8. The Technology and the Dream - podcast episode cover

8. The Technology and the Dream

Nov 04, 20191 hr
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Summary

The episode delves into how Dr. Ruja Ignateva's OneCoin scam infiltrated impoverished Ugandan communities, examining the stories of individuals like Daniel and his mother who sacrificed their life savings, including selling land and livestock, for the promise of quick wealth and banking access. It exposes the ongoing promotion of OneCoin and similar pyramid schemes like DAGCoin by former proponents and even church leaders, highlighting the deep-seated hope and desperation that cryptocurrency hype exploits. The investigation also reveals new, crucial information about Dr. Ruja's whereabouts, suggesting the cryptoqueen may be closer than ever to being found.

Episode description

The final episode takes an unexpected twist.

Presenter: Jamie Bartlett Producer: Georgia Catt Additional Research: Ignatius Bahizi Editor: Philip Sellars Original music and sound design: Phil Channell Original Music and vocals: Dessislava Stefanova and the London Bulgarian Choir

Transcript

Intro / Opening

This BBC Podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. Dej, jag skulle ju köpa några nya palstält. Det kanske blev lite mer grejer. De hade ju allt, man hade en skribord, jag köpte en sån här, och kontorstolar, och sen hade de en skit snygg tippkont. Vi har inredning för hela arbetsplatsen. Välkommen till AI-produkten!

Emerson presenterar Oskars läggd. Oskar har inte skottat på över tre år. Om man kan välja mellan trappor och rulltrappan så tar han hissen. Hans ben får inga svåra uppdrag nu för tiden. Men sen hoppade Oscar på Amazon och köpte en skivstång. Fem kiler. Limpulver och en rejäl massagepistol. Nu kan Oskar mosa meloner med sina lår och asgar det råbigt. Supertajta vixor. Bra jobbat, Oscar! Få lägg det att hända hoppa på jämmöson.se. BBC Sounds. Music, radio, podcasts. Doctor Rouge is closer than me.

The Global Reach of OneCoin

Probably in Europe, and we believe she spends a lot of time in Frankfurt. Maybe she leaves sometimes, perhaps travelling under a fake passport to somewhere out of reach from the US authorities. Dubai or possibly Russia. We wanted to find the missing crypto queen. But the more we learned, the more we wanted to find something else. How far her vision had spread and its cost to ordinary people.

So we're with a 22-year-old one-coin investor called Daniel. Driving to his small village near the border between Uganda and Rwanda. What is it? Some scams don't start out fully formed. They often begin life with a few cut corners or by taking advantage of some gap in the law. Sometimes the people involved think they can turn it around. But then the scam starts to grow. It starts to spread. More compromises are made, and before long it's too late to go back.

I don't think Dr. Rougea ever thought one coin would make it to where we're going. Where Daniel is from, 3,000 miles from Frankfurt and Sophia, Dr. Rouge is a household name. One coin. How? One coin. My name is Turiasing Radania Leinard. I'm 22 years old. I personally invested 700,000 Ugandan shillings. I think it's like$250. And where did you get this money from? How did you get it? First of all I had my own money. I I had like four hundred thousand and then I had like three goods I sold.

Kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo. You so encourage to solicit the three hundred to make it seven hundred the starting package. What did you do with the goats before you sold them? Yeah, they used to graze them back home, my young brother. Uh so they were just rearing them. The goats are basically reared for meat. You did that for one coin? There was no other way. There was no other way. And the dream. Thank you.

Saturday David's Crypto Dreams

How did Daniel get involved in Dr. Rouge's one coin? It has a lot to do with one man. Saturday David was the first person to promote OneCoin here. اشتركوا في القناة How old is I in Georgia. He stopped a couple of years ago, around the time that Doctor Rouge disappeared. He's agreed to meet in his office in Uganda's capital city of Kampala. Saturday David is impeccably dressed, wearing a thick gold ring and diamond brooch, and surrounded by photos of himself.

நான் வருகிறேன் வருகிறேன் வருகிறேன் வருகிறேன் வருகிறேன் வருகிறேன் வருகிறேன் வருகிறேன் 500,000 euro. You earned 500,000 euros? That's right. I did last yeah. That's a lot of last year. Yeah. That's a lot of money, isn't it? Yeah, it's a lot but not compared to what I want to make. Well how much do you hope to make in future? Uh I've got big dreams. Big dreams, big dreams. I want to build a city. Oh excuse me. I want to build a city. A city.

what what city city a city yes i'm just one i want to build the mine a city in uganda that is digital that will be doing and accepting everything in cryptocurrency. So I need like 1 billion euro to start with my city. It's going to be called the crypto city. And do you think you might achieve that? I will definitely achieve it because I'm a believer.

