Veda Semarne

Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, guys, I'm Jade Ivan and I host Tell Me About It, the podcast that is the antithesis of a success story podcast, where we leave things like girl Boss, energy and lucky breaks at the door and instead celebrate and commiserate about all the things that make us human. This is the podcast manifestation of those conversations you have with your best

friend at four am. We have all kinds of women from all different walks of life, like Gwen Stefani, Steph Schep, A Man and a Knox, La La Kent, Raven Simone, and Joe Joe. Listen to Tell Me About It with Jade Ivan on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. Big Brother, North Korea's Forgotten Prince is a new true crime podcast that dives deep into the life and mysterious assassination of the man

once destined to be North Korea's next dictator. Join me, even Lee as we investigate a twisting tale of espionage, palas, gossip, and political backstabbing, and dive into the motives and suspects behind the most bizarre assassination plot of the century. Listen to Big Brother on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcasts coming February. My name is Veda Samarne, and I was the script supervisor on the Ontice. Welcome, Welcome, one and all to the

Office Deep Dive. It is nice to be back with you all on this fine Tuesday or whatever day you happen to be listening. I am your host, Brian Baumgartner. Today we're wrapping up our little mini deep dive on the women of the Office with a woman who was truly the glue of our show. She kept everything together, our script supervisor, Veda Somarn. This is someone I respect

and admire so much. Okay, she was with us on set every single day making sure that we did our jobs and set our lines, and that the director, the editor and the writers all got what they needed to make a great show as well, and so how was she repaid, Well, she was repaid by the cast with groans with eye rolls, because when we were having fun shooting set, when Veda came in, Oh, well it's because we did something wrong. Oh, that's how we repaid her.

But I really do. I love her and Veda and I we had a special connection because Kevin's car on the show was actually vedas car in real life. Yeah, remember Kevin's fuzzy steering wheel cover. Now that that's all Veda think of this, the simple task of keeping the entire cast on track, helping everyone with lines, marking every take, supporting the director, editors, actors, props, wardrobe all at the same time. She even made sure all of the clocks and watches were set to the same time. Yeah, yeah,

that was all her too. Now, when we spoke all the way back in February, she was working on Steve Correll and Greg Daniels show Space Force, lots of other office cast and crew, so she was getting to hang out with that crew almost every day in that moment. Lucky her, and well lucky you, because now you get to listen to my conversation with the incomparable Vada Samarn, Bubble and Squeak. I love it, Bubble and Squeak, Bubble and Squeaker cook at every month. Left over from the

night before. Oh my god, how are you so good to see you? Oh my gosh, I know it's been so long. So all right there, right, yeah, right by that. It's always so fun to see people from the office. It's well, you were just working with a bunch of all. Yeah, that was a really cool experience to be back with, you know, Steve bunch of us, Dave Rogers. Yeah, it was very cool. Yeah. Is that that? Wait? Who is it? Well? Yeah, yeah, um,

do you still have the RAB four? No? Oh gosh, okay, So you know, I remembered a good story about that, you know, because the prop Department always had to change my license plate right a right to make in Pennsylvania. And I once drove home with the Pennsylvania plates, I remember, and when I got home, I thought, oh my god. That's not good, is it? You know? And then and then of course I didn't know how to get them off, so I had to drive back the next morning with

the mom. But it doesn't reflect well on the prop department that's yeah, they had. But also I remember there were all these stickers all over it that were like Pennsylvania stickers that I had. I just left on as because Kevin was always there, so my car was always right there. And it's that's that's another continuity thing that I thought of, you know, like the car continuity. There was so many weird kinds of continuity, right, all right, So first, how did you get hooked in? Was it

through Ken Kappas? Yes? I had done a movie with him. I did a movie that he wrote called Sexual Life, So I knew him from that and he knew I was smart and that, you know, I could figure stuff out, and you know that this show was going to require someone who could figure yourself out? Right, And you came in Diversity day right, Yes, that's the second episode. Yes, yes, yes, they didn't do the pilot. I never met the person who did the pilot. But no, I did every other

episode after that though. I just stuck with it. I mean why wouldn't. I mean, it's the best show to work on the way the show was shot. Was that more difficult for you? In other words? Like there are no marks, so much improving that would affect you a lot too. Yes, it made my job completely different. I had to reinvent it. I think everyone did, you know, in their own job, their own department, of their own capacity,

they had to reinvent what they normally do. You had to throw it out the window and start all over again. Because this was really different. At the beginning, no one was allowed on set. None of the crew members remember that, because the idea was that it was going to feel like a real office and you guys were going to get acquainted with the space and feel like you were home when you were there, so that you would feel

