A Saturday Night Special - Talking w/ Dexter Taylor

Take a look behind the curtain with a real whistleblower, an American patriot. Prepare to embrace the uncomfortable truth, because this program has no time for comforting lies. Here is civil liberties enthusiasm, Second Amendment defender and recovering FBI agent Kyle Serif. Well, hello my friends, and welcome to the Kyle Serafin Show for an evening edition. We don't normally do this kind of thing on a Saturday night, but here we are with dim the Lights a little bit and we're

doing a Saturday night special. Little play on words there for

you guys. It is Saturday, April the 6th, 2024 and we're rolling live right now on rumble.com/kyle Serif and if you guys want to join us, if you are hanging out over on X and if you saw it over here on Twitter, you want to say, hey, I want to jump into the chat with all these crazies they're already talking, you might as well get over here, jump on into rumble.com/kyle Serif and make sure you give us a like a follow while you are there, OK?

If you guys are familiar with this program, what you know is we always talk about that. I'm a constitutional extremist, and it says that I'm a second amended Second Amendment defender. You may not know that I actually got tossed out of the FBI over Second Amendment affairs. We're going to probably talk about that just a little bit.

But I really want to bring on and highlight a story of a gentleman that I've come to know through playing around on Twitter, because that's where I spent a bunch of time like I probably shouldn't. And his name is Dexter Taylor. He's been on a couple of major programs, but not nearly enough. His story is the story of all of us and he's made me change my mind about one thing in particular that we should just ignore the ceded territories in America.

And those ceded territories are captured places like New York and California. And for all of you who live north of Virginia in on the Eastern seaboard that that look like you're losing your Second Amendment rights and you sort of just said it's over. This man is in the fight for it right now. His court case is relevant to all of us and I want to make sure that we bring him on and

have that chat. So without any further ado, without any sponsorship reads or anything else, we're going to just start talking to my new friend Dexter Taylor. There he is. How you doing, Sir? Good evening. How's? It going, brother. Good to see you. It's going well. OK, so we should probably put this up front. It is possible because I don't censor anybody. Men who are facing persecution by the by the government sometimes have saltier language

than men who are not. And I've I've had, I had one of the guys from the Whitmer case come in here and he got framed up pretty good by the the federal government and and he had some some aggressive language. So if it gets aggressive, we're going to let people know right up front that if you got little kids in the room, it's bedtime. Put them to bed. That's what needs to happen because some men are going to be talking about some things that

are difficult and uncomfortable. But without any further ado, let's get into your story. But I want to start from the very beginning. If you don't mind, I'd like to give people a lens of where you're coming from and who you are as a person. We tell people where you grew up. Sure. Sure. I grew up in New York. I was born in Queens, NY, and grew up there. Hollis, Queens and lived in New York all my life except for seven years where I lived in Baltimore.

And you know, I went there, went down there to go to school, and then I dropped out and bounced around for a little while trying to get myself together. And then I got into computers. I taught myself C++ and got my first job in the industry in 1994, moved back to New York to work for a start up. And I've been working in the software industry ever since. And that's the right code every day. So. And you still write code every day. That's that's your bread and

butter. Yes, Sir. And. Although I'm not working now. Yeah, understood. I I think we're going to get there and you live in New York forever. You are you a guy that gets into trouble in New York? Do you go out there looking for, looking for fights, looking for, for altercations on the street? What kind of guy are you? I keep my black ass home. I. Told you guys I was going to get spicy right away. Listen, ain't like nothing good happens outside the club. 1:00

AM you know what I'm saying? I no. So I'm usually. I'm home in my studio, you know, You see, I'm sitting in the control room of the switching yard. This is the third recording studio I built. And so I'm usually, you know, messing out of the studio or working on code or something like that. In fact, I have a We'll get to that later. But I have a software software demo I want to want to show for you. I'm up for it. But yeah, yeah, no, Never. Any trouble with the law. Squeaky clean.

Criminal record. I have one arrest for trespassing that happened in Baltimore something like 30 years ago. Other than that squeaky clean, you know, no, Like police coming to my house, Nothing like that. And as you know, I'm a conservative, so I'm not out here, you know, talking me crazy stuff. You know you're already on the radar for that. Well, they're watching. I mean, they we'll get to that. But yeah, they're watching my social media and I'm delighted that they are. Oh, oh, for sure.

You know, hopefully we red pill some of these clowns that are out there looking at it. And by I just mean I want them to see the truth. I'm not asking anybody to change a political party. The the reason I bring that up and it's interesting that you mentioned you got one arrest for a trespassing. I I also have 11 little blemish in my record and I still managed to have a top secret clearance

work for the FBI. There's something funny about having a conversation with somebody knowing what it's like to spend a night in jail, knowing what it's like to be on the other side of things to to find yourself in trouble, having to face the wall and put your hands through the bars and all that kind of thing, which I got to do when I was in the

military. It was stupid, but it happens and there's a there's a certain amount of empathy that you develop for for knowing that there's another human being there with a whole story that they don't know anything about, that you don't know anything about when you're on the on the cuffing side of it. So I always thought that was. I thought that was actually an important thing that a lot of people don't have that experience in law enforcement.

That's right in in any case but that but but a trespassing charge 30 years ago was a is negligible. That's a nothing. You're not a troublemaker, you're not a man, and and yet you find yourself looking down the barrel of a pretty significant prison sentence if things go sideways. If the state of New York gets the way that they are arguing right now, do you want to lay out the specifics of your case now that we kind of just kind of briefly touched who you are? Sure.

So, you know, aside from being an online conservative, you know, some years ago I got disgusted with the left and started something called Foundationism. And we can talk about that later. I make stuff. Like, I love making stuff. I love building stuff. I make my own furniture. I have a workshop in my basement. I taught myself how to Weld. I learned carpentry from my old man. I saw him when we bought our

first house. It was a handyman special and a gut and renovate that house from the inside out, room by room. So I've always loved making stuff. And when I was a kid, you know, I always loved weapons. You know, tanks, planes, rifles, this, that I just love. Loved it all like any red blooded American kid. A few years ago I got into gunsmithing.

I found out that there were people who were buying legal parts, You know what what they called 80% receivers, machining them to completion, adding parts and coming up with finished weapons. And I was hooked. So I went and I started buying legal parts online under my own name, shipped to my house and I started building weapons. I started out with Glock style pistols and then I built 8 very sweet AR style rifles and at the time I thought, this is great, This is going to be my second career.

You know, I'm getting kind of old in this business, but the two A people I'd come across were really cool people. And there was this kind of whole DIY atmosphere to the two a community that I really liked, you know? And you and I talked before about people like Bill Guiseley, who I really looked up to, who got his first contract building triggers for the US Army sharpshooting team. Like, I love that guy, Kevin. And let's just dig into Bill.

Let's just talk Bill Guiseley for one second because his background is not like he's not like a guy that grew up doing firearms. He was a mechanical engineer and and he approached it from a different way in the same way that you have that software background and and sort of that problem solving through code which is very logic based. Bill Guiseley came about it and was like hey I know material science, why are you guys using the materials you use why aren't

you using these processes. And so we came at it from a different way. I I just the the explosion of interest in as you said the sort of DADIY atmosphere but also sort of that that injection of new backgrounds and looking at existing problems and saying why do we assume that it has to be a Remington 700 platform. Why can't we just start from scratch and build something with a vault?

You know, if we're going to manually feed a gun, then why don't we do it the way that we might do from scratch? So this attitude is, is very new. It's in my lifetime. It's in your lifetime that people have started doing this. It's very cool. So anyway, that I think that is, that's something that's happening in the gun world right now and guys like you are and Bill Guiseley is maybe further back down the line, but we're getting there where people are just bringing novel ideas and

backgrounds to the gun world. Oh yeah, yeah. Oh yeah. There's that guy up in New Hampshire, Kevin, I want to say Brittingham from Cue Firearms. You. Got a contract with Special Forces. Yeah. I'm like, this is the coolest thing I've ever done in my life. I'm making, you know, I'm making American firearms in the traditional way, which is in an American home. So anyway, I got into doing this stuff all the time I was doing it. I never brandished. I never took pictures. I never took videos.

I never talked about it online. I never, you know, 'cause I didn't. That wasn't the kind of energy I was interested in it. I kept it quiet and private and while I was doing it and I was I was doing my prep work, I I applied for membership in my local gun range. Passed the criminal background check at my local gun range, Westside Rifle and Pistol in Manhattan. Took their beginning training course. Took their training course for the for the Utah concealed carry

permit. Got my fingerprinting, done all that stuff. Subscribe to a service called Rocket FFL to learn about the different kinds of FFLS and what I would need to apply for what the process would be in order to do this thing legitimately for money. You know, and and I have all these plans.

I was going to buy a piece of land in Southern New Hampshire and set up a gun lab there and and develop some of these products and systems that I've talked with you about before and we can talk about that tonight if you want. And then in April of 2022, I got raided by a joint NYPDATF task force. Basically SWAT team broke my door down, arrested me, hauled me off to Rikers Island where I spent a week. My bail was almost 1/4 of

$1,000,000. My family had to put their house up to Get Me Out, and the state of New York has charged me with several counts of felony weapons possession. And if they get their way, I'm looking at 18 years in prison. Let's talk about the the raid, for starters, because I want to. I don't want to walk past that. I think that's a that's a real thing that exists in the fear in the hearts of some people. And and it should be, it should be something that people can

internalize. Where were you when when the knock happened? There was no knock. Perfect. Where were you when there was no? There was a no knock warrant. Yeah, yeah. You know about those? Yeah, I was. I was in bed. I had gone to sleep the night before listening to an audio book. And I woke up hearing voices that were not the audio book. Violence of action, you know, police search warrant for my. And the first thing I said was, hello, hello, Hello. My name is Dexter Taylor.

I live here. Who are you guys looking for? Because I thought they had the wrong house. Right. It it never occurred to me that the state of New York would be like, we have to get this guy. Do you know what I'm saying? Just so anyway, you know, played it cool, played it, you know, got arrested like a professional. No harsh words or anything like that, you know? Hold on like a professional. You. You you were a gentleman. You weren't getting arrested like a professional.

Professionals get arrested all the time. We got to be specific. That's true. I've seen people who get arrested like professionals. They're like, hey man, what's up? Hey, I saw you. Before, yeah. You don't want to be that guy. You don't want to be arrested like a professional. You want to be arrested like a gentleman and and like a gentleman. Yeah, OK. And so you went peacefully and. And you and you didn't didn't resist anything.

No problems with that. Had a had a nice conversation with the officers in the car on the way to the 83rd or the 84th or whatever that was. Isn't that weird? Yeah, right. It's one of the guys, I think his cousin. His cousin does Python programming. So it's like we talked about they're. Like, oh, you're in the code. Like cool. Like why are we at your house?

Like how did that happen? And, and what's also worth knowing for people who haven't experienced this and you, you're going to have a lot more insight than most. But a lot of times, the people that are doing the search warrant or doing an arrest warrant have very little to do with the case. They got a quick brief. This guy's got a bunch of guns. We're going after the Brooklyn arsenal. This is what's happening next. We're kicking the door. He's super dangerous.

And then they go, oh, he's actually like a really nice guy. And he sounds like a computer program. He's got some pretty cool stuff in that house and looks like he's doing some recording. That's weird. And then they go back to their jobs and they never think about it again. Never think of exactly. And your life, meanwhile, is in wreckage. IS in wreckage. That's right. The yeah, it's like one of the funny, funny thing. I just thought it was one of the one of the cops at the precinct.

You know when I was in the holding cell and every now and then someone would come back and let me go to the bathroom, whatever and get a drink of water. The guy forget his, I forget his name. But he said we went and it's like we had some back and forth. And he said, well, everyone says you're a nice guy, so I'm going to try to figure out what's what's going on. Do you know what I'm saying? There's always one guy that wants to white knight the situation, right?

And he's like, we did get the wrong guy. Listen, listen, yeah, there should have known that. But yeah, so, yeah, felony weapons possession. Hang on a second. I'm just pouring some more beer. This is the. Right. Move Right Now, I almost poured myself a beer. But if I drank a beer with you, I'd be going to sleep in the middle of this, And I don't want to do that. I want to stay sharp. So I got water.

Let let's talk about how it came to be that a man who ordered things off the Internet legally in his own name was suddenly on the radar of the NYPD, who had no otherwise probable cause to believe that something was going on in a place that you're not advertising these weapons. Let's talk about the specifics of how that goes down. Sure. So ATF has been going around the country to various parts manufacturers and more or less demanding customer lists.

And some of those manufacturers, some of those online retailers complied. And then ATF would take that list of people and go around to local police departments and say, get this guy, get this guy, get this guy. And of course, it depends on which jurisdiction because, for example, if I lived in Texas, this wouldn't have been a problem. I mean, in fact, if I lived in Texas, I probably would have been doing side work, like helping the sheriff's deputies maintain their hunting weapons.

Or, you know what I'm saying? It's like, you know, they would have probably had come to some of my barbecues or whatever. Do you know what I'm saying? But like, just being New York, that's, that's how it is. So yeah, that that's how it happened. NYPD, as a matter of fact, has a dedicated unit to liaise with ATF for just that purpose. Right. So when they have like an ATF, they call it, I think they actually call it Ghost Gun Unit. Oh, perfect. So yeah.

