A Psychospiritual Shift w/ Valerie Spencer

On this podcast, I've invited you to go on a journey with me towards healing from shame, trauma, attachment shoes, adverse childhood experiences and more. But I believe there's another essential element involved in healing that we may be briefly touched on here that haven't really done a deep dive into yet, and that spirituality. Now let me be clear, I am not talking about religion. I am talking about spirituality now. I love Renee Brown's definition of spirituality. You

know we love Renee Brown. Here. Renee Brown defined spirituality as recognizing and celebrating that we are all inextricably connected to each other by a power that is greater than all of us, and that our connection to that power and to one another is grounded in love and compassion. Practicing spirituality brings a sense of perspective, meaning, and purpose

into our lives. I believe spirituality is a crucial part of our healing, and I have the very most perfect person with whom to have this conversation with you today. I first met Valerie Spencer in two thousand twelve for a panel I was moderating for the National Black Justice Coalition in Washington, d C. Valerie was a panelist. Now, Valerie Spencer owns every single room she walks into, and she truly owned that panel. She has a present that

is undeniable, that is anointed, that is everything. She is just that girl. I was familiar with Valerie Spencer because I had seen this incredible documentary called Beautiful Daughters that documents the very first all transgender production of Eve Insler's The Vagina Monologues. Valerie was in the documentary and she stole the show. She was incredible and it was clear to me then that she was a superstar, and over

the years we've become really good friends. Valerie is the creator of the Holistic Empowerment Institute an organization which addresses empowerment on a social, cultural, and holistic basis for lgbt q I plus communities. For over two decades, Valerie Spencer has worked in social services focusing on health disparities as they relate to transgender people and others within lgbt q

I plus communities. In two thousand eleven, the California Legislative lgbt Q Caucus officially recognized her as a state and national leader in the movement for lgbt q I plus political and social freedoms. She has worked with the federal government, health departments, universities, conferences, and community based organizations all over the country. Please enjoy my conversation with Valerie Spencer. Hello, Hello, Hello Lari Spencer. Welcome to the podcast. How are you

failing today, my sister, I'm alive, I'm illuminated. I'm prepared to serve, alive, illuminated and prepared to serve. Amen. Hallelujah. I miss you. I haven't seen you in so long. We had a zoom or something, but it it's not the same, so we need to hang out in real life. I was thinking about sisterhood and I was thinking about what that has meant in my life and how I have such incredible trans women in my life and you're certainly one of them. Where there's no there's never been

any competition. And when I think about competition, I think about competition for jobs. Even in the not for profit world that you've sort of been in for for most of your life, there's competition and backstabbing. And then for men, I said, there was a trans woman online talking about this this man who I who seemed very editory, who put her in competition with another trans woman, and I

was just like, this is not when I'm living. And I thought, before we get into the incredible work that that you're doing with the Holistic Empowerment Institute, can you talk a little bit about your experience with what that is in our community. I want the girls, and you know, I'm talking specifically about trans young trans women now before anyone else who this might apply to, to not be in competition with each other and also to be well

and whole. What comes up for you when I say all that, Well, Typically when people talk about the deficits in our community, particularly around trans women sharing or competing the space, we tend to focus on the trans woman herself, or the trans women themselves, or the community itself. But the problem is actually not connected with the women at all. The problem has to do with having to navigate through and in a culture of society that does not fully celebrate,

embrace or seen the woman that you are right. And so you've got to rally a cage. You've got to shake your baby rattle to be seen, to be noticed, you've got to say to the culture, look at me, I can walk. You know, all of those things that children do, all of those things that we all do

as human beings to struggle to be seen. And so when we fixed and do that completely, and and we're not just talking about Pride parade signs, and and I am so pleased with all of the activism that sort of spawned this trans inclusion um the Gap has changed its website, So many things have happened, but these are tertiary at bets. But ulture has to accept the fact that your sons won't me, Am, your father's won't me, your uncle Teddy and them they want me? Now, do

they want me more than you? Well that's a conversation I'm not privy to. However, they won't me, and they also see my womanhood. Now, you may not see my womanhood, and he may not get on this pulpit and talk about my womanhood, and he may not get in the ballot box or in the legislation office and talk about my woman But up and here the sanctuary, he validates, celebrates,

and expresses fully his appreciation for this woman's body. Now, when we're begin to move the culture to the place where trans women are truly on equal footing with every other woman, then we can revisit the conversation of sharing

and jockeying for space. But if you notice all women jockey for space and do strange things to compete for sexual space, I think perhaps it's just a part of the blow of womanhood, the blow of being that caregiven, that nurturing, that woman that really wants to see this person in her life. We do those things as women, but it's transporting. Probably the reason why we do them because the society does not embrace our womanhood not fully.