free to do whatever. So the way that affected me was humongous because first of all, I I had to be in the green room with the writer the entire I think it was two or three seasons we did. So I was outside the main office. I was outside the door, and so between takes we both have to run in, I mean literally run in to give our notes. And the nose slating meant that I had to reinvent the way I did my notes because I had to be able to signal to the editors where all the

good parts were. So I had to use time code instead of slates to separate out each part of it. So I had to create a new way of doing the notes. This was at the beginning. Later on I got a little bit more traditional, a little bit more, but at the beginning it was totally new. Um, you would just slate the scene and the camera would just keep rolling, and a lot of what was on the camera was just the camera sitting on the ground and

feet walking by. So they had to use my notes literally to find the takes and to find the coverage. Like I'd say, here, the camera's going wide now, so we're going to get a three shot of the accounting department. And then now and this take we got a close up of Kevin, and this take we got a close up evangel and this take we got a close up of Oscar. You know, it's like every take was a different piece of coverage or you know, a continuity there was.

There was so much continuity. But luckily everyone was on top of it, so it wasn't just me, but I was definitely needed. I needed to track so much because you know, the episodes would take the place in the course of a day, so it all had to make sense right right right, like what was on even what was on people's desks or yes, because things would change through the course of the day. Yeah, and if we were going backwards or write Office Olympics, you know, like

which games had been played. You know, you had to know at every moment we tried to shoot an order. Usually we had to know which games have been played to know what each part of the office looked like. There was a lot too, you know. I had to have like special charts for everything, like what else. Well, for example, the clock was always in the shot and it didn't run it we said it. But when I prepped for each episode, I had to assign a time to each scene so that the set decorator could just

take that list and set the clock. And they had. We realized after the first couple of shows that we had to set it for every scene, no matter what, because you never knew what the camera was going to capture. I remember in the Hot Girl episode when they were buying purses, you know, I had to keep track. That's another one. I had to keep track of what purse was on what desk at what time, like who bought what?

And I remember very distinctly this was the moment I realized that we had to be so careful about continuity. We had to make sure the whole office was correct for every scene because we were shooting a close up of Dwight, and I remember Randall just suddenly went around to the other side of Dwight so you could see Katie in the background Amy Adams, you know, and you could suddenly see that he had the purse that he bought later on his desk, and so of course I

had to run in, No, that's not there yet. But that's when I realized, no, we can't leave anything out, you know, everything has to be correct for every moment, because I don't know where the cameras are gonna see. Yes, I remember you with the clock and with the watches on people's risk, and I said later and I have used this since that the greatest decision that I ever unwittingly made was that Kevin did not, Thank God, because having to adjust that watch every scene and the clock,

you're right, well, the watches. I got a little more easy going about the watches. I decided only if someone was going to be camera, because that, yeah, there was enough for us to worry about. There was so much, right, Who does the script supervisor serve well? The script supervisor is a department of one, so you're your own boss. Yes, it's really hard to manage. I remember that if there was a Kelly line about how she was, she was a department of one and her department was so hard

to manage. Lets saw that applied to script supervisors, right. But in terms of I guess, I don't know. It's so interesting to me, Like in terms of you know, you're talking about needing to do stuff for the editors. You've got writers chirping at you, telling you. You know that they want lines a certain way. You serve them all. I mean, you production, you keep track of a lot of information about the scripts, and you know how much

is shot, how much remains. You keep track of all the scenes and you know if anything's missing you tell them right away, or you keep track of scenes and what um the director or the writers want to include in the cut. For the editor and for the For the actors, you're helping them with lines. Sometimes they don't treat it as help, but you basically are helping them

remember their lines. And you work for the writers in the sense that you're trying to make sure the script is properly shot and that all the lines are as written, especially on the Office, because I mean, let's face it, it was like Shakespeare. The lines were beautiful. They had to be said exactly as written at least once or twice, just because they were so beautifully written. It just had to be that way. So I was a real I was a real stickler for the bourbage, you know. The people. Yeah,

people would cower when I came towards them. If they had like a whole paragraph that they had to say, they would be so nervous that I was going to tell them they were doing it all wrong. But you know, for the most part, I just wanted the comedy to be for it to be as funny as it possibly could be. Right. I want to talk about that a little bit, that relationship between the actors and you on

the show, Like did you did you feel comfortable with everybody? Well, like Rain for example, like Rain would give you hell. I loved him, you know, I loved everybody. It was everybody had a different way. You know. I think a lot of actors just they wanted to be so perfect that they get frustrated and and sometimes they take it out on me a little bit. But I don't really take it personally, and I know there's a lot of

