Hi.
I'm Louise Aerie and this is season six of our New Zealand here a podcast, The Little Things.
And I'm Francisca Vudkin. Good to have you with us. In this podcast, we talk to experts. We find out all the little things that you need to know to improve different areas of your life. We cut through the confusion an overload of information out there to help simplify life. And today possibly we're going to simplify your wardrobe. Possibly, wouldn't that be fabulous? There is a few weekends ago I round you when you were in the midst of
quad a book clean out of your wardrobe. You're quite good at doing a bit of an audit, aren't you.
It Really I am good at doing it, but I don't do it because I need the audit. There's probably something else at play. And at the moment, it's just like we've got a lot of projects on going on in the house. Our on suites are fallen apart by the way that was as we might remember, it was last September that that happened, and what are we in going into winter and it's only just being sorted now. So you know, there are a few things that are making my own living space or you know, not comfortable.
So I was like, what can I do for myself.
It's just a bit of control, get of clash and make things a bit easier.
Just yeah, because in the in the mornings, and it's not that I'm you know, I haven't got time to look through my wardrobe. It's more that it's more that things that inside out on racks. I don't know if that's the habit you have. I cannot believe when I do this order, how many things I put back in the wardrobe inside out.
Oh no, I don't tend to do that, but I yeah, no, it is it because you've worn it and then you just put it, i don't.
Know what.
Into my room and putting them into clothes you're wearing other times and then up again.
No, because it's all under control, and then suddenly it doesn't pretty much, that's how it works, right, So things are under control. I've got all my t shirts and their colors and the and the thing. And then and then after a while that just starts to be like no, no, no, not that one, the one with a different neck, No, no, no, no, you know, and then it all just gets messy and my wardrober is similar. And also we had the change of seasons as well, which I'm not really one of
those people that change the seasons. I just put a jumper under a some address and keep wearing it.
That's what I tend to do. Yeah, there are people who do that. No I do that. Oh you do? Yeah? You rotate things seasonally? Oh gosh, no, no, no, no, I thought you meant just the same clothes but just add layers.
Yeah, no, we both do that.
Yeah.
Yeah, some people rotate their entire wardrobe.
Oh god, I couldn't. I couldn't. I couldn't get my head. And I think that's the thing. I'm just too lazy. It's just too big a job to go through it all and try and trim it down and work a still out, and so I just live in chaos and it's not really serving me.
Well. Well, I just like to say, of the two of us, yes, I have literally nothing under my bed, not one item of anything, not on my side, not on my husband's side. What's your story, Francesca might not quite be the same as that, but that's okay. I pull everything out and vacuum.
Under the irricasionally I think for me also, over the last five years, my body shapes changed a lot. You know, perimenopause hit. Some things change, and I think I also just can't be I can't be asked trying to get my head around actually what fits anymore? What needs to go and what can stay? And you know, there's quite a bit going on.
There is a thing going on. And my hair colors changed in the last decade. Yeah, I'm gone from well, I don't know how long I was gray, but I've gone from blonde to gray, and that does impact things. And I think I think our skin changes tone as well as we age. Is that would that be right? I'm not sure, but yeah, I just think there is a lot going on for us and we don't stop and go. Maybe this just isn't for me anymore.
Maybe we could make them. Let's make this simpler. Let's find out ways to make this one simpler. Today we are joined by personal stylist and style coach Captain Taylor. Caitlyn has twenty years experience in the fashion industry across both high end fashion and chain store. Through her business, Chasing Kate, she helps everyday women work out their personal style, get their confidence back and feel good in the clothes they wear. Caitlin, welcome, So good to have you with us.
Thanks for having me. Guys excited to be Oh.
We're excited to have you. It's going to be a very interesting conversation. I suspect and a bit of fun.
Yeah, you deal with a lot of women through your business. What are the main issues women face when it comes to styling and dressing themselves?
Oh? That could be a whole podcast in itself, couldn't it. The biggest thing I see is people getting a little bit stuck with their style. So they've probably been through some sort of life change, so they've come out the other end and gone, what am I doing? The clothes don't fit like they used to do, The can't find the things in stores that they like anymore, They don't know what suits their body, or they just the complete opposite. They have a wardrobe full of clothes and they don't
know what to do with them because they're overwhelmed. So overwhelm is a word that comes up so much from women at either the spectrum that overwhelmed with choices out there, don't know what to do, or they're overwhelmed but they've got their own wardrobes.
For sure. I'm definitely underwhelmed my wardrobe at the moment. Do you think that it is important for people to have their own personal style or do you think that boxes us in too much?
No, I really do. But your personal style could be so eclectic that you wouldn't be able to put a name on it, but it's still your style. So I think it's it's such a cool way to express who you are without having to walk around with a resume on your head. So it gives you that freedom to be you.
Really. That's interesting because before we did this podcast, I owned it up on some AI thing and it was trying to get me to determine what my personal style was, and it was trying to get me to describe it in three words.
Oh I do do that, Oh you do I do? But that's only one element of it, right, Yeah. So there's your words, there's your colors, there's your body shape, there's your best bits. So there's a whole kind of like your foundations, your staff foundations.
Well that makes sense. That was trying to sum it all up in three words. That's impossible, But I like the idea that you don't kind of feel like you have to be fully defined by just sort of one one style that can be a clctic And did you get to three words? No? Not well no, all I came up with was All I came up with was sneakers, dress and cardigan because I like to keep things really simple.
I like to wear as little as possible, and I just and some pot I just put tights on and a cardio over the top.
You know of a dreas yea, but simple could be one of your words.
Yeah, so it's comfy.
Comfy or make comfy for me is a given? So that doesn't that shouldn't be a word because everyone should be comfy, regardless of w caring.
I think is we're a word back there we go, you got tom to go.
If we will.
Have those we will have those words. Do we all have a bit of style even if we don't know it. If you're sort of thinking, oh, I don't really have any personal soul, maybe we do one hundred percent. You do.
Everybody does. There's also that style that's kind of maybe hiding inside you. So when I get my clients to think about their style, we talk about slightly aspirational. So where do you want to be Where do you want to go? And I had a beautiful client last week. Start of the session was really kind of shy, but you could see she really wanted to go bolder. By the end of the session she was making bolder choices. She just needed permission to do it. So I think
everybody's got style inside them. It's just about how to get it out and how to define it.
Why do we why do we need to ask for permission? Oh?
