Why The Fed and Totalitarian Control Will Fail & How To Protect Yourself | Aleks Svetski

important for you to have. Uh, it's maybe one of the most important ones that I would recommend that you listen to. UM. It's what I learned a long time ago, twenty five years ago from Robert Kiyosaki, and he said that, UM, imagine a cup like a glass, and you have the glass and you can put the contents inside the glasses the context and what you put inside is the content. And we don't Eventually we can't put any more continents.

We need more context. We need a bigger cup. And that's exactly what I try to do on this channel. And that's exactly what this interview does. So while it might not be the most tactical information that you want today, it is that important. It's the big picture stuff. It's how you can change your thinking to change your life. Of course, we do get into how to discern truth, how to think through complex things to make them UM simple,

what I try to do all the time. We also talk about UM, where the future is going, what are the different systems that we have, UM, what can we do, what is the hope that we have for the future, And then ultimately asked him at the end to give me his forecast for how this plays out over the next decade. UM. This is a conversation that I really really hope that you'll listen to. UM. It is available on podcast as well. Just go to search Market Disruptors podcast and you can listen to it because it is

pretty long, but it's super important. So let's go ahead and just jump right in. Hey, everyone, welcome to another episode of the Market Disruptors Show. Today, I'm sitting down with Alex Fetzki, and he is the CEO founder of Amber, which is a bitcoin service. But more importantly, he is a very very well UM he's a very well respected thinker writer. He's been writing some amazing pieces that have really caught my attention. I really want to dig into

these and discuss them. With everyone today. Um, he just wrote a new piece the Bitcoin Times. I think it just came out yesterday. I'm gonna link to it down below, and I would advise everyone to go check that out and read his work. So I'll link to it down below. But Alex, welcome to the show. Mark, thank you very much for sending me on men. I really appreciate it. Yeah. So, UM, I'm obviously, like I said, I've been kind of following

the stuff that you've done. I think you kind of caught my eye about a year ago, and UM, you talk a lot about breaking things down to their most basic truths, um, and so they're kind of easy to understand. And then obviously you're kind of painting this future of where we might go and hopefully ways we can prevent that. So that's what I want to kind of talk about today. So for everybody that's listening, that's kind of where we're

gonna cover. But why don't you go ahead and just uh give us a little bit of background on what you're doing and and kind of what you're writing about right now. Cool. So, So I think what you mentioned there about breaking things down to like based truths is you know a lot of people. We've been sort of brainwashed through what I call feat academia too, to sit here and believe that we need a source for everything.

You know that that truth is all relative, morality is relative, and everything is relative, so there's no actual truth, and that you know, we need to do empirical kind of testing for everything. Um you know, you see these academic monkeys who are like you, do you have a source

for that? And it's just it's so ridiculous because there's there's so much in life that like that are that are praxeological truths or that are what what you know is called and philosophy like a priori truths where you don't need proof too to be able to deduce if something makes sense or not. You can you can quickly dismiss something without any evidence if you can find if it's consistent with what's called an a priori truth, which is true whether or not you test it, whether or

not you knew the answer, didn't know the answer. We didn't even know the question beforehand. And like mathematics is like an a priori science, it's you know, one plus one equal to long before we figured it out. Um, So, so that exists you know, and and other a priori truths of things like um, you know, like time moves forward, you know, you can't move back. So something that happens later, you know, is a consequence of something you know that

happened before. So you know, we have directionality. So so's

there's a bunch of things. Another good example would be, you know, more of the same thing is worth more then less of the same thing, so so so you don't have to you know that when we look at ustrain economics and all this sorts of stuff, you know that we can build these accurate theories where we can predict what happens with certain interventions in an economy or in a system, not by having to empirically test it, because it's impossible to empirically test an economy because every

human being is different and every moment in time is different, so you can't actually go back and apply any models to it. So what we do is we use praxeology, which is a which is a non empirical science to say, based on these sets of truths which you know, we can deduce to their to their to their base level. If we do this, if we behave like X or Y or z what direction will that lead us in

or what consequences may that have? And the world seems to have lost this, Like the amount of people that I've asked that a young these days that have gone and studied economics at university and I say, have you did you guys do a module on praxeology And they're like, what's that? Yeah, like the most important, like I think, the most important to sciences on the planet of praxeology and math, and like, you know, people are not taught

any of this crap anymore. So, you know, we're just taught to regurgitate whatever crap is written by another person who's regurgitating someone else's crap. And we've got we're just referencing garbage on top of garbage and top garbage. And we we live in a world now where there is an objective truth anymore. Everything is relative, um, and we just you know, we're swimming in a sea of lives and see a bullshit. So yeah, well it's coming back

to your original quote. There is like I try and break things down to these base truths, um, and we can when we can start from there, we can you know, remain consistent and come up with ideas, concepts, rules, UM, and we can observe how best to to live and to cooperate and to act as human beings. UM. I just think that's missing. Yeah, that that that was great. Now. I know a lot of people might hear that and go, WHOA, that was kind of deep. I'm not exactly sure what

what that means until we're gonna dig into that. But just for everybody listening, I want to really talk about where UM, because we have these problems today where we're headed because of that UM. Talk about this kind of totalitarian UM nightmare that we're kind of starting to have where the Nation States are just having all this power, and then what we can do today to protect ourselves

and then change that. So make sure if you're listening, you're gonna stick around for that because it's gonna get good. But before we do what I want to what I wanna do is just you've just mentioned that people have lost this ability to break that down, and so I also see the same thing where people can't think on their own, and so maybe we could just talk through

how people could actually change that. Obviously not sending people back to UM University, but I think you could give us some basic tips of how people could start to find truth and how they could start thinking. So if we can start with that and give people some ways to think clearly and have some truth, then we can show them where the world is going and how we can solve it. Maybe. So what do you think about that, Like, how can people think more critically and find that truth?

