Ep. 315: On a Prayer with Michael Waddell

he said, He said, this is Michael Pecan farmer. I made the comment to a great friend of mine out actually from Wisconsin, who's in Montana. He's an outfit or now. And he says, and I make a comment to one of our producers. I say, hey, Bud, you need let's roll. I said, this ain't Tiley Winks. We gotta get out there in the snow and get a turkey in the outfitter jumps up a big brawny guy. Now this guy is probably two sixty, big, big brawny shoulder guy, looks

like he should have played NFL. And he said, don't make fun of Tiddley Winks. And I'm like, man, what are you talking about? I said, I was He said, I'm a world champion, right, you're like the child's game Tiddley winks. I didn't even know there was a game tiddler and a winker. A tiddler and a winker. I don't know in today's society if you can say somebody's

a tidleer no more. But what is the game? It's like it was he brings out his wife, go to the closet, Gertrude, and get the He brings out and it looks like a like a board and it's got these little plastic things and he's think, think with his hand, and he takes another piece of plastic sitting there and he's winking it or tiddley in it too. And they beat some French guys at it. Yeah, he said he's

world chiff. And he said, yeah, we have these French guys come in and we just throttled him, roasted him. Go back to France. It's free fries. I'm going now, I'm glad here that the Americans best at the French at that. Yeah. I didn't know we had world champions in Montana. I gotta confess something to you. We used the same I stole it from a movie. I think this is gonna this is gonna be horrible to you because we'll say, are we here to turkey hunt? Or

whistle Dixie Whistle? That's right? But I know what the hell where that comes from? The movie. There's a movie there's like a Western or something. We're Josie Wales. What's the context? It's like, are you here to throw down? Like do you want to get serious? Because he was

he was from the Confederacy. Yes, yeah, Joe who says it's who Josie is in a there's a potential confrontation happening, right, and he's staring these guys down who are obviously starting to kind of second guests there, and he said, they're like, do I actually want to die at the hands of Clint Eastwood right now? Exact definition is if you engage in unrealistic or hopeful fantasizing. An example would be if you think you can drive there in two hours, then

you're whistling Dixie m m, like they'd never best the North. Yeah, maybe maybe right. But in in that movie especially, he was going on to something. Steve It says this idiom alludes to the song Dixie and the vain hope that the Confederacy known as Dixie would win the Civil War. Josie Wales was the Confederate soldier. Yeah, just an outlaw

turned out law. But he's saying, right, he's saying, you want to get serious, or you want to whistle Dixie, which then becomes a double entendre, right, because you're gonna say, like, pledge allegiance to my side by whistling Dixie. Or because he was after the who were the bad of the red red legs red legs, the red legs with the bag.

But you know why that that Uh, that movie had a number of great lines, but the most famous line of all that overshadows all other lines in that movie is when he uh has a big chaw backy that's just seth that means a large amount of chewing to back on his mouth. I know I used to do that. Um. He spits it on a man who he's just killed. Yep, and and in his compatriots says to him, aren't we gonna bury them, to which he replies, cal like the crows, and the cost to eat too. Buzzard's gotta eat the

same as worms there. That's right, It's funny. I just watched this movie the other day too, for the first time. No, I've seen it a lot, but it was actually my son. He was home from college and I was talking to him. He's twenty one. I said, have you ever seen Outlaw Jose Wales? He said no, So me and my other son, two of my sons said and watched it, and I mean it was like blown away, what a hell of a movie. My kid would really liked it. My levon held he'd be ready for all he would like and

he could watch it. I mean, it's it's it's not it's not g rated, but it dang choke is good from the standpoint of what all he went through. And it's pretty deep movie. Like I said, it's it's deeper than just um. I tuned my boy and zero Dark thirty and forgot that it begins at the very prolonged water boarding session. He uh, like, what are you looking

at that? He didn't finish her. We're gonna reapproach in a decade, so I'm not along in like quote movie lines and just assume everybody around you're supposed to understand. Like I told my wife the other day, we was sitting there eating supper, and my kid it said, he plays guitar, and he's like, I want to. I want to let's go jam dad. And I said, hey, you know what, I'm calling the boys, and Christie, my wife,

like no, it's it's already eight o'clock. And I said, all you gotta do is put some damn chips in a bowl. Remember sling blade? Oh say you know what, that's it. I'm calling the boys, so you know we're gonna make some music. And in my life bit perfect notes that all you gotta do is st some chips in the bowl. Okay, we got delayed introductions for joannest Patella Senior Michael wall The I understand now Pecan farmer, Pecan farmer outdoor. Once upon a time, you still working

to hunting space. Now I just I got overalls typically on setting the cafe, drink coffee and talk about my crop. So, uh, CAL was asking you, you guys, I grew up Pecan. I don't know why, right, you guys great peakan, No, I actually be honest with you. I'm from Georgia and I realized once I got into the farming that most of the farmers who make a lot of money. I asked them, I said, what do you call him? Is

it a Pecan or a Peacan? And I had two of the biggest Peacan farmers in Georgia said, it's it's peak and boy. And I said, well, how much did you do last year? One guy named Joey Collins is a good friend of mine, has been my mentor. He said, well, we we did about I don't know, three or four million pounds last year of peak Hans. And I said, so that's two dollars a pound. I'm trying to do the math. So I'm thinking, Okay, he's a wealthy guy.

I said, I don't think I got peak, Hans. And I don't know if I got I got peaks, just like yall. And so he happens to be the guy who buys my peakns. So it's I always up in the air. So I'm following the money man, I'm going like I on like Little Wayne and jay Z. I'm sure, I'm I'm I'm calling up what they would call it, and I think they would call it peaky. And under the situations, so you had, uh, did you buy an existing orchard? Did you trying to start one? No? I did,

I bought it existing orchard. So So my wife and I had a farm out in Kansas that I had bought just for an investment in the hunt and loved that state, loved the resources there, and so I ended up selling it, and so I kind of want to place around my house in Georgia. Of course, land is a lot more expensive there than it even is out in Kansas, and so there was a track of land

I was looking at at the time. It was about two hundred acres and um anyway, and I got to looking at some man, this is an old Peakan orchard, and I knew nothing about it other than the fact I love Peak camp Pie, you know. So I got to cleaning it up, and my wife was dead against it because it looked terrible. It was growing up and it just decrepit old grown up or not being harvested. Not being harvested. They've been planted back in our area.

There's a family called the Callaways that were very much like the Vanderbilts or the Rockefeller is, very successful back back into the Great Depression, even going back to the the nineteen hundreds, and they had at one time around thirty acres, so they had planted these trees back into forties. So they're very, very old. And so we cleaned orchard up and we just wanted to homestead there and build a house,

and that's where we wanted to live. And so in the process of cleaning it up, and me and my dad just bush shogging and working and getting a skid steer with a mulching head and just cleaning up, making it look nice. It you could tell at that point we had, you know, a lot of healthy peak han trees. And so then I started calling around and like you and all of us here, we meet so many people

across the country and down south, and Georgia's wanted. Georgia might be somebody can correct me if I'm wrong, but I know it's one of the top producers of peak Hans. I know Texas, this big Oklahoma, but Georgia might be the number one. And so obviously there's a lot of knowledge just south to me. So he ended up with all people Luke Bryan, who's a you know, a huge star.

Now his dad is one of the leading kind of guys in chemical and fertilizer, and he's got he's you know, down south, We've still got a lot of cotton, a lot of peanuts, and things like that, even some tobacco and stuff like that. So anyway, I talked to him

and he got me on the right track. And then I had another buddy, turkey hunter with a lot down to South Georgia, who was a big farmer, and so got alright track and we started making you know, across However, I could have bought another bigger farm in Kentucky for what I put in equipment, and so I'm still trying to see a profit. But anyway, at least I can truly, you don't have a gate garden. You know, the fewer nuts you produce, the fancier your packaging has to be.

I think you're right, you're gonna artisan. Yeah, gonna have a story. I know there's only six nuts in this exactly. I gotta look at my hat though. It's so cool, you know. Yeah, I'm learning, and it's so frustrating. Man. I learned a lot, you know. And obviously, growing up you're hunting and fishing. I'd always big in food plots and planning and trying to put back, you know, to the resources that we like to hunt. But I just realized as a whole another game when you're trying to

produce a crop, especially for the community. And I found out too that most of our crop, the peak ends, goes to Asia. I guess they go everywhere, and so it was it was a learning curve. Say the least, you know, the squirrels like that. Lord, let me just

taste squirrels. Y'all come to my house. I got. I was just telling Core and I just got my little boy a little squirrel dog and went out to Missouri and bought him a little squirrel dog and U and dude, I've had more fun with that dog, especially around the edges that a orchard, because it's just a plethora. It's like a state park. You know, they're out there trying

to get these peakns. So it's so you're in that stage of life where you can pretty much do whatever you want as long as you say it's for the boys, like got watch out, je Wales got it stage trying to work. Some things are more important. And it's funny. I've met a lot of people over the years. That's a funny subject because you know the span of my career. You know, he made a lot of people. But I remember different shows like he and I met years ago, started out words what you showed, uh and him. I

showed Michael a picture of it. Was me, Michael Nick Monton t Bone at the Harrisburg Great American Outdoor Show, and I think I was like sixteen or seventeen years old. You could have made him feel really awkward by acting disappointed that he didn't remember. Well. I think that's why he didn't bring in the framed copy on his phone. Yeah, like, oh, you don't recognize me. I looked a lot of different. Yeah, but I remember going to the show and you have

somebody come by, Stephen. I'm sure he's seen this happen. Like a young couple and they have a kid and maybe a two year old son, and they'll have a brand new white bow are a set of clothing that is just insane. I'm like, man, you're gonna really enjoy that. You're gonna love that new bow that's a new r X five. What are you gonna love it? Now? I think for me? Love his kid. He changed my life. He can't even eat milk duds alone. So yeah, I'm

just gonna get it broken up. Best payback for our for our ladies always finding things on sale that really wasn't on sale. You know, so uh oh, speaking to kids, that's a good transition. Um, Doug Dern heard my spirited um gripe with skiing, which I have to point out, I'm only mad about skinks. My wife enrolled my kids in nine consecutive saturdays of ski club, which means there's

nine saturdays that you can't ice fish. Every Saturday when I want to ice fish, she goes, well, already paid, and I was griping that I didn't have anyone to pay to go ice fishing, so I can't use like a similar there's no one to pay. And I was like, I'm gonna find a way next year to pay for like thirty days of ice fishing and already paid. Sorry, you can pay me, You're gonna have to go. And that's that's somehow spiraled into you getting mad at the phenomenon that I got of gravity. Is that I got

mad about gravity and skiing. Now, Doug Durham heard this and sent my wife um a big text, like this heartfelt text message about he never ski then he moved in New Hampshire and learned to ski, and how great it is that she this and that and she shows me the text. But her reply is Uh, Steve can suck it. I'm tweeting right now, skiing took Sonny Sonny bono as well as ice fishing. Uh. Oh, here's another ice fishing thing. Phil. Okay, you're you're ready to play

this clip? Philm I just learned today. Now, my agent, who has ice fished one time in his life unsuccessfully, I'll point out that I was his guide. Uh sent me this ice fish and article. And I learned that everybody already knows about the ice fishing article. But I'm trusting to someone out there doesn't know about it that you're looking at him right here after? Oh, would you agree with this statement? Okay, would you agree? I have a friend from central southern Illinois who likes to think

he's from the South. I was saying him, saying to him, if you live in a state where ice fishing occurs, you are not in the South. Is that fair? That's true? And and that's why. And that's where Abraham Lincoln was born. He can't claim to be a repertort. I told him, I said, Land of Lincoln and they ice fish there. There's like two things, dude, It's funny. I have a friend,

