I'm with Ray Scott, and he didn't need me, you know this way, and I mean, the spotter can help, but I didn't know what I was doing, so Ray didn't need be at all. And he was next to Pat Summerl who had not I don't remember exactly when he had started his career, but he was relatively new at that point. This was in the early seventy seventy one. Maybe Wow, Well, the president of CBS Sports was in the booth. It was a big deal. So I got my exposure to television right there, and I went, Wow, this is
great. And so the spectacle of all of that kind of hit something in me. I was a kid who wouldn't talk in front of two people. I was very shy. I mean, I hated anything like that. But I'm up there and I'm going, oh, this is this is pretty good. So when I got out of the Navy, I went back and went to school in Minneapolis and got a job in Knoxville, Iowa. And there we are today. This is the Laravian la Pey Podcast, a production of
iHeartRadio Podcasts, and is presented by UW Credit Union. Here for every U Hi, everybody, I'm Wayne Laravie and I'm Matt Lopez. On this episode of the Laravie La Pay Podcast, we visit with the legendary television voice of the Milwaukee Bucks and Jim Pashke. Stay tuned, good stuff Just ahead. Uw Credit Union another local team that's owned by fans, offering great rates that help Wisconsins enjoy greater possibilities. Pop in or hop online at UWCU dot org.
We welcome in Jim Paske, who for thirty five years was the television voice of the Milwaukee Bucks. In October two thousand and seven, Jim was inducted into the Wisconsin Basketball Coaches Hall of Fame as a friend of basketball. It's a heck of an honor. He's an eight time Chicago Midwest Regional Emmy Award winning winning a broadcaster. In twenty thirteen, inducted into the National Academy of Television Arts and Sciences prestigious Silver Circle and honor given to outstanding individuals who
devoted twenty five years or more to the local television industry. Also a member of the Milwaukee Press Club's Media Hall of Fame. I first ran into Jim in Maryvale. I want to say Maryvale Arizona. Jim, I was broadcasting Cubs games. You were doing Brewers games, and that's got to be going back maybe ninety three, ninety four, somewhere way back then. Well, let's see, that would have been ninety five or ninety six probably. That was my second stint with the team. I had been out of baseball for
three years, as you recall, So I remember that very clearly. We had a nice chat back then, and it was a pleasure to meet you, And of course we have been able to keep tabs on each other, all three of us, for a long time. Yeah, you really have. Jim was one of the first guys over in Milwaukee who supported me. I put it that way. I think of Jim Pasky. Dennis Crawsey was
another one of those guys. I didn't know too many of of the Milwaukee media folks, Tim van Horn, but Jim was always really supportive of my career when I first moved here in nineteen eighty eight. Jimmy Vettich has to do a lot of different sports. What was your first love? Well, I grew up in Minnesota, and I always tell people I ended up in basketball for thirty five seasons, but in Minnesota. It was always hockey in
the winter, right. Basketball was probably the sport that I was least exposed to, and then I end up in the NBA or around the NBA for thirty five seasons. The first day I ever worked for a living was at a Minnesota Twins gay. It was the sixth game of the nineteen sixty five World Series. I was fourteen years old and worked as an usher for Game
six and seven World Series against the Dodgers. Baseball was probably my favorite as a young man, and to be able to do seven seasons on the television network with the Brewers was a great thrill also, so I guess baseball when I was younger, but now the sport is basketball, no question about that. Jim. Did you did you do any hockey or did you play hockey
as a kid? Growing up very poorly? We used to build a rink every October and we'd flooded in the neighbor's backyard and play every day after school. You know the skates they have today, If I'd have had those, I probably could have been a little better at it. We have the old leather ones at the ankles, were you were on your own with the ankles today they have a little bit more support. I was a terrible hockey player, but I love the sport. Worked the first NHL game again as an
usher. I worked through high school and college for all the pro events in Minneapolis, and so I was there when the North Stars debuted and loved that sport. But you know, moved away and I did a little bit of hockey with the Milwaukee Admirals, did a few games on television. That was Everything I've done is one hundred years ago now except for the buck. Yeah, I enjoyed the sport. That's a tricky one because of the free substitutions. You have to be on your game when you're doing hockey, and I
found it very enjoyable. And you just have to be patient and work your way through the free, free exchange of players and that sort of thing. You have to be around that one every day, I think, to figure out what guys look like. Can't see the numbers, and you know, you have to be visually locked in on that. But I enjoyed that sport very much, and quite frankly, if no one's listening, I'm paying attention to the NHL playoffs now through out of the NBA playoffs. I kind of
shift over a little bit. I've always enjoyed the National Hockey League playoffs. It's quite a spectacle. Yeah, I do. I tried calling hockey in college Ohio State for a couple of years. It's day and night. You think of the variety of you know, going from hockey to a baseball game. I mean, that really is day versus that's day versus night. You mentioned that about hockey too, when we were all doing the remote broadcast.