pressure on them. You were very, very skilled at that, particularly when we were in the conference room, and I just recall at times, you know, being in between a take and there being a kind of pause that when you're inside the conference room, you weren't quite sure what was happening, Like it felt like nothing was happening, and then you would turn the corner and it would be like, oh,

somebody's getting it now, somebody is getting it from Beta. Um. But I think it was all truly it felt like everybody was working to try to make it the best show that was. That was so lovely and unusual about that show. Like, I mean, for nine years, I was excited to go to work. I got up, I was happy that I was going to see the scenes I was going to see that day, and I was so excited to see everybody at work, you know, every day. So and I think everyone felt that way. We all

loved it so much. We wanted it to be as good as possible. So sometimes it took you know, a little bit of bullying, you know, to get some Sometimes people would argue with me about lines, well I would make them say, like every article, every little word, because I could feel the rhythm of the line, like I knew how the line was supposed to sound. It was

in my head. So I just ignored when people thought I was crazy because I knew I was right, and it quite often the line would get a laugh after they added that tiny little word like a just like one little word could make all the difference on that show. I've never seen that any other show. How much after you handed in your note, were you in dialogue with Dave Rogers or Claire or Dean or not really like once because you're shooting the next That absolutely was because

they were right there. They were in the next building, which is such a luxury because that doesn't happen very often. So I could go over there at lunchtime or between

scenes and say, you know, here's what's happening. A lot of times I would have to talk to them about the director, because we had a different director for each episode almost, you know, and so many newcomers who were experienced directors, but they had never worked on the show before, so sometimes I thought they weren't quite getting it right. So I'd go and talk to Dave and what do you think about what we shot yesterday? Does it is

this director getting it? Is there any way that I could kind of nudge them in one direction or another? And sometimes you'd say, you know, just get more reaction shots, get tons of reactions for this episode because I'm going to really need them, or or they'd say, you know, you're not. This director is not getting enough angles. I need more angles to be able to pace the scene the way I need to pace it, because that was

a big thing for them, pacing for the comedy. I remember some instances, but I want to talk to you about how you were tracking not just continuity within an episode, but also continuity within relationships that spanned Marc right, I was, and Um sometimes that was very difficult. Well, first of all, I didn't always know what or remember like what parts of the script had ended up in the final cut, because it was half of it basically would be in the final cut, So I didn't always remember what had

actually aired. And then if something was stated in season two and then in season five we revisited that idea, sometimes I wouldn't remember that we'd already said something about that. I'll give you an example, like UM, who started at Dunder Mifflin first, Pam or Jim. Okay, that was a big issue that the fans noticed because early on we said it was Pham, I believe, and then later on we said Jim had been there or the I. I I

don't remember which round it was. But it was years, literally years later, that we addressed it again and contradicted ourselves, and that was you know, I would catch those things quite often, but I couldn't catch all of them. It was just too hard. There were two characters and yeah, and they all had their own stories with different relationships. There was some question about like how many kids did

Meredith actually have? Was it one or two? Because she says when she's being described to Michael when he's trying to write a funny message on her birthday card season the second season, for the first season, thinking they say she has two kids, and then later she only had one. So then I think it was in a way episode that we addressed that issue and why she wouldn't talk about the other kid, right right, right, And I think that was the other thing I remember Greg talking about,

which was, yeah, the webisodes. Was that a part of the history of the show too, or was it just the episodes or was it everything we shot, Like, Yeah, there's a lot to keep track of. Yeah, and the writers had to try to keep it all on their heads too, you know. So hopefully with everybody thinking about it, most of the problems got addressed. But I'm sure, you know, I'm sure there are things that the fans are still finding little nuggets. So you would take the script and

you would break it. So, so tell me, like the process of what how you would break down a script. Well, I would do that on the weekends. Would take the script and um, for each scene, I would you know, note for myself the significant things that happened for each character and each scene, and then what time of day that was, so that I would be able to create

like a story flow for myself. After the first season, I believe there was almost always a beast story as well, So I would separate out the A the B. Sometimes there was a C story and I'd color code them so that I'd see each story separately and how it

developed over the course of the day. So, like you're tracking, say, if Michael and Carrol have something this episode, and Jim and Pam or you know, Darryl and Jim or something, right, you're tracking all like, in the middle of the day, they're not speaking to each other, you know that, I know that. You know, Okay, that's that's about four hours into the day. And then a couple hours later something happens that makes them bond again. And yeah, that that.

