Ep. 212: Chad Mendes on the Fight, the Hunt, and the Food

the Ronella's for dinner. Yeah, for the first time. Maybe I don't know about that. I've eaten over at your house first. You know what. Your wife's just never joined you. She's always been out, and I've just had you and the kids over. I think it was the first formal total potla is total runella formal dinner. Sure was loud in there. Our house is not very acoustically friendly log cabin, you know, and we just don't have enough bears and lions and shipped on the walls to dampen it down.

You have five kids in there, it's yeah, and he's got a cold rolled sheet steel table, which doesn't help. No, don't help either, But yeah, we're making fun, which if you don't know what fun is, it's basically a bowl of very hot broth that's traditionally made from oxtail. I used wild game stock PHO. I'll point out, Yeah, that's how you that's how you spell it. And uh. Then you add to the stock a bunch of very aromatic um herbs. You charge some onions, you charge ginger. There's

cardamom in there, coriander. I'm sure I'm missing a few, but get the idea very flavorful uh uh strong on the nose stock. And the way it all comes together is you have some rice noodles, you have some raw meat, and then you have some m garnishes like mint leaves, basil, green onions, sliced solid pane, you knows, bean sprouts, and you put the noodles and the meat into the bowl and then you take a big ladle of the super hot stock poured over the top, yeah, over the raw meat,

and uh it basically cooks it um. When you're in a Vietnamese like a noodle bowl restaurant, you can choose from oh basically every cut of meat out there, and I'm guessing that some of them they must cook ahead of time a little bit, but we just used like the tenderess, we used just use backstrap. Well yeah, he used. Um his baby moose got ran overround the road down below his house. That is that baby moose. It's so

pale and we had to eat the whole thing. My kid looks up the hill beyond Yanni's house and there's a bedded kylamuse on the hill. So we're like, probably due to the proximity eating her baby. How's that kid? Now? If I was on a hill and someone was eating my baby down the bottom of the hill, I would be pissed, going, what does that bro? Do you think that was the mother of that baby? Who knows? There's

quite a few moves running around that drainage. So I like to I like to think it was not uh so that we made some fun and I thought, you know, fun, it's just not gonna be quiet because the kids are tend to be Some kids are really into it and my kids, it's like a fifty fifty depending on how they're feeling about how interest they're gonna be in eating fall. That night, they kind of flagged the red the raw meat. Yeah, they like what it was kind of the attitude. Everybody

has the kids. And again some nights my kids tear it up and the other nights it's it's just not what they're feeling. But so I thought, well, it should make a little something extra. And since we're going Vietnamese.

One of the other things I love to eat a Vietnamese restaurant are these fried spring spring rolls that come served with um basically a big stack of lettuce leaves, like whole lettuce leaves, think of like a head of just leaf lettuce, and they just separate them out big stack and also the same thing again basil bean sprouts ALPENI knows all that stuff. And you take the fried uh spring roll, which basically just like a skinny egg roll. Inside of it I had, Yeah, the filling was probably

fifty percent uh. Like a rice noodle. It's like a really skinny noodle that it cooks so fast that you don't even actually cook it like boil it like a traditional noodle. What we do is you just basically put it into a bowl and then pour just boiled water over the top of it and just let it sit in there and for ten minutes or so, and and that's how you get the best consistency out of those rice noodles, and then from there it goes into the

hot bowl. Sup. But it also was part of the filling for these fried spring rolls, which also had like very finely chopped onions, carrots, cabbage, uh, some rehydrated mushrooms, fish, sauce, garlic, a couple other things, and uh yeah, all rolled up Steve Fried And for me Friedman, it was was that that befat tho was in there. Yes, it was, yeah, and my how did you like that double sized West and Fryer like things nice and you can get some work done with that thing. Yeah? Did you want to

see kids eat some ship man? Give them those? Yeah? We took them skiing the next day for lunch. Is cold and uh yeah, like before they touched anything else, their hot chocolate wasn't even drank and they had polished off. I think five. I'm gonna have to take notes on that one. Yeah. Yeah, the voice chatman, what's up? Ten months old? Baby? Ten month old? Yep, I don't know where got it? Yeah, we uh first baby girl probably plan on having maybe one more. The wife's trying to

do maybe two or three more. But I think I'm good with one more, stop at too. Everybody's got everybody's man. We got, we got burned on three, we got we were maxed out for a couple of years there. Now we're in the clear, but it got rough. My my good buddies had one boy and they're like, let's just do one more. Had twin girls. We got three now. So now that you have a girl, are you sort of are you hoping for one or the other for the second one. I mean, I'm gonna be honest here,

I was hoping for a girl. I've always just pictured myself. I'm a softy man. I you know, people see me. I'm this UFC fighter. I'm supposed to be this like extremely tough dude. I'm the biggest softie you've ever met. Like I love having my girls, you know, and just I don't know something about being able to cuddle my daughter. And um, and I'm hoping that she gets into the outdoor lifestyle and I'm hoping that she's into hunting and fishing and stuff like that. I'm gonna do my very

best to get it go in that direction. And obviously that's up to her, but um, you know, I wouldn't be opposed either way. It would be nice to have a boy and a girl. But did you have a rough relationship with your dad a little bit? I had. I had a very complex relationship with my dad, and it made me want a girl because I could. I was like, man, I don't know if I can do all that. Yeah, from the other side, so I was like, if I have a girl, hell would be easy. Yeah.

And I mean I had a good relationship with my dad, like he was always taking us to wrestling and doing all that stuff. But my dad was always kind of a tough ass, you know, And um, I don't know if maybe that's what it was, but yeah, I feel I feel good having a baby girl, and I'm just excited about that. So I had a girl first as as well, and when we were having our second one, we waited, we didn't know, and I ended up rooting to have another girl, just because my thinking was I

wanted them then to have sisters. You know. I see my wife and her sister and they got a strong relationship, and um, I can just look at me and my siblings, and I don't want to say I'm really that much close to my brother than my sister. But a little bit, you know, And I figured be nice that their you know, your sisters. That's what we ended up with. Yeah, oh nice, so they're tight, see that that would be awesome. And I grew up in a household. We had eight people

living in my house. One night, I had too many people. So my mom and my dad had me. And then they split up when I was young, and then my dad remarried. My mom remarried obviously my mom, that wasn't part of this, but um, the woman he remarried had a boy and a girl already and then he had two boys and a girl with her, so all of

us were living in one house. I had lots of your brother your dad had, My dad got city of me, and uh, and that's what I'm saying, Like, Bro, I probably shouldn't make the statement I had a horrible relationship with my dad or anything, but we were close. We He got me into wrestling when I was five years old and wrestled ship every year all the way up through college and then jumped right into fighting. So, um, my dad coached me all the way up through up

through to high school. And it was actually your your coach into high school. Yeah, and once I got to high school, he backed out and let the high school takeover. But um, you know we were talking to another athlete, Um, you know, uh Bo Jackson, and I was surprised to hear bo Jackson say that, Um, he wouldn't want his kid to play football? Really, would you want your would you want your daughter to go into UFC? I couldn't. No. No, I thought you were gonna say wrestling UFC. No, not

a chance. Uh, you know, because like, what is it about it? Um, It's one of the main reason why I got out of it. You guys know Jason Hairston good, I'm good buddies with them. The whole CTE thing scares a ship out of me. UM. I feel like, obviously, with boxing, you know, that's one thing. You're getting knocked down, and you know, you're basically getting flash knocked out and then getting back up and counting it off. I'm back

and then get flash knocked out again. You're saying in boxing, in boxing, you know, so obviously UFC fighting is not that way. You get flash knocked out and the guy jumps on you and finishes you, that's it, you know.

But we box as part of our training, So I'm still doing the same ship in the ring, you know, ten weeks out before a fight where I'm taking repetitive blows to the head, where if I get my bell rung during spiring, we stop it for a second, and we're all too damn hardheaded to be like I'm done, Like let's keep going jump back in there. You know, there's a lot of in my opinions, a lot of head damage that happens. That the sport is so young that we just haven't really seen the long term effects

of it. And I want on your sex. I want to bring people that might not know because we talked about Jason Harrison, so I want to make sure people track what you're talking about is Jason Harrison. He was one of the founders of Citica a long time ago and then founded uh coo you, the hunting apparel company. But he had been a high school college football player.

UM went into the NFL, never played in the NFL, but went into the NFL and practice in the NFL, but had a number of concutions and then I guess it was a little over a year ago, took his own life UM and had observed correct me if I'm wrong this, but had talked about in interviews and mentioned his concerns about traumatic brain injuries and that he would he worried that he saw things in his personality and saw things in the way he responded to things. It

made him like, wow, is that is that me? And then again, um in a way that was inexplicable to a lot of people around him him. And I mean he had everything. I mean, beautiful family, beautiful kids, you know, a very successful company. When like when we would go on hunts, he's I remember multiple times, you know, sun coming up, we're getting you know, on a duck hunt or something, and he'd look over at me and just be like, dude, this is like this is living the dream.

Like we're working right now, and it's like it takes you back and you're like, dude, you're right, Like this is awesome. You know, multiple times, and I know he had those moments of him like he knew he had the life, like you know what I mean, he knew

everything was good. But he had talked to us multiple times about him knowing that he had CT like he knew it, like I'm you know, they had a family plan, like ten year plan, stuff like that like that this was something that they knew was was a serious thing, and you know, it's just kind of a bummer. And for me, like I have teammates that over the last I mean, should I fought for eleven years and from the beginning to when I just I just retired last December. Um,

but I can see them changing. You know, there's certain people on our team where we they take a beating in the gym training and they take a beating in the fight when they get in there, and it's like, dude, you gotta stop. But they just one of the things that you see. UM speech Like a lot of the times you're just like, dude, where are you? What are you saying? Like they're they're talking to you and they

just start jumping around. So it's not like not like like it's not annunciation, it's sort some of it is. I mean, you got a guy like Chuck Ladell. I don't know if you've ever talked to that guy. Sometimes I'm like, ah, I don't know what the funk you're saying. Man. You know, I don't know that. I didn't know Chuck before my college career, so who knows. Maybe he's always been that way. But there are certain guys where they they're talking and you're like, I don't know what's going on. Uh,

you know. And and then also just mood swings, Like there's certain guys that during during training cam saying I mean this is probably understandable, but they'll they'll just flip out like something's not going their way and they throw ship and storm out, you know. And you know, I know that's a that's a symptom just not being able to control emotions, you know, and ship just gets out of control. Um, did that factor into your decision to retire big time? You know? I had my first baby. Girl.

