Episode 168 - Merger Is Coming

Coming up this week on the Martcast. Well with the finalization of the XFL and USFL merger on the horizon, Countless theories have been floated across the internet about what the makeup of the new merged league will entail. But as we approach to date when the paperwork will actually be finalized, what should you expect from the new merged XFL and USFL league? Dust off year old Edard Stark

impressions merger is coming? When coming? Exciting show this week longtime friend of the program, John Lewis of John Lewis Sports on YouTube stopping by first time ever. We're running through all of the latest news this week for the XFL USFL merger, latest rumblings, predictions, what do we expect, and what

you should expect moving forward. It feels like that the XFL is just going to be absorbed by the USFL, and I hope that there is some way and I know you don't want get into hypotheticals or speculation and all that that's all we got right now, but I hope there is some way for the XFL brand to live on, because it would just be a shame for that to be, you know, three strikes and out, and then lots of CFL stef to talk about this week as you barrel towards CFL Week twenty one

and the CFL playoffs. Darryl Davis, longtime friend of the program, stopping back by. You need Darryl's insights into Craig Dickinson's contract not being renewed as he head coached for the Saskatchewan rough Riders. Who would Darrold Davis like to see take over that role? We get Darryl's thoughts on the CFL team award

nominations, CFL Week twenty one, and lots more. If the coach can't motivate a team or get them better, then you have to get Rif the coach, they gave him a second chance, which maybe they shouldn't have done, but the way that the salary cap works out, you'd probably keep them round for one year to finish off his contract. Craig Dickinson's a great guy. We all love Drag Dickinson, but the players took advantage of him. They didn't play for him, they weren't inspired by him, they didn't believe

he could be a head coach. They had to fire the head coach the fact they made no other changes. I'm fine with that. And in a great chat with standout kick returner James Letchrier junior of the Montreal Alloleds as they prepare for a couple big weekends against the Hamilton Tiger Cats here approaching the playoffs should be a good one. Like and subscribe, you guys lookers to the

Marcus read here what we have lost on the program last week? You've kind of ill fadd after the conclusion show. Now we have Game of Thrones. Not sure if that's better or worse here, but a merger is coming. Winter is coming. You already know the meme. I think next week is going to be the week meetings. This week going on in the XFL players kind of be notified of certain things, so I expect news coming out here soon. Kind of final catch all today John lewis excited to have him on,

kind of doing the final rundown. Whe are we hearing? Whe are we thinking? What would we prefer? Kind of all the different rumblings going on here last couple of weeks, I know people are getting frustrated. Tried to stay out of the kind of hypothetical too much, but it could be fun today, kind of organizing, kind of collecting all of the final thoughts and theories here, kind of predictions as we hopefully get the official announcement for

the XFL and USFL Merge League here coming up next week. I really appreciate John Lewis, like I said, for coming on. Darryl Davis is always for making time batting through coffeeing illness there. Really appreciate that. Excited to see Darryl here coming up in a couple of weeks in Hamilton for the Gray Cup, and then James Letcher Junior. Really appreciate that. Really punctual guests. I always appreciate that players coming on. Appreciate Francis and everyone over at

the Montreal Alouettes for setting that up. Should do it for me today. Like I said, hope you guys enjoy here. Let's hope for cross your fingers. Big news coming next week. Make sure you subscribe. We'll be going live doing shorts and kind of all that stuff. I think I'm working from home all week, so it should be available. Kind of win that news if and win that news break, so like and subscribe. We'll see at the end next Well, I was sitting I was literally cutting my hair

over the weekend. I do you know one day a week is my hair cutting day. And I thought, I am so rude. I've never asked this showman to come on. I mean, John's had me on and he's asked me to write in stuff about it. And I said, let's get John Lewis on here, John Lewis Sports YouTube. We'll talk to kind of everything today. But John, how are you doing? I'm doing good. Read I know. I appreciate it, man, it's a It wasn't rude

at all. You have been so generous with your time. In fact, my first real video you were the star of the show on that one. So no, I appreciate to appreciate you having me on. Everything is going well. We're just you know, sitting on waiting on news. Yeah, waiting on news. So the theme today is Merger is coming, Winter is coming, and so we'll talk through kind of the recent we I've really tried to get outside of a lot of the hypotheticals of everything, just because in

the Facebook groups and everything had been crazy. But I feel like we're close now. I feel like XFL had a meeting with their players this week. I said, announce me this is coming next week. I feel pretty good about that. Still hearing mixed reports obviously about the number of hubs and kind of all that stuff. We'll get into everything, but first off, I appreciate you coming on because I do feel like I'm in my little bubble a little bit in terms of like the XDAL news hub writers, and you know,

I hate bringing people on that. I feel like we agree all the time. Would you say you're more pro USFL than pro XFL, that you're the opposite side of the coin, I mean no, I mean I think I'm right in the middle. I mean I really just enjoyed both. I got you know, I've attended USFL games and XFL games. I just like spring football as you can and alternative football as you can, as you can

tell back here. So but it does feel like to me reading I don't know that, I mean, this is certainly isn't going out on a limb. It feels like that the XFL is just going to be absorbed by the USFL. And I hope that there is some way. And I know you

don't want to get into hypotheticals or speculation and all that. It's all we got right now, but I hope there is some way for the XFL brand to live on, because it would just be a shame for that to be, you know, three strikes and out, especially when obviously there was the

original XFL in two thousand and one that was a disaster. Twenty twenty, you know, they bring it back and things were going well until COVID and then it just felt like they're going to try to revive this brand, and it felt like it was good, and it felt like it was a more traditional league than the USFL. I would just hate for all of that to just kind of go by the wayside. But it feels like that the USFL

has the upper hand now because the XFL asks for a hand up. No, and I do think, yeah they ban off today in terms of you

know, any hypotheticals anything. I think we're fine, you know, because this is to me, this is kind of the last catch all before we get into all this and speaking about I didn't want to kind of preface on I know you're I was trying to take you on Twitter to promote and I saw you're on threads now only there was quite the kerfuffle on Twitter this week where I guess Pat McAfee in relation to Jim Ersa talking about the Colts and

the whole referee and the review process and all of that. The Colts game versus A Brown had come out and said there would have been review and they need more, you know, referee reviews, and obviously Pat was familiar, right with XFL twenty twenty and its familiar with all that, and basically made a statement like yeah, you know, I heard that they're merging. And

basically the USFL once the XFL came back, they couldn't do anything. And so you know, there didn't like you know, needless to say, a lot of the USFL fans you would have thought that they were being told that like Santa Claus didn't exist, right, it was. It was a lot

of whatever. And so like I just my preface, and I saw a lot of that online this week, like don't worry about what other people think about any of the like I get, you know, we get like Anthony Miller on here we're poop poo and stuff and people you shouldn't be so negative. You should be I don't tell anyone what to think. That's why I ask your opinion on everything. It's very interesting to me. People get so up in the arms about what other people think about things like I don't particularly

care what you think or not. I care about your Indian and want you need to share it, but I'm not going to get mad at you if you say one thing or the other. So well, in the whole Pat McAfee thing, it's like, I get it, and you know he might have pooh poohed this or that, but you know, Pat McAfee is uh no, I mean, I think he knows the NFL very well. I don't know that Pat McAfee could name you three teams out of either league,

So I don't know that that would be I don't you know. Yeah, he got he got some traction and because of what he said, but he's paid a lot of money and apparently pays Aaron Rodgers some money too, to share opinions. So I mean, that's what it is, and that's what it's like lists when people get so mad at oh Rolling Stone has this list of the one hundred greatest songs and then there's some crazy thing that will be in the top ten. There's a reason for that. It's to get traction

and to get people to talk. So but as We've talked about read the XFL fans and the USFL fans. They're so tribal and so protective of what they think is their league. I was never in either of those camps. I just enjoyed it all and but yeah, there, but when someone says something bad out what they think is their league, then they get a little man. So I can imagine the kerf that was happening on Twitter. It was Yeah. I was like, like, who cares? You said?

You can't? You know you couldn't. It's it's always the uh, the yeah, the fly by night. You know, hey, I'm just going to passing glance on this and you get a lot of that. We get a lot of that with the CFL people whatever. I did think it. Yeah, when that report came out about Aaron Rodgers, I think farheard Lology had just come on from CFL, and I DMed him. I said, I'm sorry I can't pay as well as Pat MC to come on the show. But so getting into all this I'm with you feels like somewhat of an

absorption to me, and I've been very open about this, don't. I don't particularly enjoy that because I don't particularly enjoy working with Fox, and I think that right or wrong, and whether other people agree or distrect, I think US XFL has been far more workable with a lot of like the al

football community journalists, you know, I think across the board. To me, that's my biggest hesitation at Fox, feeling like even outside of us, if they don't need anyone butt Fox, right, we don't need to promote anywhere but calling coward then maybe Skip, you know, Skip Bayless will give us a shout out. Are you concerned if there is kind of an absorption here of the x L. Yeah, I mean, I see where you're coming from there. You've obviously had a lot more experience like dealing with these

leagues. I've had a little bit, you know, as far as like trying to you know, getting on a mailing list. It just seemed like that was a whole thing with the for me with the XFL. USFL were you know, last year. And it's funny to say that cause last year I at this time worked for a Fox affiliate and as a as a sports reporter and anchor, and I was trying to go through and get some of

the players that were you know, local to this market. You know, to try to talk to them, do interviews, and I really I mean I was going through interns. I mean, it was just it was a whole thing, and frankly didn't get a lot and had to just kind of DM some guys and get them myself. But I really think I would hope that the USFL and XFL or whatever this new entity is going to be well.