Here in Uganda a lot of people work in network marketing or multi level marketing. It's an opportunity to make more money than even in very respectable professions. Profession I'm a medical dentist. No dentist. Yeah, sure. So I joined the network marketing at a university when I was stuck. I had no tuition, school fees, my parents could not afford

So I was looking of where I can get money to pay up my school fees. So a friend met me and was like, Would you be open up to see how you can make money? took me to a presentation where they were talking about there was this company they were selling supplements. I was of course depressed. I'd lost hope. So I went into this room and everyone was excited.

And all what they were talking about is how to make money, how to travel. I sat, I listened. Then at the end of the presentation, they wanted money to start. Which was equivalent maybe to twenty five dollars. I could not even afford the twenty five dollars then. He scraped together the twenty five dollars and started his new career. And then in early 2016, a European multi level marketer told him he should stop selling vitamins. Start selling one coin.

He asked me questions, like, have you heard about cryptocurrency? I said, no, I've never heard about cryptocurrency. Then he said, have you ever heard about Bitcoin? I said, no. اشتركوا في القناة So I said, have you had about one coin? I said, no. He said, don't worry. I will.

OneCoin's Expansion and Doubt

At this time in early 2016 there's no one else in Uganda using OneCoin. Nobody talking about cryptocurrency in general. How big did one coin become in Uganda? How many people invested? Oh the many, many. Over I think over fifty thousand people. So how what how much money did you make from this? I didn't make a lot of money. May 300,000 euros.

Quite a lot of money. How does that compare to working as a dentist? Of course, excuse me, that that's unbelievable. Nobody has ever made that money in my entire genealogy. People at the top were making good money by recruiting others. And like most OneCoin promoters, Saturday David also became an investor. I have over 17 million coins. I can still open and look at them. Wow, yeah. I mean, you're just looking at numbers. It's fifty fifty. I've not lost hope completely.

But you would become immediately overnight one of the richest people in the world. You'd you'd have more money than any of the Bitcoin you'd have as much money as some of Mm-hmm. And what's wrong with that, son? everything is possible to us will believe i believe He's not given up all hope, but by the end of 2017, he had enough doubt to stop promoting to others. We believed in Dr. Roger so much, so when she kept quiet, I think, from October 2017, so I was like, what should I tell people?

I've been telling people from what Dr. Ruja has been saying. So now she's not speaking anything. What should I speak? That's when I called my team members. I told them, for now, I will stop promoting OneCoin. The one coin financial documents leaked to us earlier in this series revealed something important. In Europe, less was invested in the first six months of twenty seventeen compared to the same period. In twenty sixteen, but in Africa, the Middle East and the Indian subcontinent.

More was invested in the first half of 2017 compared to the first half of 2016. As the money started drying up in Europe, OneCoin promoters turned more and more to countries like Uganda. In late 2018, Konstantin Ignatov visited Uganda, turning up in a huge motorcade to promote the coin, visiting schools lined with clapping and cheering children. I'm very, very happy to meet everybody of European.

Thank you for warm welcome. I'm traveling the world really a lot and I really need to say that if there were more people like you the world would be definitely a very beautiful place. Thank you for having us here. Thank you. Did you feel a bit bad because of the people below you had invested because of the my man I felt so so bad. Up to now I still sympathize with them, especially us in this developing economy. People don't have a lot of money. Even $1 is too big for them to lose.

Prudence: Sponsor in the Slums

This is a slum area. Daniel, the twenty-two-year-old one coin investor, is taking us to meet his friend Prudence. She's my friend and my sponsor. We call them sponsors because they're the ones that introduced us to one cone. Hello, are you poudent? Barbero Saturday David in the pyramid. Prudence joined the network and started recruiting new people. How many people live here? There are many. They are many. These slum areas have many, man, many.

the kind of s houses, the infrastructure, the hygiene, everything is wanting. That's Ignatius, our fixer, who's a local journalist. And it's filthy. What? Do you know everybody that lives around here? Yes, yes. Because it's me who treats them. Yeah. And their kids. And their families. So are you like the local like the local uh nurse really? Yeah, oh my nurses. Yes, I'm the only one in this area. It's a very long feels like a very distant place from some of the one coin

leaders where they live and what they do. These guys are not mostly touched at such kind of people before. They don't have good access to information. Have a lot of dreams. So when you tell them that at uh Five million Ghana shillings should be getting billions and then sell the little what of what they have in order to make that five million shilling. Yeah. Yeah.