Now those are the ones that that can shoot the 30 caliber magazine clips. Don't start. Don't start with. It it's so bad, how is it the people that know the least about the thing that we love and like and get excited about are the ones that are the most interested in telling you how dangerous it is? I saw that. I think we also that video of the ATF guy like trying to field strip a Glock like literally the the, the possibly the simplest pistol that you could possibly field strip. That's it.

Like he couldn't do it. Did you see the the grand thumb answer to that? No, I didn't. So you know who Grand Thumb is, right? He's a gun tuber. If you guys don't know who he is, they call him a, you know, flannel daddy. And so he's a former Air Force guy and he has this gun channel. It's a big channel. They do a lot of fun stuff. They've got a good sense of humor. It's very similar to the kind of sense of humor of the guys that I worked with when I was in the military.

And so he lines up maybe 12 or 13 Glock pattern. Firearm. He did see that and he like field strip. Yeah. And he was like, let's see if how many I can do before the ATF, like head of weapons. So he goes through them and he's like field strip, strip, strip, strip, strip. And he's just dropping them because he doesn't give a shit because he's got probably all the money in the world and all the guns in the world too. So he's dropping all these things that you and I would not be dropping.

And when he gets finished with doing it, he's like, it's like 12 of them. I'm out of clocks, get fucked ATF and he's just so mad. But it's the same way that I felt in my heart too watching this guy. I'm like, who is this scumbag that is, that is, that is, you know, in charge of our weapon program.

What should, like, get back to doing tax stamps, dude, How about you stamp out all the tax stamps and make sure that people get their suppressors they paid their own money for and they're willing to give the government $200 just for the right to possess their own property? I get real passionate about this stuff. I get like people don't want to see me offline. I I get hated. I hate capital. I I let the ATF own me a little bit with the hatred that I have for them.

Like I gave them the right to be to make me angry and it and I don't like to be that way. And I'm angry for your case too. So they've got a ghost gun unit and they've liaised with these guys. And even though there is no good reason why the NYPD specifically would be able to know anything about it because of the federal overlap. Correct. We are now dealing with the NYPD is now in a place where they are lawfully. Was. Was ATF wasn't even on your

search warrant, were they? I don't know if they were on. I don't think they were on the search warrant you. Didn't see anybody with like ATF police written on their chest that. Oh, on the day, on the Day of the Red, they were there, I saw two people with ATF windbreakers, and they've vanished immediately after. Like I never we never saw ATF against. Do you know why they had to be there?

I don't know. Because the because they were there, they were the probable cause to get in, I'm sure of it, right. So the ATF was the one that generated that. So they want to make sure that they're there. And now that the the the the task force that's with them is part of that, that search. Now they're in a position legally to be able to see things that are against state law even though they're not federal.

But but the original issue was whether or not like, I don't know, you were making machine guns or something like whatever ATF, you know, jurisdiction is. So people need to understand how how egregious this is. This is not like, oh, these guys got together and they're trying to do this task force because they're interested in, in, you know, looking for bad guns,

Something like 50% or 57%. I think Gun Owners of America put this out today on Twitter. 57% of the investigations that the ATF is involved in are people who have sold less than five guns. That's what they're calling illegal gun dealers, you know, And that's how you get wrapped up and stuff like this, because they're justifying a paycheck instead of doing their damn job and looking for, you know, drug dealership, whatever. Right. And of course, the thing about me is I wasn't even selling

guns. It's like I didn't. And they know I wasn't because they seized my phone, cloned my phone, never returned it. They seized my computers. They subpoenaed my e-mail records, Right. So they know for a fact that at one, I was not here talking to any crazy shit. And two, I wasn't transferring weapons, hinting at transferring weapons, offering gunsmithing services, hinting at gunsmith like.

There's no money involved. This is literally a passion project, a hobbyist thing that Americans have done for hundreds of years. Correct, correct. And I was again, I was trying to develop legit products and and systems you know we we've talked about cyclic energy flow. Yeah, let's go into that, blow some people's minds a little

bit. Let's talk about because because this is what This is why it's worth knowing that when people who come from different backgrounds look at things, they see different, they see the problem differently. And the problem is always the same. You have a round, the round goes in the chamber, it goes down the, you know, barrel. There's some gas that's exploded. We got to do something with the gas. We got to do something with the harmonics on the metal. So all these things, they look

different to different people. To you, what did it look like? It looked like a circuit, you know, because I've always been a circuits guy. You know, I used to, I used to haunt RadioShack when I was a kid, you know, and messed on with electronics and what have you and.

And so it's it, you know, after I started doing, especially after I started building AR rifles and I started looking at people online who were talking about the problems they'd have, You know, I I realized that, oh, you don't just, you don't just build an AR and expect it to be operable.

It has to be tuned. That's to be properly tuned and understanding the way that the way that, you know, you touch off that round and then the hot gas pushes the barrel out the muzzle, but then some of the gas is redirected in order to kick the bolt back and literally operate the weapon. It's like, oh, there's a whole all that. That whole dance has to happen correctly and a lot of things

can go wrong. You know you can get, you can get failure to feed, you can get bolt bounce, you can get this that. Too much gas, not enough gas. Gas. The over gassed, under gas. You know how How's your how's your brass ejecting from the weapon? What's the angle? Where is it going? And and people just just while you're saying that people who want to tune like those Glock handguns you made those those polymer 80s, cause I've done

this. You'll set up a camera behind you and you'll watch the the angle of the brass and if it's consistent, you know it's feeding properly. And if you're having problems and it's all over the place you go, well, maybe I've got too much spring or not enough spring. Maybe I got a hot enough bullet or not a hot enough load. Like there's all these games playing. And I'll tell you my first failure that I ever had with an AR which I bought in in a gun show in Kansas. It wasn't seated.

The gas block wasn't seated, so it walked and at some point I had a bolt action AR and I was going like, that's not really what I wanted out of this. I didn't know anything about the gun, though. And if you don't know, you're like, why? Why is this not working? The Gremlins aren't doing their job in there. And then you realize, aha, I got to seat the gas block right where it needs to be. The gas block has to be the right size, not too big, not too small, all this kind of stuff.

That's right. Well, it's funny you say that because I remember, I think it's been a long time. But I think the barrels that I got had had a little nub on the on the opposite side of the journal bearing so that you could, you could type in the grub screw and it would like it was more likely that it wouldn't walk because there was a little recess to take the screw so that it would. Right. It would seat properly anyway. So yeah, I was like, oh, this is a circuit, right?

And and the different components in the weapon are are can be likened to circuit components. So the barrel is actually a wire because it's a mass flow circuit right now as opposed to the circuit that has these lights on for example, which is you're moving electrons around around a path, you're moving mass around a path and so the barrel in that sense is a wire, right. And then the you you could look at the, the, the, the hole in your in your the whole leading up to your gas block.

That's a resistor because because that's constricting your flow. Your gas tube is another wire, right? The bolt carrier group is a resistor because in physics that's what masses do. They resist movement, right? The law. They resist acceleration of the law of inertia. And your buffer weight is also a resistor, and your buffer spring is a capacitor, right? And so I started thinking, well, what if you could apply electrical engineering

principles to this thing? And if you could kind of build a universal receiver and fire off a few 100 or a few thousand rounds different loads and what have you. Then if you know a few basics up front. If you know your your your your projectile mass and maybe your powder type and maybe your powder weight, your grain weight of your powder charge, then you should be able to plug in

everything else right? Like the length of your gas system and sudden you know your dwell time, whatever and and and the mass of your well. You should be able to plug in some numbers and come up with a weapon that's roughly in or come up with the masses and weights right? That would give you a weapon that is roughly in tune. And now I. Will say I don't think. I invented this. I think that the big manufacturers have done this. They probably have. Right. It's, it's proprietary.

You know it's it's internal, right? It's not. Open. Source to write some software and open source. Yeah, well. And The thing is, this, like this already exists for Ballistics. People can already take an existing rifle with an existing barrel length. You plug in the length of the barrel, you get a chronograph of your average speed.

If you know what your speed is, you know what your projectile is. You can find out how far that bolt's going to go, if you have the right coefficients of drag.

And so on. So once there are programs on the outside of the gun, but if you're building your own weapon system and you personally want to tune it because you're a hobbyist, you're looking for bringing that Ballistics principles and say, hey, what's the algorithmic sort of thing where I just move a couple of variables around and get this

gun into tune. Which is a thing that would be interesting to a hobby gun maker who's out there making one offs and saying, I want to do this interesting thing, I want to make a monolithic receiver or I want to make something that has a modular barrel swap. I don't know. All these kind of fun things. Exactly so you could so instead of these hobbyists happen to be like, oh I bought this bulk carrier group but that's too heavy.

I got to buy a different one or have to mess around with with my my buffer weights and my springs and their do trial and error. I just thought it would be a lot more fun for hobbyists if they could have a piece of software that said OK this is my barrel link, this is my valve whatever. And I'm using this powder, and this is my grain weight, and this is my grain weight of propellant, Grain weight of projectile. OK, you need to use roughly these weights, you know.

For your buffer. Or you may need to screw around with upping your spring tension. So yeah, simple thing. Wherever the easiest and cheapest way to tinker with it, you might want to play that. That's exactly right. You know, so I saw I I was developing that and. Well, thank God. Thank God New York stopped you from that. Because, God forbid, I mean, right, The thing I love is that you? Have a horror. You got a good sense of humor about how stupid all this is. Horror and moral terror.

Let's let's zoom back out again for a minute, if you will. What's going on with New York and the fear of guns? Why is it like that? Well, here's the thing. I think, I don't think New York. I don't think there's a broad based fear of guns in the New York population. I mean, I think there's the fear of people of being brutalized or terrorized by by wicked people with guns.

But I don't think most ordinary kind of working class New Yorkers and working class New Yorkers definitely outnumber the elites, right? I don't think there's some broad fear of guns among them. I think that New York has been, as you say, captured by progressives. And what do we know about progressives? Well, we know that they believe in the perfectibility of human society through administrative means, right? So if that's what you believe in and that's your program, we are

going to perfect human society. We using the instrument of the administrative state. You can't have people defending themselves. Like, no. What are you? What are you talking about? Right, you need. For that matter, for that matter, you can't have like tight knit families and tight close knit communities and all these and and these old loyalties and the faith of your father's and all these

traditions. You can't have all that because we have this program and you have to get with the program, Do you know what I'm saying? Like, like we're trying to perfect society here and you're in the way. So you got to go and whatever you hold dear, that's got to go. And if you have a constitution that says you have a right to do this because you're a human being and and that right, you know, you have that natural right that adheres to you and we

can't interfere with that. Well, that's got to go. That's self, yeah. self-reliance is not part of their program. They probably don't like gardens on the roof either, I'm guessing. Probably not. No, we got to regulate that too. Before we got going today, one of the things that I I laughed about is that I don't do Saturday night shows in general. So we've got folks that are joining us for the first time on a Saturday night. And I said it's a Saturday night special, which has a kind of a

double entendre. It's kind of a double meeting. You want to kind of tell people what that is and then maybe we'll unpack that a bit. There's some fun about that. Well, this was, but back in the 70s, I remember when they talked about Saturday night specials and of course in the news they talk a Saturday night special is a revolver. It's a low cost revolver essentially, right. I think it's relatively shorter intermediate length barrel

revolver. And in the 70s when we started hearing about this, it was in the context of robberies. People are doing all these robberies with these Saturday night specials and this is a problem. But it turns out, and and I can, I think I learned, I might have learned this from you is that it was really about this a wave of kind of affordable personal firearms, you know, that that became available, right, that people could buy to defend

themselves. And of course wicked people got their hands on them and use them to attack the decent. But there was nothing, in retrospect, there was nothing particularly wicked about the Saturday night special. It was just that that was what our betters in in the media decided. We needed to hear about that kind of weapon like, oh you know, be afraid of these

weapons. Well and and the legacy of the of the Saturday night special these inexpensive usually imported semi low quality but functional handguns was that black people were using them to do crimes.

This is where it really came down to it and this is the this is one of many many many instances of race tinged gun control which we didn't necessarily we don't necessarily have to dwell on it too much but somebody I I pushed pushed something out there the other day on Twitter and I just said gun control is racist changed my mind and and everybody goes well no anybody that knows the history of gun control and weapons control in general knows that it goes back pre US

constitution. There are parts and codes that existed all the way back into the 1600s on this continent that we're trying to restrict black people from having knives. That's the earliest one that I'm aware of was in New Orleans and it was about blades because that's what people carried. And and it was about how do we make sure that we handle this

problem. And then some of our major gun control issues, and particularly the Gun Control Act of of 1968 was specifically right after race riots that started happening. And they went, well, we're going to use this fear that we've got right there this moment, and

we're going to get some control. And I don't think it has to do with whether they were scared of black people or even racism, but they certainly drummed it up and they use that as kind of the specter of it. And Saturday night specials were primarily what were outlawed during that time. And and the story was, is that if you listen to people that are pro gun like me, it's like, well, that's what people who don't have a lot of money would get to defend their home.

Because if you don't have a lot of money, but you got 50 bucks and you can buy yourself a $50 revolver, you show me anybody that wants to run through the door when there's a $50 revolver on the other side of it, I'm going to show you a liar. It's like people say, what's the best caliber? It's like whatever caliber you have that you can point at. Somebody caring which, yeah, when, when the trouble jumps off. Right. I knew a guy that would run around with a 22 Derringer.

