conviction when he sent off letters openly expressing his surprise at the guilty verdict. But ironically enough, Rougier may have inadvertently paved the way for this verdict when he gave the instructions

to the jury before deliberations. Part of Jonathan's alibi was that he had been watching a cricket match on TV at his flat in the afternoon of the crime, and during this testimony, Jonathan provided specific details about the match, including how the commentators had mentioned stoppages for rain well during his instructions, just as Rugier told the jury that there'd been no rain stoppages during that particular match, which

was a bit misleading. Jonathan never said he witnessed any stoppages for rain, only that the commentators had talked about the subject. Rugier received criticism for potentially misdirecting the jury, so I think his letter expressing doubt about the verdict

were his attempt to make things right. I know that Rugier stated that if Jonathan was guilty of this crime, he was exceptionally cunning, because you'd think that a guy with no criminal record who'd supposedly not handled the gun in two decades would leave a lot more dowbing evidence behind if he took such a lengthy trip in order to commit a double murder.

like hey, guys, good to see you. We should hang out soon, like remember you saw me? Right, You start to lay out a path or a trail that when you do need someone to say, hey, we saw him. Did they remember you? When you have zero accountability to a crime and you're asked, hey, what were you doing that day? What I do every day, it's pretty boring. I woke up, I cleaned the house, I went for a walk, I said hey to some lift guys. That's about it. Waited for Cheryl to come home, because that's

his normal day. I guarantee you if they had planned out a four hundred mile round trip murder to make sure that they got this money, there would have been clear things put in place to make sure he got home to his child and was not sent to prison away from this new baby he was about to have. He would have laid groundwork to make sure there was evidence available to prove his whereabouts because he had actually plotted an alibi.

But it only makes the investigators more suspicious, like why are you saving a receipt from like buying a food at a restaurant like weeks earlier, why do you still have it? So it looks obvious that they're trying to fabricate an alibi for himself. But here Jonathan didn't attempt any of that. He just said, oh, I spent the day like wandering around London walking and I talked to these lift engineers. But it didn't really look like he was like trying to plan this four hundred mile round

trip and establish an alibi for himself. So, following Jonathan's release from prison, it seemed to take a while for the South Wales Police to finally acknowledge that there might be another killer out there somewhere, but they ultimately did launch a new investigation, and of course another suspect has

recently been taken into custody. Given that a neighbor reported hearing two gunshots from the two's property at around one thirty PM, and Harry and Meghan were each shot once, is reasonable to assume that this is when the murders took place, and since no one showed up at the farm to check on the couple until several hours later, the killer would have had ample time to cover up

the crime and dispose of evidence. Once you discount the idea, that the Twoses were murdered so that their daughter could inherit the estate. There doesn't seem to be any apparent motive for this crime, as Harry and Megan didn't have in, you know, enemies, and nothing appeared to have been stolen

from the residents. I started to wonder if the whole thing might have just been some sort of thrill kill from someone who just wanted to murder a random couple and selected the Twoses because they happened to live on an isolated farm. However, since the afore mentioned teacup and saucer were found on the dining room table and the couple appeared to be in the midst of preparing lunch, it does seem like the killer was invited into their home.

Everyone who knew the Twoses said that they never brought out that particular China teacup unless they had a guest. The circumstances of how Harry and Meghan were shot and how their bodies wound up in the cowshd are not entirely clear. It seems like Harry was shot just inside the cowshed's front door, and Megan was shot outside before her body was dragged in there. And they were both concealed.

It's possible that Megan was inside the cowshd when her husband was shot and attempted to make a run for it, or she heard the shot from inside the farmhouse and came running outside before she was ambushed. For all we know, the killer may have led Harry and Megan to the cowshed at gunpoint, or Harry escorted the perpetrator in there and was taken by complete surprise when he was shot.

