How can I help you today? I've done bits and pieces of work of all sorts of stuff, but nothing really in-depth apart from the meditation stuff that I do. So I feel slightly like I'm coming from a place of really playing catch up. The main thing that I'm struggling with is I I know my trauma. I know where it came from. I know the habit patterns I am repeating over and over again. It's the it's my purpose. It's like, I think I know what it is, and I feel
quite driven to be doing what I am doing. But how do I know if it's not the right thing? Yeah. So it sounds like you're kind of in, like of all the steps we just talked about, you're kinda hanging in between steps 2 and 3. Yeah. Right? So do you remember what the steps are? Here, I'll show you just so we can have some context. Okay? So based on what you just said. Right? You're like, I know my trauma. Right? So let me just
share this real quick. So you're like, you know, like, I understand my trauma is what you just said. Right? Right? I have an awareness of that, where it came from, why I do what I do. Right? Mhmm. And I'm not entirely clear that you've gotten clear on why being uncertain or not sure is good for you. And I'm not entirely clear that you have a good relationship with doubting yourself yet. And I'm not entirely clear that
you have good congruence between what you want and what you're doing. Does that make sense? Yeah. It does. And so, like and also, I'm not entirely clear if you're if you have a lot of understanding about what makes you, you know, dissociate checkout in dorsal, what makes you go sympathetic and and have anxiousness or anger. Right? No. That that's a whole new Yeah. So that also so so you're on the Kipp of step 2 and 3, but you
didn't you Kipp step 1, which is very normal for most people. Right? So so my recommendation, one, is before we even get into talking about your ambivalence about is this the right path or not, we just need to know how your nervous system works. Because you might not know if where
you're going is the right place or not. But, again, to the analogy of the steering wheel, if you don't even know that to go left or right, you have to be in motion, that's gonna be a confusing drive no matter where you're going. It has to be very inefficient to get there. Does that make sense? Yep. Yeah. Yep. Right? So what we wanna do is we wanna first understand how does your system work, not just how does the nervous system work, but how does your nervous system work. Intelligence
between what you say, which is here. It says like improve your relationship between your trauma and your trauma response. So in your case, the way that manifests is it manifests as I know my trauma, which is what you said. But then you said, I just don't know this is the right path. So I have a hypothesis that whatever happened to you is informing your self doubt on some level. Mhmm. Is that true? Yeah. Okay. So we wanna improve that relationship and even
understand why is that self doubt there in the first place. I can give you a little tiny taste of what that feels like if you want. Yeah. Go on. Oh, yeah. Go on. What am I, like, a circus performer? Do your juggling act, Mac Mastin. Go ahead. Just do do juggle away. That was really funny. You're funny. Okay. So where do you feel confusion in your body? When you're like, I don't know if this is the right thing or not. It's in my in my intestine,
in my lower belly. Okay. Great. So ask that part of you how old it thinks you are. 4. And ask that part of you how it's kept you safe and why it's kept you safe. It's kept me safe because I don't know what I'm doing. And what would happen when you were 4 if you didn't know what you were doing? I get shouted at. Okay. So on some level, this part is protecting you from anger of others Mhmm. And disapproval and probably rejection of others also. Mhmm. Right? So
let's just try this for a second. Go to that part if you want and just say, for you and any other part that I know of or don't know of, you can say it out loud or just internally, whatever works. Thank you for keeping me safe for the reasons I know about and the reasons I don't know about. Thank you for keeping me safe for the reasons I know about and the reasons I don't know about. Just notice how that feels. Yeah. Exhale. And how does that feel? There's a
lot of gurgling going on. Is that a good thing? It feels like it's unknotting. Love that. Okay. Now how long did that take? Not long. So That's amazing. Brief example of, like, a tiny taste of what I'm talking about. I'm like, wait a minute. I think I know what my purpose is, but I'm not entirely sure it's the right thing. And how long have you been struggling with that kind of, confusion? Yeah. 5 to 10 years. Okay. And what have you done to work on that confusion? Nothing. I've just
blundered on regardless. Push through. Uh-huh. That's right. Okay. So I want to say something to you. Okay? This is for you and for everybody else who's listening. Okay? You sound like someone who works hard. Is that true? Okay. So that's a good thing. Never stop working hard. Okay? But this is what I wanna say to you. The worst thing you can do in the world is what doesn't work harder. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So your
playbook is, I don't know what to do. I'm gonna do it harder. Faster, better, stronger. Right? And this part's like, I don't know what's going on. It's like trying to talk to you and you're like and it's like, I'm confused. Right? Oh, but I know what my trauma is, but I don't know why I gotta move forward. Who cares? Just moving forward. Why am I so tired? I don't know. I don't know why I'm so tired. Why does my gut kinda have digestive issues or IBS
or any of that type? I don't really know. You even say if you had those things. But imagine if you're not paying attention to your belly and your gut, there might be digestive problems. I have no idea. There might be energy problems. I don't really know. Right? But what I'm saying to you is just a brief moment of, like, hold on. Thanks for keeping me safe. Notice you had a somatic release, like, gurgling. That's your body releasing something with, like, what, 15, 30 seconds of attention.
