Ever wonder how some businesses just seem to grow their email lists seemingly overnight? Well, today, we're diving into one of the best kept secrets of email list growth, bundles. We're gonna talk about why offering value pack bundles isn't just for funsies and for freebies, but it's actually a really strategic move to building your list and finding new people, making deeper connections with your people. So we're gonna get into this episode of the mindful marketing podcast.
But first, I have to give a shout out to our sponsor today, Riverside. Riverside is the virtual recording studio we use to record this Very Here podcast, especially if you're watching on YouTube. What I love about Riverside is that we have not only the audio version, but the video version of the podcast. Their magic editing makes editing like Chef's Kiss super easy and
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get 15% off. Alright. With that, welcome to episode 329 of the Mindful Marketing podcast. Kate, welcome to the show. I'm so excited to be here. And, yeah, reverse that is great, I have to say. Yes. I'm loving it. It's making my job a whole lot easier. And I'm excited for this conversation because we were talking before this how we have been in the same circles. We have similar, like, friends overlapping
and this is, like, our first time really, like, hanging out. So I'm excited to just get to know you a little bit better and pick your brain all about bundles. But before we dive into bundles, you weren't always a bundles person. Give us the background, the Kate Duster background. Where did you start your business, and how do you get to today? Sure. So I'll I'll try to keep it short, but I feel like everyone that's been on the Internet for a 1000000 years, their story is
also a 1000000 years. So I originally started my business way, way back, and I think it was, like, 2015. I gotten fired from my banking job in 2012 for giving birth because here in the United States, they don't like to protect pregnant women so much, especially not in 2012. I had been at the my job at the bank for 11 months, and you have to be some place a year in order to have job protection. So I didn't, and they're like, yeah. You have to come back in 3 days or you're fired.
And not, like, laid off, like, sure. I'm terminated, and I had an emergency c section. I almost died on the table. Like, I couldn't even walk by myself on day 3, so that wasn't gonna happen. And, unfortunately, when we sat down and did the math because my husband was in human services, we would actually be losing so much more money if I went out and got a job rather than relying on the social services that we have here on the state. So, like, I was on WIC. I was on food stamps. We had the
health insurance through the state. Like, I must say, like, I signed up for everything that we possibly could because, again, he was in social services, so he wasn't making that much money to be able to support us. He tried us hardest, though. And so, like, a lot of moms, when you end up staying at home, especially when you've always been kind of a go getter, your brain melts a lot. So I'm like, I've gotta do
something. So I started out, like, 98% of us with a blog, and then just through Facebook groups were huge at the time. And through there, I found out that I was actually really good at this thing called copywriting, which I didn't even know was a thing. It was just like people would be posting, like, their landing pages or their sales pages, and they'd be like, oh, can, like, someone tell me, like, what you think of this? Like, I would just rip people's stuff apart because it was awful.
So I found it. It was a thing. I actually got under another copywriter, and I did that for a while, and then I went out on my own because, again, I, you know, I took some great courses. I love copy hackers. It's still one of the best investments I've ever made, But I also made sure to find a mentor to work under them, to be able to provide a good service and not just be like, oh, I happen to be good at this one audience. And then, like a lot of service providers, I'm like, I wanna do one to
many, so that's how I switched to courses. And what was happening is that I mean, everyone tells you this, but when you switch to courses, you need a much broader audience than you do for services. So I had extremely high conversion rates, but I had the issue of getting into the new people, the like, growing the email list because my email is converted, my sales converted, my launch was converted, but it was still just launching to a tiny audience constantly. And that's when I stumbled upon the
concept of running bundles. Back then, it was the first one that I had ever seen. It was actually called the coach's toolkit giveaway, and I am from New England. I was living in Rhode Island at the time, and it turns out the lady that was running it lived 10 minutes away from me. And, like, there are no online business owners I've ever heard of. So her being 10 minutes away, like, I
saw her address at the bottom. I'm like, holy crap. So I messaged her, and we actually became really great friends, and we still chat now. And so I was like, after, like, I was, again, like, all participants, like, someone who registered, it was like, this is just brilliant. I was like, can I run my own? Like, do you mind? And she's like, no. Absolutely not. She's like, let me throw in something too. And so that's where it got started. The very first one to run was the back to business bundle
giveaway. We since took out the word giveaway because people confused it with a sweepstakes. So just free bundles where it's at, and that was back in 2019. So we've been running them for, like, 5 years, 5 or 6 years at this point, and they just work like gangbusters, and they work really well for your contributors. And I think that people they'll see, like, those, like, mega super bundles with, like, over a 100 some odd people,
and you're like, oh my goodness. Like, I could never do that. I'm like, I've done that, and I wouldn't suggest that you do do that unless you have a team behind you, because and one of the things that I'm sure we'll talk about, you can have amazing results when you just even have, like, a couple of your friends getting together and doing this. Because instead of just, like, you by yourself promoting yourself to no one, because, again,
algorithms don't like you when you're new. SEO doesn't like you when you're new. And I know with Google AI, SEO people are like, ah, losing their minds because of all the auto answers going on. But with a spondyl, it's like, for a limited time, for, like, a week, everyone is just pointing people towards you, and you also get to introduce your audience to great people. It's just such
a win win scenario, whether you're doing a free one or a paid one. Like I said, I'm a really big fan of free ones, especially for early on in your journey, but I'm sure you have a lot of bundly questions. I'll, like, laugh because I could talk about them forever. Yes. I do. First of all, I wanna acknowledge, like, how shitty it is to literally just give birth and that not be like, not have the support. And it's it's so it's so wild that there's still
challenges with that today in 2024. So anyways, sorry that you had that happen to you, and also it opened up the business. So, well, there you go. There's a silver lining. But, one of the things that one of the place I wanna start with this conversation is just defining what a bundle is. Because if someone's listening and they're like, okay. Cool. But, like, what are we even talking about? Can you explain what a bundle is and how it actually helps with the list growth piece? Sure.
