Mound Builders With Gregory L. Little

the visionary insights of the sleeping profit Edgar Casey. Doctor Little I spent decades investigating America's ancient sacred sites, and his research offers a compelling look at the loss civilization that once shaped this land, long before mainstream history days to admit. So buckle up because today we're venturing into the mounds, the myths, and the mystical memories of Forgotten America. But the other rejects that I got with me today before we get to Greg, I got Lisa, the occult

reject mad scientists with us today. What is going on? Lisa? How are you?

specialty of experimental psychology. Now I've been out of school for a long long time and most of my career has been in the field of criminal psychology, and I'm still active in that field, but I don't talk about it much. And that's just one of those things that just I really just don't discuss much. If somebody wants to ask a question, I'd be happy to answer it.

I got into this mound stuff in nineteen eighty three, after I've finished my first book, and it's a long, involved story, I won't get to it, but it came out of nowhere. My first book was called The Archetype Experience. It came out in nineteen eighty four, and it was a follow up to Carl Jung's final book, which was called Flying Saucers, a modern myth of things seen in

the skies. And since nobody understood what Carl Jung said in that book, or at least I'm saying nobody in the UFO field seemed to understand it, I decided, as a new young doctorate to go ahead and write the book on it. So that was my first one, and then I got into Mound's unexpectedly. I have a lot of books and a lot of different topics. I've written textbooks in psychopharmacology and criminal personality and personality theories and just lots of different areas. But the Indian Mound stuff

culminated with the writing of this monstrous book. It's like five hundred and some pages long, and it's called The Illustrated Encyclopedia of Native American Mounds and Earthworks. Every page is like this, and it goes through state by state, and it's got like a thousand sites in it. And this can't The first edition came out in two thousand and eight. The one I just showed is the second edition, and I can plug that because you can't buy it. There are none of those available now.

Ksey Organization a long time. It was actually the My wife was the head of the Casey Organization for many years and was on the board. Uh and we actually ran the ares where we were the Ares Search for Atlantis project for ten years in the Bahamas and the Yucatan and uh so we did a lot. So wherever you want to go with that, just quick quick question.

all anymore. Just don't want to, don't.

were mentally communicating with it. In fact, that, according to Agar Casey, is how the priests of Atlantis found out that Atlantis was going to be destroyed, and this was in ten thousand BC, and told them to come up with a plan to set up the three hall of Records. The main one, of course, is in Egypt. That's the one everybody knows about. But according to Casey, there were three hall of Records that were identical in case one of them got destroyed. So there's one in Egypt under

the Sphinx. There is one in the Yucatan at a place called Piatris Nigris, Guatemala. And then there's another one which is in the Bahamas, which when Casey gave the reading, it wasn't called the Bahamas.

back in about nineteen ninety seven. I was not an active member at the time, but we went there and got to meet one of the directors, and the director of the ARI found out about my interest in Indian mounds, which I'd already written several books about Indian mounds, and I was in the process of doing this monster at the time. Of course, this took a long time to do.

And he said, hey, why don't you look at the Edgar Casey readings on bound builders and compare what Casey said to what is known at the time about Native American mounds and history. And my answer was, I didn't know Agar Casey did any readings on Native American mounds. And again this is back in nineteen ninety seven, and

he said, yeah, so I did this research. Casey gave sixty eight readings about Native American mounds and ancient history in the Americas, but sixty eight readings specifically mentioned the mound builders. Some of the things that he said is that the mounds were built from the south up and he said that in the late nineteen twenties and at that time, really up until roughly nineteen ninety six or so,

this was true. What mainstream market marchaeology said is that the mound builders began in the north and went south. But Casey said in the nineteen twenties they began in the south and went north, and of course that was considered nonsense. Now that is the fact it began in the south and went north.

But now we know that mounds were being built in Louisiana starting in nine thousand BC. Wow, And we know that there are and there are more mounds in Louisiana the date to about six thousand BC, and a lot in four thousand and forty five hundred BC. And as you keep going north from southern Louisiana, it gets to thirty five hundred BC, thirty seven hundred BC, then you might get to two thousand BC, and then you're into about fifteen hundred BC, and it just pops up everywhere.

And in South America, the oldest mound right now that's known is a place called Isladel Tesoro, and it is dated to eighty four hundred BC. So that's one of the things Casey said that was absolutely crazy. When he said it, it made no sense whatsoever. He said that the mounds, though, were replicas of the experiences that people

had from Atlantis. And so, as far as I know, Casey is the only one of the late eighteen hundreds early nineteen hundreds people like in Theosophy or some of the alternative spiritual beliefs that said that the Native Americans

were the Atlanteans. Case he said point blank in his readings that the Red Race were the Atlantians, and he specifically mentioned the Iroquois, and he said that before Atlantis, the final destruction of Atlantis around ten thousand BC occurred, a number of Atlantians went, particularly to the northeast of America, and they merged in with the Red race that was already there, but they were the Atlantians. So he also said that there were three big dispersions into North America.

One of them began in fifty thousand BC. People from the South Pacific, that's the term that he used, came mainly into South America, and then some of them moved up into the western part, the southwest of the United States. He said there was a The other intrusion into the America is around twenty eight thousand BC, and then in ten thousand BC there were loads of people, different people that came in and that of course is when Beringia opened, when the Bearing Straits let a lot of people from

Siberian Asia come over. And all those those are the dates that he gave. And now at least the ten thousand BC, which he said again in the nineteen twenties, before Clovis and before the Folsom Points were found archaeology at the time he said this believed there was no one in the America's before six thousand BC. Up to around the nineteen thirties and forties, archaeologists told us that there was nobody here until about eight thousand years ago. Amazing.