I was definitely tracking that kind of thing, and I would get a lot of questions about that from the actors. Yes, like when is this happening we're shooting scenes out of order? Yeah? And when did I get angry? Yes? Right? Am I building up to it now or has it already happened? Right? So you have this chart, and I'm fascinated about this. So are you Once actors get in wardrobe, if the wardrobe is changing, does that get added to your chart?

I mean, every department keeps their own continuity, so I'm just really checking it. Right. The Yankee Swap episode must be the most complicated and difficult. You know, when does Phillis have the mit? She gives it to Michael, And when we're shooting scenes out of order, who has it? What are they doing with it? Yeah, definitely had to have a very clear chart of that. I remember Mike Sure and I were in the Green room for that, because that was when we still were not allowed on set.

And I remember he's we had so many charts on the walls, and one of the charts was his tally of how many times he had to run in each day. Oh my gosh, you do that document, Oh my god, like how many times he had to run in that It's really funny. It's a hard time for hiring, so you need a hiring partner built for hard times. That's Indeed. If you're hiring, you need Indeed because Indeed is the hiring partner where you can attract, interview, and hire all

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available now. Listen on the I Heart radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcast on an episode by episode basis, you're a department of one, so you serve yourself and you're served by yourself. But are you like, who are you working closest with on a weekday? Is it the right yours? Is it the director or it's usually the director, but I mean the director and the actors. But um on the office, the writer was very involved, so that that was I also worked very closely with

the writers. That isn't always the case on comedies. Usually the writer comes to set, but quite often they'll send a writer to supervise the writing for them. You know, there will be like a designated writer who's on set, but on the office it was usually the writer of the episode would be on set. Did you have any special secrets or ways that you dealt with any of the particular actors on set? I mean, your relationship with

each actor is different. Well, there were different ways I would have to phrase things, like would you try one where you say it this way? Or you know, with you, I would just say, you know, here's the line in the script. You know, there wasn't a lot of attitude there, so you would just you just say, okay, but I want to say it this way. You know. We would just negotiating and it would be quick, easy. Yes, there

would be some negotiation, Yes okay. But sometimes I would have to word things carefully because and I remember once I told one of the actors, um, it's funnier this way, and I realized, no, I can't say it that way because he got so mad at me. Don't tell me what's funny. Yeah. I mean that's the thing is that I imagine on some shows there would be a level of defensiveness or like I don't feel like we had that.

I feel like everybody was trying very hard. Yeah, yeah, everybody wanted it to be funny and want you know, I felt like there was an understanding. They knew that I was saying something because I thought it would improve their line or improve the scene. Yes, it wasn't. It wasn't ever personal for me, So I think I think the most part, people were really nice to me. I

think it was more I just remember fondly. Actually, I don't know if you felt that way, but I remember just a very you know, almost like family like when again, like when you would turn the corner, it would be like, oh no, here's bed. Oh boy. Um No, it was fun. It was frustrating to me that I couldn't prompt lines because I just was usually too far away. My voice doesn't care very well. And people would end up just laughing when they asked for a line because they couldn't

hear it. That's exactly so frustrating for me. I mean, I've always I liked prompting lines. I tried to do it in a timely fashion, but I don't know if you remember. After a while we asked the stand ins Stephen Socks and that's right, Mary Socks to be on lines. If it was a long scene, they would kind of crouch somewhere closer and just be How was that came from me? Because I said, you know, it's really not on this show. I really can't be on the lines

all the time. So we set up that system where Lori and Stephen would sit in the room and just give lines really quickly, because that's what you need when you're an actor, right, you need to hear the line just really quickly so you can stick with the momentum of the scene, right, so it doesn't you don't lose this scene. I do. I do remember, though, again I don't know why. Every all my memories go back to the conference room, but just being in the conference room,

someone going well, what is it? What's the line? And you here, and then everyone just laughing because there was just no embarrassed there was no way to hear um. How difficult was it to track all of the improv

stuff that happened, Well, I couldn't really track it. I mean I would just say, okay, here this is a big chunk of improv, and I try to describe to the editor what was happening in that section, and and I try to make sure there were points where they could cut in and out of the improv sections, and that was all I could really do, just make sure that everything up to the improv matched and everything coming out of it man, and that there were angles to cut two in case they needed to cut out of it.