So you're going to get together with anywhere. I've had some students run bundles, so that was just 4 other people. It was just, like I said, 4 other friends, and or up to, again, a 100. I always say, like, shoot for that sweet spot, like, around 15 for your first one if you can. Some people drop off. But, basically, what happens is for a limited time,
I always suggest just, like, a week. The bundle is open, and, essentially, what's gonna happen is everyone is going to push their audiences towards the registration page or the checkout page. Talk about the difference between free and paid in
a minute. And once people go ahead and sign up, we're just gonna say this is a free bundle, then those people are going to be brought to what we call, like, a bundle claim area, and everyone is going to be able to claim items that either people are selling as, like, trip wires, or I always call it trip wire or better things completely for free if it's a free bundle. If it's a paid bundle, usually, you can get people to put in more
premium products that they sell for a much higher price point. But the whole point in running this bundle is basically you are going to help everyone grow your email list. One of the requirements that we have and that we teach our students and I see a lot out there because a lot of students now running bundles. It's like, it just if it's gonna be a free bundle, it can't be an
item that people can get for free on your website. Like so say that you've got, like, a normal webinar that you do or, like, I have a to your worth of email ideas, PDF. Like, you can't submit that to a bundle because it's not special. You want to be able to, with your full chest and integrity, say, you're going to be able to sign up for these 5, 10, 20 items completely for free, and you can't get all 20 of
these for free anywhere else on the Internet. And that's why people get so excited, and that's why, as a host, you're gonna get a whole bunch of new email subscribers. Usually, your item is first on the page, and you can highlight yourself. And your contributors are going to be able to get all of these eyeballs on them because everyone's collectively promoting it to their list, and they can grow it. So it's like, you as the host are
making great connections. You as a contributor are getting to grow your email list. We're really big, which is nice. You can get anywhere from a couple hundred to over a1000. Again, it depends on the size of the bundle of the audiences that people are bringing. But, usually, you can bet on at least a couple of 100, and the audience wins because they're getting exposure to all of these new amazing things that they probably wouldn't have found on their own. Or if it's
a free bundle, they wouldn't have necessarily been able to afford on their own. And same thing even with paid bundles as well. So that's kind of the whole premise. It's basically, you finally have somebody on your side pulling that tug of war for attention of, like, actually pointing people to you. You don't have to rely, like I said, on an algorithm or on giving
money to Zucks and being like, maybe my ads will work, maybe not. Right? Like and there's nothing wrong with ads, but it's just another way to get a huge influx of people and attention. Yeah. I agree. And one of the this one of the main ways I've grown my list as well outside of ads and social and all of that over basically, since the pandemic is when I started participating in bundles and
things. And I've gotten a lot of like, that's where a lot of my email list growth has come from is from these bundles because people sign up for the bundle, and then they sign up for whatever my free thing is. Like, I have a few, like, $9 to $17, like, little products that I'll put in bundles. People will sign up for it for free, and then now they're on my email list. They're my world. And the thing that I love about this too is they also get to experience what a paid product is like from me.