Here's how I looked at the whole fight game. I came out of college. Um, and I told you, I like, look, I i'll fight. I'm gonna first try this out. If I absolutely suck at it, I'm gonna go get a real job. Um ended up being good at it. And I said, okay, and this is this is what age oh shout. I think it was twenty two or twenty graduating college and I got you and you but you've done it during college. No, I just wrestled, so so you had like there's like a transition from wrestling. Yeah,

you're saying. So when you said to know if you're good at it, you mean to know if you're good enough like to make that jump to approached by somebody need to say, hey, you should try this out? Or is it just something that was happening and you're kind of like, oh, I got some You're looking at people on TV and stuff being like, I bet I could kick his ass. No, I mean for me, it was Favor. You're right, A favorite. I don't know. Do you guys know who that is? The California kid? Uh? He was.

He was kind of the pioneer for the lighter weight Guys, you're gonna be disappointed. It's it's it's real interesting to me. But excuse me for not knowing. I'm the same way, man, I get it. Um No, so you're I wrestle the U C. Davis, So I knew you're I through the wrestling community. Um My wrestling coach at cal Poly would put on a six week camp every summer up in Tahoe, and he would bring us in as like counselors and like people that would you know, mentors and stuff like that.

And he brought Favor in as well, and so at that time I was. I think it was my freshman summer going into sophomore year in college. Uh, Favor was there and he's getting ready for one of I think he had fought maybe two or three times when he was getting ready for his first championship fight, and he kept hurting all the other wrestlers because he was doing jiu jitsu like submissions and stuff, and none of us knew what we were doing, and so nobody wanted to

train with him. And he's like, man, I have to work out, Like I gotta fight coming up. I gotta train, and either were gonna have to go back to Davis and start working out, or I gotta you know, I don't know what to do. And I'm like, i'll train with you. I don't know what the hell I'm doing. So I jumped in there and we trained together for the rest of the time he was there, but he like pulled me aside and he's like, dude, I think he'd be really good at fighting if you want to

give it a shot after college. He's like, I have um a gym up in Sacramento. He's like, I have a spare bedroom in my house. If you you can just crash there until you get a few fights under your belt, and you know, you have some money in your account, and I'm like, well, Ship, I'll give it a shot, you know, like like I said, worst case I suck at it and I'll just go get a real job. So we kept in touch all all my

college career and day I graduated. That next day, I threw all my ship in the U haul and moved up to Sacramento. Yeah, moved my stuff into a spare studying college kinesiology, so study how the body moves, just which a lot of that actually helped out my fight career a lot, you know, a lot of the nutrition

classes and just understanding that type of stuff. But um, yeah, So I threw all my ship in his spare bedroom, and that same day I went and jumped into U to pro sparring basically so and they put this stupid funny looking headgear on you, the sixteen ounce boxing gloves shin guards. Why sixteen O gloves just to keep each other from knocking each other out, which there are still guys that got knocked out wearing those. But you just have these big pillow gloves, you know. Um, And I

have no clue what I'm doing. I'm watching these guys. I'm sitting on the sideline and these guys are like trying to kill each other, you know, and I'm like, what the hell did I just get myself? And it was it was it cage Like walk me through how cage? Like people to use the term cage fighting anymore? They do for the time, but it was it like a rebranding maybe. So a lot of people are getting fused

on on the sport. So m m A Mixed martial arts is the sport that's like football, and then UFC is like the NFL, so it's um so people like sometimes I'll get asked, oh, do you do you fight in m m A, Like do you fight in the league m m A? And I'm like, um, I fight in the UFC, but I do fight the sport of m m A. But so I used to be or maybe there's still are other yeah UFC s right, No, so there's only one UFC, no other things they had the same function. Yeah, So so there's the octagon and

ship what was that, Yeah, that's what it is. UFC is still an octagon. It's so there's different organizations, so like Bellator is another organization. So do you have the UFC which is like the top of the top, I'd say probably Bellator is right underneath it, and then one is a new one that they just opened up in Asia. Um. I'd say those are probably like your three biggest right now. Um. But the sport is mixed martial arts. So everyone that's

fighting in those organizations is fighting mixed martial arts. It's just what organization are you in? That makes sense? Yeah, for sure in a from the old days, like when do wrestlers came out of this more successfully than boxer? Like it's better to be a wrestler, I think so, Yeah,

mainly because of in my honest opinion, it's body awareness. Um, Like someone they can learn how to move and put their body in certain positions naturally without having to think about it, versus someone that's just standing straight up trying to punch you. Like those wrestlers, get those guys down and it's game over. You know, if they don't know what to do on the ground, it's pretty easy. You can't. It's hard to punch someone from your back. That makes sense.

What year did you do your first UFC fight? Oh? UFC? So I signed with the w e C, which was World Extreme Cage Fighting, which UM was owned by the same company that owned the UFC, so that was a farm league for the UFC. Yeah, it was like for the lighter weight guys, they did like thirty one five, one forty five, and one fifty five and that was it, I believe, I take that back. They had a few other weight classes, but the majority of it was like to put some light on the lighter weight classes because

the UFC started at one fifty five and up. So I don't I really don't understand why they did that in the beginning, but they eventually just realized this is dumb and they just merged the two and had all the weight classes exactly. So now the UFC just goes from the smallest weight class up to the biggest all in one organization. What was your weight class? And so my senior year one of I got I got, like, you know, pounds, All right, Well that's actually what I went, Chad,

would you like a week to bulk up? Yeah, Steve actually going to the gym so much. I'm starting to looking like j loet I love it. Uh uh oh go ahead, gal, uh you want to continue down the career path here. Yeah. Yeah, so, um, you went from spare bedroom on a sparring team was for somebody or yeah, so our team was Team Alpha Mel. So that was yeah, you're I have put together this team. This is the dream of his that he wanted to build this m

M A team like nobody had done before. And he started recruiting all these wrestlers and we just talked about his favor had the same mentality like wrestling is the best base. So he started getting all these NT double A wrestlers and pulling us all in and we all came together and built Team Alpha Mel. And we we had coaches like so you have your striking coaches, your strength conditioning coaches, you're jiu jitsu like submission stuff type

coach coaches, um. And so you have this one stop shop, um where you can just do all your discipline training and one location UM. And that was kind of unheard of back then when it first started. Like most guys when they were getting ready for a fight, they'd have to jump over this gym and just do their submission stuff. Then they'd have to jump over to this gym and do their strength and conditioning and then over here for striking. So this was kind of like a kind of like

a new thing, new era. Was there, like a revenue share model in there, like what makes the team the team? So yeah, so we all paid a percentage um of our fight purse, so say to compensate all the training exactly. So that's how we divving it up. And everybody paid for all the coaches and everything. UM. And and that's just how like everybody pitched in. UM. But yeah, so we would train, UM. We have all these now training partners on one location. So I got guys that were

in favor of the world champion at that at that time. UM, so I'm training with straight out of college with some with the world multiple world champions, UM, learning the ropes and how to fight and like all the techniques. And UM did that for three months and what was that uh supportive atmosphere? Like were they they invested in you and in getting you uh improved him? Yeah for sure. And that's what was so cool about that team. It

felt just like a bunch of brothers. Like everyone came from the n C double a mentality, like the wrestling mentality you guys had a little bit shared exactly. We all knew each other and we all wrestled against each other or on the same team. Some of us um in college and so coming together everyone, you know, it was it was really cool. Everyone's pretty close. Everyone's helping each other out for fights, and um, I did that for three months before I had my first pro fight.

UM and I still remember. This guy's name was uh, Incarnacion was his last name. He had a whiffleball bat for a leg. One leg was like, I don't know what the hell had happened. Maybe he got in an accident as a kid, but he was um uh really high class kickboxer, and so you know, he's jacked everywhere as other legs all jacked, and he has this one like really skinny leg all the way from the top of the big birth or yellow just yeah yellow, not

the red guy. Nope. And I remember going out there and I it was like like, like what do you mean, like because it had been specially developed as like, yeah, I think he I don't know if it was a birth defect or if he got an accident like I said, but there was like not a lot of muscle on it, but holy sh it, did he throw that sucker like it was a blade. Yeah, he would like head kick people knock him out with that thing. Yeah, And so

I remember going out exactly. We trained a lot for that, and he threw that thing at me in the first like fifteen seconds and I moved and I remember it just whizzing by my head and I'm like, dude, you cannot get hit with that thing. I've never being a when I was a little kid man, you remember, like remember like the Chicago Bears had their big deal where they like won Super Bowl, like Fridge Perry and all

that ship. I remember, like it's like probably the last sports interview I listened to was Fridge Perry was talking about why he like black shoes. She said that people see those black shoes and they think you're gonna be slow. Then you smoke him something in that leg. He's like, oh yeah, dude, people are like not paying any attention

to that leg. And all of a sudden, that cold guy has to be it, man, because I remember watching highlights of that guy and just like studying up on him before I fought him, and he had multiple head kick knockouts with that thing, and I'm like, that thing is brutal. I won. I took him down I'm not getting kicked at that damn thing. And I took him down and choked him out, and like, I don't know for a couple of minutes, you know, and I remember getting up just feeling so pumped, like this is this

is pretty freaking cool. I just got paid to beat somebody up and that was good money, right yeah, I mean yeah, change to college. It was only a couple of grand. But you know, going from no no money as a college student to a couple of grand in a couple of minutes, I'm like, signed me up. In the second you turn, remember like selling my first magazine stories. The second you turn something that's generally cost you money and it's something that makes you money is a triumphant feeling.

It feels so good Like therese, you're like, sucker. Yeah, So what what made like someone that self describes themselves as a softie, Like what made you be a like be pumped up about beating somebody up? I think it was more of just a success thing. You know. I was so nervous going into it because I didn't know how the hell I was gonna do. You know, coming off of wrestling, I was I was the main in wrestling.

I was an n C double A runner up, two time All American in college, and so I'm like, I got a lot, Like there's so much pressure that people are are expecting me to come in here and do really well. What if I go out there and get headcacked and knocked out by that football bat, you know? And so there was just for me. I remember feeling super nervous, Like I remember walking because at that point, it wasn't um a cage, it wasn't an octagon, it was a boxing ring. So I remember walking, you know.

And it was basically in my hometown, so I had tons of people that I knew from high school and growing up and watching me, and I'm like, man, I can't please, don't screw this up. And uh. And so I went out there and was successful in a couple of minutes, and I just remember just being like, Yes, that was freaking awesome, Like I want to do it again.

And I think that's one of the main reasons. It's just the success part of it, like like filling the relief all the hard work, knowing that you just killed yourself for that whole training camp to go in there and within a couple of minutes, you know, not getting beat up at all and just being successful. So you probably get people ask you this is probably annoying, but did you get a lot of fights in your little kid I got a few. Yeah, not not because I chose to. I was a tiny little guy, Like I

was eighty pounds my freshman year in high school. Like I was so small. Yeah, and so like my whole life, I got picked Like I would get picked on and then I would just whoop their ass, like guys would come up to me thinking that they were just gonna bully me. And I mean, like I said, I started wrestling at five years old. So did you grow up Did you grow up poor, like in a poor neighborhood. No, not too much. I grew up in like a little farm town. Why is everybody fighting and beat each other up?