it would be it's not what I expected at all. I really didn't. Oh is it's here? Prudence runs a small, poorly stopped health clinic here. So y this is your your clinic here, it's like a health clinic. It's only just treating people. Yeah, you finished my studies. I joined Nancy. How long have you two known each other for? Like um six years. Six years, seven years, six years, yeah. Yes, there's Prudence first heard about one coin a few months after Saturday David started promoting it.

How many coins you bought? It's a lot. I have like a Sixty packages. Sixty packages. Yeah. Did the one coin people tell you that you would become very rich, that you would make lots of money? Future billionaire. Future billionaire? That's how they told us. Anywhere people are struggling to make money, a speculative cryptocurrency investment or an MLM opportunity.

will always sound very appealing. There is trainings. They told us to move district to district, town to town. We used to go with nice cars. Yeah. They gave us nice cars. They gave you a car? They used to tell us you go while dressing smartly, you get nice funds. Looking good. Who would be the typical person you'd want to target? The farmers. Why why the farmers? Because I target the seasons.

that they are harvesting in this time. It's when they have money they get money from where they are growing. Those people in the villages they trust people from town. where there are people from deep, deep villages. We sold everything in the village, land, animals. Ruth selling their cattle and some houses there in the village. We sold everything. So they would sell their houses where they lived? To buy the one coin packages? Yes.

The same things that had lured in Jen McAdam, change your life, get rich quick, don't miss out this time, were exactly the same. Except here, it was even bigger. So I in the villages, what do you tell them when they come and ask you and they say to you can't scare them. They can't scare them. I tell them to wait. Some of their kids at home sitting without going to school. Sam doesn't have where to sleep. kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa kwa

You're hiding yourself. What do you mean? I don't want those people introduced into one coin to see me moving around. They can easily kill me. They thought I did their money. Even though Prudence now thinks this money will never come back, she can't tell other people the truth. Daniel, you said that that it was it was prudence who told you about this.

Lingering Hope and Unspoken Truth

It's a bit unusual to have you two sitting with each other because you recruited Daniel and his family so you don't have any anger with prudence. I understand she invited us in good heart And we are still friends. I feel bad because they lost a lot. Did you do some research before you started to sell to people? No. I didn't do any research. How how many how many people now do you think are still

working for one coin here in Uganda. The I mean offices are there working. Offices are open. People are still investing. I mean I just can't believe this. They tell us to wait, you wait, wait for the good news, wait, wait. They are still investing. They are still recruiting. And people are still putting their money into this. You know uh Rujar Ignateva, the woman who created this one coin. We went to see all her houses.

in Bulgaria. We saw she has a big yacht. Really big yacht. She has a mansion on the seafront. I mean this is your money. She's getting money out of her brain. Like she used her brain to create something that we believed in. I can feel bad that she stole our money. Kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo, kwa hivyo. Mm, I think we bring ourselves.

Like a lot of young people in Kampala, Daniel moved here for work. He's originally from a small village six hours drive away. How often do you see your lamb and your brothers? Sometimes it can take a yeah. Oh yeah, that's a long time. Yeah. First of all the the distance is quite big between Tungam and Kampala. He agrees to take us there to meet his mother, a farmer

Who's also invested in one coin. Then you can earn more money in Kampala and then send the money back. Yes. And you wouldn't believe what we saw on the road. I I just saw a truck with uh a one coin label. Lebo with one coin, yeah just big truck labeled with one coin. There was one coin, it's just that we were over speed like we're on the big speed. But I just saw it from there and then like this treat the entire way.

Banking for the Unbanked

When Dr. Rouge promised banking for the unbanked, it resonated with millions of people. It's something we take for granted in the UK, but well over half of all Ugandans don't have a bank account. Count. Some don't have the right papers to open one. Many say the fees are too high, others just don't trust the banks with their money. Far more people here have mobile phones than have bank accounts, and many already pay for things with phone symbols.

Cards. Cryptocurrencies, real cryptocurrencies that are decentralized and secure, could be revolutionary in places like Uganda. They offer the possibility of a simple and cheap way to make payments. And hold money without the banks or governments being involved. OneCoin fell on fertile ground here. Dr. Rouge was promising both a way to make money and financial freedom. That's what made her such a revered figure.