So I did one last year, where I contributed a offer that I had just made. And, for the first time, I put, like, a testimonial thing at the end, and I got so much good feedback. I was like, just from, like, the testimonials alone, I would definitely do this again because it was like it just felt good for people to, like, go through my stuff and be like, this was awesome. And I'm like, it is awesome. So Right? I can cross promote
other things. And I always say and this is again, coming from somebody that was on welfare and all of the things, I really do feel like bundles can change people's stars. Yes. I'm stealing that line from A Knight's Tale, everyone. But it really can, because it can change you as a host if you're not actually gaining traction. It can change you as a contributor because now, like you said, you actually now have all the social proof that you're
gonna need for your brand new product. So when you go to launch it or to put ads behind it and update the sales page, you've got all this legit testimonial of how great it is. You can screenshot it and put it on there, not just type in the words. So now it's gonna help with that product, and
it's gonna get you more customers. And like I said, all those people that either got it for free or at a discount because you are in a paid bundle, now they have an opportunity to succeed where they might not have been able to. And I'm like, this is, like, just the ultimate win win win win strategy. I'm like, there are very few downsides when it comes to hosting a bundle
or being in a bundle. Yeah. Okay. I have some very specific follow-up questions that may or may not be for me specifically, but I feel like the listeners are gonna get a lot from this. So one of the challenges I found with bundles is that the people who are signing up are getting so much free stuff that sometimes
I feel like my stuff could get lost in the mix. So when we're thinking about participating in bundles, how do we choose a product of ours that kinda stands out against what everyone else is contributing to the bundle? I love this question. So when it comes to you choosing a gift, whether you're participating or you're the host, because you still need to put something into a bundle if you're the host too. Like, you still need that product. I think that it is always important, and I know it's
gonna sound so silly. But make sure on your end that the product that you're picking is a really good representation of the bigger products that you have. So for example, I have, like, one product on productivity. It's called, like, Trello magic, because your girl's got ADHD, and that's the only thing that I found productivity. It's called, like, Trello magic, because girls got ADHD, and that's the only thing that I found that can wrangle my brain. And I have tried them all. Right? But
I don't have any other things related to, like, ADHD or productivity. And so, like, people can like my style, and they can like Trello, but it's kind of a big leap to go from, oh, I learned how to organize my business from this person to I wanna learn how to host bundles from this person, or I want to learn how
to sell to my email list from this person. So you have to be strategic in making sure that you're not just, like, throwing in, like, some random paid workshop that you did once that has nothing to do with your bigger ecosystem. Or, like, you had done, which was really smart. You knew you wanted this new product. You knew you wanted to be known for it, and you knew you needed testimonials. You're like, I'm gonna put this in there so that way I can get
people to be able to go through it. So when you're picking something for yourself, you wanna be really strategic in a lot of where are they gonna go afterwards. And I call this the bundle on ramp system, so that's really important. The second thing is you wanna make sure that you are picking a product even if, again, it's a smaller product. It doesn't have to be like your $2,000 course that you're putting in a bundle for your pay. Right? You wanna make sure that it's solving a really
sexy problem. You just don't want it to be something that's sort of generic sounding. You want it to be like whether or not the bundle host makes it so items are searchable, which we can talk about what tool I use for that after if you'd like to, or not. You wanna make sure that when people are scrolling through, looking at all this stuff, they see yours, and instantly, they're like, yes. 100%. So that comes down
to the title, which we've had actual contributors, like, tweak their titles. Those are courses from it. And this is another one to be able to really stand out and not get lost in the shuffle you might not think about. Make sure the mock up for your product looks great. I'm talking about it looks professional. The branding is great. It's not just like you threw up. Like, some, like, Canva where it's like, I don't know. Make me a logo, and it's like this, like, square image or, like,
this awful coloring. Because people really do still buy with their eyes first. So, like, take the time to take the screenshots to make sure your branding looks really nice. I mean, your example of ours, it really stands out in our free bundle as well. So it's like, make sure that mock up looks really great. Make sure that the title looks good. And actually spend some time on the description as well. So that way, it
sounds punchy and catchy. Because, again, because bundles are more prominent you're welcome, everyone you need to make sure that your item is always going to stand out. Now not all hosts like myself, we try to do especially for a free bundle, we try to do one expert per topic. So that way, like, you're not competing with any other person. Some bundle host, it's just like the more the merrier, so you're not gonna have that aspect. So that's why you need to think
to yourself, okay. I don't know if I'm gonna be going against, you know, 8 other people that talk about Facebook ads. So what really juicy hook or subtitle can I add to this? Or how can I make my mock up a little bit better? How can I make the, you know, the landing page or the sales page where these people are gonna land look a little bit more posh, look a little bit cooler? And you wanna go ahead and do that. So, again, make it look nice, really catchy title and sub
headline, and, like I said, that really nice mock up is gonna help. I'm making sure that it's part of a bigger picture, and it's not just, like, a throwaway thing that's gonna be so hard to connect people to different offers that you have. Yeah. Okay. I wanna talk about the different offers too because, there's a piece to this where, yes, people are signing up for free and you're growing your list, but you could also, like, very immediately make money from this. Right? So Oh, a
100%. Yeah. So with my so the offer I'm talking about is be your own b roll. I I often I I created this last year. Okay? And it's one of my most popular products because it's so specific and people are like, oh, yeah. I get it right away. But I've been testing out different order bumps and
tripwire. So order bump meaning, you know, someone signs up for the free thing, but if they add something to their order, kinda like grabbing M and M's before you check out at the grocery store, then, you know, obviously, I get that. And then when on the thank you page, I'm like, thank you. Here's your product.
