The Kabbalah with Jin, Branch and Matt-Tiphareth and Netzach

lot of fun. Of course, Jen and I are always recording things, and I think we did a recent one with mister Lamb that I'm not sure I fits out or not, but that was a lot of fun. The last time I was here with you, guys, and of course we did that just said I think the last time as well, so that was another banger. So it's nice to see you guys so frequently. I really enjoy this hobby. Thanks for having me.

at Mettmore nineteen. There's also my website with some cool stuff there, which is Kabala dot com. That is k A A b A l a h. That's a little different writing there. And there's also the Grade Lodge website which is super cool. So the true Grade Lodge with a v instead of a you. So the True Grade Lunch dot com as well, and uh yeah, I feel like the kind of stuff that we talk about, you're going to be pretty much the same on all the other platforms. And yeah, thanks a lot Nick for inviting again.

host spaces and now on YouTube. So as Matt said, like the True Gray Lodge, check us out Meta Magicians for a new aon very cool. All our work is there and you can also listen to Threshold Saints. I just dropped an episode with Crystal Drinkwater, who's been on this show, O call rejects the great episode with her, both on this show and on my own, So if you're interested in herbalism, geo ontology and all of that,

please check that out. I also have an episode with Kelby Losak, who is another outlet, kind of bad boy writer on Twitter and just a great dude and he's actually like a real magician, and so his episode will also drop this week, so just keep a lookout for that. But the Grey Lodge every Friday YouTube and yeah, that's that's where you can find us. And we're always doing either Friday Nightgnostic Mass or we do a series. So thank you, guys, no.

to catch this episode. Sorry I have not gotten back to you, but I do plan on getting you back on. I kind of left her hanging. Wanted to get her back on myself, but sorry, I forgot, But highly go check out her work. I think she's actually really good at what she does, and I'm sure if Gin had her on, it was a banger of an episode.

them in. I do think it's important to understand these things. I could probably take days if we went into why they all do, which we don't have time for. But again, I'm just mentioning it because I do think it's important to go back and try to understand and even maybe meditate on why all these associated with that? You know, many reasons, I'm sure. So now let me pull up my notes, all right, So Tifferreth beauty. Tifferreth the sixth ceph means beauty and occupies the center of the trees

middle pillar. It is considered as a role as mediating mediating intelligence, unifying higher and lower Sepharath. Some call it the sphere of the Redeemer or Kether on a lower arc. Tiffareth can also, as has been said, let's us see the Father reflected in the sun. That's s O N though, the central mediating intelligence that connects all creation and integrates

divine and human consciousness. The titles and symbolic images in the tie one title to it could be a z r Z a r Apin the lesser countenance it could be called Melek or King Adam the Son. The magical image is given as a majestic king. A child can be used a sacrificed God, reflecting Tiffareth's three aspects, and Tiffareth also kind of has like a sacrificial or kind of my opinion, sacrificial Christ like aspect used there. The divine name and archangel would be uh I'm probably gonna

screw this up. Yad hey fad hey alo a vadad something to that effect. Or it could be uh, I don't know. Some people yah he va yeah, yeah. However you want to pronounce that, sometimes some people will pronounce that a little bit differently, and that is meaning the lord of knowledge. The archangel is Raphael, angel of the Sun.

it might be both. Sometimes you can see contradicting angels because of the planetary sphere being a little bit different than kind of what they're using the archangel for on the kabalistic tree, the spiritual experience, I'm sorry, past the planet in chakra. The planetary sphere is the song, the virtue and the vice devotion to the great work, spiritual service. That's Teffaret's virtue and pride is its device, and the devotion to the great work is kind of the goal

that is centered around Tiffareth. The spiritual experience is the vision of harmony of things and the mysteries of the crucifixion. I would also say, I think a lot of a lot of cultists or ceremonial magicians would probably even say this is where you would come into contact with your holy guardian angel. Symbols would be the lamin, the symbolic breastplate, the rosy cross, the cavalry or crucifixion cross in a truncated pyramid and cube quick the tarot correspondences the six

the suit of sixes. Obviously it's a six sphere, so that goes with that. And the colors, which I do think are interesting actually absolute could be a clear rose, pink, Bria would be yellow, et c would be rich salmon or pink, and asia Siah however, you call that a

golden amber. The psychological and spiritual function Tiffareth could be seen as the focus of the higher sell for individuality, the point where divine smark, Spark, Chestin and Goeburg manifests as conscious love and wisdom on the personality Tiffareth is the keystone of the tree, holding the balance between all other Cepharroth. So yeah, that's about all I got on the I guess the associations and the correspondences. I don't know if any of you wanted to say something continue after that.

for Raphael and Michael. And it is interesting that Nick you said that is that Raphael can be associated with both mercury and the sun, as Michael can also be associated with mercury.

both of those resins. Obviously a goat, Yeah, exactly. He's a much more alchemical, maybe hermetic angel, where Michael is much more fixed, you could say almost, because he holds in his traditional iconography a sword and a shield. So when he very that's very Givera and gebela right like, but meeting together in synthesis. It's the it's the protector, the bulwark against the forces of darkness, plus the sword, the flaming sword that cuts them away. So but then

sometimes you will see him holding a scale. When you see him holding a scale, it actually makes him more Gavratic, even in like I know we discussed this last time in Matt's obviously Brazilian but in Kimbonda you will often see Saint Michael depicted as kind of the lord of the issue when he holds the scale, specifically the scale, because he's a little more left handed at that in that iconography, and less tifferatic, less balanced, less like harmonious. It's not that he is, but he brings a more

martial quality. And as someone who has some experience with the angels, I will have to I have to say that I never really like him for that gaverratic association. I find it too hot of energy for me. I'm just saying this is just my preference. I always found it it heated him up too much, so be careful with that. I prefer him more at a tifferatic kind of a more neutral place or a more balanced place.

they balance upon. So maybe you know, that's some kind of reference to maybe how that judgment is discerned, because the sword a lot of times too, is used to point to each letter of the law, kind of like the pointer fingers used when you're doing tourist study. We're not supposed touch it with our hands, you know. So, and the fishes too made me think of.