En route to the village, we stop off at Umburara. The town's motto is Ibirungi Biruga Omotutu, which means good things come from sweat. There are several one coin offices in Umburara. And in one of them we meet a well-dressed businesswoman who's a local promoter. I'm called Re Maranga. I'm the one who started OneCoin Barra. I was working with an NGO called Mjab. It was HIV based. I threw in my resignation. And I joined that day.

So did you think you could achieve more and change more people's lives for the better through one coin rather than being an HIV? But you were a nurse, you were saving people's lives. I mean that would be more meaningful than cryptocurrencies. This is something bigger than what most people understand changing people's lives. I resigned for cryptocurrency because I saw that this was the best for people. Saturday David.

Prudence and now Ramarenga. That's the third person in three days we've met who's given up working in the healthcare system. promote one coin. There's something very wrong with an economy when this happens. Did you ever meet um the founder? The founder of OneCoin?

Faith in Dr. Ruja's Genius

Not really. But we have ever seen her on stage, we have ever experienced her on videos. I follow everything up until when she went into a safer zone for security purposes. What what do you mean she went into a safer zone? What do you mean? Because one coin is bigger than what people thought. So when other people go to know that it is fighting the current way of banking.

So it came like a threat. So our leader had to sacrifice herself and go to a safer zone and concentrate on bringing the vision to reality. Elsa you think she's is she still somehow in charge? Very in charge. She's still somewhere in controlling things. Because when it comes to the systems, you see that someone genius is the one doing this. It is not a normal way of how everyone can do. I want to assure you, she's a genius. She's one of a kind that the world has to appreciate.

Did you read the US charges? I read. I mean they look they didn't they look pretty bad. Because that is what they want to create to the public. They invented claims. They are invented claims. There's no blockchain behind this currency. kwa hiyo kwa hiyo kwa hiyo kwa hiyo kwa hiyo kwa hiyo kwa hiyo kwa hiyo kwa hiyo kwa hiyo kwa hiyo kwa hiyo Let's we should always look at the two the two sides of the coin. It's from a genius.

And that's why I'm proud of her. Yeah. She's educating everyone. Yeah. She's one of a kind. Yeah. Very extraordinary. Dr. Rouge has unleashed something powerful here. Hope and hype. Maybe it doesn't need Rouge anymore. You're going to become a kind of um Ugandan Doctor Rouja. Cause I'm the Doctor Rujak. That's the I mean. Yeah, I'm the doctor. Yeah, I've done her work on the ground and I'm proud of it.

Daniel's Mother's Sacrifice

We dug this route manually. Another hour west of Umborora and we get to Daniel's village. I remember it was the whole day had come this way but we dug it manually with host this one. Wow, what you did? You helped to do this. Yeah, like. Who's this guy here? This is our little, little musty little brother. Oh, hello. What's your name? How old are you? Six years old. Six years. Am I a good brother? Yes. How?

I have many. How many brothers and sisters do you have again? They um What's the sort of typical day here? For the people that live in this village? They wake up, then go to the gardens, especially the banana plantations. It's the main source of the water they do. And that's that's every day you're doing that? Yes, almost every day. Then if they're not in bananas then they would be in um sweet potatoes, cassava, just as a supplement. Beans, granite. We've it's eight kilometers down a dirt track.

off a road that's like 300 miles away from Kampala. I mean how a scam like this could go from the brain of Rujy Ignateva in 2014 all the way to this tiny little village of a ten families. Yes, this is me. Yeah. Yes. Daniel's mother's house is next to two or three just like hers. A concrete block with a tin roof was the Five small rooms, a small television and a cooking area. And what are the some of these uh s it sayings on the Yeah, those are like words of encouragement, like

Silence is the best way to revenge. Don't lose hope, no condition is permanent. Ah, okay. We just want to say thank you for Daniel who's been such a good help to us. while we've been translating that now. That she's very proud of me and she loves me so so so so much. We're gonna get somebody else to check these translations, I a towel covers the front door. And barely ten meters away is her land where she grows passion fruit and plantain.

For the last twenty years she's been harvesting here and selling anything left over at the local market. Chikatuaru uh muraka. She has worked for so many years and she's tired. Yeah, she says that it's too much, like it's extreme pain, like she had pain is extreme due to working hard.

