Welcome to the nonprofits. For today, we cover two stories where pastors claim that voting for the wrong person can be hazardous to your health. In a bizarre twist, a pastor Robert Henderson claims he healed a man who had been hospitalized for voting Democrat, suggesting that spiritual ailments were merely a side effect of poor political choices. Repent and you'll be cured, he proclaimed, as the switching parties could
remedy everything from the sniffles to serious health issues. The second pastor proclaims of fulfilling their divine assignment will protect them from death. These spectacles of faith us a partisan politics showcase how some religious leaders are reinterpreting a political affiliation as a matter of spiritual life and death, prompting laughter and concern and equal measures. After all, who knew
a vote could be so hazardous to your health. These articles are from The Friendly Atheist by Him and Meta on September twenty six, twenty twenty four, and Slave Magazine by Molly Olmsted on September twenty fifth, twenty twenty four. I have to admit, when I first read this little bit of trouble, even taking as serious but Jonathan, I was curious, what do you think is this a story about this dying democrat? Is this just some made up
story to excite and work up a crowd. Well, what do you think it seemed.
To be eating. So yeah, they're eating it up because that kind of anecdotal evidence is something they eat up to justify their positions on a lot of things. But one of the things that makes me kind of interesting is that, you know, the preacher prayed for him, right and five minutes later a congress a congregationalist who was aware of that was somehow related to the to the gentleman involved, got a phone call saying he just came out of his fever broke, he's fine. You know. That
was about five minutes after that. And I'm sitting here thinking to myself, I've been in a lot of hospitals, but that word when somebody's feaver breaks or something like that, will go to the doctor right away and then go no place for ten or fifteen minutes, sometimes an hour, and then it will finally get out like family and friends and things, you know, because they've got a lot going on, you know, especially in ICU, you know, so it's like I was supposed to get released, and it
took at least three hours to just get my release papers up there and then you know, and that was like hours after I actually responded to the medication I was on. So it was like, yeah, I don't think that his prayer happened when, you know, before his fever broke. I think it happened somewhat after the fact. So it's like, doesn't make sense to me, But it does make sense to me that the preacher Henderson stoked the correlation with
the timing of the prayer, because why wouldn't he. You know, he's trying to get his congregationalists to believe every word he says, and so naturally he cured the guy. Right, I don't think so.
But you know, hey, I have to say you're you're a lot nicer than I am, because I question whether any of the story ever occurred at all. And this is not a complete fabrication to work up a crowd. But as you said, nothing happens fast in the hospital, So if the word just came down that the patient's fever had broken, it seems like odd terminology. The way he talks about this fever all around, very not medical.
For the lack of a better way to put it, I just think that it just sounds like a good story, a good fish story. Now, Eli, I know that the leaders of this gnar, this New Apostolic Reformation, they've become influential political figures within evangelical Christianity. I know that they use symbols like the appeal to Heaven flag. I know that that's the same flag also that we've covered here on the nonprofits of Samuel Alito's wife actually flying and
getting into some hot water. Do you think there's a trade off between what we're seeing with these evangelical religious leaders and political figures like this, Oh?
Absolutely, because political leaders of a particular persuasion have learned that they can get free campaign support, just like from church leaders, just by like presenting the right image. You know, if they say the right things, they take the right pictures, these churches will fill the ballots on your behalf for free. And that's what's happening. And I think the idea here is kind of disgusting because I'm on the same page
as you. I don't think that story ever happened. And the reason I feel pretty comfort about that, like I didn't work in a hospital. But I've worked in the medical field and I did some clinicals, and I don't remember like a lot of phone calling taking place when developments happen. Like the people that are there need to know. And then if somebody like the next of kin comes in and as they are in the room, they're like, hey,
what's going on with treatment? But for the most part, like if it's an adult with a fever, that adult is capable of making their own medical decisions and you're not going to call anybody to tell them that the fever broke because that just doesn't make any sense. And yeah, the same I agree with you, John that like once something does happen, it some time is going to go by before like any you know, any reaction, Yeah, any reaction, any that's less work.
On their shoulders at the moment. So exactly, yeahs to worry about, Yes.
One last thing I have to worry about right now. Exactly. So I think that the because this is this, Henderson isn't the only pastor to do something like this fabricated story and be like, well, it's because of this particular reason,
but it was God that made it better. Just to like kind of influence the opinions and the like the non religious beliefs of their their congregations, their congregants, and he knows that not everybody is going to believe it, but some of them are going to and and the ones that don't aren't going to speak up because they they're they're going to face like alienation from the church. People are going to like accuse him of not supporting the pastor, and they're going to be like kind of ostracized.
So they're just kind of psychologically torturing gullible people into shaping the world the way that they, the individual pastors want it, and I think it's kind of use.