Each sport had its challenges. I think trying to call hockey remotely might be the worst. Would you imagine that? Well, high definition television probably help that sport more than any other sport, right because you could, you know, start to see the puck a little bit better. In the old days, with those you know kind of you know, not the same quality of television, you couldn't see the puck at all. You had to kind of you could tell by movements and motions where the puck was if you do the
game. And I think that's why it struggled to catch on back in the days of those old McLaughlin era television broadcasts, you know, and yeah and so, but but the high def is helped that a little bit. But no, you're right. You know it's coming around and people are starting to catch on to it a little bit, you know, guys, I tell you, and I grew up in Massachusetts. Hockey's big in New England to Jim, as it is up in Minnesota. And I tried calling a few
hockey games. I just the hard part for me, guys is the scrum in front of the net and the puck goes into that. Who scored? You know what I mean, it exists to follow the puck and you know, and I'm watching these NHL playoffs to my when I when I was in high school, I was a New York fan and so the Rangers were my team back that and I'm watching them now. My oldest son, Scott's a big Rangers fan, and he and his little boy stay up to watch the
games. And the speed of that game even you know, and I agree with you, oh artly, Jim. I mean, I def TV has really helped hockey, but the speed, the skating ability. I said to my wife last night watching the game, said, wow, these guys are good skaters. It's amazing how good they are. Well, my son played high school hockey, and so I followed that, and you know, I learned a little more through him too. But I think the average body fat
on a hockey player is the lowest of all pro athletes. Maybe soccer players are down there too, but it's around five six percent I think on average, at least it used to be. I mean, they're in great shape. People say, why do they only skate for two minutes? Well try it sometime you're carrying about thirty pounds of equipment. When I played hockey until I was fifty five years old, and to this day, that is absolutely
the most perspiring inducing workout that I've ever done. I mean, you sweat quickly and profusely when you're skating, and it's you have to be great shape to do that. I was the wrong body build for hockey. But you know, you're absolutely right, great great athletes and fun to watch. And I don't know what their speed is anymore, but they're out there moving and
they have clubs too well. It is amazing. And you know some guys that Wisconsin through the years who played in the NHL, like a Tony Grenado, who was he was a linemate with Wayne Gretzky without the La Kings many years ago. And remember one of the first conversations I had with Tony it was about really and you speak to this gym when you're watching the Stanley Cup
playoffs here. I mean, most people will tell you that is the most intense postseason the ball and that it's not it's not so much winning it, it's just enduring it. The guys who look like the guys who are hoisting the cup look like they've gone fifteen rounds with Tyson and in his prime. And you know, Tony would talk about guys, you know, they're iv
in the locker room. Obviously we see that with football too, but the grueling nature of the NHL playoffs, I mean, each sport has its own set of challenges, but Hackey might be that the top of the list. Apparently they don't even have time to shape, don't lift their arms or your tires, grow those beards. You know, Yeah, I know that's true.
It's uh, it's very intense and and I mean there have been some great games, overtime games at Boston game the other night was fantastic, and uh so yeah, it's uh, it's a tough sport and uh, it's it's interesting. Uh. Once I think fans get involved with the sport there, they it has a stickiness to it. You know, if you if you get involved with that sport, you tend to stay with it. Uh,
you see what it's all about. And uh, it's pretty sticky in terms of interest, you you know, just to kind of finish up this hockey that we're talking with. Jim Paski, the legendary voice of the Milwaukee Bucks. But you know where they the Admirals play Now they play in that little arena u W. Panther Arena, and it's great for basketball, and it's really kind of neat the Bucks. Luel Sindor and all those great teams Mack and Oscar Robertson, they all played in there at Wilt Chamberlain and then
some of those great Knicks teams all played in that building. But it's a small building. And now they put a hockey rink in there, and guys, I'll tell you what an adbrose game, you're right in the middle of the action, even if you're in the back row, it's outstanding. I mean it was like that for the Bucks. There was not a bad seat in that building. There still isn't a bad seat in that building for any of the sports they play in there, great atmosphere and you know, yeah,
I keep track of them too. And what a tricky thing they had in the first round. They had the top seed or a higher seed, but they opened on the road and Austin lost to and then had to come back and win three to move on. I mean, that's and they did it. It was pretty impressive, Jim. What was interesting about that is that they had the call on that they could either take the two at home at the front end or the three on the pad. They took the two
on the road. That's really interesting, and that's interesting. I guess their thought was all they had to do was steal one on the row and then come home and take two out of three. But they made it tough on themselves. But it was very impressive the way they got through that. The Lerivial of Pay podcast is presented by UW Credit Union Here for every u For more than ninety years, UW Credit Union has helped Wisconsin ice achieve their financial
goals at every stage of life, offering great rates for greater possibilities. Joined today at UWCU dot org, who knew that we would be talking to hockey for as long as we have, but it has got to called. But John Greenberg, long time you know, worked with the Brewers for a number of years. We all know him and obviously doing a great job with the Milwaukee Admirals. I want to kind of bounce topics here a little bit because
I was looking up a story on eu Jima. I can't remember if it was within the last couple of years, but I think fans of a certain age would be interested in hearing your connection to Ray Scott. Yeah, oh well, yes, Ray Scott was serendipitously in my life. And it goes back to working at the ballpark. I started when I was fourteen, and again I worked through high school and college at Old Matt Stadium in Bloomington, Minnesota. So I was there for Twins games, Viking games. We worked
the hockey games next door at the met Center. But one of his sons, predominantly one of his sons, I think two of them worked at the ballpark. But one of his sons was a chief usher for Andy Frayin and we got to be very good friends. And I hang out with Bill Scott for many years and Ray was never home, of course, he was traveling working for CBS the voice of the Packers. At that time, CBS assigned announcers two teams, and Ray was assigned to the Green Bay Packers the Lombardi
Packers, and the family knew me. I'd been around, and one day Ray asked me if he could take my parents to dinner. He was moving to Phoenix, and he had never met my parents, but he asked if he could take them to dinner. And at dinner, he asked my parents if they would be guardians for one of his sons, Patrick, who needed to finish high school. So Patrick lived with my family for a couple of
years. And that's right when I left. I went in the Navy at the same time, and I'm out in California and I get a phone call from Ray Scott and he said, Jim, I need a spotter for the NFL game on Sunday was Dallas and the forty nine ers way and it was a player aff game. And I said sure, And it was his way of doing something for me because my parents had helped him out. And I walked into that both and I'm with Ray Scott and he didn't need me, you know this way, and I mean, the spotter can help, but
I didn't know what I was doing. So Ray didn't need be at all. And he was next to Pat summerall who had not I don't remember exactly when he had started his career, but he was relatively new at that point. This was in the early seventy seventy one. Maybe Wow. Well, the president of CBS Sports was in the booth. It was a big deal. So I got my exposure to television right there, and I went, Wow, this is great. And so the spectacle of all of that kind
of hit something in me. I was a kid who wouldn't talk in front of two people. I was very shy. I mean, I hated anything like that. But I'm up there and I'm going, oh, this is this is pretty good, you know. So when I got out of the Navy, I went back and went to school in Minneapolis and got a job in Knoxville, Iowa. And here we are today, amazing serendipitous situation where Ray, you know, just did some thing for me. And the night
before that game, he took me to the production dinner. There were thirty people from CBS at this dinner, a big fancy restaurant in San Francisco. And I mean, so I got an exposure at a pretty high level, and you know, it took me a while. I don't know that obviously I didn't get back to that level. But you know, I told myself when I started, I'm going to do this myself. I never asked Ray.