I don't know, man um just a fighting town. Yeah, there's a lot of ghetto nous too, like it's a farm town. But there's also because it's in California, Yeah, you know what you mean, Like it's hard to picture, but there's a kind of a weird there's like agricultural areas in California that it's different than the area in Indiana, like like things are kind of more compressed like worlds Clyde a little bit exactly. We had such a melting pot of races and just tons, you know, tons of

different types of people there. You got one side of the town it's all the farmers who, like you said, the agg people. And then you go over here and it's um, you know, low class, just pretty ghetto people that are living a rough life, you know. And then you go on this side and you've got people with tons of money, you know, living in these big mansions, you know. And so it's kind of just a mix

of a little bit of everything. But man, I just I remember as a kid being terrified right in the school bus because we'd have people that were fighting on I didn't like fighting, Like, it's not something I like sought after as a kid. Um, but there would be people picking on other people all the time, getting fights, and dude, it was not something I enjoyed. But it's you know how old you thirty four? Yeah, sound like twelve years older than you, but longer reach Like I'm older.

It's even another advantage I have, right, Um, my kids now in school, so they're five, seven and nine and the Latin. The intolerance these days at school of people like beating people up. It's just like it's like you don't beat people up and you don't bully people. I remember things happening when I was a kid, like on the school bus that I just can't even imagine now. There was I don't want to say the kid's names he's still around, and I don't want to say the

girl's name because she's still around. But there was a girl that would ride our school buss and she would get off the school boss. This is in junior high. She would get off the school bus and as she walked up her driveway, the same kid every day would roll down his windows and yell out and call her repeatedly, hay thunder thighs, thunder thighs, thunder thighs. Every single day. Oh you couldn't do that, and like just to have it be though. It's just he's just harassing her about

the shape of her body. No big deal, dude, And like they're just the brutality that kids get away with me. It's amazing, Like kids are like kids are awful. Man. You gotta it's like real Lord of the fly. Gotta kind of go. You gotta like governed kids. Man, I agree, And that's I'm kind of terrified. I mean, this same age with all the social media stuff and where we've come as a society. Like I'm terrified for my baby girl, Like what what the hell is she going to be

like when she's in high school? You know, Like what am I going to have to do? How many kids am I gonna have to beat up to keep her safe? You know? And that's I don't know, that's just something I'm terrified, But I think that's why we need to have another sibling and hope that you know, it's either it's a girl and they're really close, or a boy

that can just whoop the mass. My daughter screwed something up on the boss like, which I don't I still don't understand the full story, but um, she can get on the bus in the right way. But we heard from a teacher that my little boy went into her classroom and just read her the Riot Act about no way. Yeah, how worried it was. That's cool? Yeah, that's really I guess you just tore down right in front of everybody. Did not like it? Don't make me worry like that? Did? Uh?

So what was your induction the hunting and fishing. It wasn't young young, so I started hunting and fishing. I grew up here in central California, UM Blacktaill up in um D D seven was the zone I grew up hunting near Shaver Lake and Dinky Creek and um, me and my dad and my brothers. I don't know what it was. They were never as into it as I was. But um, I think just through some buddies growing you know, not not even growing up. I think it was kind

of later in life. Um, but I mean I remember just having this this weird like I would Hunting to me was like one of my most favorite things to do. Like I remember, here's a story. Like me and my brother. My dad used to like, um like discipline us with hunting, like you're not going hunting and I would ball yeah, like I remember you are going hunting. Yeah, no, you're not going hunting. And I remember, so this one story I had this kid, you would use it as like

a weaponize it. Yeah. I think that would work very well with your son. Oh god, oh yeah, my older boy because he boy, he's sensitive to he wouldn't like to get excluded but yeah, i'd tear him all. Yeah, I don't so. I remember one time, me my brother, I was probably six or seven, and my dad. It was a um Friday. He just my dad owns the cabinet business, so he would he's obviously self employed, but he would be like, look after Friday or sorry, after

we're done Friday, Saturday morning, we're gonna get up. We're gonna gop. It's like a two hour drive before daylight, and we're gonna hunt Saturday, um all day Sunday and come home Sunday night. So you guys an overnight, yeah, camp and do all that stuff. He was, he was pretty like he was into it. He was into it as a kid. Want to take kids in tents and ship and yeah, which I don't know. Yeah, that's another story.

But I remember I had this like star shaped metal that I wanted a wrestling tournament, and I took the ribbon part off, so it was just a star and that was my Ninja Star and me and my brother up in our bedrooms playing Ninja's that Friday night at

the drywall. Oh no window, my brother was, I was in my room and then it was just an empty doorway and then he was in the other room, and I don't know why I did this, but I tossed it and I remember that one of the star edges sticking in the window, just like breaking a hole and sticking it and like just shattered around the edge. And I mean these were pretty big windows in our in our house, you know, And I just remember being like,

oh shit, like, don't tell dad, don't tell dad. I'm like, I run in there, take it up, and I'm like trying to figure out a way to like keep it covered from him finding And of course, like shortly he comes up there to see what we're doing, and there's a freaking hole in the window, and he lost his ship, and needless to say, we're not going hunting tomorrow. And I didn't sleep on and I was so bummed due to cry, like I cried. I think we just went

to bed right then because I was so upset. And uh, I think overnight my dad realized it was an accident, and he still got us up before. I remember him coming in in the dark and loading us up in the in the truck and we headed up. But did you guys have some successes kids? Um? Yeah, I mean kind of. I killed my very first buck up there. Um. It was with my old PSC nova. I saved up

um my in high school. I saved up enough money to um like I would mow lawns around our neighborhood, and I bought a used PC nova um from a buddy, and I killed my very first It was just a little tiny forkspike um frontal shot clean pass through and uh me, my brothers. It was me, my and my two brothers and my dad went down. We found him, followed him down this real deep deep canyon, got to the bottom, and my dad was like, all right, so we'll gut this showed us how to do all that.

He's like, I'm gonna hike back up and I'm gonna get the truck and I'm gonna try to find a way to come down here because we're not pulling this thing back up out of here. My dad gets lost, and so we're just like, what the hell do we do? We're sitting there in the dark with a dead deer. My dad is like wandering through the woods at night, and luckily we like drug that thing out and another hunter saw us, loaded it up, and we just told

him how to get back to our camp. Um, and my dad was out there from most of the night. Like he ended up finding his way back to the truck eventually, and then I don't even remember what time he going back, maybe to two or three in the morning. Um, but yeah that was Yeah. I love this, Let's do it again. But yeah, I mean I I was successful then and like growing up, I was thinking about this not too long ago. But my dad never really killed anything. I don't know if it's just him always trying to

let us go first, but I killed that one. My brothers never killed anything. And I think my dad killed one other little two point um you know, years down the road. Um, and that was pretty much it. I think we only killed to two or three deer in that area from when I started as a little kid until I stopped hunting up there, which was basically after college. Did you have all what kind of stuff you did,

like hunting, you know, be begun hunting and stuff. Yeah, I grew up doing all that, so um, yeah, there was a lot of good trout fishing up up in that area. Um. We would go up there and sometimes pull over nighters where this was like one of my favorite things to do, where we'd go up there, no tent, no nothing um and there was one spot. If it was a full moon, when the moon would come up and over the hill in front of us, those trout would go nuts on a globe, bobber and a cricket.

So we would just go out there and just sit and wait. Sometimes that moon wouldn't come up till like midnight, and you just sit there. Nothing would bite until then, and you know, everyone's kind of started getting down like, well, maybe we're just not gonna catch anything. And sure enough, as soon as that full moon would come up and over, we would all limit out on trout like illuminated, illuminated

or whatever. And so we would do that from time to time, and we sometimes we're just crashing the bed of the truck for an hour or two and then drive back home. But we wouldn't can't really wouldn't bring anything for it. Just go up there and catch our limit as soon as that moon came up and over, and then we drive our two hours back home. When you decided to start going into athletics, did you ever sense that there was you were sort of making a decision in life. You know, there's this Jim Harry I

can't remember how. There's this Jim Harrison quote where it's something the effect of I think we're talking about like ten year olds or something, and he's saying that where he grew up, there was already a split. And like you had your boys that had a baseball bat, a baseball mitt on their bike, and you had your boys with a fishing rod on their bike, and they might intermingle, but they're kind of their paths in life for like

a little bit. Set you defied that because now you're done doing the one and you're like very dedicated at that, you know, hunter angler. But did you going off to be so aggressive about athletics, did you, like ever did occur to you that you're just gonna have no time? Yeah? And that actually like this like a discipline right college for me was I really had to put the outdoor life on hold, um because you just couldn't be successful in both. And it was tough for me, man, It

was really tough for me. In fact, I almost quit wrestling my freshman year in college. I remember going through the full season and having to cut back on what I loved, absolutely love to do, probably more than anything, UM. And I was just trying to find myself, like, is this something I really want to pursue? Like I could just go to college and be a normal person and do all the things that I love to do as

far as the outdoors goes. And you got that one buddy who's always calling you being like, man him down, here's yep. And so it was brutal. Man I almost quit. Luckily I had a really good coach in college, and we sat down and he just kind of weighed out the pros and cons and it kind of just put

things into perspective for me. On look, I can suffer now, I can kill myself for these four years, and you know, be successful and have something to where I can transfer out of college into making money and be able to do all that stuff for the rest of my life. And so after like really like thinking about it and putting that type of stuff in the perspective, I said, all right, and I stuck with it. Had to keep

all that stuff on hold. I would still get out from time to time, Like so I went to cal Poli, which is right there in your past robles. Tons of wild pigs in that area. So we would go out from time to time and do some pig hunting. Um, you know. But for the most part, my dear hunting, pretty much everything got put on hold for four years, for four years the more exactly. But what's great about the fight game is fights fights can happen at any time in the year. It's not like a season. So

I might get a fight scheduled. Um. And this happened quite a few times right right before deer season would start. So I would kill myself through the ten week training camp, go out there, whoop this dude's but and now I usually take like a good two to three weeks off and let my body recover, depending on if I had any injuries or anything like that. And so then that

would be my hunting time. Time to yourself. Um. There was a point in my fight career where I started to lose control and started doing a little bit too much of the outdoor stuff, and I could tell my training started stuffer. I was in the in the training room, I was filling it, you know, getting tired when I and get tired, you know. And another person that actually sat me down was Uriah was like, look, man, He's like,

I see you're starting to struggle a little bit. Um, I see you're on all these hunting and fishing trips, like maybe we should cut that back a bit, and uh see, I would. Yeah, it's funny because like you're you're performing at such a high level that stuff like that is regarded because like for most people who are so sedentary, that was sort of like that was up their game, you know what I mean, it would be like, oh, you look great. It seems like you're getting out, you know,

and you have a little more energy now. But if I have it be that that is like the slack

around I know, right, it's kind of weird. And I mean the thing I think the things that made me kind of feel crummy in the in the workout room and say you do a hunt where you're not eating a ton of calories where my body's I'm used to being on like a very strict routine when it comes to diet, like making sure I get enough food and the right kind of food where you're living off of freeze dried mills and just eating kind of minimal stuff

for four or five, six sometimes a week. Um, you know, and I'm not yeah I'm hiking, but my body's used to redlining, you know, multiple times a day so it's almost like taking a step back, which is which was good from time to time, Like right after a fight, after just killing myself for ten weeks, that's perfect. You know, maybe not so much the calorie part of it, but not killing myself, not redlining my body where I'm just hiking around glass ng sitting for a while. My body's recovering.