It's like, do you want to you want to screw with that guy? He's got a 22 derringer. He'll shoot you and it'll still suck. Nobody wants that. So it's very interesting. Knock down power is a myth. It's like, don't get shot with this 22. Yeah, just don't get shot. Most people are not going to try to take that risk. If it looks like you're serious about pulling a trigger then you know that's that's the whole story about the sound of the the 12 gauge shotgun.

It's not that people think they're going to get hit with a shotgun is that they don't get hit with anything and they can hear the shotgun it's just loud in any case. But the the the just the kind of the amuse me like you said don't get mystical on me is what you sent me this text.

But the the idea that we're doing this Saturday night special, we're talking about this, there is this weird fear and I always wondered whether it was race based, whether it's just because people are in close proximity in New York, is that some of it or if it really is that progressive small number of people steering the the ship and and just running off liberty. I think it's the small number of people steering the ship.

I really do. And you know, I I should add that you know, there are there are right wing progressives as well. You know let's talk about part of the well, that's part of the problem, right. It's like you're. I don't know if you're familiar with Sonny Johnson. You might be. I think you were in one or two of her spaces maybe. But Sonny Johnson is a black conservative and she's she's one

of the real ones. You know, I always say that I, I, I probably don't have, I don't have a bigger profile because I don't talk like Larry Elder or Candace Owens or Jason Whitlock. Right. What? What is their style that caught on to people, do you think, looking from the outside and diagnosing that? Oh, oh, talking shit about black people. That's their. That's their style. Okay I I did tell.

I did tell Larry Elder when I saw him at Freedom Fest in Memphis, that I didn't think it was a good idea to hang out with him. I didn't want him around me because having recently been thrown out of the FBI, I thought being seen with the black face of white supremacy was not a good look for me. And he did laugh about it.

He's got a good sense of humor so but but also they're like everybody was there kind of kissing his ass and because he's he's kind of a big name in the area and and like I'm like I don't know he's just a dude who's got two different colored shoes on. I don't know if that's a thing that he does. It was amusing to me. I just wanted to say if I see if I catch him off guard, he laughed. To his credit, he laughed about

that. So. Yeah, I mean, I look, you know, the the one of the problems with look, if you've been in my spaces or heard my content, you know that I what I'm always saying is that, and I've been saying this for a long, long time, is that black Americans are actually staunchly conservative. That's just a fact. I was telling people this. I'm getting into arguments about it. Back when I was still on the left. I was saying this because people were trying to come up with all

these reasons why. Well, it's like why why aren't, why don't more black, Why aren't there more black Republicans? And I'm like, well, you know, your attitude is one of sneering contempt. That's why like it's it's not attractive. What what do you mean you know you you want to come at me and you want to you want to you you want your pitch to be a noun A verb and plantation. Well I'm sorry that's yeah. That's no that that's not a that that's a terrible pitch. That's a terrible.

Pitch That's selling a negative. That's not selling an opportunity. It's not just that. I mean selling a negative you can sell. I'm like, I'm a problem solver, so you could actually sell me a negative and I'll be like, oh, a problem, sure, let's solve it. But the problem is like, I'd I'm very suspicious of people when people seem to be trying to get me to switch off my critical

thinking and try. And when you started the conversation by trying to shock me with this specter of chattel slavery, like, right away my bullshit detector goes into OverDrive. I'm like, why are you trying to shock me with this word? You know, in other words, make your point and move on. You know what I'm saying? So it's like this, a plantation, plantation, plantation. Like that could be a starting point, but that shouldn't be the ending point, that shouldn't be the mic drop.

It shouldn't even be a starting point because the fact that. There's some simple minds out there. Look, look, look, it's like make your case, make a conservative case. That's it. And as far as I'm as far as I'm concerned in in New York City for example, there are plenty of people, Smithsonian black people specifically, who are property owners, who own brownstones, who own whatever. We have businesses, right? And they're intra, they're they're ready to hear a message

about smaller government. The problem is that a lot of conservatives, when they, when they bother to come talk to us, they never talk about that. They want to talk about crime and welfare. Well, listen, we know about crime and most of us actually have serious problems with the welfare system. You know, I remember my parents and all their friends when when I'd hear them talking politics when I was a kid, they'd be complaining about the welfare

system. They'd be complaining about the fact that, well, hang on a second. How come I've got to, you know, drag my ass out of the house every morning? I got to walk past people who are waiting to get a check and they're having all these babies that they can't afford to raise themselves. So we have to raise them. What's up with that?

OK. But some that there's a segment of conservative America that doesn't understand that they they somehow they're just unwilling to give their fellow citizens the grace of assuming that they're human beings capable of reason and so and and and that's the problem. So that's one problem. Well, the other problem is what you just said there is that they fundamentally are looking and saying that urban people living in, you know, people living in urban areas that are black are not like me.

That's what they're that's the thought. They're like, well, they're different than me. It's like why? It's never been my. Experience, but it's weird. You can say they're different people, but I mean, they have the same kind of interest. It's like if you own property, you're trying to protect what you have from the from the overreaching state. You know you want a good life for your children, what have

you. So progressives have captured New York. Conservatives have decided that New York and cities like it are not worth saving because, because very many conservatives, I'm sorry to say, don't know how to do math. They are numerically illiterate. They can't do basic. They can't look at an election, turn out graph and do basic calculations. Well I think you're, I think you're assuming that they're looking at that. I think you're assuming they

look at that graph. Guys like me who look and go, I can't ever live in the state of New York ever because all the things I got AI got a closet full of felonies over there. I'm not doing that right. And and you know I I basically move based on where I can keep the things that I already own. But but I've never looked at them.

I've never looked at an election graph and thought wouldn't it be worth trying to flip that sucker because there's only a small fraction of people that are showing up for each election. And I've never done that. I've never done it. It's never even occurred to me And that's why I've enjoyed talking to you because some of the things you've said is why do you consider it seated territory.

And I was like, I don't know, it's just doesn't seem like we can win because the because they keep losing but maybe change. Well, yeah it's, it's that's exactly right. It's like look if you if you look at the turn out graph and you know in in very many quote UN quote blue cities, right. What you find is that the turn out is very low among black

people let's say. I mean I looked, I did this for Boston and a couple other cities and it was like these turn out numbers were like less than 50% in many cases. So you have like the majority of black voters who are eligible to vote, not voting, right? And then you say, well, Democrats have a stranglehold. What stranglehold? In other words, 90% of the 30% of black voters who do vote, let's say with the the 40% who do, 90% of those vote for Democrats. But but you have a whole 5060%

who are just sitting at home. Is anyone talking to them? If not, why not? What's the matter with you? Right. And and and so this idea that well. We're just not going to go for the It's not worth it to us. Really, It's not worth it. Oh, OK, fine. And that's and that's crazy because states like California which is solidly blue because of the urban areas, that's why the cities Vote Blue.

A lot of them are like really bad idea people in your business who just who vote for things and vote away their own rights as best they can. Which is weird on on some misplaced sort of social compassion maybe. But but there are more Republicans and I'm I'm not a Republican. I know you're not a Republican, but there's more Republicans in California than any other state. There's just also more Democrats, it turns out. So they lose. Correct.

And also in in San Francisco. I'd be willing to bet that the working class people in San Fran outnumber the Silicon Valley kids. They got to. Right. So they got to so so again the question is why can't you talk to these people And and you know it's it's this it's this weird kind of diabolic pride. Like, no. Like, my approach is perfect. And if my approach isn't working, the problem is with someone else. Well, I mean, I like that. I also kind of viscerally reject that right in my career.

You know, one of the things I've learned by the way I've learned this partly, you know, sidebar like thinking about military people and and how like military people do things and their attitude toward information and their attitude toward responsibility and their kind of proprietary attitude to things they're responsible for. That was a big influence on my

career. Like I decided to look at these people and say how can I use what they do and and their kind of way of looking at the world to become a better software engineer. And so one thing was, you know, you take responsibility. Like, like this is my problem. This is my problem, right. But what do I see from so-called conservatives? The problem is with somebody else. It's not my problem. It's like my bad outreach. No, that's someone else's problem. No, they're brainwashed over

there. That's their that's that's the problem that they're not capable of reason because my my way of reasoning is so, you know, recondite that they can't possibly. It's like, no, like your outreach sucks, dude. It's just it's terrible.

And I mean it's manifestly here, but look, didn't didn't a bunch of conservatives so-called PayPal conservatives, Didn't a bunch of them get up on their hind legs when Trump got a mug shot, when when he went to Georgia to get his mug shot taken and they were like, oh, he's got a mug shot. Black people are going to love him now it's like, what are you talking about? Stupid? No less a person, no less a person, Dinesh D'souza said.

Literally said in writing, Trump is the gangster for black America. First of all, stupid. We hate gangsters. You understand what I'm saying? It's like we're family people. Like we don't like gangsters and gang bangers and drive by shoots. Like we hate those people because they're a threat to us and to our families. Dumb ass. It's the matter with you that makes.

Perfect sense. Here's the thing that I've been I've been trying to. It occurred back to me when I talk to people that are young, because I had, I got into this this discussion with a couple young people and I brought up the other day and I actually did a whole show on this and the show was entitled Conservatives, What are you conserving? We did a big space on it and all I want to do is I want to ask people that simple question and it goes to the heart of what

you're talking about. Also, anybody who's ever been an instructor and I know that when you're a coder, you're always learning, but you're also always teaching because that's what that's what debugging is about. You got to go through and you're teaching yourself and you're other people are teaching you what you OK, if you are not properly delivering information to someone. There are two parts to every

equation, right? There's that there's the transmission and there's the reception TX and RX that happens in radio. It happens in a lot of network traffic. If we are not getting information across, the failure is in one of the two. It might be that the receiver is not doing the job, but it may be that you are not transmitting A receivable information. And so I I constantly have six different metaphors, 6 different imagery, 6 different ways that we can talk about something.

When I talk about guns, Yeah, It's like, OK, let's talk about this. OK. Think about a throttle. Oh, you don't like a throttle? Like, let's think about this. Let's think about that. You know this different thing. We got to look at a, a, a gradual weight. I will give you different images because if it doesn't resonate with you, if you've never driven A5 speed and you don't know how to use a clutch, that's not

going to be useful to you. So I will move on from that and I will give you so. So the the question was what are you conserving? And what? I was not shocked to learn, but maybe maybe I raised surprise like a little bit. Like, oh, I had a young gal. I said what are you conserving? She's part of a young conservatives organization, a young GOP group. And she said, well, you, you know, like the, like the, you know, the Constitution stuff and the 2A.

And I said, you're going to tell me hashtags. Is that what you're going to? That's what you're conserving. They're hashtags. It's like, Hon, I'm not trying to be mean to you. What I'm trying to have you do is do critical thinking. It's so important to me that you actually know the things that you are trying to conserve. And once you do, then you know how to connect with other people that want to conserve those and you know how to communicate why those things are worth conserving.

That's right. And also why we've lost most of those things. We got to probably actually not conserve them, but go get them because we got to actually we got to be progressive about getting those things back at this point. Well, I mean, look, you know, thinking about it's, it's funny because when I hear my MAGA brethren speak like I'm not MAGA, but I have a lot of MAGA

people in my circle. And when I hear them speak, you know, they, they talk about rhinos, you know, Republicans in name only and so on and so forth. And it's like all these people up on the Hill and there's there's a swamp up on Capitol Hill. Here's what's interesting, right? How come all these Republicans have been in office for so long, right? I mean, if I'm supposed to be on a plantation, right. And I'm supposed to be some benighted savage who just doesn't understand his own best

interests, right? Then it's like, well, okay, you tell me why. Bro, listen to me. Listen to me. Mitch McConnell is so old, right? Dirt gives him mad respect. Do you know what I'm saying? Like. I call the Jerry ocracy. I've done people are like, they're like, what about Chuck Grassley? He's great. I'm like, Chuck Grassley is 1000. Like I want Chuck Grassley out 25 years ago. I want, I want Mitch McConnell

gone. I think if you're over the age of like 65, like if you're too old to do regular jobs, if you would have normally left because you're not there, why on earth are you trying to die on the floor of the Senate? But look. I agree with you on this. But let's take that off the board, off the table. Second, forget about age limits. It's just like they're not delivering. You're complaining about them. You're complaining about the terrible things they keep voting

for and they keep, right? So then why have they been there for this long? Don't tell me that's because of the magical brainwashing machine that Democrat, the Democratic Party has. Because that's that's in your house. You see. So, so. Have you ever seen those surveys? You talked about numbers earlier. I want to ask you this. You ever seen the surveys, the popularity or the like? The What do they call the approval rating of Congress? You ever seen? It's it's it's like it's like

toilet bowl low. Right. Yeah. It's it's it's a little bit, it's a little bit higher than syphilis. Right, essentially like moderately higher, but like slightly less than, like, you know, chocolate covered. Dog on who's? It depends on who's hot this weekend. You know, it's like. Syphilis. Syphilis is trending. It's it's looking good. No, I like chocolate covered dog shit. Then then there's Congress, then there's syphilis. I think that's the three levels.

OK, so people are like, well, there's chocolate and it may be dog shit. OK, that's where. OK, so that's Congress. But here's the thing. People's individual Congress person always rage quite high. And this has been a game going on since I was a kid. I remember hearing about it even when I was in high school. They said the reason why is every single Congress person comes home and says this Congress is a bunch of crooks. They're a bunch of evil doers. Look what they're doing to this

country. You got to send me back there to fight them. I've been fighting them for 50 years. Keep sending me back. I'm doing a great job of not fighting them and everybody just goes like Oh well, he said he's fighting them. so-called the lever. There's that. There's some of that, right? It's just failure to look and see. We love politician, but we don't equate them with results. I love 0 politicians. I only care about outcomes. Right.

