¶ Henry Nowak: Police Negligence Unveiled
This is a Global Player Original Podcast.
This kid was left to die and handcuffed as he was dying.
What's happened to you, right? Don't think you have mate.
Kiitos.
It is clear that this is one of the worst bits of policing you're ever likely to see.
brought a charge from Farage. There is this two-tier anti-white police
If you actually look at the cold hard facts, you're twice as more likely to be arrested if you're black.
The police in this country have a sacred duty to police without fear or favour. Everyone in this country is equal before the law. It is the promise upon which our whole justice system rests. a'r ymwneud â nhw'n ymwneud â'r ymwneud â'r ymwneud â'r ymwneud â'r ymwneud â'r ymwneud â'r ymwneud â'r ymwneud â'r
That is Shibana Mahmood, the home secretary, commenting on the police behaviour in the wake of the murder of Henry Novart. a young 18-year-old student on his way home from a night out.
It is really a horrifying story of what happened in so many different respects. But how on earth did the police let Henry Novak die in the way that he did? Welcome to the newsagents.
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The news agents.
It's John.
It's Maitless and we're gonna talk to you today about Henry Novak, an eighteen year old finance student, a young kid, a young man who was full of life and and joy and had his life ahead of him, who was killed as he walked home from a night out.
¶ Family's Plea, Farage's Politicization
And this is one of the frankly most upsetting stories I think that we've covered on this sh show. And it's certainly one of the most upsetting stories that I've come across for a long time. Because as Henry was lying, dying, as it turns out, unable to breathe, having been stabbed. Police who arrived at the scene did not help him, did not go to his aid. They handcuffed him because the perpetrator of his stabbing, of his murder, told the police that he, a young Sikh man, had been racially abused.
What went through the minds of the police? As they looked at this 18-year-old kid lying on the ground and told him that he had not been stabbed when he was trying to tell them that he was fighting for his life, that he couldn't breathe. We we're going to play you a very short excerpt from the body cam that has now been released with the blessing, we should say, of Henry Novak's family. It is distressing.
What's happened to you alright? You've been stabbed whereabouts. No, no, that's not brick.
It really is the most horrendous example of policing. gone wrong where someone has says, I've been stabbed and the cop says, I don't believe you, I don't think you have mate uh it's hard to imagine anything worse than that. And it comes after the call, as you say, Emily. made by the murderer's brother saying that I we are the victims. We have the been the victims of a racist attack. We've had our turbans knocked off, we're Sikh, and the P word was used.
And that was all a kind of politicization of something where the absolute reverse was true. And the question that is now being raised is, you know, was this somehow a failure of policing because of a fear of doing the wrong thing, a fear of being labelled racist, or even worse, was it a s an example of two tier policing? Outside the court after uh Vikram Digwar was convicted of the murder, we heard from Henry Novak's father.
And it was a really heartfelt uh address that he gave to the public of their pain and their anguish, but also of their need. And desire for this not to be politicised further to sow further division. Let's have a listen.
In fact, Henry told officers that he could not breathe nine times. He told them he had been stabbed four times. The response from one officer was I don't think you have mate. The police have said they were misled by the murderer and that the scene when they arrived was complex. Unfortunately, it seems to us the truth is much simpler. The police were told by our son himself and by a member of the public who called 999 that they heard someone shout that they had been stabbed.
But the police did not believe them. Henry was pulled across the gravel, his hands forced behind his back, and he was placed in handcuffs. Instead of being treated as a dying victim, police formally arrested Henry for assault and read him his rights. That was the last thing he heard. Henry did not die with dignity. He did not die with the care he deserved. He lost consciousness before anyone believed him. But today matters. Today Henry was believed.
The truth has been recognised. Today, justice, in the eyes of the law, has been served. But justice alone is not enough. We want to use Henry's breathtak heartbreaking sorry story to make change for the better. We do not want his death to be used to create further division, hatred, or tension. We want his story to make our streets safer for everyone.