I wonder what just came up for me is I wonder if we enough of us as trans women haven't fully divested of patriarchy. What I believe is that it is the patriarchy and When I say patriarchy, I mean institutional sexism, and we don't We don't need men for patriarchy. Women engage in patriarchy as well, but patriarchy, that patriarchal system pits women against each other. I like to talk about systems and structures because it's really important. But in

the face of that, what is my responsibility? What is what can I do in my life to change my circumstances? Because they're both both and right. So what do you think about that? In relationship with patriarchy, Ladies and gentlemen and family human families understand I am reven bellary spensively. Sometimes nothing conveys the truth like a little piece of profanity. So here it comes. I think women have just got

to put some more respect on their pussy. Girl, you have got to put some more respect on the instrument that you possess. You're throwing your pussy out here to the wolves to be too needing and coming home straight cat it. And we vet these individuals based on the package, based on the spit of game, the swag, the smell, the attention. But girl, we got to have a little bit more. See I'm over fifty. Perhaps that's it. I'm almost there. Next year i'll be You're gonna love You're

You're gonna love your It's an explosion of goodness. Truss. Your thighs go eastant list to welcome out. But other than everything else, you're gonna live you. And I just think that for me, when I see trans women going through all this, it makes me want to parent. Mm hmm. That's the beauty of thing in your fifties. You realize,

I know my thighs can't compete. Stop competing. Let's parent and pour into And when I see trans women going through all this, it tells me that somebody, a mother figure auntie, somebody has not told you the value of your pussy. Footnote pussy is a colloquial term. Therefore, whatever I say, it's pussy, it's pussy. Now. The man that I'm with, when I tell him, eat this pussy, he knows exactly what I'm And I don't have to do a thesis on anatomy and trans psychology. If I say

eat this, Listen, I'm talking about my elbow. He's going straight to that elbow. He knows just what I'm talking well, And so do you really know the value of your trans sexuality. Have you been taught that you have your own sexual power, your own sexual pool and vibrational pool, and so you don't need to compeople with another woman's energetic pool. You have your own and it works every time. Now will he marry you? Perhaps not, But if you audition a further, that may not be him. Amen. Amen.

What I love about what you're saying is you're you're preaching. Um, You're preaching a gospel and a different one, but a very important one, because it's about our inherent, our inherent worth, the spirituality, the God that we carry within us, the sacredness, the sacred each of us whole. Because I think about, you know, when I was younger. I think about a relationship I was in for four years and two thousand and two five with an alcoholic who is emotionally abusive.

And I believed at that time in my life, because I was trans, that that was the best that I could do, that no one would love me, that I was not lovable because I'm a black trans woman and nobody's gonna want me. And this man wants me, and I've met his mother. So here's where I am in that narrator You're all right. I may not be able to find a man who loves me. I may not be able to find that. And I'm fifty five and I brushed up against it, but I have yet to

lock arms with it. But the one thing I do know that I do have agency over is that I will not be disregarded. I will not be disrespected for even for the sake of my own ego desire, even for the sake of my own vanity, even for the sake of my heart's desire, which is to be loved and affirmed by a strong man. Valerie, have you always been there? I haven't. What was the ship? When with the moment when you were like, Okay, I'm gonna put some respect on this pussy. I'm not going to allow

what I used to allow. What was the ship? Because that's what the girls need to hear. How to shift out of that thinking, out of that mindset, into the one where we value what we have. Well, first of all, I know this, You're never gonna send enough pictures to make this thing work, right. You'll be sending pictures of your colon, your pinky toe. You're fleeing the inside of your vagina, the outside of vagina, your prostate, your old

You'll be sending pictures forever. Eventually somebody will tell you that they want you or they don't. Now that's one thing, yes. The other thing is I've been skinny, I've been fat, I've been skinny, I've been a little thicker than I used to be, and I still poll I'm clear about this.

You know, there are a lot of inconvenient instan well, not a lot of inconveniences, but there are a couple of really key inconveniences to being in a trans woman, and this whole loving relationship piece is one of them, but one of the blessings of being a trans woman. I can have a horn in the top of my head and a fang. I can have gray hair with one breast that wraps around my whole neck, and I can walk outside to my sidewalk and whisper sex and

people will come from everywhere. I can always pull some trade. This is that you are a trans woman. You can pull sex. Now that may not be your appetite, and you must get to know I really want love and intimacy. I need to grieve that because that's not what I'm having. Or I'm hot and I want some sex. Click. So when men come to us, now, this is the power

of mine. When men come to us and think that they're doing us a favor by wanting to have some sort of sexual relations with us, that's a chop for me. But we need to put that in its full content, because here's what I said. Okay, daddy, you're just talking about being screw buddies. Well, now let me put you in the queue, because in this culture, I don't have a husband, but I have several auditions lined up for screw buddies. I'm sorry, you're number forty eight on the list.