So again talking about the scales and everything about the associations that can be different, I have two ways of thinking. So first of all, I talk many times about this. I think I talked here as well. But in the spaces there is this idea that the tree can change not only with time, but maybe through the perspective. So for example, if you want to create a religion out of someone, that person will be usually or that thing

whatever will usually add different. So then again we have the importance of different being the center of the tree. But then if maybe you want to do another religion and that same character which was in the previous one is there now, maybe he has to be in Gevua for the religion to make sense, because if he was also in different he would conflate. It's kind of like if you want to make a religion auto of you know, Jesus,

you Jesus must be the solar character. So even if there's another solar guy, he kind of has to go somewhere else otherwise it again conflicts the symology there. So I think there's so firstly, there's this right, this idea of the treat always changing, evolving as long. But there's also a lot of bs. So that's why, you know, just studying the books and whatever. I think, don't do it. If you want to do properly, you know, get get a proper initiation, go get the expertses yourself. Which I

think it's also very tiperatic. Let's say you are getting the experienced, so the thing itself that you're trying to practice, like Nick said, the higher self that are trying to achieve. You know, you could also say it's an analogy you can make. It's if you're doing martial arts when you get the black belt to in my understanding, would be when you reach the threat in that thing. So it's not the end like you basically just you're about to

start actual practice. You know, you got there, okay, and now I see clearly what I need and so on and and again we have the importance of different on astrology, like why nowadays a lot of people just care about their their sun signs because well, your son is the core of your being. It's not the whole of your being, but it's it's the core. It's there. So like Joshua was saying that it's in the middle, not only in the middle column, but in the middle of the tree.

It has the most connections with other spheres, so it plays a lot this like central. Again, if you're talking beauty, beauty is very related to harmony. So again the scales making sure that things are harmonized are in center and not you know, Gevura is here, and then he said it's like here and then net size on the other place, like tiferend is making sure everyone is in the center,

like gravitas is working. Yeah, there's again a billion things we can talk about different here, but those are the ones that came up to mine.

possibly even have a contact with God. You know, I still think there's things that you have to your old self that you have to slang and get rid of. So that was just other stuff I wanted to mention about Tifferreth.

that can be earned, all the success. Everything good. Right in theory, Gievera would be the opposite, like what's the discipline that you need to do it? What are maybe the the like cons of doing it. Let's say, oh, I want to buy like a supercar. Sure, you're gonna have to spend a lot of money. You're gonna have people maybe now looking at you wanting to rob you or whatever. So there are cons doing things. They are disciplined.

If you want the apps, you need to you know, practice everything as want stop eating maybe some stuff that you like to eat to me. Then tifferread is the synthesis of those boat two things like, Okay, how can I harmonize the good the bad? How can I see the beauty of what I am creating? And if it's not beauty and if I cannot harmonize, maybe there there's too many cons, then you probably shouldn't do it, you know.

Like again, if you want to eat something and then you look at it and it's like dark and gray and looks like a you know, like a stew of something, then again you're not gonna eat it. That's the Tifferat kind of blocking not working well there. And also if you think about it, then there's this there's the stalk usually you know nowadays a oh, you know, everyone has their beauty and swim and sure in the way different works in everyone, but some people worker better than others.

So yes, beauty exists like different as a proof, but that there is such a thing as but it is not the only you know, a construct or whatever. There is a concept which is beautiful in it. You can find it in nature for example. They'll have to be a social thing, right so that when you were talking about them, you know, bringing the things. That's one that I this came to mind.

signals back and forth. So that would be kind of like back and forth again, you know, being able to travel from one.

the importance of a couple of stick initiation. I agree with that in those terms, but I also think that experience is like hugely important and to like understand how the city's work. So a lot of what we're talking about is maybe more intermediate. But that's why I like the iconography, because I think it shows people at least it can open, as Nick said, like it flips a switch for them to sort of experience it as we're discussing it, because they can actually see the colors that

you would actually see in a sepharatic experience. And then That's just my opinion, obviously, but I think that's a good way to describe it. And that's how I always found it. Like when I used to listen to like Nick or anyone else talk about sepharaotic experiences, I would always think of the iconography and then relate it in that way. So this is Jesus of the sacred heart. This is a very interesting image. I've talked about it many times on the show. I've probably showed a similar image.

This is the tefaratic image if you want to use like obviously I used one with blue and red, but there are ones where the heart is completely gold or completely gilded. This is obviously gold is the chemical metal of the sun. Of course, Maps discussed on the importance of Hesseen and Gevra together. That's really what Tiffer it is. It's a it's the forging of the fire, but you also need water in alkam All alchemy. It's not just fire. Fires one transmutation, but water is another. And but it's

in their synthesis. So people are going to say, okay, well you can't synthesize fire and water. Well, actually you can. It's it's in it's in plasma diamond thunder lightning. That's really like a kind of synthesis. So it's like Nick's talking about like a switch, well a CDC, like what is more plus ultra, more in the polarities than that. And so I agree with what Nick said. That is how I think of tiffer It. This is just me but and I might be wrong, but this is how

I think of it. This is not my this is not my strength. Sha we'll say yo.

twelfth century. Yeah, there was a reintroduction of Kabala then, but then clearly again with the rosicrusions. So I think that this image perfectly encapsulates a lot of what different is. It's not his whole being, meaning that the vessel is supposed to be empty, sopposed to be like a golden vessel. Like. Another good image for this is actually our complementary image, you could say, is Mary Magdalen and I will go

find when when I'm shut up. But she holds a crystal vial, so obviously this relates to the alchemical marriage between the sun and the moon, and her tears are said to sometimes be in the vial. So it speaks that idea again of the heatless fire, because what happens when you refract light through a crystal cut crystal that is filled with a clear saline liquid, it's a you get like a prismatic effect. It's a heatless fire in the most fundamental of alchemical ways. So that's kind of

what is hard is too. It's kind of a it's the redemption arc. It's the redemption arc, and that's what I like about the Like I'm not a Christian and you know, so like people can believe whatever they will or whatever they want. But for me, I actually like this a on of the sun idea of like a as an arc of redemption. I think it's important and I think it actually speaks to what Nick said about

climbing the tree and how it can be. This can be a very difficult sepher because this is one that your will really really matters, like Nick saying, like he can just blast off, like this is where your will has to push you through the threshold more than anywhere else. Which is also interesting because this is also considered to be the least dense of the separa, the one most composed of light, So I think that that is an