And so there you have Mark Novak making it clear that the focus should be on their sun. who was murdered and remembering him and of course the lessons to be learned about the policing of it, but it not to become a political football.
Yeah, and within twelve hours. of his father making that very dignified call on the public to understand who was to blame for his son's murder. Nigel Farage had stepped in front of a microphone to say the rights and privileges of white people matter less than those of minorities. Now, my guess is that Some people will see what has gone on. See what happened on that night in Southampton.
And been so horrified by Th they will have asked themselves whether there was something cultural, whether there was some kind of unspoken blueprint in our policing which says think about racism the whole time, think about minorities the whole time. This is a police force who in the last couple of years have faced allegations of being not just racist but homophobic, misogynist.
So is there something that makes the police assume that the young m white man was to blame rather than the two Sikh men beside him? And yet the fact that Farage barely allowed the father's words to sink in, before really Finding what looks like a political vacuum to exploit. I think will make a lot of people feel quite ill, actually.
Because what seems to be happening already called out, we should say, by Kemi Badnock, who's accused Farage of whipping up Anger and Division, but what seems to be happening around this horrendous human tragedy is the makings potentially of another Southport. Tommy Robinson Far right leader calling on people to take to the streets in Southampton to protest. What are they protesting?
protesting a young boy's death. They are not protesting a young boy who was stabbed to death on the streets beside his university. they seem to be protesting whatever Tommy Robinson thinks they should be protesting right now, which is questions around race.
¶ Debunking Anti-White Policing Claims
So there is no doubt in my mind listening to that body cam footage, what the police said, the way the police behaved, the actions of the murderer and his brother. That something horribly bad went wrong.
Catastrophic.
Absolutely bloody awful and just unbearable. I don't know how Mark Novak and the rest of the family will live with that knowledge of what happened on the street in Southampton that night. But to go from that to make the sweeping generalization. that there is now a two tier policing in this country and it is anti white. Given the evidence that people have seen over successive years just seems to me a stretch and teetering on the irresponsible.
further making more difficult The job of being a police officer in this country who are trying to keep order in the best way they can.
The last few minutes, I should say we're recording this at 5 to 2. The Home Secretary Shabana Mahmood has made a statement in the Commons and warned that. Police officers completely unrelated to this case are already receiving death threats so serious that they have had to move house.
Mae'r gwaith gwaith, unrhyw unrhyw unrhyw unrhyw unrhyw unrhyw unrhyw unrhyw unrhyw unrhyw unrhyw unrhyw unrhyw unrhyw unrhyw unrhyw mae wedi wedi'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'
So that was Shabana Mahmood in the Commons a few moments ago. Let us speak now to our very own crime agent, Andy Hughes.
Andy, no sooner had Mark Novak, Henry's dad, made that uh incredibly powerful, heartfelt appeal last night not to turn this into more tension, more hate, uh than we saw Nigel Farage, a reform leader, saying the rights and privileges of white people matter less than those of minorities.
and
My guess is that there will be a lot of people who actually don't necessarily see themselves as Faragistas or Reformists saying, is that happening? That that feels Like exactly what happened. Of Henry's death.
Well I think the first thing I'd like to say is when you look at these extremely visceral images of the body worn footage, it is clear that this is one of the worst bits of policing you're ever likely to see and that's Exactly what I'm hearing from several police officers I've been speaking to about this. The idea that a kid was lying there on the floor after being stabbed, dying, and then two police officers rush over to him. He tells them that he's been stabbed. And then they say
I don't think you have mate. And then after that they handcuff him. Well st for starters, that goes against everything police are trained to do. Um the police officers, if if they are told that I've been stabbed The first thing they should do is that they need to check for injuries and save life. The second thing is if someone's not presenting any threat at all.
then they shouldn't really be handcuffing the uh the suspect. And the idea that the last thing he heard was the rights being read to him. is just sickening. That's actually usually reserved for terrorists. I know of one occasion back in the twenty seventeen Westminster attack where the attacker was lying on the floor dying.