He got upset with me because I didn't ask for any help and wouldn't take any help, and you know, just the way I wanted to do it, and it worked out pretty well. And I remember when then he came to Green Bay, very late in his life. He was working in Green Bay in radio, so I'd get to see him once in a while. One quick story about him. So this all happens, and I go to Knoxville, Sioux City, Peoria, and then I'm in Madison. And this is in seventy seven or seventy eight. The station in Madison was on
the Brewers networking week take one trip a year. So I go to Texas and Ray Scott was doing the games and I was going to do it inning sit down and I'm sitting next to him, and he does the first inning and then he tells the producer he wasn't feeling well. I did the next nine innings with zero preparation next to Ray Scott. So he did that for me. Also, I did a whole baseball a major league game, and I mean, you know, unbelievable, right, So he paid back that
little thing my parents did for him pretty well in my opinion. Well, no kidding, did it happen too fast to be nervous? He said, you weren't quite prepared for it, but they just happened all of a sudden. Just go, don't worry about it. Yeah, you know, I had prepared a little bit for my inning, you know, and I'd studied and you know, I would never go into something like that without thinking about it and doing some work, right, And but it was probably the best
thing that happened. I had no choice. I probably said what are you talking about? And he said, you know, three two, one go, And I did the final eight innings with him sitting next to me, you know, helping, you know, come in a little bit here and there. But I did baseball that night on my own, with no no real preparation. So it was great, you know, it was wonderful.
Yeah, you know, that guy, I had a chance to get to know him a little bit, and then he was hostumously inducted to the Packers Hall of Fame, I would to say around two thousand and two thousand and one, and I happened to be m seeing that night and his son, I believe it was Bill. I believe it was his oldest son. Yes, well, Bill was his second oldest son. Okay, let's see, he had one two, three, four boys and one daughter. Patrick was number three, and then he has a son in Phoenix and any son in
San Francisco at that time. But if Bill was probably there because Bill always stayed in the midwell. Yeah, and you know he accepted the the award for his late dad. But I had had a chance when I was in Kansas City at a doing a pregame show on the Chiefs Network and sat down with the Ray Scott and talked to him and talked to him about the ice bowl in that Dallas Green Bay back and forth in nineteen sixty six and sixty seven. And he put it in such a succinct way, I guess it,
which should not be surprising. Everything Ray said was succinct. But he said, you know, the whole thing came down to two drives in really two plays on the goal line in Dallas, the Cowboys had a chance to get in and tie the game and maybe win the championship in Dallas, and the following year, the Packers are in the same position on the goal line with a chance to win. The Cowboys didn't get it done. Tom Brown
made an interception. The Packers got it done on the quarterback sneak, and that was really he said, that was the difference those two plays, with the difference of those two teams. Isn't that amazing? And while you're describing that way, and I'm thinking about all three of us having the distinct pleasure and honor to be around moments like that, We've all had moments and what
a gift that is. As I'm retired now, I think back on that and I'm so grateful for the opportunity to you know, the fifth baseball game I ever did at the major league level was the one heavis no hitter and we'll hit her. That's crazy. That's still crazy to me. And then of course all the NBA stuff that's happened. But we're very privileged to have those moments and be right there alongside history. It's fantastic and the two of
you had great moments. Awesome was the announcer Jinks in play within the Heavies no hitter. Did you avoid mentioning it as it was going on, or did he say, hey, he doesn't given up anything yet you got to report the story. Well, it was a little different back then, you know, we were kind of well. I was sitting next to Mike Eagan, the world champion, right and in the seventh thing, I said,
what do we do? And he said, don't mention? So this is my fifth game now, and you know I'm gonna defer to Mike, so I don't mention it, and neither did he. I mean the line scores over the pitcher full screen. I mean, you know you have to be I don't know what you'd be doing if you didn't know what was going on. If I had it to do over again, I and I did get a few other opportunities. Higea in Kansas City came close, and I used the language a little better the second time, and kind of you know,
took people on that word journey. But I remember getting back to Milwaukee the next day and the media, you know, was questioning whether that was the right thing to do. And I went to the ballpark that night, and but Seeley said, don't worry about that. He said he got it, didn't he. You know, I'll never forget that. You know, it probably wasn't the right thing to do back then. It was a little different. Today. You couldn't get away with that at all. And whenever the
Brewers are close, my phone blows up. They have a no hitter in the simthinning, and you know, they want me to fans want me to tune in and see what happens. And you know, they had the combined no hitter, but Gwan still has the only single picture no hitter. He was But yeah, so that was that was interesting. You have to talk about it. And you couldn't get away with that today. But I deferred to Mike, and you know, it's a good story. Well, those
baseball guys, they don't. I I was working with Rock. It was Chris Bryant. He had just been called up by the Cups and he had had a like the previous week, and there, you know, there was all this hype about him. And I mentioned uh at the beginning. As a boy, you know, it's a matter of time. He hasn't hit one out yet. It's a matter of time, and he's he turns and stairs daggers and here it. Ryott watches one over the wall and left and
then all like I'm done. But no, it's no, it's no matter what you do in those situations, you're gonna somebody's gonna somebody's gonna love it, somebody's not. How did that come about the opportunity with the Brewers for you, Jim Well, I mean, it was very strange. I had only worked local sports news. I was at the Channel six and I had worked with a person who was behind the scenes named Lyle Sulsey, and he moved over to Channel eighteen. And then there was an opening and I got
a phone call. I'm at my desk and Lyle called and said, would you consider doing the Bucks and the Brewers? I mean, you know, are you kidding me? Let me think about that? Sure? I didn't even think about it. I said yes I would, And people said,
are you sure you're making the right decision? And I, you know, I couldn't understand why they were asking me that, but you know, I rolled the bones a little bit on now and it turned out Okay, I didn't know what I was doing at the beginning, and I had to learn how the fly, and that's how it happened for me. Each one of us has a different story on how the doors open, but mine was a crazy phone call and two sports at the same time, which was wow,
ridiculous. Yeah, I mean that almost never happens. And you're exactly right, Pash. If people ask all the time, well, how did you get started? Or can I follow that same path? There's no single path in this business, and it's a lot There are a lot of intangibles involved, timing and everything else to get to where you eventually end up. But
no two paths are the same. So it's very hard when kids ask that, and you know, you try to tell them what, well I imagined, why I did this, this and this, But that doesn't apply to tape because that was two thousand years ago. You know that would be out of context today. But at any rate, you get to the Bucks and you team up with Johnny mac John McLaughlin, a member of the world Champion Bucks of the early seventies with Louel Sindor in company, a legendary team to
this day, and you guys made up a legendary broadcasting team. It seemed to me from the outside looking in. And I never really ran into you guys on the road, but you guys seem to be really close to, really good friends to just spend a lot of time off camera together. What was that relationship? Like, Well, you two would understand this more than anybody in our business. They throw two or now maybe three people together, and you know, they wonder if it's going to work, and sometimes it
does. And that's what happened with John and me. It just worked, and we were close. We were close for a long long time, still are to this day. Things change over. I mean we worked together for twenty eight years, almost thirty years, twenty eight years exclusively and then the last two years others were involved a little bit as John took some time off. But yeah, we we were very close. We spent a lot of time, you know, going to dinners, and we spent a lot of
time talking on airplanes, and we were close. We did things when we were back in Milwaukee on occasion, and then Ted Davis came in and John and Ted kind of, you know, did their thing a little bit, and there was some other stuff going on and but but yeah, we're still close to this day. I just talked to John a couple of weeks ago.
