Coming up on The Mindful Midlife Crisis...
Billy: Out of the 48,000 plus suicides, the rate of suicide was highest among middle-aged white men at nearly 70% of all suicide. It is that last figure that we want to explore today, because we find it so incredibly alarming.
(intro)
Welcome to The Mindful Midlife Crisis, a podcast for people navigating the complexities and possibilities of life's second half. Join your hosts, Billy and Brian, a couple of average dudes who will serve as your armchair life coaches, as we share our life experiences — both the good and the bad — in an effort to help us all better understand how we can enjoy and make the most of the life we have left to live in a more meaningful way. Take a deep breath, embrace the present, and journey with us through The Mindful Midlife Crisis.
(interview)
Billy: Welcome to The Mindful Midlife Crisis. I'm your host, Billy. And as always, I'm joined by my good friend, Brian on the Bass. Brian, how are you doing over there?
Brian: Fantastic, Billy. Thanks.
Billy: You got a rocking replacement shirt. Nice.
Brian: Absolutely. There's no day that's a bad day for a replacement shirt. I just want to let you know.
Billy: You know, we've talked a little bit about your musical taste or our musical taste. Who was your influence to play the bass?
Brian: To play the bass? Actually, I started out as a guitar player. The first time I jammed with anybody, it was a room full of guitar players. So, there's eight guitar players at this get together. Nobody plays anything else. I said, "Well, I'll try the bass. What the hell." So, I ended up trying the bass, and my other buddy went to drums. He was a guitar player, too. Then we formed a band from there. So, it was very accidental that I was a bass player, actually.
Billy: So, was your band with seven guitar players, a bass player, and a drummer?
Brian: No, we just rotated in and out that time. We just got then together with a bunch of buddies. But then, subsequently, I kept just playing the bass. I was like, "This isn't so bad. I'll take the bass."
Billy: So, who were your musical influences to play the guitar?
Brian: I don't think I had any specific influences. I just wanted to play the guitar. I never saw somebody in like, I want to be like him. I just said, "Playing the guitar is cool, so I want to do that."
Billy: Excellent. Excellent. What was your first band called?
Brian: The Buttermilk Five. Because we were all at Perkins at three in the morning, and we're like, "We got to come up with a bad name." Because we had been out, as you can imagine, drinking. We stole it off of the Perkins' menu, The Buttermilk Five.
Billy: Oh my gosh. That is a fantastic band name.
Brian: Yes, thank you. Thank you.
Billy: I would go see the Buttermilk Five.
Brian: The band right after that was For Amusement Only, and that was stolen off of a pinball machine.
Billy: So, what did you guys play?
Brian: Classic rock stuff.
Billy: Got you. Oh, man. The first band that I was in was called The Glory Hogs.
Brian: The Glory Hogs. That's pretty good too, though.
Billy: Yeah, the reason we came up with that because we couldn't have been four more arrogant 20 something musicians. We all rotated. I primarily sing. But then, I also played bass on some songs, and then the guy who was playing bass would move to drums or move to guitar. You know my buddy, Willard.
Brian: Oh, yeah. He was great.
Billy: Yeah, so, he would drum sometimes, or he would sing and play the guitar sometimes.
Brian: He's a talented guy Willard.
Billy: He can do anything.
Brian: He really can.
Billy: He's unbelievable. But then, our buddy, Lee, could just shred on a guitar. Our friend Chris could play bass guitar and drums, but he preferred to play in drums. So, whenever we would play something, somebody would show up somebody else on an instrument. So, we're like, quickly in a glory hog. We just said, "You know what? We're going to call ourselves The Glory Hogs. Because all we're going to do is just upstage people wherever we go.
Brian: The worst thing in the world is coming up with a band name. I'm telling you, it’s awful.
Billy: I love it. I think that's maybe the English teacher in me that I like coming up with the titles for things like that. If anybody's out there and you need a good band name, one, go to Perkins.
Brian: Steal something off the menu.
Billy: Or let me know. Because I'd love to give your band a sweet name. Send me some of your demos.
Brian: You should have been in the room when The Brute Squad was trying to decide on a name. I think we went through 764 different names, including Corrupted Dump Truck. What was it? Oh, there was something about ninjas. The Blues Machine was another incarnation of that band.
Billy: Well, yeah, you guys were Blues Machine before you were Brute Squad.
Brian: Exactly. Right. The Blues Machine. But when it came time to change the name from The Blues Machine to something else, it was — I wish I remember the ninja because it was funny. I'll have to look it up because I have all that information. It was almost impossible for us to decide on the name until The Brute Squad came along. Then we're like, "Oh, yeah. That's it."
Billy: The Brute Squad fits to a tee.
Brian: Oh yeah, it's perfect. It's really perfect.
