This is the most dramatic podcast ever and iHeartRadio podcast. Chris Harrison and Lauren's em coming to you from the home office in Austin, Texas, where today we're talking about proposals. Now I propose to Lauren, and I'll admit it was beautiful and it worked. She said, Yes. There is a tradition in a traditional old school marriage man and woman that the man gets down on one knee and proposes.
It's what we were all brought up with Disney movies and romantic movies being there in front of the Eiffel Tower, the Empire State Building. All the industry was built on the man proposing to the woman. Is that still a thing? Should it be a thing? Why don't more women propose to men? And it's something else that we talked about a lot on the Bachelorette. The premise of the Bachelorette in early days was let's flip the script. Let's put the woman one hundred percent in control to the point
where she chooses the winner and then proposes. But what we found, as much as we wanted that was the man took over at the last minute, that the bachelorette.
Actually try to do it. You tried with which bachelorette.
Every bachelorette we wanted that.
Every single season, you tried to have the bachelorette propose.
We would have loved to have the bachelorette proposal.
So tell me how you tried, because it's not like we've ever seen footage of the woman's about to go down on one knee and the guy steps in.
We never saw that.
Trish, for example, the original Bachelorette, we knew it was her and Ryan. Everybody knew it was her and Ryan. We would have loved to have her propose that first bachelorette would have been awesome. At the end of the day, Trista hopeless from antic loved Ryan really wanted him to propose, and we ran into that pretty much on every occasion where the bacheorette said at the end of the day, I want him to take this leap as well. I want him to make this commitment and I want to say yes.
And oh, that's interesting.
I like that because it's like this has kind of been on my terms, but I want him to have some ownership here.
But it was funny that that's the way it went for the bacheorette that's not how it goes for the Bachelor. The bachelor was always in control and then they proposed.
True, why doesn't the woman? Maybe the woman should propose on the Bachelor?
Right, I mean that, yeah, you should have to say, okay, now I need you to choose me. But that still never came into play ever on the Bachelor. It was never even a question. So post that's the patriarchy? Is that sexism? Is it? What is that the in us? That it always ended up the same way. As much as we actually tried to make it happen the other way,
we couldn't. And it's not that we couldn't. We could have forced I guess that moment, but they didn't want that, and we wanted to give them the moment that they do.
Did any bachelorette really want to do it?
I can't remember any bacheorette saying I want to propose. I will propose.
So part of the reason we want to have this discussion today is we saw this article in Time magazine. It's kind of an opinion piece and the headline is why don't more women propose? And the article gets into look times, they are a change in women are more financially independent.
Why is this still a thing.
And I think a huge part of it is just sort of the like I think probably overall, women feel it's romantic to be proposed to. They feel it it's men showing effort. They feel it makes them feel loved and special and caretaken.
It just feels like there's this old stigma that women want this more than men, and men need to make that leap of faith, they need to commit into the stigma.
I think that's very accurate.
Well, and if we really look into I could be wrong, but from the light research I've done and it makes sense to me. I think the whole reason men proposed to women in the first place is rooted in that women used to be seen as property and that marriages were about were very transactional and about you know, the
unions of houses or alliances. Yeah, like the arranged marriages would unite houses and countries, and women were property and their families would get a you know, a dowry for them being proposed to, and and it was very businessy. So it's really very unromantic when you think about it that way, that the idea of a proposal is rooted in wartime alliances or business transactions and women being property.
But I think it has evolved into or dissolved into the guy is the one that is hard to commit, Like there's this again. I just think there's this tradition that we all feel that the guy is the one that needs to step up because you know, if a woman proposes to him, oh, she's trapping him or she's it's like, the connotation is different and it shouldn't be. What I'm saying is that's bullsh I think the whole concept is complete, bs, And if you're in love, you
don't care. I would not have cared at all. If you had taken me to NAPA and proposed to me, I would have been so damn happy. I don't care if it was us backwards forward.
No, Matt, Okay, hold on, I want you to really think about it. Yeah, I think I totally agree that you would have been happy, and I think we both would have been happy if say, us getting engaged should come out in this really casual way of me turning to and being like I want to marry you? Do you want to get married? And you would have said yes, and I think we would have been really happy and then maybe we would have said, let's go pick out a ring together and we would have had a fun
time of it. I want you to really imagine yourself, truly, tell me how you would feel if I had done a big proposal and I had gotten down on one knee and proposed to you.
I don't want you to get down on one nay.
See why why that's interesting.
I wouldn't have cared. It would have been I think you would have felt bad.
