Ep. 383: TLF's Tribute to Virgil (Part 2)

We continue on the verge the laps fans hold, sorry the hell? Oh no, okay, go ahead, we continue on the verge the lapsed fans. One of a kind tribute to Mike, Virgil Jones boss, and we reconvened with everybody that we could find that could recollect the bachelor party we did twenty twelve or Virgil walk through those doors. What a blast to catch up

with those guys and see it through their eyes. Oh totally. I mean that's that's kind of it, like the to see it through you know, because I mean we've I've talked about it with them, but to actually watch it and revisit it, I can also have. Really, I'll tell you what the most surprising thing is is because you know how oftentimes your memory will make things come across as more inaccurate. It's like, you know, you remember things a certain way. Yes, everything that happened is exactly how I

remembered it. Wow, which is wild. And I was so surprised about the little nuances I forgot, most importantly that Virgil was the one who wanted to go out to eat afterwards, and we were actually not intending to do that. I always tied it up in my mind with the idea that he was haunting us for meat sauce the whole night at the cigar bar. And so we just acquiesced afterwards. But it was really a thing where we were ready to split and he wasn't. Yeah, he was not. He's like,

I mean food and yours for brilliantly. That's the most Virgil thing possible. Yes, And so as we ended our recollection of that memorable night on a poetic note, now it's time to grapple, if you will, with the n ring career of Virgil and what it was he did on WWF television that would have caused us to want to pay him to come to a bachelor party all those years later. Yeah, I'm sure by the time this one's over, people are going to get it right. Yeah. So absolutely,

it's about a lot of things. But we have to figure out where the man came from. First. We have we have to establish how Michael Jones became Virgil and who Michael Jones was. And do you think that would be an easy task for a carneie like this guy. Oh no, no, it's not. It's a fucking it's a fucking hassle. A Yeah, enlisted you on this one, which was great because you were able to find quite a bit yourself. Yeah, in terms of trying to track down anything genealogical,

anything you know, in terms of like the places he's been. And as a lot of people may have seen upon and we've mentioned it, Virgil's passing just a couple of days ago. A few days ago, there was reporting out through his management team confirming that the birth date everybody had had for Virgil all these years was was inaccurate, that in fact he wasn't born in sixty one or sixty two, but in fact was born, according to his

management team, in nineteen fifty one. And now we went through, as you heard on part one, the emails that we exchanged with Virgil to get him to come to the bachelor party. And of course, when you book a flight ticket for somebody, you need their date of birth, right, Oh my fucking Christ. And he gave us the nineteen sixty one day of birth. So say what you will, whether that's a cafe birthdate or not, it was enough for him to confidently have us book an airline ticket for

them. That says a lot about the security around taking the date of birth in the first place. I don't even know why they bother. But I'm here to tell you as we look back on the life and times of not only Virgil but Mike Jones, I'm here to tell you, yes, that

there's reason to believe that Virgil got paper on two different birthdays. That it's not just that he lied to people throughout the course of his life, but that he actually had reason to change the year of his birth because well, if you knew his real birth date, you might be able to connect why all of a sudden, what seemed to be a very, very promising football career disappeared into thin air, and why Virgil an interview after interview over the

course of his life, particularly in the latter stages of his life when he was a hot interview. Yet for wrestling geeks, sure, Sam Roberts, across the spectrum of wrestling websites, he never told even a shoot interview he did with our video, which, of course, those are always predicated on, like tell us where you grew up, tell us when you first saw pro wrestling, tell us what your parents were like? Yeah, a blank slate. Nobody really knows what the hell Virgil did growing up. He write

what endeavors he sought to pursue before taking on pro wrestling. It's clear from his ar video shoot interview that he did not set out to be a pro wrestler for his whole life, that he was only vaguely familiar with it. Feinstein asks him, like, who are your favorites, and he says Sam Artino because he's from Pittsburgh. But you can tell he didn't watch wrestling.

He barely cared about it. He makes passing reference to getting involved with a boxing promoter early in his athletic career and apparently training to box, if not having some boxing matches, and it was that promoter recorded in virgil Or video that put him in touch with the Wild Siamoans saying hey, you know what, you could be a pro wrestler too, that that might work for you, mm hmm, and Virgil realizing he had quite the physique, and I'd

imagine that boxing background is what led to them putting the boxing trunks on him. When he turned babyface right, got with the Wild Samoans and trained there and was, according to Virgil at least a well liked pupil of Afa and Cicca, and went on in the business with their tutelage at his back. Mm hmm, but we don't know anything about his upbringing. We talked about how I mentioned rather in Part one about how I had this sense that he

came from a military family, and a rather strict military family. But as I was going through his interviews and stuff in preparation for this, I couldn't really find much string to pull there, and I was like, Wow, where do I get this idea that he's from a military family. And then we go back and listen to the audio of what he told us all at the bachelor party, and he mentioned, right, that was a Navy seal, right, which probably means he was an Air Force general or something which

didn't exist at the time. Let's not get into that. But yeah, everybody's dad was a Navy seal, I'll don't you get right down to it too, and mine too. And he was in the reserve. It was the reserves, right, so whatever, And I'm sure he was. He was a decorated gentleman. Now, I don't know what kind of records you have at your fingertips, boss, but you were able to discern who you basically think his father was, right, Yes, more or less, let

me bring up the the family tree I was creating. So we're working on understanding, and it comes from I based it off of you know, you know, I used the the uh, the Watchman call it the uh. It's fine. No one cares Wikipedia as as kind of a reference point, just to kind of see if there was if there was there, and and so I was like, okay, I used the names, and a lot of it was kind of it was kind of, you know, a little a lot of guesswork, because there's not real there's not a lot out there,

and he has the most common name on the planet Earth. I know, seriously, Michael, Michael Jones, like, are you fucking kidding me? But I was able to find and I used the idea that you know what you said about him being potentially in the navy, and I found a Warren Wilbert Jones senior. And I knew he was a senior too, again based on the Wikipedia, because there was a Warren junior and he was in the military, and so I kind of figured out that and who this this

this Warren Wilbert Jones. Again, I'm not one hundred percent sure, but it's the best guest that I have is was born June thirtieth, nineteen sixteen, died September seventeenth, nineteen ninety two, which kind of fits the timeline too. Yeah, you know, it works. It works to have someone who was born, you know, either in the fifties or the sixties. So according to Virgil, he had a you know, rather strict upbringing.

We didn't get a lot of detail out of them about it, but yeah, this was before well Wikipedia existed, you know, of course it existed, but I don't know, it probably wasn't as robust. And I feel like this this string that we pulled on in researching Virgil's background, that he had attended Virginia Union, which had division to college and played football there. Yes, that revelation, as far as I can tell, while it's in his Wikipedia, only only came out in an interview that someone he was close

with did for for slam wrestling. I believe it was after his death, So I don't think that's been sitting in his Wikipedia page for very long, this reference to Virginia Union. Okay, and I'm thinking myself, why the

hell I'm googling this six ways from Sunday. I'm trying to find interviews that he's done over the course of his life where he talks about how he got into the business and what is his upbringing, was like, yeah, why doesn't he ever mention what seemed to be a very promising football career totally, Like, I mean, from what it looks like, I mean, I don't know. I don't want to. Obviously I have stuff that I sent you, but I don't know if you want to divulge that yet. I

don't want to break your rhythm. No, You're not gonna break my rhythm. No, this is definitely queuing you up in a lot of ways because you helped connect some pieces. So I'm like, you know what, Virginia Union, what is this? Tell the folks what you found about Virgil's gridiron exploits? Well, that's the thing he was. He was a pretty well rounded athlete. I mean, I found his high school number one. I found out that he went to Wilkinsburg High School in Wilkeinsburg, Pennsylvania's it's just

outside of same same county as Pittsburgh. And you know in his yearbook, Like I found a fucking year book. Oh yeah, and it's him. You can tell by his face yeah, you can tell. I mean he's got it's the same, yeah, the same droopy eyes, he's got the same nose and you know, same head shape and everything. And he played basketball and football at at at Wilkinsburg High School and he and then he went to this this this college and it's I'll tell you something, there is something

fishy about the college thing because he's he's not really in the yearbook. He's in a little bit, but like it's not I had to really hunt to find him in the yearbook based on the years he would have been there when he was supposedly playing football. Because he's in the thing is in the same yearbook that he's playing football. He's not given a headshot like everybody else in the whole fucking school is given a headshot. And it's very weird. I

did eventually find him in one. I'm trying to see which yearbook it is. Oh yeah, and again this is high school, No, this is college. Now is now Virginia Union. Virginia Union is where to me it starts to get the little fishy in that he in that he's featured in athletic

team pictures, but he's not featured as a student very interesting. Virginia Union, a historically black college Baptist university in Richmond, Virginia, which which kind of aligns and tracks with with with kind of like his background, strict disciplinarian. You know, this is like a this is a pretty high level, pretty high level school. Yeah, totally with with with quite a heritage behind it. Yeah. You know, even if you look at the yearbook,

you get the sense it's a very buttoned up kind of place. Yeah, yeah, totally totally, not one that would necessarily tolerate a carnee in their midst even if you could play football very well. So, yeah, you're looking through this and I'm seeing these images of Yeah, that's Michael Jones, for sure, that's Virgil. You can't you can't doubt the yearbook pictures. So okay, why is it such a damn mystery? Then? Like, why doesn'tnybody know this about this guy? Here? It is, it's out

there, it's why in the open. And then you're you're looking at some of there's some newspaper coverage of some of his exploits on the football field where he showed a lot of promise. Yep, oh, I think there's an interception where you want to game or something like that. He was a defensive back. I believe cornerback. I believe cornerback. Yep, it's back. Maybe both, maybe both perhaps, And then you know, as you go, I'm like, whoa, you pulled an article from I think the Kansas

City Star. Yes, And this is where it really got weird, because read this article about Michael Jones and how far he got towards a potential career in the NFL, and yet we haven't heard anything about it. They were talking big time. Can you read that for the Solar system? Please right here, somebody pinched Mike Jones and tell him it's all for real, that he is actually standing in a huddle. Oh. I was gonna say, it sounds like it's about his wrestling career. No, it's not for real.

Tell him it's all for fake. With Emmitt Thomas, Jim Marsalis, Willie Lanier, and Buck Buchanan. Pretty heavy stuff for a rookie safety, isn't it, Especially for a free agent from Virginia Union, who only two months ago was notified to report to training camp with the Chiefs. Last Saturday afternoon in Liberty, Jones proved he can step in a step in fast company. When he emerged as a star of the Chief's first scrimmage, Jones swept

in for a couple of tackles on sweeps. Once breaking through a cordon of interference, he climacs the scrimmage by picking off an interception. The Chiefs coach liked the way Jones plays the game, they consider him a prospect despite a lack of speed desired for defensive backs. Jones was clocked by most scouts in college at four point eight or four point nine and was passed up for consideration as a free agent. It's my start, Jones explained yesterday. I really

moved faster on the field that my time shows. Jones makes up for a lack of top speed by hustling and concentrating on his assignments. I want my techniques and how to play my position. I try to put a hundred and

twenty percent into each play. One hundred percent is not enough. Jones said he had wanted to play pro football ever since taking up the game as a Pop Warner League player in Pittsburgh. But when I didn't, but when I didn't get drafted and didn't get any free agent offers, I decided to put thoughts of pro football aside and spend my time working for a degree. I knew then that no matter what happened, I would have my education. He said, I don't know which. I don't know which Virgil you're doing.

No, I know I'm slipping into the other. I'm slipping into you two of the other version. He wasn't a Southern man, let's you know. But he did happen, But I don't know. He did sound like it though, he be aw cb a c what are you Hermione Granger and fucking with the tongue between the teeth on the sea. Yeah. When I got my diploma, I thought about pro football again. I contacted the Chiefs. That was the only club, I wrote. I had always liked the chief

I'd followed them on television. And another thing, Willie Laniel was here, and he was originally from Virginia. Jones attended Wilkinsburg High in Pittsburgh and was a tailback and defensive back, but at five nine, one fifty eight,

he didn't attract much attention from college recruiters. The University of Pittsburgh glanced his way but decided his size wasn't major college caliber, so Jones considered the other offers from the likes of Field, Bethany of West Virginia, Shippensburg State, West Virginia State, and Virginia Union, the non headline schools that make the

Others section in the Sunday Scoreboard during the college. During college, Jones grew to six feet and one hundred and eighty seven pounds just completely naturally using weightlifting and stretching exercises. Does it say just completely naturally? In the article, no I added that, okay, well he was always very serious about saying you never did steroids, right, all right, Well, I don't know how you can add inches to your fucking body like that, but whatever,

you know, you're bone, don't you know. There's only so far they can go. But mostly, as they explained, I think it's just my time to grow. Apparently. Really, he also developed as a player, climaxing his career. They love that fucking climaxing. Yeah, that's one too many. Here, Kansas City Star, porn Star. Here the Kansas City porn Stars this career with eight interceptions. The Most Valuable Player Defensive award in

the Virginia College Is All Star Game and College Division All American Honors. Wow, now, how can how can he have gotten that far? I mean, I'm not suggesting that he had a decorated football career. I'm not suggesting that he even really had more than a cup of coffee within the the general radius of the NFL. But Virgil was not one, as we learned, to downplay anything he's ever accomplished in his life. Right, Virgil is one

to shove it in your face and to exaggerate it to the hill. He would take that article and by the time he was done with it thirty years later, you know, he was a backup like defenceman every Sunday on the sidelines. You never saw him because he never got much playing time, but he was there. He was always there, was the rudy. He was the rudy of whatever team. So what's going on here? How did Virgil get so far in terms of a potential NFL career and really just have like

an athletic background that he never talked about. I listened to the interviews. He never talks about it, really, and again the revelations about what college even went to didn't seem to really come out until his passing. And then

I remembered something. Oh boy, I remember that. Early in my research, I looked up the records of the information he provided us to book his flight for the bachelor party, and in addition to his date of birth, which I was able to find countervailing evidence of nineteen fifty one as opposed to sixty one and clearly the same guy based on the nature of the records I was looking at. Yes, I also had his middle name that It's not like his middle name has been a big mystery, but it's Charles, Yeah.

And I remembered searching for Michael Charles Jones No to get a sense, you know, because I'm thinking, you know, while Michael Jones is an incredibly common name, Michael, it's so common that if you were to be listed in a newspaper, you might go by Michael Charles Jones. M that's journalistic practice so that other people with that name don't potentially suffer, you know, reputational damage if the story's negative, for instance, by assuming it's the

wrong Jones. So it becomes common practice to use your middle name when you have such a common first and last name, particularly in publication, so it's to not great confusion until the reader precisely who it is that you're talking about. And I'm like, wait a minute, that Michael Charles Jones I read about? Was this is before I realized fifty one was the real date? How Michael Charles Jones I read about was thirty years old in nineteen eighty one?

Mmmm? Virgil wouldn't have been thirty years old and mmmmm nineteen eighty one because he was born in nineteen sixty one, right or sixty two? Mmmm? Why would Virgil want no one to know that Michael Charles Jones was thirty years old in nineteen eighty one? And when you told me that you found that article about how Michael Jones had gone out potentially for the Kansas City Chiefs, and was you know, essentially a semi pro football player, right or

at least he's on the the what do you call it? The like the workout team, right, squad to squad? Thank you? It clicked in m And it's when you told me that, I said, stand down if you want to protect the surprise he did say that that's a shoot. Because I realized that the Michael Jones I was reading about out of Pittsburgh, PA. What what year is that Kansas City Star article by the Way nineteen seventy five, that the Michael Jones I was reading about in Pittsburgh area newspapers in

nineteen eighty one, who is thirty? It's him, and it's it's a national story. It's picked up by the Associated Press. It is not a

small deal. It is Dare I say the kind of thing that you would change your date of birth for to avoid people being able to connect one in one his hometown paper Pittsburgh Post Gazette nineteen and eighty one, We learn the following the trial of a former Pennhills police officer and his cousin on heroin trafficking charges, Oh My God, is set to open Monday in US District Court.

Anthony Pope of Verona, who resigned from the force last February, and Michael Charles Jones, Oh My God of Monroeville, will go before Judge DONALDY.

Ziegeler on charges that they illegally possessed about two hundred and seventy five packets of heroin with the intent to distribute them when they were arrested April sixth at the twenty two Motel in Monroeville. The Proceedings will open with a motion by defense attorney Stanton D. Levinson and Edgar Snyder to prevent the U. S Attorney's Office from using his evidence the heroin seized in the arrest Edward H. Shied, a special agent for the Federal DEA. This was a DEA raid

only shack. This isn't like a traffic stop, local police department, you know, kind of small town deal. This is a fucking federal investigation. Said at a preliminary hearing that the heroine, a total of about four ounces with a street value of up to fifteen grand, was found in a car rented by Pope, which as we'll learn, was Virgil's cousin, when federal, state and the local police closed in from a stakeout. Levinson said he

will argue that the evidence was taken illegally and should not be used. Police did not have sufficient cause to arrest Pope, and Jones enacted in improperly in not getting a search warrant. Levinson said, without the heroine, the prosecution will have no case. He said. Pope twenty nine, who listed his address at Second av Varona, left the police force February twenty eighth to join his family in operating the Atmosphere Lounge and home Wood. That was just five

weeks before the arrest. Victor Cicero, Penhill's police to director, said at the time the arrest that Pope was a fairly normal officer. Ciceros declined to comment when asked if he was investigating Pope's work on the force. Pope had a thirty eight caliber revolver and his police badge with him when he was arrested. Oh my god, k fabe copp Virgil, Virgil's cousin, and this

ah, and this was where it clicked. This is where I was like this, this can't be Virgil because he's thirty and nineteen eighty one, and Virgil never had anything to do with the Chiefs or the Saints or anything like that. That's no one's ever heard that about Virgil. This can't be the same guy. And then you found that article, and then this paragraph had all the meaning in the world. Wow. Jones, thirty, was a

member of the former Pittsburgh wolf Pack semi professional football team. He also played briefly with the Kansas City Chiefs and New Orleans Saints of the National Football League. Holy Shed gave its addresses Fox Hill Drive in Monroe, Val. He said he also was employed at the Atmosphere Lounge. If convicted, each man would face a jail term of up to fifteen years and a flan of up

to twenty five thousand dollars. During the preliminary hearing, Shy testified that a confidential informant in an unnamed motel employee identified Pope as the man who used aliases to register at the motel several times last winter. Let me ask you, boss, mm hmm. If Michael Jones is allegedly in concert with this gentleman to move heroin packets, and this guy is able to create a false identity and use aliases to evade detection, and as an actual police officer so really

understands the ins and outs of how to pull that off convincingly. Is it too much of a logical leap to conclude that maybe old Virgil picked up some pointers and got himself a cafe birth certificate. I think that's a very very

very probable thing. I mean, because you type in Michael Charles Jones with the nineteen sixty one date of birth, and if you might not know this, but you know date of birth is a huge investigatory detail for police officers because if you have someone's DOB, you can much more efficiently search their entire entire criminal history because you know it's them. It's almost as good as a

social Security number in that regard. Oh my god, And so anybody who would have done a background check for Virgil and of the organizations he went on to work for anything like that, if he provided this this shoot date of birth, you better believe there's going to be a hit for a fucking dea drug raid in federal charges. That's what happened to the football career. That's why Virgil doesn't want you searching up his name and association with these football teams

because these articles would come up hashtag lapsed bitch, damn fucking right. Based on that information and other details supplied by the informant, a stakeout was set up at the motel she had said. Pope was arrested when he attempted to leave in his own car. Jones was arrested when he went to the car rented by Pope. The defense attorneys asked US Magistrate Iliagene Sessenich, who presided over the hearing, to force shide and prosecutor Assistant US Attorney Charles Sheedy to

reveal the name of the motel employee. Cessanich refused the request. Levinson said he will not push the issue further a trial. The hearing on the defense request is expected to take up the first day Siguler denies the motion. Jury selection will probably begin Tuesday. If Siggler approves that the prosecution is expected to appeal. The proceedings are expected to take about a week. This one all the way to trial, this was this was splashy stuff, and unfortunately the

the the adjudication isn't really easy to find. I can't really I can't really say what came of the case. Yeah, but and I don't know if maybe he did some time. I mean, it's entirely possible. You would think, let's tick a quick gander, because, unlike Michael Charles Jones, Anthony Pope, an association with heroin might might pull a different hit. I just thought of that just now. If that is indeed your real name, Yeah right, What I wouldn't give to just have known about this back then

and so hard. Tell me about Anthony Pope, Yeah, tell you about your cousin palell I forgot, man, I don't even know who is that I forgot? He would forget so badly? Yeah, oh no, I don't know. I don't. I don't have any cousins, many relatives I never had. Okay, okay, you're going with you don't have any relatives? Is that? Is that what I heard? Okay, here you go. You're ready for fucking money? Oh yes, ready? Are you fucking

ready? Give it to me. September one, nineteen eighty one, ap National US District Judge Donald Ziggler handed out seven year jail terms to a former police officer and a former professional football player and a heroin charge the US Attorney's office. Ziegler and Muddy also sentence former Penhillsboro policeman Anthony Pope, twenty six, of Verona, and Michael C. Jones. See that's Michael C. Instead of Michael Charles thirty of Monreville to five years probation. Jones formerly played

football for the Kansas City Chiefs and the Saint Louis Cardinals. Okay, he didn't play football for the Saint Louis Cardinals. I mean maybe the other one said the Saints. The prosecutors he might have played I mean he also might have played for the Los Angeles Patriots. He played baseball for the the Saint Louis Cardinals. That that's possible. But let me see what was the before they were Arizona. I think they were Saint Louis and he played cornerback for

the New York Yankees. They were They were the Saint Louis Cardinals in the NFL too. Oh they were. That's not an error, but I don't know why it said Saints over there. Pope and Jones, who were cousins, were convicted August sixth. The possession was intended to delivered twenty two hundred, now two hundred packets of heroin. Oh my god, there was a typo in the first one. Apparently he valued at ten grand. Both the fendants were allowed to remain free on bond. Michael C. Jones sentenced to

seven years in jail. And I'm looking at eighty one and I'm looking at seven years. Maybe some credit for good behavior, maybe some probation. Yep, my god. Virgil was probably sprung months before he got into the professional wrestling business. Ah wow, let's fucking go wholely shit. So if you want to know why, there's this mystery around when Virgil was born. It's not just because oh it wouldn't it be funny if I was younger and I

could work everybody to thinking that it wasn't a vanity thing. It was what you thought. It was that this guy had a hustle, the depths of which the business really wasn't prepared to accommodate, and that mark mindsets aren't prepared to for this guy really ran the streets, as they say. Wow,