And and here's the thing, I wouldn't, I wouldn't be so salty about that in particular. Except that the same people who keep sending the Chuck Grassley's and the Mitch McConnell's back to do the same terrible job, right? Want to look at me and say, like, will you people keep voting for people who were doing you no good? Yeah, Nancy Pelosi is your fault. Then Chuck Schumer's your fault. Right, exactly. And it's like, but what again? So so Mitch, McConnell's your

fault then. And that that aside, the other thing again is that people look, let me back up a second some back story. When I stopped, when I left the left, right, I didn't jump to the right. I didn't go to the Republicans because again, I thought that, well, how can I put this like, I look, I'm a black dude. I don't worship my own skin because that's idolatry. But I'm, I love my people, right? And I love my tribe. And I just didn't like that.

You know, Again, that whole sneering contempt that I seem to hear from Republicans all the time. So I started my own thing called Foundationism, and I have a manifesto. I wrote our, you know, the Foundationist Manifesto. And the first point in the Foundationist Manifesto is see deeply. The second point in the manifesto is listen closely.

The third is reason, honestly. So, you know, I think and and I wrote that manifesto and I designed this system because I wanted us to. I I I didn't think that we were going to solve all our problems if we just got rid of the lefties. I thought that a good first step to solving our problems was enabling us to have higher quality arguments about the things that are wrong with our Republic, with our systems. Yeah, so it's like everyone, and I remember I was inspired by this.

Well, by many things. But there was this interview that I think Norman was it Norman Mailer did, where he said that the world would be a better place if the cops were the best cops that they could be and the robbers were the best robbers they could be. Oh yeah, he said that the world would be better if the robbers were like, awesome and the cops were awesome. You know what I'm saying? That sounds like my kind of cool.

Yeah, that is correct. So. That's like a real, that's a real contrarian kind of thing. Because people go like, oh, why do you want the robbers to be good? Because I want everyone to be really good at what they're good at, even if it's being bad even. If it's being bad, exactly. Because that makes the good people have to be better. Well, if a per look, if a person knows that he's a, he's like a second story man. He's like, no, I'm not going to shoot any.

I don't shoot people. I'm not some killer. I'm a second story man. I creep. That's what I do. See what I'm saying? He's not 1/2 ass. OK, I got to pause the half. Ass is that. I got to tell you the story now I'm, I'm, I'm at the FBI Academy and we got this girl. We got a lot of girls there that I'm not sure they've ever been outside, like outside of a building. I think they've just lived indoors, you know, like a lot of

indoor dogs. And I'm not mad at them because they're real sweet people, you know what I mean? Like, there's people that are too nice to be mad at them, but you're looking at them going like, how are you in the same job that I'm at? So we've got this legal instructor and his name was Mike. What's that? His name?

His name was Bullzomi. That was his name, the bull Bullzomi. And he was really loud and he was really excited and he would yell things and so he would walk around and he would ask these questions and he would just get real like amped up. And he goes, he goes, Teresa, I'm using real names here, by the way, because that's how I roll. He goes, Teresa, he goes, we're going to break into this house because we're cat burglars and we've got a pillowcase. What's the pillowcase for?

And she goes the cats. What he oh, Jesus Christ, he. Stops in his tracks, He stops in his tracks and he's never heard anything like this before. And he goes what? And she goes the pillowcase is for the cats that we're going to steal. And he said, I'm going to step outside for a minute. Somebody help your classmate out here and explain what a cat burglar is. And it was like, these are the people. Like, she has a badge and a gun Still, she's a real sweetheart.

Like, I I I'm fond of her as a human being. I'm terrified that like you said, a second story man, I heard you explain and I'm like, oh, OK, cool. I get it. Yeah. This is someone who's on. He's he's he's a he's using sophistication. He's not using overt violence that would have that would have confused my dear friend who is an FBI agent. I just thought you had to know that that's what that's the caliber that we're up against. That's I'm not surprised. In the league, you should be

scared. I'm beyond fear at this point. I'm just like, I'm just grimly resolute. But. But I mean, yeah, you know, I thought that that that's what we needed was to have better quality arguments, you know, about what was wrong. It's like, no, we're not going to get rid of the lefties. Just like, let's, let's have decent arguments about stuff. OK. What I see is, is that these arguments are poisoned by like a handful of very specific sins. And one of them is pride. Pridefulness.

Right, Diabolic pride. You can have symbolic. Symbolic pride is fine. Symbolic can. You define those two for me, for me and everybody. Yes, Symbolic pride is that which unites. Diabolic pride is that which divides. OK, so symbolic pride is fine. You know, you're, you're in, you're a military guy, you're proud of your regiment, no problem. You know, you're proud to be part of your family. You're proud of your family, proud of your kids with no problem.

But the pridefulness that says, well, I'm better than it if you know, if if other people think I'm obnoxious, it's their problem, it's their fault. I'm not obnoxious. They're just too sensitive, you know or you know I'm like you just don't understand the way I do things And that that that's diabolic pride. And and and the scriptures make a very big deal about diabolic pride for a reason because it's a self reinforcing sin you see right? Like like the sin of wrath, like you get angry.

Well, your anger will cool eventually, right? Same thing with lust. You know you you're lustful, but your lust will will ebb and flow whatever, right? But pridefulness like you will just spiral right down because pride interrupts the feedback loop. If you have said and said that. Vanity is better than pride. Vanity is better because at least vanity is social right.

Like you want to cut a good figure in front of other people, so you're acknowledging the fact that other people's opinions matter, but if you're prideful, that's not the thing. And so. You're worshipping of yourself. Pardon me? You're worshipping yourself. Your your, your pride feeds itself because you are the audience and you are also you are also the one receiving it and you are the one who is giving it. And so that's the self. It's like government.

It's the self licking ice cream cone. Correct. Yeah. So right. And so, you know, diabolic pride is what caused, like the Angel of light to become Diablo, right? To become the devil. It's like, no, I'm, I'm cut off from that feedback loop. I'm cut off from the source, Right. And I, look, we see this among lefties, yes. But being a conservative, I'm concerned with what we see, what's in our house. And I don't like to see that in

our house, you know? And again, I see that when people say, well, we don't have to worry about outreach because our outreach is perfect. The problem is those people over there, I'm like, well, that's no, that's pridefulness. Stop that, you know. And when people, you know consume Internet crime porn and and they're they're obsessively looking at these 45 second video clips of some, you know, young black people, for example, in the streets doing doing stupid

stuff, you know what I'm saying? They're they're consuming that and and they're like wallowing in this resentment, you know, and and they're working themselves up into this frenzy and it's it's a pornographic frenzy. And look, pornography is a problem, not just sex pornography, but all kinds of pornography. Because because a pornographic view of the world destroys your ability to deal with real things and real people, right? It's amygdala porn. Pardon me?

It's amygdala porn. It's amygdala porn. And and just like you know, if a young man who gets a young man who is addicted to sex based pornography find that he doesn't know how to talk to a real woman because a real woman is active. A real. Girlfriend, a real wife, is active. Yeah, she's not paid to be some sort of, you know, whatever flop job there. She's going to listen. She, a real girlfriend is going

to challenge you. She's going to say get a job, stop sleeping on the couch, get your shit together, right. She's she's going to say, you know, listen, I need you to take out the garbage or open this pickle jar or kill the spider. She's going to look at you and say don't bullshit me, OK? The chick on the screen with her tits out will do none of those things. OK, Now if you, if you transfer the thing to to a crime porn, Well, yeah, if.

If that's your interface, to quote UN quote black America. If all you're looking at is, you know, clips of crime porn and degenerate celebrities from the music industry or from wherever, then when it comes time to talk to someone like me, you don't know what to say. You know how to act. And I've seen that time and time again. You know, it's like, what? What's the matter with you? Like you can't just have a conversation. Yeah, that's just a dude over there.

He's got a beard like me. He's he's got he's got a you got a daughter. We got an awful lot of things in common. I I learned how to do C++. I'm terrible at it, but I understand that it works right. Yeah. So, so, you know, I I've been, I've been really concerned with this. This is the fundamental problem in in captured places like New York. It's not that that that the Democratic Party has these superpowers where they can just

brainwash people. And there's no it's that the people who were supposed to be fighting against these things are not fighting against them. The people are supposed to be conserving our constitutional rights, are not conserving them.

And again, that goes for, you know, again, I said, I said there's such a thing as a right wing progressive because there is when a lot of these conservative politicians bother to come to the cities, they seem to leave their conservative politics or the conservative beliefs such as they are behind them when they cross the city line. And, and and and by the time they get to me, they're talking like, like, like statists. I'm like, well, what happened to limited government? What happened?

You were talking about limited government when you were talking to that to my white brother in the suburbs or in the farmland. That sounded good to me. I was like, hey, that. Yeah, right on. And then And then by the time you get to me, you're like, yeah, we need, we need more police and more laws and more this is like, whoa, what? Happened. Same answer. Better culture, better people doing the right things like expanding our values. That makes more sense still.

So, OK, so getting and getting and getting and getting the government's boot off our necks, all of you can figure things out, right? Full agreement there. Let me ask you this, is this New York specific? Or do you get that feedback to Chicago, Los Angeles, Because, I mean, New York is New York is its own animal. I mean it's. All our cities, all our cities. This is the problem. I mean, again, just think for a second. I mean, look, I again some

background. You know, I am the son of working class immigrants from the Caribbean, right? And at a certain point, I started really identifying very strongly with my working class background. Like, you know, my path to conservative was probably not the same as not, probably, definitely not the same as, you know, other more prominent black conservatives. Because again, I wasn't. I didn't look at the Republican

Party as a model for anything. I didn't look at Ronald Reagan as a model for I can't stand Ronald Reagan, Rudolph Giuliani, neither. I started looking at my background and like the people I grew up around. And then I realized, wait a second, I grew up in conservatism. Like, like the stuff these guys talk about, excuse me, when they bother to talk righteously, It's like, wait a minute, I grew up with that, Like, like, and and

everyone I knew. They grew up with parents who are fanatical about education, who didn't want to hear any excuses, right? Who wanted excellence, who insisted on discipline and respect. You know, who were people of faith, right? Who believed in black self-reliance? Right. Who believe that you shouldn't be asking the government for stuff. Do you know what I'm saying? Like, but when I was a kid, I didn't know that that was conservatism. It was just life. Do you know what I'm saying?

I do. You know, I mean, I grew up. I grew up going to Sunday. I went to Sunday school at Saint Albans Congregational Church over on Merrick Blvd. I remember around graduation time, you know, the the elders in the church, strangers, people I didn't know would come up to me and say, hey, you know, you're doing this proud young man, you know, keep on hitting those books, keep on, you know, I like strange old people. Strangers were proud of me.

That's a good feeling. It's a good feeling, but what I'm saying is that's. Conservatism, right? Community values the future. And and I'm and I'm telling you that as far as working black folks are concerned, most of us grew up like that. I I think, I think most people maybe right. Like isn't that just like that's not even a black value. I don't find. I think it's, I think it's American.

I agree. But I'm just talking about the the, the, the, the retardedness of the GOP and their inability to talk to black folks. That's what I'm talking. I mean, I agree. With you. Well, it goes right back to that that that first thing that I think you at least are illuminating to me is that people are looking it. It still comes down to that person is different than me. For some reason.

I didn't grow. I I, I grew up luckily enough in California and then in Texas in places where I didn't know that was supposed to be the case. I didn't know I was supposed to look at people who had different colored skin or came from different backgrounds that were like, you know, like, I was like, oh, like they're Filipino. They just have cool food.

I don't know how to pronounce it, but it's got a lot of sugar in it, and I'm into it. Like, that's what I knew growing up. We had a lot of Filipino. We had a lot of Vietnamese. You know, I had some friends that were black that were in my little, you know, schools. I went to Catholic schools and you know, you just meet people. It's like, well we all have the same values and we're all Catholic and we're all going to the same school. We all want to they're willing to pay for education.

So that's something. So we pretty much had a lot in common other than some of us had more you know family members and less and some of us had different food at lunch which I try to trade for or whatever you know like but but but at some point at some point the people I guess the people that are running this country many of whom are very old, grew up with some really old ideas that I didn't learn. You know they didn't learn what I learned in the 80s and 90s.

They didn't grow up learning the things that you learned and with that awareness going like, hey, these are just American values. They've actually, they're they're still living, segregated values and they're approaching I. Think that's, well, I think that's part of it. But I think, I think you could look at it also in the opposite way is that part of the problem is that we are, we are besieged by people with brand new ideas. What are these new ideas?

Well, the Well, the idea that a man can become a woman without just by saying words. Wait. A minute. Are we getting bigoted right now? OK, let's do this. Yes. Yes, and you're welcome. How? How weird a planet are we living Where guys are doing that, right? Right. How? How? Weird. A Planet are we Where where Planet Fitness is going to side with a dude with a semi erect penis in the women's locker room and kick women out. I mean yeah.

OK that's a new idea so that's that's definitely new. I'll, I'll give you that 100%. Right. So. So any new ideas are are, and they're part of the problem. Part of the problem is that, you know, you could say new ideas, very, very new ideas, very old sins. Again, pridefulness, right. Resentment. I mean, you know, the story of one brother striking down, another out of resentment. The second oldest story in the Bible, right? So. So these are very old sins.

