How to Meet Yourself with Dr. Nicole LePera

We tend toward negativity, self pity, jealousy, or fear. We see what we don't have instead of what we do. We think things that hold us back and dampen our spirit. But it's not just about thinking. Our actions matter. It takes conscious, consistent, and creative effort to make a life worth living. This podcast is about how other people keep themselves moving in the right direction, how they feed their good Wolfe thanks for joining us our guest on this episode.

You may have heard on our Gratitude episode that came out around Thanksgiving. It's Dr Nicole Appara and author and clinical psychologist in private practice. Nicole was trained in clinical psychology at Cornell University and the School for Social Research, and also studied at the Philadelphia School of psychoanalysis. She's the author of two books, How to Do the Work, and her most recent, discussed here with Eric, how to Meet Yourself, the Workbook for self discovery. Hey everyone, this

is Jenny. One of my absolute favorite things is when we hear from listeners of the show, and something we hear quite often is that one of the biggest obstacles to feeding the Good Wolf is remembering. Because life is busy and we get caught up in routines and we're all on autopilot so much at time. So to help with that, we've started sending a couple of text messages after each episode is released to listeners who sign up

for them, and it's something we're offering for free. A listener wrote us and said the message has caused me to pause, even if just for a moment, and help me to remember important bits of wisdom, bringing them to the forefront of my mind. Remembering is the hardest part, and the text messages are super helpful. So if you'd like to hear from us a few times a week via text, go to one you feed dot net slash text and sign up for free high Nicole, Welcome to

the show. Thank you so much for having me, Eric, I am really excited to have you on. We're going to be discussing your book, which is called How to Meet Yourself, the Workbook for self discovery. But before we get into that, we'll start, like we always do, with a parable. There's a grandparent who's talking with their grandchild and they say, in life, there are two wolves inside

of us that are always at battle. One is a good wolf, which represents things like kindness and bravery and love, and there's a bad wolf, which represents things like greed and hatred and fear. And the grandchild stops and thinks about it for a second, looks up at their grandparents, says, well, which one wins, and the grandparents says, the one you feed. So I'd like to start off by asking you what that parable means to you in your life and in

the work that you do. Absolutely. I think for me, Um that powable really illustrates what I believe is our core state of being, which is in kindness and compassion, and those two wolves. I think when we're not you know, living, reacting being from that space like you're saying, greed and all of those others, you know, I think more traditionally negative things that we associate with. In my opinion, that really is emblematic of the effects of our experiences and

namely trauma. So what that parable really represents to me is the empowerment and the choice that we can make that regardless of how much we're carrying from our past experience, is how much we're living feeding, if you will, that negative wolf, that ultimately we can make a different choice at any time. And I talked about all of those different choices, all of the ways that were stuck in our past, and of course all of the ways we can empower ourselves to change the future direction of our

lives in my work. Yeah, I love that. I think that's a great place to jump off from. Maybe we could start for just a couple of minutes talking about what sort of led you to really diving deeply into this work to create in the community that you had to teaching other people about this stuff. What was it that brought you to this work. Yeah, I think that's

a really really great place to start. And what brought me to this work was, you know, several years into obtaining my clinical my PhD in clinical psychology, opening the private practice that as long as I can Remember I was always driven, wanting, curious about the mind and humans.

So I was very early on on that trajectory to become the psychologist sitting in a room with a practice, and I achieved that somewhere in my mid twenties late twenties and going about my life living in Philadelphia, the city of my hometown that I was choosing to live in with a partner, and came to realize how stuck I was feeling, and came to hear that word in particular reflected in at this point clients that I had been seeing since I opened my practice, some for many

years of increasing insight awareness, even sometimes action plans. I really try to work in a very action oriented way, giving clients tools, choices, new actions to leave each session to really create the change or leave the symptoms, change the way that they're functioning in their relationships around their day to day life. And I kept coming up against that word of stuck. No matter how much insight and awareness, client after client would come in and begin to feel

alongside of me increasingly disempowered. So my journey eric really began when I first got curious seeing that same pattern in myself, checking all of the boxes that I thought were going to lead to this life of fulfillment, and yet I didn't feel connected to my life at all.

I didn't feel connected to my partner. And ultimately, in that journey of curiosity, I was met with a whole new world of science of our brain, our mind, and the connection between our mind and our body that I couldn't look away from and really embarking on my own journey of changing, you know, my life really in a transformational way and really inspired me to begin to speak the more whole, comprehensive story um to the clients that I was working with and then ultimately into my first book,

How to Do the Work. And so let's go back to you practicing clinical psychology. Then clearly you were doing a lot of good things. You were giving clients a lot of useful stuff. What shifted in your approach or what did you have to add to the approach in order for it too? I think you just used the

word to become more whole. Yes, it was more of an add to the approach, and one of the first things was adding a layer of understanding, and the understanding was really around the power of our subconscious mind or really the space in our brain that houses all of the habits, and so some listeners may be very aware of the habits go to bed that you know, take them through their day, and others and that might not really be sure of what I mean when I say habit,

But really habits begin the moment we wake up. What are the first things that we typically do. You'll see a consistency of how you approach your day, and we can even drop in a little more to begin to explore what our mental habits are. Our mental world, our thoughts specifically are very habitat. We don't tend to narrate

our story in a different way. We tend to rehash the same stories, meanings assigned to all of our events day in and day out, and ultimately then our reactions, how we cope, how we navigate life in our relationships are all very habitual. And understanding again that our subconscious actually prefers those habits because it feels a sense of familiarity or of certainty. It now, over time, has learned exactly what to anticipate happens next, because it always happens next.

So now, just mapping this conversation onto my client work in session with other humans when we're having these very beautiful, insight oriented conversations were typically in a different part of our brain entirely, we're in the gifted part of our brain called the prefrontal cortex, where we can think logically. We're calmer, we can have a grounded approach and imagine

future outcomes that are different than the outcomes we've been living. However, in time, what happens Once that client left my room, left the treatment room, those habits took over, and ultimately, when we are not conscious to how we're showing up, we're going to continue to recycle the same ways that we once showed up because no amount of logic will

override the comfort in that familiarity. To simplify it, we can have a litany of reasons why these new choices are going to serve us, but in that moment in time, it will just register as that possible threat because we don't know yet what comes next. And ultimately, that I think was the first major shift is explaining to the many shame at this point humans I was working with who couldn't understand why they were so stuck, who began, just like myself, to assign all of these meetings. Well,

it must be my personality something I can't change. It must be my genetics. Right, these things are just inborn and I can't be any other way. And ultimately, one of the main things that I hope my new workbook highlights is how all of these habits that make up who we are and how we're acting aren't necessarily who we are at our core. Yeah. I love that that ties so closely into some of the work I do in a program I call spiritual habits. The word spiritual