And it's a lovely thing to know about. So with that backdrop, how about we become a what's that I imagine that he I mean, you know again, looking just quickly at his uh at his uh uh uh wikipedia, I would say he probably got four years because or like served four years before being let go, because it does skip. It is kind of crazy, like it does skip from his college to eighty five, and you know, then getting the training meeting Tony Atlas, it says, and then training with

a wild Simons that amazing. Woo wow. Let that be a lesson that when ye, when it appears a wrestler is lying for no other reason than just to be amusing, be smarter than that. Yep, Virgil Virgil Virgil don't fuck with the big dogs, that's correct. So what do you say we get acquainted with the wrestler Virgil became after doing time. That's the only thing we could do. Michael C. Jones born nineteen sixty one broke into the business. He worked everyone until they okay, God so so fucking good.

I mean, it's unbelievable that he lived his whole life without anyone figuring this out about the man, Like I always say that tlf was, as we celebrate, TLFX was endowed with perfect timing in that when we decided to do this show, and when he decided to lean into that research, when

we realized there was a hunger for it. Yep, all of a sudden, every fucking word ever written in any major newspaper was at our fingertips, right exactly, the resources existed to run down claims, to investigate right the matches that you know, Mike Mazurki had, yep, exactly like contemporaneous newspaper coverage of wrestler's careers in the thirties for under the cinemat, Yep, all all started to be, you know, fully and robustly available, just when

we came calling a ton of wrestlers, I mean dozens of wrestlers that had meaty, weighty career years came out with books after we launched the podcast that laid out in exquisite detail, in many cases, exactly what you would want to know about every little beat of their careers. Because the market for those kind of books had developed and matured enough that you know, everybody was getting

on the train. It's just lap serendipity all over the place. So nobody ten years ago even would be in a position to if they were researching a potential interview with Virgil to find out about this. Nobody, no, no, And I'm sure Virgil took comfort in the fact that, you know, unless you probably know what newspapers archives were in terms of like how readily available they are. But think about it too, like you wouldn't have how how

difficult would would it have been? You know again, It's like I think to myself, it's one of the reasons why I hated doing research in school, because of not having a direct line to kind of go to and uses as a reference point, like the fact that you can do a word search,

you know, and get results right away. Like you don't get that now you look through fucking those those those slide machines whatever were my microfilm, Yeah, microfilm, you know, like you don't get that, like you have to just and you would never be able to triangulate to where right you'd be able to find that piece. And even you know the fact that that piece if they if that Kansas City Star article didn't have a picture of his

face, yep, I know you wouldn't. You still wouldn't feel although I would I would have felt comfortable just because they mentioned the college and the time of that point, I would have felt comfortable with that. But no, but you make a good point. I mean, like it's and also too, you know, it was on a whim. It was on a whim that I decided, Hey, you know what I haven't done yet. I haven't looked up Mike Jones. I've been looking up Michael Jones all the time.

And when you're sort of looking up Mike Jones, all of a sudden, a ton of shit came up that was including on ancestry. Like that's how I found him in because he's not Michael Jones in the in the yearbooks, it's Mike. He was known as Mike. Yeah, his whole life apparently like not even like but it's funny because you'd think in those type of types of of records, you know, yearbooks, they put your they put your full name down. Yeah, but no, it was Mike Mike Jones.

So how early was he was he sprung? Well, we know at least as early as nineteen eighty six because he's doing his first uh he's training eighty five eighty five. Yeah, he's making his first television appearance in nineteen eighty six for the WWF. Is a job guy Lucius Brown spelled luscious a Johnny Valiant on Color commentary takes great exception to Gorilla mon Soon pronouncing it is luscious, so they say it's lucious. And he is bricked up man.

He looks he looks like a guy that discovers steroids in prison, if I'm honest. Yeah, and he is. He looks a lot bigger than he ever did. Is a million dollar man's bodyguard. And he does a quick job to Paul Oor Dworff taking the pile driver. Wow, this is Paulor and Dwarf back when he was coming out to real American to taunt and mock Hulk Hogan. I did not know he did that. That's oh yeah, tremendous. Oh yeah he did. I might as well. We might as

well pull it up. I mean, it's it's it's a it's a necessary part of his career. So if you want to jump onto YouTube, we're gonna do a funk uh style watch along for this episode because a lot of these matches, especially the WWF ones, we've covered already. But watch along. You haven't had from us yet, so this is an appropect time to do that. What am I looking for? I guess just for Orn Dwarf and Virgil Orndorf Virgil. Yeah. There, it is like a commercial there

contra, which is fine. I'm lining it up here. Do you agree that the previous ad is relevant to you? Oh Jesus, I don't. I strongly disagree. Consumers want ads that are relevant to them. No, consumers want no ads exactly. So stop stop taking the dais at conventions in conferences and acting like you have a unique beat on what consumers want from brands. Consumers want nothing from brands. They want to be left alone at all times and when they have intent to shop or whatever word you want to use,

They go to the fucking website and buy it right exactly. They don't just suddenly get get impacted by you know, inventory. Oh I'm sorry, I'm looking here right now on the to the right on the feed there. Oh yeah, I guess. There was a Virgil versus Diesel match Monday Night Raw, April eleventh, nineteen ninety four. There was. Yeah, he came back a couple of times for like one off appearances. He wasn't in the ninety four rumble, was he? Yeah he was? He was okay,

so that was it. That was that? It was? It was yeah, it was that weird time where he was just yeah, doing these these these random I think that was the rumble I should have been talking about in part one. Remember I was saying he wasn't booked in the beginning. You're like, yeah, he was for ninety three. He certainly was. I was like, okay, it was there through Summer Slam ninety three. Yeah, ninety four rumble is what I meant. Okay, yeah, that

makes sense. So you're ready to do a number ten. He came out number ten and he was one of the guys chucked by Diesel. Amazing. He was in the fucking ring for thirty two seconds. That's in the archives right in ninety four. Rumble it is. Yeah, we did it. We did it not too long ago, a couple of years ago. So you ready to watch Virgil's first WWF shot. I absolutely am September seventeenth, ninete eighty six according to YouTube. Of course, you can find it out

there as well. And we'll hit play in three two one, play four. There's nol Phillips on the call. That's what you look at him ship. He is huge, all oiled up, luscious brown. He has got it. He's got hair. I know, I'm weird. That's really funny. We're America and I had no idea he was doing that. People thought for a second it might be help yeap of course, like to the Ring

by Bobby Heenan. Look at that. Look at that fucking face. Oh no, it's like Elizabeth behind him that Liz I think so looks like here though maybe it lives to Fabio. There we go, wonderful. Look at look at the man, Look at Virgil. Look at Virgil. White trunks, white boots, white knee pads. Yep, just like the most like you know, strident like we can do this kind of babyface and he's doing the you get the footwork going on there, he's ready the born doorf fucking

Christ. Think he thought that this was kind of the end of this big time like, you know, I'm sure he did not feuning with Hogan. It's all over. Like how many people realize that the long the hard way that See here's the guy using my adjectoe lucious lucious us right here. You can go to the bank of that. You can the JV alliance, the JV team over there. That's what it is. I got that right,

luss luscious uh luscious. Junior Varsity also got a couple of shots for Crocketts as a job guy did Virgil all right, and and spent some formative years in Memphis as well before coming in as a million dollar man's bodyguard. Referee was checking virtual sleepads for Heroin. I found out that's that white is turning a bit brown there. I'm not sure that's just a ring girl. That's just like an attendant, if you will, chanting, Paula, we want

hunk, I don't. I don't like the buildings with the ceilings like that. There's mid Hudson Zivic Center. I think in Poughkeepsie. Oh sure, Matt explains that, Oh my god, look at these people, eighty six manslution. He's tall too, man. He stacks up. He stacks up favorably against Rangeorf. Of course, I had a wonderful zeke. All those stretches stretched a lot. Look at Virgil, awkward on his feet. Nice sleep Frog tries the second one. It gets hot shot across the top o

drop hard Virgil who had to eat ship man. We talked about the sid Justice angle. Oh yeah, just flailing it out of the canvases. Didn't I ask him he wasn't on the video, but didn't I ask him about how he felt like, you know, being I wish, I wish they all have that. Ask him how he felt about always being the butt of a joke, basically this party being no exception. Yeah, right, exactly. You know your your Virgil as a hit on Dusty Roads. You're Vincent

on a as a hit on vincick Man. Yeah, you're at this bachelor party because you're a fraud. Like thrown violently to the floor and dropped face first across the railing. Was Virgil. Yeah, he always just like he acted like I had nothing to do with using that name to mock other people. Man, I don't want to, you know, lampoon anybody. He

just hed totally no sould those questions he was at. Of course, that was what he was always asking, shooting interviews and stuff, and he acted like he didn't even realize that he's being used to make fun of others. Yeah, back in the ring, hard Whip and a Lariats, Paullen Gorf puts down Lucious Brown, Lucious Luscious Lucius Brown. Yeah, yeah, that's right, Jimmy Valley, and you're it's not Luscious Brown, it's luscious Lucius Brown. All right, here goes Curtains see a verge. Oh spiked him

tough, that tall, tall, lanky guy. I just heard Jimmy Valiant say, sell it, daddy. Are you counting in Spanish? Johnny exactly? Let's get to your fresher work, and there's American. He's still what the hogan bos do. Look at that. Remember, he was like supposed to be the backup plan if Andre couldn't make her Mescelania three. So that's being built right now, fall Lady six. He definitely thought I think this is before the big Toronto Exhibition Stadium match with Hogan. Yeah, I mean,

how would have that even worked? Like, hadn't he already beaten Orndorf in that cage match? Oh yeah, so what the fuck? How would that have been? Interesting? If? Or a good question? I think they probably would have shot a hot angle or something. I look at that jump poof. He totally used to leave his feet on those pile drivers. Man. Oh yeah, no, fuck's given. So there you go. Virgil is now a pro wrestler, having after having done time. That's right,

ha ha. I don't think I can say that enough. It's just I don't know. I don't relish it, but it's satisfying when someone who is such a carny, you know, oh, such a smoke and mirrors guy, such a guy you couldn't believe anything came out of his mouth. He I think tedd Tobias he said, you know, he lied when telling the truth would have been easier. I believe that just just you know, you realize where it all started. Just he's, you know, con man

from the beginning, hustler from the beginning. Well, the thing that I like, again, I don't like that you know. I don't want him to. You know, I don't like that you serve time or anything like that. What I do like what I like about it all. What is satisfying is that we were able to uncover secrets that's right, good or bad. Could have been good secrets, I wouldn't have cared. It's just like the idea that there's something that people didn't know that's right, that was unsure

in the thrill of the hunt. Yes, oh my god, I can't tell you how many the moment you said, can you find me a birth certificate? Down the fucking rabbit hole. I'm great to know that I have that U break glass in case of emergency option. Yeah, because you've been unleashed on this now. Man, you've got it. You've got it. You know exactly where to look, and it's it's wondered. It's a wonderful

thing. It only makes us more powerful ten years in. It's painful because it just takes up, exactly, It's like it just takes up because you know, you start just taking different paths. Because now I'm now at that point, I was like I was determined. I was I was like, I'm not gonna and not find this or at least something that gives me evidence, you know. And I saw that article with his face and the chiefs, I was like, oh my god, that was all him. That

shit that I dismissed as not him was all him. That's wild. And now the birth date thing makes sense. So having been sprung from the clink and having been piled driven by Paul Oworndorf on Superstars, Mike Jones is ready to become Virgil. And we turned down to the million dollar Man, Teddy Biassi's book, because of course he came in day one as the servant of

Teddy Biassi. Here's how it all happened, Ted writes, before I ever wrestled a single match for the World Wrestling Federation, the viewers were introduced to my character through a series of vignettes. They carefully craft created vignettes rather to make me as hated as possible. It was slapstick comedy at its best. The first one showed me in the back of a limousine counting my money. While I was counting the money, I got a paper cut. I told

my driver in personal valet Virgil, to take me to the hospital. When we got to the emergency room, I demanded to see a doctor. The attending nurse said I had to wait like everyone else. Look, you don't understand. I'm the million dollar man. I don't wait on anybody. The nurse reiterated that I had to wait. All of a sudden, I called Virgil with a snap of my fingers. He pulled out a lot of money and handed the nurse three or four hundred dollars. The nurse took the money

and said, I'll be right back. Sure enough, she came back with the doctor. I arrogantly replied, that's what I thought. Then I turned to the camera and said, don't get upset with the nurse. She is no different than you. She did the same thing that anybody would do. She took the money just like her. Everybody has a price for the million dollar man, That's right. People always talked about how this was Vince. This was Vince channeling kind of like a an inner. Uh you know,

Ted. What I'm thinking about, actually is how do you feel about about, you know, touching women in the back of the limousine? Oh no, how do you feel about that? Do you? Okay? Well, well I think that might be a bridge too far, Vince. I'll do anything for the gimmick. But well doesn't listen, then you can. If you wan't to do anything for the gimmick, then you're going to go a bridge too far. Virgil, have any thoughts, pal Virgil, what do

you think about about him banging hose in the back of the limousine? You know, yo to Bob. I am fine if that happens. If you need help, I can help Virgil. I'm asking for a friend. What are you packing? I don't want to brag. I got a nineteen inch flaccid it's up, buss and I then he ended it with my debarrogant laugh. Debs writes it became the standard punch line for all my early interviews. There was another vignett where I went to a restaurant. We pulled up and

there was a lying long line waiting to get in. With Virgil by my side, I walked right up to the front of the line. I told the major d that I needed a table for two. Sir, you were going to have to wait in line like everyone else. Look, you don't understand. I'm the million dollar man. I don't wait on anybody. I'm sorry, sir, but you're gonna have to wait. Out of the blue, I called Virgil with a snap of my fingers. He pulled out a

wad of money and handed the major D four or five hundred dollars. The mayer D took the money and said, well, sir, I think we have a table for two. One of the people in line started complaining and came up to me and said, hey, pal, who do you think think you are. I just looked at him and smiled. I then took a step back, and Virgil stepped in with his great, big arms and

foul demeanor. The guy just backed down and slithered back in line. Virgil and I got seated at the table and we were waited on hand and foot. Then I turned to the camera and said, don't get upset with the mad or d. He is no different than you. He did the same thing that anybody would do. He took the money just like him. Everybody has a price for the million dollar man. These vignettes, Boss, were

very much predicated on Virgil's arms. Sure, he's standing there with his cutoff tuxedo yep, looking menacing and you know, as capable and as wonderful of a worker's teddybias he was and as much of you know, he's a good sized guy, we can't forget that. A key lynchpin of those early teddybiasse vignettes and character the character work was that Virgil was the guy who would step in when things got hairy for the million dollar man. Of course. Yeah,

I mean, well that's that's that's what makes it so perfect. He wasn't just there to wait on him hand and foot. He was there to literally fight his fights and to be sort of like this menacing presence that would keep people from attacking the rich guy that everybody wants to strangle. So he was absolutely key to the package. He really wasn't. Yeah, and they found form a character that you know, didn't require him to talk. So it was great because he's not a very good talker. No he's not.

And once he does talk, you're like kind of a lot of that aura goes away. You know, you're like, oh, this guy doesn't sound tough at all. He sounds kind of goofy. You know, Yes, that that's one thing in wrestling, man, you better hope that when the time comes and you get that mic in your hand, if you're over before you touch the mic, you better hope you sound like you look, because if your match doesn't, if your voice doesn't match your your physical presence,

it's over. And and I always have the feeling that Vince thought stings didn't one of the most I agree, and one of the most disappointing people in that regard. The Warlord. Oh that's a huge one. I know it's sacrilege, but man, the fact that he doesn't have a deep, booming voice is so so sad. I know that was why it was so That's why the Goldberg thing kept working. It's because once they did let him talk, he sounded like a fucking madman, right why he had a timber in

his voice. One more vignette, DEBIASI writes, had me going to an exclusive hotel. I asked the front desk clerk what the best room was, the honeymoon suite. I'll take it. I'm sorry, sir, it's taken. Well, that is the room I want. That is the best room, and I wanted. I'm sorry, sir, it is taken, and there is a couple in there right now. Again, I called Virgil with a snap of my fingers. He pulled out a lot of money and handed

the clerk five or six hundred dollars. He accepted the money, and the scene quickly changed to show him kicking the honeymoon couple out of the room. Then I turned to the camera and said, don't get upset with the front desk guy. He is no different than you. He did the same thing than anybody would do. He took the money just like him. Everybody has a price for the million dollar Man. The vignettes were being aired and I

hadn't yet been seen wrestling. When I finally made it to the live shows, the immediate response from the fans was that I was a pompous ass who thought he was God because he had lots of money, and that was the whole idea of the character. The vignettes laid down the foundation for people to hate me. The book includes many quotes from outside folks, including Bobby the brain Heenan, who contributed this thought. Ted's million dollar Man gimmick was excellent.