So I had always encouraged that we got reaction shots. That was a big deal to get a reaction passed, yeah, which would give just cut natural cutaway points through anything n n y um. In terms of unscripted stuff or even physical gestures, I'm sure that you had an instinct least eventually like oh, well, that's going to be in the show. The example that I'm thinking about is gay witch hunt, so Oscar or Michael going and kissing, Yeah,

that would be in the show. Yes, yeah. How do you signal that out or does that become a specific thing that you add in to the script for the editor or my script is always the official script. It represents what was shot. So I cross out things that we don't shoot, and I'll add things that we do shoot if they're not in the script, so definitely, I'll I'll write that in. So I put this in this take Michael kisses Oscar. Every director and the writer love that use it if you can, you know, Okay, but

yeah I did after a while. No, which takes we're going to be in the show. Which takes We're gonna be looked at the most closely. And you know, I knew what Dave would choose when I saw the show. You know, at the end of the week, I would recognize the takes that he chose. I think I I knew he was going to pick that one. After a while. Yeah, Like it's this the family thing. I mean, you just know people's taste, you know how they work, you know, you know you know each other so well after a while.

I mean, Greg, obviously you are working closely with him when he's writing on set, when he's directing. How much communication do you have with him about your job specifically? It was just when he was on set really when he was directing, particularly, and he would interact with me a lot. And then I think that's when people find

out what my job is when they direct something. Were there any particular relationships with directors that you felt like you worked really well with and and and that working relationship, but well, I think well, always when the writer directed their own episode, there was a real understanding because I

always I really appreciated the scripts. The scripts were so good, you know, um, and I think that they felt there was a lot of support coming from me because I wanted the script shot properly, and sometimes, Um, I could help a little bit with the angles and the you know, the way the scene was shot, because I knew what we would traditionally do with a scene like that, you know.

So I always enjoyed working with Ken Koppas and Paul Fieg and um Ken Whittingham, and Yeah, there were certain directors that would keep coming back and then I would love to work with. It was funny on the office, particularly on that show. After a few years, we felt like we knew how to make the show, and we felt like we didn't even need a director. So the director would come on and they would be guided by all of us, and sometimes, um, we would wonder about

how they were shooting something. I remember when time a scene was shot, it was a scene in the parking lot. We were shooting it from an angle that I thought wasn't that right angle for the show, But that was just from what was in my head when I read it. Well, the next week we came back and reshot it from the other angle. I didn't. I hadn't said anything because

I felt like it wasn't really my place. I mean, the director and that DP were were decided to shoot it from the other side, but I thought, that's not how this is supposed to be shot. So sometimes, you know, there was a real feeling that the crew knew the set, knew the characters, knew the scripts better than anyone else, and so the director would just bring in a few interesting ideas that would shake it up a little, which

was good because it never became formulaic. For that reason, I think because we had so many new directors all the time. Yeah, well here's some names. Randall Einhorn, Matt Son, John Krasinski, me Um, I believe, Steve Carrell, Claire Scanlon, Dave Rogers all directed. I'm sure I'm missing some, but all directed on the office for the first time. How was that for you? Working with inexperienced people, but people who knew the show so well? Did that present specific challenges? Yes?

And no, I mean it um, when we had like a famous director coming in, it was always exciting, but it was always that was more of a challenge because they didn't always get the show, and it was hard to politely steer them in the right direction. Um, when it was somebody who was working on the show already, that problem was already solved. They got the show, they knew what the human they knew the humor, they knew, they knew the characters, they knew the spaces that we

generally worked in, and they knew how to make the show. Um. But sometimes they didn't know how to direct. Um, but just because they hadn't done it before, and sometimes they didn't realize all the different things that were their responsibilities. And because we all knew how to make the show, we would often pick up the slack and we would do part of the director's job. And um, that was sometimes difficult because we all had so much to do already.

To have to, you know, help someone out when they don't even realize you're helping them out, that was kind of hard. Sometimes interesting. Yeah, I mean, you had all people just trying to direct this show, but the diverse range of experiences. You know, you've got editors, You've got Dave Rogers and Claire Scanlon who presumably have never dealt with actors before, but they knew what shots they need.

They knew what shots they needed. And then you've got Randall and Matt, who again don't really know how to deal with actors, but they know where that camera is. Whereas you know, actors, I knew how I wanted it to look, but don't talk to me about lenses, right, or like what lens we're going to use, you know, So it's like coming at it from just different perspectives. I just think it's very interesting. I mean, every director

has their strengths and weaknesses. But um, but when you get someone like Ken coppas, you know, it would go really smoothly because not only did he understand the show and know how to make the show, but he also knew all the aspects of directing and what everyone was expecting from him. So that was always the best for me when it was somebody like that. But um, but I know, I really, you know, wanted to support everybody.

