Should Mamdani's win in NYC be a wake-up call for Labour?

This is a Global Player original podcast. Thank you. New York will remain a city of immigrants. A city built by immigrants, powered by immigrants, and as of tonight. Led by an immigrant. That is Zoram Mamdani, the 34-year-old self-described socialist, Muslim who has become the mayor of New York City. He is a charismatic communicator. He has captivated New Yorkers. Does British politics have something to learn from that dynamism?

There were several Democrat successes last night, but we're focusing on Mam Dani in this episode because he is, in essence, the poster boy. The poster boy for a new look politics, a different kind of politics. A braver, slightly edgier politics. Is that what progressives need to learn if they want to regain the trust of a sceptical public? Welcome to the news agents. The news agents. It's John. It's Emily. And I guess the first thing we have to say about Mam Dani is.

he was incredibly lucky in the race he fought. A Republican candidate who barely got seven percent, whose name recognition was pretty small, even amongst Americans. and a disgraced former democratic governor Andrew Cuomo, who had already lost the party support over sexual harassment allegations some years ago. So in a way, Mamdani had the feel to himself. Nevertheless, I think his victory was quite astonishing.

In terms of the turnout, more than two million voters, and in terms of the way he managed the messaging, he was not. Scared of the voter. He was not scared of his own policies. He knew what he wanted to say and he delivered that message to them. We've seen a politics uh dare I say since you know Rishi Sunak took over in Britain.

Where frankly there hasn't been an ounce of charisma to go around among any of them. Now you can say that probably a good thing. We've had too many big personalities in politics. But equally you do need people who can communicate. who've got a sense of authenticity, who've got relatability, who've got an energy, a passion, a drive, who can somehow infuse and make people feel that there is a bit of hope out there.

And I I'm just so struck by Mamdani where you c you know, look, I'm don't buy into a lot of the policies and, you know, who knows whether it's gonna work and whether he'll succeed and, you know, whether people will end up disillusioned again. But he fired people up with an idea that politics can make a difference. And I kind of look at so much of what we're seeing now in British politics, whether it was under Sunak or whether it's now under Starmer, and you just think it is so underpowered.

It is so sort of apologetic and weak willed and kind of well we're doing our best and it's very tough and I just think actually there is something maybe that we can look at New York and think, is this applicable to us?

Yeah, if if you've just woken up to this result and you want the sort of beginner's guide to Mamdani, let's try and encapsulate a little bit of what he stands for. He's only thirty four years old. He's Ugandan born. In other words, he can't ever stand for the US President because he was born outside of America. But he is a New Yorker and he comes from a democratic socialist position. He's been an assemblyman for the last few years, so he knows the city. He's he's fought for Democrats.

in the city from in the New York Assembly. And he comes with some very clear, easy to describe policies. He wants free childcare for New Yorkers. He wants free buses for New Yorkers. He wants to have five grocery stores that are essentially government subsidized to make ordinary everyday goods shopping much cheaper for New Yorkers. He is aiming his whole philosophy

at the kind of immigrant class of New Yorker who has to commute two and a half hours because they can't afford to live in the city that they would call home. So he's introducing, he says, rent freezes on New York property. In other words, his whole stick Has been about affordability. How can I make this city affordable for ordinary Americans again? And it's something that.

Donald Trump actually has not been able to do in the last year. He hasn't brought prices down. He hasn't really made many ordinary Americans feel that they can afford these costly cities. And Mamdani posted just before his win. A video of himself was

on a street corner a year ago, holding up a sign saying, Come and talk to me. I want to talk about politics. I want to hear your problems. Come and talk to me. And nobody went to talk to him. There's just a sort of very lonely figure. He's sort of looking slightly lost on this sort of New York street corner. And a year later, he has become the magnet.

for people who say, what could politics look like if it was energized, if it was not about the rich, if it was about a different form of communication, and if it was something that embraced All the minorities, all the differences that Trump and his administration have made clear they despise. Because the numbers are huge.