No one could have done it better than him except Vince McMahon. A He cared himself as a true professional. The funny thing is that most true professionals and wrestling aren't nice guys. Ted is a really nice guy. When I was producing interviews with the WWA. I had to watch over the guys, monitor what they were saying, and keep up with them. But I never had to worry about Ted. He did everything on times, spoke proper English, and got right to the point with his interviews. He's a true

professional. And Virgil did talk and shoot interviews about how Bobby Heena did coach him through promos. So Bobby's like behind the camera for a lot of this stuff. Remember he had that very short period of time where he was working in the office. Yeah, right when I first brought him in, before he really became a television commentator, and he was helping produce interviews. He's even listed as like a producer on one of the early Coliseum home videos,

just one. That's how quickly it lasted. But apparently he was still tangentially involved enough that they called upon him to get Virgil through some promos as well. After the airing of the introductory vignettes, I started wrestling wrestling jobbers on TV and easily squashed them during the nineteen eighties unless you were shooting an angle.

Very rarely you see competitive matches on free TV. Most of the televised matches were what we called enhancement matches, which were designed to highlight the stars. Today you see top guys wrestling each other every week. Continued the pompous antics. We decided to no longer just throw money at the crowd, and now I picked plants from the crowd and made them do humiliating things. We

know about the basketball and the kid crying. We Taedobyasi deprives him of the of the opportunity to win what was it, five hundred dollars if he can dribble it for a certain amount of time, and another person, another person five hundred dollars if you bark like a dog. There's Vince again. He came back to that one with Trish years later, didn't he? How about it? Hervert making a woman come in and say wolf, Wolf, Wolf, and and all of that. Virgil handing him the money the whole time,

playing that that key role on the periphery. Debasing continues. No matter where I went, Virgil was always by my side. It was Vince's idea to bring Virgil in his my valet. I didn't meet him until we put the final touches on. The character name is Mike Jones, and he's from Pittsburgh. My hat's some wrestling experience, but fans hired him for his look. He had huge arms of bald head and a great physique. Vince laid out to Virgil exactly what he was going to do. He was going to

carry my bags and shift for me. You know, he you know, he's he's you know, Vince. He's been in the company before. What company here? You know? He wrestled, He wrestled Orango. He did TV job last year in a TV match. Not this company, Absolutely not. I would remember a man like him of these proportions, of these proportions, of this proportional aptitude. He never worked here. Nobody ever worked here. Unless I knew about this, nobody ever worked here. That's a great

thought starter from Vince. Vince laid out to Virgil exactly what he was going to do. Okay, he would open the car door, my hotel door. Virgil was muscle and manager at ringside. He was my personal servant everywhere we went in public. That was his job and he got paid well to do what. Virgil never took the role personally. He has nothing to say and shooting interviews about like you know, give us a story about going on

the road and pretending to be a millionaire. The whole thing was a Vince put all kinds of cash in Ted Dibiassi's hand so that when he went out in public he'd live the gimmick and give people the idea that really what was that rich? But nothing, nothing at all, No memories at all. He's very good at selective memory. The name Virgil evolved, Ted writs from

a meeting over dinner. So here it is. Here's the story. If anyone acts like still the Virgil name wasn't a shot at Dusty, like the poka dots, weren't a total fucking attempt to humiliate the guy, then fine. If you have to hear it in black and white. Here it is. After I signed with the World Wrestling Federation, Pat Patterson, Bobby Heenan and I went out to eat over stakes. Pat said, guys, we

have to take up a name for Ted's servant. After throwing out stupid names and laughing about things, Bobby said, So tedd Byassi puts on Bobby Heenan. Bobby said, let's call him Virgil, like Virgil Runnels. Got that all right, And so Virgil it was Dusty Roads his real name is Virgil Runnels. It was an inside wrestling rib on Dusty. Wasn't my idea, of course not. But when Virgil left World Wrestling Federation and joined me in

WCW, they decided to call him Vincent Ribbing Vincent K. McMahon. Bobby Heenan says, at that time, Dusty Rhodes was the booker in Atlanta. He was burying everybody who was working in New York. There was no Atlanta really at the time. It was more Charlotte, but I get it. He was burying everybody who was well. It was TBS. He was working in New York, and so they needed a name for DBS. Servant I

said, how about Virgil Ted's finisher, the Million Dollar Dream. I never thought of this one before, where he put his opponents to sleep, was named after Dusty because he called himself the American Dream. Even the sleeperhold was wow, holy shit, we got to kick Dusty in the balls twice. Heenan said. It was a good rib on Dusty, not that he wouldn't do it to us if he could. It was good fun. Virgil and I Ted Wrights became good friends. He was a heck of a nice guy,

and we spent a lot of time together. We initially thought that would be good idea a room together on the road. Unfortunately it didn't work out because we needed our own space as well as control of the thermostat. One night, I woke up sweating bullets. I checked the thermostat and Virgil had turned it up to about eighty degrees. I turned the thing down all the way to zero degrees. Can you imagine, boss, Oh, do you imagine having to fall asleep in a hotel room with somebody that insists on it

being eighty's It gives me a fucking panic attack just thinking about it. You meet my wife, Oh, she goes that high, No, not that high, but she as You like it cold? Oh? Absolutely, it can never be too cold. I've been on the road with you. You like it cold, You like it hot, not the boss. It's gotta be like sixty five degrees at least at the hottest at night. It's unbelievable. I get to be I have to move my my legs around and every

place, no matter how recently I've been there. It's cold on the bed. Wow, it's got to be cold on the bed. If it's warm I get very uncomfortable in the first night of the road, first end of the road with Virgie. You both fall asleep and he gets up in the middle of the night to crank it, so you already even have a chance to know what's happening until it's too late in your in the rows of heat

stroke. And then well, then I'll get up in the middle of the night, and there's no way that that heat wouldn't keep me yes, wake me up. I'd get up out of the exact same thing. I'd go up there and turn that shit down. Phenomenal fucking freezing. I turned, Debasi says, I turned the thing all the way down to zero degrees. That's really funny. I'm a big guy and enjoy sleeping in cool temperatures. Break the machine. I got up in the morning and couldn't even see Virgil

in his bed. Yeah, that's the thing about air conditioners. Respect them, because if you freeze that thing over and nobody's going to be happy. Yeah, exactly, nobody wins. I got up in the morning and couldn't even see Virgil in his bed. He was buried under a blanket, on top of blanket, he said. Man I don't know if room with you, I can't handle sleeping in the cold, did or brother? I love sleeping in the cold. Virgil says in the book Ted is a great person.

Even though we were on the road together every day, Ted and I never had an argument in order to get into one single fight. Well later on they kind of did, but that's the autograph circuit bullshit. I didn't get along with my own family that well. Virgil discloses, here interesting wonder way that would be. I don't know a Navy seal watching his kid go to jail for heroin trafficking and then becoming a fake athlete on top of it.

I don't know what was a bigger embarrassment to the family. Mike was his name, Warren Jones, Warren Warren Jones, Warren Peace is more like it right. He was like a brother to me, Virgil said of Teddy Biassi. I even had the privilege to meet and get to know his family. I signed a contract to be Ted's bodyguard. He treated me as a true professional. I did everything that was asked of me and never complained. I never viewed anything as demeaning, and by no means ever took anything personal

I never cracked a smile, always staying in character. I did the job to the best of my ability. He really does. He does not ever crack as the Virgil character when he's mean and menacing. Yep, Yep. It's like he's always so good at keeping that stoke. It's almost like he just disconnects himself from the stimuli around him. It's like he's in a trance almost when he's in that character. Yep. Yeah, he just kind of stares at you and you just, you know, you feel unsafe. No,

no, no, he's unshakable. One night, we were staying at the Marriott Hotel Newark Airport. At that point, if it wasn't a major show or pay per view, vincedent' want Virgil to drive me around in limousines, but rather at a Lincoln town car. After wrestling that evening, Virgil dropped me off at the front door. I told him, don't worry about picking me up in the morning. I'm going to take the hotel shuttle to

the airport and I will catch up with you at the gate. It was a break for him because he could take the rental car directly to the airport and check it back in without having to worry about dropping me off. When Virgil got to the gate the next day, I saw that his eye was smollen, like someone had punched him. Man, what happened to you? Oh man? I got up and had to use the bathroom in the middle of the night and accidentally ran into the door. Do you believe that,

boss? No, well, I don't. I believe vincient man punched him in the face, and not for for for even listening to ted dybs to say I'll take the shuttle. I didn't even think anything about it until a month or so later, when I returned to the hotel. Virgil and I run different flights. I ended up checking into the hotel by myself. As I was checking in, one of the bell guys came up to me.

We were regulars there, so I got to know most of the staff, he said, so, Ted did Virgil ever get over that black eye after that airbag hit him in the head? Air bag? What are you talking about? Oh my god, man, the last time you guys were here, Virgil went to take the car back. He got into the car and instead of backing up, he drove forward and ran right over the concrete block. The airbag shot out of the steering wheel and hit him right in the

head. It gave him a black eye and a bloody lip. This guy's like a he's kind of like a a like a goof, you know, he's like, oh, yeah, I mean he's he's just he he is the you know, he's a walking Murphy's Law. All right. That's what I love it is that what they called the heroin trafficking statue Murphy's Law. He's just one of those guys who, you know, I don't know, like it's just he's just got he just has no because he's done because he's

made bad decisions, right. He just continually makes bad decisions, right, because what's what's one more right? Right? Because the next, the next bad decision is going to be one that pays off. He's like a gambler who you know, just keeps His solution to losing a lot of money gambling is to just take a bigger gamble, right. And that's actually because that did that is something people didn't say about him, that he did have a

problem with the race tracks. So that actually is probably isn't too far off. It's trying to make a quick buck. Yeah, he's a hustler man. Very simple. Just put something in my hand that I can three x the value of, be it a an eight by ten of me holding the million dollar title, or a fucking baggie of heroin, or a betting slip at the track, or or making a goof appearance at a bachelor party. That was one last great hustle man. I mean we not only did we

did we have to hire him a ride. He took us for one. Oh. I bet you could have you know, I bet you could have talked him down like, oh, that's that's what the knobs. Oh, he hadn't done it for four hundred dollars, I guarantee you. Oh my God told him listen, I'll feed you, I'll feed you, I'll fly out. All right. This is how good of a negotiator I was. He named his price and I said, okay, Well, circumstances were very different at that point. Well, it was all about the fact that I

even found him. Yeah, And at that point, the last thing you want to do is fuck it up over three hundred dollars, you know, especially with the with with your dad willing to make this happen. Because he happened to get a phone call from the only family in the world whose father would actually think it was worth spending on this guy who would know enough about wrestling to think he was worth a lot, but not so much about wrestling to know that he would do it for half the price, and not too

much arresting to know that he really isn't worth a lot. You're right, And by the time that became apparent where everybody was already pretty drunk. So yep, it was fine. Yes, So that happened that evening. Virgil picked me up to take me to the arena. On the way there, I asked him, Hey, man, how is your lip? And I, oh, it's okay. Now, hey Virgil, that door you ran into didn't happen to look anything like an airbag, did it. His eyes got big and he said, who told you? Man? Who told you?

We just laughed, Virgil. I purchased a three This is Virgil talking. I purchased a three thousand dollars pl a black leather coat. Davy boy Smith ribb me real good by putting tape on the back of my jacket. When I went to remove the tape, the glue pulled the leather off. I was furious. And immediately wanted to get back at Davy Boy. So

he's a he's a big spender too. He ended up destitute, of course, And you know that WSW contract pretty sweet, you know, I mean, it wasn't one of those guys that got kisses in the mail for three years after the company closed, because he was dropped right before the Russo Bischoff era started in April of two thousand. But you know, he shouldn't have been that that straight out by the end of his life, I don't think, But you know, maybe this is this is a glimpse at how he

chose to spend his money. When Pritchard talked about him upon his passing, did say he was someone that put away his money. He remember him being very stingy about that. And he was mathematically inclined. I mean, we made jokes about how he told us he was a math teacher and things, but he said that in other interviews with a pretty straight flight, a pretty straight face. No doubt. I don't doubt that he was a math teacher. What I doubt is that he made one hundred thousand dollars a year working

as a substitute math teacher, working one day a week. Didn't he tell us it was like four hundred thousand or something even crazier than that. Ben, I don't know. I thought it was one hundred thousand. But he's working one day a week. I said, what are you talking about? Man? It's like, oh, dude, you're not like a tutor as far as I could tell, trigonometry and geometry. Yeah, does he said he had, I guess from a Virginia union. He got a mathematics degree.

Yeah, which is interesting. So yeah, and that all tracks right, you know, thinking about numbers, pushing weight right, of course, you know, trying to get sixty bucks off of polaroid instead of ten, pushing weights, pushing dates. Yep, huh. Deep inside that apparently clueless head of Virgil is just like all these charts and graphs at all times. Absolutely, he's like constantly calculating upside. He's like, uh uh, what's his name? In a beautiful mind? Yes, John Nash, John Nash

or Kevin Nash. You know, shit, I got charts and shit going through my mind all the time. I got fucking you know, map charts and look, I got a beautiful mind. I got a beautiful mind. You know, I got a beautiful mind for direction, got a beautiful mind for profit for tax advantage. I said, I'll tell you what I got a I got a beautiful mind for ten ninety nine. Ted convinced me to wait to get back a Davy boy a while and get him a few weeks

down the road. So a few weeks later, Davy left his Union Jack flag cape unattended. I seize the moment, cut my name out of the back of the cape. It was perfect. Uh. Davy then try to give me back by cutting my black pants. The pants he destroyed were actually mister Fuji's trousers. Virgil and Ted Dibyasi are now a thing. Give me a give me good trousers. I need your trouveth. I'm gonna, I'm gonna. I'm gonna hold on him for a while. Ah ah my Yoko

Dullah as opposed to your Yoka Zuma. I didn't say nothing about Yoko Duma. Ah ah my Yoko dullah Too good, dude, too good. I can't believe lapsed Fuji isn't a thing. So what's the date we have on this? DBAs in Virgil versus Bam Bam Bigelow and Hulk Cogan tag match. It's January twenty fifth, nineteen eighty eight, so we're talking to like, what two weeks before the main event. That's wild. Wow, think about

that for a second. Yeah, we talked about how Virgil very rarely wrestled, and DBSC made reference to that, and no fucking clue that he didn't wrestle that he wrestled before ninety one before turning Babyface. Yeah, I thought that was kind of like the big first match. Well, I mean the tag match returns Face at ninety one. Rumble he's wrestling in, That's what I mean. Oh not SummerSlam, right, No, I mean I'm talking about it. I think I feel like the first time was that tag match.

Yeah, it's Mermlan ninety one. That to me was always the first time he wrestled. Yeah, the Hasbro era fans, it really was. It was the first time because I remember the novelty of seeing Virgil and wrestling trunks on that show, right, and also kind of wearing those long ones that kind of in a way resembled what he would have one of the variations he would have, because it was like he'd had those long stripe ones if

he wasn't wearing the boxing trunks and trunks. So this is in Madison Square Garden, so of course it airs live for the luckiest fans in the fucking world, those who have MSG cable as just a you know, a full card on the Madison Square Garden network, just like the whole coc and Iron Cheek match for eighty four and that whole show that we covered last time we

were with you. And so this is how the broadcast kicks off and how much anticipation is in the voices of Vince McMahon, Lord Alfred Hayes and Bobby Heen and I can't possibly describe for the forthcoming unveiling of Virgil in the ring.

Just let that, let this simmer for a bit. Do you feel that night in Madison Square Garden the tag team matchup in the main of that everyone looking forward to Ted Tbs and his body guard Rustler Virgil and they will be squaring off against Bam Bam Pigelow and the World Rustling Federation Heavyweight Champion Hop Cogan. Hello everyone, I've been the man of ringside along with or let him scarry your Lord Alfred Hayes and who is that? What are you doing

here? I have a long here. You don't even have a head center, a microphone. You don't belong here. Bobby the brain heenen wo course represents the King Harley Race, also representing the Islanders, as the Islanders will be squaring off against the British Bulldogs and a sensational tag team matchup. All of that in a great deal more. We have all kind of excitement here. I know you're looking forward to it. Absolutely. The fresh bull Dogs

have a great test in from the game. If they complete the Island as they're surely in line for a title shock. But most of all, the intrigue of Andre the Giant here backing up the team of ted Dbsad, a million Dollar Man and with him a Virgil, the ever present Virgil. All right now it braw you at home, Please don't let I'll forget you too excited, all right, freaking awesome, the ever present Virgil. That's right,

he was a present. All right, you got this video, let's queue it up, I do. We're going to take in Virgil and the Million Dollar Man, Teddy Biassi versus hul Cochin and Bam Bam Bigelow. Remember this was that short lived Babyface Super Push that the Bammer's got yep, that was so summarily abandoned after apparently he rubbed under the giant the wrong way and

Andre gave him a hard time in the ring of the garden. Oh that's the thing, you fucking if you touch him and you rub him the wrong way when you're giving him like a massage or a rub and forget it. Absolutely absolutely fuck go fuck you'll think you are he throw me a pharaoh. Look what's behind you. There's some very behind you. Brother. Oh shit, furven oil, chuck you fu fuck a thumb up his ass? How about that? One O six forty is your time code? One O six

forty. This is video of the MSG television broadcast, and we're gonna take this match in. Apparently it's on one of the whole Comania Colosseum videos to this match. Alight, we haven't got there yet. No, on the Colsseum collection side, we have not. Obviously it's deep into the collection. If this was eighty eight, that's true, that's true. I'm ready when you are. All right, here we go in three to one play.

All right, we're back in manusin Square Garden and awaiting the product of the world Rosling Federaction Jacks and hol Kobe right when he makes his way to the ring, and he will be a company with want Bam bicklow individual. I believe mister Heenan even individual. What kind of individual was that? This individual that Bobby Enan was associated with? Yes, shake a little bit that mat going hair, Yeah, because I'm not sureing hair. The following contests the

time team match schedule for one fall, Big Team number one. Both men have a whole combined my five hundred and ten pounds and they make their winroom President in the Netherlands and Tilly thank God for parad Ooh we get the locker room shot. Ye, let's go cam gimink m King King King, get the King k k k k k kame King, keep the King King King Kinking King King King King King King King and thank you for that. With Andre the Giant flanking them. Yeah, speaking of right the main event,

Yeah, exactly right. It's pretty wild. The thing right before that nb SU blowout special that the M s G Show still looked like this. I don't know right this this actually looks a little bit better than comes Alster. It is with herser all over humpered ink life. Did they just finished doing screen caps for Wrestling Media for the NES back there that this crew. Harry comes with the title still not winged Eagle. No, not that was the main event that was. Yeah, so this is Holt's last walk at MSG

with the old belt. Wow. So they hit the ring and immediately DEBIOSI and Virgil season stop. You heard Vince Mack comment about Virgil's impressive physique. So he's getting a chance to flex that without the vest for once. Double knock and knocker. Deber's at Virgil bumping for the industry. Very impressed with those traps, right, yeah, and he's always knew how to set a trap delta. I'm listening. I don't set traps for women, all right,

Double big boot from Hogan and Biggs tearing the shirt Bammers there. I'm talking with Bamers and then said, hey, you know when we do a fucking double boot, you right? Oh, d Berzy, it's a top buckling. He's gonna do some bumping around for Hulkster here. This must be such a rush for Virgil, Oh, I imagine. I mean he comes out of jail and in two years if we have our math, right,

he's wrestling in the garden. No experience really Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's the kind of dreams WWF could make possible if you, if you have the look that Vince was looking for at that moment, in a role that he needed to fill, like you really could have a charmed life for a little while. Yeah, and it's all about criminal criminology. Absolutely corner to corner, whip Holster crushing Gbiasi. Of course, Hogan Dibiasi a big what

if? Oh yeah, he's rubbing Debiasi's face. He's interesting. You know, you look at Virgil, you look at his fucking body, and you see Hogan, and Hogan's just like, you know, it almost looks like he's got a belly compared to Virgil. Interesting, you know, it's like it's almost like he does his physique is less than Virgils. Nice tight shot of Andre getting pissed off that Hogan's pointing to bim Ben Bigelow and get into the dark and crawd to pop for him. Yeah, all right, told

he didn't do anyone over four hundred pounds in the WWF. Uh, Andre is gonna have a problem. Yeah, Abert hits the buckling. It takes a shoulder block and turns inside out. Andre I told you before, if you want, you know this guy can do a moon set, right, can you do it? What are you going to do? A pounds exactly? Are you going to do a a somersault splash from the top rope? Are you gonna do? Are you gonna do a on a Harlem hangover?