Understand that when you start to look at the ratings, these are grassroots efforts, These are grassroots fans, These are not This is not the NFL. I mean, the NFL is my favorite sport, but I love pro football in general. So it seems to me like if if I'm a guy who's you know, a very small YouTube guy but would like to would love to like get somebody on and say, hey, let me talk to this player and kind of tell their story, that the ex that USFL or Fox

would be pretty open to that. I mean, I understand that you want to protect your your IP, you want to protect your brand, but I mean, how what kind of big deal would that be to, you know, say, hey, this guy wants to talk to you. If you're you know, whatever player you are, this guy wants to talk to you, you know, do you want to do their podcast or YouTube channel or

whatever. So hopefully they'll be a little more open to that. And what you said is interesting because you say the XFL you had, you had some better luck with that. This merger I think presents a golden opportunity because the XFL, you know, USFL and XFL were competitors, but now if they're together, they can really say, Okay, they can sit down on the table. USFL guys can say this is what we did and we had success. The XFL guys can say this is what we did and have success and

maybe put that together. And hopefully part of that, part of that would be let's make the YouTube guys and the podcast guys let's give you know, let's cut them in on the deal too, because they speak directly to the fans. So hopefully, like that would be one positive outcome of this merger. Well, and yeah, I think, and I've been talking with some people in the XFL, like there is a thought process there of you know,

we certainly bring more to the table together than we do separately. And sure, I would say, hands down, the USFL is you know TV exposure, now you know XFL you know, minimally better in the ratings with like less broadcast, you know, exposure. I think the XFL we had debates on this, you know, talent, it's the high end talent better in one versus the other, obviously having the teams in the markets. But it is it seems like it's it's a if we expected this five years down

the road. I mean, it seems like it makes sense to get to this point already, you know, to get to this point eventually, but that seems surprising that we got here so quick. Are you you know, and I've asked this over the last couple of weeks. Do you feel like this is a merger of strengths coming together? Is this a merger of necessity for survival? I think both things can be true. I think I think

there is. The XFL it seemed to be okay, if you these are two very different leagues in my opinion, the USFL, and some people don't like this and have kind of disagreed with this, But to me, the USFL, owned by Fox, was kind of the pet project of Eric Shanks, who is you know, a big deal in in Fox Sports. It was a TV show. The XFL tried to create something that was a little bit more like a traditional league. I think you can, you can find

success somewhere in the middle and those come together. But the x the USFL, for instance, if the USFL lost sixty million dollars, that's a rounding error for Fox, sixty million dollars to the XFL, and you know, Capital Ventures people, that's a huge loss, and I think they didn't want to try that again. So I think there's a little bit of truth in both of those things. There are strengths to both leagues. I think it was a little bit of different ideals of how they wanted to build these things

up. It sounds like they still want to do the franchise thing and put these teams in their cities, and I think that's a big would that would be maybe more doable with Fox as more of a backer, because again, they can lose sixty million dollars and nobody bats an eye. When the XFL, with a capital group whose goal is to make money, loses sixty million dollars or whatever that figure might actually be, it's a different story. So

I think there's success that can come out of here. But I'm like you read, I thought that this was going to be in maybe twenty twenty six, twenty seven, not twenty twenty three, twenty four. The are you

surprised with all? You know? Because there's obviously been the rumors out with the United Football League stuff that the X ANDFLS trademarque and the National String Football League stuff, which is so funny just time as a flat circle with all that that, with both of these leagues spending so much money and resources, you know, to acquire these things, like we've always said, you know, Danny and the Rock could have just started the Rock Football League and kind

of moved forward and where they you know, was there too much baggage of what people expected from twenty twenty carried in now and obviously Fox having to go through the lawsuits and stuff like are you surprised that they were so quick on both of these just to say we're going to be I mean, I think one of these will be true, right, whatever league it is, But they say, hey, we're getting rid of all this and we're going to

start a new Yeah, I mean, especially this quickly. Yeah, I just thought, you know, it felt like when you when you listen to the Rock and you listen to ing Garcia and the way that they talked about this was a long term play. This wasn't to come in and just you know, try something and it was financed. It just you know, that's

I was extremely optimistic. And listen, I'm an old guy. I mean, it's all it's always cautious optimism when you're talking about alternative pro football from even you know, from two thousand and one, but you go back before that and a lot of people know the history. But it was interesting that they started, when they started to snap up some of these names, I did wonder, like, I don't know that it's going to be called the United Football League. Maybe it will, but it just seemed like what value

does the UFL play as a brand. That's what I didn't understand is like, was that maybe a preemptive move because you know, there is a United Football League out there right now and it's I mean, it's not a real league. It's the same people that did the National grid Iron thing, and it just felt kind of scammy. But I think that, you know, was that maybe a preemptive move so no one can use that to maybe compete against them. I don't know that there's a there's a lot of business that

happens that I'm not privy too and have never had that experience. But I was surprised that the NSFL the UFL got snapped up by by Fox and by the XFL. Uh well no, and I I mean I would hope it was something called the USFL. I just acquired the USFL podcast domain that,

you know, I I I think there. But to me, if you're spending where where, we're so cost cutting on all of this, and you know, even as conservative as the USFL was, the XFL spending so much more money doing the travel and doing you know, trying to get the people in and the stadium leases and all that stuff like that, you would spend any amount of money at all on something like legal fees or any of this stuff just to be okay, we're moving on here. It just does seem

weird to me, uh, in terms of that. And uh, you know, there's no like you said, there's no brand recognition for any of this other stuff, like I would even if you could have called it the us XFL or whatever, I think there's more brand than Okay, it's it's a comment. And then like, okay, this is a new league now we're combining to me. To me, it always feels weird, but I'm kind of open to any of that stuff. Yeah, I mean, you've

got to find the right brand. And I hope that they're there's more or talk, and I'm sure there are because you know, again Fox is involved in Fox knows marketing and they know sports marketing, So I hope that there's a little bit more talk on you know, what can we brand this? I love the USFL brand. Do you remember when even that came about? Like again, I was working at a Fox affiliate and had no idea that

this was happening. Then all of a sudden, on our on our Fox Sports wire that was internal, it said USFL is coming back, and they sent all this old video and they had like, you know, the promo announcement. This came out of nowhere, And I thought to myself, this

is really cool. But what does the USFL brand really mean to maybe the demos that that Fox is going to try to reach, because I don't think it's going to be you know, old guys, but maybe they're trying to reach, you know, a younger audience, but you have that cachet maybe of the nostalgia of the USFL. I don't know, but after two seasons that I thought were pretty good and good play, I know they wanted better ratings in this second season, but it seems like the USFL brand it's got

some juice. And if you combine that with the XFL somehow, you got to think that there's success there and that there's going to be some brand recognition, because that's, to me, is what's going to be important. Not to you and me, that's what's going to be important to some of the fringe fans out there who might just be sampling this for the first time.