So those are the sum of the things that Casey said. I will say this in these books, Egar Casey's not mentioned one time. I just there's just no reason to do it, because I'm only covering what we know about mounds and mound sites so people can go to them. Uh So, you know, there's nothing in this book either about criminal psychology. It's just it's irrelevant. Uh So I try to keep all these things separate, so that.

as far as all these other intrusions. I am at the point now as I've learned so much in the past years, because I have a lot of archaeologists that talk to me now they don't do so openly, but what's happened in American archaeology there's a huge shift. Of course, when Clovis was basically killed, there's actually still Clovis holdouts. I wrote some did some Twitter posts on it, and this was after a mainstream archaeologist told me there's still

archaeologists in academia arguing that Clovis was first. There was nobody here before ten thousand BC. And it's a crazy there's so much the overwhelming evidence, but things have dramatically shifted, and the big shift is this, it's like everybody, almost everybody knows about Kahokia. Kahokia is this massive mound site in Cohokia, Illinois, which is about ten miles to the

east of Saint Louis, Missouri. Kahokia is most known because it has this gigantic mound called Monk's Mound, the name for when a monk lived on the top in historic times. Monk's Mound one time covered seventeen acres. Now it now covers fourteen acres, but it once covered seventeen acres. I'm giving you that size because the Great Pyramid at Giza covers thirteen acres. So Monk's Mound covers now fourteen acres. After hundreds of years of erosion and archaeologists screwing it up.

It is one hundred feet tall. It's as tall as a ten story building. That's the way to think of it. So you got this mound that's a ten story building. There's a stone, giant stone chamber inside of it that wasn't discovered till nineteen ninety seven, and nobody knows what it is or what's in it, and we probably will never know, at least not in our lifetime because of nagpra laws. That's another whole story. But there's a one

hundred and twenty mounds at Kahokia. Monks Mound is just the biggest sorry question.

gigantic conical mounds. They can get up to eighty eighty five feet tall and like a top of an ice cream cone, like a big That's why they're called conical, So they're big. Uh. They usually have stone chambers in the base and loads of burials in them, and the burials are generally pretty elaborate. Sometimes they have earthworks around them, which means a huge ditch, maybe an outer wall around it, an earthen wall. They started building those around two thousand BC,

that's the earliest. Most of them date to one thousand BC to roughly two hundred BC, and then they transitioned into the Hope Well. So the Adena people were the people who built the Adena mounds, and the Adena Mounds is simply it's a culture name from Adena, Ohio, which was the name of the plantation near Chillicothe. That one where the first mound of the Adena mound was excavated, and it was a governor's house where they did it. He had the mound on his land, so they called

it the Adena culture. Hope Well was also there and near Chillicothe, and it was the Hopewell Plantation and the Hope Well were the sort I guess the logical outcome of the Edena, and they built these gigantic geometric earthworks, some of which extend fifty six miles in length. The largest geometric earthworks in the world are in the United States. They start in Newark, Ohio, and they end in Chilicothe, Ohio. That's another really long story. But the Adena, there are

some authors who say the Adena were white. I can tell you that there have been quite a bit of studies where they have taken the skeletal remains excavated from Adena and Hope Well and Mississippian, which was the next group, the next culture that came after the Hope Well. They have taken those skeletons. They have removed both mitochondrial DNA and new kittar DNA, which do kular DNA is human DNA,

and a lot of people don't understand mitochondrial DNA. But anyway, I won't I won't get to take the rest of the show. But they have tested them and their DNA essentially is the same as the as the current descendants of those people who are the Native American tribes or the first peoples in Canada. First Peoples is the term used in Canada. Now in America, most tribes do not like the term first peoples because they want to argue

about who was first. And we know there's a lot of movement, but they were here a long long time, so I'm not a I do know this too, and this is where I was going before the term Adena came up. What's known is that there was a huge intrusion of people around the year nine hundred, eight hundred to nine hundred. They came into the Southwest at that time from Yucatan, going across the Gulf of whatever you want to call it. No matter what I say, when I say that golf of you know what, somebody gets mad.

If I call it the Golf of Mexico. Somebody will say, no, it's the Golf of America, and the other way around. So there were people traveling from the Yucatan to what we call Florida and to Louisiana. Some of them were probably going around on land. They were traveling, they were bringing culture, they were doing cultural and people exchanges. But it was occurring on a massive level in the Southwest

this is now known. And this massive group of people coming into the Southwest brought this culture with them, and it was a culture of kings. You'll hear this. You'll hear people talking about chiefs all the time. And the first time that I started saying Native Americans had kings, at least at Kahokia they had a king. And that's only been the last year where I've found that out, and it's from mainstream archaeologists, so it's causing a revolution

and archaeologists. But what they did was take this into that area called American Bottom where Cohokia, Illinois is American Bottom. They brought this type of corn or maize, which grows really well, produced an astonishing surplus of food, and literally

tens of thousands of people came in there. And you'll hear if you look on Wikipedia or other places, they'll tell you, oh, the population of Cohokia was five, maybe ten thousand people, and then some will say, well, there might have been twenty thousand in the area, but now it is at least twenty thousand people right at the core of Kohoki, and another thirty thousand living right around it,