And what he did, where he succeeded and look, New York isn't you know, you can't say, Oh well, because it happened in New York, it could happen in Doncaster or Hartley Pool or anywhere else you care to mention. But he did engage young people. And so often in politics you kind of hold to the truism, well it's all very well going after the youth vote but they never turn out to vote. So much better to gear all your policies to old people because you can depend on them

always trotting along to the polling station or zimmer framing themselves along uh to the polling station. Well, Mam Dani has in you know, shown that you can get young people out to vote. And I think that kind of talks to a generational thing as well. that, you know, undoubtedly in this country right now, in Britain, there is a super serving of the boomer generation, my generation, where, you know, there are triple locks on pensions and there's all this stuff that is there to help.

older people and if you're young and you're renting or you're young and in employment but you don't have much of a work guarantee, then life is pretty tough. And I think that this shows again a way of doing politics

that is differently. And it's not just about progressive politics. It's also about a way of communicating that gets people's attention. I mean look, in this country you've arguably got Nigel Farage who's very good at getting attention. and Zack Polansky, who's very good at getting attention. I'm not sure who else I'd put into that category. And so you kind of look at what's happening in New York and think, is there something we can all learn here?

Yeah, I mean I think so much of our politics at the moment is almost like memo to self. How can I go out and say nothing? How can I go out and not make a headline? How can I go out and not answer the question? How can I go out and emerge from this interview unscathed. By speaking in a word salad, by kind of m meaningless platforms. But she won't actually tell the public what she's going to do.

So she gets the journalist of Westminster to ask questions, saying, Will you raise taxes? And then she says, Oh well that's not for today, it's for three weeks time. In other words, the convolutions of language are I think partly what makes people feel so confused about what our politicians are actually trying to say. And earlier today we heard uh Bridget Phillipson, the Education Secretary. Now,

Fair enough. She wants to go on. She wants to talk about kids and the reset to G C S E's and she wants to talk about Britain and she wants to talk about the schooling system. But there is a moment where she's asked on Sky News what she makes of the Mamdani win. The victory has just come through in the early hours of this morning, and this is her response. I'll be honest, I don't follow American politics especially closely. I've seen a bit of it online, but um

He's clearly fought a good campaign if he's managed to secure such support. Do you r do you really do you really not follow it closely, no? No. I d genuinely. Like I'll follow the big stories but um Not not especially. I mean some people might say this is quite a big story though, right? He's uh new York mayor. No, it's a big story. I mean I'll follow, you know, the activities of the US government, I'll follow what President Trump has to say, but um no I've got

Yeah, Hasbro probably come on to talk, but I've got quite a lot to be getting on. I got that. So yeah It sounded uh you know, I'm a great admirer of Bridget Phillips and uh but it sounded so lame in some ways that you know, if you're gonna be there on T V and you know that there's gonna be have been a big story overnight Uh do I believe that she didn't hasn't followed at all what has happened? If you're really interested in politics, if politics runs through your veins.

You'll have been following what's happened in New York and you'll know what the significance was. But it's that thing, Emily, you were just talking about a moment ago. I don't wanna g I don't wanna give a headline on something else. I just wanna stick to my lane. I wanna you know, I've got my message, I'm gonna stick to my talking points, I'm never gonna stray outside them.

And I just think that people are turnoff. Yeah, I think a lot of people will be will be sympathetic to an education secretary who wants to talk about education.

i n nobody would say that about Trump right now. Nobody's saying, Oh, I haven't really followed what's been going on in America or I haven't really followed what's been going on the tariffs. Oh I haven't really followed what's been going on, you know, with with Donald Trump and and the sort of locking up of university students or whatever. And actually the point about Mamdani is he is now taking the fight.

From progressives, from Democrats to Trump. So for no other reason, watch what he's doing, because actually that could be a really important thing to learn. I would love our politicians to be more courageous. Why don't you say what you think? I I know the risks, I know the pitfalls, I know that if you come on and say, Well of course the government's made a mess of this, there may be a headline saying government split over whatever policy it happens to be.