It's so weird and I'm obviously not the demo honestly, I mean for any of these like you know, people are saying like, oh, you know, read is going to be so poo pooed if there's no Seattle team, Like I don't really care. I mean, like the USFL thing has never done a lot. I have known nostalgia for the Stallions or the Breakers or any of that stuff. I mean that was kind of before my time. And then you know the one stuff with the XFL. I remember watching and

I wasn't the biggest football fan. I just knew, okay, this is Vince McMahon. This is something I should try to watch. And I didn't know football even well enough to understand even what the differences were back then, Right, what would out have been in two thousand? You know, I was fourteen years old or whatever, so kind of living through and then even this twenty twenty version, Like, you know, I think the people are a lot more firm with the BattleHawks and maybe the defenders. I don't think

that, you know, the DRAGONUS has ever been that. Sorry, I'm a brand, so I'm just curious moving forward here. I don't know how much weight there isn't any of this stuff. I mean, I'm not the right person to ask, but I've never gotten this obsession with the USML branding that it seems like a lot of the USFL people have. Yeah, I

mean, and I am old enough to remember I was thirty. Thanks for making me feel old when you and the well twenty nine technically when the first XFL kicked off, and I remember the original USFL At that time, I was in high school and I or well, eighth grade or so. But anyway, I really wasn't that huge of a football fan. I like, you know, the NFL but didn't really understand this the whole alternative thing in spring football. But yeah, it was just it was just really surprising to

me. And they you know, they even bring back the logo and everything, so that that to me is, you know, I hope that pro football and alternative pro football is a thing that's going to be financially stable and we'll get the eyeballs and maybe this is kind of a secondary thing, but I am so interested in the branding and what they're going to come up with here, and it feels like they need to come up with it pretty quickly. Yeah, well and that's you know, so that's the thing. Obviously

we're here end of October at a minimum. I have heard you expect like an April launch for whatever this is going to be. I think, you

know, I know that the XFL were signing letters of intent. I think that's I think it's very odd to be having players signing letters of intent for teams that we don't know if they're going to exist in a month like that to me feels a little hollow, And I don't I haven't wanted to get like too critical on like the XMLS Twitter about all this stuff, just because I don't know how much good that does, but you know, advertising season

tickets and by this merchandise and do your costume things and we're going to give you thirty percent off, and like, you know, it was one thing for me buying old Sea Dragon stuff when the XFL was going out of business last year and getting a discount and knowing that hey, like like I still have old jerseys like in plastics where. But to be selling this stuff in

earnest now is that you know. Knowing that and I wanted to get into some of the different commendations we heard, but knowing that this stuff might not exist here in the month, that to me is is a little hollow because most of the at least the rumors floating around are at least all or most of the USFL franchises retaining and then a various number of XFL ones that they're going to stick around. Yeah, you know, it was interesting too.

Alan Offerd, who he's got a YouTube channel. He was in Orlando for the for the showcase recently. I heard an interview with him recently where he said after and this was after the showcase, so he didn't really kind of he didn't say, you know, who told him, But he was boots on the ground there and he said what he had heard or kind of you know, the rumor that was floating around there, because he said a lot of the officials pretty much said we can't talk about it, but that the

XFL would lose three teams and the USFL would lose three teams. So maybe they have come to some kind of compromise. It would be a ten team league. You can kind of see where the XFL would come from because Las Vegas, that's that's easy to pitch one of the Houston teams and and then you know, sorry, but maybe Seattle, so it it. And then you could look at and when you look at the XFL, you could probably lose the Generals. I mean, they're not going to find a home.

I just don't think they're going to find a home in the New York, New Jersey area unless you call them maybe the Canton Generals or something. I think they could probably do that with My guess is, and this is speculation that they could do that with Pittsburgh maybe and make make them the Canton whatever Bulldogs would be nice to bring that back and maybe you know, you you

jettison Philly and New Orleans. I don't know, but to me that made the most sense because that way, you've got five USFL, you got five XFL, and you got a ten team league. So uh, it's you know, there's been so much speculation and and from and as you know, you follow a lot of these guys and that they're they're sourced, you're sourced,

they have good reporting, You have good reporting. But it did sound like originally that the us CFL was going, as we talked about before, was just going to absorb the XFL and kind of decide, Okay, we're keeping our eight, we'll decide what to do with the XFL team. So maybe there's a compromise in there somewhere. And so yeah, and just said the kind of the I guess to set the table for the rumors up to this point. And I will just say and not that I think anyone tries

to go out and liars spread misinformation. I do think things change where maybe if you heard something at one point and it does not end up being true, that doesn't necessarily mean that that wasn't true at that point, right, And you know, we even talked with the NFL trade deadlines and well, this person was talking to this team and they have going somewhere else. Like, it doesn't mean that that wasn't you know, it means it's it's a as Stephen A. Smith says like that, you know, it's a fluid

The list is kind of fluid here and going through. But the initial report coming out a couple of weeks ago. Now Neil Stratton with inside the league talking and I do believe in this that there'll be some number of hubs, whether that's you know, I think he originally said it was going to be six. At that point Mike Mitchell had put him in our group to that chat today that he's hearing eight h let me get up to that. He's here at eight hubs with twelve teams, two divisions, so all this stuff

floating around, but the I do believe the hubs. I do believe that there was Then he had the follow up report the next week that was in the eight USFL teams and four XFL teams. Since then, like like you've heard five and five, Mike's saying here twelve teams, that would be six and six. I've had people from the XFL tell me six and six. You know, at the minimum you're not getting eight and eight? How does that make you feel as someone? You know if it's almost kind of like

the Hunger Games, like are you in? Like are you you know? Is your is your district? Like it feels and like I said, it feels disingenuous selling merchants, you know, not that you can halt everything, but it's a really weird time right now. It is. I did buy an Arlingkedin shirt when it was on sale because I thought this might be the last, you know, XFL champion, so I got to get a renegade

shirt. Yeah, and you're right, I think because when these it's been almost a month now since they announced the intention to merge, so we're almost a month later where we're still talking about we still don't know what's going to happen. And I think you're right. I think you make a very good

point. Read that something could have been true or been discussed at one of the in a meeting and it gets out and they're like, Okay, well this is what this is what we've talked about, but not necessarily they haven't signed the contract yet. But yeah, it is. If you're a USFL or an XFL fan and you don't like the other league. I think you're going to be disappointed either way. I mean, that's that's the thing. It's like, you know, for people like me, and I hope I'm

not in the minority. I loved both leagues. I love both leagues. It's it would be it we're not going to have two Houston teams. So we know that we're gonna you know, we're going to lose a team and that's going to be kind of sad. And you know, as we talked about when you we talked about predictions and I did a video and you were

nice enough to, uh send in like three predictions. And you know, one of the one of my predictions, and it's not really a prediction because it's just math, is that they're gonna be fewer opportunities that That, to me, is one of the sad things of it is there are a lot of at least there's more that than there would than zero. But when you start to lose teams and you start to contract and however many it's going to

be, you're gonna lose some opportunities for players. But yeah, you're right, it's kind of funny when you start to see Uh, the advertisements on you know, on Facebook and things for it, Oh twenty percent off. Just put this in and you know there's always the response just wait a few weeks and it'll be half off, or it'll be a clearance sale. So you know that that is kind of the sad thing at Disingenuous. Yeah, I think that's right, because they are they keep saying, we you know,

we're going on business as usual. We saw, uh, you know just recently that the the XFL and signed seven more players and one of them was Seattle, you know, went to the you know, rights to Seattle with a letter intent. It's I don't think we're finding any clues really when we start to see these releases. You know that those rights could be could go if it's one it's gonna be one combined league, so those rights could

go to any team. Well, and I don't think that, you know, in terms of the numbers working out, And I don't think they are going to care if it's a XFL and for USFL or vice versa E, or which which leagues fan base feels they're gonna say, logistically, here what makes the most sense money wise, whether you know, what are the costs to run these. I mean, Seattle was a flyer in twenty twenty.

Yeah, in and of itself, that wasn't going to be there. And I Sam Swartzein told me the story offline about that where it was, you know how, and I think I remembered hearing this, you know, but it was like the house show and they ran an XFL promo and the crowded tendanccy and I was probably at that house show and didn't even realize it, and like the pop that they got, and Vince McMahon was like, derm, you know, we gotta go to Seattle, like so, you know,

but but you know, Luman costs a lot. So I think that will go into it more than well, which league, span base or which city or well, uh, you know, the Birmingham Stallions have more legacy than whatever. I mean, I think they're going to look at it is what does it cost more to run here? And where can we save money and how can we house some of these teams together? Well, and that's you know a lot. Some of the fans are like, well if they if they do hubs, I'm not going to watch. Well, then you're

you might as well just get ready to not watch. And I don't know why that's that's a problem, because if they're doing hubs, it's not because it's because they want to make this a viable thing. So I get that you you might not have liked it, especially if you're an XFL fan. I didn't like watching, you know, games from Birmingham because no one was there unless it was a Stallion's game. But even they lost some attendance, So you know, I get that to a point, but you have to

remember, especially if you're an XFL fan, they had a hub. They had one hub, and then they would fly to the city the night before, and I get, yeah, they had home crowds. I was at the Saint Louis game this past year, the one where they scored it felt like a thousand points, and it was incredible, and the vibe was great before the game, during the game, after the game. That was really

fun. That was as a fan where there were thirty thousand people. You're trying to reach millions of people and hopefully that you'll get more than six hundred thousand viewers and that you will try to make this a viable thing, So

you might have to have hubs. And you might get bigger crowds for other games, but it really feels like and I know we'll get more when we get the announcement read, but it feels like they want to get this going, get these two leagues together, and then hopefully try to sell these franchises later. But you can't sell franchises if your league doesn't have value in your

hemorrhaging money. So yeah, do the hubs for a year or two and then start to find the right owners to bring these teams into the cities. And see, that's obviously where we disagree, right, I mean, I'm vehemently anti hobbit, and to me, it's more than and I understand that.