The family had saved up around three thousand pounds to buy a maze store so Daniel's mother wouldn't have to spend every day in the fields. When they told us about one coin, we suddenly changed. Like we saw amazed was something so small compared to one coin. So you thought you could spend the money Not messed up. Right. So that was a quite big decision. It was a very big decision. It was a very big decision. So can she remember that? And you first came to her with one coin and told her about it.

Uh she's saying that it was not easy. She had a lot of doubts, like she was asking a lot of questions in her head. But then when we explained her more and more and more, she started believing, you know, everything would change. Hm. Does does your mother have a computer or a smartphone, anything like that? Oh no. So did she she was your mother was not able to Or when did she learn that this money, maybe that one coin wasn't everything you'd said it was?

The Burden of Concealed Truth

I've never told her confirmed her that it's not going to work, it's not going to work, no. I've never told her about that. Sorry, but what do you mean? You've never actually told her everything. I've never told her directly that it's not going to work. There is no more money. There is no more hope. I've been telling her, it's changing, they keep postponing this, don't know what they are thinking, maybe it's just a delay. But not f one hundred percent full confirmation that you won't write.

It's hard. It's hard to say. You never know. God can help. We get some good money, we start another business, and then she forgets the other stuff. You're still hoping that you won't ever have to tell her because you can make the money up another way. I will make money. Do you think that sh your mother does actually know, really? So can you ask your mother if she thinks, does she believe that maybe she will get some of this money back?

Hey, hey, hey. Yeah, she's saying she still she she still has hope. She says that when she knew that you've started investigating about them, she knew that things are now working out. Even people are coming from abroad to ask about them. So she thinks things maybe we're we're a good sign, w the where is a good sign? Yeah. She's saying you're the whites you've come. If you have information that the money will not come, you tell her. Not so sure. Not sure, but... Maybe you can tell, huh? Maybe.

It's gonna be quite devastate. I don't But I also but also but it's false hope if she thinks we're here because we're gonna say everything's good. Could you tell what about the journalists? Hm. We're investigating this because something's a lot of people aren't getting their money. Yeah. I think that's okay. Is that is that okay for you? Yeah I think it mm. Yeah, Ati Bad Bad Shovel Kugambere. Ever kobakwata Hungon N Badoma BBC BBC News L UK and Biz Rikuchondoza one coin.

ini kok kukanggara namukagar kenyum She's saying that if you have your money and it's taken away from you Life becomes stressful. Like you've been plan planning for something, it doesn't happen, so life is kind hard. Should be very happy if the money comes. Why not coming?

The Reality of OneCoin's Impact

This is the reality of a scam like OneCoin and it Where in the world it is? It's the same thing. everywhere. This anger, of course, But far worse is the embarrassment and the shame. It's hard to admit you've recruited your loved ones into a scam. So they live on in quiet desperation, refusing to give up entirely, half knowing it's over, but preferring to suspend belief a little longer. Um it was a bit s it was a bit strange back at your house.

Daniel, because I was a bit surprised when your mother didn't know everything that you know about this. Did you find that a bit strange? Notre I didn't find it strange. She ain't at the front of the information. So she gets what we tell her. She's researching it online on Facebook or Google. So what we tell her it's what sh sh she will take. But she has uh sounds like she has a bit of hope still. Yes, she still has a lot of hope. I mean

Do you feel bad not telling her about the truth of this? Yes, I feel bad, but uh it would save the negative attitude as of now. But aren't you just putting that off on one day you have to tell her? Yeah. We have a proverb which says that you you you better die tomorrow than dying today.

OneCoin's Denials and Church Links

OneCoin rejects allegations that it is a scam and states that. The series will not present any truthful information and cannot be considered objective nor unbiased. The company also claims that the allegations made about them around the world are being challenged. Stating, Our partners, our customers and our lawyers are fighting successfully against this action around the globe, and we are sure that the vision of a new system on the basis of a financial revolution will be established.

To our claim that one coin is not a cryptocurrency, because outside its ecosystem it has no value, they say Quite obviously, one coin verifiably fulfills all criteria of the definition of a cryptocurrency. Our wish and aim is that one coin can be traded to a much further extent. It's not just friends and families who are promoting one coin in Uganda. We've been told that even some members of a church in Kampala have become involved.

So the next day we go to meet Fred and Tabazi. He preaches at the One Light International Ministry. One coin? One light. One coin? We've been told he promotes one coin to his congregation. The first meeting we had scheduled in Uganda was with Fred, but he didn't turn up. So we found the address of his church and on Sunday turned up and waited outside the building for him to come out. It's got one life in the reception. Oh yeah. An assistant comes down to ask us what we want.