like in the suburb. The immediate suburbs. So in an area of a radius or let's say a diameter of ten miles, a circle of ten miles, you had fifty thousand people or more, and then a lot more living outside of that. But in the year eleven fifty it collapsed. And when it collapsed, this is the great mystery that comes up about Kahokia. Where did everybody go? Where did they go? I mean, you see that on ancient Aliens, you see it on other places, and where they went

as well. And what happened was that there was a massive drought. The people were being controlled and were going along with this kingship idea because and what I'll call the path of Soul's ideology. That that term is from a book that I wrote in twenty fourteen, and it's their belief system about what happens to you when you die and how to control where you go when you die. That's the path of souls. It involved the use of hallucinogenic substances, It involved the use of ritual, that involved

the use of these geometric earthworks. But when the drought occurred, people lost faith in the king, they lost faith in the system, and they were starving, so they left and then around the year twelve hundred, fifty years later, these same types of sites as Kahokia, with these gigantic platform mounds and multiple mounds. And by the way, Kahokia was

a walled fortress. It had walls twenty feet high. And right after Kahokia, around the year twelve hundred, you have hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of small towns and cities that are walled fortresses popping up from Wisconsin, in Michigan and in Pennsylvania, in Florida, in Alabama and Louisiana and Texas, all over the place. So I don't know how I got to that, uh, but I'll end with that because I can talk your whole time. I don't I don't need to do that.

of the Eastern Gate. And some say that the womp and belt that they hold is actually the Confederation Document of Canada because the Crown doesn't actually have one. So that is an interesting kind of Canadian conspiracy layer. But no, I agree with what Casey said, but that the southern sort of buildings that were more grand. But in defense of like the Great White North, we'll say the far

northern archaeology is very under explored. And there obviously was those studies in the Yukon that got I guess academically canceled because they upset indigenous sort of oral stories about the history of that area. But I have seen Sundance wheels and like stone ones that are they say are thousands of years old, So I have seen those in northern Alberta, so I know that there is something that

is like very interesting. I've also been to Sundance several times, so I don't know, but yeah, I mean it's a I think that you're right though. I think you see like a great movement of people, like I always say, like the Navajo, they only went in the fourteen hundreds, Yeah, right right, and they're related to people from that are They call themselves Dene, so they're even their language didn't change that much in those like seven hundred years of walking down south, I guess.

photos and information. Somebody asked me last week, where's the northernmost mound that I know of in North America? And I can't pronounce it because the name changed, But it's actually in what used to be called Barrow, Alaska, which is as far north in Alaska as you can go, right at that top of Alaska and the Aleutian Islands. One island called Rat Island in the Aleutian Islands has

five hundred mounds on it. Just one small island in the Aleutians, but all the Allusian islands are covered with them. Canada has a lot. I would suspect there are thousands of Canada in Canada that are not documented, which means registered with the government, with the agencies and their practices. The practices of the first people there were very similar to like the Seneca and the Mohawk and the Five Tribes and so on. And the swastika is a very

big deal. I don't show these much, but I have a whole bunch of magazines and photos of class commencements from Pennsylvania schools Indian schools that the whole front of the commencement booklet like it's a booklet and it's got rows of swastika is on it all over it, and that was the symbol of the school, the swastika. I have pictures of Native American basketball teams and they're on their jerseys for swastikas. Swastikas were it was considered a

symbol of good luck. It was a symbol of wisdom also, and I'm sure it was far deeper than that. But I do know that the mound Builder's cosmology with this path of soul's idea, I don't know how much that transfers to say, the Northern the Northern tribes, but I do know that they have the same basic beliefs as the Navajo. There's some shared underlying cosmology and belief system with all of them, and it appears to be the same cosmology and a lot of Asian and even European cultures.

Andrew Collins is one of my good friends. He stays with us a couple of times a year. We go over to England and stay with him a couple of times a year. And Andrew and I have written quite a few books together and made a lot of videos together. But Andrew studies that stuff in the cultures in Europe, and that's what we have collaborated on. I'll do the

Native American stuff and he does the European stuff. But there's some ancient system of beliefs about the body and about spirituality and the soul and what happens when we die that appears to be almost universal and what we're yeah, what we're seeing in the Native American low at least, is their side of that universal belief system.

with Orion, which came from Robert Bouvall. Of course, and so Andrew did some work and he wrote a book called The Signas Mystery, because an engineer has said, well, the stars of Signus, which is the northern cross, the three the three main it's actually the cross the t of Signus. Those three stars fit the pyramids better. So Graham didn't like that. Graham and Andrew are good friends. At the time, I didn't know Graham. I do know Graham now pretty well and have interacted with him quite

a lot. But Graham said, signus is ridiculous, it's not part of it. Well, when the book Path of Souls came out in twenty fourteen, Andrew wrote the introduction to it, and Graham wound up buying The Path of Souls and then he contacted me, and it was astonishing because in the Path of Souls it talks about this belief system of Native Americans. When they die, they do this ceremony for the soul, and the ceremony is done on the winter solstice, and it's aimed at Oryan. You have to

aim it at Oryan. So you might do a cremation on the top of a crematory mound, and you have a enclosure around the mound like earthworks. Hope well, earthworks, But there's an opening and the soul is propelled through that opening, and it has to happen on the winter

solstice sunrise. They've got a two week window to do it, and the soul makes a leap toward Orion's nebula, which is called Messa forty three, and it's right under the three Belt stars, and it has to occur right before the sun rises and blots it out, so Oriyon sets into the western horizon. Then the soul tucks into Messa forty three. There's actually a depiction of this in lots of Native American pottery and in lots of their iconography.