I think you would have been like, babe, get up, I do It's.
There is a tradition like would you have called my mom or dad? You know, would you have asked for my hand in marriage because I called your mom.
Which again probably goes back to the like dowry and well, for.
Sure it goes back to we see it now arranged marriage. I would like to marry your daughter. We would like to unite the clan.
I hate the phrase asking for their permission. I hate that phrase.
I do your blessing right.
That's a much better take on it, because asking for permission means like again that the woman is this property.
And I definitely did not ask your mom's permission. What I said was, you know, I would like your blessing, and.
She loved it.
She was so touched by her phone call. And I do think that's a very beautiful thing.
That's the thing is that those traditions that I think are very sweet and I hold dear. I meant a lot to me to call your mom right before, because I know that it may have gotten out on the coconut Telegraph. I didn't want it to get ruined. But would you have taken that step? Would you have called my parents?
No?
I mean maybe, well I would have called them to give them a heads up. I think, yeah, I don't think I would have called them.
And then it would have been weird. Your mom would have not been involved.
What's interesting is you know in this article gets to this again, women are more financially independent than ever. We want equality and relationships more than ever. We don't want I'm not saying everybody, but overall, there's this movement away from the man's the provider, the woman stays at home. Of course, this isn't a new movement, but as much as we're going towards that, proposals have become more decadent
and over the top and still traditional than fu. I mean, people I guarantee you people spend more time and money on proposals today than maybe ever before.
I think the more things change.
You need a photographer, you're supposed to have flowers, you're supposed to throw a party after.
And have the family there and all these things.
Well, two things, two schools of thought. Number One, there is the social media aspect, right, people know it's going to be seen, they want to post it, they know their significant other will probably want content. Again, did it
happen if you don't see it on Instagram? The other thing is, I think, and I found this on the show when I was producing, the more things change in this world, the more things we crave to stay the same, the more we kind of lean on those traditions and things where we kind of harken back to when things were simpler, and a traditional proposal is like that. And I always said the beauty of the Bachelor and Bacherette
was its simplicity. At the end of the day, no matter what happens social media, the craziness all that there's a boy and a girl on a mountain, on a beach and a air balloon in a submarine whatever, just staring at each other hoping they love each other, and that again.
I'm just a girl. Yeah, staying in front of a boy asking him to love her.
Notting Hill reference always works, but that is again you go back to the Taylor Swift story. With this Travis kelce guy. We want to believe in a good love story. And it's so simple. The superstar woman, the football player. It's America. It takes us back. It's what we wanted to believe in Megan and Harry that we are now so disillusioned by, and we're disappointed in. We want to believe in those fairy tales, even though the things are now getting so crazy on yeah, apps and all that.
Yeah, and maybe because the world's feeling a little dark, it's nice to see some beautiful flowers in a gorgeous proposal moment.
What would Swifties say and what would happen to the world if Taylor Swift got down on one day and proposed to Travis kelcey. Let's flash forward and say they're madly in love, they've been dating and this is going to happen. We all see it coming a mile away. But it's Taylor that proposes to Travis.
I think Swifties would love it, and it would totally change the game and suddenly make it.
Okay because she is a leader, and she is so empowered, and she is the most powerful woman maybe you know, possibly in the world, definitely the most famous, and if she did that, it would change the game. It's interesting a whole generation of young girls would grow up saying, Okay.
Well, you know my former mother in law, who I'm still very close with and I love, She's always been a real ahead of her time thinker. She has been saying this for years. I mean for years she's been saying and she kind of did it in her own marriage, and they've been together like thirty five years, if not longer. I think she kind of said to him, like, let's get married, and she's and saying for years. If women want to take ownership of their lives, then why not
take ownership of the biggest decision in your life. A piece of advice I heard not long ago was we worry so much about where we're going to go to college and what kind of job we're going to have. The most important thing in your life, and studies show that this is the biggest factor of happiness in your life is the life partner. You choose who will you spend your life with? That is more important than anything.
So why are women not taking a stand and getting ownership in the deciding factor of the most important choice of their.
Life, of the proposal of where it all starts?
I would say, also a good mattress. Choosing who you're going to spend your life with.
In a good mattress, the mattress a decade.
The two most important things long relationship.
Good interior designers will tell you spend the most time on your couch in your bed, So make good choices. I think, I actually, I will say I think. Also what could go away with proposals entirely for me is the getting down on one kny thing. I don't need it. It feels weird. I mean, I loved our moment, but I'm but I but our moment would have been just as good if.
I was sitting there next to you. Sure, yeah, why are.