Mike Scoby who lives here in Bozeman. He sends me videos of his kids ice skating, and my kids are more intrigued to look at those videos, and they would be of something to Walt Disney. It's like a unicorn's gonna come running across here. And you're right, it's because in my life, I'm forty eight now, I've never in my life seen a frozen lake or even a pond in Georgia. Not once, I'm talking about not even. I

mean you might see some ice on the edge. Did to get twenty Did you guys get listening right now? A little bit of snow though, Yeah, we'll get a little bit of snow. And let me just tell y'all and when y'all see the forecast, go ahead, y'all welcome to come stay at my house because it's the most entertaining thing you've ever seen. Every redneck. We got car hoods and makeshift sleds because you can't go to the local sporting that's going by Toboggan, right, and dude, no milk,

no bread, no gasoline. Everybody's barbecue and it is a party. You think Elvis has come back from the grave. It's that fun and I'm not lying. Uh so this town feel is gonna play this clip. This town in Ohio, uh has the thing where they're trying to get ice fishing to be allowed at a local park, and they have a mayor who has a very spirited argument about why, why the slippery slope that would occur? Should you be

able to start ice fishing at the well? This this pond you you like in the years past, you can ice fish it? And then all of a sudden they just threw a sign not that says you can't. They'd be like when the pandemic started in Washington State, said you can't fish. Yeah, I mean you can golf, just

can't fish. I think instead of spirited, I think it puts in a better perspective to say logical, yeah, explanation of why you can't ice fish, and it lets people understand that there's a lot of different forms of logic out there. Yeah, alright, litterally, Phil, I want to hear it too, just because I can have another chuckle. Additionally, if you open this up to ice fishing, while on the surface it sounds good, then what happens next year? Did someone come back and say I want an ice

shanty on Springs Park for X amount of time. And if you then allow ice fishing with shanties, then that leads to another problem prostitution. Hey, I was not ready for the rest the data points to consider like a Saturday Night Live serious, but this guy secret was pointing out. This guy's got like he's like one of those dudes

that sort of rails against something. But he's got like, actually is the one that has the problem because he had this other He got all kinds of other trouble because he's railing about these like pornographic books being taught to kids, but then it turns out they're not being taught to kids in his school. He just like his head just immediately goes. This dude looks at porn every night. He's got an addiction. They just don't want to say this dude's head immediately goes like where it goes. But

to his defense, I should have. If I was in the city council or whatever, I would raise my hands said that's stupid. But when I was in high school, kids that didn't have like the like if you had kids that you could go down in your basement with your girlfriend. No one's gonna come down there, because your parents are gonna be like, oh, I totally respect to space. And then you had parents that are gonna come down

to every three seconds. Maybe want some popcorn? Right? The kids that could not have privacy, them and their girlfriends took up ice fishing. Mm hmm. Yeah, you like, drag a big shanty out on the ice, be like, oh, you know what I mean, Susie're going ice fishing. No one ever questions it. I'm not saying, just saying it was a thing that happened. You took up ice fishing. Ice fishing again, huh? And from there a prostitution ring starts. That's why I said my hands. I would have raised

my hand and said that is stupid. However, it does make me think of There was an article on the It was supposed to be on the psychology of trophy hunting, right, and you start reading this article and immediately you're like, well, this is just an anti hunting article in general, masquerading

is something. But you know you're almost done at that point, and the second to last paragraph it says, now, it's important to note that none of the data the testing involved in this article was performed on actual trophy hunters, so it is not relevant. However, if you have the opinion that, uh, you do not like trophy hunting, it

can be relevant. That is confusing, just like, oh okay, it's like I lay all this out for you, because if you want it to be supportive, even though it is factless and baseless, you can use this to support your argument. Like if I came to you and I was like, I'm doing some research on prostitution. If you were a prostitution, did you exactly, I'd be like, well, did I publish my results? That's interesting, But I do have a uh this now many many published video of

this city councilman or mayor. Uh, and uh that's the fact that I'm gonna use this guy's a mayor. It is odd though. I did go to International Falls one time to fish, and I met Bill Cosby Harvey Weinstein there and it makes me wonder, what's going one? What are you guys doing? Yeah, that's first time I ever saw that Charlie stand Us sign one of those those those ice chanties holding that fastball. Remember that baseball? Like, Charlie, what you ice fishing? So you didn't hear the mayor?

I got it um uh your what's your walt in Montana Canvas Dude, I went down to have a I don't want to see what I did because I had all They they're not looking for custom projects. I was pointing this out. I had a cost project done at Montana campus. And those are the nicest dudes on the planet. Very helpful, the nicest dudes on the planet. If you're in the market, they make wall tents of many varieties. If you're in the market for a wall tent, I would go down there. You go into that place I

didn't know you drive buy it. All tanks is on the highway. Man. They got a million people in there stitching away making them right there. When I went there to pick up that wall tent, there was like five dudes that came out and we're like, let me help you load this. The nicest guys on the planet making making beautiful wall tents. I like them so damn much. I want to buy one of the wall tents. Still, I gotta keeping the catalog on the bench. I spent

a lot of days in mind every year. No one needs a comment on this, But one day I got real mad at the uh you know those SpaceX, those Starlink satellites, because they kind of messed up the whole night sky for a long time. Like you'd be sitting there a turkey hunting trying to watch the stars. Do you see these damn things. That's the first time I saw him. I was sitting around the campfire turkey camp out in eastern Montana, and I thought the world was ending.

You know what I'm up and so that you know what I'm glad about. Um, A solar storm killed forty out of forty nine of them, hundred million dollars of damage. Now they're gonna like fall back to and burn up in the atmosphere. Is now they're gonna this time when they're messing up the night sky like nah, it'll be like a meteor shower. A million bucks were satellites burning up in the as they re enter orbit, full of rare earth minerals. Who have you seen that? Don't look

up yet. It's pretty good. I saw those, but I was drinking bourbon that night, and I wasn't sure all the stars were moving exactly. This is gonna be something we're gonna have to come back to you later because Krin's not sure if it happened or not yet, but uh, you know he's had Hampton sides on and he's working on a book about Captain Cook. Yes, they might have found a ship. I didn't know it was missing, but they might have found a ship. Did you know what's

missing Captain Cook? Ship? Is that the No? He was like, no, no, you're thinking Captain Hook. No, I'm I'm thinking of the one where they were the pirate shirt they're protecting this ship. What was that one that was and the kids got the pixie dust and flies around? But I was like, no, I met that guy. Yeah, Doctor Hook, Captain cap'n Cook was I don't know what happened to him, Like this thing is. I just know that he gets killed in Hawaii, stabbed in the surf. But I never thought about what

happened to his ship after that. But apparently it goes missing. So this is way way back. I mean, this is like, what the hell you're Captain Cuttin Hook? What you're to Captain Cook get killed? We got a clear a Doctor Hook had great band. Captain Hook fictional captain. I did meet him in Disney World. He's never got older, he's doing good. We're talking about Captain Cook who uh was?

I guess like the the like a national hero right for England and discovered all these new lands, including the Sandwich Island Islands, which is the island chain of Hawaii. Um I always screw that up. I keep learning that and forgetting it. Yeah, Like when you see a reference to the Sandwich Islands in the history, that's what they're talking about. But Captain Cooks journey ended there in Hawaii and then his ship and crew continued on. I didn't under was it scuttled? Did they lose it in a

in a storm? I didn't understand that it was lost. I thought maybe it was purposely sunk out there. From an article in The Guardian, it says it was scuttled in Newport Harbor by British forces in seventeen seven and eight during the American War of Independence. That's right, block

the herb. Well, but why are the Australians mad? Then they're just mad to still wearing mask I think this okay, Like you know, it's like a joint group working on recovering bits and pieces and saying for sure this is the endeavor even though there's a bunch of ships scoutled out there um. The reason that the Australian National Maritime Museum is in a beef over this thing is because even though they're a joint group, they came out and

they said this is for sure the endeavor. Even though the joint group is pretty sure, but others in the group are saying, we still got a little discovery. The ozis jumped the gun on the whole thing. Ye can you tell I didn't read the article. It's not obvious and I correct my So the Aussee people are not aggravated. I'm sure it's their government is still frustrated about something. Many Uh oh, this is good, this is this is a joke, right, Yeah, we're talking about how to score

a squirrel. Boone and Crockett get a Boone and Crockett score off a squirrel. And the guy rode in a little diagram showing how to score it. He says he found it years ago. So it's length of a buck squirrel forehead to tip of tail, length of head behind the ears to the tip of the nose, testicular circumference. Come on, now, A plus B plus C equals your squirrel's nut and chatter score. Now here's my issue with that as we discussed my carp can came from Michael.

Have you ever heard that, uh, some squirrels will bite the nuts off of other squirrels here? Oh yeah, I've heard that cast right, you had a dominance or heard that? With this scoring? Is that it measures? He went and talked to a bunch of eggheads scientists who told that the squirrels don't do that. I was gonna say, I can't say I remember ever dressing a squirrel. I'm like, yep.

Squirrel doctor John Kopowski told us on this podcast they don't chew the nuts off of other squirrels, but their nuts are always ascending or descending up into their abdomen. So at any point during squirrel season, you got a percentage of squirrels run around out there who don't have visible not right now because it's a squirrel rut right now, well not right now, that's right, but like in fall, they have their nuts up in their abdomen for the

most part. Yeah, but there's a big percentage of turkeys that don't have spurs, and you like to uh score those. That's a good point. Yeah, but you wouldn't like kill a white tail in March and then be like, well, he's a zero because he doesn't have his handlers on a good point. And it wouldn't be fair to score Southern may and ice fishing for the first time. I'd be unfair. I like the rest of it, but don't agree with that measure. Oh here's our news item. I've

heard about this before. There's a there's a plant that people plant in their yards. It's like a highly toxic to wildlife, and they just had five otherwise healthy elk died in the Wood River Valley, Cal's old stomping grounds north of Haley and Idaho, where First Light is headquarters. Someone points out eating ornamental landscaping the U plant toxic

to both wildlife and pets. Blaine County issued an ordinance back in two thousand sixteen banning the planting of the U plant because of how deadly it is the elk. Fun fact for you, You plants are very common ornamental plants around cemeteries, which kind of ties into the Yeah, and you often see with brows lines, which is alarming. They put it around cemeteries because we're trying to so death. Oh no, I think it's just like a hardy thing that you know, doesn't need a whole lot of attention,

but it is common around cemeteries. Has who's read about the moose that that beat the living hell out of the sled dog team? I saw that. I heard this is an idea rode musher uh spend an hour stopping the sled dog team. The musher empties her gun into the moose, still keep stomping. Mm hmm. I saw that actually on a on a news app, and I can't believe I didn't read it, but the headline kind of said enough. You know, he trampled the team and then turned for us and charged us humans who sought refuge

behind our our machine. But unfortunately he turned around and went back to the team and for nearly an hour continued. So that's where all those twenty two bullets went when they couldn't find any That's what she had trying to find, wondering. Eventually the moose died. One of the dogs is still fighting for its life. Geez, you know your twenty two shall comment because you know how she closes it out.

Might have been carry bigger gun. That's true. I've often thought I said that one time actually at the Nashville turch Federation. We were talking everybody. I had all my friends that would come like, hey, man, what are you. You've been able to get the AMMO? And I'm like, I mean I got some and everybody, and I'm sure this happened out here. People is like, man, I've been buying all the twenty twos I can And I'm like, you ever thought of a three all three or eight

maybe thirty all six? I said, that's gonna be a tough ord to fight with just twenty two, you know, when that was going on. I mean it's still going on. But when like the with the first animal shortage, it's like I fell to the I became the same as everybody else, like your whole life. You're going to you like a box you'd buy like like like for Christmas, you might get one of those little mini milk, those little milk things, Like in your stocking. There'd be like

two of those milk things. You're like, okay, there's like years twenty two shells and every order of those about thirty shells end up in your carpet. Actually, that Christmas day on three you started shooting that AMMO and enjoying it. Once we got onto those tube fed Marlin twenty two. We needed like more of those things. But anyway, so

then like the AMMO shortage comes. Then one day I'm in Cabela's and they got a thing up that you're limited, like you're limited to two cases or two cars, whatever the hell it was long. That was the first time I ever bought a brick brick, first time I ever brought a brick in my life. Is the minute someone told me that's as much that, Like I could only buy that many, I'm like, why better buy two? I still I don't even know what I have to I

feel compelled to buy like that volume of you. You're like maybe you know, you do a lot of promotions, so you know, from different stores Cabella's, bass Pros to independent dealers, and I catched myself. I I even saw a sporting the store downtown last night, and I was thinking, I promise you going and say if I got some twenty two hurt. I think it's hilarious, Like you bring up this idea like you used to be, like you got that, and then he immediately started shooting. It was

an immediate need, immediate grati joined it. Don't want to shoot it. Yeah, it's like I have a serious hatred of ornamental towels. Yeah right, it's like, oh no, those are the looking at the towels for you, right, And it's the same thing. It's like going, don't go cracking in the twenty two shelves. I know what. I've got four boys, and so they're you know, living on the farm now, I mean they're just I love it because they just out and about and they're squirrel hunting every

day or shooting at cans and stuff. And I caught myself, you know, it's like, okay, hey, family meeting, all right, you little jerks. I counted I had seven thousand, four hundred three bullets and I'm down to seven thousand. Who shot? You know? I caught myself like what am I doing? What am I gonna do with all these twenty two shields? But we got them. So if a war can be one in America on twenty two shilds, nobody will mess with us. Nobody got to talk to the mushroom and

get some feedback. Well this year, I mean, think of the different all the duck hunting and run around I did. I was exposed to more UH brands of shell manufacturers than I ever have been in my life. And that's where somebody who's been shooting a shotgun for a long

long time. Because more and more manufacturers were like sourced and sought out and and and being successful, and well you mean like the big the retailers were trying to go anywhere they could go, anywhere they could go from Turkey and and France and Spain and so like you're buying like those what's that company foci? Yeah, Fioki. Here here's something interesting to on the subject that that shows

that it is deep, Steve. Is the fact that I get a call from Blake Shelton was a last year and he says, hey, what hell don't you work with Houarnty and those guys? And I said, I do? I do? He said, man, I I'd like to get some mammo

and um. And so getting back to the twenty twos, he said, and you know he and Gwyn now Stefani, who you wouldn't think of as a kind of a conservative and hunting and fishing and she's kind of she don't even eat meat, but yet she's super sweet, coolest girl you ever seen in very like loves to see Blake and he's hunting buddies and just treated us, my wife and all everybody around Blake's friendship great. But even she mentions, shouldn't we get some bigger AMMO than twenty twos?