And if you wanna go further, here's something else. But is there is there a strategy to this for, like, order bumps, trip wires that can really help, especially, again, since there's, like, a 1000000 people signing up for your stuff? Is there a strategy for, like, standing out with the order bumps and upsells and tripwires and all that? I think that it's just making sure that it makes sense. So I think that everyone and, actually, our mutual friend, Lainie Lamar, back
she was in one of our bundles. I think it was in 2020 or 2021. She had a whole podcast episode and a whole blog post breakdown about the conversion rates that she got from our free bundle versus what they standard got. And, like, yes, it's a little bit lower, but it still was above industry average for what she was getting. So you want to think to yourself,
you can't be, like, psyched up, like, oh my goodness. Like, I talk about social media, and so many other people in this, but I also have to talk about social media. They'll never buy from me. You need to just think about, like, okay. If somebody is really excited for b roll content, what do I have or what can I offer that is that next logical step? Again, these are all just sound principles. So it's like, they might have the b roll, but maybe they don't know what the caption is.
So if I have some premade captions, I can put that as the order bump because it makes a lot of sense. Regardless if there happens to be other templates that are in the bundle, like, you can't necessarily think about that. If there is, there is. I highly thought you're gonna get them and be like, oh, it
turns out that Jessica had these for free. Like, I want a refund. No one's gonna say that because they just got one of your great courses for free anyway, so they kinda feel like I feel like a butt face if they did that. Let's be real. So you're like, okay. So we've got our BOA product that we have. We've got our order bumps, say, captions, because they're gonna be like, oh, what do we actually write with these things? So then for your actual upsell on your thank you page, like, wow.
They're gonna need people to talk to. So maybe that's when you would offer either a discount or full price however you want to, a course or an offer that you have about actually growing your audience. Right? So that way, it's like, oh, this logically makes sense. Well, it doesn't make sense. And, again, I teach this a little because I teach a lot about email marketing and funnel building. Right? It doesn't make sense to be like, okay. I'm gonna have
a get started with Pinterest course for my people. The order bump is also gonna be about, like, maximizing Pinterest. And then my other one, it's just gonna have, like, the same hook because they think, oh, I already solved that problem. So you just wanna make sure you're solving the next problem that you're reading, like, their
mind. When it comes to any type of bundle, though, for upsells and order bumps, you need to check the rules for the contributors that the bundle host has if they allow those things. So, like, not every bundle host, free or paid, is going to allow you to have order bumps. Now we let our contributors have order bumps because, again, I'm all about everybody winning. Right? But it can't automatically be checked on. It has to be checked off. Or, like, no. We're not gonna send people
to you. We're you're just not in it. Same thing for upsells. We have no problem if people are selling on their thank you page. There's a slight issue with Thrivecart where sometimes it doesn't let people get the free thing unless they put in a credit card or PayPal. And so it tells people, I'm like, you can't run it native through Thrivecart. And I know this sounds annoying, but if you just create a standard thank you page someplace else that is selling whatever your typical upsell
is, then by all means, you can have it. But I cannot ask people to put in their credit card for something for free. Like, we just won't do it. We also don't accept, like, free months of memberships. But, again, in your welcome series that you have for your item or in your product, there's nothing that says that you can't promote your membership. It's just we don't ever want like, I would never want anyone coming to you, for example, being like, I signed up for that bundle that you talked about,
and Amy charged me, and you're like, it's not even my bundle. I don't even really know who Amy is. Like, I don't wanna create more customer support for my contributors. That's my job to make life easier. So, again, just, like, think to yourself, okay. Pretend nothing else is in this bundle. What is the next logical step for the item that I am putting in? And that's what I would do. And, again, the upsell on the next page on the thank you page can always be something that's more more
expensive, more pricey. But for that order bump, it's just like you said, the candy. Right? It's like, you know, it's like $2. Right? Again, you can have something on there that's more than $2, but I wouldn't try to put an order bump that's like $100. Like, what now? That's not gonna work regardless of where the traffic source is from. Yeah. Yeah. $100 is a big commitment for someone who just met you. So yeah. I totally relate to that. Again, the M and M's at
the end of the aisle when you're at the grocery store. I love this. Okay. So I may or may not be thinking about doing my own bundle next year. So if I were to, hypothetically, of course, create my own bundle, what is the first thing I should think about? And I may or may not have already bought the domain name, so, you know, there you go. Well, the name can help. So and I always say that if you wanna give it a little bit more clout,
give it its own domain name. You'll notice that a lot of our stuff does end up being hosted on main pages because I like their servers. I've never had them go down ever except for once in February this year. I'm like, really, main pages? Since 2017, your servers have never died. And the week before, when I'm testing everything for my bundles, when you die so I'm also bad for people that were launching that week or, like, had summits, because
I know a lot of people host their summits. Again, because Leadpages servers are great. I felt so bad for all those people. I'm like, we're just testing. When it comes to a bundle, like we had talked about in our bundle on ramping system, the bundle is a thing. Do not get me wrong. It's a thing. But it's not the only thing. You really need to think of it as a part of your business. So the first thing that I always want people to think of is, what else do you have
going on? Meaning, are you using this bundle because you typically launch in March? So you should have a bundle in February or even January. So that way, you have a whole bunch of new people to launch to. And, again, when it comes to, like but, Kate, they just got all this stuff for free. Are they gonna buy your bigger stuff? Yes. If you wow them, if your product was great, if you make sure your face is everywhere, which I know you do anyways, so, like, make sure your
face is everywhere so they can build that personal connection. Yeah. They're gonna buy from you. And again, it's not like my Pinterest course that solves my Pinterest course that solves my Pinterest course. It's a little bits and pieces leading them towards it, and I can learn really well. So the first thing is, like, do I need this for a launch? Or another thing to think about is, like, what is just traffic dead? Like, just like nothing's going on.