And the soul then traverses the underworld during the day, so it makes a safe passage in the underworld, tucked in to an ogie is the term they use, that spelled ogee. The soul goes under and around and it comes up the next night on the eastern horizon, which is where Oryon rises, and then of course it crosses the sky and sets in the western horizon when it comes up when it's first scene to night, the soul

comes out of this of messy or this ogie. It hops on the Milky Way and makes a journey that lasts a while on the Path of Souls or the ghost Trail as some Native American tribes call it, to signus and at the Signals constellation it meets a gigantic raptor bird, which is a judge, and then it has these trials, and the judge is at the fork of the milky way. One side of the milky way is

a dead end. The other side continues on. If the soul is found worthy and not burdened by its deeds on Earth, it is allowed to pass, and it goes to another portal or ogi, and it goes to the other world. Well, when Graham saw that, Graham researched the same stuff and said, oh my God. I was at a conference with Graham and he stood up. He showed the cover of Path of Souls, and he said, Okay, I got to admit it that the Path of Soul, it's the same thing that the ancient Egyptians were doing.

That it's the exact same kind of cosmology, and it's shown. They showed it slightly different. But that's where the idea comes from. What I've said that there's a shared belief system here that is across massive cultures, and there's no real way to explain it except I do believe that ancient America had lots of people come in and out many many times, many intrusions. I will say this that if a thousand men came, let's say, a thousand guys from England came in, which isn't what I'm claiming. But

let's say a thousand Vikings came in. If they were all men, they wouldn't leave a trace of themselves with Native Americans, not a genetic trace if you're looking at ancient DNA, which is mitochondrial DNA, because mitochondrial DNA only comes from the female side. So even if the those Vikings had inner bred and had you know, thousands and thousands and thousands of children that and their descendants are still alive today, they wouldn't have a genetic trace with mitochondrial DNA.

Coast too, there were Chinese. There's actually native American DNA that perfectly matches what we would call formo well Taiwan. Sorry, I can't say foremost it's a dirty word. It used to be called that when I was in school, that they made him change the name. Long story.

But it is very interesting and like the idea of land claims like you guys are talking about, like Martinism, and I agree, I think that there was a templar influence because if you look at treaty chiefs, especially the numbered treaties, so in Alberta, Saskatchewan, and Manitoba part of Ontario. These are called the Numbered Treaties. So these were like the major, major treaties that sort of set up the founding of Canada really because the treaties are with the crown.

So all the treaty chiefs had blue eyes. All the treaty chiefs signatories, so it is interesting. And they were all mixed race, but more explicitly mixed race, not like mixed race like me where they're like half half. Not that they were like secretly. I mean, I don't know if they were, but they were like French, Canadian or Scottish usually those are usually the two things. And in regards to Chinese ethnicity in on the West Coast, this is something I actually studied a little bit. And so

so there is a more recent explanation. And when we uh JJ and Nick and I can't remember who else was there, but we did the big trouble in Little China, so we talked a little bit. Yeah, and so we talked a little bit about this. So the Chinese when they first came to North America, they didn't were not

allowed to bring women. So there was actually a high degree of inter marriage between the two communities, and even like Jennifer Tilly is the most famous example, but there's actually most people from those islands, like you were talking about the Aleutian Islands in Yukavic and so the Vancouver Islands, a lot of those native people actually have Chinese grandparents or Chinese ancestry of significant degree. They were saying, it's

upwards of thirty percent of them. So that's considered significant for like an ethnic Studi's kind of demography. So it is interesting, but I just think it might be more recent, but it definitely exists, and people were definitely seeing systems the same, like the medicine societies, like the Metawun societies. Yeah, there's definitely overlap with like freemasonry and like Cabala and how they understand sort of the cosmology. And you look at medicine wheels and the colors all match and it

looks like malkouth on the Cabala stick tree. But then you understand like it turns and there's all this build out, but it's all oral, right, So that's sort of the difference between like the more European stuff and the obviously the more indigenous stuff. It's also interesting, Greg about your point about Kahokia, because in Cree tradition, if a society collapsed, they would just disperse into small family bands, and that's totally fine. It was a very kind of anarchic existence.

So if it seems like they were drawing more from the Cherokee kind of culture nexus, because the five civilized shrubs, interestingly, are all part of the same ethno linguistic family, right, and they don't clude like these other people that we're talking about, like how you was talking about Nyckmah. So they're Algonquin speakers. I'm talking about Cree people. They're algonquin speakers. Denny people are not Algonquin speakers, but they're part of

an arctic thing. So they've clearly adopted the religion as they move south, if you want to call it like an axial religion, like they started absorbing the practices as they moved into the Southwest. That's how I think of it.

skeletal remains from mounds were tested for mitochondrial DNA. And this began actually in the nineteen eighties, and it began when the National Institutes of Health were trying to find the genetic cause of certain dis diseases that the Pima tribe in Southwest America and the big the Blackfoot tribe in the north I'll call it Northwest area Central area of the United States. And so as a test they took nuclear DNA from them, which you get from blood.