Who knows? Because we've been told constantly to be smaller and to be quieter and to not stand out. And you know that one person said that one thing that one time about what you're wearing, and it's stuck with you. Yeah. Yeah, it's a lack of confidence, is what it is.
It's even in the short time we've been talking, it's got my head spinning because I'm thinking, yeah, you're right. These are the things we put on the outside of our bodies every single day and greet the world, and we're not maybe greeting it as authentically as we could.
It's the first thing people say. And you hate to set people judge you on appearances, But like I said, you don't walk around with the resume on your head. So what you wear and how you show up is very much that first impression.
And well, I'm not personally judging anyone else, but I'm starting to be quite judgmental live myself here.
Yeah, I think, Well, I think it's about having the confidence to just be who you are, and like for my clients, it's about being able to get up, get dressed, feel like themselves and then get on with their day and actually not then stress about what they're wearing or like does this fit or does this suit me? For the rest of the day. They just I want to give them the confidence to be them.
So where do you start? Where do you start with a client when it comes to defining what their personal style is.
Also, that's staff foundations that we talked about are kind of the key. So that for me creates a framework. So it's not rules, but it's a framework that we can work within, especially if we get overwhelmed. So understanding color, and that's less about you're an autumn mirror winter and more about understanding where you sit on the spectrum of color and then how you can put colors together. So that's a real key piece. Understanding your colors, understanding your
best bits. Dressing well is about dressing to the parts of your body that you've got the most confidence in drawing attention to, rather than dressing to hide. So many women dress, Oh I just need to hide my tummy or I need to hide my arms. What about if we dressed in a way that makes us feel confident about our bodies and that doesn't mean revealing, but it means drawing attention.
Toe.
So we look at color, we look at best bits, and we look at your style personality, which is a couple of words that can kind of help describe where you want to take your style.
Okay, right, so I've been wanting to talk about colors for a long time. You go, Loo, when before we started, you were talking about some cream Tracki's with a big and deeese stripe, I think, And you said they're great on the bottom because cream's not my color on top, you know, And you know this, how do you know?
Yeah? So color is kind of like a spectrum. So there's cool and warm tones, and there's basically dominant and muted tones as well. So it's about color. The colors that lift you up are colors that kind of almost
mimic your coloring. So what often happens with women as we get confused a bit because our hair color might change or our skin tone might change a little bit, and so we get confused that we're put in a box of like you're an autumn and then all of a sudden, your hair might change and you've slid down to kind of a spring when you're talking about seasons. But having that confidence in color, it's just the colors
that make you glow. And then what it means when you walk into a store, you can then eliminate half the shop because you just go, that's not my side.
When you see it. Just before mimicking your coloring, I was just going, I don't know if it's cind of I feel like I'm mimicking tiredness or something like, how do you kind of you know what what color goes with tiredness?
Right?
Okay? Yeah?
As opposed to right. If we feel tired and yucky, our immediate default is to hide in black, and to hide in gray, and to hide in maybe Howard in beige. But if you fake it till you make it, Yeah, put on a color that like imagizes you and it will often make you feel better. So again Colour Psychology, whole nother podcast. But there's so much power in color
alone to change how we feel about ourselves. You know when you put on the right color, because immediately your eyes pop and your skin glows and you feel like ha, Whereas you're not going to put a color on and go I look terrible on this. I can't wait to wear it all day.
Looking at Louise, because Louise has been talking to our produced security and myself about colors and we should be getting our colours done for quite a while, we've been laughing at her and tell her to going about the eighties. If you look at Louise, what colors would you suggesce would suit her?
So my first question to Louise would be what are your three favorite colors to wear?
Wow? Green, yes, blue yes, and probably rid yeah.
And what three colors do you avoid?
Oh, cream, I don't. I like brown, but I probably don't wear it very much. And I do like mustard as well. Yeah, they're probably the main ones. Actually black is really aging me now, yeah, like close to my face is aging me.
And that's quite telling. So like that's the first question I ask clients, rather than diving in and saying to them, these are the colors you can and can't wear. It's like, what do you like to wear? So the fact that you avoid creams and browns generally, I would put you in the cool camp. So we want colors that are clean and clear and crisp, so blue based colors, so your coloring has that clearness to it, which means crisp
colors are going to look better. But if I look at your coloring, so the contrast between your skin, your hair, and your eyes, it's what we would call quite muted. So you have soft coloring. So if you look at me, I have fair skin, but I have dark hair and dark eyes, so my coloring is much more is stronger, more dominant. So I'm also a cool tone, but I sit at the stronger end of coloring, so I can wear strong color. You sit at that kind of more
soft end of coloring, so softer color. The fact that you said no black tick because black is basically the absence of light, so it's a really really strong kind of force. So black will overpower you basically Now as you yeah, as you soften.
Interesting because you do look beautiful. You know, you've got that gorgeous sort of purply light, purply icily Drea you wear that you look gorgeous and things like that. There we go, There we go. Does that sound good that we'd.
Call you a summer Yeah, But what can happen is we can kind of cross that barrier. So for me, that color that muted through the dominant is a sliding scale, and we can shift up and down that scale sometimes.
So for you to be put in that summer camp, so to speak, it means that you're kind of you hit a limit, but there is no limit because you can just slide up and down the scale a little bit, more so by leaning into colors like red that's traditionally a more winter color or a dominant color, but you can still make that work.
So this is going to lead into a question later on about the capture wardrobe that that's my issue with it is that we'll get there later.
How are you inserted in let's talk about best bits. I love the way you. I love it too. It's just like, let's move on to best bits. When somebody tells you what they think their best bits are, do you tend to agree or do you think that a lot of the time we might be missing what our best bits.
I one hundred percent let you choose your best okay, because if you're getting dressed, you need to feel good in those best bets. So what I like when clients go I had to ask my husband or I had to ask my friend, I'm like, yeah, but what do you think are your best bits? So I think that ultimately, I might say to a client, oh, but you look great if your waist was defined, but they don't want to do that. They want to show us your legs power to them, Like, ultimately, yeah, yeah, what you wear
is up to you. So yeah, I'm I'm very much supportive of what my clients would choose as their own best bits.
Oh, I like that.
And I do think that as a probably confronting question for a lot of us, very much so, because we don't reflect on that often enough.
Yeah, and I ask it that way really intentionally. So what I don't ask my clients is what are the bits that they want to hide? Very much, make them focus on the bits they want to highlight. It's much more powerful when you're getting dressed.
If you said that to me off the top of my head, I would go, best bits, wrists and ankles. But that doesn't really give you.