So I will always tell my people, usually, you'll see not a lot of summertime ones, but more so now than you used to because a lot of people, their traffic and attention is dead in the summertime. So it's like, if you want to be able to, say, even do, like, a summertime promotion where, say, you're gonna do, like, a flash sale of the day, Well, host a bundle the month before. Right? So that way you have a whole bunch of more people to talk to
with. What's different about a bundle versus a summit and why? And I'm sure our our mutual, Krista Miller, she may or may not have thoughts on this. I don't necessarily know if I would ever host a summit into the middle of this summer because people have to sit down immediately and watch that. Whereas for the bundle, all I have to do is sit down and sign up for stuff. So it's a lot more, like, out and on people's
own times so it can work. So the very first thing to think about for your bundle is where is this strategically fitting in to other big projects that I have, or what am I trying to help it prevent? You know what? No one ever talks to me in the summertime. Let's do it in the summer. You know what? I love launching in April. It's my absolute favorite. Let's end of February, beginning of March, we're gonna host this bundle.
So that way, you know, we can have people come to this and my welcome series and even in, like, the product just this is why I love things like ThriveCart. You can just duplicate stuff all you want. Right? Maybe you can do that in your course platform. It's like, where even in that product, it's like next steps,
sign up for our free live challenges that we've got going on. So that's really like, that is sort of step number 1 is where do you need it strategic in your business, and what are you looking for? That's probably the other half. If you are sort of just starting out and your list is, like, 50 people, then go for a free bundle because getting, you know, even 500 new subscribers is business changing because it's gonna give you so much momentum.
It's gonna finally give you progress. This is why people give up in online business because they don't see progress. It it just got flood, all the dopamine. You're like, yes. Right? Again, even if it ends up being a couple of 1,000, that's huge for you. If you already have an email list of, like, 15,000 people, oh, it's cool to have an extra 1,000 that you didn't necessarily pay for. You might be like, you know, I think I'd rather have less people but kinda make
more money, so maybe that's why I'm gonna go with paid. But, again, it's like, where do you wanna see your money? And, again, people who buy paid bundles will still buy other products too. It's not saying that they're not, but it's like, do you need a lot of eyeballs, or are you looking for a larger cash injection? Or is it like, I'm gonna have a nice cash
injection from doing the monetization strategies that we talked about? We're gonna talk about other ways to monetize a free bundle as well and then the bigger payday with my launches that I've got going on. Yeah. Okay. This makes a lot of sense, and, y'all better watch out because I may or may not be doing my bundle next year. But I'm probably gonna have to, like, buy some stuff from Kate for the for this to work. So, so we've got our
we've got our bundle date selected. We've kind of got a theme. How do we pick the right people to be in the bundle? Because as you mentioned, you could have 15 people, you could have a 100, which is that like, that sounds way too like, way too many people to meet. But how do you recommend choosing the right contributors? I would say, especially if this is one of your first bundles, and if like I said, if you decide to go for your route, it's
up to you if you wanna go free or paid. A lot of times I tell people to go with a free bundle first. I don't wanna say because the stakes are lower, but, like, the stakes are lower. Right? Because you're not like, oh my goodness. Like, my contributors aren't making a whole bunch of sales. With a free bundle, you know your contributors are gonna get a bunch of email subscribers. So, like, everyone should, like, this is amazing. Right? So that
way you can take that sort of pressure off yourself. And, again, to switch it over from free to paid later on is not hard at all. So that's kinda just one of those little first tidbits to have in there. But when it comes down to sort of figuring out, like, the whole, like, what to include and who to pitch, I usually like to start with what items and topics do I wanna see in there. So I always like to think about my person, and this is by, like, consumer
bundles, ones that aren't necessarily business to business. So business to business still works, but especially business to consumers works so well because it's like, okay. If my ideal person say that I like to help, you know, moms with organization, there are so many other things that moms can help with lifestyle wise. Yeah. Even a little business wise if you wanna throw it in there that it's just like, oh, man. She would really love this. That's how I always
like to start stuff. Like, she would love this. Like, she would love organization. She would love something about yoga. She would love kids' principles to keep them occupied. I mean, no one wants to think about end of life planning, but, like, maybe she needs something about that or dealing with elderly parents. She okay. So you just kinda think to yourself, like, what would biggest people love to learn about that isn't something else that
you teach? So, like, if you are the bundle host and you wanna be known for and we'll just say, like, I know you teach about lots of great social media. So you wanna be known as just, like, Instagram. Like, that's that's where it's gonna be your stake and your rodent. Right? Don't invite other creators who also talk about Instagram. You're
the Instagram person. Now you can invite a couple different people that say talk about email marketing because that's not the thing that your bread and butter's about. That's not what you wanna be known for. So it's fine. But I always, again, sort of think to myself, what else is this person gonna need? So, like, it's like, okay. If I help people host bundles or I host people with
email marketing, what else is this person gonna need? Well, I cannot teach them how to make a pretty sales page, so maybe I want somebody that helps with graphic design. I'm never gonna talk about social media because I'm so inconsistent about it. So it's like, okay. So, like, we can have somebody talk about threads. We can have somebody talk about ads. We can have somebody that talks with this. So I was like, start with the topics first. I will usually just to