But you know, two or three months of that, it kind of catches up and I would fill it when I'd get in the in the gym and start training. When I start spawning with guys and I'm getting fatigued and stuff like that, I'm like, all right, it's time. So I did listen to favor. I cut back a little bit, um started, you know, overcoming that type of stuff in the training room. Luckily, it didn't ever affect any of my fights because I was usually pretty smart about like, look, if I have a fight, I have

to be serious here. But sometimes, you know, I would fight one time a year. You know, it's I got tons of time. Then I'm just like training, but I don't really have a purpose. I don't have anything lined up. You know, they're the US is like putting me kind of on the shelf for now because they're waiting for a certain match to happen, and then I fight the winner of that fight. So I'm just like kind of training for nothing, not training for nothing, but but way

more motivating. Yeah, and so I kind of get in those types of years where it's like should I'd rather be out chasing blacktail or something, you know? And so that's why I would be kind of doing that for two or three months at a time, and and I would fill it in there. But did you know, Well, let me ask I got two questions, load of questions, but scrap that. Did you know? I'll ask you that

one later. Um, do you think, like, based on the kind of person you are and what you realize about yourself now, do you think you'd have been successful at anything or do you think you just happened to hit the thing you'd be successful at. Um. I think I probably would find a way to become successful at anything. I would like to help. It was it was that it was like a drive to like do it. Yeah, And I think that comes from the years of wrestling.

I I know, like in in college, like during the summer, if I just didn't train, if I went like two weeks without training, I feel like the biggest piece of ship. Like I just feel like guilty almost. And that's just because I'm like so used to doing everything or doing something every day, and I think even now that transfers into my daily life, like and I'm running fins and feathers. If if I don't tell people what it is that

we didn't do a good job of setting off. So that's a company and me and a good buddy of mine started back in two thousand fifteen. UM. What we call it is like a celebrity outdoor service. So we put together like a yearlong schedule of different species of hunting trips all over the world, UM and fishing as

well mixed in there. UM. And what we do is we have like twenty different celebrity pro staff members, which are a bunch of different UFC fighters, pro ballplayers, actors, PBR guys, just mix of different types of athletes and

celebrities you'd see on TV or watch playing their sport. UM. And what we do is we book clients on those trips and then we add one, two, sometimes even three of our celebrities to join people on these trips, a kind of hosting role exactly, and they'll hunt with you, they fish with you, hang out and camp, have some beers tell stories like just make it a new, like unique experience, um, because there's a lot of guys that have booked a ton of different things all over the

place and they kind of get to that point where they're like, well this is just it's kind of boring for me now, and so now they can kind of mix it up. Or we do get a lot of like bachelor party guys, Like for our fishing trips, we're gonna come hang out with a bunch of different UFC guys and drink beer and catch fish and you know what I mean. And so we launched it back in two thousand and fifteen. Sixteen was our first full year, and I honestly I had no clue how it was

going to do. Like I was like, is this going to be kind of a conceited Like are people gonna look at me and be like, do you're an idiot? I ain't booking ship with you? Or people are gonna love it and want to come do these cool hunts with me or some of my buddies. And we sold out like every trip that we had that year. We sold out completely and I'm like, dude, we gotta we gotta grow. We gotta add some trips for next year. Like that was too easy. Yeah, you care if you

want to. If you're trying to look this up, it's fins like with the Z so f I n Z. I'm looking at Chad's and Feathers is with the Z as well. People in imagine by the type they type in Chad Mendez fins, it'll yeah hopefully, Um, but yeah, so we we just basically added from from two thousand sixteen on. We've just added a few trips each year, um,

and we've sold out everything that we've done. So it's been I mean it's pretty it's pretty rewarding for me to know that people a just want to hang out with these guys, but you know, taking something that I

have so much path about, you know, hunting, fishing, teaching people. Um, we get a lot of guys that have never hunted, never fish, that watch your guys a show a ton and you know, they see Rogan, they see cam, they see all these guys who are going out and you know, killing their own meat and living off of that, you know, And for me like being able to talk about that in interviews that I was fighting, Like, look, I live

off of my wild game, like my training camps. The meat that I eat during those camps is all the stuff that I've killed throughout the year. Or even when you're on like a super regimented diet, you're still putting wild game. And yeah, that's like any any diet that I've So I work with the RP Strength who is a h It's a program that will create your diet as well, and so that's who I use, um what used to my training camps. But all the meat, I

can't understand. What I don't understand what that what that's a that's like a consulting Yeah, basically like that you give them all your info, um, your goals you know obviously wait height like all that type of stuff, And like I tell them, A, I have a fight in ten weeks. I need to get down to this weight, but I don't want to lose much muscle. So we need to get as lean as like body fat lean as possible while keeping as much muscle as I can so that when I cut that last ten pounds of water, Um,

you know I don't I'm not dying. Um And so then they put together a full diet plan for your training camp, knowing how much your training, how much you know working out you're doing each day. Detail pretty freaking detailed, like um, maybe not quite down to the peanut. We're talking like, um, like a meal would be like a four rounds lean piece of meat, which any wild game is is okay for that umty grams of complex carbs.

So like your whole oats brown, okay, down to the peanut then, And I mean it's a lot of freaking work, dude, it's I mean, meal prepping is a must. Like you can't. You can't. I don't have a dial, and you follow this thing and you'll get like yeah, and are you doing your own meal prepping and cooking? Yeah? Yeah, I love you don't have someone coming and do it. I wish, but I'm too picky with my food. Man. I love cooking.

I love Here's here's how much I love it. When I'm cutting weight, Like I'm the week of the fight. I'm in my hotel room. I have wig ins in two days and I'm sitting there watching the Food Channel, watching these people all these delicious and they're just like, oh, I'm gonna make that I'm taking that right. So some people, my wife's like, you're freaking insane, like why are you watching this? And I just I don't know, it just feels good to me. Tell me, what can you I

don't even know this word kenesiology? Canogy? You studied this in college and then you went to like the highest level in terms of nutrition and body performance like professionally. Um, when you look back at it all now, like your formal education, everything you learn from watching sort of like the world's top athletes getting the best shape they've ever

been in. What is your sort of interests in tolerance and fad diets and stuff like do you do you do you think there's like a magical formula and are you always like trying new things out or do you think there's just like like what's your diet theory your diet philosophy. Yeah, I've never I don't think I've ever

tried any of these fat diets. Um. I see a lot of people doing a lot of different things and teach their own I mean, if I feel like every human body is different, I think somebody's will you know, will be okay and getting away with doing certain things where other people's bodies will not put up with it UM. I honestly think find what works best for you. Some people could live solely off meat and nothing else and feel great. Some people only want vegetables and that's that

works great for their body. Me, I've always been about balancing everything. Like I, I love carbs, I love vegetables, and I love meat Like I My my solid meal

is a protein, a carb, and a vegetable. And whether I'm cutting weight or not, like even during the weight cut, like I would always make sure I had that type of so like my those RP mills would be a say, like I said, a four ounce lean piece of meat, so like a venison steak, and I would have to weigh those out umty grams of carbs so like grams of brown rice um and like two cups of broccoli. Or my favorite thing would be cucumbers with a little bit of rice wine mint aground them. Just kind of

mix it up a little bit. That was it, man. That was something that I lived off of for ten weeks. Obviously, I mix it up, and towards the end of my career, I started getting really creative with it um because you can get away with like they have whole wheat um tortilla, say, you know, and I can do four ounces of ground lean venison whole wheat tortilla or just however many would

make up what I'm supposed to eat. And you know, you can get away with making like tacos or you know, because I make a little um piko to guiles salsa or something. It's all veggies. And so I know I need this amount of vegetables, this amount of protein, this amount of carbs. Throw that together. Now I'm now I'm eating something that's not boring. I would eat that anyways, you know. And so I would start getting creative towards

the end. Um and mainly because I was kind of getting bored of eating the same things over and over. And when you're like hungry like that, do you just just feel like that just like punching someone. Oh dude, I get angry bad, I get really yeah. I get really emotional when I get hungry. I have zero zero patients. And my wife could probably attest to that too, but um yeah, man, it's I get really irritable, do you guys? Is that just I get so irritable? You can watch Steve.

You give him what's your take on alcohol. I drink it, yeah, I mean in moderation obviously. Um, like nothing through training camps, I would never drink. But that night after the fight, I I'd let loose, like we'd get We'd get a little stupid loose for sure. So what about ahead, oh all your meal prep? Is that what led into cooking for you? Or you've always been kind of tinkering with cooking,

like through college and stuff. No, I think the cooking has always been something that, um, that's always interested me. And my dad was always the one that cooked in our family, UM, and it was something that I remember watching him have so much passion about and I think I don't know if that's just what transferred it over to me or what. But um, I love cooking for people. I love cooking for large groups like our fins and feathers trips. I'm usually the one cooking most of the meals.