But I think the public now are sufficiently sophisticated To know when they're being bullshit, if that is the past tense. I love that. Yeah. If when they are being bullshit and when they're telling the truth or when they're expressing genuine opinion. And I think that so much of communication strategy. Um, you know, people who do media training.

is not how you score a goal, but how you stop letting a goal in. It's the Geoffrey Boycott. Yeah, dead bat. Dead bat, dead bat, dead bat. Yeah. Over, start again the next over. And I think that that is something that is corroding politics and it's just making people it's when people hear politicians like I m I mean we were pretty tough on Rachel Reeves yesterday.

But I think people hear that and they think, Oh for God's sake, what are we what what are you trying to tell me? What are you trying to tell me? I mean I think it goes back to for example when you hear Mamdani talking about the city built on immigration That is a speech that Kirstama could equally have given, right? He could have given that in the first few months. To be fair, I think we've heard Sadiq Khan give that kind of speech.

But from Starmer we heard the whole thing about the n you know, the island of strangers and then we heard a row back from the island of strangers. And then h he sort of seemed to suggest that yes, you have that immigration is the most important issue that you could possibly deal with.

And we haven't really heard anything that suggests that probably immigration is one of many issues that needs putting in context for how you get an economy working again. So in other words, you can't really follow a line.

I think of what he thinks. Now, Mamdani, and I think we have to be honest about that, lots of people will hate Mamdani's policies, right? They will absolutely. fear what he's gonna do to the costs, what he's gonna do to

you know, th the rising sort of welfare bill, what he's gonna do in terms of the promises that he may not be able to meet, is is it really a good idea to keep, you know, m rent freezes on? There are many New Yorkers who think that's absolutely the death knell for the entire you know, city that that sort of has capitalism in its DNA.

But since his win, what is really odd is the number of city voices who are now coming out and saying we might not like this, but we admire what he's suggesting. We've actually got to work with him. We'll help him. Right? Because they've seen the turnout and they've seen the energy and they've seen how many young people have been queuing round the block just to get to to vote. And so in other words, I guess what we're saying is something really simple, which is Choose a lane and celebrate it.

Don't split between your lanes'cause you're so scared of offending Farage one day and you're scared of offending the left of your party the next. Like Just choose your lane and say, This is what I genuinely believe. It might go wrong, but I'm I'm just gonna go for it because that's the way that we can test our politics in this day and age. We can see if these ideas work, if they're provable.

Well in a moment, West Streeting, the health secretary, one of the government's most effective communicators, on what he thinks the lessons are from Mam Downey's victory last night. With award winning. Reporting from the heart of Your life. Player app or the new LBC app. LBC, leading Britain's conversation. The news agents. Well, we're joined as promised by the Health Secretary Wes Streeting.

one of the Labour front bench, the government who was watching what was happening in New York overnight and The tweet you put out where suggested that there are lessons for progressives to learn. What are those? So you gotta learn the right lessons and not just assume you can transfer one campaign across to any other campaign in any

country or part of the country and bear in mind this is kind of liberal New York City. But I think there are a few things that struck me following Mamdani's campaign all the way through. Um the first is that authenticity is the most powerful currency in politics at the moment. I think there's such a lack of trust in politics and politicians that um that authenticity that he showed throughout the campaign um really, really matters. The second is that hope is a more powerful force than fear.

So throughout the campaign he had to contend with lots of attacks on his character, his faith as a Muslim in public life. No shortage of that challenge here in Britain I'm afraid too. uh and he um withstood those attacks and and actually in some ways hung a l hung a lantern on um the issues that he was gonna be attacked on. So he was Standing proudly um as a Muslim candidate.