kind of rip the Band Aid off if you're not used to pitching people. You can sort of look at your closer circles first. Or if you've been speaking on summits before, you can always reach out to, like, you know, people that are hosting. Like, I'm pretty sure, you've also hung out with Eden Fried. Right? So it's like, oh, I'm like, let me ask Eden. Right? Like, she talks about tripwires. People love tripwires. Like, Eden's the coolest. Right? So, like, let me ask Eden. She
wants to be in there. And sometimes it could be just a bit more casual. So I will start with a couple of those, but you do we have in my course collaboration, Cashin, we have the pitching pyramid. You do want to after you sort of just, like, get your feet wet, you got a couple of yeses, you know, because it's your friends, all of that. You do wanna expand a little bit outside of your circle or even just ask people, like,
especially, again, a lot of our friends host them. It's like, hey, there. Who are some of the best speakers that you had in your summit? Right? And I was like, oh, yeah. It's just for this person, that person. And then reach out to them if they don't already have a topic that you need covered. And then you can always, again, go with the intro. I was like, hey. So I know that we've both participated in these summits before, and I know that everyone loves your
talk about, you know, Black Friday stuff. Would you be interested in contributing something for Black Friday? I always like to and this is the longest part of the process because we like to be really hands on with our pitches. I like to look at their website, and I like to see what products that they have and also the audience a lot that they are pitching towards. Right? So it's like and if it happens to be somebody that you've admired, and this
is what I always tell my students, go pitch the people you admire. You never know. They could say yes. Chances were you probably know, like, their launch schedule a little bit. So even in the email, it's like, hey. So I know that you launched your super awesome course usually in March, And I'm actually running a bundle at the very beginning of February
that can really help it. So that way, you can get a lot of people in your launch triggers that you're running, any of your launches, all that sort of stuff. So we like to do that. So we always sort of start with topics, and I was like, look outward. Again, who are you following on Instagram? Who have
you always wanted to connect with but haven't? Another thing that you can do is look at people that have participated in summits or bundles in your industry and be like, well, it looks like they want to be in, like, a contributor style sort of thing. So, like, let me ask them. They're speaking at summit. Chances are they'll wanna be able to speak into a bundle. So you can look at it that way. We have found people on Instagram. I looked at people on
Pinterest. We have just Googled people. So that's again, I'll always start with a topic. Some people you know ask around, then again, look at other sort of collaborative events, and then just, again, just do some good old searching if there is a topic that you really want covered. Yeah. I love the specificity too of, like, looking at someone's website, because they can't tell you how many times I've gotten pitched by something. And I'm like, do you
even know what I do? Like like, it's so wild to me. And when I so I hosted my first summit this year, which is it's a lot of work. It's I mean, it's probably just the best work as a bundle. But I think what made it a lot easier is, leaning on my network. I could literally just email my friends and be like, hey. I'm doing this thing, and I know this is what you talk about. So you wanna, like, come hang out with me in the summit? And so when you can be that specific, it
does it definitely makes a difference, which I love that you say that. Yeah. And if you have a smaller network, but, say, you're in a group coaching program or you're in a Facebook group that's run by somebody that you bought their courses before, look to see, do they have a day where you can pitch stuff or reach out to their admin, like, send them an actual email and be like, hey. I'm running this event. Is it okay if I post about it in your
students' only community? I want to ask first. That's, like, the biggest thing. You can't just show up to somebody else's party and try to take their guest. Ask, and you can ask them if they wanna bring your own deal too. So we also the last round that we have is applications, which can make it really easy to fill in the gap because, technically, it's people coming to you wanting your stuff. Right? So even if you are very teeny tiny, I always say take the time. It
doesn't take that long to, like, create a little application. You're just gonna duplicate your, you know, information page or what's going on. But instead of, like, let us know, it's fill out this form, and you can fill it in that way as well. Yeah. That's so smart. That's so smart. Okay. Last question is about optimizing everything after the bundle. So whether you're a contributor or whether you're a host, you mentioned kind of scheduling it in so that you have,
like, a plan afterwards. What are some of the things we can do to maximize conversions from bundle to, like, paying customer in other ways? I love that. Well, first of all, if you're a host, make sure when all of your timers run out, so when the registration is over, when the claim period is over, because usually we'll give people some extra days, make sure that you've got something on a you missed it page rather
than just being, oh, you're out of luck. Right? So that is where, unlike in a free or in a paid bundle, you would, you know, put something high quality. That's where you can put don't leave your empty handed. Watch this webinar. Right? Grab my normal freebie so that way they're in your funnel. So that's sort of, like, the first thing of, like, optimizing it. Right? If you are a contributor, most of the time, you're just giving people a link
to a typical sales page with coupon code attached. So that might not be as easy to have, like, oh, sorry. The coupon code expired, but here's this other thing. Technically, if you wanna get fancy schmancy, you could do that. But for most of us, we're not necessarily going to do that. One of the things that I always tell the contributors because, yes, people are going to have a lot of emails. Are you going to see a lot more unsubscribe than you typically
would? Yes. But chances are you're gonna see a lot more new subscribers than you typically would in a week. So it's going to even out of the wash, everyone. Right? Like and it's one of those things. But one of the ways that you can really start to stand out and optimize, and we had already hinted at earlier, is show your face a lot. You want to be able to build that personal connection with the people.