you could almost use as psychological. It just depends how you define this stuff, right, But it really is recognizing, as you're saying, that there are habits of mind that are healthier than other habits and we just are on autopilots so much of the time, and so how do we change that? And one of the things you talk about in the book is this idea that this change happens little bit by little bit by a little bit, moment by moment by moment by moment, Like we have

to keep repeating these things. And I think what you were just saying about coming into the psychologist office and you have an insight is valuable. But if it doesn't translate into lots of little repeat changes. Then you're right. The habits just reinforce themselves because the brain loves to take shortcuts. And that's what habits are to a certain degree, right, It's just a shortcut that the brain is like, well, I don't have to think about that anymore. I can

devote my energy to thinking about something else. And that's the essence of autopilot that you talk about, And to speak to your point, it really is the consistency that the habit is created when we repeat a daily action over and over again more often than not, until that

becomes more or less right. What we do, what we think, how we are in that moment, and I think very understandably, and to get there, of course, we have to repeat that consistently enough, and I think really understandably for a lot of us, when we're in the depths of our suffering or when we're feeling inspired a change, we can't tolerate, right, life as it is as we know it. It's really natural to want to white knuckle it and change our

life from top to bottom starting tomorrow. Start to eat difference, start to sleep, different management, stress, differently, relate to others in a completely whole new way, really understandably, because our idea is if we change really quickly and transform ourselves overnight, then we could get to the place of limiting our

suffering or relieving our suffering quicker. However, we have to understand, like I was sharing our subconscious mind, and because it's the repetition of these habits, the more new we do,

the more overwhelmed we're going to become. It's going to be really frightening to imagine the outcomes of my life looking completely different from top to bottom starting tomorrow, and that resistance that will happen, whether it's the thoughts in my mind convincing me out of the endless to do list all of the reasons why this isn't working and not to be bothered doing this yet again today because nothing's changing, or for some of us, that drops into

our body we begin to have a new experience. Maybe for some of us it's even being connected to a body and all the sensations that are living in that body. We feel different than we usually feel, or we feel uncomfortable, we feel distressed, we feel the feelings right that have been present all along. All of the reason why if we're listening to our minds if we're listening to our body, and that discomfort. So many of us revert right back

to that familiar pattern. So I'll speak often when I talk about consistency about a practice that I call setting an intention for a small daily promise. Whatever that outcome is, break it down into the most manageable bite size, even to the point where you almost want to roll your eyes because what change will happen? And practice making that choice as consistently as possible. That will do two things. The first thing it'll do it it'll limit the overwhelm.

You're already going to feel overwhelmed doing something new. So that resistance I suggest to expect it to be there doesn't necessarily mean you're going in the wrong direction. I think a lot of us miss assigned that to be our intuition, guiding us back into these right old habits that are just us. So once we have language, oh this is I resistance. It's keeping me safe. It wants me to go back into that familiar I can stay calm and continue to make this choice even when it's uncomfortable. First,

that's the first thing it does. Second thing it does it allows us to begin to show alignment between the intention I'm setting for how I want to show up

differently and the actual action of showing up differently. Because the large majority of us, especially if we've been unconscious to our autopilot for a lifetime, have lived what I call in habits of self betrayal, where we have many different intentions or our actions don't align with our best interests are once our needs, or sometimes even the very direct intention we set for ourselves. So the more we show that alignment, I'm making a small promise, I'm keeping it.

I'm not criticizing myself for how small it is. I'm rebuilding that. In my opinion, what that translates to is self trust, is self confidence, and is empowerment. Yeah, there are so many things you said in there that I could piggyback off of. In the coaching work I do

with people, we take a very similar approach. I talk about it, and you know listeners won't be able to see this, but I got my hands sort of straight up and down, and I talked about when we do what we say we're going to do for ourselves, there's an interior alignment that feels good. And when we don't when we make promises to ourselves, I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna do that, and we don't. We feel out of alignment, and over time we increasingly I loved what

you said about self trust. We don't trust ourselves. You know, people will say to me, I'm just the kind of person can't finish anything, I start lots of things or And it really is that realization that like, well, okay, we have a tendency in that direction, but we can unwind that, but we may have to unwind it little

bit by little bit. And the other thing that you talked about that brought to mind for me was, you know, when I was twenty four, I was a homeless heroin addict, and I did change my life kind of overnight everything, but I did it by going into like a treatment center where everything was different and all that change was supported. So there are ways in which we can make big

change in our life, particularly in a crisis. But my experiences it almost always has to happen in a different environment because our current environment, the people, the routines, the physical location, it has such a sense of dragging things back to what's expected in that environment. And again I mean more than just place. But you know, our total

environment is so important. Yes, I couldn't agree more. And a lot of times, you know, whether we see this in those context of leaving for a kind of structured treatment experience or going on vacation, having a weekend retreat, so many of us, I think, fine, that we can restructure life almost completely and be this new person in this new context, and then before long, at least once we get home, we're right back in those familiar patterns

because we have to realize that we aren't interconnected being really simply, what that means is we are always in connection with other humans around us and the natural environment around us. So when we're going back into a system that has set expectations repetitive behavior, yours right that if some of us been repeated for a lifetime depending on how often or how consistently we've been in one particular environment's location, relationships, etcetera. Right now we're fitting into almost

like a puzzle. We can think of it, and my piece right fits in right there, and it becomes really hard to step out of that framework or those set of expectations. And I just want to piggyback on something you were saying earlier. I think sometimes another byproduct of living in our habit self repeating things, engaging in these habits of self betrayal, becoming right the self professed person

who just can't change or finish anything. A second thing we do, and I've lived this experience myself, is we don't look at or we don't assign any responsibility to us who's unable to finish something. We point the finger at the person who, if only they didn't show up this way, I wouldn't, or the environment or something outside of me right that's making me, leaving me no choice spot And this is again language I think that really

illustrates the lived experience. And when we're not conscious, when we're in autopilot, when all of those habits and patterns are firing at the already, we actually very understandably don't have those choices, and we can feel very out of control, very reactive, very disempowered, and it becomes very easy right to point the finger outside of us, as opposed to saying yes, circumstances are happening, relationships, other individuals are around me, and they're choosing to show up in the way that

they are choosing to show up, and I am still responsible for how I'm responding to that environment or my participation in it at all. Yeah, And I don't know who said this, but what you're pointing to is that in those moments we tend to either go into blame or shame. Right, we are blaming others or we're feeling shameful about our inability to change, neither of which is

a very helpful place to be. Right. We don't change out of shame, right, It's not an empowering place to change from, so I think to your point, it's more sort of recognizing these habits and patterns, and it is so hard when so much of it is subconscious. I recently had a conversation with gab or Mate, and he talks very eloquently about how all of us are faced with a balance between attachment and authenticity in early days in our lives, attachment always wins. We sacrifice our authenticity.