And so so I'm asking Blake and and it's funny to know that this twenty thing is really the first thing I tell Blake, I said, Blake, Yeah, and those guys would be glad to let you buy something, I would assume, I said, But they don't make twenty twos. He said, Man, I got a lot of twenty twos. I need some six and two forty three. And I just, I mean, it's so funny, but it's so true. I don't know what the I mean, nobody had to market that round. It just hey, we should probably get some,

you know. A matter of fact, I'm like to leave in a minute. IM gonna run that down there. Uh. I want you to tell a story, Michael that I'm sure you told a bunch of times, um, but I haven't heard it from you. But just like it's sort of uh, you know, it's part of the legend of Michael Waddell's you've gone on and have done. I don't know, man, is it fair to say, decades of outdoor media, I

really have. You know, I started when I was eighteen, you know, working essentially at realtory through competition, turkey colling and guide and so's all I really know is this industry. You know, and talk tell about like how the like you kind of got like your sort of genesis was a turkey calling contest. Yeah, walk me through how that

all went down. It was. It was crazy. Um, you know, being from the South and you know, very similar to the Northeast, you know, where you grew up in Michigan, while you got us here in Pennsylvania, everybody seemed to hunting fish. And it was just a natural thing. It wasn't something just did for a hobby. It's just like it was a lifestyle. You didn't it's all you knew.

You just did it. I mean, you ate to meet you know, you had there was mounted deer heads and almost everybody's home there in our restaurants, and so it was never even a conversation of who didn't hunting fish. It's just everybody did. And so growing up, you know, I started just like everybody else. Squirrel rabbit, you know, didn't lead the deer. And then when I was around twelve or thirteen the the state introduced wild turkeys to our area in Georgia, and I guess we had been

wiped out down there. They had pretty much been wiped out because there was a few counties that had a decent population. But I lived in in an area called Maryweth, a County, Georgia, and we didn't really have any turkeys and never had seen one of my life. Didn't realize that they had to do that. They actually had to augment the population down there. They did. They did a lot of Nationale turch Federation was very involved. Now there's

an organization called Turkeys for Tomorrow that's doing it. But they're they're doing all these uh you know. The most successful way they found they would never turkeys in one area in Georgia, and in some cases they might bring them in from Pennsylvania. The Pennsylvania restocked a lot of the Southern states, so it was a pretty cool story of what they did. But certain areas did have a decent amount of turkeys and so, but our area didn't.

So when they introduced him. I remember my uncle Morgan come in one day and he's like, you ain't gonna believe what I saw down at the corner stand and I'm like, dude, I'm like, you know, I'm like twelve, you know, like you know everything, no wild turkey, and it was just like a unicorn or something. And so you know, it's like another spring goes by my dad A literally we we start turkey hunting. Well, I just

fell in love with it. And the first time that my dad and I went together, um, we were successful and we got a turkey, and I just thought that it was the coolest thing ever to interact and and call and talk. And so quickly into that, I started really just getting into the turkey hunters and the turkey callers and and a lot of these grand national champions

like the Walter Parrott from Missouri. UM. You had you know, callers like Terry Ram who were just world champions and and just some of the best Paul Butsky who's from New York, UM anyway, and I just immediately I remember going to the sports shows like anywhere, and I'd be like hoping I could run into one of those guys who shake their hand, and then they were all these turkey calling contests. So I just started practicing up and a guy named del Rom not right there from your area.

He uh he. He was just a manufacturer that that built a lot of calls. He had a lot of amish there in the area that was building some unbelievable box calls and stuff. And so he just kind of took me under his wing and said, hey, you're a pretty good caller. You need to get in the contest. And and he sent me a box of turkey calls for free, and I couldn't believe it. He said, but I'm only sending these because I want you to compete.

The first contest ever got into was a Georgia state championship and then I got like, I was like third place. So it freaked me out. And I'm calling against these guys that are my heroes, like I'm intimidated to be around him. And when it comes to this turkey calling world or circle and um and back then we'd go to contest, even it'd be anywhere from five hundreds to thousand people watching a contest. You know, it was kind

of intriguing. So I started doing good and really I was seventeen eighteen, and that's where I met the people at Real Tree. I started meeting other people in the industry, other personalities and and things like that, and that just led to actually first being a guy. I remember Bill Jordan's Uh he Happened? Real Tree was based in Columbus, Georgia, which was only about an hour from where I grew up.

And so David Blanton, who was their producer, and back then they had their show on t n N, the Nashville Network, and it kind of got put away and UM changed pass far as that network, and UM they were doing writers, so outdoor writers and media that was the media for writing. You know, they didn't have the TV shows and obviously not podcasts like this to get the word out. Message. It was all through the writers.

And so we would have a realtory would have these big writer hunts and then have all these writers from Brad had Herned into you know, Bubba Phillips to you know, Laurleie Dovie, all these writers, you know, even Jim Shocky and people like that, would would come down in Turkey hunt for articles that they could turn around and sell

to these publications. And obviously Bill getting this message about this camouflage, so they invited me to help guide on some of those hunts, to guide the writers, and I just I couldn't believe it. I remember I showed up and uh, two things I couldn't believe that. One is it buy my dinner at night, like Bill would buy my dinner, and I remember, you know, and then then we would go hunting, and I remember like after the hunt, we never talked about it, but I remember David Blanton said, hey,

I need you so security number. Like what did I do? I thought I got in trouble. He said, no, man, we're gonna pay We're gonna pay you. And I'm like, whine, dude, I mean, I mean I had a blast. You guys bought my dinner and you know, and stuff like that, and no, man, we're gonna pay you a hundred dollars a day to help help guide these writers. Man, we appreciate it. So dude, I man. I was literally like Red wrote, load up the truck and go to Beverly Hills.

I'm like, this is it, this is it. And through that I just started meeting know a lot of personalities that I looked up to, like I remember Dale Earnhardt coming down and and I remember Tomboud Intimidate and I had won the world championship. That year, me and a guy named Ricky Joe Bishop would want to two man team like scenario deal and we we want it and one I don't know, it's like a thousand bucks we won.

And you know in these cool you know, world champion titles or whatever, and who was that put on by? That was put on at the time by mass joke down in Birmingham, Alabama. They had it every year. And then obviously the Grand Nationals was put on by the Nationale Turkey Federation. And then they had another thing called the US Open, like it's some golf that it was Turkey and UM, and so that was the one. You had three big prestigious titles and uh two of those I was able to win UM in a in a

two man team Grant Championship. And then the US Opened the best ever done with sacking place. And so through that I kind of met a lot of people. And obviously I still love to the deer hunt stuff like that. But what was so funny was is um when I look back on those days, man, I just like again, I just thought everybody knew about these things things in the galaxy. I was just in my own little bubble and in the Corin Corina and I were talking a

little bit prior to this podcast. It was just so amazing to see all the other cultures because I'd only seen the small area in the south, and I was meeting people from the Northeast for the first time, getting to be buddies with Dale Rahm and Terry Rahm, and I was meeting people like Paul Butsky from Niagara Falls, New York, meeting people like Dick Kirby, who was a legend, you know, and I just one is I realized the different cultures and what you ate what you saw, and

then I started seeing going to these different places, I started realizing that there was a lot of people that didn't kind of like my kind, not necessarily my kind, but just any of us who hunted and fish. And I was actually kind of just kind of tore up about it, like I couldn't unders. Yeah, I was. I went to a workshop one time to learn how to edit in Rockport, Maine, and um, yeah, it was put on as an international Felmine Arts. Still, I don't know

how they found this. I thought it was kind of tortured just to throw me into the like not through like writers association. No no, no, this was later, so yeah, I kind of got a head in the story. So so basically what happened was I was guiding and I started doing that, and um, a lot of the writers become buddies, and a lot of these you know, different

celebrities to come in. They got to be friends and and one of the most intimidating things that ever happened to me early on far as kind of when you you know, when you're trying to be quarterback, I guess or you put in to be a quarterback. Remember Dale Earnhardt was down and uh and Dale was kind of very intimidating kind of guy, and he said, uh, we had hunted together one time before and killed a turkey. And so he gets down there and I'm I'm nineteen

years old, twenty one maybe. And Dale gets down there and that morning before he says, hey, I'm want I want to go with that young world champion. And I was like, you know, I'm Michael, you know, and He's like, yeah, I want, I'm going with you. And somebody said and somebody else like, now I was gonna take it note, I ain't going to I said, I know he'll get me a turkey, said, boy, you're gonna get me a turkey. You know, I wasn't yes run out to the trust,

Come rum man, I gotta get deal with turkey. Thank god we did. And so to the day he passed away in that dreadful accident Daytona, he had always come down and he'd want to hunt with me and David Blanton and another guy named Glenn Garner, and he just had complete confidence that we'd would, you know, get a turkey.

And so I think for me as a young man, started building confidence that first of all, like, man, this is fun, this is awesome, and that that first place of I played sports and stuff, and and it led to Bill Jordan and David offered me a full time job to UH to work in production, to to video and guide. So I never was hired to be this creative production guy. I was hiring more to in those days.

Just like a lot of times still in your world, Steve, you know, you have somebody that's interested in the space.

It could be a celebrity and and so at that particular time, it could have been a country singer or somebody that wasn't that good, but they enjoyed it and of course it was a good marketing platform for them in the T n N days too, for Mark Chestnut or Sammy Kershaw or Hank Williams Jr. To be on that particular TV show, especially with the connection in the day with Nashville Network and hunting shows that come in

that Sunday night block. So we'd follow NASCAR race. Well there'd be millions of people watching this outdoor programming, and so so we would go and a lot of times they would say, hey, we're gonna send you with Michael. So they know they knew I wasn't like the most creative guy, but they knew I could keep things in focus and I could kind of coach them along, like hey, you know, push your safety off. Now, Hey don't move,

but you know he's coming closer, you know. So so I was kind of guiding slash you know, Slash video and and and so with that, I just fell in love with the job. And I didn't know anything about editing, and that's when they David Blanton said, man, we need to teach you how to edit. And at the time, that was when everything was going from linear to non linear digital and the Avid and all the different software writing edit right, Well, yeah, I I when it was

coming to editing with me. You know, first of all, I still I'm pretty good writing, but I had to have a really good editor because I I'll write like I talked, so I need I don't know where to put the commas and all every time. But when it comes to you know, video editing, they sent me to this place in Maine, Rockport, Maine. I don't know if it's still happening. They used to have these crash courses, like for a week or two week courses if you wanted to learn how to you know, cinem photography or

on six temimeter film or you know. I'm sure it's changed. This was back in the early nineties. But I remember going up there and they sent me to school for nine linear or editing. And I remember what was the biggest takeaway. Everything was shot on these big beta tapes and so for me, my buddies couldn't believe I had access to this footage of back then the Monster Bucks videos and all Stars of Sprame videos that Realtrey was setting in Walmart stuff. So I took all these masters

are dub of these masters of all these hunts. So I thought I was gonna be like this hero, like I was gonna show up and they ain't gonna believe this. Young kids got all this awesome his great cameras, you know, And I'm thinking, if I showed up there, you know, with my buddies, you know, up with me, either're like, hey, yeah, we got something good. If we've all been young learning, if this stuff, will I show up? Man, I might as well have been to Antichrist. And they're like, and

I remember what's sitting in class. And I told the teacher, I said, I said, man, I worked for a company, and I don't know how to do it. I said, I'm pretty good tape to tape, I said, but obviously this is the way things are going. And they sent me here to learn, and it was a seven day course and and I remember saying, I got some unbelievable footage. And they had everything was on high eight and VHS, and so they were struggling to get content to digitize

into computers. I said, man, I got some really nice stuff, but you know, if you'd like to see it. And so the instructor or the professor teacher, he said, I'd like to see it. So I showed him he was, Oh, my god, are y'all shooting us on the b VP ninety And I'm like, yeah, I think that's the name of it. Man, that's a sixty tho all the camera, I said, I know, many what do y'all do? So he's really intrigued. I said, well, my boss, you know, they got to show on t n N and I'm

just a guy slash camera guy. But you know, this is the stuff. And I said, and they sent me here to learn how to edit hunts and to get better, so I can obviously post and send this to t n N. You know, I said, I just I don't know nothing about c G. I don't know. I don't know the the the way, the right way, or the code of of certain things. And we had cutaways and

all this stuff. So anyway, I'm learning. Well, he shares it with the class, and he remember the first time ever i'd heard somebody quickly making an excuse like you said, look, a lot of you guys are not gonna agree with this, and I'm thinking, no, nobody's not. I mean, don't these guys eat. Don't these guys eat? You know, like for sure you know? And anyway, sure enough, I remember a couple of the girls got up and said I stood up in the class and said I want to have

anything to do with that. And I'm like, man, and all of a sudden, you want to talk about feeling like the dumb he'll billy redneck from Georgia. I did then because I'm like, man, I'm sorry. You know, I was like, man, this is And finally I started getting piste off. I'm like, look, I'm here to do a job. I said, Man, I got a job. Mom and Daddy didn't send me up here. Hell, I'm here because I got I got a job and I'm gonna learn that

it this. And I told instructor, I said, look, if you knew me, just you know, hang out and go catch lobster out here in the port and help with the fisherman there. In the meantime, I'll come back. You can teach me how to edit this, dear foot, but I gotta learn how to hit these hunts. And uh. And there was one dude from Ontario that was there that stood up and said, hey, I agree with Michael. You know I grew up hunting the fishing and all.