We have on Ai pom prints on the farmyard gates and the farmhouses front door which did not match the twoses Cheryl or Jonathan, and they may belong to the killer. But since the police did not do a good job preserving the crime scene, it sounds like there isn't much in the way a physical evidence at all.

talking to you. I could easily see my mom saying, well, while you wait for you know them to call you back, or while you wait for you know someone to come pick you up, let me make you a cup of coffee, let me make you a cup of tea, and just being a hostess, she'd grab whatever was right there, right which could have been that cute little tea and made a cup of tea. Now more likely that they knew

the person. But could they have been helping someone who had mental health issues and they knew that person and they were someone that they really cared for. I feel like they would have told Cheryl about you know, we have this troubled friend. They come and check on us, you know, we're trying to help him out. But I could see someone with a mental illness who they knew and cared for and didn't realize they were that sick. Turning on them doesn't have to be a motive for money,

doesn't have to be something that seems logical. Could have been a thorough kill. Like Jules just said, but or Robin just said, but to.

So if a stranger did show up, I think that they were friendly enough that they wouldn't have felt threatened and just invited this person inside and still been taken by complete surprise when they decided to kill them.

political aspect. And then they get someone on the case he decides, I don't care if this makes our department look bad. I just want to get to the truth. And that's when they finally wind up apprehending the real killer. But I know that in twenty twenty three they said that they were doing new forensic testing on some items of evidence in the case, So I still inclined to believe that maybe that is what led them to this eighty six year old man.

the Jos's farm. He was carrying a hold all bag and when he noticed the car passing by, the man apparently made an attempt to conceal his face, and the witnesses were pretty certain that he was not Jonathan Jones, as he was described as being considerably shorter than Jonathan

at around five foot nine. We've had police provide descriptions of vehicles which were supposedly seen in the area on the day of the crime and have never been located, and there have also been vagar from neighbors that they heard loud arguing from the Tuesdays property during this time period.

But I think the most intriguing lead was provided by a solicitor who claimed that Harry visited his office a week before the murder took place and was accompanied by a middle aged man whom he described as a plummy voice stranger. In case you're not familiar with that term, the definition of plummy is used to describe a low voice or way of speaking using long vowels, of a type thought to be typical of the English upper social class.

The solicitor said that Harry inquired about his mother in law's will, as Megan's mother had left them the farm when she passed away years earlier. This meeting was described as being tense, and while details are pretty vague. The plummy voice stranger has never come forward or been identified.

another man present. Again, it seems like if he was going to try to maybe solidify something for his own will, if he was trying to gather information for a business deal. It seems like something he would have spoken to his adult daughter about. You know, it's not like she's an eighteen year old and he doesn't want to bother her

with financial issues or any kind of business decisions. I feel like when my parents are trying to investigate wills in the family, when they're trying to make a property sale, anything like that, I'm aware of it. So it's odd. Who was this person with him? And it seemed quote tense. Was this someone he was trying to make a business deal with? Was it somebody who thought that Harry owed

him something? Again, is this something that would have been kept from Cheryl maybe if they thought they were kind of at risk or being exploited for something. But very interesting, and who's to say that that man that some of the witnesses saw walking that clearly was not Jonathan wasn't that eighty six year old man.

focused on Jonathan. And I don't know when this lead with the plummy voice stranger came about, but if it was years after Jonathan's conviction was overturned, that might be why it's so vague, Like maybe this solicitor came forward and says, oh, yeah, I remember several years later, Harry was in my office with this stranger. And that's why we don't have more specific details about what this meeting

was about. But it seems to me that if the investigators had learned about this right from the outset, then this plummy voice stranger should have become the lead suspect.

Was it the stranger or was it from Harry? And because they go back to what Ashley said, maybe they wanted to know the value of the farm because Harry had a potential debt. But it makes me wonder and I don't know if you have the answer to this, Robin, but did anybody else have a financial motive to end the lives of Harry and Meghan any other family members?

