Superintendent Tyson Bennett of Sherman Independent School District in Texas resigned after controversial removal and reinstatement of a transgender student in a high school production of Oklahoma sparked national outrage. The school board accepted Bennett's transignation followed a I'm sorry, I can't start over again. I I just could not read. I was just like, wait, greading. It's fundamental, and obviously I completely forgot how to do it. Okay, but yeah, if we can see it one more time,
I would appreciate it. I forgot to bring crew back in, so sorry, I was talking and you could near me. All right, well that's cool. Okay, let me make this a little bit bigger so I can actually see what the fuck I'm saying. Okay, very good, all
right, you're ready. Yeah, let's go ahead, all right. In five or Superintendent Tyson Bennett of Sherman Independent School in Texas resigned after controversial removal and reinstatement of a transgender student in a high school production of Oklahoma sparked outrage nationally. The school board accepted Bennett's resignation following a closed session and appointed Thomas
O'Neill as interim superintendent. The controversy began in March when Max high Tower, a transgender student, was barred from playing a role that did not match his sex. Have signed. Ever, after significant backlash, the school reversed this decision, reinstating the original cast and script. Max's father, Philip Hie Tower, praised the board for advocating for all students, hoping it marks a shift towards inclusivity and standing against discrimination. The story is from NBC News by Joe
Jakaba on May two, twenty twenty four. So, Senny, I'm coming to you. I'm wondering, what impact do you think student the superintendent is Tyson Beckford's. I'm sorry, Tyson Bennett. Tyson Beckford is a hot model. Not to be construe with Tyson Bennett, but his resignation will have on Sherman's Independent school district and it's handling of issues related to trans understood. I don't know. I don't know this state enough to be able to have a
qualified opinion, but I would. Well, there's Texas, so I'll just keep that in mind. Yeah, yeah, it's it's I don't think it will have a huge impact, maybe specifically in the school for a few years.
But the political climate is so so hard on transfiople right now. I saw a video of Pete Boody Jedge recently and he was talking about how the far right equates being different as an adult subject, how the simple fact that those people exist is an adult subject, when when it's simply not, it's just people existing, and it's I don't see how it can get better. Uh when when when I see the situation right now, how polarized the the US is, because it feels like on one side, the purpose is just
to be mean to everyone. And I don't know how you can come back from that, from that, that kind of mentality of wanting to trigger other people just because you you like it and it just fits you. I just don't know how you can come back from that end. And so I don't think one guy being fired for that is going to change much. Uh. It's going to change a hell for the life of this teenager, that's for sure, in a good way. But other than that, I don't think
it will help much. You know, you said something very interesting when you talked about how basically it's become a polarized issue just to mention a people exist, and I and I think about how, especially on the right, you have such outcries about people who happen to be not white, not cis gender, not I mean that are that are cis gender, that are has weosexual, and how this is supposed to be the norm, but any person who happens to be outside of that particular uh group is considered Oh, well,
you're you're being you're being woke, right, just because you mentioned that these people exist and and it's and it's very and I don't know how we come back from that either. Kelly, what what are your thoughts from it's the only old white guy cis male on this panel. I have to say, I am qualified to say this panel is pretty goddamn woke. Okay, okay, okay, that's fine. I mean, like, listen, I don't necessarily have an issue with using the term woke. I've used it for a
long time before it became polarized. Uh. Woke just really just meant, you know, when I used to use it back in the day, that you know, you just need to be aware of the systems that are around
you and how they can affect you. If you happen to not be white or a man or both or anything of that particular effect, right and and like right now, I just see when we're having these particular discourses concerning like especially trans people, that you know, just like giving them a place to say, I exist, I am here, I am human, and I want to live my life and participate in life and community around me. That's
the polarizing issue, and it makes it makes no sense to me. But you know, but Kelly, since you mentioned wokeness, this article actually mentions the school board, you know, held a special meeting last week to discuss terminating Bennett, but then take any action. Yeah, they didn't. Yeah, so what factors might have influenced the boards decision to even accept his resignation?
That particularly the weekend, you know what, I was wondering why they didn't vote and to get rid of them, and that I found it really interesting. And then then it made me wonder what it was that talked him into resigning. And I have a feeling they probably made some kind of backroom deal. You just resign and you go walk away from this without the bad we had to fire you thing hanging over you for the rest of your career. And I'm pretty sure that that had something to do with it, But
I want to know. And this is not something again. You know, you start to read these stories, you want to know more, you start doing some research on them, and you can't get the answers to some of the questions. And I want to know, was Bennett responsible for getting this kid kicked off the play? Was it somebody at the school? Was it the principal? Who was it exactly? Because we don't actually know, and I think that person is you should be the one we're talking about here.
