Welcome to the Nonprofits, the weekly show that addresses current events and news items from an atheist and secular humanist perspective. In our first segment this week, we'll be putting Texas's state motto friendship to the test. Texas State Senator Brian Hughes has introduced two controversial bills. Senate Bill sixteen would require proof of citizenship to register to vote, a move
critics say would disenfranchise low income and minority voters. Another bill, Senate Bill nine sixty four, proposes that Texas issue driver's licenses with a non citizen label for legal immigrants, potentially exposing them to harassment. Advocates argue this stigmatizes legal immigrants, reinforcing anti immigrant sentiment. The bill's future in the legislature remains uncertain. This story is from San Antonio Current by
Michael Carlis on March twenty six, twenty twenty five. All right, so starting off with the fun stuff right away, Jimmy, why don't you give us.
Your thoughts on it first?
The article claims that this proposer will quote disenfranchise low income and minority voters.
Exactly will this do that?
Yeah?
So thank you for asking my opinion, I appreciate that. So the typical argument toward having voter id is that a lot of people can't really afford to either travel or just pay for the idea itself, and that disproportionately affects people of low income areas or of a low income background, and of course that typically falls on people of color minorities, and so you never really see a Democrat or a democratic policy being hey, let's do let's
have more strict voter ideal laws. The argument is typically, well, Republicans want us to impose voter ideal laws so that you know, their wealthy kind of base or their wealthy euer base will be able to coast them into into victory. Right, So that's the typical way that this would disenfranchise people. But the second one actually would have an opposite effect, in my opinion, because they would be giving IDs to everybody.
So if everybody were given an idea and they were non citizen and it said non citizen on their ID, well then that would really that's a scary thing because that actually targets people who are not citizens, which is exacerbates the problem that we're seeing in this country now where immigrants are being blamed for a lot of this country's problems, and so that's that's kind of my initial take on why that is targeting or disenfranchising minority and poor communities and then again immigrants.
All right, yeah, Helen, I know that you had some to say on this too, Jimmy, So Jimmy tucking about how it's going to it seems at least target populations, specific populations in the United States. Do you think this is part of like a larger nationwide effort.
I'm well with just the you know what's going on now with people being arrested, you know, without you process, you know, being here on green or or you're an American citizen and you just have an to have the
right name. That seems this is a trend. This is a reflection of this because if you have an educated voting populace, guess what who Guess who's not going to make it into power Because the more educated you are, and the more and also if especially people that live in poor communities, people of color, they're going to be educated on the issues that matter to them and figure out which candidate is going to help them, you know,
get resource and get out of poverty. And help with jobs and things like that, like you're going to pay attention to those things if someone says, you, guess what, we don't really like that. So we're going to make it harder for you to vote. And that's they're going to push legislation to make sure that people aren't able to vote as easily as they could, you know, because it does affect you know, these people that may not be able to drive to a voting booth, you know,
or something like that. And I find it really silly because I got my voter ID in the mail. You can vote by mail. But I think that this is just a reflection of people of color and poor people, as Jimmy said, just being targeted.
Yeah, to me, it just seems like very frustrating.
It seems how can you get more anti American than that than taking the voice away from the people. I mean, that was really kind of one of the founding principles of the United States, at least from what I understand, is that the citizenry can contribute to the governance.
Right, the citizens can vote for who they want.
And if you are removing the vote from I mean, it's kind of a taxation without representation. Kind of situation if you're targeting specific groups for that disenfranchisement, for that removal from the whole election system. Jimmy, can you give us any background, I mean, are there any historical examples of similar type of identification requirements that might you know, that might give us a little bit of cause to worry here.
Well, in the United States, you know, there was a time where people had had to and forgive me, I'm no expert, but they had to prove that their grandfather voted in order for.
Them to vote.
That was a function of the Jim Crow South right, and so of course at that point many freed slaves or recently freed slaves, their grandfathers didn't vote because they were slaves, so then they be able to vote. Right. But the most popular example, of course, and this isn't necessarily a voter id law, but this is an identification law or an identification infringement upon someone's right rights. And that is the star of David that all Jewish people
in Europe were required to whar to identify them. You know, this helped identify who was the problem and then led to at least at first deportation, but of course later imprisonment. And that's the scary thing about a policy like this, because we're already seeing talks of deportation. We've already seen migrants be removed to incredibly harsh places. The prison at El Salvador. Recently, we saw an American citizen get moved there.
We saw a military aircraft, a cargo aircraft, carrying US immigrants within the US to Guantanamo Bay, which I would argue is the closest thing that the United States has at this point to a concentration camp. So you know, if you look at the road that the Jews had to follow in nineteen thirties Germany, and then you juxtapose that with what Latino immigrants are facing in the United States, everybody should be sounding the alarm in defense of these people.