We stay in touch, and that was really magical and and such again a great stroke of luck for me, because I showed up every night at the beginning, not knowing what I was doing, and I was concentrating on that, and I never had to think about or be concerned about what John was going to bring. It was there every single night for thirty years. And what great blessing that is for people in our position right right, It was great. And so I can't say enough about the man. He's doing
well, and I think he's enjoying his retirement. He's staying closer to home than I ever before. But he's in great spirits and doing very well.
I think folks would like to hear. I mean, we all go through really good seasons in the case of both of you guys, you know, championship seasons of NBA and obviously the Lombardi Trophy, but we probably all you know, you do this a certain number of years, you go to have really tough years for the team that you cover, right, Jim, I can't remember the exact year, but it was back in the day when maybe thirty to forty games were televised, and I think early in the year the
Bucks won a game and I think that might have been it. I think it was a year where what year was that? Yeah, I think I told you that story. Bill King, who was the pr director for the Bucks, came up to me at the end of the season, and I don't remember which year it was. We did thirty televised games, and at the end of the season he said, Jim, do you realize what you just did? I said, what are you talking about? He said,
you did Opening Night on the road. The Bucks won that game and they lost the next twenty nine on television, so they were one and twenty nine on games that we did. And I had no clue, no clue. I got into this business because I enjoyed the spectacle of sport. And I still have a book. It's the first book my parents bought for me. It was a sports illustrated coffee table book, and I keep it. It's kind of it's in decent shape, but not great shape, but I keep
that on my desk. It's a picture book from the fifties of all the sports around the world and the spectacle of sport is what attracted me. And so when you get into seasons. We had twelve straight seasons where the Bucks were struggling. My first three years with the Bucks, they had good teams and then they went downhill for a long period of time. And I just always approached it on you know what, it's a sporting event. There's another team on the floor, it's the NBA. What could be better? And
the spectacle is going to be there. Sports is beautiful because on any given day or night, you may see something you've never seen before, and you may see something that's never happened before. And so I always approached it mentally that way that no matter what the team situation is, just be ready for, you know, the spectacle of what you might experience and kind of look at it that way. So I never had any problem and John never did
either. He was always very up and energetic about the game of basketball and the NBA, and so that got us through a lot and hopefully the fans, you know, enjoyed that part of it. But I don't know how you would do it other than that, you know, if if you got into every game and you lived and died with it. We do a little bit, but you have to kind of control that because if you let your motions in your work be affected by what you're calling, could be a problem
for twelve straight years. In my case, Martin's knowing for people who don't do this to understand too, right, even medias like certain media folks, they don't. And I could not agree with you more. Yeah, you want to see the Bucks win, the Brewers, Packers, Badgers, all that, but if you let that dictate your life, it's well, good luck with that. Well. Players have to deal with that, and so do we, right, I mean, we have to be professional. We have to get our job done. We have to be in the right I
call it a slot. We have to be in the slot every night. And you can't get too high or low in and out of that slot. You have to figure out where your slot is and stay there. You know, guys, it's interesting because I had a chance in Chicago obviously to do the Jordan Bulls. But after that and Jim, you'll remember very clearly the Bulls really were. They sucked, They were awful, and as matter of fact, they haven't been close to really good in a long time. Maybe
Derek Rose for a brief moment before he blew out his knee. Those clubs. Tom Thibodeau was the coach they should have kept, and now he's doing a bang up job with an injury riddled New York Knicks team in the playoffs. But they were terrible. Jerry Krouse thought he could rebuild this thing on the fly at all these draft picks that traded Pippin and rob Bit and everybody else. And Jordan didn't come back, and they he ran Phil Jackson out
of town, the whole bit, and it just it's amazing. But we had some really bad years where I mean, I don't know, they won ten twelve games or something like that, and I just remember when we would do a game, I always kind of said, Okay, this game on this night is going to be It's like, okay, we don't know that they're two and twenty five, all right, We're just going to do this game, and you know, hey, if they do well, if they're winning, then you kind of build that game. So each game kind of
is its own canvas and you paint on that. Especially in seasons, you know, this is really something to kind of focus on that game how don't if that makes sense to you, Jim or not, Well, absolutely, I think you know, I don't know if fans appreciate the cliche one game at a time. It's so worn out that you know, people disregarded, but it's really true. It's true for players you have to have a short memory. You have to show up after yesterday and especially in baseball, and
and do today's game. And you have to approach it like everything's great, and sometimes it might turn out that way if you approach it like that. It's just a matter of it's being a professional and it's understanding what your role is. And so I never really had a problem with that. I was excited to work every night, no matter what the record was. Both of you. Yeah, you have to always say at the approach that if someone's going to tune in, chances are that person actually works for a living.