particular time and see a solicitor? And why would Harry bring along this guy that no one seems to know his identity? So interestingly enough, prior to this meeting at the solicitor's office, Harry made a phone call to the National Farmers Union where he claimed that someone was trying

to a victim, but never offered any additional information. So if Harry feared that he was going to be evicted, that might explain why he felt compelled to check his mother in law's will to make sure the property was his. The situation seems pretty odd since the Tuses had lived at the farm for over three decades at that point. So who was trying to evictim? Was it the same man who accompanied Harry to the solicitor's office? If not,

then who was this guy? I suppose that if someone wanted the twos land and this could have given them a potential motive to commit murder, But since Cheryl wound up inheriting their estate, I'm not sure if anyone else gained anything from this crime. I suppose this alleged eviction could have been some elaborate con job from the killer, But what exactly was their endgame? And if the plummy voice stranger was planning to kill the twos is, why

would he allow himself to be seen by solicitor. The fact that this man has never come forward seems to suggest that he was involved in this crime. But I just have this feeling that there's a big piece of the puzzle missing somewhere which might shed some light on

what happened. I know police received an anonymous letter about the case sometime in the early two thousands, and while they've never publicly revealed its contents, I wonder if it provides any additional insight on this whole situation.

And he's like, that's fine. Can I please see my mother in law's will just want to check and see who she left our land to.

the crap that's happening. I gotta go pull up the will, I gotta go see what this is. I just feel like that would have been a such a big deal and such a frustration that it would have been voiced at some point. But it could have been someone who says it's mine and when you don't give it to me, or I'm proven wrong, I'm so angry that I snap.

even though I don't live close to them. So it's possible. And again, there are some parents who, even though they do talk and love on their babies every day, they spare them from any emotional or financial, you know, struggles. So it's possible that they kept it to themselves. But I just thought, you don't know, you never know. We don't know the right answer here, so it's all possible.

can still talk about his background. So in nineteen eighty five, Cooper was working as a farm laborer in the county of Pembrokeshire, and on December twenty second, he decided to break into a mansion located near the village of Schoveston to perform a burglary. The mansion was owned by fifty eight year old Richard Thomas and his fifty four year old sister, Helen Thomas, whom Cooper had previously worked for, and it sounds like he was expecting the residents to

be unoccupied. However, Helen happened to be there, and Cooper killed her with a shotgun blast to the face when she recognized his voice. Before Cooper had a chance to leave, Richard returned home and was killed with a shotgun blast to the face as well. Cooper subsequently set fire to the house in an attempt to destroy evidence before fleeing

the scene. On June twenty ninth, nineteen eighty nine, Cooper committed another double murder in Pembrokeshire, and this time the two victims were fifty one year old Peter Dixon and his fifty two year old wife, Gwenda Dixon, a couple who'd traveled to the area on a camping trip. The Dixons were taking a walk down Pembrokeshire Coast path when they crossed paths with Cooper, who was carrying a sawd off shotgun, and he proceeded to rob and tie up

the couple before sexually assaulting Gwenda. Cooper then forced the Dixons to hand over their bank card and provide their personal identification number before he fatally shot them. In a bizarre turn of events, Cooper had recently been a contestant on the popular British game show Bullseye, and the episode aired only one month before the crime took place. In fact, footage from the show would have actually be used to match Cooper to a composite sketch of the suspect, which

have been created from eyewitness descriptions. Two decades later, Cooper was finally linked to both of these double homicides via DNA evidence, and after being convicted in May twenty eleven, he was sentenced to life imprisonment.

double shotgun in the United Kingdom are extremely rare. Like I mentioned earlier, it seemed like whoever killed Harry and Meghan was very skilled at using a shotgun, and we know that Cooper previously murdered at least two couples in that fashion. As you might recall, the barrels of a twelve bore shotgun, two shotgun cartridges, and a holdall bag were discovered in a quarry and a mine shaft located

in close proximity to the Toos farm. While it's never been conclusively proven that these items were used in the murders, is worth noting that the shotgun barrels were painted white, which is something that Cooper liked to do with his own shotgun. But while there are some similarities between the Twos murders and Cooper's other crimes, there are also a number of differences. Cooper's victims received a shotgun blasted the face, whereas the Twoses were shot in the back of the head.