It's also dangerous in the long term because no two of these pastors have the same vision of what they want the world to be, and so eventually the religious wars happen all the time because you got two people in power who don't want to share power, and so they have to fight each other and you have really nasty things as a result.
I agree with what you said, Eli, as far as the way information goes from a situation like this, the way the discussion happened, it almost sounded like they had a red line directly into the doctor's bluetooth on his head, and so the doctor could give them a play by play while he's addressing the situation and the health concerns of this patient they're talking about. And that's just not how things work.
Now.
One thing I wanted to question you about, is this the newest Republican healthcare? I know that the Book of Mark was the latter half of the last chapter was written much later than the rest of the book. So I took it on myself to do a little rewrite and figured that whoever believes in vosts GOP will be saved, but whoever for lots of Democrats shall be condemned forever. That's kind of what it sounds like to me, a
heavenly hmo. So what did you think about the idea about when he's talking about all this evilness coming through voting for Democrats? Are we seeing pandemics out there of people who've voted in the past, or people other than Republicans getting sick? Is that something?
Think you didn't hear that eighty two million people who voted for Biden all got sick at once. You didn't see that it was headline news man, Well at least it was in the religious newsletters. But maybe I'm just kidding. But you know, the idea is also that these things are made up all the time. I mean, lying has become the new way to get everybody to get excited,
you know. And I'm sitting there going, you know, there's literally the country is the strongest economically, and otherwise it's ever and wages are up all that, and they still claim that it's going to to the dogs, right, And they claim that because if things are going better under their demonic because they'd like to demonize us. But not only that, but not just Democrats, but anybody who's not a Republican is considered working with literally working with the devil.
And that's how they present this. They have a black and white theology, and that black and white is very important to them to maintain, and so they, you know, they want to make sure that they're on the right side of things, you know, that they're on God's side.
And you know, one of the old sayings I heard is, and this is a little different than most people are, is that the devil's greatest deception was making sure that everybody thought he was God in the Bible, and that the devil was the real God, so he made everybody believe the flip side of things, And if you look at it, it kind of looks that way, doesn't it.
So you know, but it's just like, we're all demons, we're not human, so it's okay to hurt us, kill us, do whatever they need to get rid of us, getting ready for their big rapture.
I definitely think you're onto something there with the fact that we're all demons and we're not good people and we're not even human. I think that that dehumanizing factor of what they teach really is the most dangerous thing they do, because, as you said, it allows people to kill and do terrible things that they would never consider themselves doing to another human. You mentioned satanic Hank Kooneman.
He's the one that put on that Second Spectacle where the pastor made the really out there claims, but you know he made He's he's been on record saying that Taylor Swift was satanic and that she did satanic acts in her and her performances. And he's also we did the show about a three million dollar land scam he did one time. But you know, as you said, switching over to you though, Eli I noticed that him in this article made the comment that they cast a spell
to heal the guy. Well, what did you think of that that terminology when they're talking about you know, magic and satanic and all these things and then lumping them in with casting a spell.
Yeah, I was just kind of thinking about it when you know, John was talking about how like we're all demonic, and I'm like, you guys are the ones that believe in demons, Like you guys believe in all this crazy stuff that you think is so dark and like horrible and twisted. Were just like, don't do that. And I think it's really fitting that he called it casting a spell, because I we call it magic all the time, right, whatever their preferred brand of magic is, And it's just
sort of I think it's really fitting. It's just just specifically based on, you know, the way John was kind of describing it there a little bit ago. I just it as I'm looking at It's just one of those stories where you hear it from the outsign and you're like,
how do people think this really happen? And you realize that it has a lot to do with that sort of when you get into an environment where everybody is, you know, saying the same thing, and everybody is having a super good time about it, and they're all excited and there's you know, camaraderie and togetherness and community, and you start to have like these endorphins and good feelings and you associate it's that's a spell in itself, you know, if if we're talking about it really like, it has
this effect on you that is going to make you think that there's something way more substantial to what is
going on than there really is. And it's that it's so dangerous in this way that it leads people to believe things like this and then to believe that like the way that you vote like that, that US politics specifically is of such a concern to the master and creator of the entire universe that the way that you vote has you know, uh, determination, determining power and where your eternal soul goes forever and the.
Higher consequences dire exactly.
And the idea that they're they're using this and I said it earlier, it's psychological torture to convince these people that they have to think and behave and believe a certain way or else. And it's the most significant. It is the ultimate or else.
I also I'm curious about the you know, cast a spell thing. If these ministers and preachers are casting spells, can't they be accused of witchcraft and burned at the stake.
Well, of course they wouldn't consider casting spells, and they would just look at that as you trying to equate their godly manners with your filthy, sinful, demonic ways and equating the two, which makes you even more demonic, because my way is the right way, your ways a demonic way. And you're okay though until you do something I don't like, and then your ways demonic too.