You don't understand it. But uh. And at the end of it, they made us edit this this piece together from the footage that it looked like all the animals had gotten away, and um, because they made us edited that way. And I was mad. And for some reason, for some dumb reason, I never done any public speaking, but every night I had just turned twenty at that point. You hadn't done public speaking. I hadn't done any public

speaking at that point none. And for some reason the instructor, he and I, I guess because I was spent a lot of one on one time just because I was anxious, I wasn't there, just I really was. I wanted to come back and be able to press David and Bill and let them know, hey, I'm ready, I can do this. And at the time we had just bought and put in a studio there in Columbus, Georgia with a non linear system, all the hard drives, and and nobody knew how to run it, like, didn't really know how to

turn it on. Even our main editor, who actually had worked at NASA. He was had the big you know, like a cockpit and all these machine to tape to tape and and c G and you you know, hit this button, something flew in so nobody knew this. This is back in there, like I said, early nineties, right when the Avid come out. So I was really really anxious to get back and say, hey, guys, I know how to turn on. I know the basics, and I can teach you all this and then we can we

can roll, you know. And so for me being this Turkey calling guide, I was like, man, I'm finally gonna have some technical prowess when I come back. Well I get well, well, that's so I'll spent a lot of time with the instructor or teacher. And um, so at the end of it, each class, um, at the whole, at the end of this school, when everybody graduated, they had had this big dinner and every night we had a mess hall. We can go in there, and um there was a vegetarian line which I never had seen

anything like that. I mean, I on Golden Corrawl, by god, you know, when you're done, you made that dawn ice cream, you know, trying to throw it back and so all it was so new man, and I'm like, man, hey, what is this Like, Man, You're in the wrong line of why hell, this is where the you know, get you a little prime real right, okay, And the most importantly they had I just earned twenty one and they had a draft beer that you could drink free. If

you're twenty one, you could have rolling rock beer. So I might never had a roll around. Yeah, And I was drinking. I mean, I was drinking it every night. And so that last night, you know, I know that we get to show our project. And so the instructor literally says, hey, you know, we had a great class and you don't want to introduce you And they called all our names up and there was a class of

about twenty of us. It was in his class. And then he says, and also too, we're really really cool that we had a guy that is working for an outdoor company and so um we better. Yeah, I said, we want you to come introduce this project. And it's

called the One that Got Away. So it was all this footage from Dale Earnhart to Larry why Soon of we hunted with a lot of biologists back then and writers and uh and I remember and he said, but I'd like to get one of our class members of Michael Watt Hill to come up here and talk and that now I'm sorry and got a little buzz you. I might think, Man, I'm eating lobsters last night and I'm not ready for it. So I get up there, and I remember I got up on the mic and

made the comment. I said, hey, I said, man, it's such a cool honor to be here, and thank you all for the hospitality. I didn't know what to say, but I remember I said, but yeah, this is pretty this is pretty neat to be able to edit this together. And I said, we did it with our classmates. And I said, and uh, it's called the One that Got Away. And for some reason I went to and I said,

I hope you all enjoy. And then I went to step off, and I stepped right back and said, but by the way, every day on one of them are dead. And and I walked off. And so some of the ladies and girls in one dude in particularly, he was so pissed. They just glaring at me. I said, truth, I said, Man, I didn't grow up blind. Now, I said, that's I said, I just ain't Quentin Tarantino. This stuff is really dead. This is ain't fake. And so the

people working, oh wow, there's deal earn hurt. Yeah, some some of them were, but they were more like appaul to and like I said, you know, and I heard y'all talk a lot deep on that, and and I love the documentary I'll put together. I text you on that the that's on Netflix, and um, I thought that explained it. Well, yes, oh my god. And I loved how you know, he was able to interview the people that was probably on the fringe of, you know, not

even understanding hunting, but forcing them to look deep. And and I think sometimes us as hunters, we have to look deep and see that maybe maybe we did grow up different and we understand it. But I think once we can help explain why we do it and how we do it and the different reasons, then it makes it, you know, clear. And so for me, that was a huge learning experience because I didn't I really didn't know.

I honestly was completely ignorant. I wasn't dumb. I was ignorant to the fact that I just everybody I had met was like meeting Seth. It was like meeting you. Was like, even though we might not enjoy the same things, we still like you know you ice fish well, I catch you call it crappy. I call it crappy, and you know, we we fish in the spring and and you know, and y'all fish on the ice. But they still was this common bond. And so for me, I was completely like I was calling my dad and like, Dad,

you ain't gonna believe this. There's folks they don't hunt. They don't even like it. They don't like it, they don't even they they hate me. I quartered a couple of times. But uh, a guy that comes on the show off and named Patrick Dirk and who grew up in the community in Wisconsin. And he described it once in a piece of his writing where he said, if you're not a deer hunter, you share a bed with one. Yes, of where you know, of where he grew up, right, I know Pat, he is a great guy. And that

is a hell of a quote. I haven't heard that, but that is true. Though that's true. What do you think of say that all hadn't happened, What do you think you would have wind up doing for a living? Honestly, I think I would have. I would have been out there working with my hands. My dad was a contractor.

Um I went to heating and air school in the process of working at realtory, so I would there was a part of me that I thought that what I was doing in the hunting space and guiding and getting to do and run a camera, I really there was a part of me because of the system I grew up in. I thought that that was almost similar to getting the guitar and moving to Nashville, or going to l A and saying you're gonna be a model and maybe you met somebody. I didn't really think i'd make

a living at it. I just knew at this particular time that I was young and and had really not a lot of responsibility other than one day being independent pay my own bills. I had went to heating and air school and learned heating and air technology that I didn't know, but so I thought, you did that, but you working with realtary guiding And then and then after I had started kind of a guiding and doing that stuff, I would I I would leave and I didn't have

a full time job at Real Tree. I was just guiding some during deer in Turkey season, running cameras a freelancer, so per per day type of work and um, and then I would go back and I'd work with my dad, and then I worked full time for over a year in heating and air, just doing residential residential, just troubleshooting installing heating and air units, and and that was also a kind of a new fad where everybody was doing

the refrigerment reclaiming. And so I had gotten certified in that where you know, used to he just cut the lines if he changed out of unit, and all the free on would go up in an atmosphere, and so that was in the process to where you know, he was reclaiming this. And so I was. I was young, and I knew how to work all that new equipment.

As a matter of fact, had a chance to help even order it for some of the the people I were working for and telling what was the best system, because I had just come from this tech school learning it. And I remember even that just being young and enjoying that, and I thought that that would be what I would do. And I was always kind of driven that I wanted

to try to be the best at something. And I remember thinking, I don't know if I'll always work as a heating and air guy, but maybe one day I can own my own heating and air business and work in conjunction with my dad. And my dad, you know, grew up very country and actually uh quit school when he was sixteen and really has about a night grede education. And um, my dad was barely literate, like you still can't read and write a lot. And so I've never

seen somebody work so hard in my life. But I also realized that my dad just had struggle even writing checks and taking notes and stuff like that. But he could build Empire State building. I mean, he could build anything here in Bozeman. So I remember early on thinking, Okay, I got this heat in and air background. My dad knows all the bells and whistles how to build, So maybe I can try to be a better business person and help my dad from the parts that he was missing.

And I knew I had my dad there from the work ethic of pushing me to you know, if you had to be there at eight, my dad be out there with a light at six, you know, harmon and working. And so that's what I thought I would do. And I and um and as and as time went on. After about a year or two of doing this with real tree kind of guiding and running camera on the side, David Blanton in off from me a full time job

to work there in the video production and uh. And at that time it was eighteen thousand dollars a year on salary, and he could have said, he could have said three thousand dollars a year. I'm like, man, I'm working at Real Tree. Did your dad think it was frivolous or do you think it was cool? My dad was the only one who thought it was cool. Um. I remember my grandmom and really blue collar. I mean

we were really blue collar. Like my my family was so proud because I had the service van with my name on it, my gaugees hung up in this truck. So by the system that most all of us are raised in, this conservative you made it in life that he's got a good job. You know, Man, he's making fifteen dollars an hour and they said they're gonna get benefits and they might even have a four one K next year. I had made it like what Ell is doing good and I'm so proud of you and um.

But when I did mention it to my dad, my dad was like, that'd be good. You know. He had met Bill Jerden, he had met Real Tree, and he saw the money because he was the one that would take me to these turkey calling contests when I was young, and he saw that it was an industry, and uh, he saw that there was an opportunity that you if it's an industry, well obviously there was working it. And so he was really the only one. My uncle's and

my grandmama. You would have thought that I had gotten on drugs and was going to play with the doors, you know, like I'm gonna play backup base for the doors. You know, I really thought that's what it was. And I was just, you know, like God, he had it, got this solid thing. Yeah, he's going to Montana to put up Montana tent canvas tents with Steve and what do you know. It's like, what's going on? And so uh and they just couldn't fathom that you can make

a living hunting and fishing. But I couldn't never get across to them that it was more than me just hunting and fishing. It was it was celebrating the space,

and we were selling products and there was bows. They were Arabs, you know, in this case, there was I'm a flage and Bill and his licensing program was doing receptionally well, was making VHS tapes at the time that led the DVDs and producing shows and so even for me, I was taking all this in real quick, but it was hard for me to go and tell my family,

and so, uh, it was a big change and quickly. Man, I just was blown away just getting a chance to go to Las Vegas of the Shot Show, going to the Archild trade show, these big conventions and uh, talking to Karen the other day. You know, I didn't know what to do with myself because I didn't know should I talk like I'm talking to y'all now, or should

I should I wear khakis? And you know, you know, we need to see you coming in and you know you've been catching beavers this morning, so that okay, this is real real, Yeah, that's yeah. And so I was, you know, I didn't know it like you man, you know, what what do I wear? And Real Tree would buy you all these pants and new breeches and shirts and little wolf vests and stuff, you know, because we had an outfit. When can go to a t a go

to the Shot Show? All right, coded, we're gonna wear this, everybody, We're gonna wear this, And everybody was moaning and complaining. I was like, man, they bought me some brand new L. L. Bean bridges. You know. Man, them suckers are seventy dollars a piece. You know, I'll take, you know, And we'd have olive in a khaki and a brown and I thought it was a coolness. I'd be the first one, Oh dude, But it was occer because I'm standing there, you know, and you like, I don't know. It's kind

of like on Talla Day and nice. I didn't know what to do with my hands. I didn't know how to come across, you know, It's really I was I was smiling, I was happy, but I didn't know how to celebrate certain things. And then finally, um, I think the biggest turning point in my whole career was that first year. I remember we went to a big meeting up in Nashville, Tennessee, and Viacom had just bought tenn Or. Honestly,

I might be ignor. I don't know if they just bought it, but in Viacom might have always been a big part of the national network. But I do know that Viacom at that time on t n N they also owned uh They owned uh MTV, a bunch of networks, and obviously who's that guy he used to run via comback in those days. He married like Cathy for like a wellness person, Kathy for us than what. I can't remember it, but I remember I didn't know. I didn't know about then or workings, you know, but I remember

being very excited to go to this producer's meeting. And at the time, there was a lot of people that I really looked up to, you know, people like Hank Parker who had a show, Mark Sosa who had a fishing show on the network, and then really the only big networks that was celebrating hunting and fishing at that level was TENN and ESPN and UM. And so anyway, I went, and I was just like, couldn't believe I was getting a chance to go to this to be

around these peers. Jackie Bushman uh was there, which you know, that phenomenon in the nineties, that whole Buckmaster thing was growing, and and anyway, it was just I was just kind of flatter. And I remember I met this guy from MTV and UM and he he was really condescending, not just to me, but he was so you guys, y'all, the y'all, the BANDI Killers and was smirking to hit it, and dude, my inner just country boy. Try. I just

wanted to knock him the hell out. I remember just wanting to hit him so bad, like and probably in another setting I would have, but I realized I was representing real tree and boy, it just pissed me off. And every time I tried to talk to him and I was eager, I was like, dude, man, I'm a big fan at that time. Paul Shot remember Polly Short. Yeah, like, yeah, I'm country, but I'm watching this every episode and so I'm like, man, what it was like Martha something, Kurt Loder.