And if it was Bennett, that's fine, But I want to know that it was Bennett. And I can't see like somebody on the school supervisor, on the board of supervisors calling up the school to complain about one kid. That just doesn't I mean, it could have happened, but it doesn't seem probable to me at all. It seems to me that there was probably somebody
at the school or somebody affiliated with the school that made that decision. Well, well, let me ask you, do you think that Bennett was just like since you brought it up, do you think he was just like fall guy? He could he could well have been. I don't know that he was because he may well have made been made the decision, but there is a really good chance that, yeah, we have to do something, and maybe that's why they made that back room deal to let him walk away without
being fired. You know, we understand that it's not you who made this decision, but we have to take some kind of action and somebody has to go. And you were the where the bucks stops last at that school, and so it's got to you, you know, And I could I could see that happening. I don't know if he was actually the decision maker or if he was just a scapegoat. I could see it going either way.
And that's why it's been a really bad week for getting answers to questions that were that were recovering because I've been trying to do some deep dives and I just can't get some of the details I want. So, oh my goodness, you know what, I just want to sit to all news outlets. How dare you keep information away from Kelly for me being able to do deep dives? Yes, we need these things. This is why we pay Kelly the big bucks. But you know, but you mentioned something concerning like you
give me a raise? Yeah, I know, right, I'll talk to the powers to be about giving you a raise once I give me a raise, and everybody else on the panel. But you know, I think that one of the things that the article mentioned, because I talked about it earlier, is that there was a national outcry of why on how like egregious removing Max High Tower was from this production And and and basically I'm I'm thinking that since there was a natural outcry, there was a lot of pressure to do
something right. Yeah, And since like it was a natural outcry to do something, you know, sometimes that that just means that we pick a guy, and you're the visible guy, so you know, you gotta go or you know, or if you make your particular decision, then maybe it's not that bad. But you know, if I want to ask you, how do you think public pressure and media attention influenced the school eventually reversal of his decision. Well, I think that without public and external pressure nothing would have
changed at all. The truth is, in a small rural area like Sherman, Texas, I would say that, And I do think the principal is likely played a role in it beforehand. If not, he's an incompetent principle because you should know what's going on in the school. So presuming that he had a certain level of culpability there, I would say that he thought it was a diamond does a decision. I don't think he thought it was controversial, and I think in the local area is completely correct. I think that
they would not have cared. It's only because there was external pressure and because it got the publicity that it did that we have the results we have because once again, this is a very rural part of Texas, and so it's not hard for me to imagine them saying, you know what, we don't want any of that transgender stuff here, and so this is what happens. And I don't think this is as isolated as we'd like to think it is
in Texas. So with that in mind, attention are in the United States in general, So with that in mind, I think it was the attention that changed the situation. You know, I could think of years ago during
the Civil Rights movement. One of the tactics was to use media to show people at lunch counters getting beat up or you know, pulled away, or protesters getting dogs sit upon them or also flower horses on the right in order for them to for for all of these for the world basically to see that, hey, you know, the people who happened to be standing up for civil rights. This is not These are not isolated incidents, and it's not
just in people's minds. It's really happened, and it really wasn't until like you had like that world the world is watching you type thing happening until there was like some type of like movement on the federal level to really create and push legislation to change things. And you know, reading this particular story, that's that's kind of like how I see it. It's like using media, using people's voices, using these particular things to like show that you know,
this this kid is a kid. And the kid was only removed from this production because they're transient full stop. You know, had nothing to do with their ability to be able to act out of the part had nothing to do with them not being able to have the capability of doing anything that was called for him to do. You just removed him because he is not what you
want him to be. He does not fit this particular criteria. So I now, Cindy, you mentioned that you don't really think that this particular incident is going to be effective in really being a change agent per se. But let's say, for instance, you had the attention to be able to put in the catalysts for the change agent. What do you think could be the thing that could really help communities and school districts work together to create environments where
all students feel safe and supported. Well, I'm sorry, I'm going to repeat myself. Every single discrimination has a false information at its core, like trans people are crazy or whatever, where homosexually see the choice, uh Mexicans are are you know, lazy or other criminals, et cetera. And so the there are two ways to fight this. Either you pick one topic and try to defend the people who are discriminated against, and that's that's a valid
approach. But the other way is to attack the valid information at the core of the discrimination, and to do that you need education and critical thinking. You need both. So because when you when you listen to to the people, uh the right wing talking about how talking about gay people makes people gay,
like, how does that work? Exactly? Exactly exactly, how many gay people have been exposed to only straight movies and TV shows and books all their lives and steal their gay So how can you touch the other way? They have to touch us so the cooies can move from them to you. Yeah, yeah, well then I should be the gay they ever ran into the face of the earth. And if that's the case, yeah, it's the frogs maybe. Yeah. No, It's the only way we can solve
this problem is education and critical thinking. That there is no other way.