But that's one of mine. It's all that just like just pull your sleeves up.
It's like little. Yeah.
So what I would then encourage you to do is think about some bigger body parts. So that's a great start. It's a great start. How else can we So it's just that, know it is, But it's gentle steps, right and I just got great boobs, yeah right, see, But I pre warm my clients.
They would if I had a decent bra I tell you, don't get me started on the bras.
But I give clients like a warm up. I give them time to think about it. And I'm really I was thinking on that head for give them rather than asking them on the spot.
And I think you'd sits probably are the things that possibly change over a lifetime, right, Yeah?
Is that how we work out what suits us and what doesn't by just trying things on and working out how we feel?
Yeah, one hundred percent. And I think that, like what suits me is such a loaded question because what do we mean when we say what suits me? So for so many people it means what makes me look skinnier, And that's like that's not necessarily what you feel the best in. So it really comes down to what do you feel the most like you in. So again there's there's checks and boxes. Right, there's rules, the treatings, and a daze of this is your body shape, this is
the only neckline to wear. Show me a fashion role and I'll show you how to break it. I feel like, if you feel good in something, I'm doing it today, like as an hour with a bust. I should be wearing a V neck and I've got my shirt buttoned all the way up, and that feels much more like me than if I had it open in and V.
Do you know, I don't think I ever think about I don't think I ever think about it that way. I think I always just look on the in the mirror and make a judgment on what I see.
And how I feel exactly, Whereas I think some people get too clinical and be like, oh, I have to wear this length skirt and this slink shoes or this neckline, and that's almost too restricted.
But I don't think about how it makes me feel. I just think about how it.
Looks interesting, which is which can be both. Right, You're like, if you must if it looks good, you must think I feel good in it.
Maybe she's just still to my I think I'm just accepting it. Really, go okay, that's it's got to get out of the beast and I can do great, then that's fine. I can get away with that or something that's place. Is that all right?
Yeah?
I think just being like this will do for now. Like, if that's all you can do, it's better than like having a pile of clothes ten feet hind in the background of seventeen things that you've tried and nothing's work. So minimal time, minimal energy. If you can get dress and walk out the door and feel okay, great, start exactly.
And that's why Caitlyn's here, Francisca, because we're trying to elevate.
From the we're at the low bath that we're sitting at.
I was thinking about the Black Right, and I was thinking about what you said about women often think they have to duce to look sad. War mean that the key is we get told oh, that's flattering, which is key, which is co right for smaller Yeah yeah, and we get stuck in there, yeah we do.
Yeah.
We're told not to take up space, but we're told not to be bold, be different.
We just get that language from the get go.
Yeah yeah, we just that looks great on yeah. Yeah, yeah, you look like you're really enjoying that outfit.
You know. I don't know how i'd take that, but I feel like it's.
One of those things where my opinion on what you're wearing ultimately doesn't matter. What catches our eye is people that feel really good in or look really good in what they're wearing because they've got confidence in it. It's actually not about what they're actually wearing necessarily. It's not about how big or small they are. It's not about how young or old they are. If they know, they pull it off like they're rocking it.
I love that. I do that too.
I do it in change rooms that we're going to come out. I'll be like, I really like that on you, and they're like, oh, oh thanks. You know, I think it's a really nice little boast of sunshine.
I don't think we do it enough, just a quick compliment to which, you know, Yeah, are we guilty of not having fun with our wardrobe, especially as we age?
Yeah, definitely, I think I get it. Life gets in the way. I mean, I've got three kids, under ten. I've got four seconds in the morning to get dressed, and I think you do just grab what's easy and what's there. But that's where I come back to my style foundations with my clients. So if your whole wardrobe is built on your style foundations, everything should be a little bit fun or everything should work in a way that works for you. So I kind of have an
expression with my clients. If it's not a hair yes, it's a no.
This is almost like Maria kondoing and a joy your wardrobe, isn't it?
Yeah, one hundred percent. You have to like it has to be the best white T shirt that you have found, Like you need to love that white T shirt. It's not if a client is about to go, oh, this will do before they buy something, I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Let's think about this, Like why are we settling? You know,
there's so much choice out there. So I think, if we're really smart about how we build our wardrobe, and that will come back to the capsule wardrobe point later as well, we're really smart about how we build our wardrobe, we should be able to have fun every day, a.
Lot of fun to me would be white T shirts out the wazoo and the and dozens of piece of jeans that I could marry every day.
Yeah, and that in a good few blazes.
And that's your sense of style, right, that's your personal style. I love that.
I mean I probably would get bored, because I do get bored. But you know they changed the white T shirt thing kind of head a mark with me, because that is it's an eternal quist for the perfect white and then you.
Find one, and then six months later you're like, this is what look perfect white tea?
Anymore? Are these certain things though, even though you say that the antony rules are these certain things though that maybe as we do age that we shouldn't be wearing.
Oh no, no, if you love it, wear it. I remember so clearly a conversation once with I was with a fellow stylist and we were talking to another couple and the lady made quite a judging comment about somebody else in the crowd about what they were wearing. And I normally would let it slide, and I actually just said, hey, it's her body, it's her choice, like she she feels good in it, And she was basically implying she was too old to wear what she was wearing, but she feels good in it.
Who are we to judge? So if you feel like you rocket rocket? I take inspiration from an unusual place, the YMCA gym Oh Yeah, which is, you know, one of the uncolest gyms around. And I go to it and I love it. And there is a range of people in there of all ages and all sizes, and I love seeing the confidence that people have yeah with what they wear.
I am as a Queenslander. We talked about this before I'm a Queenslander and I went home for Christmas one year and I came back and I wrote a blog on how to dress like a Queenslander. It is so hot in summer in Queensland. No one cares about their arms. They just want the breeze. Like there's like these women rocking these beautiful, colorful, floaty strappy dresses because it's too hot to wear sleeves, and no one cares. Everyone says, oh,
she looks amazing. I think we're getting our own heads way too much about what we should and shouldn't wear at certain points in our life. And I ultimately, if you love it, wear it.
I like that answer. That's fantastic. We am our producer has an issue with shoes.
And that's pulsively. I hope she doesn't mind me saying this is because she's got quite a big hoof.
That was quite a specific question. I didn't see that. I was like, shoes are a thing, okay, cool.
Well I also have a big hoof. I don't, yeah, me don't. Yeah, a team eleven sometimes, ah, you go it with eleven too? Well, only in runners, But yes, I can attend quite Oh no, it's easy to go up to a tin and.