I thought connor Folk kind of the best tweet when the original report came out with from Neil Stratton and all that saying like, I get hubs, I get why every corporate person in the world like gets likes hubs, and I get why the leagues like it, and I understand all the money behind it, but it just sucks as a fan. That sucks all the life out of it. And to me, you know, to me, you know, you have a lot of own this on the USFL where Okay,

we're in Birmingham, you're one. Okay, we're going to try to go to three to four hubs next year and then we're going to go to you know, we're You always want to see growth, even if it's we're adding one hub, even if they just added Memphis or whatever, like, you want to see growth in that way. And by retracting here and going back, I don't believe you now when you say, well, next, you

know that's the goal at this point. That's where I have a struggle with that, where now you've you've seen what that is and now you know what and maybe you did fly too close to the sun, right, and maybe it was too expensive to do that, but but now it's it's hard to go back, if that makes sense. It's like I've seen, you know, I got to live and I got to stay in the Airbnb Paradise villa over the weekend and I got to go back to my condo and like,

I don't know if I want to you know, I can't share. Yeah, I know what this is now, No, I get it. But you also that that's from a fan perspective, yep, when you start to look at it from a fox perspective, because it sounds like Fox is going to be really the owners of all this. From that perspective, then you got to think, okay, we're we're we're making a TV product. That's

what I thought with the with the USFL versus the XFL. Certainly the XFL, you know, got the boost from being on ESPN and ABC and all that, but they were trying to start a traditional league, whereas the USFL and Fox that felt like a TV show. And they made Birmingham a studio basically that that first year, and so it didn't matter. They weren't None of their finances were built on ticket sales. It was kind of built on

advertising and ratings. So so when now that it sounds like Fox is going to be, you know, they're going to own this thing, you're probably going to get hubs and you And that's from a business perspective, and hopefully we can convert people like you read and say this is this is just this is temporary. We'll try to get these into you know, you're gonna just have to live in a condo for a little bit, but eventually this is going to turn into you know, if all goes well, this will this

will be the you know, the beach vacation in a few years. Yeah, the last metaphor, it feels like. And I went and saw that new Saw movie last night with my brother and this girlfriend and h I'm a big Saw guy. Uh. She was talking about how they had laid off someone at work and they're like, hey, you need to You're going to take over the you know, these duties here for just until we get someone else. And now it's been five months, and oh, well, we

don't need to. That to me is you know, if we if we discover we are viable enough doing the hubs, you know, I to me, there's no incentive to expand on that. And obviously I don't think they were totally happy with the hub is because I don't think they would have as much as the XFL needed to reach out and call the USFL for a hand up. You know, if all was well with the USFL, you're not answering that call either, right, I mean, I'm not. I think

that is that is a very good point. And you know, Darryl Johnston was pretty unhappy with the ratings and even said as much and said, like, you know, we felt like we even had a better presentation, uh than the XFL. So yeah, you're right. It's like, oh, well, if we if we didn't need that's a great point. If we didn't need the XFL, you don't answer the phones like you know what,

you guys can just go out of business. That's fine. So this has to be kind of a this has to be a mutual partnership and mutual conversations happening. Yeah, there's no question. Well it was. I mean we went through all that with the CFL as well, where you know, uh, the XFL. You know, maybe they're just you know, really proactive about stuff, you know what I mean, like you know, hey, you know, let's talk about stuff if you maybe they're more you know,

my wife will talk to anyone at the party. I mean, maybe they're more like my wife, Like, hey, we're just reaching out. We're just not talking networking where maybe you know, I'm like the USFL, you need to call me. I'm sitting here and you let me know what's going on. We don't want this go forever, though, I appreciate your time. Anything else, you want to make sure we touch on any other topics

on your head before we get out. No, I just think you know, we you and I have talked about this and I've said it with some other guests before. It's like we had the golden age of spring football. We had year round football. It was like, you know, it started the Super Bowl ended, and we had the XFL that ended, and we had the USFL and then we went right into the you know, seems like you know, the NFL preseason. But it was fun for one year.

I'm an old guy. I'm trying to stay cautiously optimistic, and I really hope that this partnership works out, and most of all, read for everyone's sake, I hope we hear something pretty soon is that solid, and we can kind of prepare for what's next and we can get on here and pontificate and you know, criticize and be happy about things and all that. But

no, it was it was great joining you. You know, you're one of the reasons that I kind of up to my game here to get to do some YouTube stuff, and you have been generous with your time with me, so I was absolutely glad to be on with you. Well, I appreciate that. No, I mean I you know, as someone that and I noticed she didn't put the CFL on that. You know, we've been

doing CFL sefter in the summer as well. I know, I see, but you didn't mention that, just saying where there's one here, I promise, But you know, as someone there, you go, as someone that you know covers all of this. I think football fatigue is really is really a real thing, right, And I don't know if there's a nonz.

You're a number of people that could even tell you what is the next develop versus what is usblit you case in point, Pat mcaby here rounding back out to the beginning, and so whoever has the upper hand or had the upper hand, or had the leverage, and there's no doubt that both both existing hurt each other, both from a player standpoint, a TV standpoint, even having to pay the players and uh to be comfort you know, hoparable that way where Vince McMahon when the AAF went away, he said, well,

we don't need to pay our guys as much because you know, whatever they're option, they have and that's not a good thing. And that's why I'll always say that, you know the best time that there ever is like in wrestling, is when WCW is facing WWF or now with WWE and AW and I have to do all that. So I hope we don't see complacency that way, but yeah, it does feel like this is the necessity more than merging the powers right now. If that makes sense, Yeah, it does.

And you know, Mike Mitchell, he brought that up as well. You know, I talked to him and he said they were cannibalizing each other. And as far as you know, like you said, players, ratings, fans and you know, and I think the realists of us out here will say, we understand that spring football and alternative pro football. There's a reason they call it alternative or all football is because it's an alternative to the big thing that's the NFL. So you're in a bit of a niche.

When you have niches that are competing against each other, you're gonna you'll have tribes and you're gonna just you're gonna have smaller audiences. So maybe you bring those that you bring both that you bring all that together and you're not going to compete with the NFL, and that's not what they want to do at all, but you're going to have you'll be stronger together. And I think

that's what hopefully we'll see. They won't cannibalize each other's ratings, and if one of the things that we hear is true, hopefully we'll find out these these games will be on network television over the air, because it didn't matter if it was the two worst teams. I mean, there was an Orlando game that I think was on ABC that got huge ratings because it was on ABC. So I think there's opportunities there to put you know, don't don't

have people trying to go out and find these games. It wasn't as bad as the AAF where you had to have apps and everything else to find games, but it was tough for the for XFL, you know, when you're looking for well, I don't know what FS or USFL games. I don't know what FS won, Where is FX here? Where's F It was it

was too much. So if you put these on broadcast networks at a time when broadcasts now works need content, especially with the writers strike that you know, kind of wrapping all that up and the actors strike here, this is a huge opportunity for these two leagues to come together and make something really viable, at least for a year. Yeah, I just hope it is that

my last thought. I just hope that, like you, I think you said at the beginning, that we still retain some sort of this XFL and this to it, because I'm not alone in saying, you know, some of the sterileness of the some of the USFL broadcasts was a little challenging. And even if if even if I didn't agree with that, was Ian Fitzimmons or whatever screaming on the sidelines of cash Man feel like I got I won my over bet, I want my over bet, like it felt like there

was more. So I just, yeah, I hope that there's a mix. I'm not I'm not a homer for like any like you say, necessary brand, more just the mentality of that where, uh, maybe if I don't always agree with the personality of the XFL, I still felt like they had the personality where the USFL, it's it's NFL light, yeah, and

we're you know, and and that it is what it is. Then that's fine, but it does feel like it's a step down of what the NFL is versus this is something that we're trying to make it be its own thing. And it was a Fox product and that's what Fox knew how to do, is do professional football broadcasts. And that's why, you know steril I get that. I get that definition of what you're saying there, because it

felt like they tried to do an NFL broadcast. Now they had, you know, they had the drones and some other things that they you know, some innovations, but it did feel like that they were doing an NFL broadcast. And when you see those kinds of things in empty stadiums, you get that sterile feeling. I totally understand where you're coming from. There. It didn't bother me as much. I mean, certainly I would love to have

seen like a big crowd because it was really fun. I was at a Birmingham Stallion's game last year and when the Stallions played, I mean that place was rocking, but the games the next day, I mean I was one of about one hundred people there. So, yeah, you do feel like it's different in person and certainly has to be different for the audience, and maybe some of that will change when if you do have if you do have

to have hubs of the first year, we'll see. Yeah, I think Mike Kids said in our thing that there was a Molars game or something that had like thirty eight tickets distributed or something. I can't remember something somebody that number that way. Well, John Lewis, I appreciate it everyone. Like I said, you do a lot of interesting stuff on your YouTube channel.