I can't do a full fifty, boss, but I can do a one eighty or a two o five they could do I can, I can. I can drink one hundred and navy bills. That's what I'm looking for. Quick tags between the Holster and Bigelow. It's sound tag team strategy. I think you could have got behind Hogan and bigel if you were a fan back then teaming together. Yeah, oh, totally, totally. I think I think I could have gotten behind Bam Bam, anybody who was associated with Hogan,

I could have gotten behind. At that time, pumping machine Dbasi was look at this guy, he's fucking I always loved the way he sold, you know, getting his head brammed in the buckles. I also loved he's one of my He and Jacques Roujeau were two of my favorites when it came to like a top if they were on the top rope and they're coming down and the baby face strikes them in the mid section, and they do that

all day at Summersault. I'm there for it. I used to do that, but of course a kid, that was one of my favorite fucking spots, and so I would do that with my friends. I'd go to the top, I'd go to the top of a chair, I'd jump down. I'd say, hit me in the gut, and I'd do that, and then I'd do that little jump leap thing and ran on my back back with the holster. Break my neck. Yeah, that's dangerous. This so back Suplex and deebers and then Virgil eats a big hogan right hand and bumps off

the apron. Virgil is not totally bald here. I see a little bit of hair. There's definitely a yeah, he's got a little something going on. Right hand. Oh will the windmill right hand drops devers? No there, Oh dude, Brother Andre trips Hogan from behind from the floor. Girl, drop your balls from the behind. This was the spot. Boss, Oh choke call him oil can boyd? Did you as no choking? Hulk Hogan, you grow big head. But he didn't cackling uncommentary, but he

was down there. Oh yeah, but he got back on commentary. Right, So I'm walked down with this looks like a Hasbro commercial, doesn't it? Oh god, it does. This is totally sty'd used in that you know, left arm lariat by Didiassi drops the holster off the whip and still Virgil is that that standing that standing clothesline that he just did? That was then that's one of his moves in wrestle Fest. Oh my god? Really? Yeah? Yeah, you Virgil and wrestle Fest. Not a Virgil,

No, he's not Virgil off the top ra hope. Wow, Virgil comes up with a top rope single axe handle dropping Hulk Hogan Deeve's you know, des wrops a guy in the in the corner and he just stands there and then he lifts up the arm and just fucking amazing. You get a Hogan rising from his knees at the at the feet of Virgil. Yeah, what's he insane about? Virgi? Yeah? You think powerful sort? You think n W CW Hogan maintained vincent or do the think he'd called him Virgil whenever

the cameras weren't rolling. That's a good question, because you know we didn't call him Mike. He had Andrei trying to use the bottom rope, push it down across Holt's throat while the ref's distracted. Big nasty Giant. Wasn't that big show for the big nasty bastards anyways? Oh yeah, tag to DBA Virgil holding him open, Dibia rings down punishment, Hogan him a knee.

Nothing's going to stop another giant Hogan his beat. Yes, he takes a shot at Bigelow and the apron Bigelow helpless to do anything about it. He's not the legal man? Is he tatted up on his forehead? On his head yet? Oh yeah, that was the day one thing. Okay, maybe he added some of the years went, but egg knife fetch chopped from dB backing up the Hulkster going oh Hogan, wow, Hogan bumping back clips over the ropes. But the term isn't the business for that? Or

do you go over the ropes like that? So Oliver Humperdink on the move just to make your night. I believe we've talked about him and his after shows with hookers absolutely and his sweaty chest, yeah, just the and they were men, the hookers were men. That the beads of sweat on his hair and his red hair and his chest tag Hergil. He hasn't even done anything. He's just fucking waiting. Hegel getting punishment and on hul Irish What

then he drops Hogan with a clothesline isn't jumping clothes line? There? Good stuff. Birch had a fist drop from Virgil. Can can can cankingkeep you can kinging King campiging King King King Piking keeping King can keep think King King Brother halts building back up rakes Virgil's eyes. Virgil immediately tags out to deebers things looking harry for a second. There for the million dollar man's bodyguard. I love those standing drop fists. How does he get that angle? Look

at that? Look at that so fucking amazing that oppressed by Ted Dibiassi gets two and three quarters. He ain't been complaining about the cadence of the count. I think he's got a point slipper hole now from the million dollar man Debes. I mean, Virgil doesn't look great, but isn't it bad? No? I think he's protected in this tag tag mash formula. That's true. You know, I think, you know, I think it's a smart move to for this put don't I remember thought, you know, the thing

is Virgil. I never thought Virgil looked bad, right. I thought he was completely adequate, right, you know, because he was pretty fast and he sold well, and you know, he's no genius, he's no, he's no fucking ring general. But he's he's he's totally adequate. You know, he's he's better than some today. I'll tell you that ripping the top tag rope. He's very observant of that, that rule to be honesty. He's brought hul Cogan all the way down to the canvas in the sleeper hole.

Yes, here's the WWF champion, maybe fading, playing a babyface in peril. Here, not the big hot tag comeback guy. That's that's big alow. That's that's that's kind of typical for Hogan, though, I feel

like, yeah, I feel like Hogan's alway. It's kind of a weird thing because you always think that Hogan would want to be the hot tag guy, but he he he often is the baby face in peril and lets the his his partner take that, take the pop. Hogan breaks for you with back elbows in a tackle town goes Debiassi off the ropes, over the top comes Hogan, ducks a backhand and double I wonder, what is what's Hogan getting right giving? You know, you know he's not doing that for free.

You know, what's what's his partner giving him? Well, I'm sure he's got designs on take a little turning on him and getting the wrestled innu pay day out of it. You know, a guy that's north of three fifty comes out of the company. That's what Hogan's thinking. Here comes Biggs hot Tag and he's in there with Virgil. Virgil. Virgil hurts a knee on the cell. Nice nice good good bomb there, Jesus as an athlete man, Yeah no, there really was up to a gorilla press from bigelow

Ah above the garden. He's one of those guys like you. I never understood how he could get beat up so bad, so so badly, and so easily, because like he's so muscular, right, how did he always get beat up so much? I know he's like he actually he's like a two hundred pounds of reill thinjer brone exactly. That was an awesome gorilla press by kind he kind of Oh, Hogan sneaks in the leg drop Oh, Bigelow in the hot big splash on verge covered by Bigelo one. Two,

this thing's over fucking referee taking the slog? Is this I don't even Rember? Is this the first guys? Are we starting the finish? In this one, Andre's got his hands on Bigelow, ripping him. I didn't get a chance to read the script beforehand. It was fun except for the gorilla press lamb. Virgil was trying to sit up and Bigelow is coming down with the head buttons, almost like Virtil forgot that was next and I think they

cracked heads there. Yep, Virtil's backup well enough to commence a two on one beat down like Bruce Hart. There something the ringside Wow hounding on the hulks for ringside. And here's Bigelow drop kicking Andre from behind. Ray, Andre taking the bombed ricochets off the rope and hits the canvas. Hogan storing chairs in the ring. Bigelow's wheeling a chairs this crazy night at the garden. Yeah, Hogan launched a chair from the floor and Bigelow caught it in

midair. Both Hogan and Bigelo's standing ground in the middle of the ring. Humperd inc hit humper ding with a fucking chair, please, humper ding, Kumpa doing kumpa with the suspenders, wearing Andre right like he's a fucking uh uh. He's got like a like an olive tree. Yeah, he's sure that he does. Actually, Virgil and Dbiasse holding back Andre. I'm going to go pick the allars forty three. It's the announcement about to be made.

Jubilation at the garden now yet playing the saxophone theme for Bam Bam, Oh my god, King King can kill in the back. Oagan taking about with the championship, Bigelow mid ring as well, flashbulbs in the garden. This was in the middle of the show, of course, an event in the middle of the card. So they can go home, they can go home. It's really so that everybody is in their seat to hear the pitch that intermission is now and tickets for the next show are available to box office.

Get yours before it's too late. That's right. You don't want to make that announcement at a weak point. In the show. Finally Andre compelled to and was there. Is that why the main event was in the middle, so that you yeah, yeah, they'd make the announcement of the next

show and the date in the main event if they could. And that's the thing too, like if the main event was on the end, it probably would compromise what they could announce for the next show because there was probably a title match, and what are you gonna say, right Ogan laying the belt down, still ready to battle if you'd be, Assi, Virgil and Andre are interested, but of course not to have that exclusive fucking you know TV.

Ah, It's just it's just fucking miraculous. Just had such a better beat on like what the WWF was like, yeah, when you could see it on this monthly kind of supercard basis, and it wasn't like a bigger produced pay per view. It was just like well, run of the mill, their best foot forward, but like a really good house show and how

crazy these people are going. It's yep, and you'd the best part is you'd see big stars like you would absolutely would, and you see big you know, like you said, like paper view quality matches essentially Hulk Wilpo's that's right, Nagan. Last show, we looked forty years ago when Hogan won the belt in this building, and now look where he's at just four years later. Vince McMahon, Haltonmania is still running wild and Madison Square Garden try

to teach you. Bam bam bigelow the ear cup. Yeah, you don't ever get that of a Hulk merchandise. It looks like John Senor's belt. There it does. It's me out of woods, so I guess it's Daniel Bryan's belt. Actually, wow, that's a fucking playing lord. Al And you know, I believe that Hulk Hogan is the greatest professional athlete of all time is rare. They brought down the music and there's lad, there's glad. That's funny. Hell could look at this guy? How over was this

guy? This is just like a kind of run of the mill MSG show. Yep, you can end up there aging. So not a bad first, uh Gan King and Gan King Guarden outing for Virgil. Sure, not at all. So we'll push it all the way now to the Rumble ninety one. So I'm gonna load it up on Peacock. I think the Boss is an alternative method, but you at home, you know, to do what you need to do, you at home. That says to the cock, this show, this show, this show, as we pull it up,

just please, I mean, people who don't know. Rumble ninety one is everything and I watched it when we were getting ready for the World Rumble. This year, we're gonna watch the little Are we gonna watch the little thing beforehand? Where Yes talks about the dinner. I got one, thirty six fifty five. I'm close enough, I got one? Are you doing it? Right after Tugboats promo? I believe? So let me discern that. Yeah, tell people what's so special about this show? I mean,

first of all, it was the first for me. It's the first video that I ever rented, first wrestling video I ever rented, and was right after the nineteen ninety two Roar Rumble happened and I and so there's just that magic to it, and it's like there's there's something about the The commentary of

Piper and Monsoon is so great. Even though you know, I love I love Heenan, obviously, I love I love the face Healed dynamic, but there's something about having these two guys that is just a lot of fun Piper's so great on commentary, And where were you on Virgil coming into this show. Did you have any inkling that something big was about to happen with this

guy? No, No, this is kind of the funny thing. So so when I came in to watching in late ninety one, early ninety two, so much stuff actually happened in between, you know, from the beginning of ninety one to the end of ninety one. In the early ninety two, you know, like I didn't know what the Heart Foundation was. I knew Brett Hart because Brett Harder was the intercamal champion, absolutely I And to me, Jim Knightheart was the new foundation. I didn't know. I didn't

know what this Heart Foundation was. And you see him come out, He's like, you see Jim Knightheart come out dressed like Brett Hart, Like why is he dressed up like for Brett Hart? Right in this thing? I didn't know what a brother love was coming out there. But like it also, uh uh, you know, savage, the whole savage thing. Warrior wasn't there anymore when I started watching, you know, the slot like Slaughter had just turned baby face again when I started watching, So to see him.

You know, he's the heel Eve though I knew he was a heel beforehand. There was just a lot of stuff, you know, Demolition was gone by the by that point that I started watching. Wow, right, it just ended. You know, there was such a changing of the guard in nineteen ninety one where a lot of the guys, I mean, like Dino Bravo was was was this was gone. Yeah, Like by the time I was watching, the natural disasters were formed. What is this tug Boat

character? Right? Who is this guy? It's fascinating. Yeah, it's wild. I'm right after Tugboat cut his promo. So I got Gorilla and I got uh Roddy Piper. Yep, me too. And for those following on on Peacock, this is one thirty six thirty three. I We're going to take you all the way through the tag match. We're Virgil teams with Teddy Biassi to face Dusty Rhoades, the namesake of the virtual character for some

irony, and Dustin Rhodes, who was just breaking into the business. And this is the match where Virgil finally has enough after years of Teddy Biassi's demeaning treatment and what an angle it is. It's amazing. It's the reason we're here. Yes, that they did this angle is the only reason that Virgil registered with us such that we would think to invite him to a party in

twenty twelve. Yep, but this is it. Yeah, three two one play anybody at the top of their game, ready for the royal prest the piper, the bare chest under his shirt, I can take it out. This has been the greatest acting like he's on cocaine the whole night and I have ever been at and I am truly excited and the best. It's just yet thet he's popping gorilla, just acting like a fucking saying general thing. The big tag team matchup Virgil, the henchman of the the Henchman Boss.

Yes, of course a catch Dusty and Dustin Rhoades. I love this. I love this whole story here. I love this fucking story shared some stim mill talked about life, talked about pride, talked about want money not by, talked about sat there and instead of instead of leaving a million dollar tip and thank you, we want we walked cars eyebrows. I'm sure so good. And the Virgil before that time did not have friendly cry now let's take you to Sean Norty this idea, and tonight you will be the wine Son

tag team Dusty and Rhodes to have. And I would say that is a very why did this happen yet? To see you see Virgil as a tag team. How do you think your bodyguard is put a fairy knight in the ring? Man? I think my bodyguard is gonna fare very well. Everybody wants to know why why does Virgil wipe the sweat from my brow? Why? What is virgil my shoes? Shoes massage my feet? Look at the tight shot of Virgil again, theowl form of treatment that I feel fit to

give him. This right here is why the almighty dollar I have but a bodyguard I have, but a tag team partner. I have but the best that money could buy it. And this right here is why Virgil will do it. And you, Dusty Roads and that bunk of yours are gonna find out in just a few minutes. There is a bodd and that bond is the money. That's a man. Not a word from Virgil, but he's got to look on his face, that's like he's eyeballing. DIBIASI the whole

time. He's not looking at the camera or anything. He's looking at DIBIASI here it comes to dream dream what is he? Man? Working hard, heading hands. He's got a common hand sticking down in his hands. Yees American cream. Yeah, was this in Tampa? The show? This was Miami, Miami. I think I just saw Jason Hervey. I could be wrong. It looked like him, but I think he was a little too young actually, because it did have the same haircut. It might have been

a Jason drey Well. I love this woman. This woman is dancing over there, you can see her. She gets back into it with she gets right backed into it with with dba's team. I always love that. Such a great man. The best ones are the ones where you've watched them three hundred times because there's stuff I would never notice. Look at that, Look at the soft focus, the way they came in Virgil they're putting in the foreground. Yeah, they're they're doing such a good job getting us to pay

a little more attention to Virgil than we normally would. Yes, TBIASI ever the the cocky stride on his way to the ring here for tag team action. Justusty, Wow, just because we pay you someone a salary doesn't mean to give you the way to intimidate them. I I believe that I have the right to in tip many people because they get the sealery wiles would I And how how good is Piper here? Oh? He's what's he doing?

He is the reason he is He is setting up that Virgil is a human being, that Virgil doesn't need to be the million dollar man's guy, like he's he's the person. Like I don't know, I don't know how it

was played up beforehand. I don't know how it was set up. But like I don't know if there was that if they were actually playing up the descent of debiosity and virtual you know, I don't after this, Yeah, I don't know, but I but what I do know is that Piper is setting, is laying, is planning to seed, and it's brilliant because it's not done in a way that it's like, oh wait a minute, you

know this is this going to happen in this match. It's done in a way that he's just drawing attention to a guy who we've seen and like, I guess commenting on the stuff that maybe people have have talked about but not really talked about or known but not talked about in public. Yeah, here's a guy who you know is just you know, taking this, you know, essential abuse from this from this guy. So absolutely, Piper is Piper is a key element to the success of this Virgil run from the Rumble to

SummerSlam. Yeah, because Virgil would never be able to carry the storytelling verbal part of the whole thing. No, no, no at all. It's a very savvy move to put Piper in this position, and he does a great job calling upound, you know, his own background, his own his own personal mythology about coming up fighting in the streets and being somebody that was kind of a you know, kind of somebody that would that was disrespected as a kid. Yeah, like the clothes line, Dustin Roads drops Virgil with

the high flying clothes line and a dropkick. The match started with didiostic Virgil having their Irish whips reversed and they both collided. Did Piper ever get arrested for dealing heroin of no comment, having fucking bricks of heroin like a street archin. Yes, Yes, look at this DBAs dressing down Virgil at ringside

after a and what makes it work too. Is the fact that, again, at least to my knowledge, outside of that that MSG show, I've never I've never seen him wrestle, at least on him on a major card. I distinctly remember this feeling like the first time I saw him in the trucks. Yeah, and it's like, you know, he got he is. It's a major card, and so you kind of would see a frustrated gbase when his guy's not doing well. Absolutely, yeah, because that's a

new side. Like you DBS is always disrespecting Virgil and stuff. Yeah, but but him being frustrated that he's gonna actually lose a match due to Virgil, that that adds a new layer to it. Look at Virgil the leap for I've tried a monkey flip. If Dustin put the brakes on, throw on the elbows now and look at Virgil bouncing all over the place. But look at that. Look at that fucking taking the bump a nice clothesline over the top of the floor. Father and dad looking awkward, and now Debasu

stomping over to Virgil, gonna pick him up? What fuck's the matter with you? Screaming at him? Get in there. But I remember that the sense the thread running through this of like Jesus Ted, like Ticket. He's the guy doesn't even wrestle like you expect him to be able to beat these guys. He's never wrestled before. Yes, he's supposed to be able to beat them, all right, that's the name of the game. Virgil slaps the apron in frustration, climbs back into the ring now to engage with Dustin

Rhodes. Yeah, I don't see you in there, Debias says Piper again, so good planting seeds. Okay, he's just planting seeds. What a frustrated tag in there. You know, you know what makes it. I'll show you how it's done, he says. That's what Debasi said to Virgil, show how it's done. Wow, an asshole, But you know, you know again going back to Piper, Piper is is thirty of what makes the moment at the end of this match so special. Absolutely, his screaming,

Oh it would be it would be an incredible moment as itself. But Piper screaming is that is the whip cream and the cherry on top of the Sunday. I can't wait for that moment. It's so magical. That's one of the best moments of the herat WW. It's so funny. You know, it's like, you know, people always talk about creative being down and stuff, and this is, but like, think about the amount of emotional angles that occurred in nineteen ninety one. This right here the game coincidentally,

it's like two of them. So many of them actually involve Virgil, Teddy Biass and Randy Savage. Yeah. Yeah, you know from Savage Savage smashing Warrior in the Head earlier on this show with the thing Savage and and Liz reuniting they get married by like this is. I never understood the the amount of disdain that this era got, this year got ever got it, never

understood it. There's such incredible storytelling like that. I think if you lived through the whole Mania phenomenon, you knew that business was sinking maybe, and so you didn't want to judge it on artistic you want to judge it on well, it's not as hot as it was two years ago, three years ago. I mean, I just remember it being some of the most exciting television. I mean, here we are, right, I mean, here's

everybody Conrad, so many people that do successful wrestling podcasts. This is their era, and if they grew up in another era, I'm not so sure that they would have the fields required to do something like this. Yeah, it's a whole industry. This era was so dialed in that it created an industry of retrospective wrestling podcasts because everyone this is everyone's true north. It has a grow era because because you know, and part of that too is I

feel like everybody in a good way is on cruise control. That's right at this point where they're every no one's no one's trying to prove anything to somebody else. They're just like comfortable in their spot. They're they're doing their thing,

and they're just kind of doing business as usual. And I don't think it's a bad thing in this in this part, like just I mean, also speaking by the way, speaking of of weird stuff, remember I started watching at the end of the year in ninety one and with Jake, Like the first thing I saw was Jake the Snake Roberts slapping Elizabeth and beating up

a completely weakened Macha Memority Savage from Tuesday and Texas. Right. Yeah, so to come and watch this show, being the first videotape, my first glimpse into into the past and seeing Jake as a babyface, like, what the fuck happens? Not only a baby face but one of the hottest baby faces, just you know, a crazy, crazy reaction, and when he gets it, when he comes out of the ring. A couple of times they are Virgil saved Teddy Biass from the sleeperhold of Dusty Roads and from a

pinning predicament. So they're getting that in that Virgil is still being a loyal servant to ted to BIASI still giving his bidding. And then he just got tagged in and dodged a knee, lifting the corner from dust and Roads. And now Virgil targeting the weakened leg of the natural, the future Natural, showing some ring savvy. Here is Virgil, yes, indeed, attacking the weakened limb the compromise line, yelling have him to get up for something.