Like if I work with an outfitter, I'll even ask him like can I at least cook one of the nights, you know, And so we'll go and do that for the clients. But it is funny because on on Instagram, you know, there's a lot of people who are like, look at me, I'm cooking and you can look at it and you're like, you do not cook. But when you're doing it, I'm like, cut knows how to do things. Yeah, And I'm no pro by any means. I I even sometimes make stuff where I'm like, what the hell did

I do? But I mean, in my honest opinion, that's how you got to learn. I mean, I'll follow a lot of recipes and sometimes I'll tweak things, um where I feel like it would add to it. Sometimes it does, sometimes it does not, But um, I love doing it. It's something I especially with so so much wild game meat that I have. Like you guys probably know this, You get bored of cooking it the same freaking way over and over again. So I'm always like, oh, that's

why I like at night, Yeah, something new. Yeah, Because I remember my brother Danny, you know, he lives off wild game his home, and when he goes to someone's house, he's like, I just love it because it just tastes like something I didn't make. Because after while everything I may just seems to kind of be the same. Yeah. And for whatever reason, when someone usually when someone cooks something, whether it's something you've made or they've made it tastes

better when somebody else makes it for you. Like it's the sandwich effect. Like I can make a sandwich and eat it and it just doesn't taste the same. But my wife makes me a sandwich, it tastes ten times better for some reason. I don't know why, why the hell that is, but um, especially if it conforms your idea of what food ought to be. Yeah, exactly. But you know, we've talked about this in the past. Do you get like these very fitness centric people, some of

them haunt some of them don't. But it's like the one thing that binds them together is the boneless, skinless chicken breast. And I'm like, I don't care how healthy you are, it's just that is a bridge too far. Yeah, no, I agree, man. And I'm someone that will definitely stray from the health stuff. I've always tried to make things not over the top unhealthy, but I'm a sucker for

good eat man. I'll throw some heavy cream in there, dalls, some cheese in there, and like, I'm not afraid that my my wife doesn't always like it's like, oh yeah, she loves it. In fact, she actually I kind of got her into hunting the last few years. She's um killed a wild pig on that ranch that I told you guys about. Um, she's she's killed a couple of turkeys. She killed a four bearded turkey her very first time. I said, you might as well just quit now, you're

not gonna beat that. But she killed one with her bow, which was like the pinnacle of my career because I like, I scouted these suckers. I got it all set up and I just I was like, I just want you to try to kill with your bow. And uh, for the first three setups, she was trying to use the guillotine broadheads and she missed uh three different jake's at like eight yards um, and she was getting so frustrated

because that's binary rights either like a killer. Yeah, And that's why I did it, because I'm like, I would hate for her to hit one wounded and let's not find it or fly off, and I know that would probably scar and so I'm like, you're either gonna end this thing right now or you're gonna Yeah, I guess

it's a little room to like nicke it. But uh huh, And she missed three times, and you know, ship we're getting up at like three in the morning and we're having to drive an hour each time, and you know, getting set up waiting for the sun to come up. These things work in and then she misses and she's like, I think the third time it almost broke her. That's when you start telling me like, I wish we'd never met.

I didn't retire for this, So I just switched her to a normal broadhead and I was like, look, this is where you're gonna aim with. The night before, we looked at videos we like. I showed her some pictures of where to aim, and luckily, this giant tom comes walking in. Read it, read it first light. You're calling, yeah, call him in. He comes into the decoys and I think I had the decoys at like eight yards because I was like, I gonna get these things. It's close

to Hans. He comes in in and she just hammers this thing and he goes like fifteen yards and tips over and I would I was just like, I felt more excited than if I would have shot the dang thing, you know, And she's like, is it dead. I'm like, it's dead. You got him. And so she was pretty pumped about that, and we had that for um a

big mail. We had a bunch of friends that came over and we I smoked it on the trigger and we did this whole big like mail, made like a big ordeal about it, and she loved it so much, and yeah it was pretty cool and so um that was my that was my hunting story with a wife. So hopefully she definitely said she would do more and that was her last last time doing anything. But yeah, I had to get around the shore next, I know, right,

it would be cool. Yeah, Hey, when you're on like when you get knocked out all the time, how many times been knocked out? Can you even count them up? Um? Yeah? So and what do you count as a knockout at this point? You're talking about like the flash? Yeah I count those so like getting your bell rung. So this is what I don't know if you guys have ever had that happen where like sounds like boom in your head and it's like one time I was swinging out you know those mac or may like those things you

hang potted plants from. Yes, yeah, I remember hitting a tree when I was a kid one time and having that Yeah, so it's like a it's almost like a drum going off in your head. And I was flat out in the long did you did you not remember? And then wake up? Okay, so you were knocked out, So like that was the only time I was knocked out. Got you. So that's a knockout, and I would count

those is a knockout. I wouldn't count the ringing your bell where it's just kind of like everything a bell ring We used ringing your bell to have someone to shoot a shotgun next year year kind of the same because there's like there's literally like for the next three hours. Yeah,

that's the worst. Um, so we're getting your bell rung, someone hits you, You hear that noise, but you don't forget anything, like you're right there the whole time, like holy crap, you know, like a knockout the technical term for that as a bell and you got your belt rung up. And then a knockout is you don't remember

ship you just you just wake up. So I don't know if you guys have ever been like blacked out from drinking ever and you just have you ever just come out of it and you're like what the oh yeah, you gotta walk out signs. That's kind of like being knocked out. So I think the times I've been knocked out. Jose Aldo my first fight, he caught me with a big knee and I just remember waking up. Now, it doesn't hurt because you don't know what the hell happened.

You're just like shit, you're looking around everybody. Everybody, Yeah, what the hell dude sweeping up? That was my first time. Like about how long though typically in the fight seconds right? Seconds? Yeah? Yeah, so, um, I mean like, you don't really I remember watching the video. So I get hit with the knee. I went back to my back and then he jumps on me and he hits me like three, three or four times before the ref finally got to them and tackle them. UM,

don't remember any of that. Um, I don't remember getting back to my feet. I came back to um like talking to the ref already standing, and I was just like, what your brain caught? Yeah, it's it's weird. So that's like a legit knockouts, a legit knockout, and those sucks so bad because it's like, so you're open, some dudes asking you questions and all of a sudden you're like

come into being. Yeah, like a rest talking to you, and then I think you're answering them, because usually when I come back to, I'm talking like I'm talking back to the rest way. I have no idea. I don't know. I wish somebody would film this because I don't know if I'm just I don't know what I'm saying. I just when I come back to, I'm talking, and then I like, I think they probably realize when you come to. So how many of those let's rule out the bell ringings?

I think too okay, other gonna throw at me to no too Luckily, I think because I was a wrestler, I was mainly taking guys down and staying on top of him. Aldough was one and Frankie Edgar was the other guys have knocked you out. Um, I got my bell rung with Connor. He did. He didn't put me

out though, Connor McGregor. That's like the one day and a lot of people know, yeah, and then the second fight with um although he rung my bell um maybe two or three times in that fight where boom and you fall down and you get back up, like I never lost memory on any of it. But it takes your feet out from underneath you, and your your body basically shuts down for a split second. And you're when when that happens, you you jump up and you're imagine

you're focused on what you're doing. But are you also like, man, I need to be alive a long time. Yeah, I mean like have my and be functional as an old man. Or do you like think about that the next day? Next day? Yeah, you're not thinking that. In the you can't down. So like for me when I got my bell rung, I fell down. It messes with your vision for a split second to you like you can't focus

on anything. It's just like everything's blurry and I just see him running at me and then it kind of clears back up and I'm like, go ship and then I like, you know, get back into grappling and him being on top of me and we get back to the feet. But once that happens once in a fight, your head is never the same. So it feels like you have tons of pressure in your head for how long depends, Like for that one that was a brutal fight. Man,

I pissed blood that night. When I got back to the hotel, my head was probably foggy like that in pressure for a day or two. So if right now, if if right now, as I said, you gotta sit there, and yann he's gonna sit up. Yeah, he's gonna give you the hardest haymaker he can give you. Would you just be like okay, whatever it? Would you be scared about it? I mean I wouldn't like it? No, not at all. So when you go into a fight, are you are you like thinking like, man, I hope I

don't get hit. Yeah, I mean that's yeah, that's the the basic way, Like in the basic way you'd imagine not wanting to get hit exactly. I mean, and like I said, I think the difference between someone that's never trained for fighting and someone that has, like, I think you fear the pain. I fear losing my fight. So yeah, I get that's that's kind of I think I'm thinking about its being like you walk into a situation where

like you're going smart. You know your feet will get totally cold, right, You're like, my feet will be numb, and you're just going to being like it sucks, but I know my feet will be no, and you just right. I think some people be like well, if you know they're gonna be no, why would you not go? But just something you become comfortable with over time, like you've been through it. You know they warm up again later. It's just just aware that will happen and you whatever.

But you don't get there about getting hit in the face. No, And that's the thing. It's like, you know, I know I'm going to get hit going into this fight. I'm not afraid, Like I said, I'm not afraid of it hurting. I'm afraid of waking up and having a loss. You know what I mean. Because here's the shst the fight. Yeah, and here's the shitty thing about that is not always the best guy wins that fight. I mean, with those

little lass gloves on one tiny mistake. If someone just puts their head down and wing something, even if they're meaning to hit your just winging it and you don't have your your hand covering your chin for a split second and it happens to catch you. You wake up and you're like fuck, you know, like for nothing, I didn't even get the fight. And that's kind of what

happened with my Frankie Edgar fight. Like I went out there and just got clipped in the beginning of the fight, and I just woke up with the ref pushing me up against the cage like fight's over, and I'm just like mother, you know, like I shouldn't have been, you know, like I wanted to fight. And does the community do the when that happens, when someone gets like a lucky shot, is it recognized in the community, Is it like, oh, yeah,

he won, but he shouldn't have won. There's some people that know it, but most people the public perceptions you lost, you lost, you got knocked out, you lost. And in my honest opinion, this is how I would look at it. So and this is how I based a lot of my preparation for certain fighters. If I'm looking at someone's highlight riels or you know, certain past fights that were online, if it's them going out there and knocking a dude out, I don't base a lot of my um preparation off

of that. If they go out there and completely dominate a fighter from start to finish, even though it goes to a decision, that's what I pay more attention to you, because, like I said, anybody could go out there and get lucky and knock somebody out. You know, we have four rounds gloves on, which is basically bare knuckle. You know,

it doesn't take much to knock somebody off. You catch them right, Um, but if you go out there and take them down or or just outstrike them or just dominate them from the from beginning to end, like that says something. So that's the type of stuff that I would pay more attention to. Yeah, like those fights where everybody's shocked because someone just throws up a calf and yeah, I can see that you might be like, I don't know how much I actually trained for that that that

that person did that one time exactly. You know, keep an eye on it. But you know, if unless they've done it to like eight or nine different guys. Yeah, that's that's interesting, man, because I could see that you'd you'd be like, I hope I'm not the guy that gets hit real fast and goes down. I can see that you'd fixate on that. For me, in my fight career, that was probably my biggest hurdle to get over was

the fear of that. Not Like I said, I just didn't ever want to lose, mainly because I didn't want to disappoint. Um. I feel my team, my family, you know, just fans for me. You were you were with your wife while you were professionally fighting, right, yeah, yeah, we told you want to wrap it up. Was she pissed? No, she she was happy about that. I mean this she did it and you know, put up with it because she knew that I loved it. And and but supportive