And I'm not a big ideas guy, like once I can go run with something, but I always see the videos that you put out, I'm like, that's a really good idea, Like this is really good, just really creative. So because I'm not, I can't do any of that stuff with all, Like once I have something I can drive, you know, I can drive the truck, but I can't put the truck together. So good job with that. Keep up the work and we'll see you, hopefully on

here again soon. We'll get you back anytime. Read thank you for having me on. I appreciate it. Well. Here we are back here,

Darryl Davis fighting the cold. I hope we're doing okay. We'll see you in a couple of weeks. Lots of Saskatchwan Rough Riders stuff here and then obviously the CFL Awards. But what about our boy Jordan Everleague game winning overtime goal against the Red Wings. It was about time he got on the board here. Yeah, he's been a little sluggish getting started. But I'm torn. I've a detroed Red Wings fan, to be honest, so that one

hurt me a little bit loud. I was happy for Jordan, but I was a little sad because but at least the Wings got a point in overtime, so it was fun to watch. And once everyone gets going, I think the I think the Cracking start getting a little bit better too, because you're right, he's been a little sluggish to start with, and they they haven't been scoring the way they did last season, so it was good to see them get going. But unfortunately at the expense of my favorite team.

I didn't rete that you and that Jason Hussey here Red Wings fans, Yeah, I'm always okay, who's cheering for? Okay, we cheering for the leaves, we cheering for whatever. Yeah, and Cracking a slow, slow start. We got seven goals in one game, but otherwise it's been rough.

So we had Jamie and I on the podcast last week, right Green Zone, and he's saying, you know, Riders, they're gonna you know, whether they get the playoffs or not, They're They're not great Dickinson is not long for this world and kind of everything else there, you know, as predicteds here. Monday, right after we got done with our recap, they announced he is not being renewed, but Craig Reynolds is going to be there. And what's going on? You were at the press conference. What

are you reading in all this? Oh? Yeah, it's kind of as Jamie said and we talked about quite a bit on our show. Read that the problems with this football team aren't necessarily talent or organizational. It was bad coaching this year. When you look at the team that beats the Winnipeg Blue Bombers and the BC Lions back to back, they're six and five out earlier in the season, and then for the last two years in a row totally fell apart. They lost their last seven games of each season. That's bad

coaching, playing and simple. You know, if the coach can't motivate a team or get them better, then you have to get rid of the coach. They gave him a second chance, which maybe they shouldn't have done, but the way the salary cap works now, you probably keep them around for one year to finish off his contract. Craig Dickinson is a great guy. We all love Craig Dickinson. But the players took advantage of him. They didn't play for him, they weren't inspired by him, they didn't believe he

could be a head coach. They had to fire the head coach. The fact they made no other changes, I'm fine with that because that is where the controversy, and at least from my reading from the outside, is, is that that was the only change that they made. Yeah, it basically is Jeremo Well, Jeremoday got a new three year contract as a general manager. You have to give him a new contract. If he's going out to find a head coach and you only gave him one year, that's not going

to work if you gave him two years. While the new head coach who's at Worth Assault is going to say, I don't think I want to go somewhere for a two year deal. But if they're going to go get Scott Milanovitch, and I think to me, the conversation begins and ends with Scott

Milanovitch. So the Hamilton Tiger Katz offensive coordinator, if they're going to get him, they'll need to sign him for a three year deal and Jeremy Oday as the general manager will have to have that many years on his contract too, so they had to redo it for him, get him a new deal so he's got job security. To their credit, the writers did it quickly. They made the decision to move on. They didn't keep Craig Dickinson hanging around and saying, oh, I got to get ready for next year.

They've done everything. They're ready to move now. So I think that's a really that's really a feather in their cap. I know, as you say, there are a lot of people mad that Jeremy Oday and Craig Reynolds are still in charge. There's really no reason to get rid of them. And you believe that because it's more of a football issue than it is a talent issue. Yeah, while the talent's not bad, they have a pretty good football team. It was just badly coached. Nobody wanted to be the offensive

coordinator this year. Because Craig Dickinson was on the last year of his contract. They asked a whole bunch of respectable, reputable, reputable offensive coordinators are on the league who would come to the Saskatchewan rough Riders and work for Craig Dickinson when he's the head coach on a one year contract, so they couldn't find anybody in. It showed their offense wasn't very good with Kelly Jeffrey. The disappointing part this year was how bad their defense got under Jason Shivers.

It just totally fell apart. This year went long, and that had a lot to do with veteran cornerback Nick Marshall just somewhere along the line saying that's it. I'm not playing anymore. I'm not going to try. I'm going to give my paycheck and not do anything. But they had a bunch of players like that, So that's coaching. Maybe it's a little bit of personality. You weed out the bad apples, which they did last year. They weeded a lot of bad apples. But I think that team is pretty talented.

They've got great receivers, they got a good running game, They've patched together an offensive line. I'm excited to see what happens to Jake Dolagala. I think they're gonna at quarterback. I think they're gonna eventually dump their veteran who got Trevor Harris? Who got hurt? You know, he's thirty seven, thirty eight years old, getting five hundred thousand a year after coming off a season with five broken parts in his knee. So they're gonna have to

make those changes. But the talent's not bad and jerem Oda put the talent in place. People are arguing with me. They're telling me I'm a show for the Rough Riders. Now I've never been called that in forty years, which is really kind of fun these days. Read. But those are my thoughts on where the football team sits in terms of you know, I watched that last game the Toronto right coming in and look they had a shot there.

Not a lot of people there right for the last game of the season in playoff contention, And you know, I have my own grives about the Calgary stampedersa beating VC and their pants. Maybe get your thoughts on that too, But like state of you know, Jamie said, it's really bad state of kind of the CFL franchise and the Rough Riders right now. Yeah, they have, but you know, twenty four thousand is a bad that's the announced crowd that they had at the last game. Yeah, they've changed it.

They don't have tickets sold, tickets distributed. It's a I don't know tickets. Tickets distributed, I think is a word that they use, so I don't know how many of those are bought. But according to us, according to Jamie ny, that's the smallest regular season crowd they've had in seventeen years. So the fans aren't making a statement. They're staying away. And

that's how they speak around here. They speak with their wallets. It's a community owned team, so they like to tell you we're not buying tickets, we're not buying merchandise. We're mad at the football team. You know, they've stayed away from it because they're angry. But it doesn't last very long. Eventually, if they hire a Scott Milanovitch, that reinspires everybody. They get back on the bandwagon. Every year there are fewer tickets sold. You

know, Winnipeg's a bit of an anomaly. They're going the other direction. They're selling the place out all the time. Saskatchewan, once they start winning again, will sell this place out, no matter how mad. People are. Follow up questions here for the coaching steps. So Craig Dickins said, what's next for him? I mean we saw last year, right and Jason oss right go to the Aluettes And I mean, is he take a year off or what do you see hack next for him? Well, somebody might

hire him, right, He's not beholding to the rough Riders. His contract expires in the off season, so they're not paying them to do anything to not coach. So somebody will knock on his door I'm thinking and say, hey, we could use you as a special teams coach. He's a great special teams coach. He's a great person to have on a team. He's just not capable of being a head coach. He couldn't motivate those guys.

So sometimes there are guys throughout the league. Richie Holland in Winnipeg, defensive coordinator, great assistant coach, didn't have any success as a head coach. The league is littered with guys like that. Right, So I think Craig Dickinson can get another chance. Will he come back here? Is Yes?

I don't think that because it's always funny when you see like you see Mike Benavide's in BC, right, a former head coach is now their special teams coordinator, And you think, well, I guess guys can go back, but you need a little bit of breathing room afterwards. And it's not quite It's not the size of the NFL where guy where the coaching staffs are so big that they can hide guys into his coaching staff. So somebody in the

league will probably want Craig Dickinson to hire to work for them. It probably won't be in Saskatchewan, but I think that he might go somewhere else. He he does like coaching, and he gets along with people, so you wish you the best. Those are guys. You know, there are guys in this league who you don't like, and you cross paths to them. Craig Nickinson somebody, everybody who meets them likes them. So he'll get a job somewhere. I guess. I'm just surprised where you come out and you

say that you know the players basically quit. I thought he was one of the more kind of tempole coaches right now. Yeah, true in that way, but he made a lot of bad coaching decisions, sideline decisions right, and that loses a confidence of a team right, went to gamble, when to go for two points? Things like that. Players are really picky about those things when they see that their coach isn't as tight and focused as they are, or they mess up things like that, they started watching for more

mistakes. And that's what happened to Greg Dickinson over the last couple of years. He was making silly mistakes and none of them ever worked. You know, if you make a bad call and it works out, then you say, oh wow, that's really brave. But if you make a bad call and it doesn't work out, then everybody says, what a stupid decision. And that's what happened to Greg Dickinson. They started losing faith in him as a coach. They did last year when remember Garrett Reno, the defensive tackle

went crazy in that game and the Riders didn't handle that very well. This year, they didn't handle a lot of the sideline decision very well. The players started saying, we don't have faith in him as a head coach. We like the guy, you know, and you can like the guy, but they just didn't play for him. It's funny. It's funny read when

you go watch it. A lot of times, teams will go from a Craig Dickinson type coach who's a wonderful players coach, good guy, and then you usually go to a hard ass, right, you go to a real tough task master and say he's our next coach, and you bounce back and forth because eventually, no matter how good a coach you are, eventually the players tune you out. They had tuned out Craig Dickinson. Are they going to bring in a hard ass? Well, maybe if they find one,