We still doing that? What does that even mean?
I don't know.
It's got to go back again. It's got to go back to the knighthood.
And the do you know what's more romantic than getting down on one knee? You looking me right in the eyes. Yeah, Like, I'm very excited for our vows because we're going to be standing there together, looking right at each other, having that moment, looking each other right in the eyes and declaring our love to me.
That is so romantic. The getting down on one knee thing, It's there's nothing like. I don't know. I'm just saying I don't think it's needed. It's not needed.
I also when it comes to proposals, I support it. I say women get to propose, and why not. I don't know I feel about engagement rings.
What do you mean.
I mean, I love my ring.
Yeah, but I think people have gotten to the point they are spending so much money on engagement rings, going into debt for them at the end of the And you're right about the social media thing. So much of it is people want to post on Instagram.
Here's the ring. Here it is.
I don't think it's good when the ring you're trying to buy isn't reflective of the financial life you can really live. Yeah, it's it's I don't know, Am I wrong?
Has it always been this way? Has it gotten worse?
No? There was that pressure the first time I went, but I just I had no financial means, and I am a very I've always as you know, I'm very fiscally responsible and I live within my means. I've always done that, and I think that's an important, the most important lesson I could ever give financially. Live within your means. Don't keep up with the jones is. You don't know what's going on in someone else's life and how mortgage they are to the hilt in debt and all that.
So just live your life and live below your means. When you can put your head down on your pillow at night and close your eyes and rest peacefully because you know you don't have that. Just live within your means. And I think the ring is another big aspect of that by which you can buy. Yeah, well, wedding, don't over extend yourself on a wedding, on a propose, on any of that wedding culture.
Period's gone crazy. I don't mean to get like negative. I don't want to go on a run is.
I don't think that's negative. I think it's just smart.
Well, that's part of the reason why I didn't want to have a wedding planner. I am so excited for our wedding. Yeah, I I want to throw a great party. But we've had friends and I've seen how I think when you have a wedding planner, like they're an artist to some extent, right, Yeah, they want your wedding is going to be part of their portfolio.
So they of course.
Want you to spend as much money as possible. They want to, you know, make it big and blow it out, and they're going to tell you need this, and you need that. And everything to do with weddings is so overpriced. It's like a built in wedding fee. Think about a dress you get for like a party or even you know, you and I go to events, versus what you spend on a wedding dress. The wedding dresses are just jacked up price wise, they are every things jacked up.
So that was part of the.
Reason why I didn't want to have a wedding planner. I didn't want the wedding to get so annoying.
We know, I don't care how much you talk to somebody else, a stranger. We know what's important to us. We know where we do want to spend more money, and it may not be the same for you. You may be obsessed with flowers, and you want the whole thing to look like a botanical garden. That's great, that's you, that's not Lauren and I. So it's like, what's important to you? Where do you want that money spent? And so I think when we have planned this wedding together, it allows us to do that.
Okay, let me circle back to the proposal thing, because I just thought of another way to like, I'm when we do these podcasts, I'm always trying to crack you and see if you're if I really know how you feel, or if you're really being honest. Your son, Josh, yes, it'll likely get married. How would you feel if you if he called you and said, my girlfriend proposed to me and we're engaged on fine?
I know I actually would love it.
Yeah, I actually were too cool, Dad, I got that engaged. I'm like, you did? What would you do? She proposed to me? I'm like, that's awesome.
You know what's great about it?
Me and Ty. By the way, my daughter Taylor, if she's the one that proposes to her husband, I'd be so happy for her.
I think with Josh, I would feel like, oh my god, I'm so glad you're with a woman who loves you that much.
Yea.
And if Taylor proposed, I would say, hey, I love.
What an independent, strong woman you are for taking your love into your own hands.
So our takeaway for this playbook shake.
It up, play by your own rules.
We'd shake it up. Yeah, like there are no rules anymore. Go do you? Obviously these things were born out of ancient traditions that we no longer uphold. We're not living that way in free society anymore, So be free, shake it up. If you love somebody, take that leap of faith. Man, woman, whatever, go be happy. I've always said, if it floats your boat, if it makes you happy and it's a direction you want to go and you're not hurting anybody else, God bless you. Go do that. We're going to do it
all over again. And Lauren's gonna propose to me.
Why not.
Thank you for tuning in so appreciate you. Take care of yourself, take care of each other, and we'll talk again next time because we have a lot more to talk about. Thanks for listening. Follow us on Instagram at the most dramatic pod ever and make sure to write us a review and leave us five stars. I'll talk to you next time,