she like a team. Yes, she was very supportive. Always. It wasn't her favorite. Like she's sitting there always like this, just you know, peeking out or hands in front of yeah, like what happened? What happened. She'd hear the crowd go crazy and her brother would be there next to or something and he'd be like, oh he knocked him out and okay, no ship really yeah? Oh yeah. So she she put up with it. It wasn't her favorite thing,

but she was, like I said, very supportive. So um, yeah, when you when you were going through all this and and and actually in the you know, really fighting hard as a professional, were you like, man, when I when I quit this ship on going to hunting fish my was that like in the back of your head? Oh yeah, the whole time. And that's that's why we created fins and feathers. I was sitting there like, look, I can't fight forever. You know, we don't get we don't get

money after we're done fighting. Like if we don't even fight, we don't get paid. We get paid per fight. So say we sign a Yeah, yeah, I mean it makes soul sense. But I hadn't thought about it really. It's like it's like it's like job worker. Yeah, I'm an independent contractor. When I'm done with the UFC, they shoot me away and that's it, you know, Like I'm on my own. So so there's there's no sort of there's no sort of like base salary nothing, Nope, it's just

fight for money. So we are prize fighting about sponsorships. So sponsorships are different. Um. And so this is what I tried to do. I started building a base in the outdoor world. Um about halfway through my career, because I knew I wanted to do something in the outdoor world when I'm done fighting, that I could make money doing something I'm freaking obsessed with. And so I'm like,

what the hell could we do? So me and my buddy were talking about the idea for fins and feathers, and it was something we talked about for a couple of years. Um, you know, and what really kick started it for me was my loss against Frankie Edgar And that was that that moment where it was like, look, I just killed myself and went in there and got caught and I didn't even get the fight. You know. So when you lose, you only get half of your money that you were going to get. You don't get

the full amount. So I just took a huge pay cut because I got caught by something. So each guy agrees to a purse, that's you're you're agreen to the winning purse knowing that you lose. But the two guys might have a different different amount everybody potential they had the potential win different amounts of money. Exactly. It's not like one pile to this guy, one pile of that guy. No. No, So you sign your contracts. Hey, it's a five fight contract.

Each fight is um, it goes usually goes up per fight. Is there ever a huge in balance between the two fighters. Oh yeah, Like if I win and make millions of you win, you make ship. Yeah, that's usually the case. The Connor. Connor is making millions and most guys are not making anything close so he could lose and make more than the guy that won. Uh yeah, And some guys in their contract have a flat rate, you know.

And so typically it's guys that have been with the company for a long time, the company UFC UFC, and they've their managers to figure out a way to look like, tell these guys, look, we'll sign a four fight contract, but these fights are all guaranteed this amount of money. Does that make sense, so we do no win or lose. Yeah, it's just the flat rate, no matter what. So he's not even incentivized. I mean, you're incentivized for all man or reasons, but the actual money is not incentives exactly.

All the other career sponsorship and everything else just doing good. So that's why we decided to do fins and feathers. I'm like, look, let's what can I do? Two start building a a base in the outdoor world. That's why I can start working with different companies in the outdoor space um and working on sponsorships and like trying to figure out ways so I can you know, become relevant there um and get the travel around do these hunts, make money doing these hunts and have fun with really

cool people. And so we came up with the idea of fins and feathers. And I'm like, well, like I said, I don't know how this is gonna go. We can give it a shot. We'll try it for a year and if, you know, if it doesn't work, we'll try to figure something else out. He'd be like, or yeah, I'll just get real bitter. Watch a lot of TV. Get rosy overweight. Oh yeah. And so I mean we did it. I um, I lost the Frankie and I'm like that year, I'm like, you know what, let's get

this sucker started. So we started the business. We got our attorney on things, and like got everything planned out. We started building the website. It's not really you're like laying in the groundwork, right, Yeah. I started doing it was fighting, like what's the old fighter? Though. Dan Henderson fought into his forties. I want to say he was like forties six or yeah, that's very rare. Most guys, um like, you're I favor he retired when he was I think thirty nine. You kind of got your money's

work anyways, man, I mean you got out. You didn't like get out way early, not super early. I mean, I still probably could have fought for another four or five be money, but like Favor got out nine, was out for like a year or two and then came out of retirement flot a fight when he was forty, knocked the dude out, and then just lost his last fight.

So I don't know, but that's like, you know, anything in the forties is like, that's kind of that's in your cards, Like eventually somebody, I don't think so, man, I'm people ask that all some rocky ship man come back. I think I think things would have to be absolutely horrible, So you're going to do it from a position of weakness, things that have to be hungry exactly. So I'm just having so much damn fun doing what we're doing, man, And and you know, it's something I love to do.

I don't have to get punched in the head anymore, you know, And so I don't. I don't see myself coming out of retirement anytime soon. So you just keeping your business now. Yeah. I like how you can say I don't have to get punched in the head anymore and it's not a metaphor. Yeah, I'm like when I'm like listening all the good ship. You know, if I need to cheer myself up, I can start adding ned in like no one's punched me in the head probably. You know how many mornings I'd get out of bed

just like so sore from head to toe. And it's early morning. You know, we don't get cold out here like it is out here, but it's you know, high thirties, low forties, and I gotta freaking go to the gym, which our heat or freakings sucked, so everything was freezing, match are freezing. We have these big like diesel Do you ever see those diesel heaters that it looks like

a jet engine like torpedo heating. So we'd have one of those on the side of the mat, so the whole gym smells like diesel exhaust and everybody, Yeah, they heat it up. You never get a fire going into a one of those into the fire, but yeah, I mean, and then I'm like, God, these guys that want to punch me in the face, I'm like, dude, don't touch me right now. I don't even want to be here, but you gotta get through it, you know. But yeah,

those are the that's the ship. I don't I don't look forward to ever again, Like, I'm good, I'm good not doing that anymore. What's your what's your career advice for people? Oh? Man? I mean I think it is finding something you love to do. Like I love fighting, I loved competing. I did it my whole life. Um, you know, I say all this negative stuff about it, but it was very good to me. I was good at I don't think you sound negative, okay, I mean

I think you sound like a guy who's done. Yeah. Right, it's not negative, okay, good, just like it's there's like a circumspect, right, or circumspection whatever the hell I'm trying to say. I got you just looking at it from a exactly. But I mean, just find what you love to do and and if like, if it's something you love,

it's never gonna be work. Like there's gonna be times, like I said, those mornings where I'm sore from head to toe, it's cold, I don't want to get touched, but you do the workout and you feel good about it after, you know, I just pushed through that, like that was pretty cool. Do you think just do you do you think that um, being as disciplined as you had to have been, Uh, did that come naturally? Did you have to like force discipline? Um? I think there

was a mix of times where I had to force it. UM. I actually, as a kid, tried to play baseball and my dad these are this is a quote for my dad, You're not playing baseball. Only pussies played baseball. So I was like, well, hear that. Pelso because I wanted to play a team sport where I'm out there with a team, you know, and baseball and I played on the playground. I loved it, you know, And you know I was

just always so small. It's like the old portuge. He's like, I don't care if you're eighty pounds, Yeah, get your grass in there and wrestle. You know, there was multiple times growing up I wanted to do something else. I wanted to quit wrestling. UM and the discipline that was basically my dad making me stick with it, which looking back on it now, I'm glad he did because you know, made me who I am now. Same thing with my freshman year in college wanting to quit, you know, the

wrestling part of it. Then you know I wouldn't have I wouldn't have made it to the UFC. I wouldn't be sitting here with you guys right now, you know. And so there's so many things that I'm grateful for when it comes to that type of stuff. But you know, the discipline part of it sometimes was kind of forced on me. It's interesting that you mentioned the guilt thing, because, um, I think people that oftentimes when I see people who

just really lacked discipline, they don't have that. We're all see someone and I'll hear about what someone did, and I think I don't know, like like I'm I'm only talking about like how could that be of interest to you? Like how you wasted that amount of time? But where was the party that would have been? Where's a party you that tells you that you can't do that? Some people don't have that. Yeah, the guilt. I have friends like that. I'll go, don't you feel I get like

fishing guilt to not fish? It feels guilty, Like you know, a long time goes by and you have opportunities that you don't do. It's like it's like ways on my conscious. Netflix I believe is making millions of dollars off these people that don't have that in their brain, that don't feel shame. No, because I I I watch films and TV with a sense of discipline, like I'm strategic about

it and I don't feel bad doing it. I get shame at the grocery store, like when I have in between you know, busy week slots travel, like I'm just gonna get this pre made pasta stuff and then I'll throw some meat on top of it when I get home. When you get a guilty feelings by the time I'm done cooking, I'm like, why, I it's not that much more time. What are you doing? I get a guilt. Yeah,

I mean I have a life defined by guilt. Man, Like when we do it like now and then, as a sort of like a nod to our kids, we have like pizza night right, and it's kind of easy for everybody. You know, you don't have to clean up. Oh it's great. Yeah, it's like it's just everything about it's easy. They show up, kids are like, oh yeah great, they're like, you don't have to be like eat your food. Just eat your food, you like, walk up with the

box and the recycling bin and it's just easy. But that makes me feel guilty because we didn't like cook something, and like y'all have the kids to eat it like like like, yeah, I have a guilt guided life. I think that's a good thing, though, I mean it sucks from time to time. But ship, man, we don't. Yeah, I don't know. I I take that as you know, that's what it makes us all successful, like if you

didn't have that feeling. Like I said, I have a few buddies that are just like the biggest pieces of ship ever And I'm like, dude, how do you how are you eating that? And how are you like not doing anything after eating that? Yeah? I don't know because I don't have guilt. Bro. Yeah, sometimes I'm a little jealous. Get my friends who are like, you know, be like, oh man, I feel like a piece of crap because