But they also took mitochondrial DNA as a test, and they were surprised. The reason they took mitochondrial DNA is because they believed that the mitochondria, which are a type of vestigial bacteria, that the mitochondria probably didn't mutate. They had a very simple DNA structure, and they were shocked. They came up with four different types of mitochondrial DNA, and because it was convenient for them and they were shocked, they said, oh, what do we call them. Let's call

them ABCD. And all of that came from North America, so a media or from the United States. Immediately they started testing these skeleton remains out of mounds, and sure enough they found ABC and D. So at that time archaeologists from the United States went to Siberia and started testing Siberian natives that had lived there their entire lives, and they found sure enough, they had a C and D. They then tested some people in Japan and China and found that they had B. That these are called Happler

groups or haplotypes, and so they said, ah, we've proven that all of the Native Americans came from Siberia across Beringia. That was it initially, and then they found one they couldn't explain in skeleton remains and in the testing of living Native Americans it started popping up about one to two to three percent of Native Americans had it, and they couldn't They were shocked. They hadn't found any of it anywhere else except in the skeletonym and in living

Native Americans. And they call it X. They literally called the fifth one X. And it's astonishing. So Happler group X made them start looking everywhere around the world. And today there are thirty two major haplogroups of mitochondrial DNA. And if you've ever heard of mitochondrial EVE, it's based upon all these Happler group studies that began around nineteen eighty two by the National Institute's of Health, designed to study Native American genetic diseases. That's where it all came from.

So HAPLA group X and A. It's a time machine. It's very difficult to explain this, but mitochondria have mutations on a fairly regular rate, so many thousands of years as I recall it, fivey one hundred and some odd number of years as the average, but it mutates. So by removing remains from cemeteries and knowing when these remains were buried, which is something they've actually done all over the place, they can tell when these different HAPLA groups

developed in different areas of the world. One good example is HAPLA group X. A place where it popped up to very high degree is in the Pyrenees Mountains in five to six thousand year old cemeteries in the Pyrenees. Anybody know who the people that lived in the Pyrenees were the very pardon the Basques, correct, the Basques. Nobody knows where the Basques come from, including the Basque. They don't seem to know. So it's a very unusual group of people. By the way, that's a place where Edgar

Casey said the Atlanteans went. Also, in addition to North America, they went to the Basque or to the Pyrenees mountains anyway. So that's one of the things I wanted to ask you about. If they're using Happler Group's A, B, C, and D, which was the first ones found. And I have read a bit out of Canada of skeletal remain research, all of which was done in the early eighties and very early nineties, but all of that has come to a halt, at least a part where they're looking at

the skeletal remains. There's a fellow and go to another thing you said, there's a fellow by the name of Pd Newman who has a recent book called Tripping on the Trail of Ghosts, which he started when he read Path of Souls and had a discussion with Graham Hancock. It was Graham Hancock who told him you needed to read this book Path of Souls at a conference in England.

So Pd is an expert in masonry, is a thirty second degree Mason, and he wrote a book on the Theoredy, and so he wrote this book, Tripping on the Path of Souls, which is about the Mida One ceremony, which involves an ayahuasca like substance that Native Americans. We know they were using ayahuasca. Course is the substance, the DMT substance used in South America, but it was also being

used here in North America. And it's shown the way to make it and how it's used is in some of the midi one ceremonies that are in the in the literature, the ethnography literature from the eighteen hundreds, and they were using a lot of hallucinogens in this school.

see a lot of I'm really interested in syncretism. So what I used to think about a lot was kind of like the syncretism between like indigenous pathways and like falsism, because in Canada especially, most Native people are Catholic, so you see a lot more syncretism in those kind of churches,

in those kind of regions. So I was the idea that the a passion flower like whe of European thoughts said that, okay, that is like the Christ, like the explosion of like you could say, like the splendor of God, like the explosion of like a religious experience, and like an indigenous person would say that they would have maybe a different cosmological reasoning that they would see the same thing. They would they would know that that's from the Creator,

from whatever, from the spirit. So I just think that that's really interesting, and so I just I vote past the flora for.

is in the roots of honeylocusts. So they would mix passion flower with honeylocust, with the roots of honeylocust, and it created the same experience as you get with ayahuasca.

He's also found psilocybin mushrooms virtually everywhere around them, amanita mushrooms mainly in the a little further north, and many many other substances, although deta was also used with well all the tribes used to Terra, and a lot of these substances have been found in the residual studies that have been done on pipes and various pottery that's been found. There are hundreds of studies where they've taken ancient pottery and ancient pipes that have been excavated from mount and

then chemically analyzed what sent them. Passion flower, the root from the honeylocust tree, lots of mushroom those are found in it, and detera, and of course tobacco in the pipes. So many people want to believe they smoke marijuana, but it wasn't. Around thousands of years ago, it wasn't. Yeah, so just go off.

ethno medicinal potential, like where European herbs. There's an idea in Culpepper where he says, like the herbs for the people grow around those people. So in like England, they just need like the common herbs they're fine with, like comfrey and coleenjula, but like the the more quote unquote air quotes jj civilized you you go, the more eastward, the more dense the population, you need plague medicines, you

need like complicated medicinal compounds. So the herbs neces necessarily have to be and thank you necessarily have to be more potent. So it is interesting that we share or not we but you know North Americans we share like that our herbs also have a high degree of medicinal potency.

planted there. But it's all over the place. Now we're only talking about certain kinds of mound sites where this path the soul's ideology was present, where you know, you were sending the soul to the stars, and so you had to use these substances. And of course the whole Middle One story that all that, all that mythology is tied into this.