Kurt Loder remember all these yeah, math totals, there's like a major Like he was like a podcasting pioneer, right, Adam. It was like he had the Feathered Minutes and this should have been ninety six, and all these people came out of came out of there and went out to do all these different media things. They were like they even coined there on terms like VJs. Remember that video video jockeys. Well, I I was. I was for some reason. I guess what really led to a little let down,

And it wasn't all the MTV crew. It's This was one guy in particularly, I've never even got his name, but it was very obvious that he felt he was a little smarter and we were the red next step children there because we were the hunter and we were the outdoors man. It was important to him that you knew this. It was important that yeah. Yeah. And so as I got to talking to him, I I said, well, I said, man, I can tell you ain't a hunter.

I said, but ma, I would tell you, buddy, I said, if you ever come to my neck and woods, I said, you would enjoy what I get to do every day. And I said, uh, and I know you've got some heroes in this room, but I do too. And I was pointing out, I want to say, even Babe Winkelman was there. And I said, you know these guys right here in my world that I know. I said, I respect him. And I said, and uh, I respect y'all,

but you might not respect me. And I said, but if you ever come around my woods, I said you you would enjoy it and you'd be treated with great respect. And uh, and I think you'd walk way of different. And I remember it didn't really hit home. He say, oh, you know, he kind of walked away, and I remember I wasn't And when I said that, it kind of I said it. It defused my anger of wanting to hit him literally, because for me, I'm a culture guy. Like if if you're in my family or on my team,

you can make fun of me. I I told you I'll beginning the podcast, y'all can say what you want to me. I'm just real funny about the people I love. And if you you know, it's kind of like your brother's sister, you know, we can talk about him like I swear, they are you hitting on nothing? But then

somebody else says you ready to fight? And so for me, I felt like he was slapping at a Bill Jord, and he was slapping at a Cuss Strickland or Toxic Hayes or these pioneers of these companies and and um, and I remember walking away, and I remember telling Bill that night, Bill Jordan, because Bill would always just the nicest guy, would never want to offend anybody, and said Bill, I said, man, I walked the tight rope, you know, And I said I didn't want to be too country.

And Karna and I were talking about this yesterday, and Um, I said and I realized that all I can think about is I don't want to be around folks like that. I want to be back home on the IT Road in Georgia. You know, we're somewhere out in Nebraska and with my buddies, these farmers, these ranchers and people that

understand the balance and the good Lord's renewable resource. And I'm realizing more and more through that condescending nature and how they judging that we are some of the best people and best organizations and best assets to America this out there. And I said, and I will no longer, you know, make any excuses for what we do. I said, Bill, you are a hell of an entrepreneur, and you made a lot of money. And I said, and and the people that support And at the time, I think we

had about thirteen or fourteen million license hunters. I'm not sure exactly what that number is now. And I said, and this up to us to to stand up for it when I'm making excuses, And I said, I catched myself this whole night feeling like I need to shake somebody's hand to make an excuse that we're the hunter. Sorry, And it bothered me. You know, here I am two, and I'm sure Steve, you've been in some certain situations

like that. And I walked away. And I think that was the biggest part of my career because I started realizing, I got very comfortable about who I was, who who meant the most too and and uh and like I said, there was everybody that was part of my team and that I knew have become friends with, from people that truly hunted just for substance and and to put meat on their table. I knew a lot of trophy hunters,

I knew conservationists, I knew environmentalists. I knew just a good old boys who just wanted to drink a bud wise and sitting on a dove stool, you know. And I knew people at that point, you know, up in Michigan and Pennsylvania. And I started putting it all together.

And I think that was when I really become proud of the culture and really started I shouldn't say fighting for it, but just being able to know that I could go head to head with anybody that would try to downgrade the culture, not not just what I like to do, but all of us like to do. I mean, you know, some of us, like d I y, some of us work all week and maybe it is a an outfitter that you trust in to take you hunting. Um. You know, some people like to chase a big trophy,

mature animal. Some people literally want to shoot a dough just to have some skill at meat and grind some burger for their family, especially among what we see and now. And so I think that was the biggest change in part though, and that was ninety six, and slowly I think that led to the less I really cared and just become more comfortable as a personality because I never dreamed of being a personality. I just I couldn't believe

I was hunting, fishing and doing these things. And I think that's when people could either hate me or like me, but potentially at least respect me maybe and UM, and so that was that was a turning point for sure, stive, no doubt. I came up. I came across a lot of that same disapproval you're talking about, UM back in

various circles. Because through book publishing, you know, I was just introduced to New York, and through TV I was introduced to Los Angeles, and I found that a couple of things would happen where I would talk to people and they would be we would get into like hunting one on one, and they would be pleasantly surprised to learn that there were hunting regulations. Yeah, pleasantly surprised. Like that's how sort of like they that in their mind

you just like went into the woods and just whatever something. Yeah, he'd be like, oh, no, Hormett, because here's this. Let me, let's explain this whole thing. There's these things called like biologists, right, and they do like these wildlife surveys and they issue and they'd be like, no ship. And that made me realize the value of having some amount of conversation. And the other thing I would realize is that growing up in a rural area, um, we would do the same

thing to people that lived in cities. Is what we thought. People live in cities do us like everything's filthy, Um, everything's rats every you know what I mean, You're gonna you get robbed, you know. It looks like I was like, yeah, you know what, I guess I got it like an all fairness. I gotta look and be like, man, we have stereotype, like we grew up in the west side

of Michigan. Um, it was just like taken as a The only time I every went over to Detroit is we had to go over there for a school event one time, and we went over there like if we could have brought shotguns, we would have brought shotguns. There's no coming back a lot from a school event, you know, like from a school event Troit. So it does like you know, I think it does cut both ways, but there is that there is that little bit of um,

you know. I attribute it more to like I treated more like there's sort of like assholes in every walk alife and that that thing where someone's gonna go like, oh okay, dear slayer, okay, baby killer. You're like, you know what, man, even if you lived, even if you were a hunter, you'd still be an asshole. Yeah, you would be probably probably deep down an you gotta be that.

You gotta have it be that. Um you got everyone's number, like you see through everyone or you know, like you know what's really going on and hey, I want to ask they think about how many kids do you you have? I got five, four boys, one girl, I got one girl. Yep, four boys? Yet do you um do you lean on them about what you want them to do, or do you take the same approach that you wish people would

have had with you when you were a kid. You No, I definitely take um a different approach, I would say, because I think I learned. I think all of us sitting here realized that we're being able to do something that's very all American, like holy cow. I mean think about today. It's a was it Thursday during the day and we're sitting here getting a chance to just talk. This is something we do around the campfire and share

it with the world. So I definitely push my kids too to not worry about The safe conservative route is to is to look and right now while you're young. You know, if you want to break it into statistics or percentages, you know you got You know, if you look at say an entertainer Bruno Mars or the uh those guns and Roses and those people that play in band or actors and actresses and even people get do what we do. Um. Obviously, it's tough to get there.

A lot of doors have to be open. You have to have a ability, you have to have talent, you have to have so many things that happen you have to have good Lord's blessing and and the will be done. However, if you don't go for it, then you might be better later in life. So I tell them, now, push for the things that you think are unachievable, and I'll support you. You know, go for that ten percentile, because think about it, if you break it down into the percentages.

If there's a ten percent chance that I can be on a podcast with the Meat Eater Crew, or be like those guys, or possibly create a company like Bone Collector, or maybe make it as a country singer or an actor and actress. Whatever, well, if you don't make it, and you really wholeheartedly tried, guess what you got a ninety chance of going and getting the job at Afflack and sell an Insurance. Yeah. And and like I said, I'm not even downgrading that. I'm not even downgrade anybody

that does that. But I know all of us here would be pretty miserable if we'd never tried this. I mean, I think right now, I think the common ground all of us setting here, I guarantee you if we had to go work at Sonic tomorrow, we would think bang, like, holy cow man, what a heck of a ride man. We did some things, and we achieved some things. I got something on Netflix. I did a hunting documentary talking about the culture. You know what, I feel good about

flipping this burger right now. But I did it. But if we would have never done it and thought we had the potential, I think that'd be catastrophic and psychologically damaging. And I think sometimes people don't go for it enough. But all of a sudden, if you are forty eight, you say, I'm forty eight and I've got five kids, and I tell my wife, hey, I think I'm on. I know what I'm gonna do. Getting back to the sling Blade comment, I'm gonna call the boys and I'm

heading to Nashville. I'm getting the band. Watch out, Zach Brown, here I come. You know I can't do that. I got a mortgage, I got insurance to pay. I got cars. You know, you got all this stuff. You got kids, and with five kids, you know, four boys, my god, they eat Yea, we have to eat a lot of wild game. I understand your message, because we have to eat a lot just because getting Ford ribis for all these state night is when me and mama are alone. But anyway, With that said, I do push them stive

to say go for it, man, don't be afraid. Don't be afraid, you go for it. Like my son is a really good guitar player and singer. He's twenty one, about to graduate college. He's on a fishing scholarship at Manafalu University. He's like, Dad, what would you think if I went to Nashville fishing scholarship? And um, they they they I've been so proud of him and it's been amazing. Does he want to continue with that? You know, he

loves fishing. I don't think he does want to stay at the level of trying to be saying elite pro He's been around all of this, like he he was very pumped. I was gonna be up here with you guys today because he follows you all. A matter of fact, the whole whole university. I mean, I have to give you guys a hell of a lot of props on what y'all been able to do, especially with the younger generation.

I mean all I mean, I got a lot of my buddies, uh, I mean I say my buddies, But these kids at these schools are gonna they're gonna be jack when they I can say, hey, man, I was on meet either pod kidding me, you know. And and so if it comes old man talking speaks, let me tell you about my fake gains in this Turkey how ye with so so yeah, it's it's amazing. But those kids are are amazing, and I know they got that opportunity.

And I think Mason being around this space, even though he loves the competition part of it, I think he's more interested in the path of you know, media and and just the business parts of it and and seeing the the pr and the opportunity. Being that he grew up around real tree, He grew up around the clothing manufacturers, these farm companies, the bow and arrow manufacturs, personalities like yourself, um,

you know in Fisherman. I think he is more intrigued to maybe do something deeper with the people of the in the person not necessarily have to be a personality, but just I think he really respects the space, and so I think that's what he do. But right now he's he's really good at singing and playing and I and through our working met a lot of country singers and they're like, man, you already get your boy, come up here and we jam and stuff like, I said, Mason,

you are to do that? I said, what think of about it? Dude? What have you got right out of school? What have you got to do? You can get your job anything, just scratching up a little a little opportunity for for a beer on a Friday night and play guitars with people like ire Dean and Red Akins. And maybe if Blake comes to town. I said, you know you can call in Mason, you hang out. And I said, why wouldn't you do that and see where it leaves and just have fun, enjoy and learn from the experiences.

So I am if you want to say, everybody would look at me and say, this old redneck is gonna be the ultimate conservative. Boy. Get you a job and you're gonna go to work. Get this shovel and go to work. But and I do want them to work. I'm big gonna work ethic. But now's the time because once you get married, you got a kid on the way, and you got that mortgage. Uh, that's a different day. Like I ain't paying for it, get you back back. You know, you better figure out how to pay for this.

And funny you say, a very good friend of mine growing up. He followed you know, all on the wild cards, right, and he ended up going into the tech industry full time. His dad, who just recently retired from the railroad here um very similar to to your father's growing up, right, It's like, oh boy, oh boy, Well, tech job takes off. He ends up getting a big paycheck, has it like three months of not working right, and his dad's just losing it, and finally has a talk with him and

he's like, Okay, you did all that. Uh, there's a job with the city opening up. Time to get that pension there you go, right, and it's just like it's still just like yeah, it's like this is concrete. You followed the thing. You got a big paycheck. That's neat. He's like, but this is what we know as like safe that you know, it's funny that brings up in that. I mean, I know, I'm here, you know, talking and y'all asking questions about what I act you have to do.