I ran out and got pizza last night. Well, you know, you work all the time and occasionally it's okay to get a pizza and you kind of look at them and you're like, are you really my friend? Do you you film some of your hunts? Yeah? Do you do it? Like? Do you film and put them up? You put them on YouTube? Put them on my YouTube channel? Yet? Yeah? Is that? Do you view that as being tied into fins and feathers? I do um, I think because a lot of those videos actually are Fins and Feathers trips,

not all of them. I do a lot of people exactly exactly, and it's you know, they're they're not like the highest quality videos. It's me vlogging, which I feel like resonates more with people, like it's me, like you're seeing this from my point of view. I'm sitting here talking to the camera. Then I'm pointing it to you, you know, and you know, so for me, the the marketing part of going on these trips, filming this stuff and being able to with that on the YouTube for

people to see it brings such a bigger connection. Like when I go to those shows, like so many people come to the booth and they're like, dude, I love this video, I love this hunt. Oh is that that animal? So there's like a connection setting up a booth like a Friends and Feathers. Yeah, yeah, these do expo type show and then you go man that booth. So people wanted to meet you could go to the locals or not local, but whatever sports show. Yeah, exactly. We only

do the booth at two shows. We do the Sack Expo and then that big Hunt Expo. And Utah um and um both are extremely you know, I loved both of them. They can be a ton of work, you know where it's setting the booth up, ourselves, traveling out to Utah and back, and but I mean just seeing all the people like I've been going. I think this is our fifth year, and it's crazy. There's so many like a little kid like wrestlers or just kids that are into the hunting and outdoor lifestyle that I've seen

for the last five years just getting big. I'm like, dude, and some of them like we've taken a picture every single year and they'll do like a slide show and it's just cool to see the progression and when you when you if it, let's say people wanted to go and they wanted to make sure that they were going on a trip that you were accompanying. Um, so is there like a guarantee like can they be like I'm going on this trip and Chad Men does going or is it like I'm going on this trip and I

don't know who but something They're gonna send someone. So what we do is if you go to our website um Thins and Feathers dot com, our schedule page will be this year's schedule, so it'll show all the different hunts, so it'll give the species, the location, the actual dates, UM, and then what we do. It'll say price and how many spots are available, but we'll put possible celebrities. And

the reason why I say possible. If my name's on there, there's like especially now that I'm retired, that I'm going on that one. Um. The other guys we say possible, and I usually list like three, like two or three guys. UM if a fight pops up or something and they can't go on that trip. Oh yeah, because there's always a little bit uncertain because you schedule way out. So then we'll we'll really take one of these other guys, but you you'll have an idea of who's going to

go on that trip. Um. I. So that's what I was telling Call in the car. Like the last couple of years, I've gone on almost every single trip UM, and I'll bring some of my buddies in mainly because I just don't want like if it's there, if one of my buddies that maybe fights in the UFC and they've never gone on this trip before, they don't know the Outfitter, Yet you know, I just want to be

there and make sure everything goes smooth. I want to be there with the clients and make sure everything's going the way that I wanted to go um but last year, and I'm gonna start doing that more this year. You know, those those celebrity guys have gone on these trips now and they understand the process. They are buddies with the Outfitter now, and so there's gonna be more trips where I don't have to go on them anymore. And so I'm gonna start just sending more of these guys. And

that's that was the original business model for this. Like I obviously I would go on every single if I was single, I would go on every single one of these ones every year. My wife's like, I'm gonna cut your nuts off if you leave one more time. So it's like that could actually impact your desire to go

in the first place, exactly. And so I'm starting to just trying to clear up my schedule with these as much as I can and start putting some of these other guys on so that you know, I don't have to travel as much, mixing with all my personal hunts and stuff as well. What kind of trip, um, what

kind of trip? Like really lets it all come home in the right way, you know what I mean in terms of being able to like have exposure to someone that you want to hang out with, and it's kind of the right blend of effort and and you know, I mean, like is it I'm guessing it's not like hunting doll sheet. No. And that's the thing. Most of our trips are pretty low impact. They're not like we're not really doing We've done the back country stuff a couple of times, but it's tough. Man, it's tough to do.

Like a lot of waterfowl, turkeys, we do that type of stuff. Most of the stuff we do is big game. But yeah, I looked at the schedule. Man, that's a little bit of everything. And cow are calic archery, l kant mule deer, white tail back in the Midwest, San Diego Tuna trip, which I've heard from a lot of people who have done trips similar. That's a great time. Yeah, that one is one of my favorite of the year. And we get so we we charted out like a

ninety footboat. Um, there's bedrooms and stuff all downstairs. You go out for three days. There's cooks on board, cooking on your meal. It's pretty pampered, you know. And um, they prepared to the tuna. They'll do it like if you catch tuna and they'll make sushamy. Sometimes they'll do like big poke bowls. Um it's nice. But yeah, that's fun. Everyone's drinking beer. We got thirty clients on that one. Um, and so usually it's me, Dan Henderson and Claig Wueta

that's who's going on this year. But um, we're just there fishing with everyone drinking beer, hanging out that one and you know, and there's nothing. Once I get everybody on the boat and all the paperwork's done, all the planning and scheduling is done, I just get to go have fun. We get to go have fun. So it's like, you know, I'm handing out some gifts and stuff during the trip. So but which is easy. But you know, we're catching tuna, having you know, fun of the sun,

and that one's a lot of fun. We actually just sold out, um on my flight here. I sold the last three spots on my layover, so we're officially booked out on that one for but um, yeah, man, we try to mix up all kinds of different things. There's some people that really enjoy the mule deer stuff. They don't really care too much about the white tail stuff, so we we make sure we do both. Um. The cow o hunt, I think it's gonna be really cool this year. It's a rifle hunt success, right, Like, there's

tons of cows, tons of elk um uh. And so we're gonna go out there and you know, these guys that have never a lot of these guys have never killed anything before. So UM, it's gonna be a cool hunt where we're showing these guys how to do all the field dressing, how to cut these things up and get them prep for the drive home. Um, and just kind of teaching these guys like what, um, what fins and Feathers is about, but also what it's like getting

to harvest your own meal and take it home with you. Um. One thing we are really starting to plan started we've talked about the last couple of years, is doing a like a Fins and Feathers academy where we get a lot I personally get a lot of fans that follow me for the fighting side of it that have never

hunted or done anything like that. And so they see me hunting and you know, cooking all these wild game mials and having all this meat just readily available in my freezer, Like, dude, I and I you know messages, I really want to do that. I think this is awesome, dude. And again, a lot of people that watch your show, um, and they're like, I want to be like that. I want to be able to just go out in my freezer and grab you know, X, Y and Z and

go inside and cook it. And so what we're gonna do is we're gonna show people how to get their hunters safety, get their hunting license, take them on a hunt, how to hunt, show them all the field dressing and all that stuff, show them how to properly break down an animal, and then cook these really cool mills with a wild game. So it'll be like from start to finish, like if you've never done it before, this is what

you do. And just go out and take a handful of guys and girls out and teach him all the stuff that I've learned over the years. And um, you know have buddies that are unbelievable wild game cooks. Maybe bring some of those guys in pair it with different wines or something, um and just call it the Friends and Feathers Academy. So that's like a dream that I've

seen for a little bit. I just I think the hardest thing is just finding the locations, um that have all the the kitchen where and like the spots big enough to you know, a kill the animals but then also be able to cook it and teach them all that stuff with with all the right amount of utensils and all that stuff. So yeah, I'm impressed. Man. Just again looking through your schedule. Uh, there's a lot of hunts you go on without getting to hang out with

Chad Mendez for the same price. You know, Like you guys are very reasonable price. Yeah, and that we I try to keep it that way. And that's what I was telling you. So what we do is we team up without fitters, and we figure out the monetary side of it per spot. Um. I don't I'm not trying to like jack these up so high that nobody could ever go on them. I mean, is some of the

stuff relatively pricey. I mean, if you buy that hunt anywhere that you're probably going to spend around the same amount of money, but um, like I'm not trying to just like jack these up through the roof, you know, And so I try to keep them pretty similar to what you would normally pay. It's not a huge celebrity fee exactly. Yeah. And and and that's that's just one of those things. I feel like it's kind of a conceited. That was one of the issues I had when um

creating fins and feathers, Like what do we charge? Like, like what is my worth? Like what do people? You know, what what am I going to charge people to come hang out with me? Like is that kind of fucked up? Like, you know, just hard putting prices on stuff? It is? It is, And uh, I think we've kind of nailed

it down. We do. Like I said, we've sold out you know, all the years that we've been in business, which is unbelievable to me and to my business partner, and just we've had a lot of people that have rebooked on a lot of the things that have just had so much fun. And what's great is those guys wear the mouth start bringing buddies like, oh, you guys gotta come do this. It was so much fun. And um, it's just been so so cool for me to be able to live my dream. You know, I got two

more questions for Yanni. Threw this one in. Yanni go ahead, okay, so you just you just throw this in. So Yanni went ahold Y'allni took a whole year off alcohol. Now he's back on alcohol. Now he's taken How long is your little sugar breake? Three months? Three months of no desserts? No way, yeah, he says, Um, how does sugar play in your diet? Yeah? I couldn't squeeze it in earlier when we were talking about diet. But no, we're just picking up loose ends right now. Well, what's your attitude

to sugar? If I made you big old flan, would you eat it? I'm gonna tell you, guys what I had for dinner last night. So I ate my meal and for dessert, I had a chocolate brownie with the scoop of vanilla ice cream on it, with some caramel

drizzle on tops. And he'd beat yours now. Desert during your ten ten week training period, usually no, but but there are times, depending on and I think this is something that is very important when anyone is sticking to some kind of strict diet, you have to have cheap days. You will go freaking insane sticking to the same thing every single day for however long you're going to do it.

So like during my training camp, I'd say maybe once or twice through the ten weeks, we would go and I would get an ice like an ice cream or um, you know, whatever it may be. But we would go get something like a like a splurge or I'd even go out and get like a big old fat hamburger or something, you know. So to satisfy that corner of the brain. Yeah, you have to do it, man. And people that say that they never do it, they're lying. My wife made an ice cream pie for the kids

dinner and he was leaning over. There's like one little piece there, and he was like, you know, I might even eat that piece of ice cream pie. But then he didn't touch it. That's that's strong. Yeah, we'll see. You don't consider sugar the devil. Um. I mean it's not great. No, I don't think it's great, but I think in moderation from time to time is not going to kill anyone. We had a hard time defining. Um,

we're kicking this around. I mean I'm not I'm not doing it, but like defind like you know, like what is sugar right, because I mean sugars everywhere. So he had to sort of be like, wow, ship where sugars the point? Like cutting out? Like ship where the point is that sugary and sweet? Because you can't be like, Okay, a strawberry has sugars in it, you know what I mean,

there's all that, but I think, yeah, I know. So he had to look at like refined sugar is what you're probably trying to kick, right, yeah, And I were like, like added sugar and when it's easy like catch up, I've been trying to I've been not eating catch up because because that's sugar. And is this sugar? Well yeah, again, when you look at the label and if in the first two to three ingredients it says sugar, That's when I'm aiming not to be eating, right. I thought that

it was just tomatoes. Hey, you know something that Uh, when I was working on my book, my first book called The Scavengers Guy to Oat Cuisine. It was about this French chef Scofier and and all the wild game he would cook, but um for a long time like ketchup didn't mean like you'd specify, there's mushroom catchup, really tomato catch up. Yeah, there's many, many, many, And over time it just became like catchup became like catch up,

but it catch up. You be like, this's a sort of category of like vinegare toppings, and and that was the tomato one was no more then the mushroom one. I mean it's just like this whole thing like all of a sudden, like dressing just became ranch like ranch like one the fight it was like a general condiment. Yeah, it was like a vinegare, like a perade sort of vinegare topping. I would be annoying to try to bring that one back. What type of catch up? Yeah, you