I think that that's true. And I also think that there is like a biodynamic reason too, because like the obviously the further north you go, it gets really harsh in the winters, so you would like you necessitate a different kind of social organization. But like even in Illinois that's kind of like that's still not that's still not warm, right, like you know, so you you would have to you would have to have something that sort of drew people

in ideologically or politically or or spiritually. As you're arguing, like with the idea of the king, that makes a lot of sense, right, it's very logical.

Chocolate has been found in residue studies at Ettawa, Georgia, at the site of Ediwa, and the only place it comes from is Central America, Yucatan, Central America. There is no chocolate that grows further north. These are just two pieces of evidence about it. Gosh Okay. So another thing is round. There are round, flat top mounds. So when I say round, the base is not square like a

pyramid or even rectangular. It's perfectly round. Some of these are ten twenty feet high thirty feet high, so they're very big around. They're found at Jojokam sites in Arizona. Arizona has hundreds of platform mounds. Most people don't know that they have it because they're now covered from thousands of years, you know, sand blowing on them and building collapses on them. But there's a couple thousand platform mouns. There's about one hundred and fifty to two hundred that

you can go see. But the round ones apparently all came up from the South. They came up from meso American cultures, and those round ones then were seen in what are called Cato Lands, which are mainly in Arkansas and parts of Texas and parts of Oklahoma. And then the Cato were the ones that carried them over and started Kahokia. Well what they were there's two things they're used for. One of them is they were literally performance mounds. And when I say a performance mound, it's like you'd

have a stage. They were a stage, and they were stages for both religious and for some sort of political or other use. And there were others that are literally now called water temples in archaeology. And so at the top of these mounds they built these big buildings and we know, like the big building on the top of Monks Mound Atkahokia was one hundred feet long, fifty feet wide, and it was fifty feet tall. This is all known.

This is mainstream archaeology. So it was a five thousand square foot building on the floor and it probably had multiple levels, although we don't know that. But it's not the biggest building that's ever found that was ever found. The biggest one that I'm aware of was in Safety Safety Harbor, Florida, where the Spanish went in and met the His name was Carlos, at least that's what they

called him, the cask and inside where he was. I've posted pictures of this because the University of Florida's the museum at the University of Florida, which is called the Florida Natural History Museum, has a full sized diorama of this, which all comes from what the Spanish said, and they said that five thousand people would have easily stood in this building where the king lived five thousand. There were two thousand people in it when the Spanish were there.

I'm in this one building where the king resided, So there was a lot of these buildings were big. But back to Kahokia, then these water temples had these giant sweat lodges in them buildings where water was carried up and fires were going. And that's like a perfect thing during the winter. Now I'm from I'm from central Pennsylvania initially, uh. And I've traveled a lot through Ohio and Illinois and the winter, and yeah, you're right, it's awful cold. Uh.

But these mound sites were lived in year around. There. There's one in Astalon, Wisconsin, UH, which was a Kahokia outpost uh. That is way up toward the beginning of the Mississippi River, and it was year round also, and it had the same thing. It had the sweat lodges on these central mounds uh, circular mounds uh. And I and that all they believe came from the Mesoamerican influence. So I don't know where I'm going with that. So I'll stop and see what else we got.

that's called a dilution effect. So it would almost be to me that it started in the Americas and the movement went outward, not inward. Does that make sense?

the children of the law of one. If you know anything about ager Casey, agar Casey said, the good side of the Atlanteans, because it's split into two groups there was a good side and a not so good side. But the good side was the children of the law of one. But anyway, that's what the Drews call themselves. But anyway, yes, it does disperse X two A very clearly started here. Sorry, go ahead, you know.

But my question to the burial mounds one of the things that I found pretty interesting, and you mentioned Piadras that was built I believe in the USA Macinta River.

And so you see all of these burial mounds being built on the banks or at the mouth of a river, and you almost have to wonder, why was there not an outbreak of tuberculosis, of cholera, of hepatitis. They're burying all these bodies, surely they're seeping into the groundwater and going to come out, but there isn't at all. And so I always found that completely fascinating. So my question to you was, what do you think the significance was in placing these burial mountains by water?

always had to live near water. The population centers were near water, just as they are today. But I don't know, I do not know, you know, the the idea of that. They used to say that Kahokia. This was one of the theories about Cohokia when the tens of thousands of people left Kahokiah or disappeared. According to the mystery there that it might have been disease, and I once thought it was disease, and I once thought, maybe it's because

they used all the wood. You know, when you got fifty thousand people basically living on the land and they all need wood every day for fire and they start moving out, I figured, oh, they used all the wood and it became unsustainable. But that's not the case either. So, yeah, Kahokia didn't disappear because of their diseases. There were diseases that occurred, but it's after the Spanish came in, yes, and it destroyed up to ninety eight percent of the

population in some places. So I don't know. I don't have an idea why they a lot of the you know, they just didn't throw a body on the ground and then cover it with dirt. That's what almost everybody thought that a mound is, and that's what I thought till I got till I really got into this. When I started, I didn't know anything about this, and I thought a mound was just a you know, dird over a dead body. But usually they prepared the space. They carefully prepared it

they created tombs. People don't know this either. If you go to England, you'll see a lot of stone burial chambers, really well made stone burial chambers. Loads of American mounds have the exact same thing. Stone burial chambers, very well made stone burial chambers. But most people don't know this. The roofs were made out of either big slabs of stone put over each other, or they often used gigantic logs laid across and then put stone on top of them.