But the other thing that he said often in that book that's really been on my mind a lot, is about how much of that process becomes completely below the level of consciousness. It's not like I know, I'm like, oh boy, that doesn't feel uncomfortable. I'm going to push it down. It's not even there to notice, at least without much greater powers of discernment than we may start the journey with. I want to speak to this and this is so powerful, Eric, and this concept of shame.

I love how you kind of distinguished shame or internal

blame out external just focusing on shame. I think something quite universal unites us all as humanity, regardless of where you are on your experience or where you are in the globe living your experiences, because the reality of it is, we're all humans raised by other humans, and the generations that came before us, and my opinion, were ill equipped, didn't have the actual objective resources and or the awareness that even emotions and kind of a lot of the

conversations that are now coming to light are a need in childhood. So what I see that quite universally unifies us all is actually a core experience of that shame.

And it really kind of is incorporating Gabor's beautiful idea around authenticity and attachment, because when we didn't have the safe space to just truly be who we are, however, that was in childhood, as very few of us did, when we didn't have the attuned caregiver, like I did not have a human who can help me tend to my emotions, understand them, bring myself find the tools that allow me to bring myself back into safety. My mom was too distracted and consumed and disregulated in her own trauma.

So when we lack that safety, we will all adapt. And the first thing that will happen is because of the emotional immaturity, the developmental immaturity of our brain. We can't have the vantage point of an adult. We don't understand all of the mature factors that contribute. Like I was able to even just now acknowledge my mom was traumatized based on her pain. We don't have that capacity

in childhood. In our very egocentric view, as we call it in the field right, all roads lead back to it must have been something wrong with me, So at our core, I find it so many of us have that core routed belief and shame of not being worthy, of not being lovable exactly as we are. And to speak to your point about it being so underneath the awareness, probably for three decades of my life, I fought tooth and nail. I don't shame, I don't feel shameful. I'm I'm fine, this is who I am, how I am,

I'm celebrated in these aspects of my life. I'm I'm very comfortable with myself. Little did I know that until I began to unpack and pull back those layers of the onion. What I came to realize my shame was so pushed down, this feeling of unworthiness, that my entire way of being as the overachiever, blazing the path to get the PhD, to do all of these things was actually my protection that was very validated by the outside world,

protecting me from even feeling that shame. So it really took until recently to be able to say, you know what, I don't feel good enough as I am. It's very difficult for me to feel comfortable not performing a role or a service, or teaching or doing or performing right in any way for something external, because again, at my core, we can become so unconscious ourselves, and for some of us were living in a way that feels very valid right, or that we're validating or we're attempting to valid this

internal sense of worthiness. Yet that feeling of disconnection I was describing that began my journey of lack of fulfillment. All of that was really related to how unworthy I felt, how I was literally exhausting my mind and body trying to perform to the point where before I began my journey, I was fainting. I was so depleted in my resources, my nervous system was so shut down from action ng right, because at my core, that was my only way of

proving this worthiness. So again, I think it's a really beautiful, powerful point you're making, which is for some of us, it's so below the surface we can't even let ourselves emotionally touch how it felt right to be that little child that didn't feel worthy of that love and connection from the most important person in our life. So let me ask you a question about what you just said there, because I think it's really interesting. I have to tie a couple of things together real quick in order to

do it. But you talk about an authentic self, right, there is a part of us that is less conditioned by all of our experience, and it has certain traits to it. And then you also talked about this pushing yourself to get success through the outside world. I look at you, and I know you're very successful in what you're doing, so that doesn't happen by not putting effort in.

So how do you determine for yourself when the pushing of yourself is coming from maybe your authentic self that likes to share and wants to help and actually likes the feeling of creating and making versus I'm being driven by a sense of unworthiness under the surface, because this is really subtle territory. Yes, and I love this and

I think about this often. So I'm going to answer the more process um foundational, you know, approach, and then that more acute kind of in the moments of actually making the decision will kind of map it on there. Because the foundational approach to figuring out our way to this distinction, to reconnecting to our authentic self is part of the journey of getting that clarity. So for me, that meant becoming really conscious of these different habits and patterns.

Mainly for me, I was able to see all of the different ways right I showed up in performance. I was able to understand that coming from a lack of safety, I didn't feel safe enough just being who I was, So the safety I was able to attain was showing up in this particular way that indicated to me that I needed to do some of the somatic or body work.

My nervous system was completely dis regulate it. So spending I'm really fast forwarding the journey right, spending the amount of time to drop into my body to create safety, and even being in my body where my emotions live, to be able to distinct and calm my stress reaction down so I can start to make space for things outside of stress, like sadness, like anger, like happiness, all of the other feelings that had no space when I

was so disregulated. And then, over time but more connected I am to my body, the more I can in those moments ask myself, right, what is my intention? Whatever choice I'm going to make, So it might be the choice of presenting something or you know, putting out a piece of content, what is my intention? Now that I

have clarity, I can differentiate. I can hear when my body is responding the part of my body that I'm most interested in connecting to where I believe our authentic self, our essence, our soul or spirit, whatever name it is

for you, I believe it speaks through our heart. Our heart is the most powerful organ, even more powerful than our brain in terms of its electromagnetic reach, which simply means it's receiving signals from our environment at a greater distance than even our brain can, and it's sending signals out,

So how I'm feeling is reflected. Of course, all of this is outside of our visual awareness in our environment, and in my opinion, when we're talking about finding our intuition, many of us are looking up to our minds to narrate the right thing to do when in reality, and this is again why I always emphasize the body. Our intuition is going to speak in a different language. A

lot of times it's nonverbal. It's in sensations, feelings of lightness right or freedom, ease in my heart, when I'm walking in a direction that feels good to me, feelings of constriction, doom, right, clenching in my heart, maybe when I'm going in a direction that's not. Thoughts are light bulbs, ideas like musings, images, And again I'm giving different examples of how it could speak because it speaks different to

all of us. So for me, the journey of gaining the clarity meant building in those moments on only of safety in my body, but of quiet, of learning how to understand my internal signals, my wants, my needs, and again my intentions. So now mapping that onto those acute moments, whenever I'm faced with a choice, I have the opportunity to check in and say, Okay, Nicole, why is it?

What is your hope for doing? This? Is my hope on Oh, so people can celebrate me and tell me how smart I am and tell me that you know they changed their life because of what I said? Or is my intention that this isn't a really important message for me. I don't actually know what people will say or do, and they could outright and misunderstand it even and I am confident that I am saying or speaking

this truth because it's important for me to do. And that is the moment of First we need the space, the connection with our body, and then we can actually drop in in real time and get that clarity. And you could still and sometimes you might make the choice to do something for an external reason. In my opinion, as long as you've done so consciously, you can also

give yourself the opportunity not to do that thing. I love that every part of that, but especially the part there at the end, because without tagging that end thing on, it becomes let me tap into how I'm feeling. Do I want to do or not do this thing? And if I feel like I don't want to do it, I don't do it right and we don't want that.

