Episode 110: RELEASE CANDIDATE!

00:00:15 Matt Welcome everyone to the net maui podcast. we're here to keep you up to date with the latest and greatest in.net client development. 00:00:22 Matt We'll talk about some Azure, some Visual Studio, simple laser, and of course the release candidate.net Maui. I'm Matt Soucoup 00:00:32 James I'm James montemagno. 00:00:33 David And I'm David Ortinau. 00:00:35 James Mobilewire.net Maui dot dev. Remember when I registered that like a year and a half ago? 00:00:39 David David, yeah, yeah. 00:00:41 David Well there's some other domains out there. 00:00:42 David We should probably negotiate some acquisitions of, but I'm glad you did. 00:00:47 David Because yeah, it's nice to have a a cool URL. 00:00:51 James And there's a. 00:00:51 David Don't always get to use the ones you ****** up. 00:00:51 James There's a wet. 00:00:54 James No, no, it's a yeah, that's my personal and I should probably transfer that to Microsoft. 00:00:58 James Don't tell Beth, it's a website now. 00:01:00 David Now yeah, we have a website. 00:01:03 David It's got, you know, some of the overview, the the marketing speak and then. 00:01:10 David Hopefully well you. 00:01:10 David Know in in the near future we can start adding some more customer success stories. 00:01:15 David Once we, you know, have everybody shipping on the jazz. 00:01:18 James Oh I wanna I want to tell everyone this. 00:01:20 James I want to give a shout out. 00:01:21 James Wow well shout out let me open up Twitter Hon a shout out to this guy. 00:01:28 James Uh, did yummy. 00:01:31 James Yeah, this guy Tyrell. 00:01:32 James Great name Tyrell code Tech travel also cool tag just today release an app on the App Store published with the RC for iOS and Android. 00:01:44 James It's a code is it codemaster not code masters what they think. 00:01:48 James Code no code Breakers. 00:01:51 James What mastermind mastermind the game? 00:01:53 James You know the game mastermind and he made a a mastermind clone. 00:01:54 Matt Yeah, yeah. 00:01:59 James It's called maker. 00:02:00 James Anchor Trevor Tyrell. 00:02:01 David Maker breaker. 00:02:03 James It's on iOS and Android. 00:02:04 James It's completely free. 00:02:05 James It's an online code rates online. 00:02:07 James How do I play it online? 00:02:08 James I even know yet, but anyways, it's really cool. 00:02:10 James It's me with down. 00:02:11 James In Maui, I think. 00:02:11 James It's using like the graphic stuff people are shipping stuff. 00:02:15 James It's best crazy and it's an RC. 00:02:17 James What does that even mean? 00:02:18 James David, you're an old blog post. 00:02:19 David Right, yeah? 00:02:21 David So, so there's some nuance to it, but generally speaking, RC is where we're saying to the ecosystem. 00:02:27 David Hey, we've we've implemented all the things. 00:02:30 David The API is not going to change. 00:02:33 David Wink, wink. 00:02:36 David I mean there there are situations where some API changes will happen during our CS, so it's not a hard and fast rule, but we want people to be able to have confidence on it so that libraries can update to dot net six so that people know that they can build their apps on it. 00:02:52 David And for customers who you know look to Microsoft. 00:02:55 David For support and confidence in the product, it also comes with what's called a Go live license. 00:03:00 David So that means that our support engineers are now taking requests for those who have access to support and we're helping customers be successful with it so. 00:03:12 David The the nuances is that while things are all implemented, we do know that there are some verified bugs and you know our work between now and GA and beyond is going to be stabilizing the product, making sure that in particular layouts do what you expect. 00:03:32 David Making sure that there's obviously no crashers and just really, you know, generally all the things umso. 00:03:39 David Our advice to you are my advice. 00:03:41 David My personal advice to you. 00:03:43 David I know that many app developers are super eager to start upgrading your applications from Xamarin to Maui now that it's RC, I would say hold off on migrations, number one. 00:03:56 David You need to let the ecosystem of libraries catch up. 00:03:59 David You know they now are going to start jumping more aggressively on migrating to dot net. 00:04:04 David Six so you're going to want those to catch up if you have those dependencies in your application, and you're going to want us to solve some of these bugs, especially round layouts, so that you make sure that while you can convert your code and you don't have to rewrite it and it will compile and run, that's fantastic, but you actually want your layouts to look the same. 00:04:25 David And so that's where some of the bugs lie, and so give us a little time. 00:04:28 David You know, GA would be a good point to reevaluate and see if you know you have the confidence at that point. 00:04:31 Speaker 1 Right? 00:04:35 David But let's let's let. 00:04:36 David Let library maintainers kind of catch up. 00:04:39 David I we do know that you know all the major component vendors are taking a crap. 00:04:44 David Back in have been shipping previews. 00:04:46 David I just had a conversation with UX divers and growkit. 00:04:50 David They're working on a whole new version. 