We've heard Virgil verbalize anything on WWF television. He's virgilizing out there. That's a great trivia question. I don't know if people have studied it more exactly or have a memory. Almost the first time Virgil uttered a word on WWFTV, I certainly couldn't tell you. I couldn't tell you either. Virgil dragging Dustin by the weakened leg over to the post. Now he's gonna ram the knee into it. Yes, and of course looking like he's thirty five when he's twenty two. Oh, I mean, I know, I mean he

does, he really does. That's the thing. Then he looked thirty five for the rest of his life when he's fifty something. I know he seriously doesn't. He doesn't look his age now, ye know, look at the purple of that apron, I know, Burgundy, like Burgundy with that fucking logose folks, please, it's all it's just so simple. It's so simple.

It's like that stuff is just so you know. I've never while I've been okay in the past with with titles changing, I know that you're very the look at the belts, yeah, but like, look at the belts changing. But I'll tell you one thing that I've never liked is the logos of the show's changing. Yeah, sacrilege. It's been like they're so good, they were so awesome, and I don't I don't know why they needed to be changed. Again, I get it, you need to evolve sometimes

and things there it is. That's it. There's the spot that sets it up. DBS was holding dustin roads open. Virgil came in through a clothesline. Dusty Dustin get out of the way, and Virgil drops DBAs Virgil slapping his hands like damn it, I can't believe I did that. DBAs. He's out and he slapped him. Then he chops him. He's destroying Virgil. I remember that was it too. He didn't just slap him, He

started doing wrestling moves to him, fucking beating him. He rose Virgil violently out of the ring to just a million dollar man so tired he can't get up a buzz in this crowd as Dusty gets the tag. Yep, what did ted Dbasse just do to Virgil? He just beat up his namesake, all I know? Yeah, Now the real Virgil cooking here and I love this. Let's bury. Let's very fucking dusty roads right now, Roll up by dbasc two three pins dusty roads. That's it, nothing, nothing dust

immediately exit. Fucking Dusty came in like a house of fire and he got pinned on a fluke fucking roll up. It's a weird finish like a bitch. So here we go. It's time to do some business. BBS standing victorious in the ring, Virgil still collecting themselves on the floor after DBS beat the ship out of him and threw him out there. Now Deber is looking down at Virgil and barking at him. Games with the chin strap fucking beer. So let's lay out for this whole thing. Yeah, the mat that

can't come back. It's time to make us care about Virgil. That nobody nobody crosses a million dollar man without paying a puss that to night, No Jo, have kid of yours paid the plus? That's right, Na, listen to the crowd. Orty Chenney, Virgin you paid for the price till four too? Hate the price before too? What is a million dollar belt? Ki free and put it around my waist? Yes? Boy, the really stick in here, piper man, I'm so a scotsman. God,

it cuss his money tops, Laddy anything. Look at the eyes on Virgie. Yeah, Now, Virgil really knows how to make a face like he's about to lose it. He does. He's looking at tend to be in a way he never has before. I'm understanding the guy, and he does it. He still eats ship, He still does it. There comes a point, but obviously Virgil don't got no points quite. I guess that's one way of putting it. He's not ready, not not Look this is great

here he still builds. It's still building. It's got the title in the in the ring, listening sparkling. Come on, do it. Virgil's holding the belt, holds the belt, hesitating ever so slightly. What's it back in there? And then prompts it. Look at that Look at that face. Look at that scowl. Oh he looks fucking pissed about your family, about your Piper type of memories. Just don't matter. M comes a point. Yes, down with me. Virgil gets down to we need to retrieve

the belt. That's right, ABIASI turns us back to Virgil. Older boom. Listen to Piper. Listen to Piper. Look at his face, spits on the title. I mean, what a phenomenal piece of business. He's not slapping hands, No, he's not smiling. No, he's just walking away. Oh my favorite fucking Hogan promo. I mean to me, just like, oh you know what, brother boss, I mean, what the fuck? How can something involving such a marginal talent be so good. I

mean, that guy fucking nailed that moment. He totally did. And he just like you nailed it. He didn't change the countenance. Yeah, And that's what we want out of a baby face. We don't want a guy who transforms overnight to being a syrupy good guy and he never was before. We want the guy that we knew as a heel, now fighting for good, but not changing who he is. Right, And I don't know,

I don't know where Virgil if even knew he was doing it. But when he made that face and they got that tight shot of his head after he dropped Debias with the belt. By the way, that's the belt shot that I'm pretty sure he said at your bachelor party, DEBSI needed one hundred and forty stitches to close. I believe he said he needed them all around his head. I saw no blood. I saw no blood number one, number

two. I don't know why he would need them on the back of his back of his head, right, that's probably what you say when you know that if you watch the video, you can't see any blood. But maybe I can convince people it's lost in the hair. I see. Yeah, unbelievable moment, really just remarkable angle. It's one of the it's one of it's just such a it is as close to poignant as you can get in for wrestling. Yes, all right, that's really that's really it like it

is. It's such a moment because there's just so much story being told there, years and years of this guy being DBAs servant. I mean, I don't know if it necessarily was a as he says, a six year build to this. I don't know if that was the case. If they're like now, there weren't really hints. Yeah, you know, But I do think that the history was important in selling the moment because you wouldn't have had if you hadn't seen the kind of i mean, the abuse or kind of

him being this essential slave to Teddy Biassi. It's all psychologically in your brain during that moment. Absolutely, and with Piper, we realize the importance and the untapped potential of having a colored guy with a rooting and in something other than every other fucking match on the show. Yes, you know. Now, even if they have a color guy in commentary, I think of like

a Pat McAfee. He's hyped for the whole show because he's a cheerleader, he's a fucking you know, he's a guy that is being compensated for the amount of reactions he can help bring out of the crowd. It feels like he's a pitch man piper while he was animated the whole card and going nuts the whole time and did a wonderful job. He he saved his personal interest. Not he was not analyzing this moment with Virgil. They brilliantly injected him

that. It's always works in wrestling when you get the commentary. Remember when when Taz stood up for Jerry Lawler one time, or Jim Ross whatever it was on Monday Night Raw Lawler who stood up for Lawler stood up for to Jr. Against Taz because Taz was in j R's face. Yes, another example, it's like it's like the announcers can do whatever they do. They can you know, beat whatever drum they do, they can have you know,

their cliches and everything. But there when you decide to do an angle where the announce sir, who's got that unique connection because you can talk directly to the audience and you don't see him. So he's like the soundtrack over what's happening? Yep. When you can establish to the audience that this commentator has this one soft spot for this particular wrestler or for the is rooting for

this particular outcome, you have an alchemy there. You have a moment that you don't often get in wrestling, where like you can accentuate the intensity of it by adding the sound to it, not just the crowd reaction. It's just like, just like Bobby Heenan on the ninety two rumble call, I was gonna say it. I mean, that's the greatest example of that is that Bobby Heenan Rick Flair era, you know where exactly on the heelside, right where you got Heenan, who is just completely in the corner of Rick

Flair no matter what. Yes, he likes other heels but he is he is personally and financially invested, is hyperventilating if Flair almost gets eliminated, exactly Where's that? What happened? What happened to that element of wrestling, which is like forty percent of what makes something magical? I mean, when's the

last time anyone on a WW call accentuated a moment like that? I mean, I don't think anyone's ever been to me that the most recent period of something like that would have been the would have been kind of that that the Michael Cole shit, remember was like was it was it? Daniel Bryan? Yeah, the miss and stuff, and they did a good job at wrestling a thirty. But even then, that's just a good articulate call, like Jim Ross will do. I'm talking about what he would get involved though,

he got involved with with a heel. Yeah, the heel, like you know, to me, that's an example of it. Yeah, sure, like where he had a personal he wanted him to lose. Yeah, that's a good that's a good example. Yes, But I can't think of any

other times, like ten years ago now exactly exactly. That should be something you do once a year, you know, honestly, not too often, but you pick it right, man, and you can make you can make someone like Virgil be somebody that we're talking about in twenty twenty four exactly. So we're well on our way here with baby Face Virgil. And you know, there wasn't a lot of there there, so it didn't last too long. But while it did last, it was memorable and Roddy Piper was carrying

most of the freight on the interviews. Here's a segment where he just leans, as Piper used to do, way too often, leans way too much into the racial side of it, and like too many puns about the fact that Virgil's black. But that was WWF at the time, that was wrestling at the time. There's probably society at the time. Honestly. Yeah, he is on a I think it's wrestling challenge on stage with Virgil shortly after

this turn of events. Do we have going on this week, mister Piper, Well, this week we're gonna have a little lesson and human rights. We're gonna have human rights one on one. You see, he didn't always stand for Piper. Please start for poverty, Please start for a lot of different Princess. There's a difference between being a friend and fool, and I does hate a bully. Virgil want you to check something out here. I want you to take this cloth, and I want you to say to me,

Roddy, my back's hurt. With your mind friend, uh, shining my boots for me, Prowdy, my back's hurting. We please mind shining my shoes for me and my pleasure, friend, stick that foot out out there. Wait a minute, wait for what's going on? Oh, honey, I can make him shine. You're looking at me? You look at that boy? Yes, how's that look? Looks good? Get it off with kilt there? Hey, what's the point. It's a pleasure, you know why? Because I'm your friend. Let me give you out. Let

me give you another little uh blessing. Here. You take that cloth there and you say to me, rdy, kiss my feet, rowdy, kiss my feet. Stick it in your nose, slip me, don't it kiss like me? Just my food? Then you know your nose slamming here? Like, don't it kiss my had you just suck? Stick it in your nose. You'll try it. Brother, listen, step down there on my boots. And why is that cow of the bolts off my boots? I said, get down? And why the cow stop fall from me boots?

No? I said, get down? Whip the cow stuff off my boots? No? Who know? O? Whow Why don't you see your see your black nags? Oh can't see how white? Next? I don't see a yellow next stuff? I see kar man? Why are you? How are you gonna like my No? Let me again. I want you just spell man. Such oh hey, oh, I want you to look in at camera. Come wrestle me. You'll tell Fibasi Hi you spell man and wrestle Dibia. Just spell man. C I r K I l M. Come. How do you feel? I feel like a ray of heat.

I'm wrestling. Guess who's coming to dinner. Guess he's coming to dinner? All right, I guess it's a deep a the sentiments. Okay, it's it's just kind of like in your face. That's Piper before you went. I know, I know, I mean, honestly, I'm surprised he didn't like do what he did at WrestleMania six and walk out with half half in blackface. Yeah that's right. Yeah, this is not too long after he

did that. Yeah, but you know that's the that's WrestleMania build. Actually that isn't SummerSlam build, right, And what did they do at WrestleMania. They thought it was a one on one match between Dbias and uh and Virgil. Piper was out there with with Virgil, but he had the crutches.

Remember he had the crutches. He had like a motorcycle accident or something, and so eventually, Yeah, I think I think DBS lost by count out, so he didn't like it wasn't like a satisfactory finish and uh and then dB Ass kind of beat on on on on Piper with the crutches, that's right. And then Virgil saved him and he said, do Roddy, do

what you told me? Get up, get up so good. And I remember that because I probably told this one before when I was a kid in the rest May seven was obviously a restlem e eight too, was just a massive thing. And of course yeah they're huge shows. I am right. So Resum seven is the one that he's cutting that promo for, right,

that's seven, yes, seven? So that was my first one, really, I tell some Slam ninety one pay per view my first WrestleMania, and so I always associated because of this entrance you mentioned with Piper and the crutches, Roddy Piper his ring walk being a limp. Oh. Yeah, so I try to you know, I try to pantomime the wrestlers. Is the way they came into the ring as a kid, and when I would have Piper's music in my head and I'd be limping, you know, like like

that was his signature, but just happened to be this one show. I watched one show that's just it like you know, like those that's the thing is, you know, I I it's like that that that's Saturdayn's main event for ninety two. I always in my mind, I have always attached commentators saying, you know, doing the uh what's his name, I can't think of his name, the songwriter, but he says, don't you don't you don't tug on Superman's cape, you don't spit in the wind. It's like,

no, it would happen one time. But I watched that show so many times that it made me think that everybody said that that's amazing, so good. So part of what eventually happens with a piper and in Virgil trying to find stuff to say on promos is a strange thing where they put Virgil

and drag. Have you ever seen this Virgil? Yeah? No, there's there's all of a sudden they're doing like these pre tape proms, not in front of the people, like the thing we just heard, but you know, against the green screen and because Scary Sherry or Harry Sherry as Ruddy Piper WrestleMania, by the way, that that would be that'd be the time that Sherry started working with Deeves. Absolutely seven. It's because so much weird shit

happened again, Like you look at the more than any other year. I feel like you look at the beginning of the year ninety one, you look at the end of the year, and the whole everything is different, so eventful, so many sea changes, and so now with Sherry aligned with Dbasi, Piper feels like he needs to find a woman to counteract Sherry, to align him with. And so there's a couple of interviews on syndicated television where

Piper brings in Virgilina who's Virgil and drag dressed up. It looks like, I don't know, almost like a media looking woman, and like they stuffed like fruit like melons, and his fucking shirt and everything and gave him like the big lipstick treatment and everything and on the wig, and Virgil tries his hand at showing some range. Of course, now they're decidedly in the category of trying to find ways to rib Virgil on the square and make fun of him. So the Bloom is a bit off. The rose I think is

a reasonable read of this. But here's here's a sample of Virgil going to a place that many didn't expect him to well for the first time. Dabie Asi, you and I got something in common. Both got something on our corner the shade let me die y So anyway, so no offense to miss Virgilina, my gal, that's not you know, Virgelina was gonna be on the Olympic team except for that small chromosome rule. They ba bah, I need someone that takes care of Harry sharing. This is the doll for it.

What's that BBC? You call me a liar, you say, and this is Virgil. This ain't Virgilina. Who do you think you are? You can't hunt? But alire, mister DMI. I'll my brother right out here right now, I say words lead be aufy. You're looking at that trouble good stuff. I mean, yeah, good, that's a great So that's it. That's it, Verge, you're looking at trouble. You're looking at trouble. So yeah, they did like them. Yeah the piper split

screen effect from that Colisseum video. So you've got Virgil and Drag on the left side of the screen. You've got Virgil as we know him on the right side and having some fun I guess on the square with Virgil. So that was a that's a little footnote there in his story in the WWF Gone, but yeah, the precursor there ninety one we mentioned the Rumble, we mentioned WrestleMania, and all leads to Summer Slam. And this is a special event for a lot of reasons, not the least of which is it was

our very first episode of the Lapsed Fan Ever. Absolutely, and how fitting upon TLFX that the gods see to it that we have reason to revisit that first episode, right yeah, and probably one of the more important moments of that too. Oh absolutely. One of the reasons that we felt this was a great show to start with because there was just so much that was already in our memory banks both about it. This is the show that we really

got the bond going over, you know, like this whole er. It's like, oh my god, you remember this, you remember this detail. I watched it one hundred times. You remember he said this? No, he did I remember this? Yes? I remember? Yeah. I felt that way too. Did you ever hum the theme songs? Oh my god, did your toys ever go over. Oh my god. So this is ultimate, So pull up Slams ninety one if you could, yep, and for those loading up Peacock as am I. We're going to start at fifty

four oh three. It's just as Randy Savage is finishing a phone call backstage related to his upcoming nuptials, which is also very uh a huge interesting with you know, virtuals association with your nuptials. Boss, that's the very that's a very good point, very interesting going on there. So if you're ready, I'm ready. I'm ready. Three two one played Dbias. We are

just moments away from the match for the million dollar belts. Yeah, right now, I can't help but recall some of the humiliating services you forced your former bodyguard Virgil to perform. For example, you had him clean the fungus from between your clothes, a shell the toe fungus, so you made him remove the dirt from your boots, not to mention the constant verbal abuse the former bodyguard had to endure. Yeah, such a good recap package. I

sat a million times, everybody. That's a price for a million dollar man. You see that look, that look of humiliation on Virgil's face, Well, that look is my note com person to the humiliation that you're gonna suffer tonight, Virgil, in just a few minutes, at the hands of a million dollar man, you come to face the master, to challenge the master in my city, New York City, for my million dollar bill. Well, you better go and cancel all those plans of celebration that you have.

And you remember the gutter that I told you I was going to leave you laying in face down where you're in a city full of gutters. So take your pick, Virgil. But just to show you that I am not a totally insensitive man, I have left you token Sherry. Here it is Virgil. You're crying top. I mean, he's also one of those guys the ring back to you, Gorilla, he's stealer, one of those guys that

what don't know if he's gonna job. Yeah, you know, because he's so crafty, and so many times you think it's gonna be over, you think it's gonna be a clean thing, and it's not. Oh my god, she looks like she just sucked down some coum What an outfit on, Sherry. She knew how to dress for big shows. Oh, she's so fucking awesome, absolutely tremendous the Garden. I mean this is just some red hot summer I'm here for Garden summer slams. Yes, please playing. How

many there have been? How many? I mean, I'm with eighty eight, I'm with ninety one, I'm with ninety eight. Yeah, that's all you need. It is so good. I mean, also, how about just Garden pay per views? They don't fucking do that anymore. I know, it's gotta be fucking only uh, you know, it's got to be a sixty thousand seat stadium in a second tier city, right house shows and occasional TVs for Madison Square Garden. Here he comes the biggest entrance of his

life. M h hell freaking high five with Piper, who's ringside, don't get him the Yangs dbios off the Ropes and goes to town with the right hands for this whip to the corner. Deeps takes the buckle high back body drop Virgil's Cooking Gray six day over the top. Rop goes tob As trying to think of the last time we saw dB As lose lose, like get a pinfall loss on a pay per view. Right before this, I couldn't tell you. I'm gonna say it must have been. Did he even get

pinned in at Starvesers eighty eight? I don't know what it happened, or eighty nine, I don't know, but like it's it's not a common thing. No, No, you know, he'd have one on one matches, but it would always end like in a dq ORR or or you know, get they get close to beating him, but they wouldn't go quite the distance. That's a great point. That's part of also part of what makes it so awesome. Mm hmm. And I remember so much from this match,

Virgil, and I'm sure he's doing it not so much on purpose. And now we're back in he's doing the fancy footwork, the flip flopping, fly jabs, sting like a bee, just feeling like as much as he was showing in the match big right hand, it just felt like he was still like lunging around like someone who wasn't quite a trained pro wrestler. Yes, and that was probably just as amateurnists, but it actually worked for the scenario.