That's first and foremost. And, again, if you're gonna be doing bundles a lot, and I know I would never tell you, like, for every bundle, create, like, a brand new welcome series just for that. But even if you just have a general, like, buyer series for people that come through through the bundle, say they get tagged with a coupon code, make sure that, like, you're in there and you're truly getting people to consume what you've made. I think that's the
other part that people sort of forget. So it's like you can still have that follow-up. Maybe I wouldn't send a follow-up email every single day, so maybe you're gonna space this welcome series out a little bit more. And I would just like to say, I know we met in the bundle. So, like, I can put that welcome series for any bundle that that product is in. It's not like the Ultra's No Trucks bundle. Right? It's like, oh, I know that we've met in the bundle. Right?
Again, showing your faces in the email and making sure that the next step just makes sense. Again, like you talked about, you've got that testimonial spot. It's like, oh, if you wanna learn now that we've got threads down and you wanna be able to leverage this in Instagram, like, watch this video that we have about this, right, which can be pitching another product. Again, I don't think that people think that, like, oh, I can use my products to pitch other
products. Yes. 100%. You can. Just make sure that you have an after plan for them. Make sure that you show up. Just don't necessarily put them in your normal newsletter. Like, let them run that sort of buyer series welcome searches like you would anybody else, and then put them in your newsletter so that way they can hear about you. And it can be one of those things, like, if, say, you put in say you do have a membership and you just pulled out a lesson from the membership because a
lot of people, like, will accept that, so they'll do that. Make sure your branding everywhere is talking about that membership so that way they know you actually have it paid. And just show up. Just keep on showing up. Yes. I love this advice. I mean, it's just solid, like, marketing business advice anyways. When we think about our clients to customers, it's like the the conversion doesn't happen after they
give you money the first time. It's like in fact, most people feel like when you when they give you money and they have a really good, like, time well, that's how that well, my brain went to a totally naughty place. I'm sorry, y'all. When people give you money for the thing and then they enjoy the thing, like, they're more likely to keep giving you
money for the thing. And that's just, like, human nature. Like, some of my favorite people in the online space, I will continue to give them money for things because I'm like, I like the things you create. Like, what's what else you got? Right? And so Mhmm. I think that that's just really great. Okay. You mentioned the bundle that you are hosting that I am participating in. Tell us all about all treats, no tricks, the bundle. Sure. So we are running
the all treats, no tricks bundle. It is going on the week of Halloween, hint the name. Yes, everyone. There are Halloween puns on that registration page. Do not worry. I do say spooktacular and fantastic more than once in those pages. So and you don't even have to wear a costume. So from October 28th through the 1st November, you're gonna be able to sign up for a complete free registration for it. We have 39, probably 40, because I'm turning 40 on the 4th November, so the Monday right after. So
I'm really leaning into that. So I am it's part of my birthday bash. We're running. It's the 1st week of the 2 week birthday bash. We're running for me turning 40 on 4th. So in a bundle, we cover a whole bunch of topics. We have welcome series. If you've got newsletters, we've got threads. We have Pinterest. We have quizzes, which is really exciting. We have people that are tackling Instagram. We have, like, creating your first digital product.