So you know, everybody who directed, I you know, I felt like they were bringing a lot of new things to the table and some things they just weren't that

aware of yet. But you know, like some directors would you know, like an actor directing would be very aware of the acting would be very often very aware of what would make the scene funny, which was great, but they might not be aware of the angles and the different kinds of coverage that we needed and the lighting or something, you know, so they wouldn't work with those departments, so that those departments would have to jump in and

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your podcasts. And we're live here outside the Perez family home, just waiting for the And there they go, almost on time. This morning. Mom is coming out the front door strong with a double arm kid carry. Looks like Dad has the bags. Daughter is bringing up the rear. Oh but the diaper bag wasn't closed. Diapers and toys are everywhere. Oh but mom has just nailed the perfect car seat buckle for the toddler. And now the eldest daughter, who looks to be about nine or ten, has secured herself

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and the Ad Council. Hey, it's Jake Halpern here. If you've ever wondered what it's like to make a true crime podcast like deep Cover, well now's your chance to find out. Join me and my friend Dana Goodyear, who's the host of Pushkin's Lost Hills podcast, on March sixte for a digital conversation on true crime storytelling. We'll talk about how we make our stories dramatic and accurate, and how we navigate all the ethical dilemmas that we face

in the process. Get your tickets now at moment house dot com backslash d c l H. That's moment house dot com slash d c l H. Michael's search for family you know, ends up being his you know, his his major journey through the show. Do you have any specific recollections or memories about about that? About a man who had nobody All he wanted was somebody. He used the office as as that somebody and then eventually finding love and going away. Well, it was what kept me

hooked on his character the whole time. I was always so interested to see what Steve would do with each new situation. What I kept wanting to find out, what I was so fascinated with every day was to see how the scenes would play out, because I when I read the script and studied it over the weekend, I always had very specific ideas of about how it would look. I mean, I could see the whole the whole episode

in my head. So I guess what, you know, it's just like a personal fascination with you know, is is that the way it's going to look? Or is it is there going to be something different about it than I haven't imagined yet. It was just fascinating to see how the actors would play out the scenes and how they'd say the lines, because I would love the lines and I would want to hear them, and I could hear like I could hear your voice in my head.

I could hear you know, Michael's voice, Jim's voice. You know, I knew how the how they generally delivered their lines, but I always wanted to hear how these specific lines were going to sound. So as far as you know the character arc and the journey, I always felt like I was just an observer and that you know, and the writers were always coming up with interesting new twists. Right, there's a I should haven't asking people what were you

afraid of missing more Steve or Michael Scott. Oh? Well, I was afraid that without Michael Scott the show wouldn't work, and it did work. So I was proud of us that we managed to make it work. But I knew personally that I would miss Steve terribly, that my heart

would ache, that I wouldn't just miss seeing him. And it's hard for a crew, you know, when you get close to actors, because you can't just go over their house, you know, you can't just call them up and say you want to have a drink, you know, because it's a different kind of relationship, it's a work relationship. So you know, I've I knew I would miss him. Yeah, as a person, you know, just miss seeing him well,

and you just sort of occurring to me. But you know, for seven years he had the most to say, so you were you definitely had the bulk of your work with with him. He had long speeches too, which he could memorize so fast. No one's amazed me, but I would help him. Yeah, he would always warn me, you know, I'm going to be all over the place with this,

you know. So, um, I would just tell him if I thought something wasn't working, or if he was leaving something out, or you know, he needed to say something a little differently. But for the most part, he just let him do his thing. Was he always receptive to you? Well, he was so sweet, you know he Um, Yes, he was always receptive because he knew I I had a concern. You know. It wasn't just I wasn't just trying to wield my power or something, you know. I actually it

was genuine. He knew that. So we do have a picture we took though, we posed where Steve is going like this kind of like who wants to push me away? And I'm trying to give him a line, because that's the general feeling when the script supervisor gives lines that you know they're nagging you. Did you ever feel like Toby Toby pretty much always well, something I don't know, because my you know, this was a second career for me.

I was I was an academic first, and I and I was a professor and or history right and film stuff, film history, film studies and so My approach was always very sort of academic. You know this line, you know, and I think I'm might nitpick a little because I don't always have the perspective on it. You know, maybe this isn't that important, but you know I try. I did every script sour for us tries to judge very

clear clearly in their mind. You know, is this important enough for me to interrupt things to for me to throw you know, you don't want to throw the actors off. You don't want to give them stuff to think about. You want them to do their thing. But um, I mean as far as continuity goes or lines or any of any of that, it's it's never perfect. There's always something you can correct, but you have to try to be smart about what to correct and what to just leave.