Nine is pretty standard now. I am a nine, and growing up I had quite a big foot. But heaps of clients have tens and elevens.
Yeah, you used to get them in the sails, and it's sta't now. So we will have a shoe favors shoe for day to day life. And thank god trainers became fashionable at one point because this. But if you need a smarter shoe, what what what should you be looking at?
I a shiny trainer. I'm such a trainers, go to trainers. I don't hate a little heeled boot. I think just that little bit of a heel that's that's wearable to help. It's still wearable, walkable, but just to elevate a little bit. A heeled boot is good. I think it's more in the material of the shoe than it is in the style. So again I think about is it a leather trainer, is it a metallic is it a brogue? Is it a ballet flat? But is it something a little bit fancy?
I don't look at me. I'm in a white Chucks.
I don't worry.
We're all white. A love a white sneaker. But I think, yeah, it's it's for me. It's the metallic is actually the key. Like if I need to dress some it's either a metallic ballet flat or a metallic trainer, or yet a little bit of a healed boot and not black, Like like, choose a shoe that is a little bit different, and it just it elevates it. So my wardrobe is full of colored trainers, and it's full of ankle boots that aren't black. So I've got brown, I've got pink, I've got white, I've got gold.
Huh.
But they just make a little bit more of a difference rather than the actual style of the shoe.
Gotcha, that's right, because then you can elevate an outfit with the with the colored boot.
Correct.
Imagine if you have like black jeans on and a white T shirt and a blazer, and you put a pink boat rather than a black boot, just lifts at that smadge.
Like a right. Let's talk about sorting out and making the most of our wardrobes. Why can we have a wardrobe full of clothes but we feel like we've got nothing to wear because we.
Haven't bought intentionally. We've shopped, We've shopped for that hit of like, oh, pretty shiny, and we haven't actually thought about how it's working in our wardrobe. So we've scott have kind of impulse bought, or we've gone, I need a white T shirt and you've got seventeen in your wardrobe already, and then you look at it and you go, oh, the which white T shirt to wear? So you almost
create the overwhelm. So you over buy the things you're confident in buying, and then you're not thinking about.
That's the other very good point. You over buy the things you're confident about buying and then ignore the risk.
Yeah, and then you get overwhelmed by those Like I said, the seventeen white T shirt. It's which try to pick if you had two, be a really easy choice.
That's really funny about buying, buying things without thinking about how it fits them with the rest of your wardrobe and things I bought. I was in Port Douglass and I couldn't resist what my family calls the fierce to dress, which is this kind of it's like this Moroccan bright, colorful off the shoulders, sort of big, kind of multi layers. It's absolutely good. No, they won't even wear it out of the house, would you were. I were in the
garden occasionally that's a holiday purchase. They were all laugh at me, going, that is something that you bought when you were somewhere else that you thought you would bring back to New Zealand and wear and you are not leaving the house in there and they call it my fierce to dress occasion. I'm going to tune up to a kids graduation in the Fears of Juice just to just with a hat, even just to really you know, annoy them. But there's just a pure example of buying
something that you then hang on. What was I thinking that's not going to fit end?
We have thought about what's missing in our wardrobe? We haven't thought about what we do every day, so where are we going, what are we doing? And what do we need to get dressed for? And I think that's the kind of like the missing piece sometimes as we go, Oh I like that or pretty shiny, I like that skirt, or I like those shoes, but we're not thinking about the context of how they work into our wardrobe and into our life.
So if we stand back now and we look at our wardrobe, how do we assesss it?
First thing we do is we've got our star foundations right, so we understand more about our colors, our best bits, and our star personality. Then we literally we take everything out bit by bit, Like so we're going to ma recondo your wardrobe. Take everything out. I tend to do it in sections with clients. So take out all your tops. You create three piles. Yes, yes, I love it, Yes I wear it. No, No, I haven't worn it in
X amount of years. So that could be and we're pushing it now, but I would still use COVID, Like, you know, we're what five years post COVID. If you haven't worn it in five years, probs needs to go. She's literally hiding behind the microphone. I know, if you haven't worn it since COVID probably needs to go. Maybe, so maybe is I love it, but I don't know how to wear it. She's like, my whole wardrobes go.
You would die if you came to my house.
Yeah, so how much like? But if you open? How do you feel in your open in your ward room in the morning.
I have boxes under my bead of clothes, which those boxes can just go. Well, my daughters are, to be fair, my daughter is taking a lot of clothes, which is awesome. I love that whole recycling thing. Yes, but it's interesting, you know when it comes to those piles there are that do you love it yes? Do you wear it?
No?
But I love it? You know I have a couple of those. I have a hoarding Yeah, I do have a hoarding issue. So I may just one day just need that item.
Maybe, But they need to think about, like, how many times in the last five years have you just needed that item?
Have you even thought about it?
Could I even fit it?
But these are all the things we're thinking about, right, does it fit me? Does it suit my style? Is it my color palette? Does it show off my best bits. So we've got these filters that take some of that emotion away and they actually we're fitting into a more practical kind of filtering process. But the maybe pile is for some of those pieces, so it's like, I'm not really so there's boxes under your beard. That's the maybe pile, the pieces you're not quite ready to let go of yet,
but they're not actually serving you in every day. What you want to be able to do is open up your wardrobe and go, I'm going to grab that top, those pants, that jacket shows go. So everything that's in the main view has to be the stuff that you're wearing every day. So you want to have that clarity rather than the bridesmaid's dress you wore six years ago that's front and center in your wardrobe. We need to
do a rejig. So go through it and if doing your whole wardrobe feels overwhelming in one day, do it in sections. I with clients, we normally just kind of touch and feel. We don't try everything on, but I actually did for myself in sections because it was too much to all on. One is I tried everything on and I was holding onto things, had a beautiful Charlice Cooper dress that had flamingos on it. I love flamingos, had flamingoes on it, blah blah blah, and I used
to look amazing. I put it on, I went, whoa, it does not look good anymore. See you buy. But I'd held onto it. It had passed through six wardrobe bought its because I thought, yep, I love that. But I put it on and went, I'm so ready to let that go.
Now, I think I think sometimes we do that, and particularly maybe you know in a cost of living crisis, we do it because we invested financials.
Oh my gosh, so true. I spent so much money on them. And now, but what you have to ask yourself is what is the what are the other costs associated with keeping it? So the overwhelm, the clutter that whole, like, oh, I can't buy anything else because I bought so much, I spent so much, A guilt out, the guilt, so all those other things are building up. But actually, if you let it go, it means that you've got more clarity. It means you've got more intention with what you're wearing.