But you know, Cindy, okay, so, and and I guess this is like to the panel, like, please feel free to chime in because I'm about to spitball if you don't mind, Like, I agree with you that, you know, education and critical thinking is the way to be a pathway to reason right to the point where when we are having these conversations about people who happen to be different from the you know, well in America specifically the majority, that then we can be like, Okay, we're not going
to give credence to any of these particular false notions or rhetoric that happens to be talked about this particular group. But unfortunately, even if you happen to be the most learned person ever in life, and you are constantly putting out you know, information that compacts combats rather the propaganda that is actually you know, espoused about a certain people. For some reason, it just seems like
it just goes through one ear and right out the other. And you know how and I know for me, especially like you know, for a person like you know, as we all are here because we care about the truth, and we spend time making ourselves as educated as possible in order for us
to be as well informed as possible about the truth. Right. But you know, but for some reason, it seems like that we are still in this same you know circle of constantly you know, combating misinformation, you know, inductrination and all the alls when it comes to like, you know, having these particular conversations. So you know that, yeah, it can come from random people. In my country, we have our driving license as points. We have twelve points, and every time you speak too much of the
limit or any any other thing, you lose points. And when you reach zero you have to go back to follow some some specific courses. And one of them teaches you why it's wrong to act like this and and and this
is taught by people who teach people to drive. And so we need to do the same like when someone commits racially motivated crime, instead of just going to prison or paying a fine or something, they should go to a university or whatever and they should learn about not because not not why they what they did is wrong, but why what they believe is wrong and show them the facts with with books, with studies, with everything, and going to the
source of the information. Because if if you social media are too polarizing, uh when when when you see something you feel the need to answer quickly, and so you don't think as much and so you're not touched as much by what other people respond to. And so it needs to be from from the top, from from the government, from uh, someone with authority to say, okay, uh, yeah, no, Mexicans are not thieves. Look look, look at the statistics, look at and and then go through the
the arguments and explain why the arguments are false and wrong. And that's the only way to do it in my opinion. Infidel and Kelly, what do you say to that, Well, one thing that I have to say is is that right now we're so divided that I don't think there would ever be any agreement on what is the right way. And I think you probably lost half the United States when you said books, they seem to be one to go quite the opposite direction, unfortunately, and that goes back to wanting a
dumbed down population and not warning proper education for them. So while I was a little bit tongue in cheek, I do really believe that that's one of our problems is we are so polarized at this point that I don't think that we have any recognition of authority on either side to go, Okay, this
is what we do. Because if you had somebody who said, well, no, we shouldn't be teaching people that Mexicans are thieves, you would find thirty percent of the population out there who would be on your side by the fault. So then it's about committing to the other ones, and that that's why we're so split right now that I don't think that we can make that decision. But I hope that is something that we can do in the future,
because you are right in the fact. Until we're honest and we can call misinformation for what it is and actually have a conversation about it, we're really not going to change anything because we're going to do exactly what Cynthia said and that is is that we're going to talk. It's going to go in one ear and out the other, and that is one of the things that's trying. But I have to remember that there are people that do change their
mind, so you know what we're doing here. If somebody sees it and just causes them to reconsider one bad idea, that's a step because nothing changes overnight. But learning that one bad idea is something maybe I should get rid of can help not just the trans community and just the mere right to exist, but the whole realm of things. Because once you start deconstructing a real sick and twisted mindset and worldview, that religion tends to get and that's where
a lot of this comes from. Once you start deconstructing, it's like pulling a thread on that sweater. You never know where you're going to end up. Do you think that we can combat one by idea, Kelly, Yeah, I think we can. We have. I mean, that's that's history. It's not something that happens overnight. It's something that takes time. It takes people standing up. In fact. On that note, I wanted to I was thinking we would be remiss if we didn't that throughout this episode at
one point didn't give up. Kudos to Max Hihtower and his father Philip for standing up for what was right, and I really appreciate that they did that. But yeah, I think I think we can do that. I think we are doing that. One of the problems we have to fight now is one of the ways that we can educate people to accept others is to breed familiarity with those others. And that's when we get people in our society who
are being demon for things that they aren't. That's prohibiting that familiarity with them. And I really think that is a process that's thought that's been thought through. We're going to demonize these people because we don't want people to get to know them, we don't want people to accept them. So yeah, kudos to Max for you know, young high school kid stood up and made the world a better place. So thank you Max. He's in his corner in
Texas, right, Yeah, yeah, that little candle. Indeed. Indeed, Yeah, even though like I am, you know, a bit jaded, I would definitely have to say only because like you know, bitten into these particular circles where you are you know, doing the counter arguments, using
facts and data to actually bolster what you're saying. There still is I would have to say, and this is even about personal experience, about having conversations with people and actually presenting facts, and then that light comes on, like I did not know that, right. And I even think about, like the four of us that's even sitting on this panel right now, that you know, at one point in our lives we were on one end of the
spectrum and now we're on another end of the spectrum. And I would argue that it was good information that changed our minds from the bad information that we received in the past.