The Thomases and the Dixons were murdered in Pembrokeshire, which is where Cooper pretty much lived his entire life, but it's around one hundred miles away from Loanhari, and there's nothing to indicate that Cooper had any familiarity with the area at all, other than the fact that he once attended an appointment at a hospital in the nearby town of Bridge and one year before the Twos murders.

they would just so kilessly discard it. I'm thinking that they would hold on to it because they're going to use it shortly after to kill again.

from the evidence. And we still don't know, oh, if Cooper killed any additional victims after nineteen ninety three, because like I said, they were still trying to link them to additional cold cases. But if he was someone who liked to kill for the thrill of it, like you said, I could definitely see him wanting to use the same murder weapon each time.

which seems very out of character for him. Remember, the main reason Cooper murdered the Thomases was because he decided to burglarize their mansion and was not expecting them to be there, And it sounds like Cooper picked out the Dixons at random when he came across the couple on the coastal path and decided to rob them. Definitely does not seem like robbery was a primary motive for the

Jueses murders, so why would Cooper have targeted them. It just seems like there was something a lot more personal about this crime. Now, Cooper wound up being linked to the Thomas and Dixon murders by DNA testing, but for many years it was unclear if any DNA evidence even existed in this case due to how much the crime scene is contaminated at the twos farmhouse. But of course, since the police announced their intention to perform a new

forensic review in twenty twenty three. That implies that they did have some physical evidence to work with, and while they've never officially confirmed this, it's easy to assume that this led them to the eighty six year old man who was recently arrested. Like we just mentioned, this man is obviously not John Cooper, So while Cooper may have seemed like a compelling suspect in the past, it now seems apparent that he probably wasn't the perpetrator.

with murder or go on trial. I have no idea what kind of evidence the authorities have on this man, but I'm guessing they hoped that by taking him into custody and bringing his story back into the spotlight again, they might wind up receiving additional evidence or information that strengthens their case against the suspect and makes them comfortable

enough to file charges. The fact that he is eighty six years old might mean that investigators are making a last ditch effort to ensure that he faces justice while he is still alive, and if they were willing to release him on bail, that likely means they don't consider him to be a flight risk. Without knowing this person's identity, we can only speculate about what's going on here.

So by arresting this individual, would it give people in his circle confidence to say, the police have something. If I know anything and I went forward, they would believe me,

whereas before maybe I was scared to come forward. So I think this very strategic that they wanted, yes, media attention on the subject, but they wanted people who knew this eighty six year old to say, hey, if you can let us know information, we have our sights on this person, You're not going to be at risk to disclose information that you might have been scared to disclose before,

because we would actually act on it. And so I think they also were hoping that someone who had information would feel more confident to come forward and disclose, knowing that this person would likely be sent to prison if more information came out.

finally face justice. So even though the Twoses were always in constant communication with their daughter, I have a feeling that something may have been going on in their lives during this time perce period which they never told Cheryl about. If this individual is currently eighty six years old, then that means that they would have been around fifty four when the crime took place, which is not the age when you'd expect someone to murder an elderly couple as

some sort of random thrill kill. The fact that this person was just over a decade younger than the twos is makes me think it was someone who knew them personally. I've always found this whole case to be a major head scratcher, And if this eighty six year old man is eventually charged with the murders and stands trial. Perhaps we will finally learn the full truth about what happened. Unfortunately, this crime pretty much destroyed the lives of Cheryl Twos

and Jonathan Jones. So they, Harry and Meghan all deserve justice. So if you happen to have any information about the murders of Harry and Meghan Twos, please contact the appropriate authorities. Jules Ashley, any final thoughts on this case.

It stole the lives of Harry and Megan, but it also stole from Cheryl and Jonathan, both physically and emotionally and mentally. But it also stole from their child who never got to meet their grandparents, also didn't ever get to meet the best version of their mom and dad because of the struggles that they were going through due to shame, stigma, judgment from the community, and the loss of their parents. So, for me, it runs so deep.