And this is where I think the work you talk about on values comes in about knowing what's important to us, because at times, you know, in order to accomplish something that's important to us, there are going to be moments in there where internally there's just a you know, sense of dread, Like I had to do taxes last week, right, and that's part of what I got to do for this business. And you know, if I checked in with my internal self, it would have said, no, don't do

it right. It's actually it was saying that very clearly, um, and I had to go, well, okay, you know, I mean this needs to get done for these these different reasons. But I love that idea of it becomes conscious, right, it becomes a conscious choice. We can make all kinds of choices for all kinds of reasons, but the ones that are you know, the best place to be operating out of is the choice that is a conscious choice.

I am choosing to do this because X, because it feels right, because it supports something I value, and just to add into maybe because I want to show up in my relationship in this way. I think relationships is another area where we can find a point of negotiation. Right. We don't have to be fully in service of another person like I had lived the majority of my life, and we also don't have to be fully selfishly in service, right.

I think the best relationships are where there's an equal energetic exchange in some moments where maybe you aren't choosing right to watch the movie that your partner or your loved one or your friend wants to watch. Knowing right, you know that maybe somewhere down the line that switches and you partners, loved one's friends supports make choices right. So again, I do want to make space for that

gray area of negotiation. But again, to speak to your point, that only becomes possible when we're conscious to what our intentions are, what our wants are, what our needs are, and even more someone we feel comfortable sharing that with another people bringing those right into that relational space. We've been talking about a bunch of subjects that are in

the book. I mean, everything we've talked about is covered, and you have lots of exercises, but I did want to turn for a second to something you were just saying there, which is about sort of creating this safety. And you talk about before we start this journey, and you've got different sections about meeting different parts of ourselves. You say, we've got to sort of build our own

internal support system. So talk to me about some of the ways that we can build that internal support system or that safety that you were just referring to that allows us to connect with what's actually real. So safety and the reason why this the section that you're referring to, Eric comes right at the beginning of the book, is integral to our healing, to our even expression and meeting

of our needs. All of that is really foundational. Again, this goes back to the reality that very few of us felt safe in our bodies and our relationships and

our environments, in our life experience itself. You'll see I also present what I'm calling an authentic needs pyramid, where kind of I honor our basic physical needs being movement, rest, nutrients for our body, oxygen of course for our lungs, our emotional needs being, you know, emotionally safe, supported, connected, interconnected with other people, and then that allows us Once those base needs are met, then we can begin to feel safe enough to tap into my passion, my creativity,

my playfulness, right that higher kind of the things that most of us are seeking when we think authentic self. None of that is possible without that foundation of safety, and very few of us feel safe in our physical bodies given our past experiences. So building that foundation at the beginning of the journey our resources toolkits that we will want to go back to as we begin to peel back those onions. And with oxygen being one of our daily needs that is happening for us. Our body

is always breathing. I often like to suggest breath work, and I give a many different types of simple, easy back pocket breathwork practices because again consistency is key here of different ways we can use our breath or our intentional breathing to help our nervous system regulate, and really

simply I'll simplify breathwork. If we're feeling anxious, if we're always waiting for the next you to drop, our hearts racing out of our chests, our breath might even feel quickened right um might even feel tenseness in my muscles. I'm in other words, I'm fight or flight. I'm waiting to fight or flee the thread at hand. My body is mobilized, ready to go. It's too much activity. I'm simplifying all this. We can learn how to do calming, deep belly breaths to bring our body back into safety.

If I'm on the other end of that spectrum and I'm feeling listless, my muscles almost seemingly aren't present, I have no energy to even get out of better start my day. I might even be right calling myself depressed. Then I can do a more activating chest based I actually utilized the whim Hoff methot when I was so shut down. My nervous system was in that state. Remember how I described myself. I have no fulfillment nothing, I feel nothing about this whole life around me. I don't

feel connected to my partner. That was because I was so shut down. So for me foundationally, I made a daily commitment to it was whim Hoff. I would pop him in YouTube and I would do a vigorous type of breathing again to simplify when my energy is low, I can actually mobilize it, activate it to again bring me back into that safety so our breath can be foundationally. And in the workbook I overview back pocket breathwork exercises that we can pop in, and we ought to begin

to pop in. I suggest we do so throughout our day consistently because this is one of those areas, especially breathwork. Oh, breath work, I can calm myself down. Great. Next time I argue with my partner and I'm getting ready to scream or yell or slam it or I'll do that. Back to this full circle conversation. When I'm in that moment, I'm in my habitself, my emotional brain is all lit up.

That logical part of my brain that even remembers this conversation has completely shut down, and I'm so just regulated. I've lost complete control. And I catch myself after the reaction right feeling shameful. So, unfortunately, the bearer of the band news is it's about practicing this breathwork consistently enough so that in that moment I can be regulated enough to be conscious to remember that I need to calm

myself down. Yeah, there's a few things in there. I think are worth noting, the last one being very important. I have found that for years with breathwork, I would hear about it and i would try it. I'd be okay, I'm really angry. Take five deep breath, and I'm like, wow, I didn't really do very much right. But what I found was that, like you said, I had to kind of practice it and get some degree of familiarity with it and know how to do it. Then I was able to use it. I love the fact that you

brought up there are different types of breath work. It's not just deep breath to calm down. We had whim Hoff on the show, and it's funny because if you've seen his videos, you know he is a very enthusiastic man. So the interview is basically whim Hoff yelling the whole time, and then, as you can tell, I'm a whole lot more sedate. It's it's very funny conversation of everybody loves the good Wolf, you know, like he's great, he has something else. I mean, I would love to have that

kind of enthusiasm. He is a great guy. But but that idea that there are different types of breath work and knowing which one we need it what times, and practicing it I found to be really useful. I just want to piggyback on that in a little giggle. So very early on, when I first met wim Hoff and saw this very outward personality display as I been felt when I met a similar type of person, I was

turned off that kind of person. Again, that mismatched for me from being so shut down from not And this is often when we react negatively critically of someone else, sometimes there's a little information there for us. And what I've came to realize that person rubbed me the wrong way for so many years because they were embodying a space at icon it right that enthusiasm. I was so shut down. I was so flat. I didn't even have the awareness that I had enthusiasm in me passion to

then relate to another person. So very early on, when I first saw him in his work, I avoided it. Um. I had to tolerate him when I began to engage in it, because again that mismatch for me turned critical as it it doesn't for a lot of us, and I didn't want to be near that because from my flat state of shut down, that was too much for me. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, And I do think what you're saying is that looking at what is causing such a strong reaction is is