We don't, you know. I've always disputed that people say, you know, beats working. We work in a different way. Yes, we do work. Let's not let people understand think that we don't work, because I know how hard you work to do what you do. It's not physical labor, but it's it's a mental exercise and it's a craft that we do work at and I'm proud of that, and I'm proud of the people that do
it. And you know, you guys understand that we joke about not having a real job, but if you do it right, it's a real job. Yeah, well said. I keep trying to tell people that. They don't believe me. They just think, yeh tip, you know, yeah, we're at the toy department, and we can't dispute part of it. But you know that toy department can be aligned, the toys can be in the right spots, and you you know, after everybody goes through looking for
toys, you have to straighten it up again. Right. That's yep, that's what we do. And I don't diminish the amount of mental work and preparation that goes into it. It's it's really pretty phenomenal. And the test is that most people who do this at a high level tend to make it look easier than it is. Yeah, yeah, I would agree with that. And you know it's funny, guys. I think you could say this about a number of professions, okay, but you certainly can say it about
our profession. If you love what you do. It's not really the same kind of work as if I don't know, Like my uncle was on shift work at the paper mill year after year after year. We couldn't wait to retire. There are a lot of people I know that are like they're you know, I have an attorney friend like that. It just can't wait to get to retirement type of thing. But if you love what you do, I think that's where people get misconstrued a little bit. And it's not like
you're working a day in your life. Yeah you're working, but you'll love the work you're doing. And that's a whole different ballgame. Well, I don't think it's a job as much as it's a passion. Yeah, And when you have a passion for something, no matter what that is. You can have a passion for law, you can have a passion for engineering, you can have a passion for anything. Well, when you have a passion, then it takes away that quote work aspect to it because you can't wait
to get to the passion the next day. And we're all lucky. Sports gives us that and it's a great blessing. We talked about the you know, the tougher years but the championship season, Jim, which was obviously your last working with the Bucks, when did you think it was the previous year? Maybe early that year, When did you truly believe that that Bucks team had the chops to go all the way? That's a great question, Matt. That started for me when they were beaten by Toronto in twenty nineteen.
They were up tow to zero in that series, then lost four straight games. They got a little happy, in my opinion, they you know, weren't quite as focused after I think they'd won ten games at that point in the Eastern Conference Finals, they went up to nothing and probably thought that they were going to cruise through that and get to the finals. Well, it didn't turn out that way. And after that happened, in my mind,
I'm going, Okay, this is a big turning point. Are they going to learn from that and are they going to you know, buckle down here and make something happen? And two years later they did. It could have gone the other way. I mean, that could have unraveled the team. Annis wasn't going to let that happen. I mean, that was a hard lesson. So it started there and then during the championship season. Very early on, I felt and I talked about it on the earth, I felt
like they had everything in place. It was just an odd year because COVID was still in play and we were doing games remotely and all of that, and so it was an odd year. I wasn't even at the championship game because I had COVID. I got COVID when the team went to Phoenix for the first two games in that series in the finals, So everything was just all over the place. But I felt early on that season that with Drew
Holliday, they had what it took to win a championship. And then he was cruise to me, and I talked about this throughout the course of the year. The most masterful job of blending into an alpha dog team that I've ever seen. He did that so seamlessly. I don't even think Giannis knew what was going on the way. He was working it, working at working it. And when they got to the finals, Drew Holiday was not only stirring that drink, he was drinking that drink with them, and he got
them to that point. God did Jim. I just this was the next point I was going to bring up. You took it right out of my mind. I'm watching the Celtics last night and Drew Holliday and I'm saying to myself, you know, I understand everybody understated. You can got a chance to get a talent like Damian Lillard, you go out and get him. But the problem for the Bucks was they had to give up Drew Holiday and what so you understand on paper that looks like an okay deal, but you
go behind the scenes exactly what you just said. That chemistry piece that he brought. He was the final piece of chemistry. And I'm on the outside looking into the Bucks, but I'm really your Bucks teams. I've followed very closely because I really enjoy watching them play, and I've been so disappointed the last two seasons because I like to watch the Bucks into May and June. You know what I mean, I'm really missing the fact they go out in
the first round. As a fan, but I thought Holiday was the final piece of that championship in what he brought. Yeah, he was a good one of the better perimeter defenders in the league, no doubt about that. And they need that because they're not a good defensive team. But they needed that. But I thought the glue he brought and in you just so eloquently demonstrated it and enunciated it. That's what I think made them a championship team.
And when they lost him, did they get a better player and Lillard go, yeah, probably statistically, but what they lost they couldn't replace. And I never felt this year that they were on the right track. Well, I'm a defensive guy. I always think that you have to have defense to win in most ports and certainly in the NBA, and set aside the unbelievable intangibles I just spoke of with Drew Holliday in the first year in the
championship season and last year. What they missed this year with him, in my opinion, was that maybe one second or split second situation point of attack where he slows everything down. He slows the ball down. And I'll say it this way. Earlier in the season, when brook Lopez was blocking shots,
they were going out of bounds. He was moving into position to get the block, and that second that Holliday used to buy him at the top allowed brook Lopez to be in position for the block shot and then he could control the block shot. Margins in all sports are very narrow, very small, very critical, and that one second on the ball was crucial. And that's what I saw early this year. They were lacking that. They never
really had it. They tried to cover it up what you can do, but you know, they lost something defensively that that holiday, and frankly a couple other players gave them two So that was that was a big deal this year. I didn't think they had the defense down the way they added in the championship year to the point where they could rely on it again to uh to win a championship. They have the talent to win a championship, but that defense was lacking in my opinion this year. Yeah, all of that
and then Yannis not able to go in the playoffs. People who have any familiarity with the Bucks know the relationship that you and Giannis were able to build. Do you still I know you do a few things every year for the organization, appearances for them. Do you still stay somewhat in touch with the honis here even post post career. You know, I enjoy talking about this
because people think that we're like this. They think Giannis and I are like McLaughlin and I, and the truth is we were around each other every day. But we spoke in an interview situation why a year before the seasons, and they would have to stop us. We'd go two hours and say, hey, you know, we have to you know, guys, we have to stop this, and neither one of us knew how long we'd been talking, and we didn't want to stop. So we developed the relationship that way.