interesting way to think of it. So it is like it is where you find mercy and strength, both in perfect balance, so it's not going to extremities. And maybe that's why I'm not speaking for Nick but I'm saying for me, I tend to live more in extremities, so for me, it's perhaps harder to come together in synthesis. And so the Sun archetype, and Matt brought this up, and Joshua loves to talk about archetypes as well. But

it is kind of it's perennial. It's you can see it in Buddhism, you can see it in US Hinduism, you can see it in many other religions, and even in Theosophy. So the idea of the sun son and the Sun s u win there is a relationship. Now do the Theosophists conflate a lot, Yes, do the Hindus conflate a lot? Yes, They're not like the exactly like what Ma was saying. It's not like they're not doing good. It's not good synthesis, it's not good syncretism. It's kind

of like it's a little off. The story is a little off. So I like the Jesus figure for Tifferate because I think he is the most like perhaps he especially in this image, especially in more Rosicrucian ideas, like he is showing the both strength, fearlessness, gesture of boom giving and fearlessness as well as like coming into the heart,

so coming into also malkouth. So that's interesting because obviously tiffer it or the sun is our great illuminator, but what is the point of illumination if you're not a prepared vessel. So that's part of the gilding. It's part of the alchemizing process that chrysopia and the gilding at the same time. So that's often why tipper It can be described as paradox as well, because there's a slight greening process, but it's not the green of code or

the green of net sock. It's very different. And so I just think that that's also interesting because it's like the preparation and what is it goes into the vessel. Well, the vessel is empty, as I said, but what is emptiness. Emptiness is just masslessness and luminousness. Everybody's heard me say this like ten million times, but that's really what it is.

So it's that it's not where his consciousness is. It's just the point of where you're going to go for higher experiences or higher knowledge or higher access to those

higher worlds or the higher suffer. So in many ways you can say that it's we have to prepare ourselves very much on the material world by balancing ourselves, by softening our sharp edges, by embodying those I'm not saying again, I'm not saying be Christian, but I'm saying that there's elements of the christ like figure who is a good balance of both. And so maybe that's a preparatory technique to take us through tifferent. I don't know, just some ideas.

you are getting there. Getting a diploma doesn't mean you're you're good at the thing, just means now you can start practicing it for real.

a religion. Okay, just for the sake of simplicity. You need it. You need a tiffer there. You need a solar archetype. That's saying because if you don't, then it's not enough to pull people in. Like that's what pulls people in, and then the other elements support like going into let's say Christianity. Okay, you go because there's the central image, but then whenever you start to want to get off, the other elements will push you back again.

So there's gonna be like a gave erotic element. Maybe that if that is better for you, it's gonna pull you off, It's gonna it's gonna kind of make you believe again. The tifferate is the is correct and is the best one and swan so it kind of keeps pulling you in. So if you don't have that well done, then guess what pe purchase? Not going to go to your religion or again company or whatever, right, and another thing, and then maybe I don't know if you guys want

to start talking about NETSA. But to me, it's very interesting that you can say, like Nick was saying, that the tree is the body. Okay, you cannot say that is the thing. The tree is the body. It's the first thing that we can correlate to. And in a way you can put different as being the heart. Right, so again it's the center of the body and so on.

But also if you connect the colors of the spheres, especially in the which are the most basic ones with everyone will know, for example, tifferent being yellow, then you can connect that to the chuck for us, and then it would actually be the solar plexus, which is slightly be low, and then NETSA, which is the green one, which would be the hard. So you have this kind of also like people connecting NETSA, and we'll get to it to like venus and the kind of beautiful things.

But then again is more related to tearfread. So there's there seems to be this kind of exchange there, which to me makes a lot of sense because when we think about basic colors we have when we are talking about painting, painting. So usually in school we learn about like blue, red and yellow, which by chance, right by chance, it's has said give and tifferent just by chance. But then when you come to the computer, for example, because the different ways the light has to be computed, you

have actually red, green, and blue. So now you'd have and we'll get to it to Nitsa. So I don't know. I found it's an interesting bridge when we want to get to it, this kind of correlations that the two of them have, or this kind of mix and match that I was thinking about here when when Gen was speaking, I.

This is narm Simha. Usually he's depicted as actually eating a demon on his lap, so you can see like the viscera and all the intestines and stuff, and like the walls of the palace are covered in blood because he actually drinks the blood of the demon and then he starts eating the gods. That's kind of the story. So he's here depicted with his wife, who is can be said to be Lochsmis, who can be said to

embody Venus. So I think that's very interesting. And she's also wearing a pink sorry, he's obviously wearing the green around his waist. He's obviously wearing gold.

so that can happen to him. So he has to be kind of liberated from the cycle, but he's also part of the cycle himself, So that is I think a big part of why tiffer It is both complicated, but also some people get very stuck there. So like Crowley, I think is a good example of this, Like I am the beast, Sure you are the beast, hundred percent,

I totally agree. Like we are the dragons if you want to call it that ourselves or we embody those qualities at least maybe not physical like we're not all nagas pun not intended, but you know, but in a way we are the dragons. So we have to kind

of rise up into higher consciousness. But if you already attain the kingdom, attain sort of this lower the mastery of the lower worlds or what you perceive as the mastery of the lower world so of course you're going to want to experience more and more of its pleasure, is more of its delights if you want to call that, and more of the taste that exists within it. You're not going to actually want to go higher into formlessness

because it's just too good. So that is that is one of the I would say pitfalls that's described in this image in particular. And then if Nick, if you don't mind doing the last one, and then we can put the nuts I'm sorry, guys, or if Josh has anything to say.

his name is. He does a meditation on twin hearts, and I know that that really emphasizes the heart and crown, but he places a great emphasis on pink light also in the meditation, So I thought that was curious when you mentioned that, gen it made me think of that meditation.

And also you mentioned how tipp breath was mostly light and how it also had a perido or green shade to it, and I couldn't help but think of the fact that plant life is green, and how there might be some type of connection there with maybe mercy or love, because I'm reminded of the story of the Arc and the flood again arc and how it wasn't until Noah was brought a olive sprig by the dove that he knew that the that the garuva had ended the judgment,

And so there may be maybe this the sprig of aries, even the green sprouting, maybybe that's somewhat symbolic and related. But I had a question from Matt real quick before

we moved on to the Netsac. So with you mentioned how tip Berreth had the most connection, and so it came to mind all of the different paths that connect to tip rat each have a Hebrew letter assigned, so I was curious if you had ever taken all of them together, and maybe if that was an anagram, or you know, if there was any curiosities that maybe sprang forth from from taking those letters and looking at them together.