He's quite unusual as a Democrat, uh in that he um stood as a democratic socialist. And it's a sort of reminder that the Labour Party and the Democrats, we've got lots in common, but we are fundamentally quite different in terms of where we sit on the political spectrum because I and every other Labour Party member have the words democratic socialist on the back of our membership cards. Very unusual to see a Democrat, let alone a successful one.

So described themselves quite clearly as a democratic socialist and and so he he r he turned what could have been a weakness into a strength. He didn't allow himself to be on the back foot when when attacked by um Cuomo uh and indeed President and the Republican Party. Let me just the third the third one'cause I think this is absolutely applicable to the UK right now. E r ruthless message discipline on cost of living.

uh constant focus on it. It was it was i i part of every single bit of digital output I saw and was at the heart of his policy offer. And that is a really big issue for us here in in the UK at the moment as well. So I I think those are the sorts of things that we ought to be looking at and progressive

uh internationally we'll be looking at. Okay, so you have said that obviously the electorates are very different, the geography is very different, every election's its own one. But let's go back to your first thought about authenticity. When you look at government now When you look at your colleagues now, who do you think is is not being authentic enough in the way that they speak to the electorate, in the way they actually deliver

their message because you're right, we are at a a crisis of trust now. We had the Chancellor go out yesterday, not to put too fine a point on it. to tell people that bad news was coming but she wouldn't tell us what the bad news was and when journalists asked what the bad news might be and are there gonna be tax raised, she said you'll have to wait. Is that authentic?

Yes, in that she's pitch rolling ahead of the budget, which is gonna be a challenge in budget to put it mildly. And what you will get from Rachel, and I think she did say this yesterday in her speech. Is she she's not always gonna be making popular decisions, but she's making decisions that she believes is right and she'll make the case for the body. You're not even telling us what the decisions are and you're not even spelling out

what is popular and what isn't popul I mean we know with Mamdani, I know it's early days, but we know he's gonna freeze rents and we know a lot of people who have money in the city are terrified of him. Right? And he's going, That's fine, I don't care. She she's not doing that, you're not doing that as a government. Well no, not least because in terms of our economy and and trying to get growth back into our economy and make sure that we can invest in progressive ends in our country.

Um you far from wanting to frighten off investment, we want to encourage it. And so the discipline we've shown, the stability we're trying to bring back to the British economy is crucial.

you know, the capitalist beacon that is New York City. He didn't say that. And look what the investors are saying now. They're saying actually we'll try and work with him'cause it seems he's really popular. Well it's quite a different it's quite a different platform being mayor of a big city compared to being with you know the finance minister of a G seven country which is What what Rachel's doing?

So it's a different it's a different platform, it's a different set of challenges and I think Mamdani he has positioned himself well to appeal to a broad base of support Um to win an election where he was the rank outsider from the beginning, of course he's also now got to deliver. That's your challenge on us, which I don't wanna I don't wanna duck that question.

Certainly not going to personalise um criticism of colleagues, but just to I think reflect on what could be a danger for Labour as we go further into this Parliament. Um it is really important that we don't allow ourselves to be positioned as or perceived as. the defenders of a broken status quo. And the challenge as you go further into a parliament and look at the breadth of challenge, look at the news today, another prisoner manhunt underway. These are all symptoms And proof point.

for a country that was fundamentally I almost dropped the F bomb by our predecessors. We came into a broken economy, broken public services and broken trust in politics itself. And and we've got to continue to be the process. No, no, but no, quite the opposite. We came in to be changed. and to drive change to deliver change. It's really important we keep that insurgency and do not allow ourselves

to own the conservative failure. Our responsibility is to clean up the mess and we'll do that. But we tha that's where I think we've just gotta be a bit careful as we go further into this parliament. And our incumbency begins to build. Okay, you you talked about the kind of need to, you know, the the discipline of Mamdani's messaging, the digital content, the social media content, how good it was.

And how he understood the attention economy of you need to be communicating the whole time and giving a clear message. Are you as a government doing well enough on that now?