Billy: Because you guys are all pretty tall, pretty husky guys. It just fits to a tee. I said husky. Matt and Pete, if you're out there, I said Husky because I love you. I miss your faces very, very much. I hope to see you all soon.
So, it's good that we're starting out on a light note today because our episode, it's going to be a heavy one. Because we're going to be discussing suicide, particularly some of the research behind why men, our age, commit suicide. So, before we get started, we just want to share a few things. First of all, remember that in no way, shape, or form are Brian and I experts. We're your armchair life coaches.
Brian: That's right. We've been through a lot of stuff, so we're hoping that our experience could save you some headache.
Billy: Yeah, so, we're just simply going to share this information and share our thoughts on it with you. We'll make sure that we put the research in the show notes so you can pour through it on your own, and you can come to your own conclusions if you so choose.
Brian: I would like you guys to think exactly how I think, actually. You have no latitude to be your own person. Yeah, this is kind of like, did you not know that we were trying to brainwash everybody in thinking exactly like us?
Billy: That's why we have — Brian loves to do his own research. When he comes back and educates you all, you should take that in and be that person. When we say armchair life coaches, what we really mean is that we want you to be exactly like us.
Brian: Yeah, as if we are your gods to worship.
Billy: Have you ever seen the movie They Live with Roddy Piper?
Brian: How could you not see that? The movie was great.
Billy: Yeah, think of us as the black sunglasses.
Brian: That's right.
Billy: That way you can see the signs of conformity. Obviously, we're joking. We're two middle-aged dudes talking about a subject that we feel isn't talked about enough. We hope that this tiny little podcast, with its dozens of listeners, shed some light for you on why suicide — particularly suicide amongst middle-aged men — is a crisis. That's not to say we don't care about other age demographics. We're just focusing on this age demographic because Brian and I, and our friends, are all pretty much in this age demographic. So, it's personal to us.
Brian: We feel as though we can speak with a little authority on that. A little. I emphasize little.
Billy: Very little. If you are an expert, and you want to come on to our show—
Brian: And tell us we're wrong
Billy: —we would welcome that. We would welcome that. Unless your name is Kathleen, then you shouldn't come onto the show and tell us that we're wrong. Because you probably do enough of that at home. So, just take a break. All right. Kathleen, take a break from all that. But we love you. One of us loves you more than the other, just to be clear.
Brian: That's sucky, man. Absolutely.
Billy: If what we discuss in this episode resonates with you—
Brian: Or makes you uncomfortable.
Billy: Yeah, absolutely. Or it evokes emotional response, we strongly encourage you to seek out support. There are a variety of resources available to you. One of the easiest that you can use is calling the Suicide Prevention Hotline. The phone number there is 1-800-273-8255. The phone number is 1-800-273-TALK.
I also took a quick look at what the good people at the National Alliance of Mental Illness have to offer. They actually have an article titled I Need a Psychiatrist/Psychotherapist But I Can’t Afford It. Where Can I Find Affordable Treatment? We linked that in the show's notes, as well. So, feel free to check that out if you're thinking what these guys are talking about. It maybe would be helpful to talk to a therapist. I just can't afford it. Go to www.nami.org. It's www.nami.org if you'd like to learn more about their services.
Brian: The LIVIN Foundation is another really good resource. There's a local DJ, Paul Thomas, here who does just a great job with that foundation and helps a lot of people. He's always very active and very vocal about helping people. So, that's the LIVIN Foundation.
Billy: Is that just locally in Minnesota, or is that nationwide?
Brian: They have a national number, I believe, like an 800 number. But most of the events are local, yes.
Billy: Got you.
Brian: They do concerts. They even have the LIVIN Music Festival. Like I said, he's very active and very out there and very passionate about helping people. We should get him on, too.
Billy: I was just going to say he sounds like a potential future guest.
Brian: He's a good guy, too.
Billy: Finally, if you're concerned about a loved one's mental health or substance abuse, the Mayo Clinic suggests looking for the following warning signs: talking about suicide — for example, making statements such as, "I'm going to kill myself. I wish I were dead. I wish I hadn't been born." — getting the means to take their own life such as buying a gun, or stockpiling pills.
In the next episode, I'm going to tell you about how I struggle with my own mental health and the struggle with suicidal ideation. If I'm being frank, there's a reason I don't own a gun. There's a reason I don't have a gun. Because my fear is that I'd be more inclined to use it on myself than for protection. That's a real fear that I have had in the past. I've worked through that fear, so you don't have to worry about me anymore. But that is something that kind of comes to mind.
If you have ever checked out — I can't remember what book it is by Malcolm Gladwell, but he talks about a correlation between the means of suicide and suicide numbers dropping. If I figure it out, I'll let you guys know what that book is. He's got a lot of them out there.