Because you don't want people to feel like they have to pay attention to the lines. You want them to pay attention to the acting or there. You don't want them to suddenly start paying attention to like where their arms are, you know, So I'd really try to correct people to add to a minimum. I try to keep it to a minimum because in my job, there is a certain nerdiness, you know, tend you tend to be very attuned to the details, and you don't always see

the picture. So, you know, I trying to pay attention to the directors and to you know, how they're dealing with the actors. If they're not giving notes, I'm not going to go in and give a note because there's a reason they're not giving them yet. They're trying to let the actor find something. And over the years, I think I've gotten more and more sensitive to that. What was it like working with Steve as a director? The last episode he directed is the one he proposes to Holly.

What was it like working so smart? You know? It made it pretty easy because he was so nice, so smart, so savvy about the show. He was a great director to have. Yeah, Towards the end, he had this idea that he wanted Threat Level Midnight to be seen on the show. Talk to me a little bit about the challenge of attempting to piece together and and find the continuity of this movie. That was well, the thing about that was that it was supposed to be goofy, we're

doing contnuity for Threat a little lettl Midnight. There was going to be something that didn't have continuity, but that's a tricky thing because I remember when I first got hired to do the show. I remember Ken Quaba saying, we're, you know, we're not going to worry about continuity because it's a documentary. The documentarians can make mistakes. But that only works on certain levels. That works on the level

of on the cutting level. Like if if the documentarians cut in two different pieces of a take cut them together in an awkward way, that would be okay. But you can't cut together two takes that don't match, because then you're implying that this thing happened twice, and it only happened once, you know what I mean. So there has to be a reality to it that you know. Um, So that conuity was actually very important in the end

and not something I could ignore. And you didn't want to imply that the documentarians were saying, Okay, do this again, you know, but do it a little differently, because they were just supposed to be shooting discreetly, you know, and not controlling what was happening. They were all kinds of new, new kinds of continuity that I hadn't really thought about before. Like if somebody was out of the office, their jacket couldn't be on their chair because they were wearing it.

So you'd have to, you know, look at sort of the the opposite side of the continuity what what shouldn't be there? And the parking lot, it was the same way. What cars should be there and what cars shouldn't be there. We have to always think about that. Well, the most important carry that was Kevin's car for a long time. Do you remember when it first got established? It was right away, it was like yeah, yeah, the first season. Yeah.

I drove it quite a few times in the end, Yes, in front of Holloway when she's impressed with me sort of most notably, um, yeah, I remember thinking, you know, she's so impressed that I'm driving the car. And I remember having this idea of just driving it straight over the curve. It's just like and just plowing right. And then I thought its greatest car. I think I won't I think I won't do that. Yeah, but I I always remember Rap four. Oh it wasn't the Rap four.

It was CRV CRV first I forgot, yes, but it was Honda c RV. Do you remember there was like this fuzzy tiger striped cover over the wheel, over the wheel. Yes, after a couple of years, my husband bought that for me because the steering wheel get cold. But I remember at the production meeting, John was directing the episode where you were driving the car, and I asked him I should should I take off the fuzzy steering wheel cover, and he said, I would never ask you to do that.

I would never ask you to take off something like that. No, that if that's on your car, you leave that. That's so great. And we all got a little bump on our paycheck if we have are I think it was like five dollars that you got if your car was in a scene, and they just kept a tally of how many times your car was in a scene, and you'd get a little bumped for that. Do you get real? But the car was in a lot of shots, a

lot of shots. No, it was anybody who is deemed to have power, who thinks differently, is a threat and needs to be eliminated. Big Brother. North Korea's Forgotten Prince is a new true crime podcast that investigates the life and mysterious assassination of the man wants destined to be

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be eliminated. Listen to Big Brother on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts coming February. What grows in the forest trees? Sure? No? What else grows in the forest? Our imagination, our sense of wonder, and our family bonds grow too, because when we disconnect from this and connect with this, we reconnect with each other. The forest is closer than you think. Find a forest near you and start exploring. I Discover

the Forest dot Org. Brought to you by the United States Forest Service and the AD Council. What's the office? Um? Your acting debut? Well, I was only in that last Yeah, I was in that last episode, and yes, that was your acting debut. Any memories about being on set in front of the camera. I was always so nervous. I'm

really shy, so that was not comfortable for me. But I like that we were all you know that a lot of us were in that final episode, but it was I didn't want to have a line or anything. What do you remember going into the finale. Did you feel like it was time for it to be over? I didn't want it to be over. Personally, I would have liked to just work on that show for the

rest of my career. But um, I felt like it was smart to decide when your show is going to end and wrap it up beautifully instead of just ending it suddenly. But it was so sad. It was just hard for all of us. I think, yeah, what was it do you think about the show that? I mean, obviously, it's a job, and in our industry, like having a job and a good jobs is a blessing, but it felt different. There was something about it. It felt special. Yes, definitely.