very helpful. Why am I reacting so strongly to this? Why am I thinking that is so bad or wrong? Now, again, this isn't to say that we don't have values and morals and there aren't things that happen ethically that we go that's wrong. But when we're reacting to somebody's personality, right, and that's often a sign there's something going on inside us. Like you said, so we covered breath, What are some

other ways of getting to safety in the body? I talk about grounding in the moment so away we can ground a lot of times. And even speaking to this beautiful direction our conversation is going. When we're having a big reaction, I do want to stress or suggest us not to invalidate that reaction. A lot of us, I think when we hear this, oh, it's you know, it's overreactions disproportion. We might even hear that from other people

in our life. They're so dramatic. Calm down. We have to make space for the realness of that reaction, right, because it is coming from some time in someplace and

the bigness of it really is the bigness of those feelings. Now, again, we might be misinterpreting, misperceiving, imagining something that's present and there which is very similar to that very early past her full experience, but not to minimize the feelings that are present, because I do think a lot of us and even we might tell ourselves, well, I'm an adult now, that was decades ago, right, get over it, and honoring the reality of the bigness of those emotions really is

an important part of our journey, however, and this kind of maps onto them grounding in the present moment. It's a remnant of our past. Right, there was a similarity of something that we're experiencing now to this past moment. However, we have to remind ourselves that we're not what was probably that child that once was that teenager that was under supported and overwhelmed. We have to bring our consciousness back into the adult, the circumstances, the body, the choices

that we now have available to us now. And one of the ways we can do that is by making the most powerful choice we can make, which is where we put our attention. Right. So, while we might be in our minds, rehashing, narrating the scene at hand. Right, we might be overwhelmed by the emotions in our body.

If we can put our attention into the physical body objectively present in this moment in time, by maybe if we're sitting, if we're standing, if we're laying, turning our full attention to the points of contact right, feeling maybe my heels upon the earth, feeling my body weight if I'm laying, feel my entire body being supported by the bed,

the floor of the structure beneath me. Right, turning that spotlight of attention, as I call it, from our thoughts or from the body that's overwhelming us to the objective body, ground it in a safe, present moment. That's what's called grounding. We can do this even amplify the benefits of this by doing it in nature. When we do it on the actual natural earth, should we have access to that

depending on where we live now. Not only are we present in the current moment, we're able to connect our nervous system, which likely is disregulated in that moment, with the rhythmic pattern of the Earth, with the Earth's elector a magnetic frequency that actually is really calming for our human nervous system. And I noticed this very early on, having a racing mind my entire life, always being anxious

and on the verge of an anxiety attack. Where I found some semblance of peace and that was the thing I've always been searching for my whole life, peace and freedom was in nature. I found that when I was in nature, my thoughts were a little less loud, or they were there, but it was easier for me to look at the beauty around me and turn my attention

to where I was instead of what I was thinking about. So, if we're able to do earthing, grounding, whatever we want to call it, what that just means is paying attention to this my physical structure planet firmly in this time and space. And if I can do so in nature, and that's another really powerful way to send those calming signals of safety to my mind and my body. Yeah, I love that I have people do in the Spiritual

Habits program grounding in your senses and the idea. I mean, I did not invent this exercise, right, but like, what are five things I can see right now? What are five things I can hear? What are five things that

I can feel. What I find helpful about that structure for me is that it gives my brain just enough to do that it has a chance of sticking around because a lot of times for me, if it's like, all right, feel the feelings in your feet as you stand on the ground, I do that for about a second, I'm like, not a whole lot there, and bam, I'm right back in my brain. But looking for five things makes enough of a game of it that it's sort of my brain, you know, engages and it can be

really helpful. And I agree nature. I don't think I realized it until I was I don't know, thirty five years old, maybe that it was that important to me. But I have these moments like sometimes in nature where even if I'm having the thoughts like you said, I love that idea, they're not as loud. The other thing I sometimes think is like I'll always be able to come to places like this that whatever else is happening, you know my thoughts. I look around and I'm like,

but nature is here. It's free, Like if I'm worried about money, like, but nature is free, and look, I love of being here. It's soothing to me in so many different ways. I appreciate you bringing up your experience because I lived a very similar one in terms of any moment of stopping to turn my attention to my heels to sit in traditional meditation right in silence, felt

so uncomfortable. There came my resistance, all the thoughts. For me, it was all the to do list things I should be doing, self criticisms and or discomfort in my body that I was actively avoiding by not paying attention. So very similar to you, and I think probably a lot of listeners giving our attention something somewhat to do while we're paying attention to our very conscious experience. So for me it was I also one of the by products of living in that very stressed out body. A lot

of us come to find his attension. Our muscles are tight, maybe in particular spaces. For me, it's my mid to upper back, my neck, My posture even began to hunch and constrict forward from years of that constriction of my fight or flight nervous system response. So for me understand and the importance of the body and of moving and

stretching and releasing and resting my body. I began a conscious practice while I was doing gentle movement, gentle stretching, taking a gentle walk around the block, because when my body was in some version of action, even if it was just stretching to touch my toes, that gave me again that focal point because oh, my muscles are shifting, changing. It gave me something else to more fully pay attention

to that felt more approachable. So I'm really happy that we've offered that suggestion because I imagine a lot of listeners will fall into a camp like you and I and I definitely suggest even not maybe even something something physical,

washing the dishes, taking a shower. We can turn any moment into a moment to be conscious, and some of us might find value in having a something else, whether it's nature, the water, right, my muscle stretching, like you're saying, naming things in our environment, a little something to do

with our attention. Yeah. I'm a big meditation practitioner, and I mean, I get so much out of it, but I feel like I spent twenty years I won't say tasted, but a lot of years of being kind of on again, off again with it, and I think a big part of the problem there were a variety of things I was trying to do too much. But one of them was that the only thing in those days that you really read in books was about breath meditation, and I

was too amped up. And so all of a sudden one day somebody said, just go outside and listen to the sounds. Meditate on the sounds. And so quickly I was like, oh, this works. There was just enough going on, you know, because the breath, let's be honest, it's kind of boring, particularly when your discernment, your internal sensitivity is not very tuned. And so for me, sounds were it was enough going on, and that helped me learn to settle enough that now breath practices, all different kinds of

things work. And I think that's what you're getting to with movement too. You know, there are lots of ways to try and ground ourselves, to bring our attention, to focus our attention beyond simply sitting there and watching your breath, and if that is choosing to be something that isn't working for you despite repeated attempts, there are alternatives, There

are other ways to get a lot of that benefit. Yeah, And to speak to your point, just kind of scientifically physiologically, what's happening in that moment is our body is still active in fight or flight, so asking it to stop, right, our mind races our body is agitated. Right. Our body isn't like you're saying that alignment. It isn't mapped onto a com peaceful moment like we're supposed to be having