Brian: Outliers, The Tipping Point, Blink, Talking to Strangers?
Billy: It might be Outliers now that I think about it, now that you've mentioned it.
Brian: Did you see how great of a job I did as the show's producer?
Billy: You did. I appreciate it.
Brian: You were struggling, and I just swooped in and did it.
Billy: That, ladies and gentlemen, is what we call total support.
Brian: You, guys, if you want to witness professionalism, you just look to Billy and I. Okay?
Billy: And if you want to look for two people who support one another, and bring out the best in one another — when I come in and maybe I'm a little down, Brian is there to lift me back up. He is my trampoline.
Brian: As I look at this, Malcolm Gladwell not only has a cadre of helpful books, but his hair is wonderful.
Billy: It's amazing.
Brian: That is really nice.
Billy: His hair is amazing. He is somebody who probably does not have this warning sign — withdrawing from social contact and wanting to be left alone. Because why would you, if you have a hair like that?
Brian: I'm a little jealous. I mean, he's got quite a — it's one of those tight curl stand up hair styles. It's wonderful.
Billy: He's the wild dude. I don't know if you listen too much in Malcolm Gladwell, but he's a pretty wild dude.
Brian: I'm going to now, just because of the hair. Now that I've seen the hair, it's amazing.
Billy: He's got a podcast called Revisionist History. It's very popular. I figured since we mentioned his podcast, then he, in turn, will mention ours. So, I'm putting that out into the universe.
Brian: Quid pro quo. That's fair.
Billy: That'd be great. If your loved one is having mood swings, such as being emotionally high one day and deeply discouraged the next, being preoccupied with death, dying, or violence — right here, that is something that I'll talk about in the next episode — feeling trapped or hopeless about a situation, increasing use of alcohol or drugs, changing normal routine including eating or sleeping patterns, doing risky or self-destructive things such as using drugs or driving recklessly, giving away belongings or getting affairs in order when there's no other logical explanation for doing this, saying goodbye to people as if they won't ever see them again and, finally, developing personality changes or being severely anxious or agitated, particularly when experiencing some of the warning signs listed above.
So, with all that in mind, let's take a look at what's truly become a global pandemic. Here are some staggering statistics around suicide that we found from the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention, and the National Institute of Mental Health websites.
In 2019, 48,344 Americans committed suicide, making it the 10th leading cause of death in the United States. The total suicide rate in the United States has increased by over 35% in the last 20 years. That one's wild to me. In 2019, the US averaged 132 suicides per day. Firearms accounted for over 50% of all suicides in 2019. Suicide was the second leading cause of death amongst 10- to 34-year-olds, and the fourth leading cause of death amongst 35- to 54-year-olds. Out of the 48,000 plus suicides, the rate of suicide was highest among middle-aged white men at nearly 70% of all suicide.
It is that last figure that we want to explore today, because we find it so incredibly alarming. So, the first thing that we're going to do today is take a look at a five-year study, the Samaritans, which is a charity out of Great Britain, dedicated to reducing feelings of isolation and disconnection that can lead to suicide. They conducted this research. They partnered the with Network Rail, which is essentially a railway company in Great Britain. I don't know much about it. But the reason why they partnered together is because they wanted to get a better understanding of the suicide crisis over across the pond.
One thing to keep in mind here as we go through this is, they focused more on middle-aged men in low socio-economic position — blue collar positions, which is most likely why the Network Rail got involved in this. But what they found in the research is strikingly similar to what Brian and I are seeing in our own research that we've poured through in the past as well. We're just trying to make better sense of why so many middle-aged men are finding suicide to be their only way out of a life of loneliness and misery.
At the end of the episode, we will provide their recommendations for reducing suicide in this group of men. So, we will do our best to share all this information as well, so it shines a bright spotlight on the causes of this global health crisis. Because we have friends who are in this age range. This is me, and Brian, right? This is our demographic. Though it's focusing on men, I imagine that you have brothers or husbands. Depending on how old you are who are listening to this, maybe it's a son. It's an uncle. It's a nephew. It's somebody that you love that may be going through something. It's unfortunately common in this age demographic. So, we want to get a better understanding of that.
Brian: If you've reached this age and your life hasn't been touched by suicide in some way, consider yourselves lucky. Because I know both Billy and I have had personal experience with it, unfortunately. It's very common.
Billy: It's brutal. It's brutal for everybody involved. So, really, we're here to offer some insight and, hopefully, maybe a path towards healing. That's what these next couple episodes are actually going to be about. They're not going to be about me hitting puberty, as you just heard my voice. It's not. No, because I've already gone through it.
Brian: But that would be a good story.
Billy: It is. It would be. It's actually not a great story. It is actually very, very sad and pathetic story.
Brian: Well, maybe that would help some people.