There was a lot of love. You know, there was a lot of um caring for the show, caring for each other. It was a good environment and you know, even though it was very tiring, we were all exhausted, it felt good to do that job and to be there every day. It was hard to imagine not having that, and I really never have found a show where I feel that way. So I was right to be sad

because it really was something that I was losing. I mean, I've enjoyed shows I've worked on since then, but never I never felt that warmth and that camaraderie in anything else. We were all we all laughed so much that sometimes it was hard to finish a scene. And I had to put that in my notes because you know, I'd say this scene was right up until they all broke. That was something the editors would mention to me sometimes, you know, I can't cut this. It's like somebody's breaking

in every take. But then also the crew we had to you know, we couldn't laugh out loud, and that is hard to do sometimes, especially if you're in that little talking head room and you're sitting right in front of the actor. There were times when I had to actually leave the room. But that was one thing that made it great to be there every day, because you would there was so much that was so funny. There was so much laughter. Um talk to me about this

German lullaby. Oh that appeared in the show that was in Mindy's Something, Mindy Road right, Mindy Kaylenk. The episode was Night Out Dwight. It was Dwight Dwight sings Ryan to Sleep. Yeah. My mother was Viennese, so her first line, which was German, and when growing up in Vienna, they spoke German and so her mother would sing her German lullabies. So when I was a child, she sang German lullabies to me when I was falling asleep. So I knew

a couple of German lullabies. And so I just piped up and said, you know, I because I guess she wanted him to sing something to her. Yeah, I said, well he could sing what my mother sang to me. I sang it for was it schlaf kin lynch laugh. I'm not schlaf kin lynch law mm hmmm. I think that, yeah, And um, I always found it very soothing. So so yeah, well, I don't remember the words right now, but I know

because it starts schlaf kin lynch lav mm hmmmmmm. I I don't remember the words at the time, I still I remembered the words where I looked them up slow can love. That's very funny. Um, the guys, is there anything else that I've missed here? Right? Yeah, look at your list. I actually hear all this stuff. Do you ever say that's what she said? I say it, I say it. I say it around friends. I tend to not draw attention to that fact, but yes, do you

say that's what she said? My husband and I say it all the time at home, but I try not to say it on set anymore because I think people do get maybe offended by it, and you know, sets are so sensitive now about harassment and saying things like that. So I don't say it on set anymore. Just some times I have to say it, so I say it to myself really quietly. Do you do you think that this show could be made now in this woke PC environment?

I think it was, you know, a perfect storm. It's like, you know, everything came together at that moment, all the people involved, all the ideas, all the um, you know, the crew, that talent, it all came together in a way that made it all work. And I don't know if we could ever happen exactly that way again. Yeah, I don't know if it has to do with the time period, or it's just the miracle of all those

personalities coming together at that moment. Yeah, Veda, thank you so much for coming, and yeah for coming to talk to me. And you're your perspective having watched it all as it happened, is really really to watch. Well, Vada, what a delight you are and thank you for speaking with me. What a true pleasure to have you in. That's what she said. Uh, and thank you listeners for joining in. Join us again next week please for another riveting conversation, and don't forget to subscribe and leave us

comments on on whatever podcast platform you see fit. Have a great week. The Office. Deep Dive is hosted an executive produced by me Brian Baumgartner alongside our executive producer Langley. Our senior producer is Tessa Kramer. Our producers are Emily Carr and Diego Tapia. Our social media producer is Liz Hayes. My main man in the booth is Alec Moore. Our theme song Bubble and Squeak, performed by my great friend Creed Bratton, and the episode was mixed by seth Olandski.

Conquer your New Year's Resolutions with the before Breakfast podcast. In each bite sized daily episode, you'll learn how to make the most of your time with practical tools to help you feel less busy and get more done. Listen to Before Breakfast on the I Heart Radio app four wherever you get your podcasts. Hey Leeth, the listeners take here. Last season on Lethal you might remember I came to

Hollow Falls on a mission. Well, I'm finding out that in this town, the dead don't keep their secrets for long, and the bodies keep piling up. The second season with Lethal Lit is available now on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Adoption of teams from foster care is a topic not enough people know about, and we're here to change that. I'm April Dinuity, host of the new podcast Navigating Adoption,

presented by adopt us Kids. Each episode brings you compelling, real life adoption stories told by the families that lived them, with commentary from experts. Visit adopt us Kids dot org, slash podcast, or subscribe to Navigating Adoption presented by adopt us Kids, brought to you by the U. S Department of Health, that Human Services Administration for Children and Families and the AD Council,