I'll call him three weeks and see whatever. Because this is not going to be the night in shining Armor. And once you reach a certain age, a certain level of maturity, you begin to see that yeah, yeah, and and this one wants you to hear. Then you begin to go ahead and grieve that. And it's a grieving, it's maybe a reality. But on the other side of that grief is the pussy respect I speak. Yeah, I think even when I was single, I don't send naked pictures.

There's just things I just don't do. And it's part and part of that is about the respecting myself. Part of that is I'm a public figure. We're not doing that because before I met my boyfriend, I was like, maybe I'll just you know, have an f WB situation, you know, like I was, I was auditioning guys. Even for that, I need a certain level of respect, consistency. We're meeting in public. There's just there are things that have to become unacceptable in terms of how you treat me,

because I understand that this is divine. Well, you know, we're giving trends women so many instructional messages about how to navigate their body, all to change and switch their body. But the one thing we're not telling trans women it's okay to have a standard. Yes, and if he really wants you, he will meet that standard. Listen, a man is a man. I'm sorry, I'm full disclosure. I am highly heteronormative, I am highly gend the specific. I am

a woman under cut and clean. IMA's vanilla as it comes. So here's my point of view. If a man loves you, if he truly loves you, he will bite through a brick wall and get to you. And if somebody says to him, hey man, that's brick. He will say, passed me some hot sauce because my woman's on the other side of the wall. So all these things that we do, cuting our head off, getting new faces. It's fun if they make us so good, but if he wants you, he wants you, and we can't make them, and we

can't make them want us. I was. I was on a discussion with the girls yesterday. They show us very early on all the ghosting. It's like, Okay, he's not that into me. I'm moving on. I can't the inconsistency, I can't do. The go away, come closer, I can't do. And I'm in a space now. It's I've been dating this man for a year. We fell in love in December. I am madly in love. It's a love that I've never known before. I feel like Stephane Males, I never

knew that like this people and it's wonderful. And I think like, I'm like, how in the world did this happened? And I know I've learned from my other relationships, but I also energetic ling have shifted. There's an energy that is shifted where I are at a certain point, I just don't attract the f boys anymore. They just I repelled them because they know they're not running that game on me. You know, I've always been a rather a

rather dignified kind of girl. I mean that's you know, that's just why, And that in and of itself is a repellent. Knowing yourself clear about the game that's coming. You know, people can sort of see that. But I think with you, Laverne, you have a different relationship with appreciation than most of us do. Your physicality is appreciated, your talent is appreciated, and most of us just simply then, So what's the lesson of that? Valerie? Are the rest

of us curse? But lavern is gonna get it? No, The lesson is to surround ourselves with people who only see it, yes, and appreciate us, and not just intimate partners, but people who see our vision, people who see our talent, people who see our physical beauty, yes, but people who dig our logic. Get in a new relationship with yourself so that you don't see yourself as an outsider trying to push in. You see yourself as in an appreciating Now, you are a worthy magnet. I gotta take a teensy

break here, but I'll be fast. That wasn't so bad, now, wasn't Let's get back to it. In the podcast we did with Dr Joe just spends that he talks about creating the future we want for ourselves, um, not from the known, but from the unknown, and living it in the present, practicing gratitude for the future thing in this

present moment as if it's already happened. So we can begin to rehearse in our lives on a daily basis for that energy that we want to surround ourselves with, and we can begin to vibrate on that energetic field. And that feels like really super important and really comes to the work that you're doing as as a holistic healer, as a therapist. Is there's so many other things so

you've found at the Holistic Empowerment Institute. Can we start off by defining what you mean by holistic because we hear that word all the time and I don't know if we really know what it means. How do you define holistic? Well, that's why you're my sister, because you're perfect. That one question, my sister La learned has been the reason why h g I has been manifesting for well

over a decade. What is holistic? And and in defining that, I couldn't find a definition outside of holistic is encompassing of those sort of environmental piece so finance, family, peers, relationship and love and safety, housing, medical or physical safety. But that's not what I meant as holistic. In power, I meant spiritually integrated. Yes, empowerment. Now what does that mean? Well, in order to define that, I went on a quest to define a really good definition of one word healing.