I think one of the the word that comes to mind for me at the moment is responsibility. And I think one of the things we're taught in today's day and age is this this kind of palming off of our responsibility or our personal agency. We kind of give it to someone else to make decisions for us all

the time. It's like, you know, instead of pursuing what you want to learn your you know, you when you're at your most you know, individualist and curious and spongy as a child, you're dumped into basically a sausage machine of a state indoctrination system which is called schooling, and you have all your individually individuality bashed out of you for twelve years um and you're all taught the same

ship as everyone else. And you know, you come out on the other end, and of course you can't think for yourself because you didn't choose at any point in time what you wanted to pursue. There was no natural inclination towards a particular thing. You know. It's it's very rare that, you know, parents are wise or intelligent enough to sort of give the room for their children to sort of move into things that they want to take

responsibility towards pursuing. And you know when, I mean, it's really evident when you look at people like Gilla Musk and all that sort of stuff, you look at their younger years and what their parents were like and how they helped nurture their own individuality. They are the people who are changing the world, not the ones who just

became drones going through school. So like, and to that point real quick, it's also interesting to see that a lot of the people that you mentioned are actual college dropouts. They actually didn't go all the way through college and get droned even more correct correct. So, like, I think individual responsibility is such an important thing. Like I mean, I call Bitcoin the renaissance of responsibility because everything it does, it like it puts the individual back at the locus

of the decision making point. So if we look at the way the world structured today is monetary decisions are made by at you, by someone else, you know, political decisions, war, medical, Who you should hang out like, I mean, particularly twenties, fucking wild. You know, you're not allowed to hang out with anyone. You're not allowed to choose what's healthy for you or not. You're not allowed to train, you know, You're you're told who, how many people you can see,

You're told who you can spend time with. Like it's everything that defines an individual as a human being is being stripped. All of your personal agency with personal responsibilities

taken away from you. And it's it's wild. Because I had to chat with this this girl that I was sort of seeing a little while back, and she was talking about how recently, you know, she's been reading books about how, you know, setting intention and it's a bit woo, you know, like I used to be in this into that whole you know, setting intentions of the universe is going to bring you all this stuff. You know, I

don't buy into a lot of that crap anymore. But she's sort of going on her journey, and I understand

the journey she's got to go through. But what's important about that only is a lot of that woo stuff kind of the the essence of what it teaches where there's some truth is this idea that it brings you back at cause in terms of the decisions you're making in life, and you as the manifesto of your life in some way, shape or form, uh in you know, some way responsible and are in more control of your life.

And I was asking because she said I feel much better since I started thinking this way and doing this, and I inquired, I was like why, It's just like I don't really know, and then I sort of helped her extract the y and the wire is because when you're responsible for yourself, you're truly free, like response like

freedom can only come from responsibility. When you give up your responsibility to someone else and you give your ability to choose, which I believe is your only human right, you diminish your own freedom, You make your your world smaller, you, you close up your circle of influence or your you know, your your comfort zone, and you become less of a human.

So so it destroys you from within. So I think for people to start thinking for themselves, I think they need to take more responsibility across different elements, and just stop listening to what some institution like especially stop listening to fucking the news the experts. As soon as you see hear the word expert, run in the opposite direction, like run for your life or academics or intelligency or

any of that sort of crap. Like find people who live what they talk or live what they preach um, you know, discover what their principles start and then apply those principles, Like look for the same type of principle across different areas and then apply it to your own life. And take responsibility from the decisions, Like that's how we become better human beings, not by giving our decision making powers away to others. Yeah, that's a great point, and

it does really start with that responsibility. And to your point, the program she went through or some of the stuff you were into, and I've been through lots of personal development. I think a lot of us are always trying to be better person, a better person, but they always talk about, hey, uh, you are not a victim right your past. You can't

change your past, but you can change your future. And it all starts with taking responsibility today to make the future, what you want to be versus what the world is telling you is it's not your fault you're overweight, you can't help it. It's not your fault that you're poor. And that's what we really see, especially today with politics, is you can't get ahead because you're a minority, you can't get ahead because you're a woman, you can't get

ahead because of your sexual preference. And so if they can make you that victim mentality, then you need that savior. But really we're not victims. We take responsibility. So I love I love that approach absolutely. Yeah. I think I think the victimization, like I call it, we live in a world of oppression. Olympics, you know, everyone is arguing about who the fok is more impressed. You know, I'm sorry, not impressed, oppressed. So it's like I'm oppressed because I

have brown skin. Well I'm oppressed because i have black skin. Well I'm oppressed because I'm a woman and i have black skin. I'm oppressed because I'm a woman, i have black skin, I'm a single mom. It's like, well, I'm more oppressed than you because I have you know, i'm a woman, i have black skin, I'm a single mom and my kids retarded. It's like we're going to keep like arguing about who which minority is more oppressed until

we get down to like the individual anyway. And it's like, you know that this is what we've been talking about from the beginning. It's like the individual is the core unit and at the end of the day that there is no one like we can't you can't live in a society where you know, one group because they argue more oppressed than others, get some fucking benefit. It's like, get rid of all of that and put the responsibility

in the individual's hands to do something about it. And then you know, you have a bottom up approach to change, as opposed to this decree top down kind of approach, which assume that everyone is a poll victim, is some loser, um, and at the end of the day, some poll group has to pay for you know, the redistribution to everybody else, and you know that group has changed over time. But

it's yeah, it's it's it's sickening, man. So the first step is that people have to take responsibility for themselves, and somehow we need to convince people that they need to do that. UM. And I think. Henry Ford said that thinking is hard work. That's why so few people do it. Do it. And if you understand your body, actually thinking requires a ton of energy, and so your body doesn't even like to think. Your body wants to turn everything into habits, right, so it can go through

these motions without thinking. So it's almost like this human nature is to not think, um because it uses too much energy. So we kind of have to force ourselves to do that. But but it's super important to do.

Now if someone wants to take the responsibility and now they're getting this information and they're seeing experts telling them this thing or that thing, is there some principles that you have that could decipher that that could help them think about that critically, How they could break that down or something? Mm hmm. I think you were going into an example before we started talking about like the different layers of thinking, kind of like on the table is

kind of that what we were talking about. Yeah, okay, so so let's let's do two things here. UM, I'll talk about this concept called the table of truth, but then I'll also talk about this, UM, I'll talk about isolation versus holistic Isolated thinking versus holistic thinking. So what you find when you're pursuing the truth, I guess is you'll you'll find a lot of experts and central planet

type intelligencia, you know, academia, bureaucratic morons. They always think in terms of isolated components and surgically fixing an isolated component without the ramifications. It's got to the whole, right So, uh, you know, a good example of that is um, I mean,

a vaccine is a good example of that. You know, let's let's you know, let's just assume that Corona is real and all that sort of stuff, or that it's a big threat, right, um, by rushing in or actually the lockdowns is probably a better example, by rushing in

and closing down all the businesses. They think that they can solve this problem in isolation, but what they do is they create a thousand other problems because the whole system is holistic, and the more we funk with one part, the more we create these reverberations that spread out throughout the rest of the system for the system to find some sort of equilibrium, because you can't deal with things

