Conservative Christians Confront LGBTQ Realities

Junior's care for her challenge their belief. Over time, exposure to LGBTQ plus voices and progressive Christian scholars like David Gushy reshaped their view, leading to a deeper understanding of both love and scripture. This story invites critical reflection. How does a faith community stance on LGBTQ plus issues shape family relationship, Can personal experiences lead to reinterpretation of deeply held beliefs, and what role should love and empathy play

in navigating tensions between faith and identity. The story is from CNN by John Blake on November third, twenty four. So, Eli, my first question is coming to you. How did the McDonald's initial reaction to their sons coming out reflect broader tensions within conservative Christian communities regarding LGBTQ accepted well.

fix you. And he, you know, when it got out into the community that he, you know, he was gay, his parents were hearing the same thing from other people. His dad said that one of his like work relationships didn't work out because of because of his son being gay, and someone said, you need to get a handle your son. So, as the article talked about, that's a thing that a lot of you know LGBTQ plus people from conservative Christian families and homes and towns go through, you know, a

really really similar story or experience. What I applaud the McDonald's for is that they did eventually take a step back and say, hey, like, you know, maybe I have something wrong, maybe my beliefs aren't quite you know, as as as as right as I thought, And they started to re examine that. I don't think they quite landed, you know, as close to rights as we would all hope, but I applaud them for that at least.

In hindsight, what are the psychological and emotional costs of practices like conversion therapy for both the individual and the family if you can, if you can really just recall how that could be a notion that could be very I would say, detrimental to all who happened to be.

and it's a very emotional event. I think for people to be in this position to be fixed, it just highlights that there is something wrong with them, that there's something wrong with their life. You know, there's something wrong with who they are. And so I think that a person in that position would suffer. But you know, and not that I'm sympathetic to the parents, but I think they suffer as well, because then they never get to

the goal that they are set out to. Well, that that they've embarked on, right, they they're never going to arrive at a fixing. It's always going to be a farce if they even do arrive there. But I think the harm is captured in how this article highlights the father's views of his son, saying you can be an axe murderer and we would still love you. I mean, are we comparing homosexuality to axe murderer? Is that what we're is that what we're looking at? I mean, is

it really that bad as being that? Being gay is not bad?

would still love you. And I and I think that the issue that they had with how they were viewing what it means to be gay and in context, because I think that you mentioned like needing more contest, especially from the father when it came to how you know one is viewing another person, even if they come from them on you know, should I say okay, well yeah,

what what you what you have chose? I and I use that, you know, very hyperbiologist of course to do with your life as far as like you know, how you chose to live your life, you know during your sexual orientation is a problem. But at the same time, you know, having them, as you said, being compared with something that is objectively worse and saying that Okay, this is something that I but I will still love you anyway,

I would definitely think is an issue. But you know, but at least we had like some type of redemption, redemption per se, and I and I would like for both of you guys to talk about that, because there was an eventually eventual shift in the attitudes towards sarragay son and I know that, like and I and I did like mention it a little bit, like you know, when we were first talking about, like you know, in an introduction, like you know, they did happen to get

I guess more information. They were exposed to David Gushy and some of you know, his rhetoric about being and again I don't know if that's like a better term, but about really just being more tolerant and actually saying that, hey,

this is not necessarily a bad thing. Right, So, if if you guys want to kind of like just like jump in and just like really just talk about like some of these other external influences that really helped to shape the changing of how like the McDonald's really viewed their son and their son's sexuality, and how, in my opinion, I think made it a little bit better for both of them to actually have like a better relationship between them and their son, Eli, I would like for you

to start upon that, and then Jimmy, I would like for you to do a follow up.

he's gay now. And it really illustrated this sort of absurd mindset they had towards homosexuality, you know, around the time and before and even slightly after they found out

that their son was gay. And it does they do shift later on because of these you know, outside influences you mentioned, They do shift to this somewhat better attitude, But it still doesn't quite land as like a feel good story to me, because it's still looking at it as sort of like you can love God even if your kids are gay, rather than like, hey, being gay is just regular, like just like not being gay, Like it's it's not they're not shifting their attitude attitude to

it doesn't matter. They're shifting it to well, we can love you anyway, and that's okay with God. And it doesn't wow exactly like, you know, even though you're worse of a person than all the rest of us, you know, it's it still does. It still hits that way for me.

a society, a family that doctrinally rejects him. And so I wrote a note here which I have to highlight because it's kind of hilarious because I have a typo and I have no idea what I was trying to say. So I said, so many people treat these struggles as their own when they are the ones serial the actual struggle. So, you know, I don't know how the word cereal got

in there. But I know what I was trying to say, and that is, don't pretend that your son is not the one that's struggling, and try and cry poor me the reason. And even though there is a shift at the end where they do kind of come around to not ostracize him or reject him outright, I'll say that I'll take it in a sense, but really what this does for me is highlight the overarching problem that we're

li in plays for society. Right, So doctrinally, like I said, you've got this group of people that just is brought up and spews and allows hate to just continue to exist by being a catalyst for it until it happens to them, and then they have to go, oh crap. And I made a note about again about the Salem

witch trials. Everybody was burning everybody, right, especially the women, mostly the women, until the judge and a couple of other high ranking people in the sale of witch trials kids were accused, and then it was oh, this isn't this isn't real anymore. We can't allow spectral evidence in court, and so people have to change when they are confronted with kind of their own bs, and so in the end,