But the one final thought I had was how you guys were talking about how these things can relate to love in different ways, both right and left, it seemed like, and I was.

and I'm do what you will. Let's see if there's a kind of a connection there but then one thing that is actually very funny about that is that we would have then we have eight connections, and then I get reminded of like Buddha in the eight paths, right, maybe all leading to different in a way, who knows. So that was a very interesting question. I'll think about it also, like how to connect those letters?

of gold and all these things. Okay, so she I said that she matches tiffer It in certain qualities, and she has eight limbs, and so if you understand the tontric iconography in it, she has to have eight lovers, eight time kings. And so how you would do this this is like old fashioned medieval contra. This is not I'm not saying to do this, I'm just saying this is how the text describes. So you would pick eight men dependent on their birth date and certain archetypes that

they embody physically. And so the Chandali, the princess of the outcase, she would go and have relations with all of these people, and then she would be kind of the queen of Tiffert. And so what that was supposed to give as the boon is the quality of fame worldwide, renown, extreme powers to magnetize, to bring people into your song, ritual words in grammar. So that plays off of what Matt said. And it's so interesting because she is the goddess who puts the words and the tempo and the

order the actual syntax of magical music. So not just regular music. This is ritual music composed in a very specific using contra to logic kind of way. So she is the goddess of that of synthesis in the truest sense. So very interesting about the letters, And because the goddess is in tntra, it's not necessarily cross system, but they are the letters because they are also light, so very interesting,

I think as well. But what else was I gonna say? Okay, so to I want to just before we go to nutsac, can we just do the last sorry? Sorry Nick. If we can do the dragon image, I think it'll this will tie into net SoC I think this will give us a good snakes and ladders. So this is Rahula saw so Rahula. People will know him if they know Vedic astrology as Rahu and Katu. The Buddhist image, obviously is not It's not just his head and his tail, which is how the Vedics would see him as two

separate entities. He's actually one entity. He's unified, and he has wait for it, eight heads on his crown, and he also has a raven's crown, so the raven is his ninth quote unquote head. Some people would say that the raven represents Shawnee or Saturn, so that would be kind of the end of the eight or ninth planet cycle. Vedic astrology uses a nine planetary cycle, so this is really important. So he is the king of his own planets, but he is also the king of all the planets

in some ways of thinking. He's the king of space, so he obviously I chose one that had colors that I thought were appropriate for this conversation. But his tail is green. But if you understand the text, the scales can open up and they become eyes, so they become opalescent. So that's really interesting. So it's green, but it's not quite green. And even the red that they're showing him, yes, it's red, and then with the flames it appears as red,

but really the tnric color is purple or brown. So I just think that those two things are very interesting when you're talking about the higher order thinking. But then of course you have the pink, you have the turquoise, you have the green clouds beneath him. So green is really the color of synthesis, red and blue. I know people are gonna be like, no, it's purple. Purple is

the lower density, it's the stronger density color. Green is the true neutral color, and then pink is the color of that decoherence around it, because you need the pink to give contour to the green. This is a really important principle for alchemy, and just obviously something I talk about a lot about when we do these cabal spaces.

And so the pink is not the truth, but it contains the truth because it gives contour and context to what arises in it, which if we go off Matt's example and say it's the water or excuse not the water the letters there's a language of fire and there's also a language of water. But what are those two things? Just languages of light, writing of light, words of light.

So maybe the pink is there to give those things context and contour, and maybe that's what green really is, green at its most pristine quality, not is like murkier, darker qualities. But because if we think we are the if we have a big ego and we say, oh I know all the words, I have all the knowledge, I have all the things. I am God, I am the beasts. Yes, those are useful ideas, but they're also you can't stay stuck in those ideas.

It's like so much about polarity, so much about looking at the astrology and not being married to it, but saying, okay, what is this telling me? This is an interesting cabalistic story of how to climb the tree because there is no greater example of how to climb the tree than

snakes and ladders. Obviously the lightning path as Matt talks about, and the dragon path both, so you also have to consider that it's like the snakes and Ladders is tntra that comes from Jane Tontra that even the game that everybody knows, and it's a tontric idea of climbing the tree. They use nine spheres, particularly for Jainism, but you know they're talking about the tree. They even call it the tree.

They call it Jumbovia, the rose apple tree. So there you have the reference to pink and as we talked about in the Cather episode, I like I think that pink is a very has a strong quality of kether because it has a strong quality of the truth.

and all that that you talk about a lot. And then when you mentioned the scales also having eyes on the bottom, I noticed Matt included the list of fletters there and the last one is I in which is I, I think right, So as you were talking about the eyes, I saw that I was like, Wow, I wonder if there's some fact strange connection here, But of course I don't know the too well enough to know, but theose are just some thoughts that came to my mind as you were discussing this image.

like that? But it's also like the ten and the one, So the ten is also the one because zero's obviously empty, not nothing empty, and so he can but he is said to also have one hundred and eight extraneous eyes. So this is really interesting because in contrac astrology, the

sun is actually a sign the number nine. And I've always thought that perhaps maybe they just flipped it, like maybe they saw a six or whatever, they saw the image of like whatever that is, even like whatever six even is, and they just flipped it over, and so

they made it the nine instead of your sad. I don't know, just an idea, because everything is reflected, right, like there is a supernal waters and things get flipped and people come back down and they might see a different because they had a different perspective or a different system or they you know, they maybe they're thinking was flipped, because that can also flip the image for you in those higher experiences in my opinion.

it would be one after the other. The way I connect at least a tarot would be temperance, which again talking about the making things harmonized, right, making the solution harmonized, so blending the solutions and so on. So I think that's a very very nice plot to then start talking about Niza.

He can give you all those boons, those worldly boons, but then his tail is like I'm the guru, I'm the I want to escape this this like it's very antibody, narcissism. It's very like I want to just escape this world. It's it's like a trap. It's a you know, it's a it's keeping me down. But no, that's really because he's unified, he's not separate, right, So that's really you

yourself is keeping you down. You're the one who's become aggregated or you're the one who's become full of, as we would say, desire.