But I think what Scott Milanovitch is the hard ass? Or is the players coach? We're about to find out? I think. So you talk about him, I've seen and I know there's politicking involved in who we like and who we don't like. I don't like I know, I think it's Rod and balls. He were talking about Henry Burris coming in and that scene and that he wants. I don't know any of this stuff, So when does

that sit with you? Well, Henry Burris was a pretty good quarterback here for a very short time, became popular until he left to join the Calgary Stampeders, and he's been bouncing around the NFL a little bit after his career ended. As you know, an up and coming coach has he got the pedigree for it. Not yet. Does he have the friendships for it? Yeah, he has friends in the media. Henry has been one of our

favorite guys forever and ever. So you know, he sends out a tweet or sends out a text, or somebody calls him interested in the job, Henry, Oh, yes, of course I'm interested in the job. So his name gets thrown into the mix. But you know, they can say that there's eight, nine guys or ten guys, however many Jeremy Oday is going to open up with his initial candidacy. I can't see them going much further than the one name I've mentioned I is And do you think that would

be that would be a good fit. Do you think that that writer nation would would be acceptable with that? Would they want? Because I guess to me, Henry Burr seems like the sexier name, if that makes sense, where Henry Burst I'm sorry, Henry burs seems like the sexy your name? Does that? I mean it seems like, yeah, a little bit Twitter, Yeah, Kerry Joseph, you know, former quarterbacks with the Rough Riders. But Milanovich can sell He's he's been a great successful CFL coach and he's

gone down to the NFL to try his hand down there. He's done a really good job wherever he's been. It didn't work Edmonton. He took over twenty twenty and disappeared because of the pandemic season. He didn't even have to coach in Edmonton, so he's bopped around a little bit. But I think

he's the type of coach who has experiences, he's talented. He knows how to develop quarterbacks, which helps them with Jake Dolagala, and I think that that's he's the type of guy who the fan base here would be enthusiastic about in terms of the work that he's done with the Tykats this season. See what do you make of kind of I guess his resume at least recently. Yeah, when he took over for Tommy Condell, that team got a lot better, didn't it. You know, they were playing with Taylor Powell who

became a pretty good quarterback. And I think he has a future in the Canadian Football League. What they've been doing back and forth with their two quarterbacks now though, and putting bow leave by mitchellin back as the starter, I guess they have faith in him as as the veteran. I thought it might blow up in their faces, but they seem to know what's going on. The team is a lot better now. I think Orlando stein a Er, the head coach, is concentrating a lot more on coaching, uh, being

there for his players and relying on Scott Milanovitch to run the offense. Tommy Condell just you know, it happens, guys tune you out. He'd been there a long time and it wasn't working, so you need to find something.

And that's still my complaint with the rough Riders. If Jeremo Day needed something to say, if he wanted to criticize Jeremo Day late in that season this year, when that when the rough Riders were on that seven game losing streak, that's when he should have stepped in and just brought in somebody to hire to run that team for a couple of games, because you could see they weren't responding to Craig Dickinson. Jeremo Day has to hopefully he's learned that,

but he has to step in sometimes and and take charge. In terms of bigger picture here with the player asked coming up, I was very upset kind of about BC and the whole Calgary thing and all that, and you know, even giving them an opportunity and then siscotch and all that stuff. What do you make of that game here coming up? Because I have warning signs both with Calgary and then obviously going into Winnipeg for BC. You're worried about your BC Lions, I am. I'm worried about America CFL team.

Yes. Uh, I think the Lions are okay. I've never been a huge Vernon Adams fan. He's too mercurial up and down. He can, you know, and his his confidence level is so fragile. Sometimes he goes from this I'm in charge, I'm the best leader ever to oh, geez, six interceptions, I'm never going to play again, you know. And

I think that that reflects on the on the Lions. If they get a good game out of him and he's rolling along and he's not trying to get to five thousand yards passing or something and doesn't forget, you know, the basics that he's being taught by Jordan mc simmick, a very good offensive coordinator, then uh, then then they've got a chance. Defense is really well put together. I think that the Lions, there's no way the Lions should

lose to the Stampeters. They did in that game, that regular season game, they're not going to in the playoffs, you see. I don't know. To me, I feel like you needed I don't know, I feel like there's games where you need to be able to have a level of effort, even if it's not this. I don't know. To me, it felt like BC very much resigned, like, well, Winnipeg's gonna win anyway,

We're gonna be second anyway. Well, and I just don't I don't like that mentality here at the end of the season, especially when you're trying to like sell the idea of coming to BC Lions games as well. Well, true enough, but you know what, the buye isn't such a great thing in the CFL. Well look, you know, look it over over the past how decades, and sometimes that by team just is cold. The

team that wins the semi final is usually the hot one. The fact that the BC Lions had a home game already, you know that maybe maybe you can play possible a little bit with the Calgary stam Peters. That's who you're gonna play it as a learning experience and a rallying point, you say, look at like they smoked this last time. We got to play a lot better, and they're going to play a lot better. They're they're the better team. They have the better quarterback, regardless of how even Vernon Adams on

a decent day is better than Jake Mayer. So they're a better football team, and that from the offensive point of view, and much better on the defensive point of view, and talent wise all the way through. So PC's gonna win. You don't have to worry about America's football, America's CFL team taking a stumble. Did Calgary making it to the playoffs? Does that save any jobs that maybe would have been on the line, or any cool any seats or is it still kind of chaos there? What do you make Yeah,

they're probably okay. You make the playoffs again there, and they think they're getting better because you know, they they were a stable team. They didn't make many changes, they didn't have a hurt quarterback. I don't know if he's the answer, if Mayor's the answer, but they've got enough talent to be a decent team. I think this was the first year for Dave Dickinson to be head coach and general manager, and he really struggled with both

jobs. I think he's learned something. He's a very smart guy, so I think he's learned something. He'll probably maybe ask for some more help to look after the personnel side of the team. It probably hurt him as a coach because he's usually one of the better head coaches on the sideline, and you could tell that late in the season when that team really needed to play well and he needed to get a response from his team. He was able

to do that with the Stampeders and that's what Dave dickinson strengths are. So he is he going to be safe in both jobs? Yes, I think so. That's the way they want to go forward. It might last a year or two years, eventually it falls by the wayside, but right now they've saved themselves a bunch of jobs. Yeah. I saw the post game and Jake Mayer and that, you know, this is the best game, this is what we've wanted to be all year, and it's really been rough

for them. I mean, I think Mayer has whatever expectations people had, he certainly is below even even the mid most mid expectation. That's true. You know, you could see why the Callier Stampeders let bullieve by Mitchell go. You have to make a move on those things before everybody else knows you have to make that move. So letting Bullieve by Mitchell go was okay. And Jake Mayer had looked pretty good in his stead when he had to play.

But after you watch Jake Mayor play for a while, you realize he's not really worthy of being bully By Mitchell's replacement yet. Is he getting better? Not very much? Maybe a little bit, but he hasn't been on a real upswing in terms of becoming a better CFL quarterback. I think I'd much rather have Trey Ford on my list, or Taylor Powell than I have or Jake Dolagala than have Jake Mayor. Are you surprised I just saw the

tweet come out, Well, actually it was sent to me. But Bryan, Brian Scott, Cameron Duke's maybe getting playing time this weekend, the whole Chad Kelly of it all and playing you know, two and three whatever quarters? And are you surprised at that Toronto's handling this coming down the pike? Well, he got hurt. He was limping a little bit during the Saskatchewan game. So I think you have to be careful with him. He certainly makes them go and if you put him in, he doesn't want to come

out. We saw him earlier this season arguing with Ryan Dinwood, he his head coach, when they were trying to pull him out. He's the heart and soul of that football team, the competitive leader. If they don't play him and they lose, and everybody says, okay, well we're not the same team without Chad Kelly. If they put him in and get him hurt, that's a drastic thing. So I don't think it's a bad idea to rest Chad Kelly. He's really taken over that leadership mantle on that team the

way they want to do it. Hey, they've earned the right. They're a fifteen and two football team. That's amazing to me. I didn't think they were with basically a first year starting quarterback. Yes, they put together a great team around him, an awesome defense and some great receivers and what a running attack they have. It's really impressive. So they've earned that right if they want to rest Chad Kelly, they didn't have to play him for

the last six games. If they wanted to, but you want to get him a little bit of playing time so he's at least sharp for the playoffs. It's interesting because I think and obviously very drastic different situations here, but you know, weird tracking here with the NFL, and you've had the whole brock Purty kind of thing of it all, and like what part of it's a quarterback and what part of it's the team and what part of it's whatever.