A lot of these, a lot of these burial chambers have been excavated, or I'll use the word looted because that's more appropriate. They have been looted intact, and they've just found incredible stuff out of them. I mean, it's incredible, how much how many artifacts and the I hate I seldom said, I'm never said, I'm not sure I want to.

I'm not going to say what all the things that have been found at but lots of pottery, lots of copper, lots of lots of flint, coal, you name it, obsidian, stone tablets, the.

do that. But yes, some gold and silver have been found by archaeologists doing excavations in the Native American mass. It's hard to find those reports. I don't have those. I don't mention that in here because of you. I just don't. Yeah.

The rest of them, you know, are called into question because they were found by non archaeologists. But they're genuine and you can't see the originals anymore except for those in private collections.

a tribe registered nagpro representative. I went through the Yeah, I went so, and it costs a lot of money. So university and there's only a few of them. The federal they get registered or authorized to do this. There aren't many tribal representatives that are authorized to do it,

so it's taking a lot of time. So rather than museums just pulling everything out of display, they just closed the doors to that area, which we've found in Texas, the Portsmouth, Ohio Museum, which had an incredible collection, they just cordin. Yeah, the second floor, which is where all that was.

incredible artifacts from the mounds. All of those were actually reburied in a mound at the site. About a year ago. They had a secret ceremony where they were reburied Southwest. Reburied a lot. Now what you'll see in some are these have to be approved too. Replicas. There are some pottery replicas that they show, but those have to be approved also. I went to the University of Arkansas Museum in Fayetteville and saw, I'm going to guess one hundred

thousand artifacts. I posted photos of being in this museum. It's closed. I got permission to go in. I wasn't allowed to see the repatriated artifacts, which are on these stands that are about shelves that are about ten feet high, really long, and there's like thirty or forty double shelves that are just full. I've posted some photos of that on Twitter, but none of that is shown, nor will it be. So that's what's happened. Coolam moch Georgia Cola

Mochi had incredible artifacts taken. They had They were the only place I know of where they found a couple hundred pottery vessels found intact that were all perfectly preserved, placed in a chamber and a mound so they would not break, would not get wet, and they were recovered in the nineteen hundreds and nineteen forties and put on display there. I mean, absolutely beautiful. I've posted a lot of pictures of those on Twitter. Also, that's now been closed.

I was there last year at this time, and from last year at this time to now the museums closed and they're removing all of those artifacts from display. So that's happening everywhere.

a gigantic mound site there. It was a walled fortress right by the river, right under where the arch is and the football stadium is, where Big Mound was. Big Mound Saint Louis was absolutely gigantic, a massive mound. The first long Nose God was found. Artifact was found in Big Mound. When it was destroyed, they brought in Big Mound was destroyed in eighteen fifties to eighteen sixties. It took a couple years. They had to bring in a steam shovel. There are photographs of it, and they literally

obliterated everything in downtown Saint Louis. They just destroyed it right across the river East Saint Louis, same thing. East Saint Louis had a complex of roughly twenty to fifty mounds. It's believed to have been fifty altogether. I've put up an illustration of East Saint Louis, Illinois on Twitter, also that a couple of weeks ago, all of that obliterated gone. Almost all mound sites are gone. Somewhere between eighty to ninety percent of mound sites that were in the United

States are gone. They've been destroyed. Loads of them had stone exteriors, but they're gone. Some of the artifacts taken out of them are just as incredible, lacking a lot of the gold and silver, like gold and silver masks. I've never seen a gold mask or a silver mask that came out of a North American mound. I have seen a lot of turquoise that came out of North American mounds, but not gold and silver. But the main thing that's overlooked is that was the dominant culture that

was here in the fifteen forties, and it disappeared. It disappeared within twenty years gone. The population, which was probably twenty to thirty million in what we call the United States, went down ninety five to ninety eight percent within thirty years, and it was forgotten by the time the first settlers came in the year sixteen hundred, around sixteen hundred and started pushing west. By then, there had been almost two hundred years or one hundred and fifty years of growth.

Everything was overgrown, Everything looked natural. There was almost nobody left to explain it. And the myth of the mountain builders started because of that. But the population was absolutely decimated. I will add one more thing to this. The in the Yucatan it was solid buildings, solid cities. There was an island off Yucatan called Cerritos that was six hundred feet diameter, had a giant stone wall around it, and

then had a stone wall in the water. I have actually filmed that entire stone wall underwater, and that was chichen Itza's port. It's at Islus Sarritos, which is off the coast of Yucatan and from there. These huge canoes were going to Florida and to Louisiana and the Gulf of Alabama and Mexican Mexico. When I said the Gulf of Alabama, I mean the shores along the golf, not the Gulf of al I just changed the name again.

where the Adina were and so on. And they said that they rose against these leaders when their demands got preposterous, and they were mainly sexual demands, that's what's in it. And they rose and they killed them all off. There are a lot of mythological tales of Native Americans. One more thing about that. The Smithsonian did a seven year mound survey project during which they excavated three thousand mounds.