in meditation. Our body is actually sending signals to our mind, and our mind is going to try to interpret those signals in terms of alignment. That there's something very stressful, you know, happening at hand that I can't and shouldn't be you know, ultimately just just sitting here. And something else I just want to add to because I think this applies all of us that have health based anxiety,

where we're already monitoring our bodies, our breath, our heart rate. Right, turning that focus and being told to listen to your heart, listen to your breathing, right, is just turning up the amplitude on Well, oh my gosh, it was my heart out of rhythm right now, I having a heart attack. Right. So for health anxiety in particular, that internal focus is

actually we're too internally focus. So again, something else that came to mind while you're talking that I know is personally really helpful and continues to be a part of my journey is music. Putting in a headphone and for me just having and listening, not thinking thoughts and missing the song right tuning into the music, the melodies and how I'm feeling while I'm listening to that song was

able to again give me that ground at presence. But I think it's important to understand why a lot of us can't sit still, can't stop silence feels you know, overwhelming. It's not because something's wrong with us, especially if you've heard me just talk about needing to have those moments of silence to reconnect with our heart and you know, using that distinction for a lot of us stopping silence, what no, thank you, And again, all of that is

because our body doesn't feel safe. It's actually a nervous system state of regulation that allows us to be safely still and still connected to the world around us. So again really emphasizing everyone who's listening, was like, I can't sit still. I'm you know, I'm so relating to this idea of my thoughts are racing, I'm so uncomfortable in my body. That might be an indicator of really the importance of building in the consistency of that body practice,

that regulation, so that you can stop sit find that safety. Right. I mean, I think I had an intuitive sense. The fact that it was so hard for me to sit still and do that pointed to it was important, right, Like something's not right here. I love what you said about music. Sometimes all start people on a meditation practice who were just struggling and just it does not working, or they don't like it, or I just say, pick a piece of instrumental music, pick one instrument and just

follow it through the song. Follow one, and when your mind starts to wander, which of course it will do a hundred times, just go, well, what's that violin doing? And it's just another way of training the exact same muscles, but you're training them in a way that may feel a whole lot easier, safer, better. And I love what you're saying about changing our nervous system state takes a while. It's not as simple as being like, well back to what we've talked about. A lot is like you have

to do these things again and again. You're not gonna sit down and go like all right, well, now I'm gonna follow my breath and my nervous system, which has been disregulated for forty years, is suddenly going to just get in line. Absolutely. And then what I think most of us come to the awareness of, and my hope for those who choose to purchase the workbook especially um that first section in terms of our physical habits, I

was very intentional. Everything that I talked about, movement, rest, oxygen or or breath nutrients, all of that is actually necessary for our health of our nervous system. So back to these moments in time right where my lose access to my logical brain. I don't remember this breath work or whatever it is, this new thing I want to do. For a lot of us, it's because we don't have We're not feeding our nervous system the nutrients it needs.

We're not resting and getting the amount of sleep. I know most you know humans really struggle, you know, in terms of sleeping. It's those daily habits that help us have the regulation more consistently so that in those moments we can do something different. I think a lot of us will come to find that the daily habits of how we're caring for our body, we're not in attunement with what our body actually needs, or for a million different reasons, we're not acting in attunement with what our

body actually needs. You're describing some of these core things that our body needs, which very often end up being good habits that we want to develop, but they can be very difficult to develop for people. I know I need better sleep, but I'm not sleeping. Well, I know I need more movement, but I'm not moving, and and so we start to feel guilty again or or shameful.

Is your advice really then, just sort of like, Okay, don't give up, Just shrink what you're trying to do down to what is manageable for where you are, and sort of in essence, start where you are. Yeah, I think you know, starting in acceptance of that which we are, where things are right now is a suggestion that I offer for any aspect of our journey, especially if where especially as where we are right shifts and changes over time,

and especially just something like sleep. There's so many complicated different factors that impact how we're sleeping that include our sleep routines, are sleep hours, a sunlight that we're getting or not getting first thing in the morning, whether or not our body is even in that rest and digest or that parasympathetic state as a name implies or offers. When our body is peaceful, calm, save then all of those systems of digestion. This is oftentimes why we have

digestive issues. I lived probably almost three decades of my life with such severe constipation. Again a function of that constriction my digestion. Just like my body shut down, my digestion stopped. We could see the other end of the spectrum where we have IBS like symptoms. Same thing with rest. If my body is not in that parasympathetic state, if I'm in fight or flight laying in bed, I'm not going to be My body is not signaled that it's

time to rest. So that means all of the work that we're talking about in terms of regulating our nervous system before that moment of getting into bed, hopefully after we've gotten morning sunlight and we're going to bed at an early enough hour that will give us enough time to fall asleep. Right, So complicated, So to speak to your point of small incremental changes, even something like changing our sleep habits, and my opinion, oftentimes doesn't happen overnight.

We don't decide we need more sleep getting to bed, fall into a deep sleep, well, wake up, well rested tomorrow miraculously right. I just gave a litany of things that probably ought to need to happen to even prime something like sleep again. Movement also can become very complicated. Movement is one of those areas that, having been an athlete up until college, when I stopped and walked off

that hung my cleats from that softball field. I outside of living in a city which I did have to commute to and from work because I didn't have a car walking, I wasn't in the gym. I avoid it physical discomfort just like I avoid it emotional discomfort. When I went to stretch when I want to pick up something heavy, if my muscle screened out, as they will do if you don't use them over time, I stopped

doing that. So again, I think sometimes it sounds like such easy things, you know, sleep better, move but it's really understanding all of the different moving parts that have kept the stuck unable to do those things for so long, and then yes, making those small or incremental changes that probably aren't going to immediately allow us to sleep. One movement is probably not going to immediately write, release all the tension we've been carrying for years of our life

and our body. Though it will be the beginning of a habit which over time will right. Right, It's that phrase I love. It's a Tanzanian proverb is little by little, a little becomes a lot. And whether that's for the positive or negative, right we're speaking to it. That's how things accumulate so little and often is really, you know, very good advice. Let's turn to a core practice that you have. You talk about consciousness being the foundation of transformation.

You say that consciousness is awareness of our internal and external experience. But you've got a foundational practice called the daily consciousness check in, and you really suggest that this is something people do for a while to really get the hang of it and to really get what they can of it. So describe what that is. Absolutely. Consciousness in is setting the intention for beginning with at least one time during our waking day to spend that moment

first checking in. And I often like to shout out the technology that most of us walk around with them holding up a phone for those can't, say, setting an alarm for some time during our waking day when typically We're going to be hard at our habits, right working doing whatever it is that we do at that particular time, And chances are, by the time our phone dings and I hear this often foundational course for anyone who in rolls in my membership the self Healer circle is awakened consciousness.