And you know, obviously he's kind of had struggled the last couple weeks. Like Chad Kelly has never really had a bad There's been no drop off this season at all. Are you surprised just I mean now looking obviously like you said, and I think, right, record breaking if they win next week or you know, there's all sorts of accolades here, like, are

you just surprised how exceptional he's done. Yes? Yeah, everybody said that he would be the guy because you know, in the offseason the rough Riders were looking for a quarterback and he kept thinking, oh, why don't they go after Chad Kelly? Well, no, the Argonauts think he's their starter after McLeod Bethel Thompson disappeared, So they knew something that everybody else didn't really realize what a great leader he is, and so as he's kept it up.

Yes all the way through. He's not having the world's best statistics and you can argue, should he be the outstanding player in the league. Well, no, he should be the East outstanding player, I think. But I still think i'd vote for Brady Olivera being the outstanding player in the league this year because of what he's done for the Winnipeg Blue Bombers. But Chad Kelly certainly is in the running for that, and it's a bit of a surprise. Yes, he's played pretty well, his stats are pretty good,

but they've won. And what do you base a quarterback on. You know, Rock Party had his flaws. You can watch it with the forty nine ers and you say, oh, he's not really great at this, not really great at that, but he's winning, so that's all that matters. And with with Kelly, same thing. They're not the best statistics in the league, but he's winning. Do you sense an upset for the ty Cats going into Montreal? Yeah? Yeah, I think I think Hamilton's a team

on the f swing. Like we talked about with their quarterbacks. How they're doing it is pretty interesting. I wasn't sure that it would work, but their talent was in place that remember, I think when we talked earlier this season read there were tooths, there were a couple of things that we had talked about, and we said, what are the big surprises of the season. Well, Calgary Edmonton and they're bad play in their small crowds or one

of them. And Hamilton was certainly one of the teams who said, what the heck has happened to the Tiger Cats? It's the same personnel while it's even with a new quarterback, it's it's Orlando Steinauer, who you know that the players seem to follow him along as the head coach. So what happened to Hamilton? Well, they seem to have got their mojo back, and I think that there are more consistent team. I think they'll make fewer mistakes.

You know, around here you keep seeing Cody Fajardo come playoff time, something goes wrong and he'll blame somebody else. Hey, now are you are you final grave? I mean, obviously we have playoffs here. Final grade of the season for Cody here in Montreal's as far has he exceeded or fallen flat. He's better than we thought he was going to be. Right, He's They've done a pretty good job. Obviously, you know that you can

laugh about things. Because they dumped Cody Fajardo in Saskatchewan, they dumped Jason Moss, the offensive coyne, and everybody thought, oh, that's good, that'll make this team better. Obviously that wasn't the issue, right, The head coach was more of the issue. So they got rid of somebody who who's done a pretty good job, Jason Moss. Jason Moss, how he's changed his demeanor and talked about it, what he's learned about how to behave

on the sidelines, because your your players follow your demeanor. As a head coach, he's done a terrific job about that. Uh And and there's been a bond between which we heard that Fajardo and Moss had and it seems to still exist. And what made dump Cody Fajardo last year, That was Craig Dickinson, the head coach, not Jason Moss, the offensive coordinator, deciding on that. So, yes, they've done a pretty good job working together. He's not to me, he's still a bottom third quarterback. He's played

pretty well. He's got you know, he's got some pretty good personnel around him. That defense has played exceptionally well. Adding a Sean Lemon has just been amazing to them, has really sparked him. But I just don't see them as a as a finalist team. I think Howton's a team on the rise, and Montreal is one of those teams that sometimes you get a decent performance, sometimes you get a mediocre performance, and I think you're probably going

to get a mediocre performance out of them in the playoffs. All right, real quick here before we get out. I appreciate all this rapid fire here today, Daryl. This has been good in terms of the I don't want to deep dive all these awards, but I think obviously the CFL whatever the nominees came out today and I'm like in my bed, like, okay, what the heck's going on here? Trying to rethrow all this up. To me, obviously, the most outstanding player surprise Olivera over Kolaros. Is that

your thoughts on that? Are there any other surprises for that one? Yeah? Olivera to me has really been the backbone of that football team. The entire year. You kept wondering how are they going to survive when Andrew Harris disappeared. And I know it's been a couple of years. Oli Ourro just keeps getting better and better. Yes, Klaros was one at two years in a row. His stats this year aren't as good as the stats he had

before. They're still a pretty good team. They've had a couple of dips, but Brady Oi Olivera shows up every single game whenever they need him. He's fast, he's strong, he doesn't seem to make bad plays. That that's who I vote for as the outstanding player, even against Chad Kelly in the East, I think Brady Oliverra wins that bad race. How far out

is did you? Do you think Vernon Adams is at this point from contention on that from winning if he he has those bad games, which is what Kolara's had a couple of games that were only mediocre, and I think that's what hurt him. Could Vernon Adams win it? Yeah, he was. He probably would have gotten some votes this year. He's probably still going to get some votes. But I think if you watch who means the most to their team, well you can say, Vernon Adams, Yes, but they've

also gotten some performances out of Dan at Evan's stepping in on occasion. So uh, as I said, I'm not I'm not the biggest Vernon Adams fan. So I think that he's a bit of a long shot to win the West, you know, because and obviously Brady not not a unanimous decision here, you know, in terms of kind of devoting on that. The other one, the outsandy Canadian. I saw a lot of kerfuffle about Matthew Betts

not being unanimous for BC. We had talked offline, but thoughts on that and in terms of him and any of the other outstanding Canadians, well, the outstanding Canadian once again, Brady Oliver. If you're going to be the outstanding player in the league and you're Canadian, you probably win both both awards, right, That's the way Andrew harrisy that a couple of years ago, I believe. So it's rare for it to happen. Canadians don't win the

Outstanding Player award very often, but I think he will this year. Matthew Betts certainly worthy of consideration. And I know that people are saying, how could he not be the outstanding the unanimous choice in BC of the Outstanding for the outstanding defensive player after all the sacks Matthew Betts had I read was a J. C Abbott I think it was from three Down Nation who said he voted for Gary Peters, the corner who is the best corner in the league

and did not allow a touchdown all season. So he's got a valid point. That's who he did his studying and his research. And you know, the defensive end is also usually more glit' see your position in a cornerback, So Bets' stats are kind of eye opening. But to say you voted for Peters, you know, you can't fault the guy for doing his homework and

believing otherwise. Any other any other standouts here and though obviously a couple of weeks here to go for all this and anything else stand out from the CFL awards not huge ones. No, you know, it's always tough to judge lineman. When I'm voting, I go talk to other defensive linemen around the league who they who they have trouble playing against, the talk to coaches,

so it's always tough to get a real feel for it. And our voting panel expands a little bit now, so it's it's tougher to get a read on how people are voting. Read so usually you know who the team reps are going to because it's a small group. There's four voters in each center and the head coach. But now it starts expanding onto the national stage, so I don't know how they're going with it. It's always part of the fund of the debate, right It's like who goes in the Hall of Fame,

who makes the all start, who are the outstanding players. I love the debate. It's part of the fun of this and agree or disagree with whatever you want, just be talking about. That's great, well, Daryl, I appreciate it working through. You know, like we said, illness here coming on that. We'll see you here in a couple of weeks. Getting all our stuff finalized for our show, location, all that stuff, so it should be fun. But I got our hotel bloked and everything else.

So looking forward to seeing everybody here, coming up here less than a month. It's almost there. It's getting closest. It'll be good to talk to you and I'll see in Hamilton. Have a good trip. Thanks man. All right, take care body, Well, this man has had an

exciting last couple of weeks. Big I saw you know, kick return here, touchdown, everything else. James Ltchard Jr. How are you doing, sir? I'm good. I'm great. I can't be better. Can't complain about anything going on right now. That's good. Allett's are hot ten and seven here. This weekend's kind of weird obviously, and then we got the playoffs. How's this season going for you? How are you feeling me personally?

I'm I'm great, you know, I'm I'm I'm four games in, about to be four games in. I feel like as far as special teams, we're getting our chemistry down from a from from switching to a new returner. So I can't be any better right now. I'm just waiting to get to the playoffs. How does it feel kind of getting that opportunity? I was trying to kind of do them now it's where the CFL website doesn't have accurate stats. It's chilling. I'm like, Okay, when was he sign?