It did. It absolutely did because it added a scrap be factor to him totally like a guy who like even if Dbasi was going to totally out wrestle him. Yeah, could still dig down and throw a curveball at Dbasi that he would never see coming. Just like Orthodox street style, it was more about instinct and it was about right and about heart'll be heaning over just coming down. I guess from showing Hogan the belt, was that what it was? I think? So, yeah, I'll tell you something. You

look good, door. I remember this. Oh Virgil yanked off the apron, goes splat on the outside, those beautiful screaming at deeds to go get him. Look at her the Dominatrix so good. And this is coming off berating Randy Savage at Wrestling India that year. Yeah, and I was just begging that. I was just begging him, clear my meal ticket, please win this match. There're those beautiful blue floor mats. Man. I love

the idea of that. Yes, I love the idea that in wrestling, like, yes, there's your meal ticket, but like what if you lose is what happens? He doesn't pay you anymore? Right, well, it makes half the money, I guess, Virgil chance here at the Garden. That million dollar belt is a non sanctioned match, non sanctioned title makes sense. It's sanctioned by international monetary authorities. Yes, maybe it's it's sanctioned by

Wall Street. So like the way Virgil just took the post there, it's so like it's like so like almost unathletic, Like he's just like a guy that is getting beat up in a street fight. You know. Yep, oh, Virgil, head first, thanks, Gorilla said, headfirst, into the steps, goes Virgil and then does a bit of a flare flop on the ringside match DBAs keeping the pressure on now with a knife, etch chop debrus. This big guy man, he's big next to virtual. We saw

a Virgil stacked up next to Hogan. You couldn't really see that, Like he's like, James is such a big guy. Did you never He's never been so muscular, so you don't really think of him as being right. And they're rinning, barking away picking up Virgil. Now, hook of the whip. Virgil takes a big clothes line, and this is where you start to feel I remember feeling like, oh Jesus, what did Virgil get himself into? You know, yep, here we go again. This is where

he's teaching the lessons understood why he did what he did. But did you have to step in and try to wrestle this veteran, you know, right to take the fist drop, take some time and train and a million of course job. Jake Roberts had the million dollar belt too, didn't he? No? Never, he never won it. I think he wrestled for I think I think they think wrestling six he wrestled for it. I'd be wrong, but he never actually had it. I believe this is the only time

it ever changed hands. Pretty sure that's the case, even after the first time, and then the second time, you know, DBSi got it back, and then he got rid of it right. Doublas lands there off the ropes for a DBAs Virgil taking the head over heels bump. That's of course probably planting the seed for when Dbasi tries it again and takes the right to the gut he does the front flop. Mm hm, take it the leg

by DIBIASI gets too those. I guess you could say that like Tedbasi Junior had the million dollar title well after I mean, I'm talking about this initial run about that he he kind of like his ring master had it right, but like this, after he wins it back from Virgil thanks to the help from Repoman, he represents the belt for it that the bad cop gets to. That was that that the you get rid of it after that, and I'm just gone, we're gonna use it again. Bring the rest of his

uh his in ring career? What have you been holding? I've been holding back up dubes with the WHI where the ducks this clothes line and grabs a million dollar drain. It goes Piper. God, I just got so excited for Piper's call of the finish yep, yep, I get to share. It's part of the biggest like in a way it would have been about that. It's a good it's a good piece of c Cherry jumps in the ring and hits Stebia up Virgil, who had a million dollar dream on with her

purse earl have her calling for the bell pitchinglayers. The reoferee has every right to disqualify the million dollar man. Yes for outside in aparent okay, give the bill herd. The have rendered an official decision and it is as follows. Number one, he is honorary that the sensational cherry returned to her pressing room. No, thanks, can't come to what's the money else? He

car she's got n's the manager sad he didn't you too. The referee has further rule that the match between the million dollar man and Virgil, who continue so fit. That's so good. Look at him, look at him. We're an a galley out here trying to escort share to the back. Tony gia as well. I love what Piper's going. No, no, when they announce a DQ and he didn't goes it's okay. You can keep the belt like he's saying, no because DIBIASI got DQ, not because Virgil doesn't

get his chance. Oh look at this slow recovery both their feet. Great spot here, yep, no pride, you're going to You're going to recret into the corner. But no he puts. Virgil blocks elbow and deburs takes it. Come on, Roddy, look at look at look at it here we are here, we are head first the look at debs oh ver over again, look at deeps and blareflop right hand blocked. Virgil throwing the boxing punches in the corner. Shouldn't get another chance to win a million dollar nice

chopped by verg not bad corner the corner whip buckle taken by Deebers. Corner mount by Virgil at the garden, crowd behind them, three four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, eleven. It's a trivia question. How many corner punches did Virgil hit? Teddy Biassi with it the ninety one summers, Yes, Roddy, yes, Oh the first whip Virgil crushes the ref in the corner the corners to take his time. Now he reth bump, you know, when he gets actually squashed in

the corner like that. I could understand maybe hurting if it's if it's done, you know, if you hit the right the wrong way. Yeah, not like you know, an elbow to the face, like that's not gonna knock you out. And he's still gonna be done, Yes, Piper, debi As barking at Piper at ringside on the cans. Oh, Jesus, here we go. Debiasse hooks him out. Watch this suit, thus, watch this ship. Jesus fucking christ Man. It's just he's getting his windows,

amigos. Another one, Yeah, he's counting down. Here's another on order. Look at look at that execution like the floating over everything. Just it's brilliant, so simple. It goes Piper like, yeah, they're suplex don't talk to Elizabeth. A live crowd is sensing Piper going nuts. They're chanting for him. Pile Driver just a gorn dwarf plants him cover. Ref's not quite there yet. God, remember having a pit in your stomach as a kid for finishes like this, kick cut me, kick kep the dB

as one more. He sells Piper, Oh, here we go, Here we go, untying the buckle, exposing the metal, exposing the steel in the corner, obviously with attention to m talking trash of Virgil's face, holding him by the neck. So good. Now he's gonna send Virgil into the steel Virgil twice. Steber saks the bomb, Heavener recovering. Come on, come on, there's Now's the time, Virgil, now's the time to suck it up. It's on the verge. It's the tribute casts. It's gonna

crawl, crawl. What's what's heaven you're at? Now? Have us track. I'm nervous, I'm nervous, crawling out for his Virgil drapes the arm on gabers one two bray fucking Christ Piper. Ah, he bumps, take a front flip here here what a waste of money? This is his moment right here, King King King, Kinky King King, Can I can gain King King King King King can get Piper? What was? Do we know

what their relationship was? Not? Really? I mean he very complimentary towards Piper and interviews, but no, no, more pronounced than anybody else, you know, definite Virgil with a million dollar title and and Jesus, it's all here as he walks up the aisle. Oh so good. That's the same way he was holding the belt when he came to a certain bachelor party, wasn't it? Yep? Yes it was, and that's why he carried that around as a prop his whole life. Yeah, because of that match.

Yep. Unbelievable. It really. It's a testament to Piper's ability, like his performance ability on verbally that he if they didn't have that close of a friendship or it wasn't that remarkable as it seems on television, that he was able to get that across is incredible. Totally agree they were. You'd think they were the absolute best friends of all time based on what they on the way that that their their connection in these moments. Here in this podcast,

everybody has a pod. Teddy Biassi comments on this piece of business and just the feud overall with Virgil in ninety one. But you know, we continue to be friends and I would see him at h That's not the clip I was looking for him to see if I have it here, Yeah, here it is. Uh. We met when uh in the WWE office when this whole thing with the billion dollar man started. And you know, back

then, my cat, I mean, oh my gosh. You know, he had this tremendous body and kept himself in shape, and basically that's that was his role. You know, he was like the bodyguard. You know. You know I would run my mouth and if somebody wanted to say something, I'd I back up and say Virgil take over. But uh, what we did we did a thing where basically, as Virgil, Mike gets tired of all of my crap right and just says, I'm not doing it anymore.

And and so we we ended up having a one off when and had a match and dog going to you know, Mike was a great guy, nice guy, and like I said, to keep your body in that kind of shape takes a lot of discipline, and he was very good at that. He was he was much better at doing that than I obviously was in terms of state keeping his body in great shape. But it was, you

know, I just wish that he had had more wrestling savvy. I don't know how to put it in any other way, because if he if he could have really wrestled, we could have had we could have had a good run. But basically it was it was on and it was over, you know, pretty quick. Good old Virgil. Uh, he didn't have the charisma, you know, and so you know it was probably over before it really started. Surprised to hear Debasi talk about it that way or is it

sound like a fair assessment to you? No, I think it's a fair assessment of him. You know, he doesn't he doesn't have it. You know, he got by on what he had. It's miraculous that they pulled off moments like that. Really, yes, it is. It absolutely is. It's a testament to how like false it is when they talk about like like these intangibles that they pretend are in the wrestler's control to get a push

you know. It's like they prove all the time that they can take people without a great range of talent and make them absolutely memorable wrestlers, just like here with Virgil right right CBS. He said in his book Virtual wasn't the best worker in the business when we started our program. I had to be at my best for us to have a match at Wrestling seven in nineteen ninety one and work at the highest level was truly a testament to Virgil's desire to

listen and let me lead. He was very coachable and ended up wrestling a lot of good matches. The match of success had a lot to do with the presence of Roddy Piper. In the end, even though my new valet sensational show he was in my corner, I lost to Virgil. I was counted out after attacking Roddy Piper outside the ring. The storyline Crown Virgil is a new million dollar champion. He's just totally all over the place, he

says. The getting hit with the over the head with the belt by Virgil on the big baby face turn was it SummerSlam instead of Royal Rumble for instance? And all that I pisces me off so much time not hard to get right. Cannot I cannot stand it when when that's oh god, it's so annoying. If you don't know if you're going to get those kind of details wrong, don't say the name of the show, like no one the reader doesn't care. But like just stop purposely to get it wrong like that is,

but it's like one search away. Virgil contributes this quote at this point in the book. I learned the psychology aspect of the wrestling business from ted. In fact, there is no better teacher than ted when it comes to the psychoology of the business. Overall wrestling ability and speaking skills, he is the best. Working with Ted was unbelievable. There is no better field general than Teddy. He was one of the best wrestlers ever in the business.

He's in a class by himself. Given the Piper, it interfered to my matches against Virgil, we started a program, TBIs writes, and he goes on into everything that happened with Rowdy Roddy Piper. So there it is. Boss. Virgil is now a made man, at least in our minds and our memories for sure. And he's going to get a chance to try to rise to the occasion and do some promos that you know, make you want to see him defend the million dollar title or at least continue to excel as

a as an individual. Let's get a taste of some of the promos on WAF television. After this historic win for Virgil and the singles ranks, Virgil is the new million dollar champion and he wants to share the belts with everyone. Bboss. I look on my million dollar belt and I can see fingerprints from garbage men, fingerprints from a piete the carriers, fingerprints from auto workers, fingerprints from secretaries, and all kind of little fingerprints from little small kids,

like what you should eat your heart out? I know you want to come get it now? What's holding your back? I could come anywhere, any place, call the place, man, and I'll be here to defend this because I have all the good people behind me. Man, the wan to rub on this belt. It's my belt and it's all the people's belt. So you wanted to be your belt, come on down and get it,

because I'm not born nowhere. The former bodyguard has made it very clear that Tendbiyashi has an open invitation to attempt to get the diamonds in gold back. Hey, Dbosi, open your eyes and smell the coffee. Man, this is mine. Now you lost it and I want it. That's right. You always talk about gonna send the limo, Burgel, almost send the limo to you and bring you the Madison Square garden. Guess what, man, I ran your Madison Square garden. Man. Yeah, I ran in

the garden, up the steps, in the locker room. I was ready, home boy. I went write to the ring and dip my thing. I left the champion, all right, and now I'm a defendant. Kill me, man. And when you consider difficult encounters, no one has faced a tougher challenge than Virgil. The former bodyguard took on an individual who many consider to be the most skilled in the ring and walked away a millionaire. A Dbios, look at this. You're looking at the million dollar champ.

And guess what I'm looking at, Ted DEBIOSI I'm looking at you the million dollar jump. Okay, you should go by the words, man, of words of wisdom, a fool and of money soues the parts. You know what I'm talking about. You had one million dollars you put on the line against a hard working man, a man who works hard for his money. Man, I came and got it. I came and got the job done. Ted, you didn't have a deep in heart right here. Brother.

You might be a great technician, homeboy, but I'm a sure enough fighter. I'm just like all these good American out here, working eight to five every day. And you talk about man, you put a million dollars on the line. I went and gut it, and now it's gonna be bankruptcy. Well, Virgil is certainly living a dream after capturing the million dollar belt. The former buddy Guard proved that if you work hard enough, anything is

possible. Quite a slate, Oh, verge, verge, she needs a promo class with the miz an Any postgame on his verbal attempts there not good, not good. It's bankruptcy. Yeah. They're making him deliver these lines that are like, after the million dollar Champion, you're gonna go bankrupt, my homie, My boy, what homeboy? Yeah, my homeboy. I went in the ring, I got the million dollar bell, is my belt,

you'll go bankrupt. There's flashes of something there. He gets that little jive going it's good, but no, no, listen again, I think there's I just feel like it seems like nobody took the time with him to actually, yeah, hone his skills. They just kind of threw him into the into the lions. Then after being over because he was silent for four years, five years or whatever it was, then all of a sudden, we're gonna put the mic in front of him and ask him to be a

totally different character and hopefully delivers on the mic. And you know, that's

the wrestling business. You either sink or swim in that situation. So while I made that proviso about how they know damn well how to get a mediocre wrestler over as a world beater or some of the fans can latch onto like we just saw at Summer Slam nineteen ninety one, the fact of the matter is once the carpet is laid out for them to start cutting promos and establish a connection with the audience, that isn't so easy for them to dictate and

manipulate. We rather have that or you don't. So that's Virgil and his bid to kind of extend his moment in the spotlight that started in Earnest in nineteen ninety one in a particular Summer Slam, and by the time nineteen ninety two rolls around, there's a lot of changes of foot in the WWF. Virgil still with the company, but of course Hogan leaves, Warrior gets fired.

Brett Hart has made WWF Champion out of absolutely nowhere, absolutely in nowhere in the fall of nineteen and ninety two, and it led to a unique opportunity for Virgil because suddenly he's one of the last connections to the Golden era we've spent so much time talking about. Yes, I mean, of course Brett was there, Sean was there. A lot of the cast of characters were there, but they weren't They weren't featured as top baby faces. They

were more tag team associated, they were more chasing ic title level. And not to say Virgil was a main eventor but he was a guy that you associated more with the prior era than the next generation. Who was still around, who wasn't right, who wasn't cast asunder and the scandals and the whiff of you know, government crackdown on steroid use and all the other things that

led to so many Davy boys, Smith getting fired, sid disappearing. So many of these guys just completely disappearing in nineteen ninety two, and of course the reshuffling of what the top of the card looked like, so that Brett and Sean are given the ball by the end of nineteen ninety two, when they would have never been considered main eventors just a year before this, the

year we just looked get in nineteen ninety one. Of course, nineteen ninety one was the year that George z Horion went away, and the ripple effects from that were very clear. By the summer of ninety two, the the subpoenas, the Grand Jury subpoenas are arriving at Titan Towers, and it's clear that Feds are after Vince. So it's it's time to kfabe the U,

the ster rid, the steridzoids as it were. So, but Virgil still there and Brett is trying to get a solid foot forward as this new fighting WWF champion, right, that's the yep, that was the the fightingest champion of all time was his kind of gimmick, that's the play. And so as a team, Brett and Virgil actually headline a couple of house shows.

Sure wow, yeah, Sure. After Brett becomes champion, Tim and Virgil I think against Flair and I'm not sure who else who else it was, but Virgil actually had a sudden, you know, brief but noticeable association with with Brett Hart. But before we do that, let's get it. Let's get a flavor of a Virgil. We heard him after winning the belt. This is him before winning the million dollar title. A million dollar belt is gonna be on the line, as million dollar man Ted DBIUSSI means his former

bodyguard Virgie. I'm gonna catch the train down to Madison Square Garden by at SummerSlam when I beat you, man, I'm gonna tip you're a limo drivers, so nicely. He gonna take me down and ride me down the Broadway and you and Surrey, he's gonna be catching you can the kind of thing I mean, like, the sentiment is there, it's just the delivery is the delivery is not even close. We'll get to that one in a moment.

But first again, the team promo from Virgil and Brett BB and our TV and I rs it wasn't flairing somebody else, Okay, Debios and ours this Friday night, Nasau Coliseum, We're gonna make a small withdrawal from your bank account. Debiosity, We're small change came to help you. I'm talking about Irwin. I sush the massy Virgin, easy, get a grip, save your strength for Nasau Coliseum because this Friday night, me and Virgil are gonna put a serious hurrying on you. You're both gonna pay a terrible,

terrible price when you step in the ring. And it's plain and simple. A case of black and white and we're gonna make a serious, serious dent in your bank account, right, Virgin and debios you can take that. Then a case of black and white. There it is again. Of course, it's very simple. So and this is probably a career highlight for Virgil. He ends up again due to all the changes WWF and is situation where it makes sense to put him in the ring with Brett because Brett's going to

be the fighting champion. He's got Papa Shango on one of the last Saturday Night's main events, if not the last one, wasn't I that of that era of the that run Yeah until twenty six to six seven. There's another lynchpin of the era we've been talking about falling by the wayside there on Saturday

night's main event. And what do you know, come a November, late November, right before Thanksgiving episode of WWF Superstars in nineteen ninety two, Virgil this was I believe they actually I believe if I'm not mistaken, this happened the week the week before, Yeah, the Saturday. This aired the Saturday before Survivor series. And they even talk about it on service series how because

they celebrate how Brett Hard has been this this fighting champion. Absolutely, they even say most recently, he faced Virgil, He faced Virgil, he faced Shiango, he faced Berserker. He was, you know, ticking off these lower names, these lower cards names to establish himself as a champ that would give anybody a shot, right, and Virgil was among them. And uh, we're going to watch the match. It wasn't a classic, but by Virgil standards, it was probably one of the best matches he ever had in

his life, which, of course is bretttheart's specialty. Yep. And here's a glimpse of how they built it up on television. Great preful man, Hard Rainy sum it up. Your champion pulls off a gold Holy not, bro, this guy's gonna be champions for a long long time in my book. After that superb victory, Brett Hart will again put the title on the line. Tonight, on Saturday Night's main event, Brett takes on the Mammoth

Master Voodoo Papa Shango. Now shouldn't he be successful? Then next week on ww F Superstars, the Fighting Champion again defends the gold, this time against the adventurous but persistent Virgil. Now let us hid it from the champion. You know, when I became the World Wrestling Federation Champion, I picked up all Rick Flair's previous obligations. I'm not gonna hide behind this title. And

next week it's Virgil. Virgil, you got yourself a title shot. But keep one thing in mind, Virgil, when you step in the ring with me, you're stepping in the ring with the excellence of execution. Brett Hart, it's the honor to meet you here next week for the World Wrestling Federation Championship. Brett, I have a lot of respect for you, but I want that belt as bad as you want to do godful. Is that jazzy music beautiful or what? So? There it is one last bid to get

the fans to believe in Virgil with a title on the line. This time the big goal, the WWF Championship. It's the November twenty first, nineteen ninety two edition of ww F Superstars. It's a short match, but it's a meaningful one for one Virgil or subject dus. You're here, boss, what do you say? We take a look, Let's do it. Queue it up. It's right off the top. It's the first match of the broadcast. Wow. So if you find video of this show, it's literally

at the very beginning. And here we go. When you're ready, I'm ready, three two one play. Here it comes Virgil now in the the red and white striped pants. It I thought it was it is it bread today? It is a black it's red today. Okay, because he has black and white as well. Combs Brett with this with the strap. It's a new world. It's a new world. Change the game. Here a purposeful walk, the sunglasses, yep, Vincent to overdrive, trying to make

it seem like it seemed like it matters that he's champion. Exactly. Let's see what Brett Hart. Of course, it was famous for making guys that really didn't know their way around the ring looked like they were ready for the main events. Tom McGee comes to mind. Oh, see what we could do here with Virgil. Have you never seen this one before? I mean I saw it nineteen two. Wow, I don't Virgil with a good humor man outfit. This is the Virgil that did the honors for sid right here?