Billy: It involves mostly acne and awkwardness. I'm guessing, everybody is. Here's the run of our next few episodes. Remember, keep in mind that I taught English for 15 years, so I always have a lesson plan ahead, and I'm looking forward.
So, this episode is going to talk about the suicide pandemic. Then the next episode is going to talk about my own struggles with mental health, and how I was able to use mindfulness in order to navigate my way out of that. Then we believe we are going to get mindfulness guru, Sarah Rudell Beach from Brilliant Mindfulness, on the third episode in this trilogy.
Brian: That'll be great.
Billy: Yeah, it'd be wonderful because she knows. I practice mindfulness. But she is a legit, certified expert in mindfulness.
Brian: You mean we're getting real experts on the show?
Billy: We are.
Brian: Wow.
Billy: Listen, for a tiny podcast, we're a big deal.
Brian: Moving on up.
Billy: I mean, we have—
Brian: Before we do that, before we go serious though, you gave me a great idea. I think we should start a band, and call it Acne and Awkwardness.
Billy: No, let's call it Puberty. Then our first album will be called Acne and Awkwardness.
Brian: Oh, I like where you're going with that. Yep, absolutely.
Billy: That's going to be good. Here we go. We're going to talk about this serious issue here. Here's what we don't want. We don't want you to think that we're making light of this in any way, shape, or form.
Brian: Absolutely not. But we have an obligation to make this entertaining for you, whilst we're conveying this very serious information.
Billy: Agreed. We'll talk about this. But Brian and I, like we said, we've both been through some of this. Since we've been able to get through the storms, we've weathered the storm, we are able to laugh it off a little bit. Hopefully, you're listening to this. What we don't want is we don't want this episode to turn into an Alice in Chains song. Don't get me wrong. We love Alice in Chains. I love Alice in Chains.
Brian: That could be considered therapy, sometimes.
Billy: Very much so. But when you listen to songs like Nutshell or Dirt, sometimes those sound like suicide notes. Yes, you may go into that. You're able to feel that intensely, and get out of it. We don't want you to hear what we're saying, and the tone that we're saying to be very serious, a matter of fact, and then have that exacerbate some of those feelings of isolation and despair that you currently have.
It's possible that my incredibly nasally voice that sounds like I'm talking on a YouTube video at 1.25 speed, maybe that will drive you crazy. But that's why I've instructed Brian to interrupt me.
Brian: We actually prefer that you listen to this, and realize that at least you're not as big losers as we are, and feel good about yourself. That's what should be happening.
Billy: Do you see how we go from delusions of grandeur, and then just minimize ourselves? That is the roller coaster of—
Brian: This is our broadcasting toolbox on display for you guys, okay?
Billy: Alright. Let's get to the background of this research conducted by the Samaritans. This is really wonderful, thorough, in-depth research. I strongly encourage you to check out the link that is in the show notes just to provide some background. Really, I'm just going to share the summary of what they have here. My apologies to the Samaritans. I'm going to read it word for word, but I'm giving you credit for it. So, these are mostly not my own words. This comes straight from them. So, I don't want them to come to us and be like, "Hey, you're plagiarizing." No, this is all from the Samaritans.
Men from the lowest social class, living in the most deprived areas, are up to 10 times more likely to end their lives by suicide than those in the highest social class from the most affluent areas. Men in midlife are the age group most at risk. The researchers don't really understand enough about why this age group is so vulnerable to suicide. They found that suicide prevention strategies and research tend to come from an individual mental health perspective rather than a social, economic, and cultural perspective.
Brian: I would think that would be — also, it's good. That's counterintuitive. I would think young and old. Because typically, when you think about suicide, you think teenagers or that tumultuous time in your life when you're developing and you don't know who you are, and all that stuff. And old, I could see illnesses. But that's actually quite a fascinating statistic.
Billy: I wonder how much of that in this research is going to tie back to — if you remember, when we talked in the last episode about what a midlife crisis is, there was that bell curve where people are in it. When they're between the ages of 40 and 60, they say that they are not satisfied with their life. But when they get to age 70, 75, and they're asked to reflect on their life, they say that they felt the most productive. They felt the most successful in those times. So, I feel like there's the light at the end of the tunnel. If you're able to get through this, you'll look back on your life, and you'll be able to say it was those times that maybe I didn't feel as fulfilled, or I didn't feel as satisfied that, really, I just had to get through it in order to appreciate it.
So, they identified six characteristics in the men that they researched. The first characteristic here that I'm going to talk about is personality traits. They talked about how there isn't a suicide mentality. but there are certain personality traits and mindsets that contribute to the development of suicidal thoughts. For example, perfectionism, self-criticism, rumination and brooding, or having no positive thoughts about the future.