Um well objectively no we need to do better when it comes to getting our message across about what we're doing, why we're doing it, and the values that are driving our decisions. I I thought one of the real strengths of Labour's conference, which was the last time I spoke to you guys Um, I felt that whether it was Keir's speech and the degree to which I mean you could tell when he talked about apprenticeships When he talked about racism in our society, when he talked about um the dignity of work

You could tell these were things that he really cared about and hit close to home. But when I look at but let me say this But we've got to sustain that beyond party conferences. But you you talk about authenticity as well. When I look at Keir Starmer's Account on social media, and I see the clips on Instagram or whatever it happens to be. It's produced, there's nothing that feels oh, I'm really getting a real sense.

of the person and the passion and what drives, I'm getting a communication from number ten Downing Street. Now, whatever the faults of Donald Trump, you think when you look at Truth Social I'm getting the real guy, he's telling me what he thinks. And with Mam Dani, I'm getting the real guy, I'm getting he's telling me what he thinks.

I'd absolutely take on the chin the challenge that on some of our social media channels there are too many images of government buildings and not enough images of of not just the Prime Minister but all of us out and about, kind of talking to people, um, with people whether in like on uh um public service front lines or talking to people in communities.

And and the what what what I find personally irritating about that is when the Prime Minister is in those settings, even now as Prime Minister, we used to do loads of as Labour leader, but even now as Prime Minister, with all the status that brings I see someone who is really comfortable around people, enjoys their company, and you can tell through the quality of those interactions really cares. And it's the responsibility of of the government, the party

to take that and amplify it so that everyone else gets to see a window into what maybe I get to see more of because I serve in the Prime Minister's cabinet and I work closely with him. I don't think anyone doubts that Keir Starmer cares. I think that's really clear. and I wanna get away from social media per se. But if you asked what he Thought, if you ask what he felt, how can the same man that talked about the island of strangers? Then be the same man that stands up and says

There is too much racism. But I don't think we get very much of that. We don't always understand. Like, does he fear Farage? Does it you know, this this comment that was told to me Farage is right, don't vote for him. That sort of seems to go to the heart of of quite often what Starmer Says you know, he's right about a lot of this stuff, but don't vote for him.

Well in some ways the the the Island of Strangers challenge is the easiest one to answer because he's addressed it himself. Um one one of those yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna uh Islands of Strangers, I mean he set out the context for what went wrong with that speech. I I was there sat in the front front row thinking, well firstly I mean I didn't like the language. I knew what was intended.

Or I assumed what was intended and I knew how it'd be heard by people I represent and people in my constituency. Talk to him afterwards about it. Did you say what the fuck was that? I didn't use that that language, but I did say to him when he'd given his interviews that um you know this this makes a lot of sense to me because

This is the this is the key I know and I'm proud to work for. And I think that, you know, when it comes to the climate in our country at the moment, this is why, you know, today um talking to the Guardian with the chief executive of the NHS. The one of the reasons why I've been so outspoken on this issue is because it is extremely close to home and I have been shocked by

conversations I've had with people I represent in Parliament, not just about um their fear of racism, but their actual experience of it in recent weeks. Seventies, eighties style racism. Well that was my constituents. After I did Laura Koonsberg and and called out Sarah Pochin and and Reform UK's abject failure on this issue. I have been inundated with people who work in health and social care saying, you know, this is what's happening with us.

Well, this is the way our patients are behaving. This is how I'm being made to feel at work. And I've got a responsibility as the leader of that system to challenge it and to give my full-throated backing to NHS staff who say You've got the right to access the NHS, but that's not a right to abuser.

If you don't want us to treat you, you can go somewhere else and they've got my full support in taking that. Whereas why do you think it has come back? Because I'm struck by it as well and you know, words I heard in a playground At school in the nineteen seventies when I was at school, you just do not hear any more and yet it's coming back. What is the explanation of that?