And one of the armed officers actually rushed over to him and read him his rights because and I quote I wanted him to hear the full force of the law before he died, and the idea that poor Henry had that same experience. is again just sickening.
Closer then Andy to understanding what happened in this case that would have led the police to say, Oh, I don't think you have been mate you know, the the a a kid who's lying there on the ground saying, I can't breathe, I've been stabbed. W why were the police assume that he wasn't telling the truth.
One of the big problems I'm being told is that a lot of these responding officers are quite junior, have less than five years experience. And um some of the weak ones I'm told may because they're being told constantly that they are institutionally racist, they may subconsciously do everything they can To avoid being called racist. Now this may have happened in this case, but the IOPC will um will we'll have to see where that goes.
Let me pick up on that because I think that is the the broader charge that you know Emily referred to from Farage um uh at the start of this interview. Is it possible that We can all agree that this was a terrible pen. piece of policing. But can we generalise from that and say that there is this two tier anti white policing in this country.
Well, absolutely not. So uh my phone was lighting up at around eight thirty this morning from several police officers who were frankly totally pissed off at what Nigel Farage had said. He said that police officers, all police officers effectively, are told to treat people differently based on their ethnicity. I'm sorry, that's absolute nonsense. In fact they're told the opposite.
they're told to deal with people without fear or favour. Now clearly in this case it seems as though that wasn't followed, right? However, The big fear here is that what Nigel Farage said could stoke hatred not only against uh minority communities but also against the police. B and this is not based on fact. The actual if you actually look at the cold hard facts, you're twice as more likely to be arrested if you're black. You're four times more likely to be stopped in search if you're but black.
So what he's saying is not based in fact and as sure as night follows day, Tommy Robinson has asked his supporters to go to Southampton tonight.
So the potential of unrest, even though, as you say the statistics would suggest that the Mae'r problem yn yw'r british society yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r strip searched when she was still a juvenile at a police station.
Those examples are legion. But I suppose it is very unusual that what has happened in this case, it does seem to be that y uh a Sikh person or the brother of the Sikh person, the brother of the murderer, was playing the race card. Yeah.
¶ Challenges Facing Modern UK Police
and I think this comes down to from all the police officers I've spoken to they are horrified by what they saw in that body cam footage they seem to come to the conclusion that these were very junior officers who um are terrified of being labelled racist because police officers um th throughout history have been labelled as institutionally racist. And but a more senior officer would just do what they're trained to do. It's very clear that these officers did not do what they were trained to do.
That sounds like a fundamental problem, Andy, if The junior ones are the ones getting sent out and they're the ones that are most conscious of the labels that have surrounded them about whether they're homophobic or whether they're racist or whether they're misogynist.
all part of investigations into why the Met isn't working and the older, more experienced officers are retiring or just don't want to go anywhere near the front line now. I mean that is a that is a serious problem for the whole country.
It is. Uh just right to say that it was Hampshire Police uh this case, but the Met and other forces are having real trouble recruiting people and when they are recruited they're losing them fast. I was told by a senior detective today that it's very rare that people are staying past their five years now because policing it is already a very difficult job. There's this really striking stat that if you're a frontline police officer You have more than five hundred traumatic events in the
throughout your life. If you're a normal person you're lucky or you'll be lucky to have less than five, right? So that's the scale of difference. And I've been on these ride alongs several times with these cops who are responding to these incredibly traumatic incidents. It is one of the most difficult jobs in the world I would say. They are uh constantly operating in total chaos.
these situations that they turn up to. It's so chaotic and they are trained to deal with it with a level head. It's very clear from this Hen Henry Novak case that that wasn't done. But
Andy, answer me this question. I mean, wasn't it ever that? that you know, police officers are having to go and dealing with the most terrible things, whether it's people's mental health or whether it be a domestic murder or whether it whatever it happens to be, that is w what the the job entails. Yes. Has it got worse?