So what that will do is the more you could do that and make that a reflex, not just something you have to practice, but it's reflexive. It's gonna make your forward motion so much better. And that's just like I don't know. We have, like, what, 8 or 9 steps, and that's, like, at least 3 to 4 steps each. So what is that? Like, 20 to 30 steps? That's, like, a taste of one part of, like, 20 to 30 steps that we just talked about. Does that make sense? Yeah. Really. Does that feel in your
body? Relief. Yeah. That's right. Now would you be willing to ask that part if it would be willing to step aside a little bit so that you can move forward with the purpose that you're not sure about if you promise to check-in with it? I promise to check-in with you. Would you mind stepping aside to let me carry on with my purpose? That I'm not sure about. That I'm not sure about. Would that be okay? That okay.
What does it say? It hasn't actually said anything, but I've just just felt my lower belly just it's like a still pond now. And what do you interpret that as? Sometimes it's not vocal. Sometimes it could just be a slow motion. I interpret that whether I'm right or wrong. I interpret that as it relaxing and going, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Alright. That's okay. So could you see how getting really good at something like this could really help you in your achievement? Yes. Yeah. Really? Exactly.
Yeah. And, again, that was probably in total maybe 30 seconds to a minute of brief coaching on one part of, like, 30 steps that we just talked about. And yet it'll have a big impact. And so thank you for raising your hand. Thank you for letting me coach you. Thank you. Thanks very much. That was brilliant. Getting back on. I love it. Alright. We have time for one more. Who else? Hi, everyone. Hi, Mastin. Hi. Good to see you. Hi. You're building my
confidence getting on these calls, Madison, so I appreciate it. Thank 2 in 1 day 2 in 2 days. This is exciting. I know. This is unbelievable. Thank you so much. So, following on from yesterday, we were talking I forget the lady's name, but she was talking about her why, and you were giving some coaching around that. And I've I've been reflecting a little, but I haven't been able to get below sort of the surface level of
of why I wanna go into functional medicine coaching. My understanding around that is because, I wanna get down to the basics of understanding the biology and not wanting to be unwell myself, in the future and being able to look after myself with a background of, you know, dorsal vagal freeze and chronic fatigue and and what have you, and having done, you know, all the modalities, all the work, all the things.
But, yeah, I was I I geared towards functional medicine health coaching. I haven't started yet as I explained yesterday, and I believe it's coming from a place wanting to help others or helping myself first so that I can help others. Right? We we integrate it first and then we help others. So I'm that far with it, but I I'd like to get a little bit more clear on my motivation for that. And I Okay. Yeah. Love it. And by the way, compared to yesterday, your presence, congruence, and
clarity is, like, exponentially changed. Like, it's, like, really almost like I'm talking to a different person. Oh, that's amazing. Yeah. That's pretty good. Thank you. Yeah. So why is it important for you to heal? Well, so that I'm not in a place of, hurt and in a place of shutdown, in a place of not being able to move through life in a way that I would like to. And why is it important for you to move through life in a way that you would
like to? So that I can achieve the things that I would like to achieve and get clear on. Oh, yeah. So I would like to purchase a home one day. I would like to have, the safety in that. Having a background of and I'm I'm being really exposed at the moment, but having a background of homelessness due to illness, that's a big motivator for me to purchase a home one day. Right? Yeah. So you've been homeless because you've been sick? Yes.