I looked and I wasn't satisfied with most of the answers that defined healing. So I had to create one of myself. Yes, and I call healing a psycho spiritual shift. That just brought up a lot of stuff for me. What is a psycho spiritual shift? That was you? Just that was some of the energy of it right there, right, because it's energetic. Yeah, And so for our people, people of color, we experienced that psycho spiritual shift all the time. We seek it out. We usually do that in hurt

settings and religious settings. Right. I call it a touch. We need a touch, And I call it a psycho spiritual shift that leads to a new perspective of past experiences are redefining of self and it also leads to a whole new way of living and behavior. And so h G I does that in a number of ways. Some of them don't look religious. The problem with doing things that are spiritually inclusive is that people want to figure out, like where does religion fit and does it

fit because it's not. I don't want to be bothered. And so I was sitting on the beach and I was just thinking, you know, God help and spirits spoke to me and said, take the God out. It's problematic, it's complicated. Take the God out and and replace the God with what we are pulling people into what I call their sacred core. There's a sacred core, teaching them about the sacred interior. We're moving people out of a God that's over on Cringshaw somewhere and pulling them into

themselves because that is the relationship. And so we'll be doing that in a number of voice. The first way we're doing it, I've wanted to have a love letter to the trans women in my life and all over the world. We want trans women to lead from a full context of themselves, but also to see the community the transformune to that deleting in the full context of who they are. So we're taught that trans communities are

disease burdened. I even saw a smoking sensation presentation where they quoted that trans people's trans women smoke more than anybody else. They have no data to support it. I said, I know several queens, and I know maybe two or three that's smoke. Where y'all finding this? fIF a queen's who will they be? Right? So we're gonna teach our people to not see trans women in terms of deficity. We want trans women to lead trans people from a place of knowing our people is powerful. Yeah, we want

to know our people outside of the deficit narrative. Who are you? Who have you been in Africa? Who have you been in Native America? Who have you been in Brazil? Who have you been in Asia? Who have you been in Russia? Practice? Who are you? Glow? Who are you right? Not just this? I want to change my set. I don't like my breast, I don't like the shape of my thing. Who are you? That's not who you are?

Are you suggesting all of who you are as your aesthetics? No, you have healing in your end, you are trans Your purpose is to be an intermediary between spirit and human God. That's who we've served, right, So we want to teach our people a whole new way, leading with skill sets, but also this thing, our compassion m hm, to really build this platform called spiritually integrated holistic empowerment. We're building the model as we speak, got it, spiritually integrated holistic empowerment.

What does that mean? That means we know how our people heal. We use both evidence based practices and we merge them with the sacred. So we'll be using interventions in behavior health to relieve depression and anxiety, social anxiety and all those things. We'll be using some of those evidence based practices, but we also know that a good pot of greens is very healing. The process of cooking back is very hell. We also know that rocking and amone mm hmmm kept her out of prison and kept

you alive. Right, So we'll be bringing to like the ways that our people heal. Our people heals through the vogue. Have you ever seen him? Girl? I can't watch it in person. I don't go, but I can't after leave because I'm having a religious experience. Yes, ma'am, it's not. And you think about the vogueing and how that the connection to vogue in Africa, right, and that that the rhythms right, Vogueing is an an American art form that has gone all over the world. It's very exciting you're

thinking about that lineage. I love how connected to to all of the spirit you are. But when you talked about rocking and moaning, what was really beautiful for me? As I love bringing in other things we've talked about on the podcast, that feels so in the parlance of the community resiliency modeling from the Trauma Research Institute, that rocking and humming is a resource that actually stimulates the vagus nerve and can reset our nervous system and then

begin to facilitate that psycho spiritual shift. Right. That also is the power of the own, the power of the ome re centers. That nerve oxygenates the brain, the all in its full breath, right does that as well. Every culture has their way of sort of having a reset, right Nomi Horano, Nomi right, home shanty shanty home, shanty, shanty o. All of us have those ways of sort of reoxygenating the brain, re centering the snaps firing in

the brain and coming together. I love those things and I love finding the connections between the I think we were Buddhism and a few other things in um the Baptist Church, and then integrating that with like Trauma Resiliency ORG. Right, that is the end, that is thematic that is connected to the body. Welcome to holistic compartment institute. That yeah, and for me that is really exciting. I have a holistic doctor here in l a doctor Henry, and she

focuses on the physical part. In my therapist who's a trauma resiliency therapist sent me to doctor Henry. And what she illuminated to me I've been with her for um four or five years now, is that regular Western medicine basically like they can prescribe drugs or give you surgery. There's nothing really preventative. And what they do and so

with Dr Henry, we talk about my gut help. We do acupuncture, we do microcurrent, we do heart rate variability, we do all these things that like, well, what's going on. If this is happening, Let's look at your diet, let's look at your sleep patterns, let's look at all these things like sort of on a physical level. Now, see, I want to take it further as the spiritually integrated therapists. I need to know more. I need to know do you know who your ancestors are? Who are the relationships

with it? We need to repair, right, We may need you to do some ancestral repair work. And good god, I found that to be so useful. Ancestral repair work. That feat sounds like for people out there, what are you talking about? That's a little esoteric ancestral repair work or we're talking seances or so like, can you break that down for us? Because I find that really fascinating. So energy does not end, well, speak, he doesn't dissiplate. Yeah,