Well, it's got worse in the sense that the public's perception of the police is so much worse now. Policing is deeply unpopular. Everywhere they go they find people being hostile towards Imagine doing that, your job every day, turning up, and everyone victims, uh, suspects, everyone is hostile to you. That's what they have to deal with every day. So that just seeps in.
to their mentality. And a lot of them will hate going to work because of this public perception that people have of them. And frankly, a lot of the police officers that I've spoken to this morning tell me that um comments that Nigel Froge made this morning do not help.
If you're Henry Novak's family, you're just thinking Frankly, we do need to get to the bottom. Whatever happened and you know, th the sympathy for the officers or for the mistake or for the culture is frankly secondary because A kid was left to die and handcuffed as he was dying and trying to explain what had happened to him.
And those parents will have to live with that and those mistakes the rest of their lives. And yet they are the ones calling for no division. And along comes Nigel Frost this morning.
Thanks so much.
In a moment we're going to be speaking.
¶ Belarus Under Lukashenka's Dictatorship
To the president in exile of Belarus, Svetlana Tsikunukskaya, who is here, she's about to go and see the Prime Minister, in fact. to make the case for Belarus and why it needs the support of democratic countries around Europe.
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Well joining us now is Svetlana Tsikanuskaya, who is the president in exile of Belarus. Um, Svetlana, uh a lot of people will not know your full story of how you came to be living outside the country, of the election that you fought, that you won. But they see you here today because y you're going to be visiting Keir Starmer. You're off to Downing Street. Why?
So first of all, maybe a couple of words about my beloved country, uh Belarus. Uh maybe some of your viewers can remember twenty twenty when our
Uh people.
uh stood against dictatorship and I was presidential candidate and won elections but režim of Lukashenka unleashed the most brutal terror in our country after uprising of people and uh forced me to leave the country and uh for these six years already about half a million of Belarusians had to flee uh Belarus because of repressions.
Yeah. And Lukashenko didn't think you were a threat.
Absolutely. You know, he always underestimated the role of uh women. He always said our constitution is not for for women. What women can do in Belarus just just uh nothing. Definitely he underestimated women but also he underst underestimated you know, intention of Belarusian people to uh for changes. Because we really want uh get rid of dictatorship, we want our country to be democratic, to be European and to get rid of uh uh Russia's influence uh on on uh Belarus.
But he thinks he won that election.
You know, he uh yeah, he thinks that he's the only governor uh of uh Belarus. He owns Belarus.
Because he's been there for three decades.
For three decades. More than three decades, yeah.
And what was the influence of Vladimir Putin? in that election, was Vladimir Putin terrified that he was going to lose a strategic Ally and therefore it was Putin telling Lukashenko, you've got to stop this.
Uh look Putin and Lukasko they have like symbiotic friendship. They need each other, they use each other, and definitely in twenty twenty uh Putin saved Lukashenko politically and no economically. He supported him. And uh of course you know especially after uh Russia started the war against Ukraine and uh Лукашенко дав олен, а інфраструктура в ланчи фірст місяців Україну. Білорус бек Лукашенка бек-накрина, саме Путін. Соня супруг і ча.
uh you know Lukashenko is ready to provide our uh country again for possible escalation in in the the future. And uh
Are Belarusian m soldiers serving in in Ukraine with Russia? Are they are uh is there conscription at all in your country?
Look, first of all we have to distinguish Belarusian regime from Belarusian people. Belarusian people are fully on the side of Ukraine. We uh really uh want Ukraine to win because on the outcome of the war in Ukraine uh destiny of our country depends a lot. Uh many military volunteers went to fight to Ukraine on Ukrainian side. Many died. And in twenty twenty two many Belarusian um
uh partisans, you know, disrupted railways, for example, to stop Russian equipment, you know, going to Ukraine. So we with all our heart we want to help Ukrainians to win this war. We cannot do a lot because we are nation which state was seized by a dictator, dictator who is sovereign to Russia's interests, who is ready to sacrifice our independency, uh our sovereignty just just to stay in power. But Belarusian people want to help.