It means potentially you've got space to bring in something that works better for you. So again, it's actually kind of taking some of that emotion out of it totally.
It is crazy, isn't it to think I'm going to wear this because I paid a lot of money for it. Doesn't do the colors, doesn't it? The color, doesn't it the best bit doesn't doesn't match my personality. But I paid for it, so I'll wear it. Yeah, and I'm going to feel rubbish in it all day?
Yeah yeah.
Yeah.
So then there's also the question of, like, my weight does fluctuate quite a bit depending on what I'm doing and how much exercise I'm undoing and things, And so I am very guilty of holding onto things that I think, oh, in a couple of months, is a good chance I'll get into that that's worth keeping.
Yeah, how do we how do we we never get that?
How do we actually just face fact that maybe there are some things we might not get back into.
I feel like that's the maybe pile. It's a really good way to use maybe pile. It's also potentially put it somewhere else, so still keep it. But if there's another like you get under the bed, is there another wardrobe it can live in the chances are, And the reality is, I guess if you do go back to that weight, whether it's more or less than you are, now, are you still gonna want to wear it? So weight shouldn't be the only factor. The size on the tag
shouldn't be the only factor. Oh yes, I could defen into that size ten. I'm still gonna wear it. But again, like you said, but you don't love it, but you're just wearing it because it's the smaller size. So size is that Again, that's a whole other conversation. But size is just it's just a starting point, just a number on the tag that tells us about if that's going to fit us or not. So it shouldn't be a
motivating factor for us keeping something. So I think you know your own body, and so if you're fluctuating five kilos either side, you kind of know what fits if it's ten kilos too small or ten kilos too big.
Yeah, that that feels it feels just follow us fair. That's a good tape.
That's a good measure.
Yeah, that's good. That's a nice simple rule that you could. Yeah, be flexible if you like draw flexibility, I love you wist. Yeah, like clothes that have got flexible.
Because our bodies do fluctuate, so you want again, comfortable is a given, So look for clothes when you're making purchases, look for clothes that have got some flexibility infit.
The other thing is when we're doing this, when we're going through this process of working out whether we love it or it's a maybe or it's a go. What always takes me by surprise when if I'm doing a bit of an audit, which I do do occasionally of the wardrobe, is I go, oh, hang on, that looks really good with this, Like if I am trying things on, all of a sudden you realize that within your own
wardrobe you don't need anything new. There's a whole lot of things you hadn't thought about putting together so much. But while you're playing, you kind of go, hey, that's a cool outfit. Oh I really like these together. I like that together, and that all of a sudden you've got a whole new.
That nappy Sam for a while. I did one recently and I just found so many stains on my clothes.
But you were doing you did a massive order it just recently, and you're really good. You say, if there's a Marcomet T shirt or a little hole or something like that, why is it in my drawer? Out holes?
Different but marks. I did try and remediate a few marks and it did work, actually. But it's funny because I always think that that it is like going shopping, like I'm going to find something that I'd forgotten about. And I literally took everything, including the things that were in big containers on the top shelf. And this time I didn't come up with quite so many new combinations or things that I've forgotten about. So I'm a bit bereft.
But you know, it's again the mental load of removing that clutter and removing that constant sort of climbing through things to get to something else that is worth millions to me.
It's sharpening the acts, it's right, So it's putting in the work at the time, So it's putting aside whether it's a Sunday afternoon, whether it's a Friday night like whatever. Whenever it works for you, it's a good chunk of time. But once you do it, it makes every single morning so much.
It was all day, wasn't it. I was texting.
It's my frictions, like when I did the try on I had, I had, I had to sit down, I trod it on my pants. I'm ugger do anymore. Yeah, but I did. I played so in that moment. And I love that you use the word play because that's what it should be. So when you're doing that, take that time to play, because you don't have time to play at six thirty in the morning, when you have to get up and get dressed and get your kids out the door. We forgot we had netball training at
seven thirty this morning. I got out of bed at five past seven, so I had to get dressed pretty quickly, so I had no time to think about it. So if I've had that chance to play. And I even said to my husband, I was like, don't you love it when you like put something on from your wardrobe that you forgot how much you love and then you put it on and he goes, no, I don't get that.
I'm like, I do like it. Just you you look at everything in your wardrobe every day, and particularly if you got a wardrobe like mine, which is full of color and print, you see it every day, so your brain kind of gets a little bit like, oh, I've seen that before, but then when you put it on, like you forget, Oh, I love it, That's why I bought it, Like I really love it. And it almost like you said, you shop your own wardrobe, you get
that joy from the pieces that you've bought. So if we're being really conscious and discerning about what we're bringing into our wardrobe, we're always going to get that little bit of joy and dopamine when we get dressed in our own clothes, rather than searching for it continuously when we're shopping.
So let's talk about we talk about sort of the idea of the captual wardrobe, the basics that that we need and you have, where do we start?
Oh? Okay, so my theory on captual wardrobes is a little bit different. Okay. A capsual wardrobe won't necessarily be a white t shirt, a black pant, a trench, a ballet flat. A capsual wardrobe is about having pieces in your wardrobe that can be worn different ways with different things. So it's all about having versatility. It's all about being
able to mix and match. And your capture wardrobe might look very different from my capsual wardrobe look very different from your capture wardrobe because It's all based on your colors, your best bits, and your style personality. So mixing and matching is the key. So it's been able to wear that top with all the bottoms you own, and it's about being confident even when it comes to bags and shoes.
I have a bag that's the most incredible satrine CHARTRUSI kind of yellow, which is a random color but works with all my colors that I wear, and it's my most worn bag. And I would say that's part of my capsule because it's a color that works with everything. So versatility is key.
Yeah, No, I'm terrible with accessories. That is my Kelly's heel foreshore, especially bags or anyway, that's a whole other story. That's really interesting and quite encouraging because I've always sort of a capsule in the way you described it, the ballet flats, the trench, the genes, the white shit, and I was like, I couldn't quite work out.
It's traditionally what magazines has sort of fold you. You know, you need all these these are the basics, and then put a bit of colorin, you know, as an afterthought. Yeah, I have one item of color.
Yeah, and if that's if classic clean and cheek is your star personality, great, But if eclectic, boho and bold is your star personality, none of that's gonna work.
Oh I can't wait to figure out what? Well, what my words are?