Uh I think it's complicated. I do think that the sort of economic conditions that we've got in not just in this country but across Europe create the con Fertile ground. for But it's like it's become permissible again to say unspeakable, horrible things. And that and that's what I think we we like we all have a responsibility to take this on.

we all have a responsibility not to be bystanders to it. And that's not just about the response of the state and the policing of the law. That is about what we see, what we hear, uh in our own lives and whether we've got the courage to to to challenge it. And and the you know, the economic conditions in this country that there is fertile ground for people who want to exploit problems rather than address them to say this isn't

previous governments, this isn't the fault of um a broken economy. This is the fault of those people over there who don't look like you or don't worship the same god as you. And that is this is this is a tale as old as time and we have we have we have seen this movie before and therefore we have to go after it rapidly and robustly to make sure we do not see

the return of socially acceptable racism that leaves people in my community and others around the country questioning whether this is a safe place for them. We're seeing that s on so many fronts. I had one of my local rabbis come to see me. uh last Friday about, you know, and speaking for many of my Jewish constituents who are questioning whether this one of the most diverse cities on earth.

uh is is a safe place for for Jews to live. When the you know, my constituency has always been a home for for Jewish people. So this this is manifesting itself in all sorts of different ways. And our responsibility as a government

And as leaders of the country is to bring people together in common cause and to attack problems at root cause and not allow the scapegoating of the other. And that's one of the things I think we take from the success in New York, which is I I believe this to the kind of core of my soul.

Hope is more powerful than hate. Not just Mam Dani, but also Gavin Newsom have used Not just hope, but uh you know I'm gonna go to the other bit of the Obama phrase, audacity. They've been quite audacious in what they're doing and what they're asking for. So in that spirit, Wes, I'm gonna go back to your first thought which is about authenticity. And if I said to you, Wes Treating, do you think you would make a good Prime Minister? What would your authentic self say to that right now, today?

I say I'm very happy being health secretary, thank you very much. Is that your authentic answer? Yep. Yeah, because because you know, the to an extent as well, you know, uh and and I sort of get a bit f like fed up of this where um and you know, I was w never never kind of wise to attack the interviewer when you're on their when you're on their programme but You kind of know where that kind of then that line of questioning goes.

And you you always have a choice. Am I giving an answer that helps my own side and what we want to achieve? neu'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer o'r anwer

And he needs his team rowing in behind him, not rocking the boat. We've all got out there. We've all we've all of us do. Like all of us have to do that. And look we I was thinking about this the other day as we've been in government, you know, not even a year and a half yet, and you look at um the challenges we're up against in the NHS, in the criminal justice system, in the economy and so on, the sort of list is endless.

Now sometimes I think we um make the mistake of Talking a bit too much about tough choices, difficult choices. something we asked the public to give us permission to do. And honestly, for all the challenges I've loved every minute of being in government and being of having the the ability to change things for the better for our country.

Um at the same time though we we do have to kind of also remind people just like the Is one of the ways to deal with this that it I sometimes feel listening to government communication where you can see The cog's whirring where uh we've got to triangulate between the threat posed to us by reform and the threat posed to us by green and we try and steer a neutral path and we just kind of get the messaging so that it's just on doesn't upset the you know, the progressive side but it doesn't

alienate those voters, you know, on the right maybe who voted for us at the last election. And it just sounds so labored. Why don't you just tell us No look if you're if you're stuck in neutral you're not going anywhere by definition.

And like And do you think there's been too much of that? I I think the danger for Labour, I actually thought Lucy Powell set this out um very convincingly in her deputy leadership pitch, was to recognise that at the moment we've got challenges to both our left and to our right. And what you can't do is sort of, you know, to continue the uh driving metaphor, is just swerve around from one side of the road to the other

um or remain stuck in neutral. We have to set out our own stall based on our own values. I do think that we've got a lot in common with people to our progressive left. In fact I'd argue throughout its history the Labour Party has been a progressive alliance of different um centre left democratic socialist traditions.