¶ Opposition's Fight, Exile Institutions
So just let me go back to twenty twenty and I I remember vividly the massive protests on the streets, the huge numbers of people who came out to protest against the dictator in your country. Where is the opposition now? Has everyone fled? Yeah, I I'm just I'm just you know, is there still a simmering discontent in the country or is all the protest outside the country now?
Look for uh people living in uh democratic countries it's very difficult to imagine how dictatorship works because we are not divided into a position or and government. All the people want change. In Lukashenko for these thirty years he managed to build uh the system that serves to him personally, especially military, you know, services who are protecting them, but people want changes. So we cannot say that a position fled or a position stayed in Belarus.
you know, we all as nation we are in a position to this dictatorship. So those who fled the country we managed to be uh to build uh alternative institutions in exile You know that after twenty twenty all free media that were inside the country they were ruined, liquidated, declared as extremists, but they managed to restore their broadcasting from abroad. People in Belarus
live under constant repression. Just as difficult to imagine six years in a row every day people are detained for their anti regime, pro Ukrainian, pro European or anti Russian position. So we live like in Gulag, like in Stalin's time. So just of course it's impossible in such situation to go to the streets. because it will be uh new and new victims, new uh killed people by uh this regime. But for these six years Lukashenko didn't manage to suppress the willing of Belarusian people to
uh to change our country. So this is like the real opposition to uh to dictation to dictatorship. We managed to preserve our uh civil society. We managed to preserve our media and we like Honestly speaking, we rediscovered Belarus to the world because before Belarus was absolutely in grey zone. Nobody knew what is Belarus about and looked on our country through Russian prism, like we are Russian appendix backyard.
And now we show to the world that we are not the same as regime. We want changes. We want to return to European family of nations where we historically belonged. And I'm really so grateful to our partners, Democratic World. that they understand this, they don't recognize Lukashenko as legitimate leader, they keep him in uh uh they conduct this policy of non recognition. Of course I'm grateful to uh uh UK for joining uh this policy.
Not everyone has made the Belarusians in exile feel so welcome. Lukashenko has a firm friend and fan in Donald Trump still.
Uh I think it's uh uh not this not the case because uh I'm really grateful to um uh President Trump administration for these efforts to release political prisoner. A year ago we had About one thousand three hundred political prisoners in Belarus. Thanks to diplomatic efforts by uh of the USA, but what is not less important, thanks to strong and principled position of European Union, sanctioned policy, policy of non recognition
Д іс ефект. Лукашенко would never release people without economic pressure from European Union. So please don't underestim underestimate you know contribution of uh European countries into these releases.
And w and what is your message to to Keir Starmer today? I mean you're on your way there, presumably to ask him f for what you need.
So uh look we are really grateful to the United Kingdom for this six years strong policy towards Lukashenko regime. You put pressure on uh uh dictators, on dictators in Belarus but uh supporting Belarusian people. We have to weaken regime but strengthen our society. So you imposed uh UK imposed uh uh sanctions on Lukaska, aligned its policy with European U with the European Union. Um
All this year's ambassador wasn't sent to Minsk Minsk not to recognize, you know, Lukashenko. So we are asking to stay principled and strong, and of course we are grateful for such strong support to Ukraine. As I said.
Do you worry about the release of uh Russian oil sanctions now from the UK?
maybe Nisrotectic steps and uh they are made by uh like by internal, you know, decision of uh separate countries. But uh my message is that we have to uh fight with dictators with all the possible instruments. Dictators cannot be re educated, dictators cannot be appeased. and uh Europe has its power, has its strength and uh tools to fight with dictators.
Can I just go back to the question that Emily asked you about the relationship Byddai adnodd Donald Trump a Lukashenker, rydych chi'n gwybod sut sut yw'r president wedi'i wedi'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i'i' But President Lukashenko sits on the board of peace for Gaza.
Which Donald Trump chairs. Now doesn't that confer give President Lukashenko respectability? The fact that he's seen there standing shoulder to shoulder with the President of the United States looking at the situation.