in isolation. And then this is one of the Keynsian problems, is they think that, Okay, if we print money here, we're going to somehow solve the problem. But then they create another hundred problems. And it's funny. I learned this lesson viscerally when I was I did start driving when I was five years old, and one of the things I learned was when a car is losing control, So we would be, you know, driving, and then the teacher out of nowhere would grab the steering wheel and just

pull it, so the car would just lose control. And if you wanted to suck yourself up and flip the car over, you would grab the steering wheel and try and get control. If you wanted to live and not flip the car over, you let go and the car finds its own balance. So if you're so, I mean, if anyone's listening to this and they ever losing control in a car, you let go of the steering wheel. You do not touch the break, you do not touch the acceleraty just let go and the car will find

its own natural equilibrium. So it's it's a it's a really interesting um example of any complex system like biology is the same way. It's like you know, we we we think like you know, when we're looking at healing cancer or healing some problem. We go in and we bombard this one problem with drugs or you know, chemo or this or that, and we think we've eradicated it, and then what we find is we've created another ten problems, and we'll go where did those come from? Oh, well,

you know, let's hit this one. Let's hit and then we we make the thing worse. So I always look at when I'm when I'm looking for truth, is is this person talking about dealing with an issue or something like in pure isolation without thinking about the consequences to the whole, or are they approaching it in a holistic manner? So that's one good filter. The other one is this is this table of truth? And this is something I think people can apply to just about anything in life.

Is I I'm going to write about it extensively in a book that I might publish next year or the year after, whenever I get some god down time. But basically, the concept I'm calling the table of truth. And basically the reason I pulled at a table is that you know, there's this four legs of objective truth and then this sort of table of subjective reality. Now it's a working title, to bear with me. But effectively we've got leg Number one is we exist. You know, we live. We're born

in a world of finite material resources. We can't create it out of their end of like this, So we've got finite resources. We also live in a world. So the second leg is time that is fixed and finite. Um. You know that that's you know, we can't print more time, we can't go to get more time. Um. We also live in a world where energy is fixed and finite. We can't create energy out of nothing. Um. You know, the perpetual energy machine doesn't exist, perpetual motion you know,

we we can only transform energy and use it. Um. And then fourth is so there's the fourth objective truth that these are these are truths that cannot be changed. That these are what I would call a priority truth. The fourth one is that time moves directionally forward. We can't move it backwards. Um. And as a result, that means the future is always unknown or uncertain. None of us have a crystal ball. We can't tell the future by the very nature of times directionality. So we've got

these four objective truths. And in the table top of reality, I call is we are all unique individuals, and we all value everything subjectively. You might value black shirts more than I value you know, black shirts. I might value green shirts more, you know, like water, coke, food. This

that we are all fundamentally unique. So when you wrap sort of these four objective truths in in this subjective reality, this these false notions that we get fed like, you know, these utopian ideals of peace on earth, or you know that there will never be arguments, or we can remove conflict, you know, everyone will be happy. We should you know, problems you know are bad, you know we should remove

Like all of these stupidities. You find that they're not consistent with this table of truth because if we're all subjective and we have finite resources, finite time, uncertainty, and finite energy, there is always going to be conflict. There's always gonna be problems, there is always going to be disagreements, there is always going to be friction. That that is life.

But how life manages all of that is by um by two functions, either cooperating and resolving and coming up with a better quality of problems, so sort of moving up, or you know, thieving and taking and creating a tragedy of the commons. And that's sort of the two directions that we can go and and one of them is compatible with life, the other one is incompatible with life. You know. One of them is compatible with the truths of these objective truths and the subjective reality, and one

of them is incompatible. It chooses to ignore those and and that's sort of where we are today, is like we're ignoring these realities. Um, and we're trying to uh, shouldn't listen to experts and politicians and bureaucrats and academics that try and say, look, you know, we, you know, are powerful enough as individuals to eradicate you know, every sickness. And it's like, no, you're fucking not, like you know,

when we're not. It's such a it's such an arrogant standpoint to to try and um yeah, yeah, just to try and dismiss these these realities. So yeah, yeah, I love I love I love that. That's that's thinking of of a system and and really I was just thinking of like our modern medicine that we have today right where they want to just treat that one thing in your body without thinking of your body as a system. And then there are you know, holistic or or functional

medicine doctors who do take that into consideration. But it's like, oh, you're depressed, maybe you have a pros act deficiency. That's probably what your problem is. You have a pros act deficiency, right, instead of like thinking about like what what's your diet, what's your exercise? What are you focusing on what you like? There's all these other things. So that's a good way to think about that. But I and then I guess if I also summed up, what you're saying is that

everything has trade offs, right. And I see this because I mean, between my videos and everything, I five thousand comments a week that I go through, so I really kind of gauge what people are seeing. And that's the one thing that I see is they think everything is like this or that, and they don't understand the trade

offs that are there. Um And so I guess what you're saying is if people can understand that you need to think of things as a system, not an isolation, and then also understand that each decision has a trade off, or at least be better equipped to deal with information

that's coming at them. Absolutely, And I think you just probably nailed the Like a third model for for for deciphering, you know, or calling bullshit over truth, you know, for people is look at what people saying is if they if they're talking me about these panaceas or these utopias or these end states or these you know, ways to fix everything, you know, they're not talking about the reality, which is trade offs and that that is that's how

reality functions. Is Like what are the tradeoffs? Because everything has a tradeoff, like and you know, bitcoin is one example. Is it's trade off is that people need to take responsibility. But I would much rather live in a world where we have responsibility at the edge with the individual than responsibility at the center with some satalitarian that dictates what we should all live like, because one is aligned with

life and one is not. You know, when you look at nature, when you look at life, it makes its decisions at the fringe. It does not have some you know, preordained you know, dude that's sitting in the middle that dictates what the lions are doing, what this is doing, what that's doing is like nature finds its way at the fringe and and that's compatible with life. We seem to be ignorant enough to think that we can do

it from the center and somehow manage it. And I think, you know, the hubris of that is, we're not going to stop life as this broader thing. We're just gonna either do one of two things. We're either gonna get back in line with this flow of life, which is, you know, come back to bringing responsibility to the individual and do all this sort of stuff, or we're going to be the latest evolutionary example of what was incompatible with life and we're going to make ourselves obsolete in

the process. Well, one of those two fucking things is going to happen. But you know, we're not larger than life itself. So if we take that and then we start to transition that back into kind of where we're at in the world today and where we're heading into the world, I would look at that and go, well, you know, we have is ms. We have socialism and communism and fascism and capitalism and all these different things, and people want to argue what the meanings of those