This is the Virgil hit and I'm ready for resuming head is Brett puts a pair of shades on a ringsider. Oh yeah, it's like, give it to me, Brett. There comes Brett. Let's see what Virgil can do here with him. And look at this handshake. Look at that. Wow, that's a really convoluted handshake. And I wonder if that was like a if that was something of significance to bretton verge and they circle, collar and elbow. Virgil the waistlock, takeover, hey hat and I learned to

wrestle. Looks like he hit the the collegiate mats since we last saw him. Look at that Brett wearing a look of surprised in his face. That did he just take me down? Yeah? I just had to worry about jabs. Oh look at that Virgil offering a high five and Brett Hart obliging a new kind of champion here is Brett? Yeah, yes, very much so. Toleray aldon a headlock takeover swiftly done by Virgil, an athletic champion, right, a guy who doesn't need to dominate a match to stay champion.

Right back up in the side headlock. Brett looks to push Virgil off, but he keeps that lock on. Sure, sure does. I hadn't really seen Virgil work at headlock series, not at all. I mean, I've also never seen him do a waistlock takedown that got push off. Over the top goes Virgil and from the other endo across body takes down the hitman, hooks the legg's due and had luck takeover. Look at that Jesus Christ. Fucking Brett hard given Virgils so much offense already is Jesus Christ? Head

luck takeover? Milk it a bit? And then an explosion of activity, dingden didn'dn't another headlock takeover? Yeah? The bread the nice head scissors, Nope, r us out Nope. Now brett'son control. Head luck takeover of his own from the champ. Michael himself talking a lot about Sean Michaels to be challenging Brett the Survivor series coming up. Virgil also had an intercontinental title match against DeShawn Michaels on syndicated television. He yep, have nice things to

say about the click. Didn't have any problems with any of those guys. Of course, you never you never want to talk bat them even today, because I never do it again. At that time, a push off from the headlock and Brett answers with a clothesline. Vigil and see that coming. Yep, Brett outwit wits him. There drops a foot between the legs and a big elbow drop by the head Van Who's now in control. So clean to be able to watch this assistant, Oh, I know their expectations were

so low in a brilliant way. Everything was like he swelled like a treat to see the champion in action. Body slam from Brett hart On, Virgil takes him to the corner, now working him over. Nice euro a peanutper cut there could sell job by verge. Yeah, it's think he's going to jump out of his boots to sell that uppercut. Three three times, Alfonso the referee presided forearm up class Yeah, oh, kept up in the corner.

Brett goes underneath and Virgil starts driving shoulders into the stomach of the hitman in the corner, traps him, and the crowd's cheering. They are He's coming alive. Whip corner to corner. Brett hits the buckle up Virgil monkey flip out of the corner. What wow, he fucking get airtimes Brett. Hitman rides, hooking the leg by. Virgil gets two. What if they decided to pull the trigger? Oh my god, let's give him something to talk about. Let's send him home happy. Back up, whip is reversed

by the hipman. Virgil the middle rope in one motion flies with a cross body, but Brett, too smart, drops down. Virgil sails over his head and look at that, Yo, he's going in for the kill. He fell into the trap. Yep, got a little too exuberant. Basic simple gave Virgil some shine without taking any damage himself. Yep. Hit man locks out the sharpshooter. Virgil trapped and he if it's a bit and he

concedes. Yep. Raf calls for the bell. Brett retains. Virgil gets his moment for the WWF Championship. I mean, how many times had he wrestled for the world title. That was it, right, And if there wasn't that turn of events where Brett suddenly was champ, it would have been zero. Right. They get Brett hovering over Virgil checking out, I'm seeing if he's okay, right, good ship, pal. Things they are changing in the World Wrestling Federation, and that golden moment, that golden eras is

fading here. But for Virgil, it's one midbring embrace with the champion of the WWF raising up Brett Hart's hand and for even if for just a minute or two, feeling like he belongs yep. At this part of the card, Red Heart takes the middle world, hoisting the winged Eagle belt that we've missed so dearly. It's a beautiful sight, special bullet, and that was

that for Virgil's brush with WWF championship glory. It's a match. I'd imagine that that meant a lot to him, and I'm sure it meant a lot to Brett, because he was somebody who took credit in elevating somebody that you know, people didn't necessarily see is as worthy, in making them appear to be so it's it would be wonderful if we could get Brett's thoughts, you know, on Virgil, particularly upon his passing, and well we did. Hey, this is Brett the hte Man Heart and I'm reaching out to my

longtime fan. This is going out to JP, and I want to ask your questions about Virgil. I just want you to know Virgil was always a good guy. And you know, I think everybody loved Virgil for just being a guy that was always in a good mood, always just so happy and so friendly and so easy going. I never knew the guy to ever have any problems with anybody. He was just such a great guy. And all I remember about it mostly was just having a big smile on his face all

the time. He loved to laugh. He's loved to laugh at himself. He was a very funny guy. And and he just, you know, everyone that knew him just he just kind of float around and kind of put a smile on your face all day long. He was. He was very easy going, and that's what I think what stood out about him the most. You know, I think when you talk about that match that we had, I know he was a really big fan of mine in real life.

The way I wrestled and stuff. He'd always come back after my matches and talk to me about my matches and how good they were and stuff like that. And then for him, when he finally was going to work with me, he got really nervous and quite worried about not having a good match and having everyone go. Everyone has a great match with Brett Hard. Nobody ever has a bad match with him, and he didn't want to be the first guy to have a bad match with me. And I know that sounds kind

of funny, but it's true and it was really important to him. And I remember telling him it' it just relaxed, We'll have a good match, and that whole match. I think the whole thing about that handshake, which is really funny because that's a handshake that it is my real handshake, but he handshake that goes back to a friend of mine in elementary school, and

so him and I had that for years. And I remember Virgil asked me to figure out a handshake with him, and I said, I showed him the one I had, and it always was a laugh to me because he's the only one that knows it other than my friend. But that's the Brett Hart handshake. And it was always really special him that nobody else knew what except for him and maybe my brother. Oh maybe not even more than that, but anyway, So that was why it was really important for me to

give Virgil that match, and I believe I did. He was really happy with that match. He had the biggest smile on his face and he loved it. And when I heard about Virgil's passing, I saw that match and I saw the handshake, and I just remember how special that was for him and for me, And I always appreciate Virgil for being a good friend. So those are my good memories about him. I don't have much else to tell you about him other than he was a great guy and everyone will miss

him anyway. Take care of JP, stay cool, stay safe, keep on rocking, and God bless. Just great stuff there. I didn't tell him I was rocking to begin with. Well, I think he just assumed you were, just you know, you know, it's just these little things that no one would ever ask him about. Oh yeah, yep. That handshake story is great because it stands out of the match, like what was that. It's a very elaborate handshake, and I'd love so, I guess

Virgil. I guess he didn't know about the heroin. Yeah, yeah, he didn't bring that up. If he knew about it, he certainly buried the lead, that's for sure. Good guy, you know. And a handshake was a friend of mine, you know, in elementary school. You know, I do remember that, Virgil. He he gave me a couple of bricks a heroin one time, and it was really nice. And I and I shot up with Davy. Oh Jesus heroin, it's the hit Man. Yeah, well, I appreciate the compliment, Davy. No one's ever

quite put it that way before. What But yeah, it's cool. Thanks to Brett for that. That that's really uh, you know, it's hard to find stuff to sink your teeth into on a virtual tribute, you know. Yeah. In terms of like things people have said about him, it's it's always very generic things that they say. Yes, but a match there that no one ever talks about, no one knows about or thinks about, I should say, and the significance of it when Brett still recalls to this

day. So that's what one thing that Brett's always good for. Yes, if there's any scintilla of story behind a match, no matter how big or small, he's probably going to remember it and faithfully relate it. And I kind of like the thought of Joel as a guy who you know, was told all along he didn't quite have it and going out there and trying his goddamnedest to have a match, you know, up to snuff. Yeah, and like going out there with with the fucking guy, you know, the

guy, and uh and and Tryina's Tryina's damnedest. And part of, you know, the affinity for Virgil that fans of this vintage had was the way he was covered, as we've referenced already in the pages of w WF magazine. Isn't that right? Boss? That is absolutely correct. You have a couple of readings for us to put us right back where we need to be, the stew that we need to simmer in here when we think about Virgil.

It's actually neat too, you know, because the one we were looking for, the one we found, actually leads into the beauty the great one, Oh wow, the one the uh, the magazine, the faux magazine cover. So where are we going to start? This is June ninety three, This is the June nineteen ninety three issue of w magazine, and there was an article about I mean, talk about laps aerendipity, food unbelievable. It's about food, and it's about how to basically eat healthy if you're a

w superstar. And so I'm going to read to you food for thought. You are what you eat. The dining hall. This this talks about a number of wrestlers. Basically they're eating habits and their health habits. And Virgil makes and appearance. The dining hall in the Augusta Civic Center and Augusta, Georgia was almost deserted. Tables were littered with napkins and empty plates. Most of the wrestlers had finished eating. It was several hours before an event was

to be televised on the World Wrestling Entertainment Network. Excuse me, I don't know what they're talking about. I mean, they used to call their collection of syndicated stations the network. Is ridiculous. A worrying sound emanated from one corner of the hall. So imagine going into this giant hall completely empty, Yes, trash littered everywhere, and all of a sudden, they're sitting at a table. Former World Wrestling Entertainment Champion Bob Eckland was putting a bunch of

carrots into a juice process before he went nuts. Yes, this is right after his comeback. He put a handful of carrots into the machine and gave it and gave it the gas. Oh my God, help us. So he's cut fucking needles and he's shooting up the fucking carrot. This is vince definitely. It crushed the veggies, sending their vitamin rich juice into a cup while the pulp and skin shot through another opening into a plastic bag. Backland

routinely lugs a juice processor with what he is on the road. It's not just because he likes carried juice. It's because he does all he can to eat and drink the right stuff for a healthy lifestyle. After all, as the old saying goes, you are what you eat. As far as living right goes, Backland is mister clean. But he's not done. But he's not alone. He typifies the world of entertainment athletes who go all out to ensure their lifestyle keeps them in tip top shape on the inside as well as

the outside. Eating right is a big part of it. Worlds Entertainment Magazine caught up with Backland to ask him what it takes to promote good health the natural way. I've been drinking vegetable juice, vegetable and fruit juices for some time. Oh my god, I don't know. I've yet to get on that train of drinking juice. I don't know by you, but he's been doing it for some time. That's good to know. As he lifted his cup. Carrot juice is my favorite for obvious reasons. Carrots have an abundance

of vitamins. They also have betokeratene, which is a precursor to vitamin A and has even been proved to prevent some forms of cancer. Really, why does it sound like it's gonna kill me when you say that? Then, Bob. Having said that mouthful, Backlan took another drink from the cup. Here's to you guys at the magazine he toasted Backlin and his Federation counterparts.

Entertainment counterparts are some of the most athletically and genetically gifted individuals and all of athletics, they possess amazing agility, strength, athleticism, and combat skills. The superstars, such as the narcissist Lex Luger Brute is the bar for beefcake and the whole Cogan maintain the best physiques on the planet and do so without any synthetic ergogenic aids, particularly god anabolic steroids. Please stop with hormones.

This is this is definitely that era right agonists or diuretics. The Ruless Entertainment and the Superstars realized that prescription drugs and certain other chemicals are meant for treating illness and not a preparation for the ring. Testimony to that belief is the fact, but the view Rustling Entertainment. He knows he's going to be indicted

in a month. Tests it's athletes illegal subject. In July nineteen ninety one, the Federation Homage Own Initiative YES began to test for animal agents as part of a extensive plug testing policy that includes YES. Today, Confederation is the only sports organization of its kind that has such a strict recording chemical substances. Knowing they must measure up creates an a spree decorps among the superstars. They

know that they can't take shortcuts to enhance their physiques or athletic performance. The bottom line is that the Superstars and the Worlds and Entertainment do things the old fashioned way. They sweat and grunt with monstrous poundages in the gym. My god, oh my lou, Lou, just put in monstrous poundages if you want it. What but just in the gym. Just say monstrous poundages in the gym. Is that a thing? Doesn't matter if it's a thing or

not. It's verbiage and it deserves to be read. Yes, it's verbiage and it deserves to be read. They spend hours on the mat in order to sharpen their wrestling skills and use the remainder of the time in grueling aerobic sessions to pair off unhunted body fat, furthermore, to augment their muscle gains

and athletic performance. Most superstars also adhere to some sort of specialized dietary regimen and sub supplementation program, including the products contained in chyle Polge Format forsh Yes this is unbelievable archele polsh Format Force fact lass Kit in the nine week Body of Building program. Backlan has always recognized that nutrition and sports performance walk hand

in hand. For instance, while at North Dakota State University, where he received a BA like a BS in Physical education, UH Backland constantly experimented with the effects that certain foods had on his body and how those nutrients amplified his athletic ability. I was a national wrestling champion in North Dakota State and a decent football player. Backland said, to gain weight for football, I drank two and a half gallons of milk a day. Not hearing me. We're

talking the real We're talking the real mood juice. Whole milk, I can, he said, mood juice. I drank two and a half gallons of milk a day, real mood juice. Hey, we spent a lot of time on this Virgil tribute talking about how he achieved that size. Yep, I think we're getting close to the answer. In addition, Backland said he had also consumed steak okay several dozen eggs three times weekly. These protein rich foods helped Backlan pack on the pounds. At the time football season began,

he was fifteen pounds heavier and as strong as an aux Baker. No, not the big Yes. When he entered the Federation in nineteen seventy seven, he changed his dietary program. Instead of a diet rich and high protein, high fat animal foods Backman did a flip and converted to a total vegetarian diet. Today, Backland also eat modest amounts of meat and dairy products. That's

when he also started to squeeze vegetable and fruit juice big time. To give you an idea of what we mean, we asked the former champ to let us photograph him while he was crunching up his beloved carrots. He doesn't. He does it with all the enthusiasm and gusto of a real believer. As we were photographing Backland, Virgil came over to the table. There it is, and this is why it's here. Yeah, he watched Backland drink juice

and our photographer took snapshots. Oh no, he watched Backland drink juice and our photographer takes snapshots. Virgil, who had been moaning that this magazine had ignored him in recent issues, asked if he could mug it up for our photographer. We agreed, After all, reporters and photographers don't usually find it at all worthwhile to argue with a man who stands six foot two inches, weighs two hundred and forty one pounds, and can crack heads faster than Backland

can crack a walnut. Besides, we think that Virgil is a really good guy and as far as living a healthy lifestyle is concerned, he's right up there with all with the best that there are. Virgil, although his nutritional preference is not for carrot juice, also carries a small appliance with him whenever he's on the road. Yeah, and his pants A cruck pipe. Oh my god. Nice A blender, Virgil told us. A blender, Virgil

told us as his best friend when he's away from home. It's so tough to eat six times a day when you have to drive two hundred miles to rethel, Virgil said, I mean if you stop to eat and you show up late for the match, and the officials might find you. That's why I take a blender with me. I can make my protein drink before I leave the hotel, pour them in a thermouth, and drink them whenever I'm hungry. Brudus beefcake. Like his megamaniac partner, Hulk Hogan, is an

advocate of carrying his blender with him. He says that he can't get along on the road without one. Without a bionic protein shake three times a day the barber can't cut and struct to efficiency, the Holster and I make our own protein shakes. We start up with some high qualatine protein powder, and then we had a few dozen egg whites, skim milk, and peaches, and we pour it down. Baby, my blunder, which the Holts are like to call the beef a mattic, is just as valuable to me as

all the steel bolts and plates in my head. Baby the fuck believe that's real. On the lighter side of the menu, no pun intended, the Bushwhackers Luke and Butsch here to an eccentric but effective nutritional program. Their diet centers around fish, primarily in the form of sardines, which have a high

nutritional value. Sardines are a good source of protein, are high in calcium, zinc, and phosphorus, and contain a generous portion of omega three, a fatty acid that has received much bally WHO over the last several years. Additionally, sardines are easy to eat anywhere. Luke and Butch can and often do, eat their meals on airplanes, in their cars, or even in

the squared circle. Along with sardines, the Bushwhackers also have a fondness for limburger cheese and grilled calf's liver, which is the only food that contains the entire vitamin B complex, a significant constituent for good health and the acquisition of muscle mass. All told, the SuperStar's nutritional programs are as individual as the

athletes themselves. You too, can improve your health and fitness by maintaining proper food intake, complete with the right amount of macro nutrients protein, carbohydrates, fats and micro nutrients, vitamins, minerals. Let your brain ribble. Let your brain nibble on that food for thought, the next time you sit to

chow, sit down to chow. And that is because there's a picture of Virgil looking up longingly with a carrot in his hand at Bob Backland in a sweater and wrestling trunks, forcing carrots into a food processor, like just a fucking like in the the the maniacal smile on Bob Backland's face. No, it's almost like it's very perverted, Like Virgil considers these carrots his pets,

and Bob is fucking destroying them in his face. I mean he's like he's he's he's holding that that that carrot Virgil like a fucking like he's gonna shift, you know, he's absolutely just quick, quick, light throat motions into Bob Beckland's midsection inside Light, And as you telegraphed, this is a great entree into really the last gasp of Virgil and the WWF spotlight that we could think of. Yeah, it's so fucking money how he just is commanding,

and this article intimates it. Respect from the WWF magazine publishers. He's never been featured, and there was a particular month in nineteen ninety three where that was remedied. He wasn't getting featured as as maybe he used to be. Yes, And I'll tell you, I fucking remember when I got this issue with the magazine, when I came in the mail and I'm flipping through it, and all of a sudden, like I see this other cover and I'm like, wait a minute, what, Yes, what's going on here?

And then it's all these virgils like virgils on the cover. And I've been following this story too, a Virgil not being happy about this, so I was like, oh my god, like wait, what's going on here? Like what is this? And then then you see the little thing and then you realize all these stories are about Virgil. Wow. And it's like, you know, I'm going to read everything, so you have it. But

there's there's a little a little disclaimer up in the top right corner. And what I love about this too is I actually took I took this page out of the magazine and put it on the cover. Wow. I like taped it onto the cover's memory. It was like Virgil Memory. So it says here this is a paid, paid advertisement by Virgil. The World Wrestling Entertainment Magazine is not responsible for the subject or content matter represented on this page.