You're listening to the little things in our guest on the podcast today is personal stylist and style coach Kateon and Taylor talking about discovering our own personal style and feeling good and what we wear. We'll be back after the break, walk back. What's dopamine dressing? Oh?
So, dopamine dressing is dressing in a way that makes you feel good, right, as simple as that. It doesn't have to be color and print. But traditionally, I guess that the way that we talk about it and go to come to dopamine dressing is bright colours, white prints. But it's things that give us that little bit of a kick of like, oh this is nice. I like this, and that we get rewarded for doing so. Dopamine is
like a reward hormone. So if we wear something and someone goes you look amazing or I feel amazing, we want to do it again. So it's that kind of constant I really like this, I really like this so it could be like your striped T shirt could be your dopemine dressing because it's your favorite T shirt. Wearing sequins, wearing combat boots, whatever floats your boat is dopemine dressing. So it's wearing things that make you feel good.
I follow mea Friedman on Instagram. I don't know if you do. She's a big fan of the type ofmine teracy. Yeah, and she doesn't give a top.
She doesn't care, and I love that for her. And she takes so much, she cuts so much from like the girls in the office about what she's wearing, but she doesn't care.
She owns it.
That's right. I don't know if you'll find me in long jawts in a blazer though, but it.
Works the Maya exactly.
Okay. So once we have sorted out our clothing, our existing clothes, if you want to add to the wardrobe, what should we be looking to add? I mean, is it as simple as going what don't I have? Or is it going what could I add to make this even better? Or if you're like me, you just see something you like and you fuy it.
So you're allowed to do that. And we'll get to the shopping rules later, but you're allowed to do that if it chicks a couple of boxes. But I think the easiest way to create a shopping list is to, yeah, look at what's missing, and I guess, think about again, where you're going in the day, what are you doing, what kind of outfits do you want to create, and are there elements of that that are missing. We talk about in people's wardrobes. I talk about workhorses and wows.
So your workhorses are your basics, so they're the pieces that kind of do the supporting. Your wows are just what they sound. They're the pieces that are the showstoppers, like the statement pieces. But again, your WOW might be the striped T shirt and your workhorse is the black bottom half. Your WOW might be a sequence blazer, and then your workhorse is the white T shirt and jeans that you wear with it. So it's making sure we've got the balance. Most people's wardrobes I see are out
of balance. We have too many workhorses, not enough wows.
And I've got a theory behind there, and that is because the wows are really hard to find. If you need a dress to go to rewards, if you need a dress to go to a wedding or something like that. It's really hard to find and you can DIY totally.
So I'm also so fan of if you see something that you love, like particularly for those kinds of things, by it and the occasion will present itself. No, I agree that a WOW could be a really cool denim jacket. I've got a denim jacket that's got like a sequin eye on the back, and that, to me is a WOW. So what it means is that everything else I wear
around it supports it rather than tries to. So rather than trying to wear six wows, rather than trying to wear statement pants and a philly blouse and that denim jacket, I'm picking my WOW and my workhorses are supporting it. And so people either have one or the other. They have a wardrobe full of wows or a wardrobe full of workhorses, And often what we're looking for is the
balance of the other one. So wows are the things that like really define your style, and the workhorses might be things like the basic tea and the good gene.
Well, it's quite not to think about as we're going to go through these wardrobes. Just kind of like, okay, one, do I love it? Okay, yes too? Does it hit all the you know, my requirements? And then is it a wow? Is it as quite a lot?
Only there was someone that like did that could help you with that?
It is so much easier. That's a really great way of putting it, though, like work how the workhorses in the wow, because sometimes I'm kind of like, Okay, now what do I put with this? And Okay, now I need you've got the dress. Okay, now I need the wow shoes to go with it, or you need the this or that, But actually it's just just one wow. Frinchise.
Well, I think I'm the reverse. I think I probably wear too much workhorse and not enough wows. And then I put on a well and I get that sense of overwhelm because I haven't I'm not in the habit of doing it. So it might be that like that fac till you make it thing. Yeah, you just put on an exposure therapy, just wear the gold cardigan.
And the place we feel the most overdressed often is our own bedroom because it's the place that we feel like we're the most comfortable. So often when you go you're in your jarmys. It's your safe space. So when you do get dressed in front of your mirror and you're putting something on that feels a little bit elevated, sometimes it's too much. Oh no, no, could possibly, but actually once you walk out the door and into the
real world, you're nailing it. I remember the moment I realized that it was to do with heels, all right, because I'm quite tall, and I remember going to an industry event and putting heels on with my mouth and go oh no, no, that's too much. Yes, and put flats on, walked into the room. Should have worn heels.
Yeah, No, that's happened to me before too. I think I lived in London for a few years and I never felt you doreast up there a bit more. Even to go to work, you wore a two piece seat and I don't work, and I could wear that to my work environment and no one would bad nilid. Or I could wear my traxi pants as well, and probably
no one with bad nyelid. So it's really up to me to say, well, what do I feel like today, and I don't we trax it pants by the way to work, because it would affect how I felt about how seriously I take my work.
Yeah, correct, what will look cool though?
The tracks?
It pants with the soup blazer. Oh you said, could like that would be a cool.
Common Yeah, I'm going to try that.
Yes, so that's your work.
Oh my gosh, this is it all makes sense around yeah, evolution. Okay, So where do people go wrong when they go shopping? What's the most common mistake we make?
Not trying things on?
Okay, not trying things on.
I was saying to you guys before they record. One of the things that I see so much is I'll pull a piece out for a client to try and they will look at me like I've got two heads and I'm not trying that on. That's not going to work it And they put it on. They go, oh my goodness, this is my new favorite thing. So you're not going to grow, you're not going to elevate, you're not going to expand your personal style if you're not
trying new things. So sticking to the same over buying the things we're confident at buying one hundred percent the biggest mistake I see when we go shopping. Also judging a shop by who you think should shop.
There, Oh yeah, that's a good one.
So not going into certain stores or thinking that you have to go into certain stores because of who you think should spoiler alert. No one can see the tag on your garment, and the only reason someone's going to know where it's from is if they own it too, So don't worry about where you're buying stuff. Buy the stuff that's best for you.
I bought a cute little drest from a shop I would never have looked in, and I have worn and worn it and yeah, literally no one's even ask me where it's from, and I haven't seen anyone else wearing it either. Yep.