Yes. Say more about that. So when I first became ill with chronic fatigue, went through all my savings, trying to stay afloat, and then was just so unwell, which I now know is a a massive trauma response. Yeah. I went through all my savings and, you know, lost my job, lost everything that was important to me. And so I've been living from that space of of survival and, trying to overachieve and then burning out. Yeah. So I wanna go here for a second to
step probably 3 for just a second. Okay? So we're gonna go here. Just for just we might be a little here too. I'm not sure. I I just wanna find out. We might be I mean, we we we we might we might go through all 3 of these steps. I'm not too sure. Let me just briefly. So let me just let me just see. And I'm gonna ask you a question before I start coaching you. Some of the questions I'm gonna ask you could be perceived as victim blaming, but they're not.
Are you okay with me asking you certain questions that are, curious, trying to understand how you work while stating it from the beginning. This is not about blaming you. It's about understanding what's happening in your system like a scientist. Yes, please. I'm not but I'm not I'm not applying a meaning to it. Sure. Sure. The reason why I say that is because sometimes when I ask certain questions, I can see people's inner critics or managers just be like start to beat them up for, like,
the the answer. So I'm not gonna do that, but we're just kinda meeting and getting to know each other. So I wanna make sure that you know that that's not what I'm doing when I ask you certain questions. Is that okay? Oh, Yeah. That's okay. Thank you for asking. Yeah. Okay. So just for context, just so that we can create that. And if it starts to happen, I'll point it out. Because sometimes, I can be very direct in my coaching.
And sometimes, especially for people who just met me or seeing something like out of, out of context, they might think, oh, he's victim blaming. But I don't do that. What I do is I uncover a recipe Sure. For how things happen. Okay. So you said that there was a time in your life where you got ill and then you were homeless. Is that true? Correct. Yeah. And how old were you? Straight away, but it took time. I was 25. Okay. What were what were the circumstances of you getting ill?
So I took a vaccine. It was the the cherry on the cake, I suppose, for a a nervous system that was stretched to capacity. So very at the time, very high achiever, working very hard, doing all the things, and, yeah, burnt out. Okay. So now and you took the vaccine Yes. And why did you take the vaccine? I'm not pro or anti vaccine Mastin a question. Yeah. That's a very good question, actually. I took the vaccine,
because it was it was pushed. It was aimed at women my age at the time to take that vaccine to prevent, cervical cancer. Yeah. Oh, okay. And did you have cervical cancer? Did it run-in your family? Did you have a did you have any reason to think that you would have it? Were you No. Absolutely not. So what motivated you to take a vaccine for cervical cancer? Just And you see how me asking that question might be like, why did you do that? Right?
But I'm just asking why. I'm not saying why did you do that you shouldn't have or why did you that you should have. I'm just asking That's a great question. At the time, I believe that that was the right thing to do for my health as I was listening to I just, you know, visit the doctor and they'd explain that I needed to take it. So I I just took that on. I I was raised with the mindset that we listen to doctors. We listen to what they say. Okay. Got it. Yeah. And when you got
sick, were you in a relationship, or were you single? Single. Okay. And are you in communication and connection with your parents at that time? Are they alive? Are they not with us? Are they where are your parents? So I had moved out of home when I was around 16 or 17. So I've got that background of, attachment trauma and, neglect and abuse. Yeah. Okay. And are we talking like, like ACE's score of what? Around I think when I from memory, it's like a 7, I think, for memory. For
people who's like, what's a ACEs score? It's not about acing a test. ACE stands for adverse childhood experience, and there's a 1 to 10 scale. And typically, if you're 6 and above, that's pretty intense. And if you're 7, 8, or 9, 8, 9, 10, like, those are pretty, you know, intense childhoods typical typically. So what that tells me is you had a pretty intense childhood. Did you choose to leave, or were you forced out?