The, the, the, the problem really is that we have just recently dismantled or started to dismantle all the structures we had in place to prevent those sins from having the run of the place, right? And that's one problem. The other problem is the people, so-called conservatives, who were supposed to be tending the garden, OK, were derelict in their duty. And now they don't want to admit it. They want to say, well, it's those lefties. Well, hang on a second.

How come there was a long March through the institutions? How come it wasn't a running battle, Right. How come? How come they just surrendered left and right? How? Come they just how come they just marched on through The Who who was fighting them? Who was supposed to be fighting them? You know, look, all the things that are happening to our country, right to our civilization, we feel like we're besieged from all sides. No, it's there are bad people and bad ideas rushing to fill a

vacuum. Why is there a vacuum there? What was there before the vacuum? Why was it? Why was it done away with? Why did we allow it to be done? Who allowed it to be done? Away with questions right. And and people have to start taking responsibility. It's not just, you know, it's not good enough for so-called conservatives to look at me and assume that I don't take responsibility for my.

Well, you people just need to, hey, hey, you people need to take responsibility for the fact that you failed to safeguard the things that needed to be safeguarded and you failed to make the case for yourself. OK? And you failed in your what should have been a primary act of moral imagination in saying that, you know something, these are my people. I'm American. These are my people. These cities are American cities. Our, our, our great cities.

Chicago, Cincinnati, for God's sake, named after a Roman senator. You know, New York, Los Angeles, San Fran. These are American cities who decided that they should be abandoned to progressives, right? I mean, of course the progressives wanted to take them over. They want to take everything over. Right. That's what they do. Right. I mean, that's what they do. OK, so so who who was supposed to oppose them and and why didn't they? Right. No, these are. Can we get an act?

Can we get an after action report? Can someone say what happened? Can we? You know what I'm saying? So I agree with you and and I keep saying the same thing and and this, this marries up with your point really nicely. You know, in 1946 they passed the Administrative Procedures Act. And what you're what you're hearing about from from people on the right is like, oh, there's this deep state and you know, I call it the administrative state.

It's much more accurate. The administrative state just knows one thing. One, we're the ones in charge. Two, we were given that power in 1946, and we've been slowly growing it through the executive branch. And three, we outlast every president and we don't give a shit who you elect. It doesn't matter to us because we're going to be here when they're gone. So our work is more important than it continues onward, which is why these institutions end up captured.

Now the scary thing is, is that they're captured by people on the left and not, and I don't hate the left either. I think you and I share this. I just did a long sort of meditation on balance. There's a big need for balance. Progressive ideas are not my enemy.

They are the challenge to make me have better ideas, as you said, about robbers and cops, better cops, better robbers, smarter leftists, smarter people on the right equals Everybody comes to a better, you know, a better version of whatever it is they believe. They hone those arguments. You know iron sharpening iron. But otherwise.

But otherwise we just get dummies that just roll over and and are trying to sell us you know sneakers whatever the heck the deal was which is when you told me that it just it makes I don't understand sneaker culture to begin with. I don't understand. I used I actually ran a case on a guy. This is brilliant. You want to talk about brilliance? This guy had worked out a money laundering operation in a very

very expensive shopping mall. Like down by the water in DC, OK, in the National Harbor. And what he did was he was a consignment dealer of super high end sneakers, hundreds or thousands of dollars. OK. And So what would happen is, is that he would have inventory that'd be on the shelf. It'd be like a size 10 Yeezys or whatever the heck those things are. I think I'm saying it right because I don't even know. I don't know enough about sneakers. Whatever. There's expensive ass sneakers

on the wall. People would come in and then they would order or buy. They would give money and they would get something out and they were getting drugs because he was selling drugs out of there. Or he was moving. He was laundering the money through a product he never had to, never had to have leave. So people came in and bought sneakers. They never took home. So he had inventory on the wall. You just couldn't buy any of it

because it wasn't your size. And so he was doing this and it was brilliant, but it was like, OK, I don't even know how we're going to get. He was flying around in like private jets and going to the Dominican Republic with, you know, suitcases full of cash. He was smart. He was a smart dude. He was abusing the sneaker culture. I just thought that was really funny, 'cause I was like, I don't understand any of what

they're talking about. Like, wait a minute, there's there's multi $1000 sneakers and people were like, Oh yeah, that's the thing. And I was like to who, you know, if that's the thing that's going to get Trump in front of black people. I was like, I I just don't think that's going to be the winner. I just just well, yeah that's. I mean I was. I was what a. Low, low threshold to aim at that one. That's just. That's silly. Don't. Don't call it low. Call it retarded. Retarded.

Retarded. It is retarded. It's a retarded threshold. It is. And again, these people exactly. And I'm like, well, well, well, what's wrong with you? You know, So this is so, so This is why, you know, when you may talk about people like Sunny Johnson. You know, I'm so, I was so happy to meet Sunny Johnson and and to get into her spaces and to start talking to people in her circle because here was someone who

actually understood. She got it like she she and she gets it. She understands that conservatism is is deep in our bones as black folks because because we've had to be conservative. Think about it. You know chattel slavery is antithetical to the concept of of of the close knit family. So we had to regenerate our traditions and and and figure a way to kind of preserve what was absolutely necessary through

that hardship. And then after emancipation we had to figure out how to start, you know, generating value and being a part, a real part of the economy instead of just being a pool, a fungible pool of Fiat labor, you know. And so she describes herself, and I'm, I'm with her on this as a Frederick Douglass slash Booker T Washington conservative. You know, and there's a lot to

that. And I think right now what I'm seeing in the political landscape in the in the United States is I see a lot of these PayPal conservatives ruining it for the real conservatives. What's a? PayPal conservative. How do you define that? I mean, it's like, you know, people whose job it is to generate, generate eyeballs and clicks and raise money, but who don't actually conserve anything. So Charlie Kirk is one example, right? PayPal. Conservative, You know,

trademark. Trademark that That's your that's yours. I can't it will PayPal. I can't trademark PayPal, but. P Conservative. It's even better. You're going to get me in trouble. You can get me in trouble, but but no, it's these fakes ruining it for the real ones and, you know, and ruining the name of conservatism such that, you know, in many black communities, it's like people will look at you as scans if you say you're a conservative, you have to

explain yourself. And again, I don't blame them. I blame conservatism because brand management is a thing. Yep. And when you're saying is like, once you, once you explain it, they're like, oh, I'm all those things. That's exactly what thing. They're like, oh, why? Why do you call it conservative? It's like 'cause that's what it's called. 'Cause that's what it is. Look, a funny story.

My mom, well, you know, my parents, when I started, when I went public on social media about my case, they started kind of taking my links and sending them to their friends and family and so on and so forth. And some people would come back and say, you know, they'd see some talk. I did, you know. And they say, well, what does he mean? He's a conservative, you know, because they thought that that meant that I had become one of these black people whose favorite indoor sport is shit

talking black people. It's insulting black people. And my mom had to be like, no, no, no, no. He means conservative like us, you know, like in the old ways. Like they're like oh, OK, OK, OK, OK You know what I'm saying? Yeah, it shouldn't be. It shouldn't be that. But that's the same question is what are you conserving? If you don't know the answer to it, then maybe you are the PayPal conservative if that's the name. But the question is this, that this is the one I want to

challenge you with. Because because I I think it's whenever I look at something that seems devious or seems seems nefarious, I will always err on the side of of giving stupidity and retardation. I will give it credit where due, right. It's almost it's it's just as often as it's ignorance to malfeasance. Yes. OK. And how many people just have no idea what the hell they're talking about? They said.

You know you know Dexter, you know Constitution to a you know families, values religions or whatever 1A they don't know the thing that they actually think they believe. They just looked at the model of people that they're like OK, these people have got it squared away. I I like the way that they're living their life. But I never asked them what it is that they live by.

I'm just going to try to say the things that they say without understanding it. Is it possible that some of these folks just, they just don't get it. They haven't internalized the thing that when you just said in the old way, the ways that I feel about it, then they would, they would immediately know because once I leave these, like this poor gal that I talked to, when I let her down there, I said, what are you what are you conserving?

She goes, I said, are you interested in family values? She goes, yeah, I said, where do you get your values? She was like, from my faith. OK, good. What faith is that? I'm, I'm Christian. So you have Christian values. Got it. What are the things that lead you to? Well, it leads me to believe that people are, you know, innately of value. OK, good. So now we have the individual self worth. We're going to move down the chain. We have to walk them to this though.

The TX and the RX has to happen. Is it possible they just don't know? They just like there's a lot of ignorance too now. When you say they who you're referring to? I'm talking about conservatives that are failing to give messaging to anybody like they're. I mean, conservatives are failing to give messaging to young people. I see what you mean. They give it. They're failing all over the place because it's just they're on defense and they're not really great at it.

They're not good at the offense, yeah. OK, so so so you asked a question. The answer is no. I don't think that's what the problem is. OK, how? Why not I? I I think the I think the problem is again these very old sins. I think the problem is a form of self worship. Yeah, Satanic pride and resentment and and avarice. I mean, it's like that, you know, like it's very lucrative. It can be very lucrative to be a paid off conservative.

Do you know what I'm saying? I mean, I mean, just think, you know, if you're a Charlie Kirk, get on the circuit. Yeah, you're getting paid, you know. Or if you're a squeaky Shapiro, you know what? Like, yeah, that's Shapiro. That's profitable. Yes. Wait, hold on. What? You getting paid? What's that? What's squeaky about Shapiro? What's squeaky? His fucking voice. What do you want to speak? About I just wanted to make sure you were saying what I thought you said.

That's fine, you know what? You know what you can't do though to Ben Shapiro is you can't put them at 1 1/2 X 'cause that's it's like helium at 1:00. And a half. What? Oh yeah, like up to speed. Yeah, most people can't process that fast. I actually can hear that fast, but I don't want to. Well, well, well, the, the pitch, I mean if you start to pitch up, you'd start to get into the ultrasonics, but somebody. Somebody told me that.

Somebody told me they listen to my show and they do it in 75% speed because I speak really quickly. And then they turned on Dan Bongino and they thought he was on drugs because it still sounds kind of like Dan, but it sounds like Dan, like he's taking Benzo. That's. Hilarious, that's. Hilarious. I try. I aspire not to be squeaky. That's all I'm saying, OK? Fair enough. Don't be squeaky. No squeaky. But. But yeah, no, I I don't think that's the problem.

I think the problem is is that there's just there's just arisen this great kind of mechanism for for raising money. You know, and we've seen this look, I mean didn't the GOP just get rid of Ronna McDaniel because she was running the whole thing like her own private fiefdom and she was funneling money to all these weird places like hey, why aren't you.

Hang on a second why are you sending money to people who are defending safe seats and like Lee Zeldin is getting starved out running for governor of New York State. What's the matter with? Man, I thought Lee Zeldin was going to pull it out too. But, like, but I also knew he wasn't. Well, well I I I think, I think that I don't think that election was fair. I I think there was some chicanery going on.

I I just, I just can't see that like Kathy Hochul who has, like Kathy Ogle has negative charisma. Who is her constituency? People. She causes other people around her to be less charismatic, and she's a leftover from a disgraced administration. I don't see how she beat Lee Zeldin fair and square. I don't get that. I tend to agree. But but then again, then again, right?

Speaking of election chicanery again, PayPal conservatives, right, will come up and say, well, you know, oh, you know, you see something bad jumps off in the city and they say, oh, well, you get what you voted for. And and I'm looking at these people like, hang on a second. You were just talking about 2020. You were just complaining about election theft in 2020. You think that's the only place election theft has happened? You think Democrats in Chicago run clean elections, stupid?

It's the matter. With you. But here's the thing you you challenged me by saying that I was listening to you before and then I went, Oh yeah, it's really important that we get unified in the things that we actually believe. If if you believe something that you should probably believe it across the spectrum. I I kind of pride myself on that. But I got lazy at thinking about New York. I'm like, yeah, New York, they just, they don't care about freedom. They hate freedom, right?

That's what they're. See deeply. You got to see deeply. I I just ignored it. I just went like, well, I don't live in New York, it's not my problem. But it seems like they love that. And I also have a lot of feelings for people live upstate that that are not, you know, constituents of like New York City obviously captures the entirety of that state. I've driven up there and seen people that were saying like vote no on the safe act and all

that. And I was like, man, these people are getting steamrolled, but they live in New York. What are they going to do? But not everybody picks up and moves like a tumbleweed like I do. So, well, that's one and two and two. Again, even in New York, The the problem is you need to activate the voters who are sitting it out. Yes, that's the thing. And that had. Never heard the voters who are sitting it out.

And those voters are ready to hear a genuinely conservative message, especially if they're black or Latino voters, You know, because because they're going to tend to be more religious, they're going to tend to be more socially conservative, right? It's just that there there are certain bad habits of thought that that Republicans indulge all the time and it makes them unattractive. And and by the way, you know, circling back to what we were really talking about in my case, right?

Think about it. Republicans are supposedly the pro two way people, right? OK, yeah. How many prominent Republicans have you heard talking about my case? Dana, not much more. A little bit on Red State. Right. I mean, I mean the really. Right. OK so so and I know for example like we've tagged. I've tagged a lot of prominent people including politicians in the New York GOP. Like New York GOP has nothing to lose. They have no exalted position that they might jeopardize if they.