And as she does, we spot Pastor Fred's brand new white Range Rover leaving. Oh is that him leaving? Yeah. In his Range Rover? Hang on. Oh what? You're a distraction. Did you come out here so we didn't see him leave? Bishop Fred. He stops the car and comes over. Hello, uh Jamie from the BBC, hello. We are recording. So what's the relationship between the church and the one one coin?

Ah. But but we we we have seen people in your church promoting one coin. I've s I've seen it on YouTube. Is it not? You can show me. Do you want me to show you? Yes. You know it's it's Simon Simon Lee. You know Simon Lee? Yes. Yes. Simon Lee just came as a visitor, then a visitor.

Bishop Fred's Deceptive Promotions

One light but he was not promoting. So I pull out a video of Simon Lee who's currently the top one coin leader in the church last year. I want you to welcome this brother. Віднам. Simon Lee. He's the most respected person in one life. Welcome, Simon Lee. From no health, no finance. Now they they get better, better financial freedom and uh they take good care of their

This is in this building. Simon leaving. But why would you have him in the church talking about one coin? No, they didn't talk about you see if the visitor comes in your home. They has to introduce him himself. But have your have your congregation invested in one coin? No. People in the congregation haven't invested. They are sick, but they're not me. All these people they are members of one life. Nine seven percent. So, have you made money from OneCoin?

Ki how much money have you made, Kurt? I can't tell but it's many it's much. But Bishop we we're speaking to people who have put money in and lots of money, even in Uganda but other places as well and they're waiting and waiting and waiting. Those who are patient they will go to heaven. Those who are patient will go to heaven. They will go to heaven. They will see God as well. Yes. That that's wh how I teach people.

My problem is you're smiling about it, you're laughing about it. You're also a bishop here and you're meant to be looking after your congregation. And we know people who are struggling really struggling because of this. Many things I've been asking but I've never gone away. So did what message did God give you about one coin? It is gentlemen.

If people stop buying into one coin will you lose money. No, we stopped buying one coin. We don't no longer sell one coin. You're not selling one coin anymore. So you so you don't recruit any you you don't recruit you don't sell we stopped by the I'm telling you the troops. We stopped, yeah. So why does it be? No this is my this is my personal office. is my fo it's my it's my office. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Pastor Fred gets into his Range Rover and drives off with a small motorcade. We knew he wasn't telling us the truth. That's nothing new, but it felt like he knew we knew and didn't care. Maybe I'm living in the old world where the ideal of journalism is that you present your facts and expose some wrongdoing. And Fred is living in the new world where facts are irrelevant. Debrief. Debrief. Alright. We'd managed to get a business card from one of the congregation at the church.

So we asked some people from Kampala to phone up and ask about investing. Bigger part of the conversation was in Luganda, the local land. And Ignatius, our fixer, told us what had been said. We asked about the pastor and the relationship with the Iguanco and he said he's the team leader. Ooh. That's why they call it. He's a team leader. Yeah. So what so what can we conclude from this call?

We could say that we have evidence that one coincided life and Hasta is promoting it because it's the team leader of all the promoters in the office at the Onecoin office on Padre Pio building.

The Age of Hype and Exploitation

This is the side of the amazing digital evolution that you rarely see. We live in an age of hype where so many of us believe in the power of the latest tech to solve the world's problems. Venture capitalists in London boardrooms. Politicians on TV and technologists in Silicon Valley, they all talk up every latest invention. But too much hype and too much hope is a dangerous thing.

It obscures the truth and fogs the mind with delusions. And ten years after that brilliant idea in an obscure internet forum to create Bitcoin. Pipe and hope have helped to decimate villages in rural Uganda. It would be comforting to think that this was just the work of one evil genius. That would be easier to understand and easier to stop.

But Dr. Rouge has identified and exposed the weak points in our social immune system which have allowed this to happen. She knew there would be enough people, either desperate enough, or greedy enough, or confused enough. To take a bet on one coin. She knew that truth and lies are getting harder to tell apart when there's so much contradictory information online.

And she knew that society's defence against OneCoin, the lawmakers, the police, and also us in the press, would struggle to understand what was happening. And she knew that by the time we realized it, she'd be gone. This girl is Maybe above all, Dr. Rouge understood an even more difficult truth. That the difference between a straightforward scam and the complicated but legal world of finance and money isn't as clear-cut as we think.