And the first thing I'll hear is, oh, my gosh, my alarm went off, and I was shocked. I forgot I even said it, and I was too busy to do it, and I'll do it later. Right, That's that resistance in action though setting an alarm, setting a post it, what that is just doing is bringing to our conscious awareness this intention of doing something new, because otherwise, chances are we're just going to be marrying along unconsciously doing a thing we always do at that moment, in that context,

at that time. So when that alarm goes off, we can do two things. The first thing is, first, just notice my alarm went off. Where was my attention? Was I really fully immersed in what I'm doing, whether it's a conversation with someone else, the work I'm doing alone, interacting with my children on my walk, or was my attention somewhere else rehashing the argument I had this morning worrying about the project right due tomorrow, or maybe you're like me, I don't know where I was. I'm just

somewhere else on my spaceship. I'm not here, right, I'm just so disconnected. I'm not aware. When we come to the awareness that you're probably, like the large majority of us, are not fully immersed, present, conscious of what's happening. Now you can you said something very beautiful a couple of minutes ago, Eric, which is now? I can practice right, firing up an actual mental new space in my mind. Right,

I can activate my conscious awareness. And the more consistently I do that, and once I realized my attention is not in my thinking mind, I'm not consciously present. Right, I can use the hook of the sensations happening around me like you suggest, Right, what can I see do? I can use the hook of my breath, turn that spotlight to oh, how's my body? My breath? Let me just pay attention to the next five breaths. Right, I

can turn attention like we're talking about grounding. I can bring myself into awareness, and the more consistently I practice that, like the gym and I'm picking up those weights. I'm actually firing the hardware in my brain differently, And the more I strengthen now that connection, that neural network, the more likely it becomes that I have access to that

in the future. So to speak to your point, I suggest that we do this until the consciousness check in, expanding the check in from one time a day to two times a day. The hope is that we can access that state of conscious any time we choose, that we can drop in and determine where our attention is and pull it back fully immersed in the present moment, at any time. So for many of us, that means weeks months of practicing this consistently so that you have access to it. To be clear, do not set an

expectation right. Definitely suggest you don't set an expectation that you're all always conscious all the time. Right. Consciousness is a state where we can shift in and shift out of it. It's the ability to know how conscious we are and to bring ourselves back to conscious that we're building towards, because I do think some of us set up this unreal expectation that I'm fully conscious to every

single thing that's happening. For me every second of every day, and that's just not going to be fully possible, right right, Yeah, I don't think any of us are getting all the way there. And I love that idea in the Spiritual Habits program. That's one of the core challenges we're trying to solve is we have these things that we know and believe to be important, but we just don't ever remember them because we're so busy and we're so on autopilot.

So how do we actually interrupt that? You know, there's alarms? You know, we found a program we use I think it's called randomly Remind Me, and it will go off randomly, right, so you don't know when it's coming, it's just going to go off and and it's a great way of doing that. And you know, there are times that those things will go off where you legit to really probably can't pause, right, Like I'm in the middle of a

power point presentation to twenty people in my company. I probably just need to ignore the alarm and carry on. But there are a lot more times than we think where we have a minute thirty seconds to reflect. And I love that basic idea of just what what is in my consciousness? Right? Now where is my attention because

we start to learn some really foundational patterns. I mean, I know, for me, if it's not immersed in what I'm doing, it is eight percent of the time planning something or figuring something in the future out that's just where it goes. I don't tend to reflect backwards very much, but there are other people who will find I'm backwards

all the time. So for me, that then gave me the sense of like what to kind of look for and what I wanted to correct for, which is like every once in a while, Eric, I mean, sure planning is important. You've got to do some of that, but not percent of the time. Yes, And to to speak to the point of the pause too. I think sometimes we're not aware of how much we can utilize time

space distance right from something. We're so habitual picking up the phone right immediately upon a call or a text, or we have the idea that we need to respond or react to something immediately. And to speak to your point, you know, especially as we're beginning this work, as we're creating safety, to even tune into what it is and what I want pausing in real time and almost immediately choosing a new response, we might not have the clarity, the access, the knowing of what it is even that

we need to do in those moments. So really utilizing space and time right communicating to the person who needs you or you know, seemingly needs something from you in that moment that you're not available until you have a moment and for some of us it might be a minute, two minutes, maybe it's a day or two to really figure out and a tune to where you are on

and now. Of course this doesn't apply to immediate right, but more often than not, we're just so habitual that we're mid phone call and if we would have just hit pause, told person that we know, we're taking our own time and we'll get back to them before even negotiat or navigator here, what is the issue at hand to decide how available we are? And again I'm speaking from someone very externally oriented, always scanning, worrying about those

around me. I never had that space, so boundaries limits. Creating space beyond just a pause in a given moment with the expectation that I know exactly what it is next that I want our need was unrealistic for me. I actually had to create some real space between myself my relationships, limiting certain interactions directly asking for time and space to figure myself out before I had that clarity to know what it is I needed to change next. Yeah,

I think that's really good. It makes me think about and I just did this earlier this morning with my partner. She was like, I want to share something with you, and I was like, right now is not the best moment. No, you can't do that all the time. But what I tend to do when I'm not being conscious is I half listen and have to do what I was actually doing at the moment, and then become irritated because my

attention is split. So I found it way better to either say, yes, hang on, stop what I'm doing, turn my attention, or say right now is not a good time and we've done it enough between us where we actually mostly ask each other, is now an okay time? Because we both know that. You know our tendency is outward focused, so you know if you if you ask me something, I will give you all my attention, doesn't matter whether I really should or not in that moment.

I love that example. Yeah, I'm totally relating. I was giggling a little bit eric, because I find myself faced with that. You know, those choices often and for me it's not even sometimes a serious I need to talk to you, or do you have space? Or I need to share something emotional from my partner. Sometimes it's excitement, um someone you know, partner to learn something new and they want to share this new, exciting thing with me.

And I do feel again because of my conditioning, that deep rooted guilt, this idea or expectation that I should be always present, whether it's something joyful, exciting, curious, or something serious, And the reality of it is, like you're speaking, We're in different spaces, we have different wants and needs, and my inability or my choice not to be fully present in that moment might seem selfish, though ultimately that's best for the entire relationship because I may now choose

to show up at a time where I can give my partner full presence. That's how we develop connection. That's all we really want is to be seeing the attempt of someone to understand what we're sharing in that moment. And when we're showing up with attention different places or maybe even secretly resentful that you want to share something with me now, can't you see I'm busy that bleeds out into the relationships. So sometimes the pause can be

of best interest. Now we can both show up fully present to each other at a time that works for both parties. Yeah. I think that's so true, because that's what happens with me. I become resentful, and maybe resentfuls the wround world. I become irritated. Yes, Just last night on a walk, she was like, Hey, I was listening to this podcast and they were talking about this thing that you and I were talking about. You know, do you want to listen to it? And I just said

not right now? Like now again we said earlier, there are times we make a decision to not do exactly

what we want for the relationship, and there you know. So, I don't mean to make it sound like every time my partner comes to me, I'm like no, Um, I'm saying that anytime I do say no, I counted as a significant victory given where I come from, right, given my tendency to just be like, oh, you want me to listen to it, Okay, I'll listen to it, but i'll listen to it and I'll be irritated that you've asked me to listen to it instead of simply saying no.