it always continues. It's not. It is only transformed continuous that always it transmutes the changes form. So Grandmama may not be Grandma, but that energy is still pleasant with us. Right, and we know that the divine doesn't really operate in here. There's then mouths, a penny, a million. The spirit of

life doesn't really operate in those sort of limitations. So if you're having a relationship with yourself based on somebody's information that that was given to you about yourself, we may need to go and clear some that up, and we might need to I took one of my clients to the beach and we had a great talk with grandmama. I take a lot of my clients to water because I believe the water doesn't work. And she did. She begin to right, you were wrong about me not going

to him. I'm gonna be okay. So now we can begin to build a whole new relationship with that ancestor. Because in the African tradition, we use our and in the Latin many traditions Ethano traditions, we use our ancestors as resource. They are a part of our ammunition. So when I do both therapy and spiritual council, I'm asking people about your therapeutic tools, like are you doing your affirmative work? Are you doing your writing? Are you doing journaling?

Are you breathing? Doing mindful MI six? But I'm also asking are you engage? Have you engaged your ancestor on this? Have you spoke some a permitive I do teach a permitive prayer. What is the affirmative prayer? What an affermitive prayer is speaking from? So what you're friend talked about earlier about sort of navigating yourself from a place that it is already accomplished. That is really scriptural, really call

things that be not as it were. Permitive prayer speaks from a place of knowing already one's oneness with the spirit of life. Right, So we're not begging God to do something. We're stepping into who we are as citizens of the spirit and speaking our word expecting it to unfold, because that is the promise and that is the law. So we're very mindful of the prayer we put out. Like you know, in my training, we had to as a spiritual counsel, we had to write our prayers and

have them critiqued. Oh yes, maybe, and they were. Christina Applegate sat next to me. We were like, dang, I got beat up critiquing a prayer Jesus Christ and grading a prayer and grading your science. Mind was no criteria for um for grading a prayer. So and reading our prayers your your comfortence this this this line here that speaks of separation. That is not unifying, That is not you, That is not affirmative. Okay, well this time this is denials.

We don't use denials. We don't say things like God I don't want um, so we don't speak, and God, please don't let them be in a council. Wait wait, wait, wait, we're not doing denials. We're speaking in front of my body operates and complete vitality and overwhelming health. That is my DNA and my birth flight is the law of the spirit that I'm speaking. We speak that you don't speak no thing. I'm hot and behind a bush. Don't let him give me no. No, that's a power less prayer.

Oh so much comes up for me. I think about negative self talk, which came up for me really strong during the pandemic, And it's just an old habit and that what we say can ship a thought, can shift us into trauma, can after our bodies into shame just a negative thought or negative self talk. So what is so beautiful about what you're saying now on a spiritual level is that um neurobiologically, it also begins to set up their nervous system for resilience. It's just a the

nervous system for trauma resilience, for shame resilience. Can I say that another way? Absolutely, you begin to set up a whole another pattern of habituation in terms of how to process trauma, how to encode trauma, how to resist trauma? Asked trauma? Right, when you live your life from a place of knowing fully who you are, some things just don't affect you like they affect other people, or how

they used to affect you. Why because you don't see yourself as this weak, needy, vulnerable, wanting to be loved transperson. I really think that language for us has become toxic. Right, This whole wanting to be trans is trying to be trans. Quit trans will be you. The definition will catch up to you and wrap itself around you. You don't need to wrap yourself around the definition of trans. It's gonna change in ten years anyway. I want to fortify you

so that you see yourself as powerful, as beautiful. That you know what your skill sets are, that you know what your talents are, that you know what your triggers are, but also you know your weapons are not to fire back at the attack, but to form a worthy shield. You can't call me a man in a dress, and that shodow my existence today. I mean, well, first of all, I have proof that it's not true. I do have a stunning mirror. However, however, I've been through too much.

I know myself too much. I know the source of the attack. That's the other piece we don't teach our well, the source of the attack. Hey, look y'all, that's the man that was never about you. That was a protective factor that people do for themselves. That was a trigger response because many Cistean women, when trans women walk into a room, we become very self and dieting for sisteent women, right, for some thank you for that. I don't want to generalize.

You know, she's like that. Why am I like this? And many people process it through attack instead of just saying, wow, what a beautiful another form of woman as I am as well. Right, But when you begin to fortify yourself, you have a different relationship to abuse and that psycho spiritual shift, it really does happen, and it changes, It

just changes everything. I always think about what gets in the way for some of the some of the girls, I mean a lot of our young trans sisters may be dealing with like survival, sex, work and just in environment. Environment is so key. My my boyfriend always says, we're part of of our environment, and so it's that who do we surround ourselves? With and we're talking about spiritual fortification.