Think. One coin wouldn't be possible unless we lived at a time when people really do make millions simply by betting on cryptocurrencies. Complicated derivatives and high-frequency currency trading. One coin sounds plausible to so many people because it is plausible. Dr. Rougea pulled off one of the scams of the century, but it was only possible because the conditions were in place. Those conditions are still in place.

The DAGCoin Cycle Continues

The vision which the founders and the chief vision office have I've seen it looks to be different from the rest. Saturday David, the man who first helped us spread OneCoin throughout Uganda, has given up on it. But he hasn't given up on cryptocurrency. He's found a new project. I said I'm not going to be po I say from me and on. In late 2016, three former OneCoin promoters launched a new cryptocurrency called

Stackcoin. You're a very special person. You if you made it all the way here, make sure it's worth it. You empty your cup, you humble your heart, you open your mind, and you learn from the best of the best. Who's ready to do that? Raise your hand. We create our own reality. And that is eigenlijk altijd de start van wat. Het is gold through een multi-level marketingstructuur waar mensen commissions op wat ze sellen. So desperately.

You buy DAGCoin through education packages. What I wanted to do with this short presentation is give you an overview of this success factory compensation plan. Let's look at the program Yeah. You do that. I just don't understand why you need network pack these packages and these network marketing for a cryptocurrency. What's the benefit of that? Why can't you just put it out there and let people buy it straight away? That's that's what has been the challenge.

Look at Bitcoin. Bitcoin is estimated that around maybe 400,000, they own the Bitcoins. And most of those coins, they are owned by those Western world countries. It should be global. With network marketing, I think it is easier because here we have people even who buy coins of whether they are rich or poor or average. the most important is the education that we give. But I look at it and I see so many of the same similarities as OneCoin. You have the same package system, same structure.

The same incentive multi level marketing system, lots of the same people are still involved. I understand you, but you see if you you you you you you have You h you drive a car, you bought a a car, then to get some accident, you can't walk. You get into another one. Yeah, but I wouldn't buy it from the same car dealer. Yes, but these are different car dealers. Maybe the other one was Toyota and this is Mercedes-Benz. And that coin is growing fast.

There are almost twenty thousand people. Twenty thousand people in Uganda invested in DACCOI. Yeah. Can you say how much money you've earned from that coin? Sorry? How much money you've earned from that coin? How much I've earned? Yeah, I've made some commissions. Do you consider yourself technical person?

Ah do I know how how to check my Facebook person to post, do this, that but I I I can I don't know how even to create a group. Given everything that happened with one coin, wouldn't it have been Better when you saw this new coin to say I'm not going to promote this, it's too dangerous, it's too similar to one coin. What convinced me is the technology and the dream.

We believe that with network marketing we reach a lot more different countries and precisely those people who would need to use cryptocurrency. We started with trainings on crypto, finance, trading and rewarded people with coins after the courses. But now people can convert directly, purchase a gift card, purchase from ATM, purchase from other users, sell something to other users, or accept the coins as a merchant.

Generally, network marketing and cryptocurrency can very successfully coexist, and this is what we want to prove with the next few years. We have real developers who are working on real technology and creating real cryptocurrency. Yeah. So when are we joining? When are we When are we joining? As we leave Saturday David's office and walk down the stairs, a young woman rushes out of a room full of people.

A sign next to the door says DAG University. So I want to take you up there and you get more information. And then would you get some commission? Sir? Yes. Yes. Oh right. So you want our commission? That's why you want to talk to us. I want you also to be in the system. Why? Because it's an advantage. So are you ready to join? Yeah. Well we no we're just uh no we're not I don't think no right. Oh yeah. Thank you.

Ruja, The Inverse Satoshi

Ten years ago. Satoshi Nakamoto invented Bitcoin, the world's first cryptocurrency. No one knows where or even who Satoshi is. But it doesn't matter because the idea Satoshi unleashed of financial Freedom through technology is bigger than one person. Dr. Ruja is the inverse Satoshi. She stands for something too, something that's more important than where she is.

Who never have been in this industry join us. They just get excited about innovation. She represents the dark side of rapid technological change. Join the financial revolution, a big part of innovation. Be one of the first adopters. Every new technology creates amazing opportunities and possibilities for people who understand it. But also the chance to exploit the people who don't. Sometimes people even come to me and say, Doctor Rouja, did I miss the opportunity? Is it over? What do we do now?