That's true. Jumped in on an issue. OK. So. So why haven't I heard from Elise Stefanik? Why haven't I heard from Ed Cox? Heard back, I should say, because I reached out to them multiple times, right? Why haven't I heard from Hey, Speaking of conservatives, right, what's her name? And she might be mad because I'm calling her out, but what's her face? Jesus, what's the guy who has the thing? Prager you, Right, Prager you. You.

Were going to do the thing my wife does with me where she starts describing something very vaguely and I got to guess. OK, so prager you. The other thing No, no, the other thing with the you. Know with the the one who was in the movie and you're like the. Thing exactly that time. By the way, I'm like 98%. Girl. I'm 98. Percent girl in the car, right?

The movie wouldn't go. There, yeah, I'm 98% with my wife on that stuff, by the way, because we have very, very similar, you know, patterns, but. Exactly. But no, Susan Prager knows about my case. OK, DM back and forth. We got a very cordial, you know, couple of DMS back and forth. OK. Have you heard Dennis Prager talk about my case? I haven't, but to be fair, I don't monitor a lot of Dennis Prager. I'll. Be I mean. I mean. I mean. Listen, I'm not. But I assume that you're

correct. I I will assume that if he did, you would know and you would have told me. So yeah. And and again, you know, a lot of these prominent conservative or so-called conservative voices who were like fire breathing on a bunch of these issues, you know, people, people said, well, you know, maybe they just don't know about your case. You know, when when Squeaky went down to Kensington, Philadelphia, right.

And and to do an active investigative journalism to inform us that people were falling out behind fentanyl in the streets of Kensington, Philadelphia, it's like, well, my question was why didn't you go visit Monterey? Marge Toure is a black conservative in in Philadelphia. He's doing two way stuff. He's doing free firearms training. He's doing civics classes, doing all this stuff. He's doing conservative content online. Right. And I have his phone number. Yeah, I can text him when I

want. So you tell me, why does someone who works for a conservative news organization not know about MASH? Well, he does know about MASH Toure. He's not interested. Yeah. Do you see what I'm saying? Yeah. So. No, I do. I like mash too the. The conservative movement is not covering itself in glory here, and that's yet another reason why people have no reason to trust them. It's like if if if one, you don't care about, you don't care when we do do conservative stuff

in the cities, that's one. And two, you don't, you know, you don't bother to speak to us like human beings. And if if we do happen to get a conservative politician who comes and wants to run New York City, he starts to run it like a nanny state guy, well then what's the point of voting for a so-called conservative right? I mean, Rudolph Giuliani did not govern like a conservative. I'm very sorry. He governed like a statist. Where was the limited

government? Yeah, You never see these people get into power and just like roll back all the power of the state. Wouldn't that be something? Did we? Were you in the space the other day when we were talking about this? I was like, wouldn't it be amazing if we just gave Congress like, we're like, look, you got two years, we're going to run on all your old shitty laws. We're just going to keep operating the US the way it's been. And we're not excited about it, but we're going to do it.

We're going to do that. And in the next two years, what we'd like you to do is create an act, pass it right now that repeals all federal laws and scraps them, and then spend the next two years creating a decent scaffolding without having, like, all this rickety shit that's held together with duct

tape. That doesn't make any sense that you're trying to close loopholes from the 1930s, back when everybody was trying to do transactions with, like, bags of grain or whatever the hell was going on. Like like you could look back to 1913 before we had an income tax in this country and we had roads and people ate, you know, and some people had electricity. Not everybody did I get it. So we've we've done some things with that, maybe at some expense

we didn't like. But we used to be able to do stuff in this country before we started taking everybody's paycheck left and right. Wouldn't it be nice if we just started from scratch and just made this thing work? I'd love to see some politicians campaign on Everything is broken. It's basically idiocracy, right? It's like love people. I know, I know stuff's all effed up. Like we got this guy, he's going

to straighten it out. Can we just get a couple of smart people in there to just go, this is garbage. Is there still an opportunity to come in and do the things you're talking about in the cities? Is there an opportunity? There's there always this, sure. I mean, you know, look put put it this way, you know in fact that's where most of the opportunity is. It's in the local.

It's in local governance, right. I've often said, you know, you know, that I'm not a Trump supporter, but I've said before that I think Trump, to the extent that Trump is AI think that Trump Trump, you can look at Trump as a useful president without looking at him as a necessarily wise or prudent president. He's a part. That is to say, he's a table flipper and sometimes the table

needs to be flipped. But that presupposed that someone else is going to come and put set the table to write and reset everything and kind of OK, we're going to do thing, we're going to run things differently in here from now on. I refer to him as a breacher. You know what that is, right? Yeah, but if you open that door and. Goes in fourth. Man on the stack is a breacher.

OK, so he's going to get up there with his battering ram or his hydraulic ram or his little shaped charger on the petard or whatever it is, right? And he's going to blow that thing. And then it's like if everyone else just stands around high fiving and back slapping with a goofy expression on their faces, you're going to, you're going to take that to heart. You're going to feel like hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, What are we doing? Here you're going to, you're going to literally probably take

fire that way. Correct exactly. Well, and in the same way we talked about that you you talked about there being, you know, who was fighting in the cities. But it's essentially, yeah, you can have someone come in and create that chaos, like make that space. But even even even in jiu jitsu, even in these, like you know, these martial arts, you make space, you got to fill that space by by moving, you got to do something. It's like, oh, I'm going to, I'm going to do a hip hop, but then

I'm going to slide. I'm going to use that that opportunity to take some momentum. There. Exactly. You can't. You can't just do one thing and then I did it you. Know. Yeah. Look how Look how cool it was. I I I pushed my body. Exactly. Look how cool that and and and listen, we have to be honest, much of what the MAGA movement has been doing over the past few years has been like, look how cool, I mean act. After Trump got elected, a lot of what MAGA was doing was like,

hey, look how cool that was. It's like, listen, there's work to do, people. There's work to do. Yeah, no time to watch. Your man, your man breached. Your man breached the door. Get in there and work. You know, start, you know, taking over. Start applying the precinct strategy. Start going around and figuring out how to get a broad grassroots that can actually start to take back our structures, our institutions, our Republic, you know?

But again, there's I I talked about self worship before. There is a kind of narcissism in despair. There is a kind of a narcissism in saying yes, it's all over now because if things didn't go my way. I'm so close. To one and therefore it's all. Over. I'm so great but I wasn't appreciated so. So it's all it's a everything's going to burn now. Really.

Really. Because last time I checked, other people in America kept the faith, kept the civic faith, right, under much more trying conditions. You know, black folks, black Americans working, black Americans kept the faith when essentially ISIS was running the American South, right? I mean, I mean going back further I mean Booker T Washington started an industrial college for black people in the in in Alabama a generation or two after the end of the after the Civil War was over wild.

So, so, so the idea that that that now because, well, they're cancelling us on social media, excuse me. Yeah, that. That. I don't. That blows my mind, too. It's like that that wasn't always there. What did you do before social media? All of America. Literally all of America. They're. Stealing elections. They've been stealing elections for a while, bro. Yeah. Talk about, you know, so that that just kind of illuminated that little thing.

And I and I want to touch on something you and I talked about privately, your instinct or interest in the Monks keeping the lights on when the world went dark. You want to talk about that for a little bit, 'cause I think I'm going to, I'm going to put you full screen for a moment, just 'cause I I really like that kind of that image. Yeah, thank you. Well, you know, when I I talk about when I left the left, it wasn't a one day thing.

It was a it was a kind of a transition period and there were several kind of milestones. But one thing that happened was that I started really thinking about Christianity. You know, I was raised Episcopal, lost my faith some years ago and I started to get it back. I started to kind of it was odd. I started to reason my way back into religious faith is weird. But one thing that I was very interested in was this idea of the monastic tradition.

Like, I began to understand that that the the Dark Ages weren't as dark as we thought they were. And again, from a lot of reading and and listening to my Christian friends and, you know, all this, I started to realize that there were people. There was this whole tradition of people who kept the lights on, kept the light of reason on during a dark period in history.

You know, I began to realize that we know about Socrates and Aristotle and all these cats because a bunch of Christians SAT, you know, by candlelight and, like, wrote out books by hand. You know, while growing all their own food and brewing their own beer. That's pretty hardcore. It's pretty based. It's it's pretty, yeah. But it's not based in a prepper kind of way because they're like, no, we're we're like like this is we're preserving something like this.

This will continue, you know what I'm saying? It's like being the outpost somewhere. You're just you're you're the last outpost for now. Yeah, yeah, well, you know, you're you're a lighthouse, that's what. You're for that's. Right. And and the same thing about a lighthouse is a lighthouse is a warning, right? It it. It's job is to send a warning. But that warning presupposes that there is still something

worth preserving, right? That ship has to turn away from the from the from the reef, right? Or from the sandbar what have. Yeah, but it supposes that there's still a ship. That there's still a ship. And somebody still cares about not running at a ground. Correct. And and that's a kind of faith, but we need that faith, right? Because building things, listen, building things requires faith. I mean, look, doing anything consequential requires faith. It just does.

It's an act of faith that's justed and said to us or maybe it was CS Lewis to to assume that that that your reason is an appropriate instrument for understanding the world in the 1st place. That's an act of faith, right. OK, So again, I'm not proposing anything new. I don't claim to have invented anything. I just started going back and and looking at history and looking at the history of ideas and it's like, oh, wait a

second. There's all this cool stuff in our theology and Christian theology is all this cool stuff in our American tradition is all this cool stuff in the Western tradition, you know, and all we have to do is kind of pick up some of these instruments and start to use them. That's all. And and listen, I I don't. I don't. I've never told anyone that there was any kind of guarantee or that we're going to turn

things around next year. I've I've gotten into fights with people for saying that we're in 100 year war. So just settle in and relax because because it it's likely that our grandchildren will sit in the shade of the trees we plant. What Well is that not a noble endeavor? Is that not noble to go ahead and plant those trees? What are you saving it for? You know, Or do you just want to keep doomscrolling and say

everything is lost? And by the way, by the way, one of the reasons why why young people, so many young people who become disaffected go to the left and not the right is because the left at least has a story where they're trying to save the world. Think about it for a second. Think about it. The left is telling people, come on, we're going to save the planet. Come on, we're going to end race. I mean, now that's bullshit. But I'm saying that's what they're saying. But they are doing it.

Yeah, you're right. No, they're offering a vision. They're offering a vision. OK, so as I've said time and time again, you know, if you have, if you're a young person and you have a choice between Team Superhero and Team Accountant, it's not even a it's not even a question. Nope. OK, Now by contrast, you look at you, you mentioned Christianity. I talked about it briefly.

You know, it's like, actually that's a really cool story If you just tell it. It's like, yeah, you know, some of the ulterior mind tried to debug the world. So basically he he took a part of himself and developed a subroutine and injected it into the system, you know, and and that subroutine turned into what it was, a living virus and it infected and it rewrote the software of human civilization

starting about 2000 years ago. And literally changed the values that people look at themselves with. This is the thing that I always tell people and this. This is why I think the Socratic method is powerful, but it is it's a it's a way of debugging leftism. Because I don't think leftists are are my enemy. I know you don't think they're your enemy. Well, some of them. Are some of them act like, yeah, some of them act like our enemy individually, but the movement

is not my enemy, it turns out. Because The thing is, is that they actually have the same values. They're just they're just off. You know what I think of it is it's like having a bad zero. It's like, oh, oh, I see. What Yes. It's like your it's like your your your sights are not aligned properly. And so you know up close, yeah we kind of hit the same stuff. But if I take you out to 1000 yards, you're going to be off the paper. You're not even you're going to be off. You know no impact.

No idea. That's where you're at. That's how far off you're 1 degree, 1° at 1000 yards is a long ways off. But at, you know, up close, ten degrees, 10-10 yards, yeah, we're still hitting the same target. And and my thought is this, my, my assumption is that people, if I get them to tell me that the reason that they think people are valuable is because people have innate worth, because they do think that way.

You have to be a, if you're a leftist, you have to believe in that there is no Karl Marx without Christianity. There is no values of Karl Marx without Christianity. That you just got it wrong at some point. It's corruption. Although I think, I think part of the problem is that is that I think that that's true, but it's also that doesn't necessarily mean that modern leftists are in any way in touch with religion. They've. Oh, I don't think they are either, I think.

They've gone in for self worship, but here's. They've detached. I agree with you. I'm just saying that if they if I could root them back to where they where that comes from the quote.

Always come from, I would say. I wouldn't take them back to Karl Marx. I mean I would like CS Lewis said that it would be an upgrade if if if young people started to become Pagan instead of materialist because that would be a good like look I've said and it's not original on my part that like you don't everything's downstream from theology. There is no culture without religion. Sorry, there is no culture without. There's no science without religion right now.

Someone that there was a Conservative and a British conservative named Sir Roger Scruton and he was doing a a panel discussion and someone asked him how how we could get young people to who were raised on on Lady Gaga and stuff like that to appreciate let's say classical music. And what he said was well you can't not directly. He said first you have to get them to appreciate silence and then in that silence right the appreciation of other things can

blossom. So I think if if we could just get, if we if we get, especially our young lefty brethren, if we could just get them embracing the idea of the sacred, that is the supernatural, right? They did it. Yes, we have law, whatever. But there is something there. The law and the state cannot be the highest value if we can just get them to admit that there's something else to which law and

the state must be subordinate. They don't have to declare for Christ. I'm not saying that, but I'm just saying if they could just agree to that, that would be an enormous upgrade. Because at the end of the day, what we need is more people to understand that, that we have to have what we have to have a hierarchy of of values. That's the main thing I I think when I when I think about what's wrong with with society and not not just society.