When I read this, I identified with this entirely. This is really what the next episode is going to be about. Because all of those things that I just listed, those are all things that makes up that personality component of me and the things that I have to struggle with. So then, when those things interact with factors like deprivation, or unemployment, social disconnection, or a triggering event like a relationship breakdown or job loss, then that all becomes this recipe for increasing suicide risk.
Now, they also talked about masculinity, and how that plays a role in possibly being a trait that leads to these men committing suicide here. What they meant by that is, there's the stereotype of the man providing for his family.
Brian: Or the man can handle it whatever comes. You're not a real man unless you can handle it.
Billy: Exactly. The fact that Brian and I are here talking about our feelings, it's probably the least manly thing that we could do. Because men don't talk about their feelings. That's a woman thing. Actually, Brian, I'm kind of curious. I've asked you this before. But you're the provider for your family, correct?
Brian: Yeah.
Billy: Does that create any undue stress for you?
Brian: No, because I've embraced the role, you know what I mean? I realized that when before I had children, it was going to be my responsibility to take care of them. You know what I mean? Of course, my wife — I have one of the best partners in the entire world. She is so amazing. I can't tell you enough how much she does. It's so amazing. Every day, she amazes me. But no, I've internalized it, so there's no conflict for me. I know it's my responsibility. I've internalized it. That's what I'm going to do no matter what.
For me, it's not how I go about that. Fortunately, I haven't been put in a position to wonder about that for a long time. But with the pandemic, that stuff comes into play. Oh my gosh. What if something happens, and I don't have a job, and I'm not able to take care of my family? But you take the best steps you can to ensure that your future is going to be what you want it to be.
Billy: I'm always impressed with how positive you approach your relationships, just the mental fortitude that you have as you approach anything in life. Nothing really seems like a conflict for you, because you see it as opportunity.
Brian: Winston Churchill actually had a quote. It was something to the effect of, "The pessimist will see problems in every opportunity, and the optimist will see opportunity in every difficulty."
Billy: I think that fits you to a tee. So, the one thing that is interesting in here that I think also connects with you — and this is going to be an episode that we're going to save for down the road — is men more so than women respond to stress by taking more risks. They are more inclined to misuse alcohol and drugs. That use can lead to becoming violent or even lethal. So, we're going to take a look at that somewhere down the road.
Relationship breakdown, this is something that spiraled me out of control many, many years ago. I've never been married. But just having someone break up with you that's, that's no fun. It really is just no fun.
Brian: Well, I don't know. If she's awful to you, maybe it could be fun.
Billy: The funny thing is that I had someone who was not nice to me. Even still, that breakup was not fun. I think that just carried over into that.
Brian: If you're not initiating it, that can be tough on the ego.
Billy: So, I'm reading through this. This is kind of interesting here. It says that some suicides in men are motivated by the desire to punish their ex-partner, or maybe an impulsive reaction to an ex-partner beginning a new relationship.
Brian: Oh, I could see that. Absolutely.
Billy: I can identify with that as well. Because just that thought of them being with somebody else had spiraled me into really deep, dark thoughts. So, I just found that fascinating. That was another thing that jumped out to me as something I connected with my own personal life.
It says here that men are more likely to be separated from children. This plays a role in some men's suicides. I think about the parents at the school where I'm at. If I look and I see two different addresses, then I know that most likely they have two families. If I talk to those students, a lot of times, they're at mom's most of the time. Then they go to dad's maybe on the weekend or just a couple days a week.
Brian: That seems to be pretty typical. I wouldn't say my experience.
Billy: For you, I'm curious to hear the role that the children play, your children. You have three boys. What do they play in your life?
Brian: Well, they're the most important thing to me in the entire world. Of course, I could see how that would be a contributing factor. Again, that goes right along with the punishment aspect of this, too — to punish the partner. Because the kids will be upset that, obviously, that person is not there anymore. That all makes perfect sense.
Billy: It feels so almost sinister that someone would think that, but that just goes to show just how emotionally damaged that person is.
Brian: And desperate. I mean, it is. Suicide is an act of desperation.
Billy: It ties into the next point that they made about emotional illiteracy. Men can experience a big build that they don't recognize because they don't know how to express it. They don't know how to communicate it, and it all gets to a breaking point. Then that breaking point leads to something dire. Men are far less positive about getting formal emotional support for their problems compared to women. They see it as a weakness to ask for help, to talk about their emotions.
I remember years ago — this wasn't in the last 10 years, but it was maybe 15 years ago. It's something like that. I was having a conversation with my dad about maybe getting some emotional, maybe going to therapy. His response was something to the effect of, "Therapy is what? Nutjobs. That's what therapy is for, it's for nut jobs." I was like, "That might be me, dad. I hate to break it to you. Sorry."