The the the banner on top says Virgil pens low down and pin them down, Pins Virgil. Two sub sections what do you call them? Features? The features Jack, there are those repeating things. Then the first headline Virgil the Man, the Legend. Next headline Path to Greatness, Virgil's Rise to Prominence, Virgil and Victory, A prolific profile, Virgil Mania right Unite in the Universe. Right, I think we're gonna have to do a Virgil Mania

shirt. I think. So that's it. Just fucking awesome And just like seeming that pose fists, you know, he's looking like he's gonna fucking kill the articles, aren't there. It's just a cover. No, it's no arginal, it's just it's just this fake cover. Nothing about this like it's all so great. Yeah, yeah, those are the little memories man. Yeah, then make up. You know, I'm sure that was somewhere in your mind when you walk through the doors at your bachelor party, do.

I mean, there's so much of that ship, you know, like he really did play an important part in in that, in that in my fandom at that at that age, you know, like he was just there. He was just there. He was just part of he was he was part of the uh of the scenery, you know, in a good way, not like he was just in the background, but like he was. He was a featured player. I'm sure I gave him a world title run at

some point. Wow, you know, he probably got a good shot at the belt and then with that one last bid for attention up in New York where he created the memories that we're still talking about here on TLF all these years later. He did have a career after this, of course, when the nWo took off in WSW in nineteen ninety six, after doing some independence including I think a shot for ECW and went to his Eastern Championship, and

remember we wrestled Terry Funk on one of the hindie shows. Virgil gets the call to come into WCW and he's following Ted Dibiasse, who had come in originally framed us the financier of the nWo. Yes, and it only makes sense when you see Ted Dibiasse, and if we're trying to recreate the WWF here in the fans minds that Virgil show up as his bodyguard. But it

can't be Virgil because now the lampooning is being shot the other direction. Now we must lampoon New York with the name we give Mike Jones, and he becomes you heard it right, Vincent. Here is the the episode of Nitro. Eric Bischoff before he has joined the nWo is uncommentary when Scott Hall, Kevin Nash and the whole crew take over and introduce the newest member. We

told you so, We told you so, joining the broadcast team. Welcome here Siders, National haff An Outsiders six in the background, let Jerry Hawk Hogan and let's bring out our newest member, Ted Dbasse's head of security, make welcome if you will. A name very familiar to wrestling fans, Bring them out, Teddy Ware's bring out Vince Fence. Come on out, face praise, easy, easy, Come on, buddy, So let me ask you a question. All waiting on VENs. So this whole, this whole

thing here, Harry comes ship. Did you just look like it's a barbarsona? What's the dother? Harry comes? Hey, that's come on, buddy, what is who is it? Piss off with the n W O what you like it or not? Brothers? Come on, that's so fun man, Hey Ben, welcome blam. I'm so worried. I don't worry this checks keep it on, keep an eye on him. Bro Hey, hey, hey, stay steady. Ask a question. That's for sure. We got hold it. We could take over we could take over basketball because we

got we got shack. But you know what I like? Hey, there's only two things in life worth watching? Okay, yeah, my brother in law told me to things in this world worth watching. One was Alabama football. The other was NASCAR racing. Can we take a break, no problem, man, we gotta take a break where you want to get broke watching Vince watching Vince. The fuck are they talking about the fucking NASCAR in the

world. I don't know. It's one of those things, like, you know, Kevin Nash is so buried underneath all the references he's trying to make that nobody knows what the fuck he's talking about. I don't know. He thinks he's mocking somebody into the crowd. The audience gets it, and if they don't get it, he's even more self satisfied. You know, the you know the score. Yeah, I know, but that was the m O back then. They just take over the announced desk and just you know,

say whatever came to their minds. And yeah, Virgil walks out through the nitro set and joins them up at the announced position and you can hear some Virgil chants there. The people were excited to see him. It didn't go anywhere. Uh. Teddy Biassi leaves the NBA shortly after this and goes baby Face managing the Steiner Brothers and then disappears from WCW. And Virgil sticks around and then they do the wolf Pack by ninety eight and just forget about

it. He's left behind in nWo Hollywood with all the other brons and just collected a paycheck wrestling in black jeans yep, which is very still to this day bothers me. The idea of someone wrestling in tight black jeans just very distressing. But that was pretty much the role he played, and he stuck around for several years in WCW got on the on the dole, so to speak. Didn't really have any memorable matches at all, not a one that I can think of. And when they kind of switch gears and went with

the West Texas Rednecks in nineteen ninety nine, the Kurt Henniing staple. That was a bunch of country musician types that were railing against rap, rap his crap. Remember that whole thing. I do remember that someone decided it would be funny to add Mike Jones to the Rednecks crew and rename him Curly Bill. And that's exactly what happened. Is he doned a cowboy hat and chewing back and acted like he hated rap. For some reason, that was reference

to something like curly Bill. I don't know where curly Bill came from. Maybe it's Klondike Bill. I mean, he's not curly, that's for sure. I don't know that one. I don't get. When Vince Russo came in and the Powers of the Bat storyline, he changed his name in said of Vincent to Shane. Oh that I remember, Oh my god. It was a bodyguard for Vince Russo along with the Harris brothers. After Russo was

ousted in early two thousand and then Kevin Sullivan regime came in. They recast him as a manager for Ernest Miller, kind of dressing in a fedora and being like a soul man next to the cat. That didn't last very long and made only a handful of appearances really and that role. And then he had a period of time in WCW where he just wrestled as Mike Jones.

Wow, God help us. Uh he was Mike Jones. But in late two thousand he was He was let go right around the time the Bischoff Russou regime happened, and you didn't really see anything or hear anything from him. He started making appearances again in the mid mid part of the two thousands, and he suddenly showed up on a twenty ten episode of Raw and like an under armour shirt and jeans. He got in there and became Virgil one more

time with Teddybase's son. Yes, I do remember that Teddybasse Junior the million Dollar Champion and was doing all of his stuff that he used to do for ted Senior on the microphone and then well into the ring, like holding the

ropes and everything. There was a tag match Virgil in DBAs against Big Show and Mark firstein the actor right, who was a guest host, Yeah, raw that week this is the guest host era oh and Virgil was humiliated and defeated, and then afterwards Teddybiassi Junior stuffed a one hundred dollars bill in Virgil's

mouth and that was the last time Virgil was seen on WWB television. Wild He became sort of like a cult sensation when his reputation for showing up at rest autograph shows and hustling people for more than they were willing to part with

became the stuff of legend. We've mentioned several times. Sam Roberts So of course, was on Opie and Anthony and was in New York a serious XM radio personality and actually went on to be a WWE kind of like desk analyst guy and like you know, show host he would talk all the time about Virgil. He would see him at conventions doing his thing, working his magic

and extracting his toll on on wrestling fans. And he created the blog called Lonely Virgil, which started with pictures he would take of nobody coming to Virgil's table, and Sam Roberts would encourage anybody else who observed Virgil in the wild with no one at his table to send him the pictures, and so he posted them as almost like a Tumblr blog, just a series of pictures of no one caring about Virgil, and you know, snippy and snarky little passages

too that went along with the pictures, little captions, and so it became a thing. It became a thing. This is years after we were talking about him coming to the party and how wild that would be. It's so crazy that no one cares about Virgil and that he's a guy that holds a similar place. It turns out, and a whole lot of other wrestling fans minds of our vintage. It's just like this, like the ultimate, like what the ultimate WTF wrestler yep. And to give you a sense of how

much fodder he was on the radio, airwaves at the time. This is just a snippet of a show from Ropy and Anthony where Sam Roberts is on talking about this phenomenon. Shit you got, Rah, this is Virgil's whole thing, like because there's nobody that comes to his table, so when a few people do, he just scams him. Like the first time I saw him at a convention, I got a picture in an autograph and I go, how much is because he doesn't post his prices because that's part of his

deal. What a scumbag. So because that way, you go, like, how much are the prices? Can you do the play acting that I really enjoyed during the break and you and chemistry? Well, so here's what happened. I'll tell you. Let's go through it again. I'll tell you the story of what happened this weekend. Okay, Because I went up to Virgil and asked for an interview, and he said, not right now,

not right now. I'm making some money. Is there anyone around? There was one guy there I signed to stand and you ever get you had to get audio, Virgil while you're out there. I couldn't what happened? You said? Okay? So so I decided to wait and watch the transaction because I know what my experience has been like with him. So the guy comes up to him and he starts looking at the photos he has laid out on the table, and now Virgil mark yeah. So he starts going, hey

buddy, hey buddy, how about little old school? How about a little old school? Old school? You like the old stuff? Right? Well, oh, old stuff throwback? You know? I like that? Virgil? Yas to watch Virgil on TV? Right? Yeah? Yeah? What do you got? What do you? Which picture you like? Here? Which picture? Which? What's your favorite picture? Here? You see that one that's all the old school guys in one picture? You see that? Yeah? I like I like that one. That's how much? How much

do you get for that? You like? Which one's your favorite picture? You like that picture? Yeah? I like that? You want to me, I'll sign it for you? You mean, let me sign it for you? Anthony? What's you? Anthony? All right? Anthony? See I need to know how much this? Come back? Get Let's get a picture. You want to get a picture around, we'll put the get a picture all right, that's get a big hole all right back there there you go, say, cheese, cheese, right, and that's sixty. Wait

wait, you didn't get what Virgi you girl friend? What you want to get a picture? Miss? I'm here, I don't have a girl. Back around, come back around, come back around. We'll get her in a picture. That would just be seventy. Then with both pictures what and then it's seventy dollars and then he and then he, but he never does seventy. You're right, that's my three card monks, Carnee, uh can

do it? Virgil is not worth a fifteen. That's like no, no, that's when you go to the cornerals and they go, yeah, you're just trying to try to try at the blue with the dart here, not to try again, try again. Do you think guys waste their money who have been trying to go see somebody else, so like they don't have that much, they waste it on him and they leave with a Virgil picture. I meanwhile, they wanted like something cool. Yeah, I mean so far,

I'm I'm I'm I'm all, I'm all for it. So that's what's going on, right. It sounds the way it should be done. So he is now firmly fodder on the Talk Talk airwaves and it's just a second lease on life, not one he would pick necessarily, but he'll take it. And uh, you know this all of course leads to Virgil coming in studio for Sam Roberts radio show and sort of confronting him about the lonely Virgil thing. But now what we hear is a Virgil who is kind of like

halfway between serious and not serious at all times. Now. Ye, so he clearly knows that he's leaning into this a little bit, but at the same time trying to keep up this appearance that he's actually aggravated about it. And you can't always tell. But here's a little snippet, and what do you think. I think? Yes, on one website and that's the real Virgil dot com. Okay, but just the real Virgil dot com. Have pictures of you sitting by yourself at conventions that where do you get that book?

Anyone can give you them pictures. They can take a stap a picture of me coming to a convention at like ten o'clock and no one's around. They just snap the damn picture. Right, there's two damn lazy to come up and pay that thirty dollars take a picture like that. Now let me ask you this. Yeah, I'm listening. You walk around and you have a banner that says million dollar man Ted dbs and Virgil. I like that

banner. I know you like that banner. That's because people come and they say, hey, where's the million dollar man Ted Dbasi And he's never there, I sayss Ted DEBOSSI would have been there, that price would have been triple even higher, even higher. But so don't you say it's advertising. Don't you think there's something false advertising? No? No, I just tell

me sure, because like it's show both of us are saying. I mean, when we were there at a certain time, right like maybe nineteen, it was nineteen eighty seventy, Okay, right now, I still look like I look in nineteen eighty. I was just thinking that amazing there I had twenty one at arms. Now I got on nineteen suit. So there's Virgil embracing it and fighting against it at the same time. There aren't many people who can get away with that as he can. That sounds like the Virgil

we met, Yes, very familiar sounding. So he started making like meme appearances. He showed up at the Joey Janello Spring Break shows a couple of times, and even showed up in AW a couple of times alongside Chris Jericho, who I think took a took an interest in Virgil in his lot in life and trying to support him there he made I did not know he came

in AW. Yeah, I mean he just did like cameos. There were a couple of like videos that Jericho did when he was feeding with Cody over the title, where Jericho was kind of doing like almost like a mockumentary style package about how great a champion he was and he was a Virgil A soul train. Jones showed up as a talking head on that thing, and he also showed up on the April twenty nine, twenty twenty episode of Dynamites, so during COVID making a cameo as well. I think he made an in

person appearance during the Thanksgiving celebration for Jericho in twenty nineteen. Yep, he was there as kind of like the MC for the festivities. And so that was really the last time Virgil was seen on wrestling television, at least nationally broadcast wrestling television, and we all know that it kind of went to a weird place with him and his in his personal situation. Eventually he suffered some

kind of malady. There was There was a good article that was posted by Aaron Di Castro on the Slam Wrestling site looking at talking to some people that knew him later in life, including a referee from Pittsburgh by the name of

Mark Charles the Third, who knew Virgil well and his his situation. He ended up basically living with a roommate who you tend to be Assi at least if you listen to this clip, wasn't necessarily a huge fan of but he ended up, you know, being surrounded with people that were like halfway promoting

him, you know what I mean, way keeping him company. It was a it was kind of a strange deal, but you know, we continue to be friends, and I would see him at some of the comic cons from time to time, and I told him going forward, I said, if you get booked on any of the comic cons and we end up there together, then please come and sit with me. And I did that that much. But the reason that I stopped doing it was things that Virgil had

said to some fans that just you know, it wasn't right. But I'm looking back at it from where I am now and I'm going, and I see he never he never would say that to me. He didn't want anybody to know that he was struggling. And later I did find out I can't remember the guy's name that was his caretaker, but it was seeing to it that he was taking care of a little bit better. And I just don't

know. It's mind boggling to me because you know, I don't know who he was living with or how he was living, but I know that it was not good. It's it's just a sad story. Yeah, kind of weird. We do know from some of the reporting the article I just mentioned that Mike Jones suffered two strokes late in twenty twenty three and was in very bad health as a result of it. How much further worsened his health conditioned God, I guess, is the subject of some speculation for reasons we'll talk

about here in a second. And dementia was also very much an issue. Now, well, we had our moments with Virgil. I don't remember ever feeling like he had dementia quite so, No, I don't think so. It's more just kind of like scatterbrain. Except for his demented overpricing of things. Right, Yeah, that's the wrestler dementia, I guess you could say. But yeah, he started suffering and you know, something close to isolation. I'm sure that the pandemic didn't do him any good because there wasn't a

lot of gimmick tables to set up there. For a year and a half, I'm sure money got extremely tight. There was a thing that he had cancer, and then his sister came out and said that he'd never had any cancer. But it's remarkable just how hard it was to get like reliable signals as to what was happening, what Teddy Biassi may have been talking about.

It was kind of telegraphed to us when we reached out for the bachelor party that the guy who made the connection news, like just so you know, I remember exactly what he said, so I don't be unfair here, but it was something along the lines of, yeah, we know him, but we're probably not going to work with them again because he was basically harassing people

at the convention. He was not necessarily a positive force. I think it had something to do with like making untoward remarks towards women or something like that makes someone uncomfortable, and I definitely got the sense that, Okay, well, while this guy's going to help me reach out to him, it's not like Virgil is necessarily still in their good graces over on that side of things.

So maybe that's part and Parcel I'm sure too. Ted didn't appreciate the apparent situation where Virgil would indicate that Ted was going to join him at an autograph table and was nowhere in the zip code. And then you know, suddenly DEBIASI gets the reputation of no showing autograph shows, and Ted takes it personally that Virgil allows that misnomer to propagate. Potentially that's just me reading between the lines, but I think that's what was mostly going on here. Now.

Virgil did resurface doing interviews for a podcast on Hannibal's television channel on YouTube, and you can find them. It's with a guy named Vinnie Vegas, and he got a few FaceTime style interviews going with Virgil, including one where he talked about kind of like the rough edges of the remarks we just heard Teddy Biassi making his podcast about you know, some kind of perceived wrong that

Virgil did against him. That led to him creating a distance between him and Virgil, and he was able to get Virgil to apologize, but in his state, I'm not even sure what we're hearing, ched Gbasi, million dollar man, I Virgil Michael Jones would like to apologize for anything that was said that I said. You may I'm very, very very sorry because you were

always a great, great man and a great worker. Virgil would emphasize, of course, his constant exercise routine later on into his life, but as noted in the aforementioned article on his passing, he wasn't really He didn't have great use of his arms lately, so there wasn't a lot of jogging happening, not a lot of weightlifting happening, And in his final years, the article reads, he usually hangs out at home, watches the news and game

shows, and a lot of pro wrestling. Virgil often borrows his roommate's car to quote unquote visit his brother, but GPS trackers in the car showed that Virgil is at Wheeling Down's racetrack and casino. Oh my God, which is often confirmed by social media posts with fans who have run into the wrestler and According to this article, virgilis damage too of his roommate's cars over the years.

Who is this roommate? Well, he did an interview with the forementioned vine Vegas on YouTube and Boss, I wish you could, along with the rest of the Solar System, join me in pulling up this video type in Virgil gives a tour of where he lives. Okay, then we're going to end our tribute news the tour to the mighty Virgil, the one of a kind wrestling superstar, with this glimpse at his final environs. Oh my god, Okay, I got an ad. Remember the cameo that Gabe and all

the great members of the Solar System got for your fortieth birthday? Yes, and it was. It was a bevy of cameos, but one of them was from Virgil. We played it on part one there when we were rewatching the bachelor part of footage, and it was like, where is this guy living? Like it seemed like it was done in like a like a hostage video scenario. He seemed I remember that. Yeah, seemed disoriented, he

seemed claustrophobic. This is the place I'm ready. When you are all right, you can find it on YouTube. This is Vinie Vegas for the Hannibal TV interviewing Virgil and all I know interesting name. Here we go three two one play. I want people to see, uh where like Virgil's room if you don't mind, so people can get an understanding, Let's walk back, Agil, give me a tour, bron Uh let me that bus. As we're good, you're on full screen. We're gonna go in. This is

Virgil. This is what. Let me see how clean you are, Virgil. There not be no panties on the floor. No, I mean this is this is all Virgils. Let me see you can make a bed, Virgil? Look at you. I mean it's just we got him a TV on the bureau, but he did not have a bed. We got TV, this table and then we have we just let me see that TV, Virgil. What size you get? What size TV you get? Look at you? Okay, But we got him the bed here that was thanks to

donations, all right? And what he has and if you look in the clock people that anybody, it's all empty. This is his wardrobe here. It's just some we're trying to help from. This is so people think these guys are millionaires and have everything. Well, this is this is what he has. That's why we're asking, you know, that's why we're asking for help for him. I mean, I'm trying my best. I'm dealing with

cancer myself, but oh my god, what he has and disturbing. And you know, we're you know, we hated to have to go this route to try to help. Yeah, we did, and stuff like that. You're pocketing something, pal, What do you care? I mean, that's what we deserve as fans. You know what, what what would that be? We deserve that our heroes and that people that we cheered for, people that we rallied behind, that they end up living completely just awful, unmanageable

lives, because that's what we are as fans. We're there as fans. Were only there for the good times, yes, and as soon as shit starts going wrong, I don't want anything to do with you. No, No, you're off my TV. You don't exist to me anymore. The company doesn't see you as being worthwhile, as being a wrestler. You don't exist anymore. And I guess in that good times column we could put the

twenty twelve Bachelor Party. We'll always have that absolutely always be grateful that Mike Jones took the booking, because it's why we're here, and a lot of the stuff we've talked about is why we were there at the time. But I couldn't help but look at that small, little storage locker sized room and think that he was pretty much back in the same dimensions he was living in when he went to prison. He didn't want to but to know about it. Oh my god, Mike Jones, there's that, and then like not

even like the uh, I mean, that's that's small. That's as small as a New York apartment bedroom. Yep, Mike Jones, I think we can say now confidently was seventy two when he passed away in February twenty eight, twenty twenty four, and the least likely person to have made an impression on us in the Solar system. I think we've done that spot that he holds in the pantheon Justice. So West in peace, Mike Jones, Rest in peace, Virgil, and we'll see you next time on that fucking cast.