Yeah.
So first of all, uh Lukashenka is not the president. Your your words are extremely powerful, so he's a person who seized power in twenty twenty.
I accept that, sorry.
And uh vi have to understand uh mm, like maybe unconventional approach of President Trump. You know, he's very unpredictable leader. And today for President Trump you can be highly respected president, but tomorrow you can be Madura for him. So uh let's uh see on uh the actions, not on the words. Yes, Lukashenko was like a like officially invited to the piece of boards, he never was there, I am not sure that he is going to be there, but if this serves
you know, to release political prisoners if it's instrument, you know, to uh influence this cruel uh dictatorship. So you know a it's okay. It doesn't mean recognition, political recognition of location conversion.
¶ Sviatlana Tsikhanouskaya: Life in Exile
Can I ask what your life is like now in exile? Do you do you worry for your life? Do are you looking over your shoulder? Have there been threats on you?
Look, of course all those people, activists, you know, politicians who are fighting against uh dictatorship, you they are always targets of the regime.
And uh of course people sacrifying their uh freedom, their normal life just you know to continue this fight. Have to say that uh some people have disappeared, being in exile al already, you know, from our movement. Moreover our uh beloved our relatives who are still in Belarus are also in huge danger because uh regime puts revenge uh for uh your active uh position even if you're in exile and also we are going through transnational repression.
Uh so we see that even being living in free countries, all these dictatorship rules they're spreading further and further in the democratic world. For example, we cannot renew our documents. My passport Belarusian passport is expired. I cannot uh get new one because it's necessary to go to Belarus to
You can't set foot in Belarus.
I cannot of course and all the um embassies like Belarusian embassies, they're forbidden, you know, to issue new documents for Belarus and people and it's it's becoming a systemic problem. And I think that's uh
But do you feel targeted, I mean, you know, on the streets of Europe? Like you know, we it's not so long ago that we witnessed the scriple poisoning in Salisbury. Do you do you feel are you conscious that there are people out to to get you even when you're in Europe?
Look of course we uh I hope that we um are safe uh on the territory of European countries, but of course we uh all those ugly uh instruments that dictators are using just you know to uh ruin their opponents, you know, their disgusting but we have to be prepared for this. And that's why our movement is uh built on uh mm on institutions. Even if some people uh uh uh please God no, but if some people disappear, the movement will continue, you know, to fight. So so this is my aim.
So let me ask you a slightly different question from the one that Emily just asked you. I mean you've talked about the threats. Do you ever think this isn't worth it? I just want to get on with my life. I don't want to be the figurehead of this. There is too too heavy a price to pay.
Look, I think that uh almost every nation went through difficult times in their history. And when uh Great Britain, for example, was in the World War uh II I think that many people could think that It's enough of us. We want to live peacefully. But your desire, you know, to get rid of um of this oppression, your desire to live in free world
was much stronger than your desire to feel to to uh live a comfortable life. So it's the same about my country. I really want uh Belarus as a nation, as country to be free. And this aim is much uh more important you know that my personal comfort and I'm so and actually I see that uh European people they're also changing step by step. They also understand that democracy is not uh granted, it has to be defended every day.
and uh this new new generation of people they got used to living democracy and they sometimes don't uh understand the price of this. So one of my missions maybe as well is to explain that uh Dictatorship in one country um can influence
Democratic world as well. It's like cancer. You know, uh you have to cut this till the very last cell because it will spread further and further. And it's moral obligation of every every person now of democratic world to um supports those who are on the front line of this fight against uh dictatorship.
To talk about the front line overnight, we look at Ukraine, massive attack by Russians uh on Kyiv, many dead. I and it comes simultaneously as we've seen Putin looking as if he's in trouble militarily, reducing the big show of military might. questions about whether internally people are telling Putin that he cannot win this war. How do you see now the future of the the invasion of Ukraine?