So it's just that sort of transparency. So let's move on to another practice that you talk about, which is self witnessing. What is self witnessing? Self witnessing is an extension of consciousness. I think oftentimes even the way we were describing consciousness was kind of a moment. Right in

this acute moment, I'm paying attention to what's happening. Self witness we can think of, is expanding that practice so that in real time, because that's the reality is we always have access to that conscious state of awareness to be present to our internal and our external world. Our mind is always scanning down our body, you know, assessing the sensations how it's experiencing. Our mind is always scanning our external environment, our nervous system included our heart. Is

how is this environment doing? All of that is, you know, contributing together to affect how I am being right. So when we can become a participant in view of all of those different things I described, the thoughts that are coloring or interpreting my experiences, the emotions that are you know, sensations in my body, the reaction that I feel myself

compelled to say or do in this moment. Now I can begin to affect real change, to create transformation, because what we're really looking to do is to change again those consistent choices we're making, not just in one moment of time, throughout our day, where our habits are living in particular like we've just been discussing, in our relationships, where all of these interpersonal patterns are activated and old ways of protecting ourselves. So simply selfnessing is learning how

to live in that active state of awareness. So I can readily at this point in my journey. You know, I can acknowledge what my common themes are, all of the meanings I like to assign to events in my particular world. My relationships are usually some version. And all this connects back to me not being worthy as a child of how I'm not considered, of how my needs aren't being considered, and less i'm considering or performing for someone else. I have clarity on that now because I've

witnessed my internal world. I paid attention to the general thoughts narrating my day, and especially to the thoughts that we're coloring. Those highly emotional moments that we were talking about, and the clarity I got was a how repetitive my stories were generally in life, and how there was a

particular theme in those moments of upset. Now I can understand why I want to scream and yell and become downright angry when I'm not feeling considered in that moment, when I'm feeling my need isn't being met, or I'm being violated right in a particular moment based on someone else's actions. So when I become a witness, a self witness, interestingly enough, this all kind of ties full circle into being responsible and an active participant and resentment faced outward

at someone else. Now we can understand how, yeah, someone might have activated, said, done been a certain way, but really right the whole of my emotional experience existed within me. I interpret it in a certain way, whether or not it was reality or not. My hormones and emotions are streaming through my body in a certain way, usually based on again past interpretations of a similar situation, and my

body feels compelled to react right in that same way. Now, yes, person was involved, However I maintain the responsibility to interpret it in a different way to respond in a different way. Right now, I can locate the control again back in myself. And all of that happens when we really do witness how much we are already participating sometimes outside bar awareness.

What you just said there outside our awareness. I've heard some people say that, you know, so much of this healing journey is simply just bringing into awareness what is just outside of awareness. It's influencing us, it's affecting us, it's completely active, but it's below the line of consciousness and being able to bring it up. Well, I think

that's why you say consciousness is so key to transformation. Yes, again, it gives us space to incorporate because, like you're saying, all of that's happening, all of that's being metabolized into the interpretation, the reaction, right, So it's bringing it up so that we can now begin to act, be regulate ourselves in an aligned state. So we're nearing the end of our time. But I want to talk about cycles of emotional addiction. What is the cycle of emotional addiction?

Emotional addiction is typically the repetitive. Most of us can identify emotional experience or climate that we tend to embody So for me, as I've been dis ribing, it was very much anxiety. For some others it might be sadness, right. I've come to identify as sad as a depressed human.

Maybe for others it's angry. Right. The consistent emotions that we revisit aren't intrinsically who we are um in my opinion, again, back to the wolf, the story that we began with, I believe we all at our core are compassionate, care and connect it loving humans and individuals. I believe that is a core aspect of us as humans ultimately, though again a lot of us aren't necessarily showing up in

connection to that space. We're living all of these different habits again that have served us at a time at a place that isn't in connection with what we truly, truly you know, want need. So when we are recycling, when we do find ourselves always visiting a certain emotions are completely shut down to other emotions. The human experience

is complex. We have the ability to experience, to process, to be with all different types of emotions, and when we typically are stuck in one again, it's usually a reflection of our early environment, of the habits and patterns of the thoughts that we've repeated causing the same emotional reactions in our body. And then what happens over time we become as I call it literally, neurophysiologically addicted. We only begin to feel or we only feel like ourselves

when we're in that emotional state. So the way I noticed this in myself is again, my body was so primed and stress, it was so used to cortisol running through my my bloodstream, It was so locked in fight or flight that even being the self professed hippie looking for peace, not only was my body not able to calm down in that moment, it actually was so familiar with that experience of being up on edge, agitated, right almost alive with cortisol, that it began to interpret any

experience of being peaceful, calm, not having racing thoughts as being not like myself as being that resistance to the unfirm filier. And again this will apply if it's sadness, if it's anger. What we can begin to do is self witness, become aware of what are the emotions we typically live in or revisit more often than not, and then again dropping in how are reinterpreting our events is

their information below? Is there some need that's not being met in that moment that's continuing to revisit this and also again expanding an awareness that no one is a sad human intrinsically, No one, in my opinion, isn't angry

human intrinsically. You might have lived the embodiment of life, might feel like that is all you've become, though again chances are that's a remnant of that past experience still living in your mind, embody, and ultimately this whole conversation, all of my work is aimed at creating consciousness and change in the moment, actually rewiring ourselves neurophysiologically as our brain and body can do at any age in life, so that we can give ourselves a new normal. That

is a beautiful place to wrap up. Thank you so much, Nicole, This has been so fun. I have seventy five more questions that we're not gonna have time for today, so maybe we will do this another time, but thank you so much for coming on. And the book is called How to Meet Yourself, The Workbook for Self Discovery, and it really is a workbook where people can take lots of exercises and well have links to where people can

get it in the show notes. Thank you, Thank you so much, Eric for your time, for your presence, for having these conversations with myself and other people. I truly, truly appreciate it. And yeah, the workbook is called how to Meet Yourself. I'm hoping that it is a living roadmap for people acknowledging that you know, our journeys are

going to look different, They're gonna have different timelines. And my hope is that people live with this roadmap and take it along with their journey as we're all seeking to return home to who we truly are. Wonderful. Yea, if what you just heard was helpful to you, please consider making a monthly donation to support the One You Feed podcast. When you join our membership community with this monthly pledge, you get lots of exclusive members only benefits.

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