But she's not fixed in Netsoc because for me, this is just for me. But and obviously I think the three of you also know this is like I don't agree that the daughter is the same as the mother. So for me, the archetypes are different and distinct and should be distinguished. So she, for me, represents the daughter archetype, meaning that she can come up maybe through nets SoC, maybe through the saint's path, you know, depending on how

you understand that, the path of the Saud. So maybe it's different than the hero, but she still comes up into that that tipperatic role, but her role is hidden. And that's also a quality of pink is it's not really real. It's a crystalline color. It's a prismatic or spectral color. So it's actually a color that you could say it comes from God if you want us to call it that himself or whomever, because it's very much something that our mind places upon something that shouldn't really exist.

It's almost like a crystalline spectral as I said color, it's almost electric and alive. So I just think that she's a cool image. And obviously you can say her and Jesus are married, and then that's obviously all chemical wedding stuff. But I'm not saying it literally. I'm not saying it just says like it's kind of a metacosmology, like you can just use the idea of the story. They don't have to be married. They could be the sisky,

they could be. You know, there's many interpretations, or some people would even say I don't believe this, but some people would even say that Mary Magdalene is Jesus himself, just dressed and maybe a hermetic garb. I've heard that. I don't agree with that. I'm just putting it out there that that is what some people think.

because the daughter is freer. But it's also like what Nick said, she's not completely untamed, but maybe she possesses that quality of love and will together. You often see this in what I call like rebellious princess sort of archetypes and mythology. He's possessed of herself, but she's innocent.

She doesn't know about like ritual magic and blood sacrifice and like evil, but she has her love and she has her will, and that's sort of what sets her forth on the path, and that's what makes her a great saint too, because she is not tainted inherently by worldly things, even though in a tontric way we would say that to travel the path of the saint is

to also walk through the carnal ground. So that's kind of how I think of her as like very much a compliment to sort of the heroic qualities of the Sun. It's not necessarily and it's not integation at all. It's

been perfect compliment, perfect synthesis. That's why I like, I think it's so important to we talked about this last time, like the sufferer are not masculine or feminine inherently, and so I think it's good, like when we do these public discussions of what Cabala is, it's good that people can see that there are actually other archetypes that can appear there. And it's not in negation. It doesn't even have to be in conflation like thinking it's the hermetic Jesus. No,

you can actually say that you can distinguish them. As Paris also said, the most base distinguishment in all of nature and all the phenomena is the masculine and the feminine. It's totally okay to just distinguish them. But if you go beyond, maybe you say it's oh, it's all the same. It's all the same, sure, but it's still good. I think it's useful for you know, penetrating the densities.

a beautiful naked woman. The divine name and archangel Jehovah Sabbath. If I'm saying that right lord of hoatsh the archangel is Haniel, whose roller ship is often linked to the moon in Venus, and that personifies beauty and love. The order of angels the angelic order of Netsalck is the elo hymn. Formative powers or archetypal ideas. The planet or the planet would be Venus, the virtue and the vice unselfishness as nets Sock's virtue, and on chastity and lust

as its vice. Spiritual experience vision of beauty Triumphant symbols could be the lamp and the girdle and the rose as primary symbols basically feminine. The feminine grace would be the rose. Active inspiration would be the lamp, and readiness to love it would be the girdle. Tarot correspondences the suit of sevens, and the colors at Sluth would be Ambibria, emerald, Yez a bright yellow green, and Assi a olive flecked

with gold. And the psychological spiritual function uh net Sock underlies instincts and emotional drives is the realm where free, free moving force begins to coalesce into forms of life. Net Sock is the seat of creative image, the seat of creative imagination and the esthetic principle of nature. Net Sock's victory comes from conquering illusions or glamour of superficial beauty, integrating the moral and spiritual depth behind appearances.

the visual colors go at net sock. I guess want I want to try to get at here is like sometimes you will hear like Lucifer even associated with this because of Venus, and I do think you can have both in this sphere. And I do think, you know, the spheres do have technically both in a sense the male and feminine aspects that this I would say is like kind of like again, I almost use the light bulb example.

But I do think it can get very deep to the extent where it's actually kind of like the false reality that you're falling in love with in this world. It's the beauty of the like what however, like again, even lust, I mean, obviously you're gonna lust a person who's of that looks appealing to you.

with it. But like that's I do even think it has a lot to do with the eyeballs in itself. I actually think a part of this that would even go back to the eyeballs to where I would even say, if we lived in a black and white world, I think things would not look as three D as realistic to where it would really catch your attention. And it's another thing I was kind of going back with with the whole rainbow. I even think, like the ideas of colors to give depth and perception and to really give

things a detail is what mind fucks you. It makes you full in love with the images and things because I always say, in my opinion, I think if you want to have a magical experiences, you got to close these eyes and show off this world and go somewhere else. It's I think opening up your eyes and loving everything that you see is the vice. That's a little deep, in a little extreme, but that's how I look at it.

I do think if you're a living in this world with your eyes open and you're in love with it, you are under some sort of Luciferian control.

a trap. It's also like a cleep up, like very very obviously, like do you get stuck in the matter, Like I'm not saying I'm not a reject matter person. But I'm also right, like I know you're not either. It's like, but we're saying non extreme. So yeah, it's not about like the full embrace of like materialism, but it's also not about necessarily the it's not about worldly spiritualism either, and so that's a big part of it.

Like you see a lot of especially like in Tntra, you see a lot of like black magicians using a venus as kind of like a very important idea because she's the great boon giver, so she can give you all the material pleasures. But then who's the planetary intelligence if you want to call it that. It's a it's a male figure. His name is Shukra, and he rides a white horse, and so he's like the king of

the world, the great sort of pleasure king. That's even how he would be described in Tontra like Pema Guelpa, like a great a worldly king who sort of brings with him like all the all the luciferic pleasures and then he can be higher. But when she's here, it's like she, yeah, exactly what Nick said. There's even an icon where she's looking down at her reflection into the into the sort of ocean of gems, that's what it's called.