words are and little flavors of the same thing. And so I thought about it, like, there's really only two, right, We really have either a free competitive model or we have like a captured, essentially controlled model. And may we just break those down into those two basics of socialism, socialism, communism, fascism. They're all what you're saying, essentrally planned, controlled and then capitalism whatever you wanna call it. I don't know if

that word works anymore, but it's free market competition. Do you see it kind of broken down into those two levels. And those are two options moving forward. That's it and and and I know it sounds overly simplistic, but it's literally you know, is it? Is it that I generally called that same model I call individualism versus collectivism. It's

one of the two. So we either place the responsibility and individual or we assume there's no individual and we assume that you know, one group can dictate to all the individuals what they should do or you know, and like and it doesn't matter whether it's democracy, socialism, communism, it's all the same ship. Like in democracy. Was seeing that in American OWT like democracy apparently is a you know, the people imposing their will on It's fucking stupid, it's

it's categorically ridiculous. So um, it's actually interesting because when you look at nature as well. Nature actually a species other than insects, which are which are quite different to how humans cooperate. But species actually have two ways of All other species other than humans and insects have two ways of cooperating, either through tyranny or territory. And tyranny is that top down approach. And there's a very very

very very very few species that operate like that. The majority, overwhelming majority of natural species all operate through this territorial biological imperative that that is that is naturally emergent. It's not like there's a brilliant book by Robert Ardri called the It's called the Territorial Imperative. And when I read that book, I had this like epiphany, was like, holy crap, private property and you know, the individual as the focus

of private properties actually biological. It's not some man made cultural construct that the collective US would have you believe. It's actually ingrained in usum. It's something that you know, it's nature's way of creating equilibrium in the world without creating a tragedy of the comments. So every single species has this innate ability to sort of have a territory, have a home um, and that territory is actually defined

by what it can defend. So so at an individual levels, like we all have natural private property rights, and it starts with us, you know, extends to our thinking, extends to our work, and then extends to that which the natural stuff out there that we mix our work with, and you know, then that becomes our private property in our territory basically. And um, it's just one model, like I said, again, it's compatible with natural law. The other

one is not. And and and that's really the fight here is, um is you know, do we make ourselves a revolutionary example or do we you know, moved with that flow and it's a I think we're gonna carry the moment. Yeah, a great illustration. It went around a while. I I posted it and a lot of people posted on online quite a while ago. But but the perfect example is is just a lion, right, So a lion out in the wild. He's free and uh, he's free to do what he wills, but at the same time,

it's not a safe life. And actually, just a two weeks ago, I was talking with a friend who was a c World trainer. Um and now they they do private dog training. But he was saying we I was explained this to him and he said, yeah, he's like the life of a lion is not easy. They're constantly fighting, haven't defend their territory. They go days or whatever however time without eating, Like it's a very rough life to

be a lion. But they're free. Or we can put that lion in a cage and give it one meal a day and all its shots and meds and it can just live there in a cage and it's safe, but it's not free. And so you kind of have those two trade offs. But like we said, nothing is black and white, so really everything is almost like a blend. You know, do you have a little bit more of this, a little bit more of this, I guess, But I

think that's a great illustration kind of show. And then the one problem with that is that you know, once that line lives in captivity, or especially it's born in captivity, they can't just go back to the wild. And so we do have these people who have been used to that, like you said, offsetting offloading all their thinking, living like a cage lion, if you will, right, and like, how do we get those people back into the wild. And so that's gonna be definitely a tough, tough task. I

would imagine, well, it's gonna be tough. I mean every you know, everything has a cost, and maybe the cost of uh, this is gonna sound really harsh, but the cost of having given up your personal agency responsibility for so long is that you no longer have the demand it of yourself. Um. And the cost is you end up becoming a casualty. All this this pendulum of life

that's going to swing back to individual responsibility. Because like there's a guy who, uh, he's a complexity theorist mathematician, Joe Norman if if you if you've heard of him, so so he's brilliant, and he talks about like he's a he's a localist called libertarian localism kind of guy. And and he kind of I remember it was him or somewhere along the lines. I don't know that the idea that the world is going to fragment anyway, because

we've sort of we've centralized that so much. And centralization is the process of giving up individual responsibility, right, so so you kind of move responsibility to the center. Now this because it's incompatible with life and nature is going to fall apart like it's not it's not a matter of Willard. It's gonna crash. It's gonna crumble because it's fragile. The more you centralize power and decision making, the less it's able, the less you're able to adapt at the fringe.

So something is going to crack it now. The only question is is do we do that fragmentation consciously or does it happen unconsciously? And if it happens completely unconsciously, it's going to be fucking messy and violent, and there's a lot of people who during that process are going

to be in a world of hurt. Now, the more time you spend becoming responsible for yourself across different levels and finding communities who you can be symbiotic with and you know, find complementary and this is I guess the proverbial bit coinciderle idea is that you know that the citadel doesn't necessarily have to be a place, but it's a it's a community of people who might be complementary

with each other. Is we are building, you know, this sort of we're bringing the locus of control back into not only ourselves as individuals, but voluntary communities, which is how we are able to abstract responsibility. So it's a yeah, man, it's it's such a it's such a simple It's it's not easy, but it's simple, like all things in life. Yeah, correct, correct? How do you lose weight? Well, I need to get this fitbit and I have to track my macros and I have to do these things, and I have to

wear the right clothes and have to do it. No, it's simple. You just consume less calories than you take it, I mean, than you burn. Right, Like, Um, so I get that. Now, let's let's try to push this into something more um timely and kind of what we're seeing right now and then and then hopefully practical. So right now we're seeing this process you said like the more we centralize, almost like the faster it's going to crash. And right now we're seeing massive centralization at a level

we've never seen before. Um. You talked about that and kind of one of your last pieces that we're losing freedom and we're seeing centralization happen at a rate that

we've never seen before. I would even say that not even at the speed, at the rate of speed we've ever seen before, but also the scale because now it's really global and for the first time, I think, you know, a lot of us have heard about this one world, one world all the time, but to see the entire world locked down in unison under the direction of the w h O was something to be seen in my opinion.

And so we have these NGOs, non government organizations, the w EF, the w h O, the w t O, the u N and i m F and they're all trying to centralize this power. And at the same time, are you seeing that? And and and does it seem like we're on this as you said, this kind of uh, this rate of centralization to kind of have this global, centralized, totalitarian world I mean, is is that where people are trying to take us? I mean what other options do

they have? I mean that they don't they don't have like that they can let people, they can let people make their own decisions. Yeah. Well, unfortunately in their model of the world, like for you to think that for an individual to believe that the world government is good, they also have to believe that individuals are incapable of deciding for themselves. So it's like yeah, and that's the thing.