I was manipulated to leave. I had no choice. So I I in a way, I chose to leave, because it was better the option was better than staying. Yeah. But did you want to leave? No. Not well. I wanted the I wanted the abuse to stop. I didn't wanna leave home. Not at all. No. Okay. And is there a part of you are you are your parents alive? Or Yes. And what is your principal right now? Not real speaking. I don't speak to them. Yeah. Okay. So when you
said what you said, I started listening. And here's the thing. I have over 20 I stopped counting at 20,000. I have over 20000 hours coaching people, and every person I work with is unique and different. There are also certain things that have universal appeal or universal
application. And so when you said that you were homeless because you got sick at 25, what I did with that was and what I'm kind of looking for in my questions is, see, when we have a certain behavior, and especially if homelessness is not your baseline, right, the way that I wonder about that type of experience is, who's coming to help me? Right. There was a a total element of helplessness. Yes. Yeah. But Yeah. So okay. That's what I that's what I think. So and
that again, not blaming, just under uncovering. Okay? What I feel in my system, and this might be inaccurate, so do not take this on just because I'm saying it. But it's almost like, I'm not well. Will someone please come help me? Oh, a 100%. Absolutely. Accurate? Say more about that. Oh, yeah. It it I I would imagine. I'd be really vulnerable, but this is okay. So I would imagine looking back on it, it was a feeling of, yeah, please
come and rescue me. That's what I wondered, when I was that unwell. Okay. And obviously, no one came to do that. Yeah. But the wish is there. Absolutely. Yeah. And I still have that girl who wants her parents to do the right thing Yes. Who doesn't wanna leave, who wants the abuse to stop and wants the love to start Exactly. That little girl has this wish, which is her wish and which makes sense. If they would just x, then I could get the love I want. Yeah. Is
that right? Absolutely. Okay. So let's think of the homelessness state as a we can use a different language for a second. Okay? So we're not saying you weren't homeless. I'm gonna add on to it. I'm gonna say you were homeless, but you're also in a state of being rescuable. Yes. Does that make sense? Yes. And, again, I'm not judging. I'm just trying to analyze the situation here because patterns continue a lot of times because they keep us in a certain type of relationship with
somebody. Right? So I'll give you an example. So we had a client once, rheumatoid arthritis, and I was talking with her and understanding how she was being caretaken by her husband and all these things. And I was just, like had this gut feeling. We were in person, and I just Kipp, like it was, like, after, like, 3 or 4 days of setting up context and being in this experience, all these things. I kinda leaned into her and I said, you know, your
husband can love you whether you're sick or not. Right? And she looked at me like, if you just say to me, I'm immediately yellow. Right? I was like, oh, okay. That that that is meaningful to you. Tell me more. And then she started to cry, and what emerged was a part of her that was, like, not sure about that. And so I'm not saying that her relationship caused the rheumatoid arthritis. What I am saying is is that her thinking on some level or a a part of her being dominant thinking that the
way I get love and connection is through having this illness. That's how he supports me. That's how he loves me. He can't just love me for me. I have to be sick for him to love me was certainly not helping her get better at best. Right? You could probably infer other things with that, but I'm not a doctor. I'm not going to say that. That being said, that night showed a little bit of a flare because we hit a
sore point, literally. But over time, her symptoms started to improve, and she started to be more vulnerable with her partner, who was actually able to show up for her for things that were not caretaking. They were just so used to it for decades that that was just kinda what they got into. And what was interesting is over time, her sort of flares and then she was doing other stuff, functional medicine and all the other things she's supposed to do to keep inflammation down and all that
stuff. But this relational piece helped her have experiences with her partner and her husband that were not based in caretaking, and she started to link connection with health also. And that was a contributing factor for her maintaining less flares, I believe. I don't have, like that's not like a that's just anecdotal observation. Right? Now the reason why I say that is because on the one hand, you
could say I haven't had this chronic homelessness. But when I'm homeless, I think I might be in a state of having this little girl desperately want her mom and dad to come let her back in. And maybe if it gets bad enough, they'll notice. Yeah. That's interesting. That's the notice part. I hadn't thought of it from that perspective. Absolutely. I've had that feeling of, you know, please someone come and help me. So learned helplessness. Right? But the, yeah, the noticing, that's
interesting. Yes. When we call this learned helplessness because here's why. Okay? Okay. Learned helplessness is like, I don't have agency to change. This is like preferential helplessness or relational helplessness. It's like if I'm helpless, if I'm vulnerable, if I don't have what I need, maybe then you'll want me back. Maybe then you'll come get me. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Which is different than, like, I don't know how to change because my locus of
control is external. I don't have any agency. Right? Like, you don't come off as someone who's that agency. No. Not at all. You to me, you come off as someone who craves relationship like most of us. Yes. Right? So it seems like when you hit a certain level of stress, it's like there's a maybe a regression to a younger part of you happened, and it was too much to take on. You didn't know how to ask for help. You didn't
know how to recruit support. On some level, there's this unconscious wish that someone will come rescue me, which we all have that on some level. And parts like that say things like, if I had to tell you what I need, you don't love me. Right? Right. Which is the expectation of a child. That's appropriate developmentally from, like, 1 to 3, 4, 5, 6, 7. Right? It's developmentally appropriate to not really know what you need. Right? But,
eventually, we gotta use our words. And so this is about recruiting relational support and recognizing that you can be successful, take on stress, and have relational support, and not have to be, quote, homeless to find a way to find help. Right. Interesting. You can have relation healthy relationships with success also, with owning a home. Like, home equals because if you think about it, home equals no family for you. Oh, totally. It's this, what do I wanna call it? The
the independence, but it's a very fierce fierce independence. Right? And that's the other side. So I could imagine a rebellious teenager being like, and this is how I'm independent. Yes. All very much so. So it's both. It's also both. It's like, come rescue me, but few, I go on my own. Totally. Now we have ambivalence, which is dorsal sympathetic, by the way. Ah, thank you. That and that's that's been the challenge.