00:04:52 David I got to see an early peek of it and it was sweet. 00:04:57 David They always make such beautiful stuff and. 00:05:00 David So if you are however. 00:05:03 David Looking to start a new application. 00:05:06 David Uhm, absolutely jump on it. 00:05:08 David Now is a great time. 00:05:10 David Yes, you're you may need to wait for a library if you have a dependency like that, but you know, we feel like most everything you're going. 00:05:16 David To need is in the box. 00:05:18 David And now is a great time to get started. 00:05:21 David So definitely recommend doing that. 00:05:23 James A super rad yeah, you know, I think one thing that's a great point is I was just doing, uh. 00:05:28 James A conference and a lot of people ask me the same question was like hey, like you know XYZ like. 00:05:33 James What are your recommendations? I have a. I have an app that's 1000 pages in my shared. My great yeah, maybe not. You know eventually, but you know, think about like what you want to do. 00:05:42 James Time there, and I think you know that that makes a great point is like you know you got that two year support policy going on so you got a lot of time on it which which as well is there and it's going to base on your app your dependency. 00:05:54 James This is a great point and you know another great point that I want to make is in this release on this RC release made some big changes. 00:06:01 James I love the guide great. 00:06:02 James Guides on the wiki page, it really helped me update my applications and some of my libraries. 00:06:07 James There's some major things to essentials which no longer is essentials. 00:06:11 James They're just in it. 00:06:13 James There's like it's a thing. 00:06:13 David Just I thought it has been a. 00:06:17 James It has been observed it's really cool I. 00:06:19 James I think that this is the right call. 00:06:21 James Funnily enough, I think John, **** and Matthew and email and I were on a call originally talking about the this stuff like five years ago at the Xamarin Essentials. 00:06:30 James But now there's things just called. 00:06:30 James Maui accessibility application model communication data transfer authentication devices and these are the different API's and interfaces in it. 00:06:42 James So you can still use all the normal stuff, but they're just tighter namespaces. 00:06:42 Thank you. 00:06:46 James So for example, my in app billing library, which I had added initial support. 00:06:50 James For.net 6. 00:06:52 James You know I need to update my libraries right? 00:06:54 James Because of of these changes and kind of go along there and that's just one example. 00:06:59 James But I will want to say that I've gone through as a library creator. 00:07:04 James The process of updating my library and it's not too bad to be honest with you, so I think now that there's a lot more documentation, it's just a little bit of multi targeting. 00:07:14 James Just knowing what to do here and there some different settings. 00:07:17 James I'm going to do a blog on it like here's what I did like. 00:07:19 James It's it's really not that hard setting up your CI CD so you know it's just going to take a little bit of time, but all that stuff eventually be resolved, but I'm super stoked and I gotta say the file new experience shells there baby. 00:07:32 James I did it, I did it, I did. 00:07:32 David Shell is there. 00:07:33 James It I did it, you did. 00:07:35 Speaker 1 Let's say. 00:07:37 David Man, you lobbied for that for quite a while, and I'm happy to say that that it actually happened. 00:07:42 David It's it's one of those interesting things where we've got a couple of camps in the in the in the team. 00:07:49 David Those who are baffled that shell is even necessary. 00:07:53 David And those who use it love it. 00:07:55 David And and we're on the side of the the, the customer, and most customers tell us it saves them a lot. 00:08:01 David Of time so. 00:08:02 David The Great news is that Shell uses all the same implementations of the other navigation pages, so tab page flyout page navigation page, the actual stuff that makes it happen is the same stuff that shell uses. 00:08:18 David So and and Shell is going to get more templating, but. 00:08:22 David Another thing that's in the template now is a default stylesheet. 00:08:26 David If you will, it's a resource dictionary. 00:08:29 David But it provides base color themes and provides base styling for all the controls, so you get consistent styles across all four platforms with platform you know, fidelity, I think is the way that I like to see it. 00:08:47 David So what what that means is that yes. 00:08:49 David An entry is going to look like an Android entry on Android. 00:08:51 David Look like a win UI entry and a fluently styled entry on. 00:08:56 David Windows it's still going to use the same colors. 00:08:59 David You know, background colors and things like that. 00:09:01 David So we think that that's going to be nice help for folks you know, so that when you do a file new IT doesn't look like you know, I don't know, make it. 00:09:11 David And so he actually gets. 00:09:12 James Yeah, that's some. 00:09:13 James It's got some style if you. 00:09:14 David Will right right? 00:09:15 David So we we we we put our faces on and and now you get that out of the box and it's also good guide. 