What's wrong with business, What's wrong with American foreign policy? Why we can't seem to put together corporations to make decent stuff and and why we can't, why nothing seems to work. Well, the answer I come back to is not necessarily the death of Christianity. It's more like the the abandonment of hierarchy and the embrace of self worship.

If if you, if you understand hierarchy and you're not worshipping yourself, even if you're just like a a vaguely skeptical deist like many of the founding fathers were right, that's better. But if you abandon that and you abandoned the idea of of a hierarchy and you go toward positive self worship, you are in a world of trouble and your society is going to be in a world of trouble. As you were talking, I just pulled up this quote by chest and I want to read it if you don't mind.

It's really, it's really interesting, he said It's from his book Orthodoxy. He said the modern world is not evil. In some ways the modern world is far too good. It is full of wild and wasted virtues. When a religious scheme is shattered, as Christianity was shattered at the Reformation, it is not merely the vices that are let loose. The vices are indeed let loose, and they wander and do damage.

But the virtues are let loose also, and the virtues wander more wildly, and the virtues do more terrible damage. The modern world is full of the old Christian virtues gone mad. The virtues have gone mad because they have been isolated from each other and are wandering alone. Thus some scientists care for truth, and their truth is pitiless. Thus some humanitarians only care for pity, and their pity, I am sorry to say, is often untruthful. Tabby.

There's a lot of that's firing at you all the time. Yeah, non-stop, yeah. But even that silence you brought up a a minute ago, that is, that's placed to maneuver. Yes, Sir. That yes, Sir. That's the table flip. That's right. That's right. Yes, right, that's right. That's right. It's an and and it's a. It's a more achievable goal because it's incremental. That's right that that's a, you know, that's one thing

everybody. Wants to solve it in one fells to actually, you know what this reminds me of something Michael Crichton wrote back in the he wrote Rising Sun. Is that what it's called? Rising Sun? Yeah, yeah. Is that what it's was that? Am I right? I think it's rising sun.

Yeah, I think so. He always had these, like really interesting things that he was talking about, like cultural commentary while he was telling the story of like a murder or whatever, telling the story of like an airplane crash.

But it was like it was really more, you know, the the story there was about the value of incrementalism and why the Japanese were able to destroy absolutely just devastate American electronics industries in the 80s because they were willing to have a slightly better VCR. They were willing to make a DVD player or you know, they didn't have to jump the DVD. They would make a better VCR.

Then they would make one that had some anti shock and then they'd make one that was able to do a couple of more features and people bought it, they incrementally would sell it. Whereas Americans were like, we need the the, the quantum leap, we need the jump that changes the game. And we're only interested in making that. And if you're only aiming at, we are going to revolutionize the industry. You don't get incrementally better batteries. That's right.

That's exactly. You don't get incrementally better politics. You don't get incrementally better policy. And incrementally, we're always trying to say we're going to flip it on its head, we're going to put in this guy and everything's going to be righteous. That's not how the world works. Right. And there's a kind of narcissism in that, too. I think so, yeah. It's cult of personality. You have to believe that, right? You have to. There's that.

And there's also the thing of humbling yourself. You know, like like it. Look in my career as a software guy, right? Sometimes you're lucky enough to go into a place. Well, now that I'm senior, you know, I I kind of have the luxury of being able to go and say I want to work for start up companies where I'm like the first or second or third engineer, you know, and stuff like that. And I've been lucky enough to do

that from time to time. But very often, as a software guy, you go in and there's already a bunch of software that's been written right? I mean, that's just the way it is. OK. Now, you may find that one or more of the systems in that place are not kind of optimal. You know what I'm saying? There's that there's something in there that's not quite right.

OK, well, the first thing you have to do is humble yourself and not go in there pissing everyone off by saying, oh, all this is stupid and you're doing everything wrong. Yes. You have to. You have to learn to lead with the question. OK Oh, I see. You're doing the. OK, why are we doing this like that? What am I missing? You know, it's very important because first of all, you need to hump.

You need to, you need to get people on your side, people who are willing to talk to you so they can tell you, the arcane Lord, that you're going to have to learn to function effectively in the company. And also if you want to make an improvement, you're just not going to be able to throw everything away and start. You can't.

It's not on the table, right? This is the same in every team environment and every culture you've ever walked in that exists before you, which, by the way, we've all been born into a culture that existed before us. So that's what a culture is if you're born into. It it already exists. So you don't get to throw it all out. And and that's and that's why my pipe dream of Congress is going to repeal all the laws. They're not going to do that, although they would be better if they did that.

They're like they would immediately be better if they scrapped all this garbage because they've done a bad job on it. But that assumes that, like you said, humility, you walk in. And this is my problem with with young people that are in their early 20s because I had a couple people saying, like, we're trying to get, you know, more young people to politics. Why? What do you know? You're like, you have energy. I'm into that. There's, there's.

And I told this kid I said I'm going to give you some feedback. You didn't ask for it, but it's free, so it's worth whatever you got it for. And I said, here's the feedback. Let me share with you. There is a balance in life between being the young guy who's got tons of energy, you got all the piss and vinegar, you're willing to run down the bad guy, you're going to run for a mile and a half and finally

catch your man. And then there's also the old guy who knows exactly where that guy was running. So he drove the car there, and when he comes around the last corner, he hits over that, he falls over the top of the hood. It's it's a joke in every police movie, right?

Going back to the cops and robbers metaphors, but but there's a balance between being knowledgeable enough, wise enough that you know a lot of the tricks and turns and you understand the wiliness of of having some experience but also having the energy to push into the space and to to to make some room to move. And so there's a balance there. And that balance I think happens somewhere between like mid 30s and mid 40s, like early, you know, early 50s kind of thing.

At some point, you don't have that anymore. And then you're Chuck Grassley. Well, I would, I would say it differently. I would say that that's why good organization, remember that we've defined deviancy down for decades now. Effective organizations for most of human history were cross generational organizations, right? And effective teams for most of our history as a species were cross generational. Team Oh yeah, for sure. There was a council of elders,

right? There may have been a younger, more powerful guy who was going to implement it, but he went to the brain. Trust he. Went to the brain trust and he said listen, what am I missing? And they said, Oh well, we've already tried that shit. We did that when I was younger and everybody died and I'm the only guy standing. We don't see again how. How? There's humble. They have to be humble. You have to humble yourself, and you have to reacquaint yourself with the and get good with the

concept of hierarchy. This is why I find my Catholic friends so interesting. You know, because right away they're like, Nope, there's a hierarchy. Yeah, we get that. We get that thing. You you get that and. And that's very, very very important. You can't get anything useful done without that hierarchy, so. And and it and it takes humility to come in at the bottom of a hierarchy. You have to know where you fit in there. I mean look every every team I've ever been on.

If you want to immediately not be effective on that team, go in there and tell people how to do things right away without ever learning what they do. It's like you don't know their culture. You don't know why they do those things. As you said, you come in the you you leave with questions. Help me understand what we're doing here. What are the values? And then and then and then again a thing that I really one of the one of the many things I stole from the US military you you

lead with service. So I I used to one one of my one of my jobs in the past I worked for a company called Take Two. It's like a gaming company. They're the parent of like Rockstar Games and two Kos. So, and I was a data senior data engineer over there and I was responsible for building this kind of a a a new way, building a new way, a new system for building a specific category of software.

So it wasn't just a piece of software it was like an entire OK, so so a lot of the junior and mid level engineers working around me, like they didn't, they didn't report to me. Like I had to convince them. I had to get them on board, but they didn't have to listen to me. So you know, I would talk to them. The first thing I'd I'll talk to them respectfully. And the second thing I do is I'll talk to them as if I was trying to help them because I was trying to help them.

And so I'd be like, hey, you know, when you get a chance come do a ride along with me. Jump on a screen share. I'm working on a data pipeline for so and so come check out this tooling I've got. Maybe you'll think it's horseshit. Maybe you think it's useful. But check it out, because I'm writing data pipelines really fast and I was able to get them on board because I wasn't browbeating them. I wasn't insulting them. I was like, hey, you know something?

I think you will generate more value for the company if you get to sit around and think for longer. Like you shouldn't have to type so much. Like your value as an engineer is, is is between your ears, not not at the end of your arms. So if you use this tooling, if you use the system I'm designing, you'll be able to sit and think more. And that's good.

And they were down with that because that's what software engineers like to do. They signed up to sit and think about problems and then, you know, write a little bit of code, you know. So yeah, this is, it goes back to the whole thing. And by the way, that idea, the idea of leading by service, yeah, that's also a very Christian idea, yes. Yeah. Model the way you want people to see it. What do they say? The the best Christian

preachers, right. They're always preaching and some of them, some are speaking, you know, some of the time. Yeah, yeah, that's right. You know, if you want people to, if you want, and this is the story, this is, this is the oldest story. It's like you want to model the behavior, you want people to see when people go like, man, that guy seems like he's really got his, his shit squared away. What is he doing? What is he all about? Like, why does he do it that way?

And then they start asking. That's called getting permission to give people information. And we used to always, I mean I used to do sales, right. So I used to do that. And and everybody's always selling. If you don't know, you are in a sales job. We're all in the sales job every day, all the time. Even when I was an FBI agent, when I was a paramedic, it was a sales job. The sales job is I have a thing that I'm doing and I'm and I want you to be on board with it.

And so I got to get your permission to sell it to you and then and then you're going to buy in and you're buying as a permission for me to actually do the thing that I do. That's right. So we're we're constantly doing that. We're doing that through preaching. You know preaching is is is permission based. You're knocking on the door. You're asking hey can I talk to you about this message I have and people go, no, it's dinner time.

It's a bad time and you go OK, sorry to have bothered you. What would be a good time to come back Because then you're always doing the follow up right. But in the same in the same way if you're you're working with those software, the younger minds you're saying, hey I I got this thing would you come take a look at it. Would you be interested, would you would you accept my would you accept what I'm doing and take some time with me.

Is there value in that? And they go, OK, sure, yeah, I'll just come think about that with you And then yeah, you're getting permission and then you go, would this be of value to you later. And they go, yeah and you go, can I show you a little more? They go, yeah, you can. So now, now, now you've got buy in and we're constantly doing that. So we can we need to be doing this buy in I think again with with the political process as

well. Yes, Sir. The the doors open we've got room that sounds like we have a we have a massive audience of of non turning out voters that we need to get excited about it which I think is very interesting and you've turned me to that which I hadn't thought about previously. That's right. And and that means that states that are generally thought of to not be in play, that all the great minds think can't be turned, that's. Right they. Probably are. I don't think those people are

great mathematicians. They may understand how elections have worked based on the structure that exists, but not based on upsetting that structure, which is what you're talking about. Yes, yes. And so, yeah, I mean, and I think that's right. And and look, I think at the end of the day, so you mentioned elections. That's, that's one part of it. That's 1/2 of the picture. The other half of the picture

is, is re enchanting the world. It is that we have to also read, you know, it's not just about talking to people about elections. It's about inviting people to reach for a different instrument.

That's the phrase I always use. It is about inviting people to reach for an instrument other than government to solve problems, you know, which is. Theoretically what Christians and and conservatives keep saying, it's like, hey, you know what a better thing is than giving a bunch of money through some garbage government program that's not well run. How about a bunch of people that volunteer to do with their own

time and their own money? How about we have values and we hold people up and we want to lift them up and we want to do it for the right reason, not because we have our money taken at the point of a gun. Which is correct. Taxes work. Correct. But I I will also say that, you know, one thing that conservatives have all have to fix if they're going to be effective is to get off this libertarian bandwagon.

Because that's just as bad. Yeah, explain that because I think that'll that'll that'll hit people in the eyes. Well, so, so look, you know, and I have, I have libertarian friends. I'm not mad at them. I love my libertarian peoples. But libertarianism is a stance. It's not a complete doctrine. Why not? Because if you're going to tell me that man should be free, then my next question is, well, what is man? Is man just a species of talking meat?

Is man just an accident? Because if man is an accident, or if he's talking meat, or if he's just a collection of atoms, there's no particular reason why man should be free. There's no particular reason why you should respect man. I mean, I have lots of collections of atoms here in my studio, right? And I can do what I want with them. I can throw them away.

I can throw them in the fire. OK, so, so my Christian friends who are libertarian, they have a complete doctrine because they started with an operating system, right? That prescribes the proper relationship between men and other things in the world, and above it, so to speak. And then they run a program of libertarianism on top. Of it. And then you can now you can run that libertarianism routine on that Christian operating system.

Correct. Because the operating system is telling you what goes where and how to put First things first and so on and so forth. But you just can't say, well, I don't, you know, man's an accident. We're all just animals. But you should be free. Three or four times. So I was going to hone in on that, but that's what it lies. It's like and and and to to zone in specifically, right, you know.