So she sees her reflection and it's so beautiful that she falls in love with herself, and so she doesn't want to ever leave the eternity of the fortress. Like the mother of the Fortress. She never wants to go because the world is really a reflection of her and she's so beautiful. But it's also beautiful and terrible. So it's the carnal ground in the garden.

telling you, by the TV and the screen. When it comes to I guess, like even you know, it could work both ways. I think, depending on how you're looking at it. A lot of times I have seen people use that. I myself, it's not it's not common, but I know other people. I guess probably because of the limac background, Hathor would sometimes be associated with net sock and people would use Hathor, and I do think that.

of like sound in sight. Really it's it's gonna be there's gonna be light, and then there's gonna be the sound that comes for it before it comes into physical reality. And then if you're looking at hath Or down at the seventh sphere, that would be like putting it into form. Now still like you're still messing with sound in sight, but like now it's coming into form, it's coming into visual reality, and that's what's making you.

come in. It's in the progression as well as we get older. But I have other comments to you, but I just want to real quick with that.

goes right instead of left gate from our perspective. And that's very interesting because then it would mean that all the planets are going to our rational brain or left brain, and Venus, so letsa, it's the only one going to the right. So the natural way, let's say, is we first have the mental image, so again the beautiful woman or whatever we have it, and then we try to rationalize it. We then to try to transform it into language and say, oh, yeah, I love her. Whatever Venus

is saying. Do the opposite, get the language and make it into an image, you know, because when you get the language out and you just observe the image, then you have the silence of Mitza, which is something I very much connect when talking about going down the tree. So again, just with the example that I made, has said the good feelings about it, GeV, the cons the discipline you need on different you made sure you have the balance, the harmony, the beauty on NETSA. Yes, there's

the victory. The victory is coming right that it's what excited. It's coming into form. It's not quite there yet, but it's coming. What usually people do is at that time when they're you know, so in love with the idea, the emotions are bubbling in some one, they go and boast about the thing everywhere. They start talking to people, this new project that I'm doing or that I'm going to do. Right, they still didn't do it because the right So yeah, I gotta do it, I gotta do it.

Oh yeah, I'm going to this trip and one they start talking to people. Guess what, now, people not because they hate you or whatever, just because by our nature, they're going to project all the insecurities, all their problems, all their difficulties, all their their trash into your project. And now, guess what, most likely it won't happen in the best way possible because you just now made it.

Instead of being a single project, you're not made sure that you know, how many, however many people you talked is about are also going to participate into manifesting this thing. So you know, if you really want the victory that is apparent the emotions that you're thinking about it, be sident about it, you know, be silent. That's what again, Venus is doing is going removing the language and then making sure the images are there, to look at the

images and see for what they really are. Because like Nick and Jin we're saying, and I completely agree, what we are like being awake quote unquote, is being asleep from the real world. So when you close your eyes, usually closing the eyes is easier, not you don't necessarily need it, but it's usually easier. But when you go to sleep is when you actually wake up, the other way around. So knowing to differentiate that, knowing which images are quote unquote real or not, is what's going to

make you, you know, navigate reality better. Again not being not rejecting, but understanding understanding that sometimes there's a history being presented to you and it's just that it's a history you don't need to, you know, get stuck on it and so on. So another very interesting thing as well. And then I'll let you guys go. So when we're when we have the image of Jesus on the cross, right, we have Jesus on the cross, we have him at different his two hands, at his satin gbura. Then we

have one teeve. We have two tieves, but one of them in NTSA. The other will be in hot that Teev in NTSA is again the like Nack and Jim were saying, all the distractions, the emotions that are distraction you in one which is also very interesting because a lot of people, if you search for you know that I am affirmations these kind of things. The planet Earth

would be usually the feeling planet. So we are many times we are stuck here by feeling and not by rational not by logic like we think we are superlargical on the most people are really at the feeling step, and let's sake stuck on that, on what they're feeling. And another thing about this distraction idea is that it could be the netsa kliffa, so distractions, you know, the is I think it's like the crowds or whatever, the

crowds would hot or something like that. But it would be again that when you have too much of the time breaks down becomes a klifa of destruction. So knowing how to balance as always it's always knowing how to balance stuff. And I think for no, for not is it but very very interesting.

And also when you said to you know, keep things quiet, it reminds me of the thought of counting the cost before you begin a project, you know, making sure that you have everything set in play, because it does seem like the moment you speak something out, you know, the universe is like, hahaha, not today.

like a bug lamp, you know. I was kind of thinking of how it might be these things maybe have the potential to steal your crown or to steal your victory. Maybe they're stumbling blocks to prevent you from getting to Ketter or.

the two extremes of red and blue. It's like that in the Bardo region, you know, in between.

Melusine Starbucks figure kind of doing the same thing. And then the one final thought I had was in the Sumerian context, a way they kind of expressed Netsac I think was speaking the end of something at the beginning. So it kind of relates to what we were just talking about a moment ago, Matt, Like, these deities would proclaim what they.

disrupting like the karmac cycles. I'm Sora, and this is like important for like the purification of the cell or whatever that is. And so yeah, I agree with you. There's something and Venus moves counterclockwise. Someone in the chat mentioned this, and then Matt responded to them, and like, the one thing I disagree with what they said is that they said that Uranus is closer to Hopema. I don't disagree in some you guys and some AONs that that is true. I personally think that Uranus was closest

to cather in this aon. That's just my perspective, but that is more how I see it. And Uranus is really interestingly pink and turquoise when they show it. I'm not saying it is. I'm saying that when it appears from NASA or whatever, the Space Stagency, they show it as having a high quality of pink or a pink

ray at least in it. So I think that that can also you can also say that that's an allegory to maybe something that they understand or that we should understand, or or something that you see, because I if you've had sephardic experiences, these are things that you actually can see. I'm not saying the planets themselves, but ideas colors of course, densities, Like when you look at planetary densities like they are a sphere, they're often like they'll say, like gas, liquid ice.

So it's all the alchemical transmutations, right, So there's a lot of alchemy in what a planet is, and it's an aggregation, it's all together, it's formed into a full density. So there's a lot you can actually understand from like looking at that those ideas of the planets. But I so I'm just saying it's more like Heather. But I have to agree with what Matt said. He said it we rotate. It's not against everything. That's the there's certain ideas of the Uranian thinking and psych has to be

sort of contraindicatory to everything that came before. Its complete reversal, a complete transgression. But actually, like what Matt said, it's very subtle. It's actually not it's actually breaking up the things that came before breaking up. That doesn't mean that it's a total disruption of the past, but you're kind of throwing everything into back into flux. You're saying, actually, we can rethink of these things and remake of the ideas.