It's a generational effect. It's one of those things that, like we said before, it wasn't Jonathan, and so that means somebody else was allowed to live a life, possibly even hurt other people and get away with it. So the idea that there is still attention on it is so interesting and I don't know if the proper word is exciting, but it is because there's generations of people saying, we still have time, Please show us some semblance of

you know, accountability. In this case, You're never going to get justice because Harry and Megan are gone, but please give us somebody to hold accountable so that Jonathan's name is finally relieved to some extent, maybe Cheryl doesn't have to look over her shoulder as often, and maybe this, you know, grandchild of Harry and Megan, can have just another piece of a healing puzzle to say, I didn't even know them, and yet it's rocked my life that

they were taken from us. So to me, it's that long term generational effects that you never know, one call, one little piece of evidence that someone doesn't even think it's significant, could change the whole trajectory of these people's future.

Not only did they have to deal with the deaths of Harry and Meghan and the incredible emotional weight and impact that that had, but having to deal with Jonathan being incarcerated, then being let out a year later, and then the social stigma that accompanies that because the fact that this was covered intensely in England as well as it was in Wales is something that I'm sure impacted them because you're getting that side eye from random people

or the people you know are whispering about you behind your back and then to be the child growing up, and that is the reality. Like Ashley said, you don't get to meet that version of your parents before all of this happened. There's an innocence that has been stolen, and then almost an innocence of that child that is stolen as well. And I keep going back to that plummy voiced individual that was at the solicitor's office with Harry. I keep thinking that there has to be some connection.

There has to be somebody that thought that they would financially benefit from this, or thought that they had some right to the farm. It's so hard for me to grasp that this could just be a potential thrill kill and that somebody just decided to go to this farm and annihilate whomever was there and it happened to be Harry and Meghan, and that they were just so nice to invite some random stranger into their home and offer them tea while they were in the middle of cooking dinner.

It feels to me, and I obviously can't know all things are in play until we know who this eighty six year old individual is, if he is indeed responsible, but just feel like it has to be somebody known to the couple.

I released Update episode number seven for the podcast. But right before it was about to drop, I suddenly heard this news about an arrest in the twos murder's case, and it was like, Wow, wasn't expecting this to close

off the year. So I instantly thought, we have to talk about this one on the path went Chili and revisit it now that we have this news, because I hadn't listened to my original episode in a while, and I was like looking through my old script and looking for clues about this eighty six year old man, and I'm thinking to myself, Oh, yeah, I'd forgot about this plumby voice stranger who visited this solicitor's office with Harry. I wonder if this is the man they're referring to.

And also that mysterious man in the trench code who was seen walking down the road about a week before the murder. So the pieces of the puzzle are starting to come together here, but we just still don't know the full truth. And of course, when I first learned about this case, I never believed that Jonathan Jones was guilty. I just thought the original police investigation was a travesty where they compromised potential evidence by not securing the crime scene.

It appeared they had a major case of chunnel vision against Jonathan and they took him to trial with extremely weak evidence, and thankfully the higher courts the thought that the conviction was a miscarriage of justice and the immediately released Jonathan from prison after only one year. But it still caused a lot of trouble for him and Cheryl because he was still recognized as a convicted murderer in the eyes of the law, and Cheryl also lost both of her parents and a lot of people thought that

she was remaining in a relationship with their killer. But regardless of whether this eighty six year old man is ever charged and ever spends any time in prison, I think this news does show that Jonathan is finally going to receive full vindication. So hopefully the authorities at some point announced that he's factually innocent and say that he's officially been exonerated, even give him some compensation for the year that he had to spend in prison for a

crime he did not commit. So yeah, hopefully we learn the full truth about what happened and that this eighty six year old man faces justice if he is in fact guilty, because for many years this has been a major head scratcher to me and I would love to learn the full truth about what actually happened.

ten dollars tier. One of the features we offer is a audio commentary track over classic episodes of Unsaved Mysteries, where you can download an audio file and then boot up the original Unsolved Mysteries episode on Amazon Prime or YouTube and play it with my audio commentary playing in the background, where I just provide trivia and factoids about the cases featured in this episode. And incidentally, the very first episode that I did a commentary track over was

the episode featuring this case. So if you want to download a commentary track in which I make more smart ass remarks about Jewel Kaylor, then be sure to join Tier three.