So so that their belief system comes from a model of the world which all your peasants dumb and ridiculous and you can't decide for yourself. We know better, so we as a you know, institution that you didn't elect in any way, not not that I believe in voting elections,

but anyway you didn't know. Like thus, but that doesn't matter because we the intelligentia and you know, the the status and whatever, we are like the bureaucrats, we know better and we know what's right for you, and we're going to mandate that at a global level, irrespective of Like, it's funny because it's so contradictory. I did this video while ago talking about how you know, discrimination as a

concept is bashed, but diversity is applauded. But like, you can't have one without the other, like diversity exactly the same thing. Thing. You need to discern, You need to discriminate in order to make a decision. And you know, in the process of discrimination, you create diversity, create differences. And like, so much for the call for diversity, when now you have the same idiots who have been calling for diversity quote unquote now calling for you know, we're

all the same, We're all in this together. Blah, blah blah, which which is the antithesis of diversity, and like I'm all for diversity, but at it's like like I'm talking true diversity, which is like what nature is. Nature is completely diverse. There is everything and anything in nature, and it's like it nature a phause like mono crops or monotony. It's like, you know, look at food, like when they create these mono crops, they die, like well you know that.

I think Brandon Quentin was talking about this last week when I was on a podcast with him, Like the original banana, they created the same species of banana. I think it was the company was dull or whoever it was. And this is sort of where the concept of banana Republic came out. And then one parasite I think it was a fungal parasite wiped out all of the bananas. And and and that's the problem with like homogenizing everything, and this is what but but the benefit of homogenizing everything

is that there's efficiencies to be gained. So if you're a central planner, what more do you want? You don't want diversity, You want a homogeneous easily like you you want a bunch of drones that you can tell what to do really easily, because it's much easier to control that from the center when you have diversity. When you have something that's alive, it's very, very very difficult to control.

So the only way they can validate their existence is to try and enforce conformity across the whole populace, and I just think that's silly. Well, the reason why they need the conformity is because they're trying to push like we should all have like equality of like we should all have be able to have the same opportunity, quality

of opportunities. But they're trying to push for equality of an outcome, and you can't get the outcome because like, even two kids raised by the same parents in the same house, in the same neighborhood, with the same school still end up in different places. And that's because the decisions that they've made are different. If we want everyone to get to the same outcome, then everyone has to make the same decisions, and the only way to get everyone to make the same decisions is to limit them

to where they many choices. Correct. So I would actually even go a step further on this, So I think the quality of the outcome is a complete fucking derangement, Like that's the dumbest thing ever. Um. I actually also think quality of opportunities are false WITHOOD two. I don't think that's possible because that would assume that remember that table of truth that I discussed, is that would assume that all materials and distributed equally, that all uh time

and energy um is available to to everyone. So it's like, but but not necessarily right because we're we're all we all have twenty four hours, and we all have the chance to go get those even though the resources are limited. If we all have a chance to go get resources,

like that's an equal opportunity to go get them. Maybe, yeah, it's it's it's it's a tough one because the problem is because life is dynamic, like unless we had some you know, great reset event, like a zeroing of everything, right and I don't not trying to use their stupid term here, the great reset, but I mean like unless we sort of brought everyone back to zero and we all started again, we just can't fundamentally get to an

equality of opportunities. So I just think that what we can move towards is not even um equality in any sense. But like a a system that is incorruptible and fair. And this is this is really where I find bitcoin, that the one thing that is our life raft is I honestly think bitcoin is the one thing that cannot be corrupted, that cannot be changed, that is beyond the

reach of anybody. And as a result, we're not even like I mean, we don't even have the equality of opportunity bitcoin like and have access to it and all this sort of stuff, like in some countries in the Balkans that there is completely like blanket bands on this stuff. You can't get your hands on it unless you know, you've I don't know, meant someone individually that can do it. So so we're not even going to have the quality of opportunity. But um maybe on a long enough time

scale that may change. But even then, like material resources um uh spread unevenly that the parents were born to a different um you know, the place we're born to his different you know, the values we grow up in a different the cult like diversity by its nature means that we're not going to even have the quality of opportunity. So like like Jordan Peterson talks about this where he's like, look, you can't change your past. It's like playing a game

of poker. You play the hand that you're dealt, right, so you you got dealt a better hand than I did. But I still have the same opportunity to play my hand as best as I can, just like you have the opportunity play your hands. So I can still bluff you, and I can still this and whatever, even though my hand sucks, and it is what it is, but my opportunity to play that hand, so I don't know. Uh, it's so I call this less um the equality opportunity. I actually call it the what I believe is the

only human right we have. It is it's the right to choose, so long as that remains um, you know, the at the core of like, so you know equality and two things is we all should have the equal right to choose, a simple as that, you know. And number two is equality in the way that probability or luck imposes its will on us. All right, So you know, luck is something you can't take out of the equation because luck is you know, this sort of I call it the force of randomness in the universe, like it

exists and we can't remove that. And as long as it applies to everyone, and this is the problem with centralization. What they do is when when forces are able to centralize power or concentrated, they actually they change how the probability your randomness associates to their decisions. So, like the perfect example was the GFC in two thou ship blew up. But then they socialize the losses, so they pushed the consequence of you know, the you know, the probability of

blowing up. They pushed the consequences out to the fringe. Um, you know, and they got the benefit of it. So they it was it was a game of heads. They win, tells we lose and that kind of um ah. I guess unequal distribution of the application probability creates both inequality of opportunity and inequality of outcome. It fucking distorts everything. But I think fundamentally inequality equality of opportunities just a difficult one because again opportunities is a bit broader than

just having the right to choose. So I think it's equality and the right to choose and equality and probability. Um And I think those two ingredients are really where we're that's the only things we're really equal in. Everything else is diverse, it's uneven, and that's a good that's a good point. I mean equal equal, equal chance to choose. So freedom, right, right, it down from being so um, if we're free, then we all have the freedom to choose.