But I've often found an interesting because you know, Steve, I know you probably run into this. Probably the one thing I noticed as getting the chance to shake hands and meat hunters across the country is. It's it's like a love Hey. They're like, what's up? You know? And I've seen I've seen him with Steve and I used at nw KEFF last year or the year that last year, they had it in there what's up me? D oh? And you can tell what they're doing. It's like love you,

but you know, somebody got to paint this house. Somebody still got to work in the concrete business on the bullfloat. But hey, good glad, y'all having fun? You know, Hey glad, you called a beaver this morning. What you guys call work? Yeah, what you got? And so so it's almost like I catch myself like hugging them, like, hey, man, I get it. I would hate me. I would I would hate me

too if I'm you. But at the same time, you can tell those respect, you know, And that was awesome at and so it hit me I thinking, man, there is a little bit of a problem. And I don't know if it's parenting or what it is, but I feel like the more you love something, the more you push it into this conservative very safe and I certainly saw it with COVID to where it just hit me

how afraid fole are of everything? Everything and I mean making a living, the insurance or hey, you ain't got health insurance, or you ain't got this, you ain't got that, and you and I'm thinking, well, first of all, you know, I'm a praying man and I believe in God. And I'm thinking, well, you know, you know, there's a certain part of this to where I shouldn't worry about this,

no way, And I understand wherey and planning. But then I think we are all kind of raised up to say, all right, go to college, get you a good job. And in the process of everything, where where are we really living and following certain dreams? And I found that there was a lot of people that's very frustrated and and bitter and almost depressed, not because they didn't make it, because they never really even tried. They made it their upper middle class making good money. You know, they're going

to their girls dance recital every year. You know, they're coaching tea ball and stuff like that and doing good and that is the American dream. But yet they'll shake Steve and I hand and like, hey, must be nice. But then I want to say, well, you don't realize I didn't get ever get the chach I coached tea ball for the first time last year. I'm forty eight, I got four boys, and last year was the first time that I said no enough to things that I'm like, no,

I'm coaching t ball. I got you know, I got a five year old, and and all my other kids are seventeen fourteen. I'm gonna coach ball. I'm just gonna say no to some things. And and so I did miss that part of it, you know, I missed. I remember people talk about Seinfeld and friends. I never saw. I couldn't have told you who in the National Championship in the nineties because I was work, I was gone, and the Elk camp going anywhere and everywhere. I couldn't

have told you what a friend's episode was like. So the mundane that most moms and dads could sit down and get your kids bedy and watch Seinfeld, I didn't even know. I didn't even know it exists. And I didn't even owe a Super Bowl that might be the only NFL game you watch because you're just working in

your grinding. So I do realize that we're blessed, but we did work hard to get here, and we possibly could have fell on our face and and and where I look at it is sometimes I wish people would be more motivated, especially early in life, to just go far it just try, because what have you got to lose? I never I never had to deal with any of that crap from my folks, and um they were my dad never. You know, he didn't finish high school. He

left high school to fighting the war. Um, he was just elated and had really overestimated what I had done by the time he died. So he was he was on like a six month They're like, you have six months lived from cancer and I had done one story and outside and I've done like two things for field and stream and he was dying and we went down to Florida to fish. I remember going into a you know where you're going to buy like a bucket of shrimp.

You know, him basically coming in through the door being like, have I got a surprise for you guys. He gets just mettled in Michigan. He's did three articles and fielding streams like you're talking, that's amazing. He was just beside himself with excitement. You know, it was nice to not have to deal in that garbage. But when you up we kind of talked a little bit how you got going when you went to start your own thing and and do bone collect did you have like burn bridges

and piss everybody off and everything? They're like, hey, good luck. You know what I didn't feel like when I was doing it, I was burning bridges. But I think there was an optic that maybe I was because I was working full time at Realtory and I've had the show, a show called Realtrey Road Trips that I just I don't even know how I got lucky enough to do

that show. But it got more around the whole standpoint of just the fun and the campfires, and I realized that a lot of these personalities were super funny and cool and and and back. The NTNN was very starch, very perfect. Every hunt scenario is perfect. Everything everybody said

it was perfect. So I thought that they might be a good lane for for the for the fun of of hunting in this camp and that venture and so um when I pitched that idea to Bill Jordan and David Blanton for Outdoor Channel, because Outdoor Channel was brand new, and that was when you'd go to the Golden Muse Awards and literally there was beer in a bathtub and it was in somebody Sweet, you know, and um and so at the time, you know, the politics are getting kind of strange at t n N and it went

away at that time. Realtory Our Outdoors was on ESPN at the time, and it was very strict. You couldn't show any impact shots. Um and and they you could like a blood prohibition, very big, like to the point to where you couldn't even have your own creative vibe or style. How we were blessed. Now we can still kind of say this is kind of what I want, this is a portrait, and we we produce it and paint it and we put it on a network. Even what you're doing on Netflix, it's still what you wanna do.

It's not dictated. Within ESPN would dictated. They told you how your show was gonna look. And I always thought it was kind of strange. And so I remember early on and saying we should do something. We're on Outdoor Channel and Bill and David agreed, and so I pitched him this idea of that real Tree road trips and they said, well, yeah you should, that's one we should produce. And they said, I don't know who we get to

host it. I don't even know if it needs a host, but I think if we could just have a spinoff show off this TNN show, you know, if we had these guests, because I remember, you know, going and have a lot of writers, Pat Dirk and being one on. We'd all go to hunting camps and stuff and we're looking for articles. Remember Jim Shocky would be there, and

you know, I was it was cool. But obviously we'd hunt deer and we'd built a big fire and you know, we eat a good food and and so I remember there's all this fun stuff happening, and uh, and I thought that that could really be a tactful way to present the fun and the real camp life. And so that was road Trips And so Bill and David said, well you host it all right? Well no, I didn't pitch this for me to to be on TV um. Bill and David were letting me hunt a little bit

as a reward. That was my Christmas bonus, Like, hey man, you know, why don't we let that old kid wont he alred to run? Let him go to Texas this year and try to shoot a deer. And they's like, hey, you got something to tell you. And it'd be like a kid, you know, try to get the cracker Jack prize, prize out of cracker Jacks. My get go to Incinatus. We're gonna let you both hunter deer down there, you know. Man, just be so excited. And so I got to hunt

a little bit. And I was getting a chance to do some turkey calling like tips, you know, because I know I was getting some on camera. So I wasn't like hired as a personality, as highed as a producer or editor or whatever, you know, jack of all trades, I guess. But when we had come against the wall and have a partner or turkey calling partner or something around turkey, that's like, we need a good turkey tip

in this episode. But here's the thing, because but you were already like you're already a champion caller, and and that kind of led to that. And even before I think you'd have gone think had I guess no one knew, I would have think you'd gone right into being like a forward facing person. Yeah, and I wasn't. I definitely what my thinking. I had always been very humble but also very confident. You know. It's like there's a fine line there is, you know where I never thought much

about it. It was never on top up of mind, like, man, one day, one day, I'm gonna be a hunting show host. I remember thinking, Man, I hope I get to hunt. Oh I'd love to hunt Saskatchewan. God, it would be unbelievable to Alaska hunt moves? Are you kidding? Made up? Be a dream? And I always think about how could I save enough money or how would I get lucky

to do it? Never did I think I'd get to do it and present it on a show and so h but I think I think, Um, you know, what happened was is as everything got to grow and I just got these opportunities to to do things that I never dreamed of. And and so for me, I'm still humbled and and I pinched myself with it. And I wouldn't. I was not expecting of it at all. For sure, I wouldn't. I didn't plan it. What year was that? What what year was the first uh bone collector you know,

first bone collector property that came out? It was a two thousand seven was when I left Realtrey. And and the reason to even getting back to that at the road trips that created a good bit of success for not only the company but for myself. And so I was getting opportunities at that time during road trips, working

full time as an employee. And Real Tree was a pretty big corporation, um, even though it's privately on but we had you know, a handbook, you know, HR department, and we had policies and parameters of what you could and couldn't do. And one of the things you couldn't do is is certainly accept any money from any of the partners, um from these licensee where a licensee based company to where you know, if it was a clothing company, UM, they would pay a royalty to put that camel pattern

on their products. So you know, in your case take a first light. They couldn't have paid me to say, Hey, why l could you come to an appearance for us at Cabella's you know you know which you know like, no, I can't accept that money. So what happened was I was starting to get all these requests and opportunities mainly from the partners or road trips, and I kept bringing it to Bill, Jordan and David and they said, man, you can't, you can't accept that. You can't accept that money.

I'm like, well, how do we handle this? And even Real Try at the time didn't know how to handle it, you know, because it was just really exciting, but also like, holy cow, I can't do this. This is against the company rules. And so I kind of feel like I'd like all these guys here to leave the room real quick. Yeah exactly. And so I remember, I remember, um, I'm very interested it was, but I remember setting. I remember

sitting these managers meeting. They have managers meeting every Monday, and um, and it was a big enough topic that I was getting companies call and I had a guy he helped me tremendous. The guy's name was Shawn Perry and he was from Endeavor Company. Now Philip Morris Endeavor California, you might know sean great guy. And so I mean, I get a call like at real Tree on my little desk and cubicle, and I said Endeavor and I pick it up. He's hey, man, Shawn Perry. I'm an

agent out in California. Man, what are you doing right away? Just cut to the chase. That dude, you wouldn't know it, but I'm I'm an agent. I worked with a lot of stars and I'm just interested. I'm a big fan of show. He said, I'm one of the few guys out here that hunt. I love to hunt. And um. Anyway, and he says, I have talked to this guy. He's a great guy. Man, he's a cool cat. And uh and anyway, he says, well, what are you making? And I said, right down to it? And he said, do

you have any things people are calling about? And stuff? He says, I love Real Tree. I'm a big man of Real Tree. And I remember thinking, holy cow, I feel like, you know, I'm looking on my shoulder like I'm I'm on the company phone here, you know. And anyway, and he says, man, you need a book, you need this, and you should be doing this. He said, I think you can do more. And and I said, well, I got these couple opportunities. And I said, but I don't know how to handle him. I can't do this a

Real Tree. So well, you would have to leave Real Tree. He said, you don't need to go against the corporate policies. It is what it is. But you're I think you're strong enough. You could be on your own. And so I'm like, holy cow, this is a whole another level of getting back to the whole family talk. Now working in unde fishing, but I got a corporate job, man,

don't shake that up. And so anyway, he he said, we'll send me those contacts, and that day literally I sent him over a couple of phone numbers of marketing people. He calls me back that day said all of them said yes. He said, I got you like a couple hun grand if you want to do it as a two year deal. And I'm I'm freaking quick, that quick, like no sort of talk about what the commission would

look like. Nothing, he said, I don't. He even told me so, I don't need I don't need your money, because I think he did minimize it from the standpoint he wasn't looking at this kid from Booger Bottom being Leonardo DiCaprio. He knew that he spend his time getting this film with dream works for him. But you know, hey, man,

I can get this kid a book deal. I can do this, and I can especially when I told him as I'm making about fifty a year at the time and and uh, which which I was toockled to death, but I realized there's more opportunity so right now, you're in the spot. Yeah, and and and I'm yeah, and I'm like, I'm happy, and I'm in this hell of a spot. I don't know how to handle it, and I don't want to be too big for my riches,

you know. And so I go down to the manager's meeting one day, smell, I like, talk to you guys about something. I got some opportunity, but I don't want to you know what, You'll think I'm being ungrateful of my opportunity here. And at first it rattled some change and they were kind of tough on me, like it was pretty hard, like I'm like, man. And then later as I started showing to some of the opportunities, it was Bill Jordan and said, hey, you gotta just leave Realtory.

You gotta be your own man. You gotta leave the realstory, but we'll support you. And and I'm like, and I'm like, he said, but you can't. I can't allow you to do this when I can allow other people in the company not to do it. He said, So you gotta leave, and that means giving up your benefits, You're not coming

into work every day. And so I left, and my first gig was with Gander Mountain and they hired me to host this show called We Live Outdoors and uh and it was an awesome opportunity and and I made good money. And then within a month or two, Realtory we come back and we sat down and put a subcontracting type of contract together where I was still hosting the Realtory road trips. And so from that I was excited. I was kind of set. I knew for two years. But I also remember, um I created one of the

things that Ganner Mountain had had me do. They said, look, we want to reform at our show and make it more around you know, what you think would be cool for your personality. And at that time, it seems like that there's always these stages in the industry, you know, um, you know where where certain things are happening. At that time, I felt like we was having to make a whole lot of excuse, you know, for for hunting. It was

weird it was having to do that. So for me bone Collector, that was a crazy, almost in your face to approach. The reality was it was really wasn't as you know this you know, muscle man and high fiving and killing everything as as it seemed like it was. So it was a little bit of a little trickery and the fact that I wanted to almost offend a little bit and be in your face, but in reality, when you got behind the scenes, you just saw a bunch of smiling guys that just had fun and you

just wanted to be in our camp. So it was a little bit of a we make no excuses. Where a hunter, where predator. It's the way I was born. I'm a bone collector. So that was the school dude, a guy in Alabama. I had this idea, and I wrote this little creed and and actually all of that. Ironically, I put this whole treatment for the show for Gander Mountain and we sat down at their board and they said it was too racy and they didn't want to do it, and they stuck, we live outdoors, and so

literally right at the meeting, I wasn't even deflated. I just thought, well, okay, And then I asked him, I said, well, look, would you have a problem if I trademark that myself and start it. They said not at all. They thought the drawing was raising. Well, they didn't have I didn't have the draw and I just told them. I just told them this big creative idea I had for Bone Collector. And I said, and it wasn't even at the time bone Collector, it was that that creed. I said, I think,

what's happening. I think my exact pitch to them at the time was Gander Mountain was a little bit struggling. Um and and I felt like they were kind of riding the fence. You know, you didn't know if you wanted to be kind of more if you want to use the word granola, I know that can be offense to somebody, but but but do you want to be hardcore here? You want to be hardcore there? I felt like they were straddling the fences. I think you just started just jump into it and be a big corporation

that really jumps into the fishing and hunting. So they couldn't tell if they wanted to go like hike and biking, yes they want to be already, or they wanted to walk through a bunch of zip off pants get to the shotgun section. You're exactly right, and and and I was just trying my best not defend, but also just trying to do my as creative is to say here's what I see as it reflects back to what I think and the people I'm meeting doing appearances in your store.