Look recently I uh had my first official visit to Ukraine on the invitation of President Zelensky. I'm so glad that uh now our both nations, Belarusians and Ukrainians. are working together strategically, you know, to defend both our countries. We are facing the same enemy, imperialistic ambitions of uh of uh Russia. They don't see neither Belarus or Ukraine or Moldova or Armenia as separate states.
who have right to choose their future by themselves. You know, we are like naughty children that have to be returned, you know, home. And uh uh of course what I saw in Ukraine is they uh like unbreakable moods, you know. I saw how much military they have achieved. Ukraine is the first country that dared to challenge Russia.
And I truly believe that Ukraine will win this war. And again, thank you to all the nations and countries who are supporting Ukrainians because they are defending not only s some pieces of their land, they are defending all Europe. Of course we don't have to overlook Belarus because Belarus can be used for possible escalation in the future. Uh but what Russia is doing they're trying to persuade you, first of all, that Russia can win.
And if you can even adopt, you know, this thought, it means that uh uh Russia, you know, through hybrid warfare is winning. You just have to be as strong as your nation was during the Second World War. You know, and stand with those who are on the good side of the history. So I truly believe that Ukrainians can win, they just need some extra assistance from powerful democratic world.
Madam President, thank you very much.
Teşekkürler.
Thank you.
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¶ Mandelson Leaks Reveal Political Squabbles
So this time yesterday we were anticipating in high expectation of the slew of Peter Mandelson uh correspondence with various ministers over his appointment as ambassador to Washington. And what we got was a lot of bitchiness. Um a lot of vanity, uh not much that moved the story on a great deal, and a little bit of embarrassment too for what some of the ministers communicated to Peter Mandelson.
Yeah, I mean I think it's fair to say that the rising levels of expectation of what they would deliver weren't quite met. But there were a couple of really embarrassing kind of excerpts that came out of that, not least from Pat McFadden, the working pension secretary, who basically admitted that he seemed to spend a lot of time talking to backbenchers in his own party, um, who were asking the question
Who can we tax now to give more to welfare? Now you could argue, I guess, that embarrassing as that was for Pat McFadden, the fact that he was raising it in communications with Peter Mandelson suggests that he was kind of aware of the perception of the Labour Party when it came to its welfare problem. Um but I guess what you really notice in all this
¶ Starmer's Cabinet: Internal Criticism
Is not just that Peter Mandelson was constantly used as a kind of sounding board by many of the cabinet m ministers and members f for their own sort of policy questions, but also how unpresent
the Prime Minister Keir Starmer is in any of this stuff. Now, maybe it's just we didn't see enough of his phone, his messages. Certainly we didn't see Mandelson's because Mandelson decided not to give over his on the advice of lawyers who said that, you know, if a police investigations uh ongoing then it wouldn't be advisable.
But it does feel like there was a lot of noise in the cabinet around Starmer, without Stama being part of it, and nothing that we've seen so far gets us any closer to understanding How Peter Mandelson was given that job.
I guess the reason we're not going to get the real crux of it is because there is a potential police investigation and on the advice of the Metropolitan Police I'm sure a lot of this stuff has been withheld. But yeah, I think that the Pat McFadden quote And the Tories absolutely weaponised that. And I think the Conservative Party will weaponise the Pac Murp Fadden quote where, you know, I I just meet people who wanna say where can we tax more so that we can give more benefits out
In welfare. I think that has a real toxic uh element to it for Labour and the way that they're managing the economy. I also think it just shows. What we already know that a lot of ministers around Kirstama think that Keystama is just a bit crap and that he hasn't kind of on top of things and there's no verve and there's no panache and there's no story in the government. All things that we've been hearing. But what these texts show is that yeah All the ministers were saying that.
But I think, you know, if if we're coming back to the central question of how damaging is it, I think the damage is I mean, I think it's in the price. So I suppose if you're looking for silver linings at this point in your government in your premier.
It hasn't got any worse.
That might be one. There you go. And on that optimistic note, we will see you tomorrow.
Bye bye. Bye for now.
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