We've never been a revolutionary socialist party. Um people have tried over more than a hundred years, but we've always been a mainstream centre left party, but with different left traditions, and I think we're stronger for that. Um what we can't do in taking on reform is to try and out reform reform in um the language we use or the policies we we we put forward. Now that doesn't mean when you're taking on an issue like immigration

do it in a values driven sense. And I it you know, my centre left values cause me no discomfort in saying levels of net migration in this country are too high. And I say that because Um I think A objectively they are. B we're over reliant on um recruitment of health and care workers, for example, from many countries who are on the World Health Organization's red list. because they've got such severe shortages. So I think it's immoral that we're poaching.

That's how I approach that question and think well let's invest in the skills and the training of our own people. Uh let's make sure that we've got a health and care system that stands on its own feet rather than poachers from other countries. That's a very different centre left authentic argument for reducing net migration compared with, you know, Katie Lamb, uh, who, you know, people are writing up as a future of the Conservative Party. Well, God help us, um, if if she is, because

cultural coherence was her argument. Now that is a extremely different argument than the one I would use. It's almost power Enoch Powerlesk in its kind of rhetoric. And why is she doing that? Not'cause I think the Conservative Party uh is now a kind of

further to the right party than they've traditionally been, but just because I think she's looking at reform and trying to ape them. So look and that it brings me back to the central point really. Authenticity is the most important currency. We've got to remain authentic, we've got to do our politics as a Labour government in a values driven way. And we've got to make sure that throughout the course of this parliament and

at the next general election that we continue to fight as the insurgents, as the change makers, as the challengers of a broken status quo. Look, you are expressing this with enormous articulacy and a good deal of charisma. You push back very hard on Emily's question about being a future prime minister. But you do sound a bit like a future prime minister. Does does does do comments like that annoy you, flatter you?

Um, I think at this stage I find it annoying because the sort of speculation and the sort of, you know, politics as who's up, who's down, that kind of personality based politics I don't think is kind of serious set against the challenges that we've got. But are you articulating this because no one else is? And being be well being f first I say being Prime Minister or in fact is

Forget the Prime Minister bit for a minute. Being leader of the Labour Party is a bit like being the England manager. Everyone thinks they could do a better job. Uh and it's a extremely difficult job I think the Prime Minister has got the toughest job of all of us. I sit around the cabinet table and think on any given day who's got the toughest job. I mean David Lamy, the Justice Secretary,'s got the toughest job today, I would argue, with this prisoner um release.

But tomorrow it could be me. In fact there's a equally serious uh story being covered on the front of the New Statesman today and by Channel Four about the maternity scandal. Um Bridget Phillipson has an enormous challenge to deal with in terms of special educational needs and support for disabled children. So right across the board we have these challenges. And so the one thing I'm always mindful of is the Prime Minister and the Chancellor

they've they carry all of those challenges on their shoulders because they have to worry about all of those things. In Keir's case How am I leading my country and my government to deal with it? Uh in Rachel's case, how are we gonna make sure we pay for it and how are we gonna make sure that we get growth back into the economy that um creates Happiness, security and opportunity for everyone. These are the things that are driving us.

it's not easy. The choices we make aren't always gonna be popular. The important thing is that we make choices that You know, down the line we will be able to look back on saying, I'm proud of those choices. They were values driven choices and they proved to be the right choices for the country. We're streeting. Thank you very much indeed.

The news agents. We've talked predominantly about what Zoran Mandani has done to electrify the politics of New York City. But as I said at the beginning, there were plenty of other races going on across America. last night and there have been some really interesting victories and and moves from the Democrats and we talk about all those at length.

In much more granular detail on the newsagents USA. We look at Gavin Newsom in California, we look at what's happening in Virginia and New Jersey and ask bigger questions about how the Democrats are taking that fight to Trump. To misquote Mark Twain, reports of the Democratic Party's death are much exaggerated. We'll see you tomorrow. Bye bye. Bye. This has been a Global Player original production.