And I threw him this idea of like, let's just make excuses. Let's let gander mount and be the foremost hardcore cater to the die hard ice fisherman, to the die hard duck hunter waterfowler as well as hiker. But we make no excuses for anything we're involved in. And so you know, and if I'm your guy, why don't we just kinda and with a smile, just say, don't worry about it, don't make no excuses who you are.

This is what you enjoy doing, and it's legal and it's safe, and we're putting back and hunting God's renewable resources and fishing for him. So that was kind of my idea. And so when they said no to it, let's just kind of sticking this kind of Manila very safe lane. If we Live Outdoors, um, which was a pretty good show, but it was like everything else and UM. So then I said, hey, you mind if I do it?

And so I was so busy with with road trips and the wee Live Outdoor, I knew that I couldn't do the shows myself, and so I knew Nick Mutt who was I was gonna I was gonna ask how it went like t Bon, like how that Nick was a guide out in Wyoming, and I just he and I were the same age, and just love the dude. Man. He's just a good hunter, a good people person. Obviously spent a lot of time with a lot of clients, taking them hunting and fishing, and just funny, just funny,

almost like a Jim Carrey type of guy. And uh, he's now married, so he don't cut up as much as he used to. He's had to get serious in life. But and then t Bone was always He won the world championship of boat a s A and he on an archery shop right right above where I lived, and

was probably the foremost bow wrench. And if you had a problem with your bow and he was having problems shooting, t Bone could have you, I mean, like hitting stuff and doing things that you was blown away because he was just a phenomenal at understanding the mechanics of bose. But he was also this this jolly, fun dude who loved to hunt, who obviously wasn't gonna be a Cameron Haynes and run to the top of the mountain first.

But just a great fun of dude. And you know he might be standing on the top of the mount and got a helicopter rride. When he got there, he gave you a Swiss cake roll. Come on steam. You don't like his buddy, you want to what you want? Were there's candy or Swiss cake roll buddy here and you go, you know, and and you just loved him. Everybody loved him and um always smiling, and so I thought, man, these guys, I think they can help out a lot.

And there was consummate professionals and knew the space and so I talked to them about coming on and helping with that. And that's that's really what it was. Yeah, And so it was just crazy and amazing and and and such a blessing. And it still is. And even though I'm a little older now, grayer in my beard, I still feel like a twelve year old. I really do. I was so excited, so excited to come up here and chat with you guys. I mean, I just I

don't take anything for granted. And uh, you know here recently te bon Us, we was Yeah, I don't who who when you mentioned that, I didn't know that this was I didn't know he was going through that. I know, um, right when I come in, right the right, the front desk. Um, we were talking about it. He uh. This past summer he noticed not that was starting to grow on his leg. He's crazy how it happened. I remember he knelt down to take a picture of a deer that Nick had shot.

I think it was in Wisconsin, and we're just gonna take a you know, grabbing grand photo with our buddies. And when he knelt down in the snow, a stob hit him on his shin and like he gave him a big bruise, you know, one of those kind of stone bruise, and like KAILI and um, like that shouldn't have done that. Yeah, that hurt, but it was like a quickly an come up and right on that you know that there's no room for anything there on that bone and it hurts. And um. Well, over time it

just was a knot that wouldn't go away. Well, this past summer it started growing and literally started growing so big it popped through his skin from inside to out, and it was just a terrible sarcoma that grew, and what the hell did they have to do with the I don't know and that, and we're still trying to figure it out. I guess it's just the circulation and that somehow, you know. I don't know how all this tumor and cancer starts, but I guess lack of circulation

certain things and it just becomes. But they mean, I know this isn't like a medical show, But is it the that revealed the problem? I don't know. I don't know. It's it's wild and and that's why t bon like this past October, I noticed he was being real quiet and he wasn't saying anything, and he had told me I was having some problems with his leg, his right leg.

And then later we were doing an event up at our friend's place, Derek Caraway's got Whittaker gunning up in Kentucky and were just having a big promotion and just sporting good store fun time and Tibon I noticed that he was setting down and the one thing I'd always made a commitment to, and I got I got really

choked up. We did a little podcast talking to t Bon is I had made a commitment two when I saw that, man, they would actually people show up and want to shake our hand, like like you know, Seth and I met years ago, and if you and the first thing I noticed were all standing. I said, look, yeah, exactly remember well after the photo for sure, But but I remember I told these guys a man, I said, we should never I said, I don't think we should

ever sit down. I said, if some if a grown man, thanks enough to come by and shake our hand, uh, you know, because that can be hard. There's a lot of pride and ego in a man's world. And I said, man, I want to make sure if they want a man hug of high five will look at trail camp pictures. I want to stand right there on this side of the table. And and so we made that commitment, and I and Tibon and told me, Michael, I'm really worried. He said, uh, my leg is really jacked up. They said,

I can't walk, an't stand real good. He said, I'm in a lot of pain, and and he showed me some pictures and I'm like, oh my god, t Bon, well he's sit down the whole time. So we're doing this promotion and Nick and I are standing outside and I look back there and t Bones kind of stand behind the counter. Man. I got welped up because I knew for t Bone to not be out there with us and to be able to because he's such a people person. He he don't want anybody to be disappointed.

And uh, and dude, I got you. I knew he's going through something. Then later, my wife is an oncology nurse, and so he told my wife, he said, don't tell anybody, said it's cancerous. And one thing led to another, and they quickly knew that there was gonna have to amputate his right leg and so to stop the sarcoma. And they had found a little nodule and he's long, and so they did the typical chemotherapy to to try to hopefully that that sarcoma didn't spread to his long and

and that particular nodule actually shrunk a little bit. And so this past Monday he did have the amputation. He's in a lot of pain, but his attitude is beyond what I can even I don't know that I could handle it. And it's it's been so odd to talk to Tebon about it, because most of the time, you know when a friend calls you with a problem, is typically you that motivates them and reminds it could be if you call men. It's like Steve, hey, bro, keep

your head up. You're doing this, and Bro, you know, you know you love you know this, And it's kind of that motivational And Tebone is calling us and talking about the sanputation, what he's going through, and he's having to motivate us, you know, like what do you say and what do you say? You know, and anyway, he's he's doing better, and uh, it really has helped remind me of that it's gonna be alright, Yeah, it's gonna be all right. I'm doing with this. I have peace

and you know what, You're gonna be fine. Yeah, that's what he's doing. It's like, it's okay, Michael, I'm gonna be fine. I'm gonna have one leg. And and and we're starting to come around like like our crew we we uh and we're just cut ups, you know, just goofing off all the time and hard on each other. And so like the other day, our producer and Nick and I we look and we found him the old leg lamp you off Christmas Carol. So we're getting you.

Hope you don't hear this before I get it to him, but we're definitely, you know, want to get him stuff like that. Remember we're sitting here and someone named Hillary came in the door and I said, I missed. Yes, she's from that town. Are you kidding me? And that house is a museum, no way, the Christmas Story House is a museum with that lamp in the window, Like you can go there and it's like there's the house on the street with the lamp from the window. I

would love to say I love that. I don't even like, I don't know what the hell I thought it was a fictitious town. Maybe it is, but either way that how you still go to wear that where they shot in video? Yeah, the whole thing. I don't know if that guy is still down to the basement beating on the beating on the cole for so, I don't want to get I know this is fresh. I don't wanna get you graphic, but you know how much look a lot of his leg they had to amputate middle of

thigh so way up. And is he gonna get uh yeah, like with with a foot and everything on. I think so I think so he's t Bone is very much a thorough detailed guy. So he does a lot of research and he'll be ranching on that leg. Oh man, he will. He'll have something like robo man. I'm sure Puts probably will. There's no telling, but um but yeah, you know. But then I've heard too that there's you know, and again maybe maybe somebody can comment, you know, and

let us know. But I'd always heard too that there was a weight limit on a prosthetic, like you know that somebody says two hundred feet pounds, but I don't know the technology. But if anybody's unaware, yeah, and he feels pretty confident that. But like most of us men, I think, you know, the way I've always handled tough times is I just minimize it and say, hey man, we're gonna be good. And so I think Tibon is

doing some of that. But man, his attitude and just it's been catastrophic in one way, but the love and the team has never been bigger because it it really like I was walking another day to squirrel hunting by myself and literally got choked up, man, and I got just thinking of not just with t Bon, but just everybody and all these campfires and all these fishing and just and dude, it just hit me hard, like, man, you know, I've been blessed to take some big animals,

you know, and some of them I score, most of them I haven't. But what amazing adventures from from Africa to all over the world to all over the country that no way I was supposed to get to do that. But not just be there, but the people I met that I learned from that understand better their value of hunting and outdoors and being a conservationist to to my take on things, and then it's just amazing. And for

me that was the biggest trophy. And one of those trophies is just all those fun times with t Bon just being the big guy that could take a joke, that could give a joke, that you can never piss him off, you can never not make him smile. It always had a positive attitude and and it just made me just love him even more, but not just him, just all my hunting buddies. And he kind of hit home because we can all lose folks. Man. We get so busy, we're running and going and then I think, man,

sometimes it's just you know, you gotta stop. And what's they'll saying, smell of roses and so that that definitely happened with this, and that the outpournal love across the space and just social media te bon. Every time he gets to talk about he starts crying, not because he's got cancer, because he just didn't even know he had that many people loved him and that would be there if he calls. So that was pretty phenomenal. When he's all up in batter, we should have him come up

on the show. He would love he would love that. I'll make sure he brings his leg land when he comes. And we've already started cutting up like we worked with third Good Boots and and uh and I remember, you know, we literally went from crying on the podcasts with t Bone, big questions, what we're gonna do with all these right foot at through a good boot. So you know, we we you know, what's the old saying to keep trying to laugh, keep from crying, And that's that's what we've

been going through the last week or so. But he's doing good. And and definitely anybody that's made a comment or even listening here and watching, thank you all man. It's you know it. The love has been so amazing to see and feel so thank for all the prayers it's been. It's been cool. Uh. We joked about it earlier, the peak in farm. Yeah, Um, is that like a Legit is that like a way out for you in the end, you know what when you kick back like man,

when I'm sixty five. That's what I'm doing right now, based on the money I've made on it, which has not been enough to even see the light in that, I would say no, but but I do think. I do think I'm learning. It's just like anything else. I'm learning to figure out a way to hopefully make a profit. And uh, I think if anything, it's been a it's been a nice something to to jump into to try to master and learn and grow and and kind of a d stress to be honest with that part of it.

I've loved, Like you know, I too love the trap as I know you do. And for me, trapping is a little different than hunting. It really is such a

stress reliever for me to go trap. And um, but if you like being a twelve year old and and have fun right the toys when you get into that, I was just down in Sacramento Valley and they have a header that goes down in between the tree rows has got two big arms that are triangles with the spinning disk blade on the end of each tip of the triangle, and it goes down the rods and and prunes the trees, you know. And my first thought was, why isn't that on any of these stupid zombie movies.