It says here that working class men and women remain much more likely than other groups to be prescribed pharmaceutical drugs to deal with problems in their emotional lives. We see certainly an overmedication pandemic, as well, particularly in the United States.
Brian: That is a very important factor in this, too, I think, in why suicides are the way they are. Because this medication is over prescribed. Anytime you're messing with the chemistry of your brain, especially with it as advanced as some of these chemicals are and what they can do to you, it's really not surprising.
Billy: One of the factors is socio-economic factors. I wonder how much of that plays a role in people having access to affordable mental health care.
Brian: Oh, sure.
Billy: Since they can't get that, then they just go to the magic pill.
Brian: Yeah, everybody wants a pill that makes whatever malady it is to go away. Look at all this stuff. You can get a pill for damn near anything. If you have toe fungus, or hairy ankles, or whatever the hell you get, they usually just prescribe you a pill.
Billy: If you have hairy ankles, you should get a pill.
Brian: I agree with you, yeah.
Billy: I have baby soft feet. Because there's really nothing manly about me. Listener, as you get to know me, you're going to realize, "That is the most feminine dude on the face of the earth. He likes books and poetry and walks along the beach. This is not a tough guy." I'm not. I'm not in any way, shape or form.
Brian: I am more of the traditional guy.
Billy: Yes, and I feel like we're a very good balance for each other.
Brian: Yeah, right. Exactly. The yin and yang, as you were saying.
Billy: Yeah, we were talking before the show. If you haven't figured out maybe the format of the show, I'm the straight guy. I'm the play by play, and Brian is the color analyst.
Brian: That's true.
Billy: So that we have a good flow here. We think anyway maybe you've already tuned out. We're sorry.
Brian: And you're not hearing this anyway. So, screw you if you tuned out.
Billy: Exactly. But if you are listening, thank you.
Brian: Thank you. We love you.
Billy: Thank you. Please share this podcast with your friends.
Brian: Here, let's do something real quick. I'm going to show you the power of just talking about your feelings. Let's do a little experiment here. Wherever you are, listener, I'm talking to you now. I'm not talking to you, Billy. I'm talking to the listener. I want you to just pause. Pause this after you get the instruction that I'm going to give you. I want you to pause it, and do what I say. See if it changes your feelings at all about yourself.
I want you to pause it, and I want you to scream "I am awesome." Go ahead do it. Push pause and just scream I'm awesome. Well, let's do it. Go ahead. Okay. Now, how do you feel? Do you feel better? You should. Because you're awesome.
Billy: I was just visualizing that, and it made me just smile.
Brian: Exactly. That's a small exercise. Just talking about stuff can oftentimes alleviate a lot of the pressure you're feeling. It may not get rid of it, but it does alleviate the pressure. So, to Billy's point, sometimes seeking therapy is not just — you don't necessarily have to be damaged or anything like that. But it's very natural for people when they talk about stuff to feel better about it, to get it out there.
Billy: That connects to the last thing here. We've touched about challenges of midlife. Did you ever watch Louis C.K.'s Louie? Did you ever watch that?
Brian: Probably a while ago.
Billy: Okay. When he's doing the stand up bit, he's talking about how he made a new friend at his age. Just funny because it is weird to make a new friend when you're 40, 45 years old. Usually, you're just friends with the people in your neighborhood.
Now, Louann — Is it Brizendine? I think it's Louann Brizendine. She has two books. One is called The Male Brain. One is called The Female Brain. We're actually going to talk about those books here at some point in time, down the road. Louann, if you're listening — I mean, you probably are — we would love to have you as a guest on our show and talk about those books, because you're a brain expert.
But one thing she talked about is that, women have a need for developing peer relationships, where men are more independent. As this research says, beyond the age of 30, men have fewer supportive peer relationships than women do. Usually, it's the woman. They usually turn to their woman, their partner, for emotional support, which then goes back to if you're experiencing relationship breakdown — which would lead to an emotional breakdown because you don't have that comfortable resource available to you.
Brian: I would like to say Louann Brizendine hair is also great.
Billy: Is it?
Brian: Yeah, not in the way Malcolm Gladwell's hair is. But she's got — in this picture, anyway — a very nice red hair. It's gorgeous. She's gorgeous.
Billy: I feel like that keeps in the theme with the two of us, because we both have great hair.
Brian: That's also true.
Billy: That is not a lie. Ladies, do you want a guy with really nice, salt and pepper black hair? Because Brian's married, but the other guy isn't.
Brian: That's right. And you know all of his secrets now. There's going to be no surprises any longer.
Billy: Man, how about this? If that does interest you, maybe don't listen to the next episode, unless you're attracted to complete nutjobs and head cases.
Brian: Which that's another episode all together.