And pulse buying, oh so, I'm very much. My natural personality is like a massive impulse shopper. But with clients, I'm so strict. If it's not on the list, no, it has to go down the bottom. So you, as part of that wardrobe order process, you create that list, and that could be a running list on your phone, so it could be you know, so every time you go to the shops, you'll if you're in the shops
and you're browsing, refer back to your list. Again. It comes back down to like grocery shopping, if you're going around the grocery shops and you've got a list to make the meals, and then you buy a ram steak, but you've got nothing else to put with the steak. The steaks is going to sit in the fridge and go off because you haven't actually thought about what meal you're working it into. So impulse buys nine times out
of ten. Unless you've got real confidence in your style foundations, Like if you know exactly what you love and exactly what works for you, and you know that everything you buy is going to slot into your wardrobe, I would say, like, just put press pause. I'm not saying don't buy it, just think about it.
It took me years not to resist the impulse to buy on sale, and so but now I've got a bit of a terrible well it's I think it's a very good habit. When I find something I really like but I don't necessarily need, and I'm like, you know, trying to film a car and you know, pay for other bills and things. I take a photo of the label and I wait till it goes on sale, and then when it goes on sale, if it's a good price, and I you know, i've got some cash from my account,
I'll purchase it then. Yeah, but I don't if is a sale on, I don't go shopping in sales. Good girl, So I do not actually go shopping in a sale. It's great it's a sale, but if I don't need something, you don't need to go shopping. But if there's something I've found and it happens to be on sale, and I've already tried it on and I know it's going to work, and you're still thinking about it, and I'm still thinking about it.
So what I get to do with when we shop with my clients is that even within the two hour timeframe that we shop, we put everything on hold. So we might go into one store and everything we like we hold because at the end of two hours they've often forgotten half of the things they've been rid on. So that's a really good tool to use with impulse shopping because it means if you're still thinking about it, then it's probably going to be worth more in your wardrobe down in the long run.
I'm still stuck on making a list. I don't know how I haven't thought of there before.
So what are some of these shopping rules what are the other shopping rules? Okay, so five shopping rules we love as five to five. If it doesn't blow your hair back, if it's not a heck, yes, it's a no. So you have to see something and go, oh, you have to have that.
We caught the shoppinges. You have to have that warm, fuzzy feeling about every single thing active where jim pajamas.
The shoals.
I have to have it so it doesn't blow your hair back. Don't buy it if you can't think of three things that you already own that it will work with, at least think about it. So go and do your research in your own wardrobe. And that's where having done an audit, knowing what's in your wardrobe, it's kind of fresher in your mind and you know what's missing. So if you can't think of three ways to work it
back in your existing wardrobe, it doesn't come home. What your bum looks like in something is not your problem. You can't see it, so don't worry about it. So Chaine rooms are notoriously terrible for their lighting and their mirrors and all those kinds of things. So you need to understand, like how you how you feel in it.
Come out of the change rooms, go into the main store, like have a think about it, and don't stand in front of the mirror and like contort yourself round to check out your own bum like it's you can't see it. Sn't worry about it, it's what it looks like. Kind of overall, if it's not on the list, at least put it on holds. That's talking to that impulse shopping and rule number five, and this will resound with you. Don't use the sale price for the defining factor for purchase.
So don't buy it just because it's on sale. You think that you're saving twenty bucks, but you're actually still wasting fifty.
I know that I love the way we do maths, and I'll come back to ourselves that we're maeah because even when I'm shopping online, say'm looking on the iconic, I'll go to the sale section first.
So that's really interesting.
You wouldn't pay full price for it? Don't buy it?
No, No, that's right. But I'm so conditioned to getting a behaving money because you're raising a family and you're not just on yourself. I agree, Yeah, I like it, although I do I have some great things for themselves.
I don't.
Don't get me wrong. I love I love a bargain, love a bargain. And if it's exactly like you said, if it's something that you've researched and put on the list and you love it and then it's on sale,
amazing like cherry on top. But don't if you wouldn't pay full price for it, if it doesn't take all your other boxes, if it's not on your list, if it doesn't match your style foundations, if you can't think of three things to wear it with, if it doesn't blow your hair back, don't buy it just because it's on sale.
So I noticed that trends went on your rules list. So what do we what do we make of trenes in particular the thing that's coming to my mind because I do have a lot of jeans, but I do not have a pair of these other bubble jeans, and they seem to be getting bigger.
Like a barrel egg. Yeah, I love barrel leggs, not bubble, barrel not bubble yeah, barrel bubble, same thing, the big round Onesah. Okay, so trends for me again, it ultimately comes down to your style personality. So I love a trend if it were on my body shape, if it matches, Like I love a barrel leg. I think because my style is a little bit like quirk is not the right word, but it's a little bit playful. So the shape, like the silhouette of the barrel, I really lean into
because it's really fun. But there's some trends I don't personally love, like the funnel neck jackets, Like that's not a trend that suits my body shape or suits my sense of style. So I think it's really important that with trends, and trends are so fast now because they used to be dictated by the fashion houses and then they were dictated by magazines. Now they're dictated by social media, and they move so quickly that by the time they filter down to the mainstream, the people at the top
are creating a whole new trend. So unless it's something that really really resonates with your own sense of style, then you don't need to do it. Saying that something like a barrel leg is very much like a cool way to update your style. So if you're a jeens girly, then like rocking a new shape can definitely make you feel more current, more modern. But if, again, if your star foundation are about being classic and clean, then maybe it's not your vibe. And that's okay too.
I know for one hundred per cent certain if low slang jeans color, no, no, it's not.
No. Well, I did read somewhere recently that skinny jeans are back. I would. I have a pair of those in my cabin and I pulled them out and I put them on and I zip them up. They had a bit of streach them and I, oh, my gosh, this is amazing, this is fantastic. And I ended up steams to do something and I've bent over and my bum popped out, and I went, oh, I can no, No, that's not gonna work.
I'm the opposite, So skinny jeans never. I never wore jeans when skinny jeans are a thing because I just don't love them on my body. But so when wide legs and barrel legs started to come out, I now own too many jeans because I'm leaning in so hard to the shape. But I love particularly things like denim. Anything goes now, And I think that's almost because the trends moved so far.
Can I just ask where you buy your jeans. I can't buy jeans that suit me. Okay, sorry.
My favorite jeans generally a little cheapiees. So I love a posty Jane. I love a k marte. Jane posts posty jeans.
We're going shopping, Frits.
Good posted is great?
Is it on the list? You just said you've got a million pairs of jeans?
Fad do you list first past for her?
She doesn't have jenes?