And I guess and and and the more essentially planned, the less free you are to choose. And at the same time, the less equal it is, because now they're picking and choosing their own winners. Yeah. So um, so the world that we're moving into, as you, as you made the point in your most recent article, right, we've lost more freedom at the fastest rate we've ever seen in history. Like I said, I already said, we've we've

seen power centralized more than we've ever seen. And so before we started recording, we talked about how like almost every like futuristic movie has always shown this kind of

totalitary nightmare and and that's obviously where we're headed. But then you just mentioned that, you know, we have this life raft and so I've gone on I just went on on someone else to show this week, and I went on this rant and I said, it's the only thing to give me hope, because I think it's the only thing that can break this I see that we're going into this centralized controlled nightmare and the only way to break that is through is through competition, and bitcoin

is what enables that competition. What do you think about that? How do you see us being able to break that grip of totalitarian control? And where's our life raft? Well again, so so the bitcoin, because it's this, like I called it earlier, this renaissance of responsibility it brings. It gives us instead of trying to change the existing corrup system from within, it gives us that new level playing field where no one is able to Again, this is where

holistic thinking comes in. This is why it's so important to think holistically and why bitcoin is I think in general, a holistic think is is um. Bitcoin itself doesn't give anyone the ability to get an advantage because in getting an advantage for yourself, you actually disadvant ege everyone else.

So that's how the world works at the moment, right, So central planners, bureaucrats in the academies and all that sort of stuff, they give themselves an advantage, but it's at the expense of everyone of the French So bitcoin, you can't do that. There's the there's a fixed supply of money. It's got its rules. If you don't you abide by the rules, you're out, like you know, and it's not you get booted out. It's like you voluntarily

opt yourself out or you voluntarily opt yourself in. So so there's no there's no impulse other than your own personal I guess need for survival, your own personal Darwinian force of you know, of existence that drives you to want to have access or operate on this field of bitcoins. So it does that out here now the existing system because it's debt based, because you know, the vanguard of the existing system, you know, it is not just going to give up the fucking reins. You know, they're going

to try and grip more and more and more. As the as the things sort of slipping out of their hands, they're going to group harder, and the heart of the group the more it slips, they're going to naturally concentrate

and centralize and become more draconian. Now my argument is, in the absence of bitcoin, yes, we do go into a total Terrian type of you know, dystopian, whether that's you know, it looks more like or Well or Huxley, or a blend of the two, like I think, you know, is most likely we're going to look like a brave united I think that's going to happen, But long term that collapses anyway, Um, the the beauty of bitcoin and if we sort of throw some sort of biblical elements

here is you know, as this life raft is, the flood is going to come and in that other totalitarian system, in the absence of bitcoin, we all just fucking drown, like it's really really really bad for everyone, Whereas with the existence of bitcoin, some of us are going to be able to protect that world as this other house

of cuts starts falling down. And you know, I wrote this whole book, the whole article about what was it called Bitcoin of Lockdowns, I think, and I put that model of you come to bitcoin through curiosity or pain. Those of us who are curious now to get in before the pain is really set in. We're gonna come in there. We're going to sort of claim territory on this new promised land, you know, which has its own constitution with, which has its own rules that we all

voluntarily agree on. We're gonna get in there and we're gonna claim some territory now while everyone else is still trying to work around here with this house of cards. But as the house of cards starts to fall over under the gravity of its own stupidity, the pain is going to start to set in and then people are going to come across to the only thing that's still functional. And yeah, it's like everyone is going to come across

to it. It's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when, and um, the only the only question is, yeah, how are you going to come for curiosity or pain? And I think yeah. But Bitcoin to me is again the last thing that gives me hope because without it, you took the the to tailor that the totalitarian central planet do not win on a long enough time scale.

All they do is they keep the can down the road to the next central planners, and one of them is going to drop the hot potato, right, But the question is whose head does a drop on, and it's all of ours. Bitcoin might help us, you know, have a sanctuary for you know, when that thing pulls down. And I think that's really the distinction here. What I was thinking is that, as you said, they have that grip, and why would they want to give that up? And

it's unfortunate. Um. You know, there's just those people in life that want to have control. Right, whether it's your local neighborhood association or your your parent teacher association, or local government or whatever. People just want to control. And so they don't want to give up that control of that power, right, And why would they. We've already talked about that. So at some point, maybe it fails. But even when it fails, a lot of times you kind

of get the same system. Try let's try it again a little bit different. So, in my opinion, the way that I see it is that the only thing that can really break that grip is competition. So if the United States and Australia and China this took you know, this nightmare, um, but another country says, hey, come over here, you can live free, you can no masks, and you can have any business you want and live free, and

then people might go there. And then if enough people start going there, another country is like, wait a minute, you can come here too, And then it's through that competition cycle where countries will realize they can't extract. And the reason why I think that's important is that growing up I had friends whose whose families came from Iran or Afghanistan, and one of my best friends family came from South Africa and they left an oppressive country to

come to America. That was free. But the difference was is that when they came, they couldn't bring their money out of the bank, their goal, their real estate, so they came penniless. They had to start over. And bitcoin is the only thing that changes that. So now we can control our money, we can take our money with us, which I think will speed up the competition, which will and I believe that's the only thing that will break the grip because people will that that that that that

centralized control. It just won't work when people when there's competition for another system, and bitcoin helps that. I don't know, That's what I was thinking. What do you think about that? Look, that's I think that's the it's a very realistic, optimistic beauty. So I'm cautiously optimistic that. Uh. And again I write this in the article, is like I hope that bitcoin helps cushion the fall of the centralized model as best as possible, because what you're discussing there is a cushioning

of this. You know, these these existing centrally planned nation states and attempts for world government and everything they are contrary to to how life functions. You know, life is this competitive thing. You know, life is always competitive by its very nature, and competition is conflict and so so that's going to exist. And the incentives to create places, whether you know, call them citadels or you know, sanctuaries for the free or whatever, that will exist because there's

going to be people with some wealth. And this is why bitcoin is just so powerful is that it doesn't matter if your friend or foe Bitcoin benefits from you, Like, you know, if you as a nation state, like game theoretically decided, man, we need to hold some of this thing because it's appreciating value. Um, you actually inadvertently make it stronger and make yourself as a nation state obsolete. So like it literally takes everything and turns it into this.