We have to be surrounded by people and energy. We that that that is going to reinforce that that force spiritual fortification. So we may need to let some people go. We may need to like move out of this home that is not you know, that's toxic if we can, right, We may need to get out of this relationship or let this girlfriend go who doesn't see really see it for us to find that spiritual fortification and to step

into what we're meant to be. And you know, I always think about when you talk like that, I think about my angelus poem for our grandmother said for often quotes she says that I come as one, but I stand as ten thousand and you just pulled up my girl. Now waitman, you talk about my mama. Now hold up. But that statement that maya made. When I read that, that came why I love being a transformer, because I am not just this diagnostic physicality that you see. M hm.

I am so lady Java that beguiled your granddaddy. I am Christine Jurgensen. That said a whole new conversation about body physicality. Right, My value goes beyond Valerie Senser. My value goes beyond this thing called trans. I have been so useful and fought after throughout cultures. So I'm not just this queen who was teased and ostracized in south central Los Angeles. That's the factual merit. The truth of it is, Oh, honey, I am the Faa. I am the Burbadash. I am the Hezra, I am the truth spirit.

I am the Shaman. I am the who do priestess. I am the priestess. I have been on than Santaria and Budom Catholicism, So we know ourselves differently. We have been given it's very narrow margin of understanding about ourselves

and the link between that and colonialism. It's so important to always emphasize and to always talk about that, that that the way European colonialism colonized so much of the world, where we were viewed as sacred beings right and indigenous cultures all over the world, and and and European colonialism came in and said, what is this, This is not

of Jesus Christ and marginalized us. And I always invite young trans people to connect with that history and realize that they are anointed and I feel like that's what you're talking about now. When when I had a look on this on this podcast, the local was saying to trans people always been spiritual leaders. That is what we are here for. And and you know we can step into that or not. They're the reason why they saw us as even as and pagan. There's a reason why

they saw us as out. Of course, we presented certain gender physicality that they did not understand. But the receipts were the receipts. And here's what I mean by that. The receipts were when the trans woman went over their growth house, that baby don't have their code nor move. The receipts were when the trans woman showed over at that dry crop. It was a dry clop. Not six weeks later they got all kind of corn over there. The receipts were the receipts. We were the kaiser of

our people. We were the hm of the land. Those colonial oppresses, yes, they saw us for what we were. We were a vehicle to stop their progression. We bore both physical energy, ancestral energy, energetic energy. We knew how to manipulate the earth and the Let we ship. It's time for a short break when we come back more with our guest. Alrighty, then let's just dive right back in.

And when I think about the current sort of anti trans, like vigorous anti trans push from conservatives, it's like, can we just allow us to be great? Allow us to step into the divineness that we are? And I think we can give ourselves permission. One of the many things I love about you is that you have not You've not waiting for anybody to give you permission to like, to to be great, to be well. I must consess.

I did. I did, now, let me tell you. In my late thirties, I had a huge resentment because I just thought, if I just stay bright and cunning and smiling and nice and upbeat, that Oprah is gonna come get me. I'm telling you ad At about thirty eight, it occur to me that Oprah was not coming to give me. That I was actually gonna have to produce this. That's why I went back to school, because I thought, Okay, well she came and got I come get me once

I really got and the other piece of earn. And I really want your listeners to connect with this, Assess yourself and be honest, because sometimes the current lanes in, as bright and shiny and seemingly successful producing as they may be, they just don't fit for you. I was somebody just trying to learn how to diagnose and and Department of Mental Health and all those things that I was not asking questions like like where are you feeling this in your body? The somatic questions. Who came to

you last night and talk to you about this? You know what ancestor have you been to me? And after a while I had to give my my self permission to let my freaking flag fly. I just have to because it felt like work and I can't do work. I learned that years ago. I just I can't work. And what I think you mean is that when you're doing something that you love, when it is aligned with a purpose that is bigger than you, it doesn't feel

like work. It feels effortless and fun and oh my god, they sent me money, right, And you know, there are sometimes in that you may clean a toilet, you may have to pick up a chair and move it. You you know, the ease and difficulty of whatever task is. That's not really irrelevant. The relevance is that I feel so appreciated and valued. Here, I appreciate and value all

these people. I feel safe. It doesn't feel like work, but I've had jobs that felt like and it feels like work, and part of that toxic I want to listen to such a self free baby, because part of that toxic work is getting yourself together to get up every day to go deal with that toxic work. You need to do some work that's not work. Some of us just can't do it. And I think I've been

thinking a lot about toxic stress in my life. And I have lived a very stressful life over the past few years, and there's a lot of pressure on me and my job, and I'm just like, how do what does it look like for me to let that go? But the toxic stress actually proceeds me being famous Leaver

and Cox. It goes back to childhood stuff. It's historical, so like trying to make decisions now for my healing, for me to be more connected to the ancestors, connected to to love, being in love now, it's really all about love that when you really are in love or feel love, it's not even just about romantic love, feeling love for music, or feeling love for acting, or art and being creative, that there's something that shifts in my

body that is just so connected. And when things go awride, I get in my head I'm not I'm not feeling allowing myself to feel the love in my body, and I'm not allowing myself to be connected. It's maybe a connection to my girlfriends, a connection to the love I have preparing for this podcast. I have love. I have love.