00:09:20 David It's for developers to see how do I do styles? 00:09:24 David How do I do visual states? 00:09:26 David How do I do light and dark theme which is there by default and there are certainly some improvements and things that will continue to do to it, but that's there now. 00:09:35 David And you know when we put it in there, I didn't talk about this in the blog post, but it's. 00:09:40 David Worth mentioning, we have been profiling like crazy. 00:09:43 David The performance of app start up on all the platforms but especially Android where you know we really want to make the improvements. 00:09:51 David Right now, that's the. 00:09:53 David And so when we put this large resource dictionary in the template, you know the question was, well, what have we just done to our startup performance, right? 00:10:01 David Because we've we have for years told developers don't put a bunch of stuff in your in your app XAML, and that's effectively what we've just done. 00:10:10 David Well, we were able to, you know, the team was able to go in and profile it. 00:10:13 David And make some optimizations to XAML and other things. 00:10:17 David So that you're not paying a huge penalty just to get those styles. 00:10:21 David So compared to Xamarin and Xamarin forms, we are ahead of the game, and so that's great. 00:10:28 James Ooh all sounds. 00:10:29 David Yeah, so we're faster and faster, not just on file new apps, but also on like the podcast app. 00:10:36 James Yeah great great great point there, which is I've been working with that team as well and Eric and and John John Peppers have been doing some awesome stuff then this one really excited to watch some key takeaways I have is. 00:10:49 James I would we were using like the the HTTP like you know library or whatever like that shouldn't use. 00:10:55 James That and then. 00:10:56 James Also, Eric rewrote monkey cash from the ground up to use source generators and not newtonsoft Jason 'cause it's not linker safe and he shaved like 3 MB off the size or whatever, so it's actually not performance, it's it's both performance. 00:11:09 James And size that they really can see. 00:11:10 James Entering and they're using that, which is a big app, so it's it's really cool to like watch them shave little tiny little pieces off of it, which. 00:11:17 James Is really cool. 00:11:17 David Yeah, they've made amazing progress. 00:11:19 David It's really. 00:11:19 James We don't see. 00:11:19 David Nice to. 00:11:20 Matt Well, I'm excitedfor.net Maui release candidate and it's springtime, so everything is blooming and so is Visual Studio. 00:11:27 Matt Mac 2022 'cause they just released Preview 9 P Nine and James. You and I were just in a meeting with Jordan mathiasen the PM for obvious Mac and he just went out. 00:11:38 Matt And showed us all the great new features there with Preview Night is a lot of new bug fixes or new bug fixes or old bug fixes. 00:11:47 Matt They fix the bugs. 00:11:48 Matt They fixed a bunch of bugs. 00:11:49 Matt And which is super cool. 00:11:51 Matt And one thing that Jordan showed us was the. 00:11:54 Matt Like I don't know. 00:11:55 Matt What what like though? 00:11:56 Matt What was it? 00:11:57 Matt James the when you hover over and like the window popped up like what? 00:12:01 Matt What is the what do you call that cold glance view quick view that looked amazing. 00:12:02 James Second quick quick view quick thing thing yeah. 00:12:09 Matt That looks so good. 00:12:10 Matt So it's like all redone for visual or for Mac OS. It's M1 is size, so it runs on the arm 64 natively architecture, so it's. 00:12:22 Matt It's no longer Xamarin studio. 00:12:25 Matt It is now truly Visual Studio for Mac and it's running natively. 00:12:29 Matt It's running fast. 00:12:30 Matt It obeys like all the. 00:12:33 Matt Like if you have light or dark theme it will do that automatically as the operating system does it, which is important because you get all the accessibility built in with that as well. 00:12:43 Matt Super cool P9. Just came out go and download it and even better they're looking at all the developer community issues. 00:12:53 Matt Vote on them, they'll fix them. 00:12:55 Matt They're getting closer and closer to release candidate as well, and. 00:13:00 Matt I can't wait to see it come out. It looks great and there's one other no documentation. We are fixing all the docs, not fixing them, updating them for Visual Studio 2022 for Mac, and those are rolling them out as fast as we can fix them. We're typing sign off and they're rolling out as well. So yeah, everything is coming up. 00:13:20 Matt Tulips for us via smack in the northern hemisphere in the southern hemisphere? 00:13:25 Matt Well, it's. 00:13:25 James Fall but right, sorry, I was hoping that the obvious for Mac would have like more previews than Donna Maui did, but it was a competition there for a while, so I didn't look like me. 00:13:27 Matt It's pouring up here. 00:13:34 David Not over yet. 00:13:35 James Doesn't let me. I will also say though that one thing that's nice about this. Well, there's not official. I mean I'm doing hand quotes here. You can't see it official.net Maui support in this. 00:13:45 James Yet you can open the.net memory projects and we are going to get all the tooling things like this. 00:13:51 James I opened the.net podcast app. I deployed it to my Mac to my iOS at Tony worked fine, which was good. 00:13:56 James Of course you could use CLI type of stuff, but it was really nice to get a lot of the tooling stuff in there. 