I'm around the team. I did fifteen events for them this year, just to interview situations with John Horace. More sponsor related, no game related stuff, just sponsor events and that sort of thing. I spoke to Giannus once I was walking by and he stopped and shooting and shook my hand, and then I saw him at an event outside of I I serve form. But that's it. Do we talk about all the time, No, when we talked. Are we comfortable with each other? Absolutely, But so that's
kind of interesting. I always kept a buffer between myself and players, you know, I just I just made that distance always be there because I would have had to talk about if you become real close friends with players, then you have to talk about what they're doing wrong, and that doesn't work. And then over thirty five years do you know how many players have left the bus. All my friends would have moved away. So always just kept that buffer and it allowed me to do my job in a way that was you
know, Freese, your mind up to do the job properly. You don't have to think about you know, his is his wife going to be upset or his girlfriend going to be upset? Sometimes thereon, no matter what you say. But I just always kept that distance. And I'm sure both of you have a similar way of doing that too. You just have to keep a little buffer there. But you know, if we ran into each other on the street, we would stop and hug and talk and we had our
moments. What he did after they won the championship, when he put on the T shirt at the podium was just I mean, I can't even describe that. I get tears in my eyes thinking about it. You know, my son was in Austin, Texas, and his neighbor called because my son couldn't talk on the phone. He was crying when he saw that, and you know, just a moment and then you know we turned it down Green
night and so those were great things. But to think that we are going to launch every week, No, we don't have to get you professional situation. And the only time it's ever happened in my career is with you, honest, and that's a credit to him. I think, Yeah, it's he seems to he got through to me. Yeah, yeah, you know,
I'm fans. You know. The hardest team to get close to is an NFL football team, because you get I don't know, forty five minutes in the locker room at lunchtime or something, and you can see him on the practice field, but you don't really unless you do an event with them outside of the team situation, you don't really get close to a football team. I noticed Jim traveling with baseball teams. You're on the plane with them constantly. You're there every day, you're at the batting cage. You get
pretty close to those guys and they get close to you. Vin Scully, though, espoused your thinking in that the great Dodger announcer said he would never go down. You'd never see him at the batting cager rarely. He did not want to get close to the players because it would impact how he had to call the game. And so what you just said was the Vin Scully rule. Two of the tea basketball teams, you know, you can kind of get close to them as smaller group. You've got fifteen guys you know
in the coaching staff. You so you get close to those teams. But football and man, I don't know. I know you travel with the teams. I know you probably closer. My guess is you'd be closer to basketball players than you would be the football team because there's just so many people on a football operation and it's so regimented. It seems like, yeah, yeah, that get true. When I did college football, you knew him a little bit, but not anywhere near the level that you get to know baseball
and basketball players. In basketball, you know, I was at practice almost every day. I was at shoot arounds all the time, on the road and on the buses on the planes. But I'd walk from the front of the bus to my seat in the back or my seat in the back of the plane and sit down. And Janis always asked me to come up and play cards with him so he could take my money, but not one time. That's not our job, that's not our role. So you know,
keep your money. I'll keep my money, and you take other people that big NBA per d of Yeah, yeah, yeah, I tell honest was great because you know, some guys, I mean, I've I've stepped over a lot of money on a plane, but Giannis plays for little tanny amounts, you know, like whatever, ten twenty dollars maybe, But he's a smart guy. He's not going to give his money away, but he wants
yours. And so you know, I just I just stayed to myself and I always told myself, I'm a guest on that airplane, I'm a guest on that bus. And I tried to act accordingly, and it worked pretty well for me. And I've watched people who didn't do it that way, and frankly it doesn't work as well. Yeah, well, what thing it's not about us, right exactly? One thing. One thing that I've found through the year is what a part of the beauty of getting older. I
can't relate to those guys anyway. College guys eighteen used to be eighteen to twenty two, I guess nowadays more like eighteen to twenty four. You know, I'm sixty two. It's not like they're going to really care what I'm doing in my world. Going to bed at nine thirty or ten o'clock if it's not a game night. And those guys are, they're young, and they've got their own they've got their music. They listen to that I have no idea what it is. So that makes it a little bit easier still
even now, to create that buffer. But aren't we lucky that we spend our entire adult lives around young men and young women. And yes, if you young in the NBA, you know that league is they all are now. But the NBA has always been a driver of fashion, of music, of trends of everything. And you know, just look at us. We're bunch. We're three old guys here and we didn't look that old. We
don't shame that old. You know, they keep us young. You know, I'm near oldest and I don't and they're not doing it's got a job with me anymore. But they do keep you young. It does, and it's your thought process. It's who you think you are. And I the same way as you guys are saying, know, yeah, they keep you kind of young. So I think I'm like, I don't know, thirty some years old, thirty or something, And then I look at a picture to say, who the hell's that old guy there. Oh wait a minute,
it's me. That's what I really looked like. My bonny tell the Amber seventy three, and my mind tells me I'm thirty five or forty, and yeah, exactly know what I will take that at this point, I will yeah, yeah. You guys have both called college games Jimmy were called Bill Wisconsin football and basketball. If I would have told you then, and weighing same question to you, if I told you then that in today's world
of college athletics. There was a story earlier this week of a guy who's transferred from Utah State to Washington, where he will make upwards of two million dollars, or about the equivalent of the thirtieth overall pick coming up in this year's NBA draft. If I'd have told you that that money would be available, what would you have said? Well, it's kind of been going toward that, and now we have the unionization situation, right, It's interesting,
it'll be intriguing to watch what happens. I mean, it's pretty crazy. I have a wild idea, and you know about if they come to college and just work and play football and get a scholarship that they can use anytime. If they go to the NFL, you know, they can use it later if they want to or whatever. But you know, the blend now gets tricky for me. Now you have a two million dollar quarterback. Is he really thinking about chemistry? Yeah? I mean, is somebody ordering him
to go to class? Yeah? I mean, so, you know that's the part that I mean. If I'm if I'm getting paid two million dollars, I'm gonna try to keep getting paid two million dollars. And so to me, that's gonna be the trick. Is you're asking an awful lot of people when you put money on top of a college situation in terms of athletics and academics. To me, yeah, it's a different game, and it's kind of more I think it's evolving into more of a pro type of situation.