I think I'll take it. It's like it's like the March towards spirituality where people say, well, I'm not religious anymore, I'm just spiritual. Okay, I guess I'll take it because at least you're not adhering to a really hateful religion and it's a progression away from it. But another thing I want to highlight real quick is that this highlights

the abuses of women by churches as well. So you know, somebody that they had gone to for help had explained that having a domineering mother can have this impact on men to be I guess homosexuals, it always comes down to the women, doesn't it. They always find a way to blame women. So yeah, there's just a lot of problems with religion, problems that or stories like this highlight them, even if it looks like there's a happy ending.

If they don't necessarily like settle into the societal norm like being cis gender heterosexual, then it's a problem, right And I know that the Church along with their rhetoric, even though like that, we have very little passages in the Bible that talks really about like, you know, sexual orientation.

And if you actually talk to some of the most pre eminent scholars in the Bible when we're thinking about some of the scriptures that may seem that they're talking against homosexuality, we find that the context is very different than what we actually think when actually it's being interpreted

as correct. So I feel really for you know, the sun And even though that I applaud the efforts a bit from the parents when it comes to them being able to kind of leap frog over them your own indoctrination when it comes to how you know, gay people are talked about, As you said, Jimmy, that problem is still there. Do you all feel and I would love

for you guys to chime in about this. Do you feel that the church holds some responsibility on how we actually are looking at you know, gay people, people who happen to be in the queer community, queer community on hold, because remember and especially like nowadays and and as of recent events, we know that you know, queer people, especially trans people are very much so under attack. And it's not just like you know from you know this one person who says they don't like you. This the person

doesn't say it is like you. I mean like it's actually becoming policy now right, And and we know that a lot of these particular sensibilities have come from faith based institutions. So what does the church actually what what what what does the church's role play into actually helping to maybe reformulate some of the rhetoric that is out

and about on a societal whole. And is there any and and do we have even seeing them possibly because we did have a David Gucci, I guess, but do we do we see this as a possibility of a change agent in the church in general to be able to say, maybe the way that we are talking about the peer community is unjust and we need to change it. Eli, I would like for you to start, and then Jimmy Light for you.

being affirming them. And sort of because I was saying sort of the way that I was saying, this ministry that McDonald's have started didn't do. This ministry they've started is more on along the lines of accepting and just tolerating as sort of like a passive tolerance rather than

an affirming acceptance and love. I think it is equally likely that the now that if they start to see the ability to if they start to feel emboldened going into the future, these religious groups, I mean, there's a chance that they might start to be more restrictive of LGBTQ plus people again and be less accepting and less affirming because they feel like they can get away with it more now and they don't have to appease to whatever. You know, the parties that they might not want to

appease to anymore now they don't have to. I think it's just as likely that it could go either way. I'm not really sure which one I expect.

of societies. They're in control of society's wealth because they collect it from people, because they make them feel guilty and fearful their entire lives, and those people then turn

and pay them to fix it. Okay. The Church feels that the LGBTQ community at least at least going back to where we have a more traditional idea of Christianity, and the church feels that the LGBTQ outlook is a challenge to this power structure, because then it negates what's in the Bible, and then it causes people to tear down the argument that the church makes for its legitimacy. The church cannot coexist with the LGBTQ community and still

maintain its credibility, maintain its accuracy. However, what we see nowadays is that churches more and more are making exceptions for LGBTQ people because the court of public opinion is saying that LGBTQ people should not be mistreated and should

not be othered. And the church church in general, I mean multiple factions of Christianity are losing money, losing participation, losing their congregation, and they are making changes in order to maintain their power, and that is all that's happening. They are absolutely the blame for perpetuating this lie about LGBTQ people and not fixing their own internal problems where homosexuality forced homosexuality is currently at play now. I don't

think there's anything wrong with homosexuality. I do think there is something wrong with an adult forcing it on a minor, which we know happens by the tens of thousands every year across the world, probably a higher number than that. Yesterday, the Archbishop of Canterbury in the Anglican Church resigned because it came to light that they had been covering up child abuse for decades, decades, and he says he's stepping down because it was grossly mismandaged. No, you're stepping down

because you got caught. That's why you're stepping down. And so the church has a responsibility to clean up its own act and stop pointing the finger at other people who are not doing anything wrong except challenging their incredibly extremist and archaic views. That's my view on that.

in South Africa. That's right, Yeah, and he's been doing it since nineteen eighty four, So we'll talk about that.