And you know, I don't know what the next step is. You know, what we can't do is allow this to go too far. You know, we can't just wait and say, oh, well, that won't happen to us where the United States, No, it happens. It happens to us. It happened to Japanese Americans posts nineteen forty four, excuse me, nineteen forty three attack.
On Pearl Harbor, right, right, yeah, and that goes against another American tenet, right, you know, the great American melting pot where we take off, bring us.
Your you're tired, you're weak, and so forth.
And really what it's doing, it's just creating in us versus them situation.
I mean, what what better way.
To identify them other than you know, making them where or in this case have on their ideas a big label saying I'm one of them, I'm not one.
Of you, you know.
And it's to me, that's just fomenting just you know, disagreement and disparagement and getting us you know, butting heads with each other rather than trying to get us to work together to make life better for everyone. It really is just it's it's really to me, it's one of the vilest ways of trying to promote, you know, try to improve the lives of some people at the expense of others. I mean, it's really it's really savage and really very childish. I think, Helen, what are your thoughts on that?
Well, the way like, obviously this is disgusting, but also to like I'm going to kind of bring it back that we're we're facing this sort of thing that only certain types of people get to vote, only certain only certain types of people get to participate in the due process, only certain types of people, you know, actually get to have the American you know experience, you know, And it's sad and frustrating because, as Jimmy pointed out, we can't wait until you know, we're you know, up to our
neck and shit, you know, and we're just trying to pull ourselves out. Like really, what we're facing right now is the fact that this is this is going to be slow burn and before and then all of a sudden, people are going to sort of wake up and go, WHOA. I didn't realize I was living in Germany in the nineteen thirties and forties, and it's like, but now you
are because it's a slow burn. Because that and that's the whole thing about like, well it's not happening to me, so it's not really happening.
Right, Yeah, And if I may, I want to just kind of combine some of the points that each of you just made, so in quoting the Statue of Liberty, Scott, you know, we ask for the huddled masses, right, the huddled masses, We open our borders to them and then helen to your point, only certain types of people get
to experience the American dream. Well, we are at a point where we are fighting against the definition of what it is to be an American, and there are people that think that they have a better idea of what it means to be an American. But really that causes us to decide that the principles that we are founded on are no longer good. And that's what this fight is about. You know, who's really an American versus who's not?
And institutionalizing it is what's happening with these these proposals in Texas.
Yeah, I mean it literally is doing that.
It's literally separate, you know, separating people on the ground right there. I just wanted to throw out some stats
that I found online here. According to a twenty sixteen study published on Census dot gov, so this is on a government website, the median income of households in the US is strongly correlated to racial and ethnic identification, with Asian Americans at about seventy seven thousand per year for per household, that's the medium median income, White Americans at about sixty three thousand, Hispanic Americans at forty five thousand, and black Americans have a median income of thirty seven
thousand dollars a year per household. And so I have this question. We'll start with Helen. How does that translate it into disparity in access to citizenship? You mentioned you got your ID in the in the mail you got you know you can vote via mail. So how does that How does an income disparity contribute to that systematic disenfranchise of certain groups.
So because I would have to because I live in I love Florida, and I happen to live in a mostly white, rich county and very red, so that gives me an advantage because I'm in an upper income bracket. I have access this, I have a car, I have
access to have that mobility within my community. Now for people that live in other parts of the community where you're forced to show your ID before you can vote, I can just set it a piece of paper and as long as I you know, they have my driver's license on file, they can just match it and go okay. So I can we can mail or mail and voting thing people that one may not have access to the internet, one to may if you are required to show your ID in person, the show that you're able to vote,
and they're like, no, you're not the correct person. They can just kick you out. And that's another problem with it two because you may not have the ability to mail in. You may not and also you may and also at the same time, this will be a double ast sword can't drive and go to a voting booth and you know, show that you're able to vote, and on the other end, you may not have access to the internet so you can request a mail in voting. See.
So that's these are real problems that people fase and that's why you see people that are on the lower income, lower income and as people of color have a harder time voting.
Right, Yeah, And I would I would add on to that.
I would say that you know, if you're in a lower income family, chances are you can't as easily take a day off to go and vote, or take a day off to go sit at the you know, at the government office for half the day trying to get your document, you know, waiting in line, et cetera, et cetera.
And so I mean it's being having a having a higher income, certainly being above the poverty line does give you a lot of flexibility that you know that a lot of lower income families just don't have their living paycheck to paycheck. They can't afford to take a day off, They can't even afford to take a sick day in many cases. And so I don't know, it just seems
really really lopsided to me. And so Jimmy, I wanted to kind of take that same thought process there, that same concept, but put it in a little bit more of a historical context here. And so this is quoted from This is a Wikipedia article I'm quoting on poll tax and so I want to encourage listeners to don't just take my word on it, don't just take Wikipedia's word on it. Wikipedia has tons of links in there, so please check this out on your own to back up what I'm saying.
But this is a quote on the idea of a poll tax.