Really doing the work for this podcast has been so joyous for me, and I feel connected when I do that connection to another human being, connected to a power, the energy of the universe, that that is bigger than me, connected to a purpose, that this same thing is not just about me looking cute on Instagram it's a glare or or low wive or whatever, that there is a

purpose attached to it. In connection, then that begins to shift the energy in my body, that begins to like to heal, It begins to heal, and that that that that's the one there it is. Some of them will dis over if we're honest that self awareness alone did not quite do it. Academic cognitive critical understanding didn't do it.

We needed something that wasn't religious, and religion has been really oppressive for our people, specifically LGBT, and actually for everybody religion all overlooking what's going on global as we have so hijacked God and may God out to be this evil motherfucker that's like, you know, my daddy was like this temp with to have on you. Don't do it in my way. I'm gonna not to hell out you where my money at? Is this the energy that

said let that be light? Or was it like it's turned to goddamn lights on me and I'm programmed to learn life's lessons by way of mistake and you're gonna burn me forever for that. That's why God said to me, take take me out, you know were I want to offer a frame to what you were saying earlier. However, I think it also requires safety and honesty because if I feel safe, if I feel safe, I'll allow myself to connect with those things or to do those things.

And if I'm honest. Now, that one is a big, big, big, big, big, big big, because we've got a lot invested in those narratives and they are multi variant and dynamic, they are organic and living, and I always like to ask my clients, what's the truth. We need that. Okay, what's the truth? We need that? Okay, what's the truth? Be needs that until we hit a hard layer of I was trying to buy love. And so if I feel safe, then

I will feel so safe that I'll be honest. And when I'm honest, a whole bunch of magical things start happening. First of all, when I'm honest, those ancestors present themselves to you and say Hi, I'm here with your name and Marcus bags. Are you ready? They become like spiritual concierge. Right, the difficulty of life is taken out because we've got other resources. Right. I don't have a personal assistant, I do have prayer. So I'm trying to promote people feelings safe.

The other thing that you mentioned leads into this. Those Instagram posting don't need a purpose what the heck for? They're fun. They are they are, they are, they are Laverne being. That's that, And so should anyone look at that and say, well, what's the meaning behind that? Nothing on Instagram getting my entire life because my body is fabulous. I'm in a fabulous place, and I came to check them up. I can't. I'm the instrument in illumination, get

into it. I am the instrument and illumination. I love the you. We have to wrap up soon, but I love that you talked about safety, because none of this work is possible without safety. The point of trauma resilience found work is to move out of the fight flight or freeze. If our nervous systems are in the constant

fight flighter freeze, if we've experienced trauma discrimination. I believe that our LGBTQ community, particularly transmarine of color, are constantly in that survival fight flighter freeze where we never feel safe. And so if we never feel safe, we can't do any of this work. We can't do any work because we're in the Olympic brain. We're not in our prefrontal cortex. We're not in that resilient place. So we have to get ourselves out of that heightened fight flight or freeze.

I'm in danger that we've been talking about this on the podcast since we started. It becomes a fog, that fight flight response that you speak of. It becomes like a permanent existence fall and so it sounds like illogical decision make it sounds like a questionable impulse control. It's just that fall of the trauma in survival, trauma, survival and affirmation. Too much trauma, not enough survival, complete depletion of affirmation. This culture does not affirm us unless we

are bionically beautiful. Everybody can look like y'all, and then it's still contingent because we age because we want to

get fat. You're never gonna a patriarchy, You're never gonna age, and you know you're never gonna get sat Please stop anyway before I ask the last question that in the podcast with I just want to um what I love, always loved about you is that there is something deeply connected to the earth, to spirituality, to something that is bigger, that's just something that is divine, and that that is

deeply necessary for us going forward as trans people. There's were so visible now in ways that we have never can never really imagine. But we really desperately need this spiritual component as we go forward. We really do. We need deeper capacities to love people who are coming for us. But we can't do that if we're not loving ourselves.

And what you have given us today is like a deep understanding of like the ways in which we can love ourselves that are deeply connected to our ancestors, to the earth, to the God that that is within us. And this is crucial right now as we face the battles of just everyday life. And so this is out there and it's available, and it's waiting. It's it's right here, and it is who you are already. So the inheritance sound is the trends soul. Let let me be clear

before let me get my commercials there. The truth sound is the you. The inheritance sound is this thing called transgender. We also, in our loving of ourselves, we have to examine our relationship to this terminology. M I retired from being trans. I stepped back in where it pays, you know, because it's become lucrative in some spaces. But in my life every day, oh my god, being transgendous too much work on my word? Right, where's the appreciation? Where's the validation?