We don't have to stay stuck in those Saturnian sort of like I am God, I am myself, not that saturn. It's like that, but people tend to think of it like that. It's really more of a solar thing, or the more tifferatic thing to sort of like relate yourself as the king of the whole world. But obviously there's a tiffer It connects to all of them, so that's also really important, right, And tiferate is also the crossing point for netsoc to have those to have a relationship

with Bena. So right, so it's like a that's also in nexus for those like two things to interact. So of course, like a king must have his castle, his fortress and he and to have it stands Like I say, if he wanted to stand like your kingdom should stand a thousand years, So that would be a quality of netsalc as well. But then the king him self might not be at nuts doctor king might himself be at

Tiffert or higher. So just some ideas I have iconography, but I don't want to you know, disrupt people's flow. I just want to say that from Joshua.

is super beautiful. Oh, you're pretty and swan talking about esthetics also a little bit of ethics, because you know Tiffer, it is kind of trying to balance things out, make things right and so on. You will be talking from tiffered and then from that's not it would be more about the feelings and emotions. Right, So if you are

constantly talking about pay attention to this. A lot of people will say I think many times, which is more hot, And a lot of people will say I feel a lot of times, which is more in that SA, So you can attention to say, okay, they're more like this and like that, or if they always bring up emotional like relationship things and so on, again more related to working through that, which is a very interesting thing to see if you can pay attention because not only makes

you be present, right because you have to pay attention, but then you see, okay, they're operating from that. That's fear. That's interesting.

which is a feeling. It's sort of a midway point to say I want it's very there's something very venus about that as well, or nuts at but I agree, and I think that it is being about conscious aware and present of like our words, and it's so interesting that space came up or like the sound at least, because sound is really capturing the five elements in space. Space obviously being the fifth element, but you can always say that is also the minds, and I think that

that makes sense for most systems as well. So the if you don't mind, Nick, if you want to bring up one of the images, I wolves the start at the sound thing, because I think it's really interesting. So this is not the usual tontriic goddess associated with Venus. So let me just say that this is a much more I wouldn't say secret, but it's it's more of like a gin. It's like a deeper tontric understanding, we'll say. So you can see she has very nuts art colors.

She has the red sorry, because the Mars always keeps his eye on Venus, right, he loves Venus so much that he keeps his like effulgent flame fixed on her. So it's really interesting because on Tuesday nights she is appreciated as well as Friday nights, so she is the

evening star of both Mars and Venus. Interestingly, and her head we were talking about like being transfixed into the luciferic sort of emanation of light, well, her head is a bore, So a bore represents ignorance, so she knows what she is and she understands, and so does the at a higher level, the apasaca or the person practicing the sadna, they will also understand. She's really truly the goddess of ignorance, meaning that once you come into understanding

again that nutsuck banah sort of interaction. Once that happens, you lose the sin of ignorance. The sin of ignorance is not the foundational kind of sin, but it is an important one to recognize what the world really is. And so in Tatra we would say it's the dualism of the world, viewing the world strictly material or strictly spiritual. It's not the it's not about synthesis. But then you'll

notice she has the green behind her. So this is a really interesting goddess because in many ways she can be said this is not always true, but she can be said to be the emanation of all the tikinis or all the yoghinis. But she's the specific expression in sound, meaning she's not trapped in light. Because one thing about the bores squeal or scream is that it's said to be able to penetrate matter and let the sort of hidden light in it come out. So that's her power.

This is called voxcity. It's the very powerful accomplished sound. So it's all the five elements disaggregated and then projected back down into space. Sorry, that's all I had for that one, Nick, but if you want to do the other two, we can. So this goes along with exactly what Nick said. So this is actually the same goddess, I know, really interesting, right, she's sitting on the lion or the dais, it can be both in the other image, but in this one she's the dancing girl. But she's

not the dancing girl. She's the boreheaded mother, so she

is a mother, so it's very specific. So it is interesting because this is her when she's able to climb through the tree if you want to call it that, like the boar who climbs through matter, the light who perceives and penetrates all matter with sound, so you can see it's like and she's always associated with the downward pointed pentacle because it's like the light coming down into matter, or you could even say it's the water of Hesed coming down into ice because Sukra obviously is his planetary

stone is a diamond. So that's one thing. Even Nick said that like there's an element of venus or nuts all that represents all the colors. It's very prismatic. And Shukra's color is actually even considered to be gold, but it's not true gold. It's kind of like the material gold, which is they often warn't about in alchemy text, like you don't get transfixed on material gold. The whole point

is spiritual gold. So that's another interesting thing because she's depicted as red, and if you understand red and a tontric color scheme, red is actually post gunossek, which means it's post quality, so it's actually transcended the golden level. It's like what they would call like the robido, but the robido is like primary because it's really not robido.

It's really the sort of you can say it's a life blood, like very Venetian like there's a like kind of the life blood coming into coming up into higher form.

Not even is what her name means, Chandy, it means a durga excuse mega, means the fortress. So just almost so identical the nuts SoC and you can see she's the emanation in light of these uh. I think there are ten images, yes, ten ten goddesses in this image that are emanations of time and space, but light taking form in time and space, so that's kind of how you can think of it. So they're all her, but she's not even really her, whereas the other one with

the boar's head she knows who she is. She's like in the fullness of her wisdom. She's a composite wisdom. It's not in her fullness, it's still her in the material world. So there are these kinds of gnostic and crypto gnostic, if you want to call that ideas For people who are interested in more Western ideas of narcissism, yes, definitely the Central Asian religions Tantra, Buddhism, even as some kinds of Hinduism, Jainism, Daoism, there are very gnostic ideas.