I call it the prospering of the commons, like it makes itself stronger. So I think that force is definitely going to help us. And this is why you know bitcoin is the is the arc, right, is it's going to allow us to have and build places of sanctuary because the incentives exist. Sometimes though my more pessimistic side. And the sort of as a function of how deranged I've seen society becoming is I think, man like, so

many people are still asleep. And I guarantee when things get much better for bitcoiners, there's going to be a lot of people out there who are going to point at us and say, you got lucky, give us your money. And you know, we're going to have to really think deeply as bitcoin is, about how to defend what we have. I mean, you know, I know a lot of bitcoiners and I'm one of these is before you get my bitcoin, will burn my private keys, like you are not going

to get them from me, and I don't care. And in doing that, I actually strengthened the rest of my bitcoin friends because I've just decreased the supply of them further. And and that bit of like, you know, this is the one thing that never existed before is a network or a system or a tool where in the cost of attack was so high, but the cost of defense

is so little um and that changes the game. And this this is I guess at the at the very core of the whole sovereign individual thesis is that when you when you change, when you alter the cost of attack um and the cost of defense and you and you make one more expensive and the other cheaper. Is it changes how human beings interact and and I think you know, this is why a bitcoin is hope. It genuinely is the one thing where we can prosper from

collaborative efforts as opposed to efforts of theft. And I don't know, man, It's like in many ways, it ain't gonna be easy. There's gonna be a tough decade. Um. You know, the more bitcoin appreciates and the quicker it does, that, I think the better chance we have of building a larger lifeboat for more people, and then that will cushion

the fall more for more people. But if you know, if the populace stays largely ignorant, and you know, bitcoins emergence takes another two three decades and everyone decides to get back snated and all that sort of ship, this just may take longer. And it just means that, uh, the full of the state is going to be more painful. So so it's gonna happen. The question is how painful is this process? That that's really the only question here. Yeah, to your point about them saying, hey, you got lucky.

We want some of that money. Um. I mean that's not a guess, that's what we're seeing today. Um. You know they're already like, well, we need to raise taxes on the rich, right, and we see that depend on what you consider rich. Um, Now it's four hundred thousand dollars in the United States whatever. You know, we've seen AOC come out and say that, Um, you didn't make a billion, you took a billion, right, So like we already seeing that narrative shift. Um. So so you're right.

I mean we we know that, and we also just know human nature, right, so we know that as well. But I just think like in the Cayman Islands or in St. Barts, for example, like people go there for money, right, so like I can take my wealth with me. I'll be in St. Barts. I'll see you there. Right, maybe that's our citadel. But I guess uh. I'd like to maybe wrap it up by moving into the question of

like what we what you see in the future. Now, I'm not going to ask you to predict the price of bitcoin because I try not even focus on that because it's so much more than that. And actually I was I was actually thinking last night. UM, you know, maybe it sounds cliche. At this point we talked offline. I mean I came in because of the ideology. I came in because it's censorship resistant. I believe it. It

can change the future. Um, and to see something that see the needs so big and the only tool that we have to solve it. But people are talking about lambas like really like with with what the problems we have in the world, and I'm scared. I got kids. I Mean, all I think about is how to navigated for my family. And when I see the problem in the world and the only tool that we have to solve it and people are talking about trading it for our lambo anyway, it flows my mind. That's that's the

world we live in, right. We've all been taught that, you know, consumption is the path to happiness. And and then this is why I love a lot of Jordan Peterson's work is that and I completely concur with him this idea that happiness is not a goal. It's not a noble goal. Happiness is a fucking byproduct like the goal, the pursuit is meaning. And we live in a world

where we're taught that happiness is the thing. So so then you know, we achieve happiness through we achieve sorry, fleeting surface level happiness through you know how many likes we have on Instagram and you know what photos we have in this narcissistic crap and the next bit of chocolate weed, the next bit of fast food we consume, the next bit of you know TV we watch, and all this crap like it's just this surface, pathetic version of life that is all in this pursuit of fleeting

happiness where and that's where the lambos come in. It's like that that same feat high time preference mentality versus the pursuit of meaning is deep. It's low time preference. It's meaningful, and it's hard, um and you know, it takes time. And and that's where I think, you know, people like you and I get along, is that we're on that path. This is this other one which in regards to that, I have a nonprofit I work with and our quote is that happy people help others. And

so back to that, that pursuit of happiness. I would think most people probably have experienced this and would agree that the most happy feeling you might ever have is when you've helped somebody else and help them. They're happy to change their life. Like when you're an adult and you have kids, like all your fun is having watching your kids have fun. Right, And so if I can go solve the need with my neighbor and really help them out, I give them a gift that they really value,

Like that's like the best feeling. So um, anyway, it's not about me buying a lambo. It's about me helping other people. But so, anyway back to this, so I don't want to I'm not gonna ask you to guess where the price of bitcoin is going to be, but how do you see this playing out? Maybe you can give me that kind of a guest. Obviously, we have the w EF, the World Economic Forum. Their goal is by So they have this agenda by own nothing and

you're happy. Um, that's that all. And they've stated it's on their websites, their pictures are there, um right, So the goal is by they've have established this comment. They don't call it communism, but we live in a commune. We own nothing, right, so that's their goal. How do you see this plane out? Do you do you see us? Over what time frame? Does bitcoin changes? Does this fall apart in three to five years and we moved to this competitive model or try to forecast that. For me, who,

I didn't think it's one or the other. I think it's a it's a messy, convoluted version of both. So I think whilst so there's gonna be my gifts is that it's going to be formal polarization. Um so, so there'll be this kind of ripping and stretching of society where people are pointing at what they can inherently feel is a problem, but don't know how to articulate it.

So you'll end up with more socialism. You'll end up with, you know, the continued separation of Main Street Wall Street, which will will look like on the surface that you know, the rich of the problem. Now, what that'll do then is then that'll kind of like point the guns at the rich that people can actually get money off, and that's not you know, the the you know, call it the elite lizards or whatever we want to call them, that will be the business owners in the middle classes.

It will keep eroding the middle class. But I think what that'll then do is that will push those people who are productive towards something like bitcoin, because they're going to that will be that pain driver. They're going to find that there's nothing else, and they're going to come across someone like you or I or someone that they respect, who has got some bit, who gets it, who's been orange told, and they're going to sort of say, hey, look,

come into this. And you know that they're going to come into it with probably a mind frame of, oh, you know this, I thought this was some Ponzi scheme. But as they dig a little bit deeper, it'll it'll, you know, spark their fire aligned with their own values of personal individual responsibility, because that's what it produced as a producer of someone who takes, you know, the creation

of something into their own hands. And there are many of us, but there's not many of us in bitcoining yet, so so so those people slowly but slowly keep coming across. And I think we'll have an opportunity to build cities, citadels, communities, etcetera of people who are more collaborative and productive in nature.