I know, also, Matt, the NCAA is trying to get this genie back into the bottle. I don't know if that's possible, but you know they're working with some of the major conferences to try to come up with a plan. Okay, let's figure we're gonna pay the players. Let's just figure out how to do it. Because you know, there's only so much money donors, and you've hit donors and you get donor fatigue and everything else is becoming a term now. I don't know how it's going to pan out.
I do know this, The impact we saw in the NFL Draft was I thought fairly acute. There were fifty two early entry entries into the NFL Draft. On a lot of years they're one hundred plus. Okay, so people, but kids are staying in school longer because number one, they're making money. Number Two, if they're going to be a second round draft choice or third round raft choice this year, maybe stay in a year another year, and maybe they're a first or second round draft choice the following year type
of thing. And oh they're still getting They're making money and maybe making more than they'd make as a fourth or fifth round draft choice. So that's happening. But on the other side of that, you got all these transfers and nobody there's no team building, And as a fan, I have trouble. Matt and I have talked about this, Jim, I have trouble following. I like what Greg Guard did with Wisconsin the past two years, brought back
the bulk of that team, added a player here or there. But now everything scatters And you know, if I was a Duke fan they had a really good season, they lose what eight of their top ten players. Well, they've got this big class coming in, but you know what I mean, it's hard to grow as a fan with these teams. It's all about one year. It seems like. Well, the NBA at at one point
tried to change things so that players stayed with their teams. You could make more money to stay with your team, so they wanted the identity that team building gives franchises and leagues. If people don't know where players are and they're confused, the stickiness again, I'll use that term because that's a term that's used in television and for advertising and everything else. The stickiness isn't there,
and so it's very interesting. I mean high school kids now, didn't Wisconsin just decide that they weren't going to allow nil for high school or Yeah, they turned it down. I think a lot of states though, have given that the green light, but not here. To me, that's I mean, that's crazy. You know, it just changes it so much. I've always been kind of suspect regarding the true amateurism in our country. I mean, I don't think there has been such a thing at the college and Olympic
level. It's really not amateurism in my view, and this exposes all of that. It's in the open now. So that's a good thing, I guess. But Matt, you could talk to this more than I can for sure. Is it a good thing? I don't know. Yeah, I've always thought that play maybe not all he's been from the last at least twenty years or so. I thought players should get something. I mean, how many times in the local bookstore on Cambus you'll see a jersey with rod Dan's
number, you know, thirty three. But he didn't get anything from that. You know the problem. And everybody in athletics, I think who paid any attention could see this coming when all of this hit, which is in il. The green light for that was July of twenty twenty one, so almost three years ago, and that coupled with the transfer portal. They had this pie in the sky mentality that it can't be a recruiting inducement, and we're all biting our lips and try to, you know, keep from laughing.
Of course it is. You know, it's not supposed to be paid for play. Well guess what. So, yeah, it's it now. Did it accelerate faster than some people thought? Yeah? I think Greg Guard admitted that a couple of weeks ago, where you know, you try to have a certain amount of money for in il, and it turned out that they needed maybe two or three times that total, So it accelerated faster.
But I think what they're going to end up doing, guys, is there's going to be revenue sharing, so schools will directly pay athletes and that will whatever that total is, however, many millions of dollars per school. But you're still going to have an eye on top of that. I would think an athletes still has the ability to go out and if there's a you know whatever business, you could go indoors for that. I mean, it's it just got like a lot of things. The idea originally Jim made sense.
It just it was like a wildfire. It got out of control in a big hurry. And now, you know, unlike professional sports like baseball doesn't have it. But the NBA, in the NFL is a cap. You know, we're they're playing without a cap right now. So if you don't have it all the money in the world doesn't guarantee you're gonna win championships, but not having much money at all all but guarantees that you have a little, if any chance. Well, it's free agency now, right. The
portal airshone that it's total free agency in college sports. You know, as you're talking, I'm thinking about the difference between in the NBA and other sports. Baseball you get a salary and then at the end of the year you get a check for the merchandise sales. In total. Oh, it's kind of an escro situation on that side. Maybe they could figure out a way
to funnel money to players. I don't I don't know if you can do it equally or how you would do that, but there's there are different levels of income usually and maybe they can figure out a way to you know, get Ron Dain a little money for that jersey being sold. You know,
that could be a merchandise category. But I mean, right now you have total free agency, and uh, you know, it's pro sports in my view, I mean, it sure looks like it's from here, Yeah, I know, you're right, You're right, Jim kind of wrap things up here and Jim Pasky our guest the Lay via the pay podcast. Jim, what do you see going forward with the Bucks? And I know you're still following that, the whole situation and everything. A couple of disappointing playoff runs
since the championship. Where can this team go because they're up against it on the cap and that type thing, and what do you foresee here? Well, winning a championship in many ways makes life more difficult or general managers and owners. It gets very expensive. They are a second apron team now, and they've also left a large amount of revenue on the table after being ousted from the playoffs in the first round two years in a row. So the
math is getting very difficult. Right, you're not taking in the revenue when you get beaten the first round, and you have costs that are that require that revenue. And now we're talking about patients. What kind of patients and deep pockets do you have to keep playing this out? And how long is the window going to stay open? They went from being a very young team when they won the championship three years ago to now they're one of the oldest
teams in the league. That's in three years. So again, the margins are very slight, it's very very delicate. It's it's difficult. I'm watching how this all unfolds. We have the situation with John Horst and Detroit and you know, all of that going on, and who's going to be leading the team and we'll see, but I know it's not going to get easier. They'll find their way through this. But the ownership then there's you know, Jimmy Aslam came in and now there's a new voice on that level of
the organization too, So there's a lot of moving parts. There are a lot of difficulties going on right now, and they just have to figure out how to do it. In terms of restocking the team, the draft choices are largely gone because they built this team with draft choices, So now you're going to have to get veteran minimum players that fit specific needs, and we