It just depends on your flavor, like are you antibody nacissism or are you like more in the middle, more toperatic. So I think that's also what this image is saying, like, yes, she has a illuminant quality saying that, yes, if you understand the deeper contrack layer, you actually can go higher, you can actually disaggregate. But if you're just a normy person, maybe you just worship the primary one. And then for some people that's going to be where they go. They

cannot they're not able to sort of go higher. And that's okay and sort of something I've had to reconcile when speaking to other people about these more metaphysical topics is that not everybody's gonna fully understand what you're saying and what you mean, so you have to relay it in a way that's not a basal but is base enough that they can actually gain a seed, and even if they don't, they can sort of take of them and the idea and be like, Okay, this is something

that I can do to sort of remedy both astrological and perhaps personal affliction.

lot of delusion initiations, and so and so on. But what then I got reminded is the idea that when people say the morning star, right, like even Nick was talking about a lucer, and then I just reminded me as well. So people say, oh, the morning star, and then most people, because they read in a book or they read somewhere, they'll say, oh, it's it's Venus. Oh yeah, but think about it, are what is the star of

the morning, what makes the day be the day? The brightest star that we can see, it's literally the sun. It's different. It is a star First of all, it's not a planet, and it is the price. It is the one that illuminates everything. Sure, if you go see Wikipedia, they're going to say, oh, yeah, but because you saw it and so on, it's whatever. First of all, Wikipedia

is not an initiation like documentation or whatever. It's just whatever people write there, right, But if you think about it this way, then again connects with this idea that it's not that they can be interchanged, but they have

a pretty good relationship, the Sun and Venus. So again different and netsa all these correlations that we're talking about the colors, how some people will sometimes change one with the other, or how in Tiffer that we are talking about the beauty, but then inn'sa were also talking about Venus, which is also kind of beauty, like Hephrodye, these kind of things. So there's this kind of mix and match between the two, which is well, not that crazy if

you think about it. All the spheres kind of contain the whole three inside of them, and so one and Tiffer than Venus are quite close. So that's a very interesting thing to pay attention as well. And one last thing, the path we're going to get into the next time, which is hot. But the path between it'sa and hot, at least in the way that I use is it would be the star, which, again they're interesting. The Venusian initiation would be understanding your start, like what would make

you become a star. The Greek stories, zoos would create stars and constellations for the worthy, right, so for for an animal or for a hero, like you have a lot of constellations about you know, al Debaran and Bursles and whatever, because those guys were worthy of becoming a star, right, So what makes you then worthy of becoming one? What is your the same quote unquote purpose here. That's the one of the true Venusian initiations, which is something to you know, to ponder, to think about.

my favorite people. Venus appears at the apex at noon. So it's kind of the demarcation. This is just a vidic idea of vitic astrology idea, but it is interesting that it kind of demarcates that sort of again, that sort of you know, the way the cycle works, because it's very much tied into seasonality. Oh, this is what I was going to say. So you were talking about beauty, Matt, So this is how I've always distinguished them. And this might not be everybody's flavor, but I think I think

it's I can make a strong case for it. Is that the beauty at Netsalk is natural beauty. So it's the beauty of the gardens, beauty of the natural world as it is, and the beauty at Tiffer it is actually the synthetic beauty, not necessarily negative. I know people have very negative ideas of that word, but this is I'm just talking about, like I'm trying art and architecture and the higher order thinking. Now, those things, of course

can become clipothic, can become institutionally decayed. They're subject to the same forces that we are. So beauty is subject to the same forces that we are of time. But yeah, it's also a really important suffer for higher creation. It can be if you do if you do it on like more of a mass civilizational scale, it's not so much the independent artist. It can be, but there's an element of it that's much more rooted in kind of the world of man. That kind of beauty. It's high beauty.

But it's like if you go to the Louver, that's very you know, I know that's not the only one. And I know Matt just visited the Tower of Pisa and he didn't find it. I don't want to speak for him, but he didn't find it very He was underwhelmed,

we'll say. And that's but that's also like an element like people project their ideas of what beauty is, what higher order thinking is, and so through sort of time, I guess, is that we look at those things and we say, actually, not that impressive, Actually I can build something better, or actually my ideas are actually maybe let's trust them, let's prove them in the world, rather than say like, oh, we need to be fixed, like the Tower of Pisa, is it, like that's it like that's

the you know, seventh wonder of the Western world, and that's as high as we can go. But I don't personally believe that. I don't think that believes either. I don't think any of us do.

that from tantric nostrology. But it is it the actual crown, while in higher tantre you would say that the crown is adamantine or like mirror like it's crystalline almost it actually it reflects ultimate reality, which is empty and the crown that would appear at Venus or nets Sock. It's like the queen of the world, but it's not. It's not inherently the queen of the higher order. It's just she's very worldly, but she doesn't necessarily think of herself

as worldly, like she's not. You know, she has the choice. She can be the great Queen Mother, or she can be the you know, the evil crimson woman or the scarlet woman.

It's actually maybe you could say that tntras follows where the light falls and then that's their kind of like ten and one point, whereas the Jewis Kabbalis prefer like the Malkouth, like the man, like where the light falls inside of us, but Tantra is more interested in like what maya is or what the illusion is, so that's

why they place her in that sort of way. But then it also makes sense to be the seven because as we've talked about many times, like there are the sets of star goddesses which always number seven, eight or nine. So you see this like replicated over and over and over in contra like different goddesses, different groupings, but they're all related to this primordial set of seven, eight and nine, just like hod yesoda. And that's all. So it's speaking

to something, in my opinion, deeper and more profound. And it's again, it's all about Matt said this really well, and I'm sorry Matt, but yeah, it's all about perspective, vantage point, viewpoint, how you're perceiving it. Your feelings really matter when you're climbing the tree. If you are full of fear, full of aggregation. That doesn't mean you have to be like full right hand path like perfect Saint. It doesn't, But it doesn't mean like go be like

full left hand path like black Magician. Like No, there is actually like a good synthesis of the two where you don't have to be in extremity.

Cabala dot com. There's also the Grade Lodge, which we do again every Fridays, which is very interesting. I'm going to put also the website there, which we are now doing on YouTube as well. We are basically trying to catch up up until we can do it live on both ways, so on ACCE and YouTube at the same time, but for now you're just catching up and including all the recordings there. And yeah, that was very much awesome. Thanks a lot for calling, and thanks guys for the space and time here.

like discussing kabala, like very intermediate, like much more. I don't know I was we were. I was trying to do something different.

her episode just dropped today and then Thursday. Kelby Losak, who is the you know outlet favorite right now and he's his new books coming out Texas Tea in a month, so it's kind of like a perfect time for his episode to also drop. So thank you guys so much appreciate it. Everyone from the lodge who came into the chat, Nick's audience who always shows like us a great love and respect to appreciate it. And Nick himself of course for inviting us on and we letting us, you know,

promote ourselves and do this. And yeah, check out our YouTube because they will start being YouTube lives eventually in a few weeks anyway, and so I'm really excited for that. And yes, the great ledge we are just moving forward into the speculative future. So thank you guys so much appreciate it.