And the way we'll connect ourselves is I think through bitcoin and and this I think will be a very decentralized, grassroots, bottom up movement against the backdrop of a continued conformist drive towards the world government, where people will be more depressed, more dependent, more stupid, more docile, um, you know, more, they will own nothing, they won't be happy, um, and they'll wonder why they're not happy. And as that thing sort of crumbles, um, you know, will will have an

opportunity to to rise. Now, the one thing I'm uncertain of is, you know, the nexus between those things is do those failing states try and come and take our ship, you know, who are the productive constituents of society? Or do they realize you do they make the the game theoretic choice not to come and take our ship, but to collaborate with those of us who have created these pockets, to compete and correct exactly exactly. So that's that's the

only thing. And again that's not a clear answer, because some may compete, some may not. And then what that's going to mean is we're going to need to get strategic with how we um, you know, how we protect ourselves in this and the negotiations and the agreements we have with the old world. So so I think it's going to be it's going to require a lot of courage, strength, prowess, intelligence, it's self sovereignty, you know, the ability to protect It's going to require a lot of that on our part.

So so I'm a big advocate of all of us who are in the bitcoint space to build skills outside of just you know, whether you're just a code or whether you're an economist person like you want to build skills and you want to build networks because it's going to require us to really be intelligent over the coming decade. And my guess is that the decade is going to

be quite tumultuous. But I actually think that by the times around will have definitively one because this clusterfuck of essentially planned the world is going to fall under its own weight. It cannot persist. You can't fight gravity for long. And I think beyond is that's when we'll see the opportunity for bitcoins, who at that stage are going to be so incredibly wealthy. We're going to have an opportunity to rebuild the world in a more fragmented, low galizes manner.

So so that would be my humble attempt at I guess. Yeah, So we have the free society and we have the centrally consult society, and the central model continues to get stronger and stronger and stronger, but maybe simultaneously the free model continues to continue tenues, maybe by we hit the tipping point and then the free model starts to take over. Then kind of I think the centrally planned. On the surface,

it might look like it's getting stronger. I would argue that it's it looks like it's getting bigger, but it's becoming hollowed out. So I actually would argue that it's getting a lot weaker. But it's kind of like an egg, So so it's it's it's becoming completely fucking hollow. There's no belief behind it. There's no faith in it. You know, it's empty, it's it's unhappy, it's depressing, but it comes out like with this bravado of like we're bigger and

better than ever, but in reality there's nothing. There's no substance, whereas we might be smaller, but there's some fucking sub stance. And when that shill is crrecked, the whole thing will full up. Now one more thing, I mean you talked about like the need. Will these other nation states where they come and compete for it, or will they try to take it. And I think maybe in the sovereign invidual they kind of made this case. But basically we can see that throughout history, UM, thing we we all

of a sudden had to shift, right. So for example, Um, at the beginning of time, you had one guy came over and took another guy's goats, and then another village would come and take their goats and their women, and then a kingdom would come and take all their gold and their goats, and then like um, now they would go and take their their oil, right um. And then there was always something to go and get. But today, as you said, the cost to defend has come down. Today,

what are they gonna get? They're gonna get my twelve words, like you said, you would die before they get that, right or whatever. So like, what are they gonna take from me? There's no, I don't have any oil at hot many goats, and don't many gold like good luck. So that as you already made the case lower the defense. But I mean, I think that also shifts things quite a bit. It does that that's the one thing that changes the game more than anything else in the past.

So every single other revolution, like you sort of mentioned with your friend from South Africa is in the process of the revolution happening and the power overturning and all that sort of stuff. The old holders of wealth, you know, good or bad, they lost it all in the process. So like or you know, when you've left one oppressed to jurisdiction for a new you have to leave everything behind. And or there's always been something to rape from pillage.

Now mind you the you know, they may be able to come and you know, wreck the place that we're living in, but but there's very little benefit for them to do that other than trying to impose, you know, we're bigger than you and you must listen to us.

So I don't know. It's like Hong Kong is the one thing that you know, I guess wasn't predicted in in the sovereign individual in the sense that how China actually did come in and you know, put the like they they've got very little to gain from Hong Kong by coming in and doing what they're doing and in fact just gonna hurt themselves in the process. But the funding idiots did it anyway, Like it's baffling to me that the Chinese win and did that with Hong Kong.

So so I think, you know, I call it never underestimate the stupidity of a status. Yeah, like you know, they will, they will. They'll cut their own nose off to spite you, like, despite their face. So it's so it's like it's it's a really I And that's why I think we we can't sort of rest on our laurels and just hope that game theoretically, you know, because because game theoretically speaking, corporation does make more sense for

the failing state. But some of these clowns are really fucking dumb um and you know, we we sort of need to be prepared for that. Yeah, well that's great. Um. With that, we're going to wrap it up. It's been great to have you. I would say that this is um, I think that's the longest interview I've ever done, and and and it's definitely different. I mean, normally it's a lot more centered around kind of money and stuff, but you're such a eight thinker, so it's super fun to

have that conversation with you. UM. I want to make sure that we link everything that you have in the in the show notes below. But one of the best places, I mean, people to go read your stuff on medium and follow on Twitter or what do you? What do you got? Pretty much? So I think, I mean, there's

a different flavor of me between Twitter and Medium. You would know, like so on Twitter, I'm much more abrasive and sort of like if you want to see the more psycho version of Alex on Twitter at Alex Swetzky. And my name is for a l e K s than s v e T s k I. Um, my medium is my more long form, thought out you'll see a much more reserved version of me. Now, my my articles are probably still fiery, but like you, it's it's much more thought out. So that's just Setzki dot medium,

dot com. Um. And then I employ everyone to check out the Bitcoin Times. It's just Bitcoin Times dot news. Don't put the www in front of it. I don't know for some reason that doesn't work. I'm not a tech whiz. But yeah, if you just do Bitcoin Times dot news, you'll get you'll be able to download there's three editions now of the Bitcoin Times, and well everyone sort of read through all of them. Uh yeah, that

that's sort of the best places. And then actually, I'm sorry, I always forget I'm doing this new podcast called the wake Up Podcast, so you know you yeah, you'll you'll find that I'm doing that with like it's it's not

not super consistent. Lately, I've been a bit more consistent, but it's more about long, longer form discussions, so it's like sort of Joe roganesque kind of two to three hour discussions with I always have two guests on and we're kind of discussing ideas in a discussion format, lesson an interview format. So if anyone wants to sort of it's not just bitcoin. It's very broad, so philosophy. I did one on religion, I did one with atheists. We did one called Bitcoin of biology recently, so it's it's

quite the topics are really broad. So if anyone's red pill and that stuff, well, if you enjoyed this this show that, I'm sure you would enjoy that podcast, So um go check that out. So with that, we're gonna go and wrap it up. Thanks so much for joining us today. Thanks a little MANKA really really appreciate a man, all right, h