Billy: Very much so. We'll get to that. No secrets here. But here's what we're going to do now. We're going to take a break. Then when we come back, we're going to talk about what the research recommends in order to address these situations when they arise, and what also larger scale communities can do in order to provide support for middle-aged men and middle-aged women who are experiencing suicidal ideation. Thank you for listening to The Mindful Midlife Crisis.
(break)
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And now, let's take a minute to be present with our breath. If you're listening somewhere safe and quiet, close your eyes and slowly inhale for 4, 3, 2, 1. Hold for 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. Slowly exhale for 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. Let's do that one more time. Inhale for 4, 3, 2, 1. Hold for 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. Slowly exhale for 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. Go ahead and open your eyes. You feel better? We certainly hope so. And now, back to the show.
(interview)
Billy: Alright. Welcome back everybody. Thank you. I hope you went and did something that was refreshing because we just got done having that suicide conversation. Maybe you yelled I am awesome.
Brian: If you're still doing that, just stop it. Okay? You're awesome. But if you've done it more than three times, now it's becoming an ego problem. Okay? So, just ease off on that. You are awesome. We love you, but you can stop telling everybody that. That's funny you say that because that's exactly what I was going.
Billy: Oh, man. Alright. How do we get governments, and how do we get health and welfare and social services to take on this challenge of helping people — particularly disadvantaged men in their midlife — get access to resources?
So, here is what the Samaritans' research recommends. Again, this is coming from the Samaritans' study that we've been talking about in this episode. The first thing that they recommend is to take on the challenge of tackling the gender and socio-economic inequalities in suicide risk. So, I think what they mean by that here is, they should explicitly aim to reduce these inequalities, that they should target these demographics. They don't go into a lot of detail about how to do that.
Now, I'm not going to lie. I'm not a gender study or a socio-economic professor. I think that is a rather complicated task to take on. I don't know that I have an answer for that. I have my political views. I'm not going to run rampant with those. I have ideas where we could handle that. But that definitely sounds like one of the more challenging recommendations that they provided.
Brian: It's for people much smarter than us.
Billy: Exactly. So, we'll leave that to them. Suicide prevention, policy, and practice must take account of men's beliefs, concerns, and context. So, this is where Louann Brizendine would really come in handy. Because her book really breaks down how men process and why men behave the way that they do.
I think taking a look at the male brain and understanding what motivates the male brain. It says, we need to move from blaming men for not being like women. This is actually very interesting here. We need to move from blaming men for not being like women in terms of being open about sharing their feelings. Instead, we need to recognize their needs, and how societal expectations get in the way of men getting support. We need to understand why men behave the way that they do, and how societal expectations shape their actions. It says we need to remove barriers to men engaging with services, and design these to be more effective for men.
That's very interesting. To me, that's really attempting to understand why men act the way that they do. It really does. In my opinion, it really does get to the heart of those two — The Male Brain and The Female Brain books. I would check those out if you haven't checked those out. Brian and I will talk about the books that we read on here, just because it makes for an easy conversation. But we also want to recommend books to you that we feel are going to make you a better midlifer. You know what I mean? Because that's one of our goals. One of our goals is to help you get the most out of the second half of your life.
Number three here talks about, recognize that for men in midlife, loneliness is a very significant cause of their high risk of suicide. We need to help enable men to strengthen their social relationships. We said number one was for people who are smarter than us. Number three, all of us can help in some way, shape, or form. I'm willing to bet that we all know men who are in their 30s, 40s, and 50s who live alone, or maybe they've become recluse. Maybe you haven't heard from them in a while. As I'm saying this, I'm thinking of two or three friends that I haven't done a very good job of connecting with. Especially in COVID times, we're really feeling isolated.
Brian: No doubt. I mean, that has to amplify everything. People, I think, are talking about that more and more on how these unintended hidden problems that arise because of the lockdowns and stuff like that. Absolutely. That's got to be a huge contributing factor.
Billy: Quite frankly, I look forward to my Fridays with Brian when we record, because it's an opportunity for me to interact with an adult. Most of my interaction is with teenagers. It's different interacting with an adult. It's different interacting with someone who's not a colleague.
Brian: Oh yeah. Exactly. Social versus professional — two completely different sets of rules.
Billy: When I walked in, Brian was rocking out some black flag. Because he and I both love Uncle Henry, we were talking about when we went and saw Uncle Henry when he came to Burnsville and did his talking show.
Brian: If you guys have an opportunity to hear Henry Rollins talk — I don't care if you've heard of Henry Rollins, if you're a fan of his music, if you hate his music. Put all of that aside, and go see his show. The one Billy and I saw, it was like a good friend sitting around, telling you about their travel adventures.
He just outlined, "This is what happened when I was in this country. This is the situation that came up. These situations are fantastic." He was telling about how he wound up freezing on a train in Siberia one time, and how he was in the DMZ in North Korea. He's been in all these crazy places, and has pictures and stories around these trips. It's so fascinating.