What's going on? So obviously you're moved up here, getting in the kind of a spotlight position here at the end of the year. What's it like getting that opportunity. It's it's it's a blessing, honestly, you know, coming up here, I was just excited to be a part of a team. You know. I wasn't really worried about playing as much as far as being on the active roster. I was just happy to be on the

team. You know, coming out of college, I didn't know where I was going to be, what I was going to do, So as far as being on the team practice roster wise, I was. I was very excited. Uh you know, just staying patiently, stay staying patient and you know, waiting for my time and whenever the time come or whenever it came,

I I did what I was supposed to do. Sorry, I really can't complain what's it take to keep yourself mentally and physically ready for that, because you know, if when you ever know when that opportunity is going to arise, right, a good support system. I think that's that's one of the biggest things. Talking to my family every day, uh, them just telling me to just make sure I'm studying the place because the time's coming, stay working hard. You know, my friends Sheler and Sneed, I'm talking

to him every day. You know, we're all rooky, so we're all all studying the play it at the same time and and figuring out our certain positions. So whenever our time comes, you know, we make the most of it. So being patient was really the biggest thing for me. What's it been. You know, it's been a good season for you guys. I think there was a little bit of uncertainty coming into the year, just

with changes and everything. We've interviewed a lot of the different guys. We've had Cody and everyone else on like what what how do you view kind of the locker room mentality right now? We're We're we're laser focused right now. Our mentality is we're the best. We're the best team in the league, regardless of our record. We're we're hitting our strive, We're getting hot at

the right time. You know, coming into playoffs, you gotta you gotta be playing as as good as you can, and I feel like we're doing that. So I think we're locked in. I think we're having great practices. We've practiced great all year, but we're having I think our best practices at the end of the year when it matters the most. So we're locked in, we're layers of focused and we're ready to go all away. Getting to host that, you know, one of the playoff games. What's it

like playing in Montreal in front of the crowd there. It's amazing, Honestly, the horns, you know, I talk to my dad all the time and then and they're they're blasting the horns every play, regardless of offense, defense is special teams, they're blasting the horns. So I know they're going to show out regardless if we were had a winning we're losing record. They're they're very loyal fans, you know. I'm I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm. I'm so happy to be playing for them because I know I know

what they do. Regardless if it's Sunday out, if it's raining or snowing, I know they'll be out there. So I'm excited to plan for them for sure. This is it. Yeah, we're a famously anti horn podcast, So good I have to agree to this. What did it not? Uh? You know, I read a lot about you you kind of you know, before hopping on here, and you know undersize kind of working through and you know it, it just seems like, uh, you know,

chip on your shoulder. I guess, whatever kind of cliche you want to use, But what is your mentality here coming in like you said, you know, getting to work your way up here, getting to do a position of prominence? How do you what do you kind of internalize about all that?

It's just something I dept with my whole life. You know, I've never had anything given to me, especially at my side, you know, so I gotta work ten times or ten times as harder as the next person, you know, based off of my side alone, regardless of the stats I put up, or or how much I've bench or how fast I am, or wherever the case may be, I always got to work harder because

of my size. So I take that with everything everything in life, whether it's football or work outside of football or anything like that, I gotta I gotta work harder because I know at any given moment, they could find somebody three inches taller than me and take and pick him over me, you know, So I try to I try to put my foot down in the place I'm at and make sure I'm noticed enough so for them to want to keep me. You know. So my whole life, I've been using that same

Italian. It's got me this far, so why not keep using it? We cover all, you know, we do the XFL and USFL some kind of all that we call alternate football leagues here in the CFL. Do you find maybe there's that similar mentality with other guys on the team, like just for whatever reason and the things don't open up and you're not giving those opportunities maybe until you got to come there and work extra hard. Do you think that everyone on the team feels that way or there's a good portion? Uh?

Yeah, I definitely think it's a good portion for sure. All the smaller guys. Definitely me and sneed because we've had the same problems growing up. We've always been undersized. But as far as other people, like a newcomer on the team, he's been on the team for I want to say about a month TD. You know, coming into a new team mid season is hard. You know, you got to learn the whole new system where it's offensive defense. You got to make sure you're you're on time and everything.

You know where to go, you know how to do this whenever the time comes. So I feel like if you're coming onto a team late, you got to have that same mentality where you got to outwork everybody and let let the coaches notice how hard you're gonna work in and that you actually want to be here. I think those those are probably the top two in my opinion. You said you were happy just to be on the team to get the opportunity any like, what was your preconception of the CFL before coming out?

Honestly, I really didn't know too much about it, you know. I was I was telling people my senior year of college, and the Hamilton Tiger Cats coach ended up coming up there and talking to me. He said he enjoyed watching me play the past few years, and they have their eyes. I mean whatnot? He said, I should, I should study a little bit on the CFL. And at the time I brushed it off because growing into growing up in the United States, I'm I'm thinking NFL or nothing,

you know, So I kind of brushed it off. And after the draft, I'm like, Okay, what's next, What's next? And my agent telling me the CFL. I know, my y'all wants you to looking at you and this and that, so I'm like, okay. A week later, I got I got called at like midnight, like, hey, we want you to come. So after that I left literally like eight hours after the phone call. I got a flight too much at all, So

it was it was new to me the whole game itself. Obviously it's still football, but certain rules and tactics throughout the game was definitely definitely crazy to me. All the running around before before the snap was throwing me off from I first got out here, no fair catch, the three downs, the extra player on both sides. You know, it's a bunch of little things like that, and and the like my field goal return, you know, if you don't, if I'm not back there, they get a point.

You know, So every every little thing like that matters, and that's what makes the game exciting. So I really didn't know too much about it. But we're here now. Do you think, you know, because we hear

there's like this learning curve rioting kind of for any position. Do you think coaching staff does a good job kind of get you guys, because a lot of people, I think, you know, it's obviously not their first first thought is going to go play, you know, kick return with every for the Altlettes, right, No, I think they do a great job I knew, like like you said, my side and everybody else is my side.

So I knew at the time when I first got here, if I was gonna make the team, I was gonna have to make it on special teams first and then show them that I could also play receiver, you know. So Coach b he said he found me right before the season started and he said I was a great as special team. So I took that right

on the shoulder as everything else and worked hard on that. And then as the season got, as we got deeper and deeper into the season, I started learning the offense more and more, and they're saying I can make plays on offense as well. So maybe maybe this next teame I might get in the offense a little bit. As far as the as far as the record shows, it really doesn't matter because we already clinched playoffs and home home field for the first round, so you know, they might throw me out there

and see what they can get next year. Well, it's exciting here because, yeah, I know, when you have everything locked up, having these opportunities. Before I let you go here, I thought it was funny that, you know, the one hundred and twenty five yards care and I was reading the quote you found it felt like it was a lot longer. What was it like kind of just having that big because you know, all you need is a couple of these big, standout moments to really get on people

for it. Are right once again, I'm gonna say it again into until I forget about it. But I probably won't ever forget about this memory. But I haven't ran that far since since track in high school, in my opinion, and I used to run the two hundred a little bit, so it felt like a two hundred, you know, running from the left and then going back to the right, and you know, maneuvering my way. Honestly, the return was built to go to the left, and I had

a little wall over there but me making it difficult on myself. I took another turn and made the most of it. But nah, I'm very blessed. You know, my teammates were running with me. Even you could tell I was tired because one of our d linemen was keeping up with me for a little bit. So I'm very blessed, and I'm excited, and I know they were excited for me and throughout that play, so I can't complain about nothing for real, Well, good luck here. I'm reading for the

Alouettes here in the East, so I appreciate it. I appreciate your time today, good luck this weekend and then obviously for the playoffs. I hope you get some good opportunities. Yes, sir, thank you. I appreciate it. Thank you for having me. Huge special thanks to all the guests

coming on today. John Lewis, like I said that, finally coming on, I felt so rude. I never asked John to come on. John's had me on his channel and has quoted me, had me, you know, write things, the predictions for him to read on his channel. So it felt like I I didn't owe John the favor, but certainly felt like I owed John the courtesy. I really appreciate him coming on. And then super appreciate Daryl Davis and like I said, everyone over at the Montreal Alouettes

for setting that up. Always appreciate the help that they help me with, you know, the courtesy they do allowing their players to come on the program. So really appreciate that. That'll do it for me today. Like I said, hopefully a big week here coming up next week. Hopefully the you know the Internet doesn't bowl up here, National String Football League, United Football League, kind of whatever. We end up with hearing lots of different things.

Still more messages here, you know, from Mike Mitchell in the in our group chat kind of as I record this, lots of speculation out there. Should be excited, excited to kind of finally get everything put to bed and we can focus on, you know, what is or what isn't going to be moving into twenty twenty four. So I like to subscribe. We'll see you next time. Thanks,