Because that goes back to which to live.
Well, absolutely, but they don't consider it. They wouldn't consider it a spell. That's the whole thing. But ye, look, I'm with you, because you know. One thing that concerns me though, seriously, John, is the fact that you know, you talked about how this dehumanizes people, and one in particular on that second wall knows he made the comment that the predatory left is going to make children suicidal, suicidal by evangelizing them into thinking they're the wrong gender.
Telling the crowd, and I quote this, you're authorized to take the Philistines out of position. Now knowing who the Philistines were, a traditional enemy of God's people and the Old Testament, do you think he's promoting violence there? Is that what he's doing?
Yep, definitely, he wants to He wants the army of God to defeat the minions of Satan. You know, it's it's an old evangelical trick to try and keep people under control and to direct them to commit violence against people that are directly threatening their religion or their control over the people. And that's just a bite model, you know, kind of it's kind of screwed up.
Very dangerous, you know. And I know that here in the ACA and other nonprofits, it's important that we steer away from certain topics, especially on election years in particular. But I find it absolutely appalling that these people can talk about voting democrat. Henderson made the comment that it's a spirit of death and all these different things that they talk about, or they talk about how important it is to literally vote a certain way or you're going
to burn forever. And you know, going back to you Eli, you had mentioned that, you know there are people who are going to remain silent because they fear that if they don't remain silent, you know, they'll be opstracized and they'll be othered as well. And that's one of the things that I think that this group counts on is the fact that you know, if you don't agree with it, well, just shut the hell up and smile anyway, because that's
what we're that's what we're going with. And the thing is is that I feel that when people hear that, it's a dangerous of a danger of desensitizing them to the behaviors that this can lead to. What do you think about that?
Yeah, And I wanted to add too, because I said earlier they'd be accused of, you know, not supporting the church or the pastor, but not only that, it would go it would go beyond that to be like, oh, no, you're doubting God. You're doubting that God is capable of doing that. So it what will happen is they're gonna they'll go to church and they'll you know, hear these things they don't agree with, but they'll keep their mouths shut and they'll interact with these people outside of those
moments where they're hearing those things. Well, these are good people, so maybe it's not that bad of a thing that they have these bad ideas, not realizing that even though they may be friendly people to people that they consider part of their in group or specifically their church, they're going to go out and make other decisions to other people, to strangers, and they're going to vote based on the things that they believe, and that doesn't the fact that
they're kind doesn't ultimately make them good people. There's more to being a good person than just being kind to a person's face that you're familiar with. So, yeah, I think to say it desensitizes is a really apt way to put it, because they're just not gonna they're going to assume like, well, you know, my church isn't the problem, it's the other churches.
I think you're right with the fact that what this does is it allows them to judge people on other levels, as you mentioned, away from church and and seeing and interacting and getting that you know, they're all right, they're good people, and so giving a buy and a pass to absolutely abhorrent behavior because well, you know, they smile, they yes, they greet me, they do all these things right and nice. Well, the problem is step out of line and see what happens, and that fear because they've
an what happens when you step out of line. That's the reminder of whether they're good people or not? Are you good people? Until you and I have a disagreement and then you know, I dump you and head out, or do I go ahead and say all right, let's talk this out and see where we are from here and then having a conversation like adults rather than you know, you're of the devil because and that's what it is.
It's so completely outhering because that's all it does. And John, before I wrap this up, is there anything else you wanted to add to this?
No, you know, this kind of speech and bigotry and that when they other other people they're they're doing that to everybody that they had a bigoted attitude towards beginning been with, and this religion just gives them cover to be who they really are, and no matter how despicable that is. You know, back, you know, not too long ago, you wouldn't hear any of this in public. It'll be
the stuff that wasn't said out loud. But now it's been legitimized and normalized to put people down directly, entire groups of people, which is just a generalization error.
Yeah, we've seen a lot of that, and I think a lot of that starts with leadership who goes and detigrates people for their own gain or just for fun, or just for political points. And then we see that, and we see those sound bites that we hear time and time again, and I do think it becomes desensitized so that some of the words that we wouldn't allow, not on mean you or us in particular, but that you wouldn't allow out of your mouth has become normalized
and become things that it's okay to say now. And that is a very dangerous route because what it does, as we said earlier, is literally dehumanizes people and tells people to get in line or else. And having been a person who is raised in a get in line or you're going to hell, I know what that's like. And I can't help but think that people can do better, even if you want to keep your guide. While I might disagree with you and your God, people can do
better than that. I hope that ultimately people see these people for what they are. I appreciate both of you for this conversation thought. I thought we enlightened, found some good things to talk about, and I look forward to having another conversation, well except maybe without Jonathan, but