And the answer is actually this is just the beginning. Whenever new technology collides with familiar human weaknesses, and when the old rules don't seem to work Always be a Dr Rougea. And I thank you very much for being here sharing my vision and just making this happen. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you.

Aftermath and Lingering Search

My name is Daniel Lehnert. Daniel has started a cryptocurrency YouTube channel. I wanted us to talk about scams. Specializing in crypto scams in Africa. Called CryptoSounds. What is a scum? He still hasn't told his mother the full story about one coin. So we are two years down the line. Jen McAdam from Scotland continues to run several victim support groups online and she's trying to get the City of London police to reopen their investigation into OneCoin. It's been some jamaic in the last

Two years. Tim Curry, aka Tim Tation, right now, do you understand? Continues to call out OneCoin and he continues to evangelize about Bitcoin. This is Tim, you're listening to 30 second crypto. is super important because it's the first creation of its kind.

Bjorn Björki, the blockchain developer who blew the whistle on one coin for not having a blockchain. Bjorn, welcome. Welcome to the show. Good to have you here. Thank you for your time. Is now working with companies to detect cryptocurrency fraud. We won't get rid of scams like this. Uh but I think information to people is really important. It's it's important to know what's going on in the world, to not be gullible.

To to be educated. Christy Kalina, the Miss One Life organizer, hello everybody, Christy Kalina and my and many others continue to promote OneCoin. And people are Still investing. Igor Alberts, the master MLM seller with the Swarovski crystals, is now travelling the world promoting DAG coin. Yes, yes, and we are here with a reason ladies and gentlemen because we have to make you an offer that you actually come. We like to bring the real future of payment.

Give the opportunity to let the unbankable become bankable. Make from this world a little bit more transparent and honest place. Konstantin Ignatov's trial for wire fraud in the United States is due to start before the end of the year. Dr. Ruja Ignateva, the missing crypto queen, remains at large.

Crucial New Leads Emerge

And as for me in Georgia? By the middle of last week we still hadn't heard back from the postman in Frankfurt. A few other leads we had were pointing somewhere else, maybe somewhere more obvious, Dubai. OneCoin had an office out there and it would definitely be safer. After seeing what's happening in Uganda, it felt so frustrating to think we would end this story here. Because we felt like we were getting close. Then, five days ago, our phone rang one more time.

Someone who we trust on this. I've been deciding whether I should call you. I've thought about it for two days. Someone who's been looking into this story too. But you came so close. And suddenly It didn't feel like the end anymore. I want to give you some information, but I don't want you to use my voice. You did the right thing by going to Frankfurt, because she really is there. You two came so close, but you need to find the house.

And she'll be laughing. She thinks those journalists that came close, she'll laugh because she thinks she's untouchable. This lady has a lot of guts. She is extremely smart. I have a confirmation. She was there, a Miss One Life, sitting at the table. You've seen her without knowing it was her. Episode 8 cannot be the last because you are able to trace her. If you continue, you will find her. I'm hundred percent sure you will catch her. Whatever we can do to help now, we'll give it to you.

You will find her. The Missing Crypto Queen is presented by me Jamie Bartlett and produced by Georgia Cass. It is written and researched by me, Jamie Bartlett and Georgia Catt. Philip Sellers is the editor, and the music which we think is incredible is by Phil Channel and Desislava Stefanova with the London Bulgarian Choir. Lots of people have been helping us with this series both within the BBC and without, and for different reasons we

I'd like to thank you as well. A lot of you have been getting in touch with us and some of your leads have really changed the direction of our investigation. The Missing Crypto Queen is a BBC Radio Documentaries production for BBC Sounds. Yo, I'm George the Poet.

They told me to tell you that I won five British podcast awards. Um, but don't watch that. I got a buzzer. Don't know what it does. But if you don't make it back, just subscribe to Have You Heard George's podcast right here on BBC Sounds. Let's try out this buzzer quickly. Reagonomics made the projects a place where baser holics wasted profits

Wait, wait, you don't remember Reaganomics, right? America's business plan for the 1980s, which reinvigorated American morale and drove communities like these crazy. Remember Black Spain. We focus on the part of the internet that most people don't know about. It's called the dark web. Undercover. US special agents are on a mission. Move in now. From the BBC World Service, World of Secrets. Follows their shocking investigations.

Att du är klar. Du kan slava igen nu. Nu kan du eller någon annan nyta. شكرا للمشاهدة Gäller för dig som medle. to prime.

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