That's been the, yeah. Yeah. That that's been the part that has, or the element, I guess, that has been conflict. That's what I'm looking for. It's been conflicting. Yeah. The under That's right. So so in a way, if we get back to motivation for a second, So we're just doing a little bit of of of understanding about how your parts are oriented. Right? One part wants to connect with your parents and have them come save you. One part wants to be independent and
say never again. And those two parts probably don't like each other. No. No. Because they have opposite goals. Does that make sense? And if you stay in that for too long, both of their goals get met because I can stay in this forever wishing and hoping that maybe one day because the next day, this this maybe next maybe it'll be tomorrow. Maybe the next day. Maybe the next day. I don't know if you ever saw the, Force Awakens, which is Right. I'm making a Star
Wars reference because I'm me. But Force Awakens was the 7th film in the Star Wars franchise. And, Rey, who was the protagonist, the female protagonist, was on this planet called Jakku, and she was abandoned by her parents there. And she refused to leave because she was convinced that her parents were coming back, and she refused to leave. And a mentor, Yaz Kanata, said to her, darling, the connection you're looking for is in the future, not the past. And it was just like, oh, what I saw is I
started crying. You know? We could talk Star Wars for days, and not gonna keep doing it. But the point is is that home can be safe. Home can mean family. Home can mean family doesn't abandon you. Home can mean independence. And if you think your your body is an analogy for your home, the same thing applies. Wow. Yes. Thank you. That makes sense? Yeah. It does. It does. And I'm looking forward to watching the the replay and allowing more of that to sink
in. Thank you. So with with with motivation, now you're what's my motivation? You tell me. Right. So well, it's it we've step the coaching the the part of the coaching, I've always sort of been doing a little bit of that anyway throughout my life. I get but the problem is is I've given more of myself than I had to give, if that makes any sense. Yeah. And I guess there's a part of me that comes up and says, oh, you're gonna over you're gonna overinvest in that. And,
we're not doing it yet. Right. All we're doing is deciding what's motivating you. Yeah. The motivation is than the actual action. Right? So for me, it might be something like to learn how to rescue myself so that I can create my own independence, have my own home, and create my own safety, and to help other people do the same. Yes. Yes. They are. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. What happens in your body when you think of it like that? It's like a deep breath. Yeah.
That's what we're Literally. Yeah. A deep breath. Yeah. Which is, like, better than, like, so I can make an impact. It's like, I mean, yeah, that's nice. But, like, it is not, like, deep breath. You know? Exactly. Thank you for that. That that was the clarity that I was looking for, because I could only get to sort this sort of level like the lady yesterday. So thank you. It was really beautiful, and thank you for letting me ask certain
questions and really understanding that they're not meant to judge. They're just more meant to inspect, because zero judgment on any of it. But everything you just expressed makes a lot of sense, and I look forward to helping you create a home. That's gonna be awesome. Thank you so much, Mastin. I appreciate this, and I appreciate you, and I appreciate everyone holding space. Thank you so much. You're welcome. Let's hear it, all. So good. Alright.