And my second thought was, I really, I really want to get in that and run up. I know, I know that is fun the toys. What's the nut that? Um everybody's always talking about how water consumptive must not be a pecan, right pecans? And no, I think Alma is like the California gallons of water for every holme or whatever. I don't know what it is, but can take a lot of you. They take a lot of water. I want to, but I don't know. You're growing them in the state that has a lot of water, though,

well a lot of my my orchard is not irrigated. So, and believe it or not, last year we got so much right in the South, I got too much water. So you're not dumping any water, and I'm not dumping any water. So maybe that's your marketing thing. Maybe it is. And if people are throwing out how water consumptive it is coming out of the Imperial Valley or coming out of California, you should just have it be like um

wid Dell's nine your game he can on a prayer. Yeah, dude, I think you need to have it be that like Calistan. You need to happy that you buy a little ship in the bag, a lot going ship for peakans. I could go out to the ultra Southern voice. Hey, everybody, y'all line up if you won't pick hands come from straight God's bounty for harm brain because God saw it fitting small batch artisan nine. My buddy Ronella only aged

meat in these prayer pecans, that's right. And you you'd be like, if you think there's not enough peacans in this bag, it's because we had to make room for this nice handwritten note. Like the story. I could get the picture it and get seth and out of sign it and like, hey, he can started here like nowadays every energy bar when you read the bag, it has

like the story. Yeah, so it'll be like peacans on the prayer began when I made a realization about water consumption in the American, and I thought to myself, I could do better. I could do that. I can do better. Are those the best tasting squirrels? The Peakan eaters? You know what they are for? To taste? I don't. I don't know. I can't tell a big difference, but but psychologically it's got to be. Yeah, I feel, And maybe that's a whole another thing I could get into organic

squirrel pecan pecan fed squirrels. They say that would ducks are the best tasting ducks because they eat so many nuts on their migration. So imagine there's something similar with squirrels. I imagine they would be and I do think, I mean, you know, getting back into really for sure what Steve specializing is. I have certainly noticed the different that animals

in certain regions definitely tastes better. Like you know, you shoot a white tail or mule deer that's been eating a lot of alfalfa, there's a noticeable difference, and that versus a sage mule deer versus you know, even ilk uh in our white tail around home, like in Montana, were hunt in the Milk River. I got those white tail. I mean, we can shoot ten deer in Georgia illegally, So it's not like I hurt for meat. But every time I'm in Montana, I always fly my meat back

because it's just the best. It's just such. It's like if it's the closest to grain fed beef. It feels like to eat with your eyes. Yeah, first, rat eat with your eyes first. When you cut open a deer that's been in an alfa offa field and it's just like overflowing with fat, your brain and immediately commits to the fact that you're like, this is gonna be the best testing deers, right, yeah, we can. We can vouch for mallards that has spent three weeks in the millet field.

They were better, right, I mean yeah, when they get like I've seen them as the fat Yeah, eating hogs. I Marrow was in Savannah hunting hogs. I remember the old time where I was there. But he said one year, he said, these hogs ain't gonna be fitting neat This year it's been real drying. Theyd been eating a lot of snails out in the coast and um in anyway,

and he said this year. I went back to this year, they're fat and they've been eating acre and he said take as many home as you can, so I did, and he was right that that sometimes, you know, whild hawk can be kind of gamey, you know, decently gamey. These were like the ones I remember my pap all raising up, you know and killing on the first frosty day, and I'm like whole I was mad that I didn't bring more like because there was a noticeable difference than

forging on acorns. And then he had a bunch of corn feeders versus them in that hungry because of the lack of acrons on this particular area in island that we were hunting on that they had to forge out there for snails and different things out there. Yeah, I didn't know what's that in Italy? Don't they produce um? Isn't there like a ham or the only the pigs

only to eat acorns? Really, I can't think what the hell it is though, But then they like cure it and all that, like a Serranos, like some kind of Serrano ham. I don't know. There's another angle for your pecans. Hey, we learned hogs on a prayer. Hey, Mike, Mike, talk about tell about how you're so so country that you're

like trying to outgrow eating. Yeah, it is funny. It's funny. Uh, even speaking to t Bone, I grew up so dame country, like you know, I didn't even realize I did until and you hit the nail on the head Steve, when you were talking about how stereotypes of say us that hunt whether you're in rural Michigan, Pennsylvania, or Georgia, Alabama, Missippi wherever, we also had stereotype of New York City or say l A. And then I realized the first time I go, I had the most fun ever, you know, like, dude,

this is pretty cool. I remember going to Las Vegas the first time, and I'm like, you know, holy cow, it's pretty surreal and cool. You know, some things I didn't like and people smoking cigarettes. Yeah, this is crazy. Man, I'm gonna go see that Michael Jackson. So man, I think fifty dollars, but it's fun. Or go see O and these these Broadway shows. And so I realized that, man, there's room for all of us to grow. But um, I grew up so country. I didn't. I didn't know

about those things. I knew about what I knew, and it was so funny even eating wild game like my papa. Man, he was a big time he wouldn't. I never thought of him as a hunter. But he made a little corn liquor and he sold it and and he only kind of lived off the land. I'd never remember him having a job. This is your grandpa. Yeah, my grandpa completely illegally, but I knew it was not yea. But how ironically, the chief of police in Manchester would come

back from old guy named Willie Starring. He'd be down there buying, buying corn liquor, you know, and I'd say he put in his car, Hey blue Boy. They called me blue Boy because that was the first blue, blue eyed grand young and you know, hey blue boy, putting a little to Mason Jars the yeah conference, skating some liquor from the papa. And and so he taught me a lot about like I remember the first turtle traps

we ever had out fish baskets. He used to have quail basket hardcore hardcore, but never did he do it for sport, like I mean, no, no, he stuttered real bad and no, no, all Blue boy, Uh, come on down. Let's now, let's go check the traps. And so we'd go and it was. I remember going bass fishing with him and stuff like that, and he would catch every once in a while in a trap, we'd catch a possum. What possum will come back and he'd start feeding the corn.

He'd feed out this possum or coon and we eat it. And so what's funny was like, uh, he changed his diet and completely changed us diet. Like he'd take a coon or possum and he had this like a rabbit pin and you might be two or three coons in there at any given time, or a possum and he would feed it. He'd feed it from table scraps to like corn bread. I never feed him corn bread. And

you know, possum obviously come to them. He cand feed him out for a couple of months and he could kill them and then eat them, just like just like the domestic pig. He had to feel. So I learned a lot about things and and also another thing, he was so fun and a lot of things he did illegal, but I didn't know it was illegal. Like we had quail in Georgia and he would have quail baskets out and we'd catch a whole cubby and it's completely illegal.

But looking back, man, that night we would equail like we had all equal that night. Or we'd go fishing. And my papa, I'd never seen him in my life throw a bass back, never like a large amount. I mean, son of gonna. We went back scaled that sucker, and and he would never he never was freeze. He put it in um old tupperware bowl and had water, and he put salt in it. Just leave him soap and water. And not only would he cook him, but he uh,

he was with a woman he wasn't. He married. Her name was Claudine, which is country, and held us just like a dollar. Pardon movie, Claudine, you're gonna take care of me. It just sounds like food. Come onto my grandma's house, Claudine. Okay, we're gonna eat good tonight. But he'd have him fish in a in a tupperware bowl, and we have four or five baths in there. And if it wasn't just if it's just him or Claudine, he'd take about two or three and he cooked him.

He'd leave other in a bowl, and so to eat from him, we'd have goat milk in there. So I grew up eating some of this stuff with my poppa to realize that I did like deer and boy, I was gonna get me a good job so I could buy me a piece of chicken. So some of it was good and some of it. Like to this day, I cannot eat goat cheese. I can go to a fancy restaurant and I'm like, man, I have goat cheese, and I'm like, no, because I grew up smelling woman.

You know, having goat milk. It ain't nothing worse if you don't know what's getting into them. Poor a big old chug, you know, goat milk over your fruit loops in the morning. Man, this this ain't I don't think this is that homogenized. You know. I tell everybody, and I'm like, no matter how good it is at the end, yeah, when it kind of like leaves your your mouth, Yeah, I taste goat dust, Yeah you do. It's kind of

like eating have Alena. If you can eat a burrito and you ever, because I've seen you on your show, y'all eat have Alena stuff and then you eat it and it's good, and then all of a sudden, it'll be like two days later, it's like you feel it. You know. So again, my daughter I recently she was eating some McDonald's french fries. Later she commented that, um, she's like, how come when you burp up the food,

it's always the good parts that you taste. I'm like, no one's ever observe that she associates it with mc burp. I was like, yeah, you know that might be like your own private experience. Have you ever seen what daddy tried to carry out? Uh? We one time, speaking of belt and stuff up, we were floating the river for ducks one time for a day and we had someone had taken a dry bag and put all the lunch ships.

My buddy Eric put all the lunch ship in the dry bag, but also put um uh, not a fuel canister, but like you know, the white gas. Remember everybody use white gas for camp stoves because it's the wintertime. So he throws the white gas can in and the food and the sole all in the same rubber dry bag, and that white gas got out. Oh my god, and you could kind of like eat that. You'd sort of faintly. No, there's like a what it's almost like you're smelling white

gas vault eating. But I'm not kiding you, man, I don't know what it was for hours afterwards, burping up like purely clear like it was so it felt like you could blow flame balls. Really the way that white gas whatever concentrate and belch back up and it was like you're like breathing out white gas fume. That is nuts. Yeah, I cannot smell that jump, you know, like if you get like a super sick on like Canadian Hunter when you're sixteen, you can never smell. You can never smell

Canadian Hunter again when I smell white gas. Still this day, I still think of that, Still think of that. True amazing, you know, because you see all this stuff about food and packaging, and you know now they're big on the bottle water and the plastic bottle you know, could cause cancer or whatever. It seems like everything calls cancer. But it was funny because the kids, you know, Halloween, I remember they had a bunch of peppermints and a couple

like Reese's those little you know, Halloween pumpkin egg Reese's it. Man, I'm just like I got a weak spot for them. I gotta eat it. But I remember just the other day, one had been sitting and Dow and I think, man, this this thing's got enough preservative. It survived at the landfield and still in this package. Like I'm eating this sucker, but it's been in a can like a peppermint, and when I ate it, it it tastes like a peppermint peanut butter. H I think, wait a minute, if all this is

air tight, I find that odd there do that? So maybe kind of that theory is correct, you know, you if it's around something just is the coffee this's in this cup? Is it pulling from this whatever? I don't know, but and I've never been one of those guys to think much about it, but to be all paranoid. But the term now is off gassing. It's off your furniture, off gases and poisons you. But also I think the

product line of the farm's expanding. Yeah, yeah, I got peppermint, uh peanut, haven't met flavored prayer pace On the back of the story, You'll be like, one day I had my peppermint's mixed up with my what's what's the pepper peanut cup? Exactly? So uh, we're two things. You're gonna stick around for trivia? Yeah, I'll tell you, man, I'm excited about that. I don't get too excited because here's the thing. Guests, I don't know why it's I'm developing

the thing. Guests don't do well. They suck at it easily, and I'm starting to feel like, um, I don't I don't want to say, I've kind of already sat. You could be jumping the gun here. You might smoke it. But I'm starting to feel like we buy it. There's like an osmotic cause at a word, what's what's? Can I get this before we go into it? And maybe it intrigue somebody come see how the dumb Georgia redneck does on this particular trivia. But what is the subject

lines at all? Hunting and fish? I feel it's all hunting fishing stuff, and I feel like it's spread out around the country across discipline. But then there'll be people that come in like Jay Scott. I think Jay Scott is like encyclopedic, yeah, knowledge about he's been like a guide for a million years fishes hunts, right, what do you get? I think he got zero. He's got a real narrow focus of like question in defense of our guests, gave you a run for the money. He came in second.

Tucker Carlson beat me, gave beat I think he came in third place. Tucker was pretty good in a hunting stuff. Man, he beat me. He did well. Really there was a question where he was the only person get it right. Okay, never mind, we'll see, we'll see. I'm gonna say, that's

what you shoot for beating Tucker. Now man we um you'll notice when we put him up the trivia Shilds, we decided to go Roman numerals, which is boring right now, but we were talking about when we get into a lot of them, it'll be like the super Bowl where you can't tell what super Bowl it is. You said to trust it is a lot it's super Bowl like

xx V. Why you know? So either way, never mind, because Spencer just presented a lot of information to suggest there's not like a guest curse, and I think that it would be fairer in future Spencer, when considering a guest, maybe like lean their way a little bit like when raising peakns Now, I made this trivia, yes, spacing of peak and trees is a four questions like that? Yeah, no, no, I made this episode or I made this trivia yesterday and a couple of questions. I was like, what else

gonna get this? Right? Very kind? Now I'm even more nervous and anxious and excited. Yeah, like you're throwing You're telling everybody you're throwing him a bone, and if he bombs, it's gonna be like geez, they even leaned his way, They leaned his way, and he's still bombed. Okay, Uh tell us, uh tell everybody the best way to go find bone Collector, to find you to find your peak hands on a prayer, Yeah, exactly. Um, well, obviously social

media you can go to a bone collector. We're on Instagram, Facebook, obviously I'm on Twitter, and then also just bone collect dot com. So you guys got a lot of stuff on YouTube, we do. We got a lot on YouTube. You know, we still air on Outdoor Channel and uh obviously every nine o'clock Eastern time we air or you guys libraries on my Outdoor TV two. Yes, we're on MOTV bone Collector there, and then we got some other stuff that we're doing over on wait Point as well.

Just just just trying to do our best to kind of spread the good word of the outdoors and having fun with it. Everybody knows us for everybody. But yeah, it's it's uh, it's there, y'all. Check it out for sure, we'll trag them down. Um okay, trivia game on al right, okay, so stick around, stay on the Meat Eater podcast feed, and you will see game on Suckers Volume three very soon, featuring Michael Waddell, the Pecan Farmer