00:14:01 James You know it's not going to be finalized, but you know you know it's in this release obviously so, but just know that there's some stuff happening there, at least, which is really, really good. 00:14:11 James And to see that going on. 00:14:13 James And I'm really excited about that. But yeah, I've been using it. I've been using also 2019 side by side 2022. 00:14:18 James I want to make that sure people know that is that you can install both of those side by side installing different versions of the Xamarin workloads. The.net workloads things like that that has been successful. I will say that on my end. 00:14:33 James On an M1 Mac Book Air. 00:14:35 James There are some noticeable difference in performance as well being natively compiled, so it's really exciting to see. 00:14:44 James Uhm there, so go give it a go. 00:14:47 James No, uhm. 00:14:50 James Oh, do we talk about how you get the. 00:14:51 James Rcof.net dot. 00:14:53 David Net Maui so you can get it through Visual Studio. 00:14:56 David 17-2 Preview 3 so basically on Windows, just use the preview channel and that will give you the Maui functionality and it will also install mauiandthe.net SDK. 00:15:10 David Runtime bits that you need on the Mac side of things. 00:15:13 David Since we were just talking about the Mac you can install there as well. 00:15:18 David You'll need to grab the 603 hundred SDK runtime installer. It installs everything, and then you can. 00:15:27 David Workload install with the workload command. 00:15:30 David We have a link to the wiki with the instructions on how to do this so you do a couple of CLI commands and then you're good to go. 00:15:38 David The other thing that you can do as James just mentioned is the new preview of VSS. 00:15:44 David Ramak does open and run Maui apps. 00:15:47 David Yeah, it does not install Maui. 00:15:49 David It does not have the templates from Maui, but you can open it and run it and debug it. 00:15:53 David So yeah, you can totally do that on the Mac as well. 00:15:57 James Now, if you are looking to get started learning a lot of people are asking inquire like wow, there's all great documentation, but where's like an in depth tutorial? 00:16:05 James Say I want to sit down for 8 hours. 00:16:07 James I just wanna learn. 00:16:08 James I want to learn bad. 00:16:10 James Guess what we got you covered because we just released the Donna Maui all Day Workshop and it just delivered. 00:16:17 James It was the most I I sent. I sent an email to 700 people, David 700 people and I said this is the most successful workshop I've ever done in my entire life. In 10 years. And it's a built from the ground up. 00:16:32 James But did this. 00:16:32 James I built this up and Gerald and and Shane helped me out on a lot of things which I would shout outs at them since it's a team effort here. 00:16:40 James I delivered is great, so it's it's 6 modules, 7 modules wherever is from start to finish. 00:16:46 James Learning all about Don Amaui. 00:16:48 James Building an application from start to finish. 00:16:50 James It's a monkey application of course. 00:16:52 James But it uses all new shell, all new styling, all new navigation, all new essential API's. All new dependency injection. You know it was really cool because as I got to do this workshop. 00:17:04 James It made me see so much new that was in down in Maui coming from the Xamarin world all my life. 00:17:11 James It was really great to see all this new stuff and it's really delightful. 00:17:15 James Delete so much code. 00:17:16 James We also use the Community toolkit for MVVM and this thing so you just delete all that mcode. 00:17:22 James It's all source generates. 00:17:23 James It's a beautiful thing. 00:17:24 James Definitely go give it a. 00:17:26 James Give it a look and we'll put a link. 00:17:27 James To that in the show. 00:17:28 James Notes, but yeah, it's a short one. 00:17:31 James This one I think we're done. 00:17:32 James We guys think. 00:17:33 David Yeah, yeah, there's so many good things happening and we got a GA release coming up and we've got a build conference coming up. 00:17:39 David So look forward to having a lot of things to talk about. 00:17:42 David Next month as well, yeah? 00:17:43 James Go register for build that there's a build website. It's up we're going to be there. There's tons of sessions from the.net team, so I'm. 00:17:50 James Super excited about it. 00:17:51 David Yeah, it'll be great now. 00:17:52 James Alright, I guess we'll wrap on that point. 00:17:54 James Let's wrap it up. 00:17:55 James We got we. 00:17:56 James We'd be longer business short one this month. 00:17:58 James Everybody just 'cause we got a bunch of meetings go run to. 00:18:00 James We want to give you the deets. 00:18:02 James But that is. 00:18:02 James Going to do it for this month dot. 00:18:05 James Net Maui podcast. TuneIn 00:18:07 James To me it's going to be a doozy. 00:18:09 James It's gonna be a long one. 00:18:11 James So until next time I'm James, that's David. 00:18:13 James That's Matt. 00:18:14 James This vineyard on Maui.