Yeah, I do.
My my favorite barrel legs, so are the Levi's baggy daddy barrel eggs. You can't go on with a classic like a Levi. And again, so many different varieties, there so many genes around at the moment, and again it is it is trial and error because there are so many different styles around. But it's just all about the quality of the denim that they're looking for. So the more, the more cotton, the less lastane, the better because you want that rigid denim that's gonna feel secure, hold you
in and not stretch. So remember back in the day, you're like the peak of skinny jeans. We were all wearing jeggings and they you'd wear them twice and the bum would just stag just too much a lastane in them, so we didn't have that structure of the cotton. So yeah, a rigid denim is going to be generally a better fit gene.
And size wise, just in general, but it is relevant to genes. We just ignore the size on the thing and try on.
What you just start somewhere though. My favorite genes are Levi's I'm a different size in the black than I am in the blue. Yeah, it does my hidden Yeah, because the dye that you dye the cotton with will affect the how the cotton performs differently.
But is that sizes in general, because I think we do get it.
It's stuck on sizes.
Yeah, just a starting point, it really is. And there's so much context around size it depends on. There's no standardized sizing. The last standardized sizing in Australia and New Zealand was done in the fifties, so there is no landmark benchmark that says this is the measurement for a size fourteen. So brands are using kind of somewhere where. And again I've got my own brand and I fit it all on me as a twelve. But I'm quite a generous twelve, so my fits are slightly more generous.
So it's the starting point. So pick about where you are and then go up or down depending on how you want things to fit. So again this is not necessarily about it being tighter or making you look smaller. If you want something to be more oversized, go up a size. If you want something to be a little bit more fitted, go down a size. I've got everything in my wardrobe from a size. I have a size four jacket because it was super oversized and I wanted
it nature. And I've got sized sixteen pair of pants and I'm a standard size twelve and inverted commers.
So just the starting point, we're not we're not going to fix and actually, gosh, might be but boring if we knew exactly what we were all the time, And there's.
Not you can't, like women's bodies are so different that you can't just use those three measurements last waist tips to to depict a size. Like, there's so much more nuance to fit.
Finally, just really quickly, that whole question about should we buy, you know, something that's a little bit more expensive and it's gonna last longer, or should we look for sort of cheaper options for things or does it just depend on what the item is.
I think a better both. I think by the best value you can afford. So again, for me, I think a poster who came up Perry Janes is actually great value and they do the job as much as another gene things like shoes I would invest in. So I think it's by the best version of what you think and think about where you see value. So is it something that you're going to wear over and over and over again and get cost per wear out of it
and something that's going to last? I think yeah, I think it's definitely a bit of a bit of both. Like you can have a mix. I think the best wadrods have a mix of cheap and cheerful and investment pieces. Just because it was more expensive doesn't necessarily mean it's better. So I think, you know, use use your your sense of where you see value, I think is important.
That's good advice.
So good, So such a good chat. Thank you so much for coming in, Caitlin. That's been got a lot to think about. I love the fact though, that near the end of that whole conversation you mentioned jeans and lose immediately like, right, let's go shopping, and it's like, honey, I have that effect on people. Yes, I mean for her.
You really want to pair of jeans, do you?
Yeah?
Yeah, I could go back to it. I used to wear jeans a lot. It's just more about exactly what you say, feeling good in them, and finding a pair that makes me feel good and fits well and is comfortable. Because I've got a little bit of to comfort.
I think that that could be slight COVID hangover as well. But yeah, very much so, time to bust it out.
Kitin.
Thank you so much.
Such a pleasure, guys, Thanks for having me so enjoyed it.
Okay, I am so inspired to sort out my hoarding issue, are you though, friendship? To be fair, I have been doing that. I have been looking at because I'm actually a really big believer in selling clothes, second hand clothes. I buy second hand clothes. I don't hate things going to waste. If you've got something perfectly good that someone else might love, get it out there. I don't really care what I get for it. But I am trying
very hard to recycle a whole lot of clothes. So I did start at the beginning of this year, and I have got rid of quite a few pieces.
Now yours is not just a one day and it's done.
No, not a little bit, but it is a lifetime of hoarding.
Oh yeah, and I still look to you know, being completely honest, I still have three bags sitting down, one man and flatmates can have fun with. One is definitely going to charity, and one I could probably just get enough money out of that bag for one new item.
Can possibly do it.
So even though I have done the audit, I haven't done the follow up. I love the shopping well framework not you know, Caitlan sort of said to us afterwards, don't think of it as rules, because you know, rules can be broken. But the framework around shopping I thought was excellent. I think also it actually well bring the fun back into it. If you've got a list, you can do without the guilt or the feeling of oh
I shouldn't have purchased that. I mean, some people are great at ordering stuff online and then sending it back. I know I wouldn't do it, would order and I would just leave it there. I love the workhorse. Wows Oh that was thinking about that. That was brilliant that's quite cool. I did say to a women to finish, you know, you've actually does the way you described. It's almost like a sign. Yeah, she see what it kind
of is. Yeah, which is why we should you know, she is an expert we should take We're really really grateful that she would come in and share that information with us.
But the other thing that I'm going to take away from this is as well, is I'm not going to decide on an outfit because I think it makes the way it makes me look as in my size? Does this make me look slim? Does this kevinber Pott tummy? Does this do this? I'm going to think about it, like, how do do I like this outfit? I love this outfit? This outfit makes me feel good. I'm leaving in this outfit. I'm going to try to change the way I think
around lot. I think maybe harder than it sounds, but it comes back to.
That same thing of what are you doing it for you? Francisca? Are you doing it for somebody else? Like at different times of our lives, we might we might address differently, I don't know, scientifically, tracing a mate or whatever. Who am I dressing for now? I'm fifty four, I'm dressing for me and so hopefully somebody would have got something out of that too. I know a lot of stylish women who probably you know, would say I already know that.
But there's plenty of us out there sort of not making lists and actually actively avoiding going out and shopping because we don't know where to start. If you want more from Caitlin, you can find her at Chasingkate dot com. She has a range of options available to help. She's also on socials Caitlin Taylor dot stylist and she has.
Her own label. It's called the Edit Label, so check it out. Thanks for joining us in our New Zealand Herald podcast series The Little Things. We hope you share this podcast with the women in your life so we no longer struggle to decide what to put on each day.
You can follow this podcast on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts, and for more episodes from us on other topics, head to zed herold dot co dot NZ and
We'll catch you next time on The Little Things.