could become like that guy. Yeah, I'm curious. I want to try him though. Yeah, Like, d what do you say catch up? You mean a mushroom catchup? Uh? Last question for you, lest Cal's got one um blue like and I like you work in the hunting industry. I

work in the hunting industry. Work in the hunting industry, and so hunting is different for people in the hunting industry, Like the opportunities are different, and you know, people and like you know, you have connections and all, like whatever, you just know what's up, right, When you want to go somewhere, you make a couple of phone calls. You find out what's going on. It's helpful. It's way more than ship. You learn on Google by calling people, you know,

because you have a lot of connections. But like I get a sense just from communications from emails, we get that like that, I find a high level of pessimism among blue collar California hunters, like classic weekend warrior like that the kind of hunting you grew up as right, and you described it perfectly. Is that pessimism warranted in California? It just seems it just seems to be like a down and out nous. Yeah, yeah, I sense that a

lot in Cali. I don't know what I mean for me, And you're referring to like people buying hunts just being a dude, you know, dut he pulls like a normal salary. He's got a family, he can hunt on the weekends. He doesn't have access to a lot of private land. It just seems to be kind of, like like I said, like a general down and out nous. You know, you talked to whatever, like, you know, you can talk to people in Wyloming. There's a general enthusiasm right like yeah,

hell yeah, it's great. But it's the pessimism mostly aimed at lack of opportunity or lack of too crowded. No, I don't think it's like lack of community. I think it's too much, if anything, be too much much, and I feel like everything it's just it's so thick, it's so crowded. There is some extremely tough conditions in California, but there are also some really great opportunities for the outdoorsman in California. In my honest opinion, we have some amazing,

amazing fishing locations. I think the yeah, the fishing is probably if you say that in California, you're probably high. Yeah, and you're if you're in California, probably are high. Yeah. I would probably, um. But I mean there's still great hunting. And here's here's what I've tried to do over the years, because I've felt that before. It's tough like that there's

public ground, but it's thick, it's overcrowded. You know, the the amount of animals you're saying, are you know, close to none um, you know, it's the opportunities aren't ideally easy. You know, you gotta work your ass off, compared to maybe I go to Utah and I'm seeing a hundred different deer in a day, you know what I mean, Like you don't do that. Yeah, no, I don't see it. And there's years I would go an entire season without seeing a legal buck, which you know just has to

have two on one side, you know. And so yeah, I can see why some people um have that. You know, it's not it's not easy, but I mean, you gotta make opportunity to Like I'm busting my ass daily knocking on people's doors, like seeing different properties that I know have amazing animals on them, and I asked for permission, Like do I get told no? Probably ninety nine percent in the time. Yes. So you're still out there mixing it up, like strategizing and trying to get onto good

hunting exactly. And there's a ton a ton of great hunting that's private though, and so it's like the worst case they're gonna say no. In fact, recently I got chewed out for asking. You're just gonna feel guilty if you don't go beat on ors that's what it is. Maybe right there, I gotta go ask. But so you asked someone and they got pissed. They got pissed you went passed no trustpassing sign to go knock on the door or what was there. So that was their reasoning

for it. But it's an easymant road. And I got permission on the road because there is a another piece of property that I can get on that that the only road in and out goes through. So this is a road that they they have a gate that goes you know, thousand yards to their house that's down there. So I hand wrote a whole letter, put pictures of me and my family so they know that it's not some crazy lunatic trying to get in there. Um, explained myself of you know why I would love to archery

hunt turkeys on their property. Um, it's a I think it's a hundred acre piece. UM. And I left it an envelope and set it on their gate. Didn't go in their gate, didn't go up there, anything, left it there. And I think two days later, three two or three days later, I get a call from a number that's from the Bay area, and I'm like, I don't know who this is, I answered, and the guy's like, is

this Chad? And I'm like, uh, yeah, who's this? He's like, this is so and so I won't say their name even though I probably should um, And he's like it was John Caswell and the biggest dick I've ever talked to? How the did you get that letter on my fence? How dare you even ask to hunt on my property?

Like just going off, and my heart's just like beating, like well, I'm getting an earful and I'm you know, trying not to be an asshole, and you know, there's so many things going through my head that I want to say to this guy, and you know, we're freaking neighbors, Like it's not that far from my house. I could throw a football into the property that's over there, and uh, he couldn't just be like no, no, you know he had to. He had to chew my ear off first.

And so he's going off, going off, going off, and he goes, he goes and to uh answer your question, no you can't hunt on my property, and I'm like, well, I couldn't tell by the tony your voice. But I

had an opposite. I had a phone call the other day with a guy where I I wanted to enquire about a property, And when I'm looking him up, I realized that he's got a business where you can send a um like you can send him like a like a you know, you feel out of it auto populates your name and stuff, and you can do an inquiry like a business inquiry. So I do a business inquiry and I apologize in my inquiry, sorry to use this. I just thought it might be less of an annoyance.

And if I called you know, And he says, and I lay it out for him, and he said, we'll give me a call next week. I'm like, yeah, hell yeah, I got it right. So we play phone tag a little bit. Eventually get down on the phone and UM has a whole bunch of questions for me. We're talking, it's going great, and I'm about right. I'm to the point where I'm like, well, where should I park? Right? And he goes, well, I don't mean to string you along. No, I'm like, great, very just friendly as ship. You know,

did you buy a chance? Tell me what you did mean? I think my feeling He went in knowing that it was a no, but was just being like I took the time to reach out to him, he felt obligated to. He felt obligated to close the loop and very politely, I'm like, okay, great, um, thanks for calling. I respect your you know, respect your perspective on it. Um. Okay, I I wish I would get that in California's really unusual. Really, I either don't get anything back, just silent. Or that guy,

this guy was from the South, got you. No, he he wanted to, Like we talked, we were talking about early before we start recording. He was closing the loop. That's amazing. I mean, just to wonder what what happens with that dude today who yells down to him to where he's like, oh, I'm gonna take the opportunity to ring the neck of this person with the nicely written

note and the nice little family. Yeah, I'll show you to take the really responsible path here and write me a letter illustrating what you'd like to do and how to contact me and giving me a sense of like who you are as an individual. I'll teach you a lesson. Dude. That's how I felt too. I'm like, you know, many people probably would just walk in there and poach and like trespassed. Like I I felt like I went out

of my way. I sat down at my computer and like wrote this, Like dude, I was so upset that ate me up to for like I have a good week. I'm just like what, like I wanted a kid doing it. You probably never knock on another door. Probably just go the trustpassing route. It's like next time, bro, I'm just gonna go here asking you to trustpassing. It's just a hundred bucks. Yeah. Yeah. The you gotta remember Old John's gotta live with himself every day. Um, live in his

own company. I got a question. We get a lot, uh but favorite game and how do you cook it? Oh? Man? I really enjoy access, dear. I So the last I think it's been three years now, I've been going to like Southern Texas UM with the Mountain Ops crew and we do a free range access to here hunt down there. And the first year I killed a buck um and I was it was, you know, during the rut, And I'm just like, man, I wonder how these are gonna

be during the rut? Is it gonna be a little you know, gamy, what's it gonna be like on freaking believable. We even had some on the grill next to a piece of elk, and so I was like, I want to taste test these suckers. And I enjoyed the access to dear more than I enjoyed the elk. And and and up until that point, I'd say elk was probably my favorite um wild game that maybe even wild boar. I

absolutely really love wild boar um but accessed here. And what like my favorite, probably most um appealing way to make it is I keep the the loin like bone in, and I'll do the tomahawk steaks. Oh yeah, yeah, And so like I'll usually smoke, yeah, smoke them for a little bit for you know, thirty five minutes, and then I'll take them out and get a cast iron hot and I'll do the butter and rosemary. Do you do the old pre smoke? Yeah, yep, cold or hot hot,

but really really low because they're thin. I mean, after you slice them, you eat there, even at that low temp for like thirty forty minutes, there are partially cooking, but the goal is just the smoke, just to get a little bit of the smoke from ma and then just finish them off in a real hot cast iron and just eat those suckers like lamb walipops. Oh god, it's so good. That's a fan favorite for sure. We are trying to do a cookbook. I'm trying to copy

you guys. I want to follow in your footsteps. But um yeah, me and uh two other buddies named Chad as well. So there's gonna be three of us, three chats, three Chads, one cookbook. But that's that's a great name for a book. That is that is and you're totally safe because we're not gonna copy you and start getting punched in the head. But we're I want to. I mean, we've been talking about doing it now for a year and a half, so I have no idea when it's

gonna when we're gonna launch. We have all the recipes done and we're looking for a publisher and stuff now. But um, I just love the wild game type stuff. You know, I'm doing that part of it. We have another guy, Chad Ward, who is uh in the trigger in the barbecue world. He's a pit Masters Barbecue World champ um and he's gonna do a lot of the barbecue side of it. And then we're gonna do. Do you guys know who Chad Building is. He has the foul life. Um, he's gonna you a lot. I'm familiar

with that. But he's gonna do a lot of the like the birds and stuff like that, and I'll do more of the big game stuff. But it's just gonna kind of be a mix of a little bit of everything. Yeah. Hell yeah. When we get it done, I'll for sure send you guys, I'll blurb with the back I'll just blurb the dude's wild game. Did you a guy up in Toronto? Michael Hunter? Nice? Um? All right, good fellas, very good. Good look at that baby man. Thank you guys. Don't let her go in the UFC. Oh that that

was my my question for you. Uh, buddy mine same. You know, very young child at home? Like where do you put the brand new baby life versus the training life? Would you rather be doing baby life? Yeah? I love it, And I mean my wife does most of it. She's she's super mom for sure. Um. When I'm out doing all this type of stuff and doing the finns and feather stuff, she's home alone. Her family is from Missouri, so and and my dad is like four hours south of us, and he just doesn't really do the baby

thing anyway. So you know, she's pretty much home alone taking care of the baby. So um, yeah, my hat's off to her for sure. I want to give you some parenting advice, but go for it. Well I can't. I gotta wait twenty years. That's that's the problem with that stuff. Man. I got like ideas, but I haven't. They haven't been born out yet. Yeah, I could be way off, you know, come like, find my kids and they're all they're all jail and whatnot. Be like, dude,

don't do that. Guy, Dude, No, I think you guys are good. I'll have to hold off when I'm when I'm how old I be, Yeah, one of my mid sixties, I'll be throwing around some advice. I might be like, whatever, you dude, don't do this in hindsight, alright, Jad Mendez, vins and feathers. Thank you guys very much. Formally, UFC, Yeah, we are retired. Thanks for coming on the show. Thank you appreciate it. Guys,