After the right to vote was extended to all races by the fifteenth Amendment to the Constitution, many Southern states enacted poll taxes as a mean to as a means of excluding African American voters, most of whom were poor and unable to pay a tax, so as not to disenfranchise many white voters. Such laws sometimes included a clause exit, emptying any people who had voted prior to enactment of
such laws. Kind of like what you were saying. A little bit there, Helen, You're already in the system, right, That makes it a little bit easier.
Let's see where did I leave off here?
Oh, the poll tax, along with literacy tests and extra legal intimidation such as by the kuklus Klan, achieve the desired effect of disenfranchising African Americans. The Wikipedia article goes on to note that the twenty fourth Amendment, ratified in nineteen sixty four, prohibits both Congress and states from conditioning the right to vote in federal elections on payment of a poll tax. Poll tax is illegal in the United States. So, Jimmy,
what I want to ask you. Does this requirement of specific documentation constitute a poll tax, either literally or indirectly? And if so, wouldn't this proposal violate the twenty fourth Amendment?
Well, I would, I would say so, But I don't know the specifics of the law. So let's say that for this proposal that tex wants to make sure that all citizens non citizens have an identification, have identification that that shows they are non citizens. Well, if Texas is issuing that license, I would say that it's not it's not going to violate that amendment. But if it's forcing them to get that identification, I would I would equate that to a poll tax because that identification.
Would be required for voting.
So if they want to require identification for voting, but they want to provide provide that identification, that I think that that that is the only way that this is fair. But making people purchase something where it's going to disproportionately affect those that are in poverty and in poor communities, and for all of the reasons that we've already discussed in which you two have so eloquently mentioned. Yeah, that
would that would do that, that would serve the same purpose. Now, this is also more dangerous than just a poll tax, because this is a physical identification, right, This is this is a way of discriminating and othering visibly physically.
Right.
This is not left up to the imagination. Well, could somebody be illegal? Could not somebody? No, you can inquire about it and there work and they could theoretically, you know, I hear, And again I'm not a legal expert, but you don't necessarily have to show identification if a police officer asks you. I hear in other places that you do. In any case, most people are going to do it right.
And if you're asked for your identification and you're giving them over proof that you're a non citizen, you're basically in their minds and probably in reality. If we think about the way things are going now in this country, asking to get deported, right, and that's what that's the way that we need.
To look at this.
Okay, not this isn't just some formality to make things more efficient. This is a way of getting around legal safeguards to protect people. And that's how we need to treat this exactly. That that's an excellent point. It's more than just voting here. It's almost an invitation for violence. Really, it's almost an invitation for you for these people to be harassed and discriminated against.
And it's I don't know, it's just really frustrated to me. Again, I'm going to be using this word a lot, I think these days, but it's just so an American. I mean, it's so it's so ridiculous. I do I have one last point, Helen, that I wanted to bring up, And so I wanted to bring this up because I think
it's kind of funny. I found an article from Texas Public Radio from twenty twenty four and they said, data compiled by the conservative Heritage Foundation, who's most known recently for being the architect of Project twenty twenty five right, their data shows that non citizen voting in Texas is not a widespread problem, and instead shows other instances of voter fraud committed by US citizens are far more prevalent.
In its database, the Heritage Foundation has included three non citizens casting ballots in Texas since twenty twelve, three times since twenty twelve. The Foundation's data also suggests that a more pressing issue is Felon's casting ballots or being elected, but you know that's a side issue. It's analysis sites at least four times in as many instances of that type of fraud than when compared to noned citizen voting.
So my question for you, Helen, how.
Does this data support the charge that Texas is proposing discriminatory legislation. We're we're all claiming that this is discriminatory. Does this data back us up?
Well, the proof is in the putting. That's that's all I gotta say.
Like, that's all I gotta say.
That it does itself, doesn't it.
Yeah, yeah, Jimmy, Do you have any thoughts on that as well?
Well? I not necessarily. I mean, I want to close out this segment by just kind of giving my opinion about why this is so important, and so if you don't mind, I just have to please do please short sentences. And and you know, what we have seen so far is the blaming of immigrants for our problems. Then we're starting to see the rounding up and deportation and imprisonment
of immigrants for our problems. So if we compare to nineteen thirties Germany, for example, the only thing that we haven't seen yet is the systematic imprisonment and killing of people for being immigrants. And I hope it stays that way.
But if anybody out there is seeing this episode right now and you're hearing us talk about this, I would say that it is time to start considering if you have not already the reality of our country moving in the direction of nineteen thirties Germany, and you need to decide right now, will you conform or will you not conform if we go that way, because I will never conform, and I'm going to stand up for everybody's right to be treated fairly and to be treated like an American
under the Constitution, under the laws that we are all guaranteed citizen or not. So that's kind of what I wanted to say there. Thank you for letting me get that off my chest.
That is an excellent place for us to wrap this up. And so if any of you out there get off your butts and do something, don't wait until it's too late.