Billy: If you want, you can actually play a drinking game in this podcast where you take a drink every time we talk about how amazing Henry Rollins is.
Brian: It's true. Drink. Right.
Billy: In fact, of all the imaginary guests that we will have on our show, he's number one on the list.
Brian: Oh yeah, for sure. There's a standing offer right now. Henry Rollins, if you ever want to come on this show, we will give you an easy chair and a microphone.
Billy: We will pay for you to get here.
Brian: Yeah, absolutely. Done deal.
Billy: What do you want? Do you want a hotel room? Do you need a flight out here? Let us know. We'll make the arrangements. By we, I mean, Brian, because he has a multimillion-dollar corporation.
Brian: You know what, Bill? I think this is a real landmark for us as our podcast just got significantly upgraded. We now have a budget. So, we just went from a rinky-dink outfit to pro, baby.
Billy: Listen, I told you the delusions of grandeur.
Brian: Things are happening, my friend.
Billy: Absolutely. We are the Walter Mitty of podcast.
Brian: Oh, wow. From The Secret Life of—
Billy: Yes, indeed. Okay. Moving on here to some of the other recommendations. They suggest that we need to identify the explicit links between alcohol reduction and suicide prevention strategies, that we need to address the relationships between alcohol consumption, masculinity, deprivation and suicide. People who struggle with alcohol, I can only imagine that it's a depressant. Most likely, if you're abusing it, it's having an impact on the way that you approach the stress that you have in your life. I know that. It has affected me. Brian, you've got a hell of a story—
Brian: Oh, yeah.
Billy: —that you'll share with us. So, if you're struggling with that, you're struggling with alcohol addiction or abuse, we have resources. There are resources out there. In fact, I have one right here. It is the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration. You can contact them at 1-800-662-4357. It's 1-800-662-HELP.
Brian: Also, 866-293-7031 is also another number you can use, if they feel more comfortable doing that one. I also call the 867-5309 number, and now I have crabs. Okay. That last part wasn't true, but the first part was.
Billy: Oh, my goodness. Well, if you need a general practitioner—
Brian: The number is — that's out of our scope, Billy.
Billy: Actually, what the general practitioners could help with the crabs, or what we need to do is we need to give general practitioners the ability to recognize signs of distress in men.
Brian: There you go. That's helpful.
Billy: Yeah, so we need to be able to coordinate that, or we need to be able to provide them with the resources and education in order to be able to identify those stressors in men, rather than just referring them to — or to be able to give them an opportunity to refer them to a therapist.
I imagine that if I'm a general practitioner and if I'm listening to your heartbeat, and I noticed that there's something irregular in your heart, then I'm able to refer you to a cardiologist, right? Well, if you're listening to somebody, and they're showing signs of distress, or they're talking about signs of distress, are we able to refer them to a therapist as opposed to prescribe them a pill?
Finally, here it says, provide leadership and accountability at the local level, so there is action to prevent suicide. So, this sounds like a grass root recommendation right here. I'm just going to read this. It says, an appropriate public body must have the responsibility to lead and coordinate action across agencies, and the third sector at local level. What I'm understanding here is, we need to have not just large-scale agencies. We need to have local agencies that are on the ground floor addressing this suicide pandemic.
It says here, it's essential if we are to achieve the joined-up approach necessary to tackle the many difficulties faced by disadvantaged men, areas of socio-economic deprivation should be prioritized. I feel like that's what our city councils should be addressing. It's the socio-economic issues.
If we are able to address maybe that larger scale, then we're able to have a positive impact, not just on mental health and suicide prevention but having more successful schools and greener parks, and what have you, safer communities, what have you. City Councils, the ball is in your court to address some of these areas of socio-economic deprivation, so that we're able to live our best lives.
Ladies and gentlemen who are listening still, hopefully, you made it through this entire episode. Our goals here are to help you live your best life. We are the armchair life coaches to help you live that best life. We thank you for taking the time to listen to us today. Tune in the next episode when I bare my soul to all of you, and let you know my own struggles with suicidal ideation, depression, anxiety, OCD-like tendencies, all around nutjob behaviors.
Brian: Billy, I'm glad you're still here, man.
Billy: Hey, I'm glad I am, too. Because otherwise, we wouldn't get to see Henry Rollins together.
Brian: That was worth staying alive for, right?
Billy: 100%. And so is The Mandalorian episode that I'm going to go home and watch right now.
Brian: Oh, my gosh. I got two of them yet. I’m up through the last two, so I'm also going to watch it.
Billy: They're so good. I cannot wait. For Brian, this is Billy. May you feel happy, healthy, and loved. Take care friends.
(outro)
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