all know how difficult that is when you have to do that. Now you're down where your margins are extremely narrow and you can't make mistakes on that. The money, you know it works in your favor, but you know it's it's hard to get a great player for no money, and so that's kind of where they're going to have to build this up as they move forward, I think, but it's fascinating. People are going to get upset perhaps that you know, they didn't win two championships in three or four years. But
it's hard to do. And you know, some people are happy with one. I mean, I retired, so I'm happy with one. But you know, this team should probably win more than one. When you have your honest you win the first one, you have to validate it, you know. That's what most people would say, and hopefully they can do that, but it does not get easier. That's what we should be learning from all
of this. This was fun. Yeah, yeah, this was This was a fun trip down every laying great perspective and I like what you said of all the things we do actually work a little bit for a living sort of guy. Well, I mean we're in good shape, but we love what we do. And that's the key. I always tell kids, if you can find something that you love, your way ahead. Well, yes, no doubt, Jim Pasky, thank you so much for taking time out with its spend it. It's been like an hour. But listen, you know
I could go on and on, but come back next year. Well, yeah, we have more questions for you, and we'd love to get your perspective on things moving forward as we get toward the next NBA season. I'd be happy to join the two of you anytime. Thank you. This has been a great pleasure for me, and you know, hopefully people can see things through our eyes a little differently. You know, we we know what we're going through and we love every minute of it, and it's fun to
share that with you guys. So thanks. The Lyrivial of Pay podcast is presented by u W Credit Union. Here for for you. That was fun catch it up with Jim Pashky, not only a legendary broadcaster, but just a just a really good guy. You know, I said, I meant
what I said at the beginning of that interview. He was one of the first over in Milwaukee, Jim, or one obviously would be in that group where I work with him a little bit, the OLDWTMJ days with the Badgers, and but Jim was one of the free maybe because he had worked in Madison and he was relatively new with the Bucks and the breweries at that point. But just you know, our path has never crossed a ton, but it was always very cordial just just a really, really good guy, just
so happy to see his career unfold the way it did. It was really just a terrific broadcasting career. Yeah, it really was. And he's such a class individual. And you know, in our business man there are times when things go well and things don't go so well. But whether it was a good time in his career or maybe not so good a time, Jim Paskey handled everything with class and dignity, and you have to respect that in addition to the fact that he was a terrific broadcaster, because you don't have
a career that long if you're not good. And he was excellent at what he did, especially with the Bucks that obviously is television work with the Brewers as well. But no, it's really good to catch up with him. This is our last of the season, our last podcast of the season, folks. We'll pick it up with you again in August. And mathis kind
of the off season. I know spring football is over now, and you know you're probably going to be spending some off season time away from Madison a little bit, you know, tell us a little bit about what you have going. Yeah, we've got as we speak right now, or I call it the North Woods Bureau Dark Cabin in Bilas County that we're doing some work ont up here, so we try to get up here where we can. I've got an Ohio trip. You'll appreciate this, I know, as you
continue getting your back in order. A lot of fellow broadcasters in the Big Ten we've been getting together like the last three or four summers for some really bad golf, bad jokes, and good cocktails. So this year's edition will be at Ohio State Paul Keels, who we both know well. He is our cordial host. So that'll be late next week leading up into Memorial Day weekend. So I guess the family time there as well. But yeah, it's the time to do it, you know. I keep tabs on the
portal, you know who. They're picking up football and basketball along the way. But it's kind of a getaway times as well. I don't know how this works in the NFL now with OTAs and you have the fun stuff, but hopefully you get a little bit of time away from that too. Right. OTA start next week and they're basically three days of on field work for the players, and I usually go to at least one of those practices.
Larry will see all three of them, but that happens for the next three weeks, and then there's the mandatory mini camp, which essentially by then Matt Lafleur probably runs two days of full out practice in and then they kind of let them go maybe a little early, or they do a bonding thing or something like that, but that'll wrap it up in by mid June, but you know, the Packers will be pretty much done and then they'll have like
a five or six week period where you know, they're off until training camp begins. I'm thinking somewhere around the twenty fourth of July. That's not a date officially or anything like that, but I'm just guessing, and then the preseason begins. But yeah, you're right, we're coming up on that window. It's a great time of year for you and I. We get to be fans watching other sports and get to do things, yeah, work around
the house and the yard and everything else. And for me, hopefully in July I'll be trying to swing a golf club again and seeing what that's like. But you know, it's I kind of relish this time of year, man, But I also you know, I get a little antsy. I don't know about you, but by the time we get into July, I'm thinking, Okay, shouldn't we be getting back into this thing now? You know? Yeah, my wife actually tells me that, like, shouldn't you
be getting back any I get out of here on my phrase. Yeah, I definitely enjoy the downtime. You know, we're putting together some content and there's some stuff that we'll be doing over the summer for both football and basketball. But it's not it's not really heavy lifting. But yeah, the body clock kind of tells us when it gets Yeah, when you get to that third week or so at July, that it's probably about time to get things cranked up. But we know all that works that'll get here before we know.
Yeah, it does. The off season flies by, that's for sure. Well, Matt, listen to take care of things up at the Northern Bureau there with the big people you have coming in, and you never know, you might have to have an nil party there at some point. I don't know, Yeah, but good luck with all of that. Special thanks to our guest Jim Pasky, the legendary television voice of the Milwaukee Brewers, our producer, engineer is Dave McCann, our executive producer Jeff Tyler for MAP,
This is Wayne. Thank you very much for listening to the Laravian La Pay podcast and we'll talk again in August. This has been the Larravian La Pay Podcast, presented by UW Credit Union, Here for every you. The Larvian La Pay podcast is a production of iHeartRadio Podcasts and is produced and engineered by Dave McCann with coordinating assistant Ajma Sewer. Be sure to listen and to
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