And what I made sure to do with this one is that nobody was talking about the same topic. So, like, we do have someone that talks about, like, just general social media, but we have somebody specifically that's talking about, like, Instagram automations and, like, selling in your DMs. Right? So I wanna make sure that nobody's toes was getting stepped on and that everything was a
really high quality. Because I have been running bundles for 80,000,000 years, we also have a bonus course that you're gonna get in there that is called the all tricks, no treats road map, where it's a very short, like, 12 minute video that's gonna walk you through how to get the most out of the bundle. Because, again, I'm will be the first one to tell you they can be very overwhelming when you're signing up for them and
you are picking things. So I'm making sure that you're picking the products that are actually going to work for your business in the next couple of months. So you're not just saving things just in case. Right? And that you actually take the time to implement it. Because, again, my biggest thing, as a host, I want you to get the most out of it, and I want my contributors to get the most out of it. Again, I can give you, like, a 100,000,000
subscribers. Not really. But, like, if no one actually goes through your threads course, it's not gonna matter. I want to be able to help you get the best testimonials for this course possible that you can. So I'm gonna teach people how to actually go through this, how to be able to handle their inbox when they're getting these new emails, why they would wanna stick around with certain contributors. Again, like, if you're seeing these things, they don't agree to flags, guys. You wanna
stick around with them. So we have that in there as well so that way you're not overwhelmed. If you happen to be listening to this after the bundle, don't worry like we have talked about. On the it's over page, we do have some gifts from our sponsors and VIPs, which we didn't even get to talk about how you can make money that way as a host. So that's a fun method that we talk about. And we do have a, live
training that's going to be going on the week after. It's going to be I believe it's on 6th, whatever that Wednesday is, that is talking about hosting bundles, and it's called the bundles blenders workshop. So that way, if you do decide that you wanna host 1 in 2025, that you can make sure that you are
setting yourself up for success. Because one of the things about summits and bundles, although I will say it's a little bit easier for a bundle than a summit because you don't have to do all the transcriptions and the video editing, is that you're gonna be putting in a lot of time ahead and not necessarily see those financial rewards immediately. It's like, but, hey. I need I need money now. Right?
Like, JJ Wentworth. Right? You got you gotta wait a little bit. So I'm gonna make sure that we're setting yourself up so that way you can really have just the best possible experience as a host, as a contributor, and really getting on there. But, again, just head on over at katejoster.comforward/treats. There are no upsells to this particular bundle itself. So anything that I would have charged for in previous bundles, like, we have an Airtable database that you
are gonna get completely for free. We have a spreadsheet if that's more of your thing to keep track of stuff. We have a live ask us anything call with our experts and VIPs that we have coming in. So that way, you can really if this year was rough, I really want you to be able to end 2024 and start 2025 with that momentum, with that excitement, and the actual tools and resources to help you get to those goals. So Yeah. Monster.comforward/treats
has everything that you're gonna need. If you're listening to this before the bundle opens, you can actually sign up for an exclusive wait list gift that we have, which is your best Black Friday yet audio course, which if you like podcasts, you're gonna like the audio course there, where we're talking about how to set yourself up for the Black Friday. That's just, like, the best for you and your business right now, especially if you have that smaller audience or, again,
you've heard businesses are hurting a lot this year. We're gonna turn it around, and I'm not telling everyone, oh, it sounds profitable. You're gonna make a 1000000 bajillion dollars. I'm talking about that you're just gonna have the best time with Black Friday when you listen to this audio course. You guys can get that for free. Again, katesanoster.comforward/treats is gonna get you everything you need. Yay. Oh my gosh. I'm so like, I'm legit excited about this. This
is so fun. So y'all make sure to sign up because I have a little gift in there too for my best car. So I'm excited about it. I'll put the link in the show notes as well, and everything that Kate does in the show notes. Anything else you wanna leave us with, Kate, before we end our podcast? I know everyone says this, and I want you guys just to keep going and that you are
allowed to be a human with human emotions and experiences. So whether this year was your best year ever, whether it was the worst and you were thinking to yourself, oh my goodness, like, I just wanna give up and throw in the towel. Like, yeah, you might need to add that other source of income being a 9 to 5, but it does not mean anything about you. I think that a lot of people put so much pressure on their launches, on their products, on their bundles, on their summits to reflect their own self
worth. And you need to remember that you are 2 separate things. And that it is okay to feel your feelings, but you still need to be able to take actions afterwards and be like, alright. This thing was was rough, but what can I learn from it? What can I do moving forward? I'm not a failure. It was not a failure. Did it go the way I had planned? Maybe not. It happens, but we're gonna be able to move on. Yes. A 100% cosigning this. Thank you so much, Kate. This was
absolutely fantastic. I'm glad we got to chat on the show. Thank you for having me. Oh, and don't forget to leave a review, everyone, and a YouTube comment if you're watching on YouTube. Yes. Yes. Yes. Keep us in the top 100 marketing podcasts by leaving a review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. And, also, side note before you go, if you have not heard yet, I have rebranded the Savvy Social
School to the Mindful Marketing Lab. And if you wanna get nosy and get all the behind the scenes details, I have 5 episodes up right now of my launch diaries, but you gotta be in the lab to get, the access to the ups and, let's be frank, downs of rebranding, all of the things that is inside the shiny new Mindful Marketing Lab. Join me there. Next week, I am talking to Peg Fitzpatrick, like an OG social media strategist. We're talking all about
giving yourself CPR when it comes to social media. Stay tuned for that next week. I'll see you then. Bye for now.