It has me living in social anxiety, thinking that people want to attack me or harmy And that may be true, but that keeps me from blocking that attack with my sickening nous, right because I'm so busy focused on Am I enough trans and invite people to yes, appreciate the legacy the lineage of being trans. But who are you A No, that's the harder question to answer. That's the deeper point of inquiry. Who am I? I'm more than

that Now. I see myself as much more than trans. Therefore, I see myself as having the availa ability to experience something beyond the trauma that is trans. But bemind you, I want to make it seem like I've gotten off trans trauma free. In my life. The trauma was like a miss. You didn't know why you didn't get the job, but you didn't get the job. Right. You were interviewed by a man. Oh my god, that man was handsome and he said all the great things that you know

you were gonna get the job. You blamed yourself. You didn't know it was about him. He liked queens. He's always like queens. If he hired you, he was gonna get clocked, so he couldn't have you here. You didn't know that. There's that's a whole podcast. But that's the beauty of being a thing. Oh, I know the team. Some attacks don't attack you like they used to because

you know you know that the attacker. It's like I know that if I let you into my house, I know exactly what position you will be getting into within sixteen men, I know exactly who you are. So I know who you are, so it doesn't bother still, couldn't I know what you want? The Reverend Reverend Reverend s Mencer, Girl, we gotta end this podcast. I love you so much. I love this spirituality. With the key key we end the Laverne Cock Show with this question what else is true?

And it's taken from my somatic therapy through the community resiliency model, and it's the idea of both. And if there's something challenging in my life, something else is true. If I'm feeling pain in one part of my body, there may be a part of my body where it's neutral and positive. So if I can focus on that other thing that is true, I can lift the pain anxiety of this thing that is weighing me down. Reverend Valerie Spencer, for you today, on this day, what else

is true? For you? I am always supported. I may can't see the support, I may can't even smell the support or even have an internal navigation of where it is. But if I can just get still for a nano second and remind myself, heyy, you know that you're supported, Bryan. We feel often alone, We feel that we have to navigate theseselves by ourselves. I often feel like if I admit my unknowing, you know, people will see me as a failure or not enough, and let them see that

I am always supporting. I'm always gonna be okay, even if I'm penniless and broke, because I'm a queen. I can make pennies and broke look like the mett gallant. Dear, I'm a queen, So don't you know, please don't see your transness as a deficit. That's your battery, that's your power, that's your songs. Valerie Spencer, I love you so much or ever you look good. Thank you. Okay, bye, y'all. Y'all gonna make me ms Joey read in the CBC. Okay, be well, Lebern call me here. I will call you

be well. Be well. M M. That was good, right. I love me some. Valerie Spencer. She's a key, key, but she's so spiritually grounded and she always has been. And the phrase that just knocked me on my on my booty, I go spiritual shift the way Valorie talked about it reminds me of sort of getting the spirit, you know, when the preachers preaching and some some truth comes over you. If the spirit hits you, when you get the Holy Ghost, that's what a psycho spiritual shifts

or feels like. But then like taking it out of the context of of church and and also thinking that we all have a sacred core, that her work is about inviting us to tap into our sacred core, and it's it's inside of us, but it is also connected to ancestors, it's connected to an energy that's bigger than us. I think it feels like she's talking about the quantum field the way Dr drum Joe dispense I talked about, Like you know, she's talking about the spirits and how

they can speak to us and live within us. I'm like, Okay, this is like a quantum model that she's talking about, but she's using spiritual language to talk about it. I love. So it is all related that there's just different approaches that we can take to get where we need to get.

But I think ultimately stepping into the divine within us doing all the trauma work that we've been inviting through the course of this podcast, so that we can feel safe, so that we can be in our resilience zone, the sacred core, and allow that to manifest itself through our entire being. Is a beautiful, beautiful image, a beautiful, beautiful invitation and gift that Valerie Spencer has given us today. Thank you for listening to The Laverne Cox Show. Please rate, review,

and subscribe and share with everyone you know. Join me next week for my conversation with Madame iris If, my voice coach and opera teacher for over twenty five years. Opera is a passion for both of us, and in our conversation we go into the dean died insane fandom that is being an opera queen, and we have a tremendous amount of fun. Whether you're an opera fan or not, is the conversation not to be missed. You can find me on Instagram and Twitter at Laverne Cox and on

Facebook at Laverne Cox for Real. Until next time, Stand Up Up. The Laverne Cox Show is a production of Shonda land Audio in partnership with I Heart Radio. For more podcasts from Shonda land Audio, visit the i Heart Radio app, Apple podcast or wherever you listen to your favorite shows,