That was started in the eighteen fifties or the eighteen seventies actually, And during their mound survey project, digging into three thousand mounds, they dug up and recorded seventeen skeletons in very well made tombs, all of which were seven feet tall. Two seven feet eight inches tall was the largest win after And that's all in the Smithsonian publications.

Archaeologists found those since then, since they did it, roughly another ten skeletons were recovered by mainstream archaeologists in their literature of about ten skeletons found that were seven feet tall to eight feet tall. Loads of them. I don't even talk about these loads and loads of skeletons were like six foot four to six foot eight something like that.

But you know, everybody's interested in the seven footers. Statistically speaking, one of every seven one of every one hundred and seventy four thousand, I think it's seventy four thousand, six hundred people is seven feet tall. And I did a statistical analysis of the skeletons that were found by the Smithsonian published it in that book Path of Souls, and found that it is not it is statistically not possible

by chance alone for that. And archaeologists actually they jumped on that and said it's the best thing they'd seen in the alternative field, since I'm an alternative person to them, and they called it the Adena elite hypothesis, and that is that the Adena leadership, the elite of the population were abnormally large people, which in a book that Andrew Collins and I co authored called Denisovan Origins, we believe that they had some Denisovan They were Denisovan hybrids or

ancestors of Denisovans that had interbred with other people and wound up over here lost there.

his last shows, Art came back after a break. You know, they had these breaks, and all the breaks on those late night radio shows are for men's prostate problems. So they lasted about five minutes and Art Bell came back and he and he called me doctor Little. Then, well, doctor Little, I did this. I did exactly what you said with those crystals. During the break. I went into the bathroom. I filled the tub full of water, I

got a pair of gloves. I took two large crystals like you told me, and I turned out the lights and I put my hands in that bathtub and I did just what you told me to do. And do you know what happened? And I was kind of and I said it worked. He said, yes, it worked. He said I couldn't believe it. He said, I had no idea it would do that. And if you rub, if you you need to use gloves to do this. This

is just a hint. You gotta wear some gloves, uh, And you gotta rub the two crystals together really hard, and you and the rougher they are the better. And you do it underwater. Do it underwater the lights out and you get refraction off of it. And it's called the piezoelectric effect. They're little, you know, you get people would say, always the sparks. It's not sparks, they're little plasmas coming off of it. They're electrical plasmas. So anyway,

and this shaman used to do that. They'd put these crystal shaman would put pieces of crystals in leather pouches in a dark room, and you can grind those things, and as you grind them, you'll see little balls of light fly fly out of the leather pouch. So, for what it's worth, Nick's finding this hilarious.

two thousand. I bought this thing and it has a souper slow motion in it, and so we set it up and in a room, I took the two crystals and I rubbed them together like this in a room with the camera right there, and oh my god, it was incredible what it looks like. And you get all these forms coming out, and they look like people, and they look like birds, and they look like animals. But you can only see him in super in slow motion, but everybody can see the lights coming off of it.

It's just amazing. But the forms that they make. So you're going to do that experiment? Now, are you?

really causing issues with people. There's a group of us that are in the professions healthcare professions or in that area who believe that the sudden increase in autism, the increase in ADHD, the increase in anxiety, and all the whole bunch of mental disorders are coming from electromagnetic sensitivity, which is a real condition. It's a real medical condition

that we have. That there is so much electromagnetic energy around us now that is human made that it's causing trouble for people to get connected to whatever is over there, whatever you want to call spiritual and nature or just nature itself. I don't tell I tell people that the Native Americans believed everything is spiritual, that everything has a spiritual nature to it. Beyond that, I have no explanation to it. I do know that how I contact it,

I know how other people can contact it. And you use that, you know, you try to harmonize it and so on. Some of the shaman would use it almost like Ager Casey did, to make certain kinds of predictions, or to assist the people who were making decisions in the tribe, the chiefs and the elders and so on, or to do healing. They would do healing with it. I don't pretend to do any of that, but I do tell people how to connect. But the problem is

that we live in that. We literally live in electromagnetic sss. If you look at you or how many Wi Fi connections you're getting where you are where I am here, I'm in a suburb of Memphis, Tennessee. I got like fifteen different wifis I'm connecting to. There's wires all over the place where I'm at. It's just everywhere. Cell towers are everywhere. You will notice a difference when you go out into a place where you get no cell tower connection.

You get no connection at all, and there's no electricity. A good place like this is hoven Weep in Utah, hoven weep Ruins. Go there and get down in. You got to get down into the canyon there where there's no connection. To make sure you have your cell phone off, don't have anything electrical on you, and I'll guarantee you you'll feel a bit different. And just sit there. You seek place like that. Close your eyes. Don't meditate. Meditation is a mistake. Don't meditate when you go to these places.

You want to sit there and you either listen. Just listen, that's all you have to do. It's good to keep your eyes closed at first, but listen and try to geolocate things in your mind that you're listening to and that will pop you out of your consciousness. That's a very simple way of doing it, but it's incredibly effective.

Facebook is a cesspool of a different kind. But but go on, just go on Google and google my name. That's it. But whatever, if something interests you, that's fine. Most of my books you cannot buy. They're in used in psychology and criminal justice. And if you're a criminal, you probably might know my name. But if you're not, then yeah, there you out. So that's a little hint in there. So anyway, it's been a pleasure, but no, I got no website to promote nothing.