Some of these things, some of the things we have, the problems we have to solve, are not amenable to sound bites. I'm very sorry. You know, in some cases we need less government. In some cases the problem is we didn't have enough government. I'll give you an example. We had a financial crisis, housing crisis, remember. And the problem, you know, our our conservative, our so-called

conservative. Brethren said at the time that the problem with with the 2008 housing crash was dumb black people getting a subprime mortgages. Now that wasn't the problem at all, but that's how they get down. The problem is that we allowed people to do crazy stuff with derivatives. We, we invited them to play with financial nitroglycerin, as Warren Buffett called it. Yeah, and to sprinkle that all over everyone's portfolio in the form of these CDO's, these

derivatives basically. And derivatives are very dangerous. I mean they're a very useful technology. But if you, if you, if you have no controls, you can get very bad results very quickly. I'll never forget one of the oldest and most kind of like revered trading firms in Britain. A firm called Bearings PLC was taken out in the course of a weekend by one guy trading derivatives on a desk in Singapore. So these things are not to be

messed with. OK, Now, so so we had a law, a regulation in place that said that retail banks are not allowed to make high risk investments, not not to play with derivatives in that way, right. It was called Glass Steagall. It's a firewall between high risk finance and retail banking because retail banking bank accounts, right. Have a federal backstop. They're insured by the FDIC. OK, So someone dismantled that firewall and as a result, retail banks were able to to play with

financial nitroglycerin. Yeah. And as a result, the effects of that crash, when it happened, were much worse than they had to be. Now was that OK, a case of too few regulations or too many regulations? Well, in in that case, it was like we we dismounted A regulation. We should have kept. You see, we, we keep missing because we don't have the correct logos. We keep missing the point about scale that people like Chesterton and Belloc got very well.

And for that matter, a lot of older, you know, older generation conservatives, conservatives from a century ago kind of understood which is that scale matters, which is that capitalism works best when there's lots of small capitalists. But but that requires a state that is at the very least going to clamp down on economic rent seeking. What do you think about the whole the whole situation when the whole too big to fail? Arguments were made, and my whole thought was it's supposed

to fail. And then a bunch of small investors are supposed to come in and buy up the means of capital and start new experiments that are more nimble. That's the whole point. Well, sure, but not if it's bigger than a certain amount. I mean, here's the thing. I mean, yes, you're right. But here's. The problem You know, you can't let a company get so big that its failure would would be a

systemic threat to the economy. Because when it gets to that point, it doesn't matter how libertarian that politician is. It doesn't matter how much Hayek or Milton Friedman or Adam Smith he's read. He's not going to do nothing. The political imperative to just do something will be too great. You don't understand what I'm saying. So the answer is yes. Companies that do bad things or that handle money badly or make bad investments are supposed to

fail. But companies must not be allowed to get so large that their failure would be a systemic threat to the economy. Because by the time they get that big luck, no politician will let them. It's not going to happen. I'm sorry, that's utopian thinking. They will step in. OK, so, so that's the thing, you know, why are there so few banks in, in, in, in, in America? Why are there not 100,000 different banks? Because there's there's too much of A regulatory burden on banking.

OK. So reasoning from first principles, not trying to say just deregulate everything, but thinking rationally will, is there a tier, Is there a banking tier that we can have where things can be more fast and loose and can we preserve? Can we still preserve security for people who just want to put their money somewhere and know it's going to be there the next day?

You know, we have to really start reasoning kind of more deeply about this stuff because again, these our systems are complex and some of the problems that that that that we have are complex problems and most solutions to complex problems are wrong. Yeah, that checks.

And also it makes sense that people that are interested in software would be. A really good group of people to talk to about this problem because if there's a lot of similarities there's subroutines there's primary routines there's you know some you know there's a lot of different outputs that are also getting regenerated back as inputs and and they're going into other you know places within that same sort of you know I like I said my my understanding of code is is

cursory at best. I I I did some Java I did some C++ I was terrible at all of it. But I understand the principles of it. I can look at it and see OK that's what this thing's doing and putting out and we're dealing with a massively complex system with a lot of inputs a lot of outputs and a lot of variables that change regularly. So if that's the case, this is not a, this is not a simple. This is why the. I always feel. Like the sort of the left isn't like what we're saving the

world. We just got to stop Carbon. You know what's funny? I see. Yeah. Yeah, that's right. Well, this isn't a conversation for another day, but I always feel like the CIA does single factor analysis all the time too. It's like, oh, there are guys, this is the problem. We'll just kill that guy. We create power vacuums over and over again like they've never seen it happen before. And you just keep thinking like, guys, this is not a simple system.

This is an entire society. They have an entire ethos. There's a way of life that was created. That person is integral to it. And you think just like cutting off the head of something and something new is going to grow back that you like and that's going to change the bottom. Like, no. You just, you know, it's so weird. What's fascinating about you saying that as I I was just. Reading this sub stack called it's called Gaius Baltar Sub Stack and he I think he said

something that was very similar. It's like we have these people who just want to look at one thing and and they want to fixate on well, well it. It's part of the progressive mindset. I did a Space a while ago where I talked about the progressive mindset. It was me and and and my my friend Sean who Co hosts the Hidden Path Conservative Space series with me. And one of the things I was saying was in the conservative mindset is characterized by by three things.

The conservative mindset wants to analyze right it. It wants to eradicate and wants to subjugate. So if you think about analysis, right, it's it's like the conservative mind wants to dissect something and try to understand it based on its parts in isolation. But that just doesn't work, Do you know what I'm saying? It's like it's not, yeah, you can't do that. You can't. You know you can't. You you can do that if you want to understand.

That part. But to understand how that part actually functions, it's just not that simple. Correct. And and we've we've kind of decided that, I don't know, we want it to be that simple. Or maybe it's another form of narcissism, like we think, yeah, I should be able to understand this or I've. I've focused on this for 10 years.

So this is the answer. But I mean, you know, look, I see this with some of these PayPal conservatives that happen to be obsessed with race and IQ. They're like, well, race and IQ, Race and IQIQIQIQ. Listen, listen, it's true that you have to have higher than a certain baseline ability to manipulate abstract ideas if you want to, for example, write

software. But it's also true that once you hit, once you pass that threshold, additional points don't necessarily buy you any additional capability. That's because past that threshold, now other things start to be more. Important, Like your ability.

To communicate your ability to write a good document, your ability to think about whether how I should word this error message that I'm writing into my code so the next guy who comes and is trying to use my horseshit code can see what the hell is going on without spending 15 minutes running down blind alleys. Let's, well, let's bring it into. Let's break it into a different analogy. Check this out. It's like, you could you? Can increase the horsepower of

an engine to a certain point. But if your transmission and you don't have enough friction at the wheel, you're spinning tires. So who cares? Spinning tires exactly. And and there's a there's a lot of that in history of. Really, really smart people. To get 0. Things done because they're. So smart they can't transmit it. So there's there's other factors in that in that problem and I agree with you 100% on all of

that, right. I mean, I mean, who was smarter, like Robert Oppenheimer or Leslie Grove? Well, I think Oppenheimer was smarter, but like you wouldn't have had a Manhattan Project without Leslie Grove, and and Oppenheimer wasn't the guy to build the Manhattan. Pray couldn't have done it. Think about all the people out there that have come up with theoretically amazing ideas and it. Takes like some high school education machinist to be able to turn it into reality.

That's exactly. And if you don't have respect for all the parts in the machine, then you're also a fool. Like, you've got to respect the person that can theorize it. You've also got to respect the person that has the hard skills to turn into reality. I used to go down to the machine shop in the engineering school at Oklahoma, and I remember one time that something just blew me away. And you see somebody that's really, really good at their trade.

And I loved, I love tradesmen. Like, I just think that that's such a it's such a lost value that you don't look at like a journeyman in a trade. And you're like, this person is where the rubber meets the road. I brought this guy. I brought this guy a a threaded piece and I wanted to to match the threads onto this tiny little pipe that I had and he looked at it and he goes musical application and I was like yeah this thread's into the bottom. Of a into a microphone.

How did you know that? And he was like, man, when you've been around thread like machine threads for as long as I have, like you just know that there are certain common threads that you can eyeball and you know what they're used for. Wow, that was like, holy shit, that is freaking cool, right? If. If you showed somebody A. Piece of pipe that was threaded on the end and he goes, that goes and that's a musical application like wow how? And that was probably like a. No brainer for him.

He just probably just like that was just, you know, that was like if I held you up a hamburger and you're like, that's a burger. Like that's how easy that was for him. That's right. And by the way, it's not clear to me that of course he.

Has you. You would assume he has a certain ability to manipulate abstract ideas, because that's kind of what machinists do when they think about jigging something up and they think about tool holding and the mental modeling, how machining out some key way in a piece of metal is going to change the metal and the whatever and the stress is granted. But like that thing where you could just say, Oh yeah, music, you know, that's a thing for a

mic stand or whatever. It's not clear to me that you can measure that capability using IQ or any other. No, there's a there's like a visual recognition there. It's like somebody who can shoot that may be dumb as a brick. But you know they can hit a target that's moving at you know, they're doing calculus in their head that is that is following a parabolic arc that is, you know, dealing with gravity and and some, you know some shape that is catching the

air differently and the smoke. You're like, I don't know, hitting a baseball out of the park. Like do you have to be brilliant? No. But you got to have some. You have to have a three-dimensional view of the world that you're conceptualizing and your hands are able to do the thing that your mind imagines and you're transmitting it into reality. So yeah. Again I horsepower, we always talk about intellectual

horsepower. My buddies and I use this word and that's just the raw ability to to to grab data and ideas and and work them. And I have some friends with a really really high degree of intellectual horsepower. Yeah, but not all of them can get anything done in the world, correct. This is very important. And like I said, where the rubber meets the road is somebody who's got good. Transmission, you've got to be

able to take that. Horsepower and move it through and turn it into an actual functional friction based propulsion. It's got to go somewhere if you wanted to do something and and we all need a little bit of all of that. Like I love having super smart people that go, what about all these problems And you go, yeah, yeah, yeah, OK we're just going to do something and this is the thing we're going to do, right. It's going to brute force it.

Right. Yeah. Thank you for thinking of all the problems. We're just going to. We're going. To muddle through it and then by the way, I'm going to. Need you to troubleshoot it as we go. That's right, because we're going to do something that's exactly right. Otherwise we just sit there and we do analysis. Paralysis. Which is what I call it well. That's right, but. As you bring that up I I just just tonight I was working on this. Project Shout out to By the way.

Shout out to Dana Lash who is one of the real ones. She gave me a a a an interview. She gave me a mic to talk about my case. And her husband, Chris Lash is mad cool. And so, you know, apropos of what we've just been talking about, like, I've been working on this. Hold on, let me put you full screen here. OK, What do we got here? Yeah. OK, so Chris Lash was. Working on. We we were D Ming back and forth and he he talked about the need to do shot registration at a

shooting range, right? So he'd have some. The, the scenario he painted for me roughly was you've got some training software, right? That's doing something, it's running on a phone or on a laptop or whatever and and somehow like you need to register the fact that you, this, a particular shooter with a pistol, actually fired his weapon at such and such a time, right? So just taking that idea, you know, we were talking back and forth and he said at one point he said, well, maybe we could

have. I've been thinking about a way to profile the sound of a shot. You know, could you write some software that could fingerprint the, could do the Sonic fingerprint of a particular gunshot? And I said, well, you know, maybe, but I'm, you know, one, I'm a big skeptic about so-called AI and things like that. And two, it's just, it just seemed to me to to too much of a heavy lift. The transient, the the the Sonic transient is way short.

And also there's interruptive sounds that's always like the sound waves get interrupted as they move. Yeah, yeah. OK, I'm with you. So, so I started thinking and I came back to him and I said hey, listen. Maybe we brute force this problem, and maybe what we do is we have a little thing that's worn on the shooter's wrist or on his sleeve. And there's an accelerometer and there's A and there's a

microphone. And the accelerometer will pick up the recoil transient, The microphone will pick up the shot report. And those two correlated together in time, will tell you that that particular shooter fired his weapon. I mean, you'll hear the the mic will pick up other shot reports because you're in a shooting range, right? But if there's not, if there's not the signature of recoil that goes on in the accelerometer, then it doesn't. Happen then It doesn't happen

exactly. So this is part one of that I I'm calling it Osiris, I told. Him. I'd work on it and work it up and then we'd. I'd open source it so that if I go to prison someone can still pick up the coding needs. So basically this is, do you want to know something that's crazy? Garmin already has accelerometers built into their. Into their their watches. I'm sure they do. Yeah. I I looked at that. Actually I looked at some Garmin watches, but my thing.

Is you'd have to buy a Garmin watch this, this prototype platform, like like this you're looking at maybe 30 bucks worth of parts. OK, like, that's it. Hold on. Let me put it back full screen again. There it goes. Yeah, so basically this is this is the accelerometer chip. Right, this is a single. Board computer, basically it's an Arduino, but it's made by a company called Adafruit and this, this is designed to be sewed onto clothing.

I think this whole thing, this little single board computer is like 14 bucks, right? So I just essentially spun up a little bit of code. Hang on a SEC. I'm going to share the screen here. Let's see. Can I share that screen? Can I do that? No. Wait a minute. One second. One second. I know what I need to do. I need to open up this window. There we go. OK, so now I'm going to share my screen. Maybe share the window. Yes, I will. OK, you share the window. So let me let me grab it.

I can grab it from here and throw it on one second here, OK? OK, cool. Yep. OK, bear with me a moment. No problem. I'm betting I can put it in guest. Two. Let's do it here, OK. And I'm going to keep that muted and. I'm going to open that. Let's see if we can make this. Happen here. All right. Up. Now you're muted. Hold on. Talk. Yep. One. 2345, got it. OK. We're on it. OK. So if you if you can see that. My guest, Mike, I didn't set. Up for another guest.

So let me pull off this scared of. Boil, There we go. All right, there's your code. OK, so can you see the The code isn't important because it's like copy pasta mostly. It's not, it's not very complicated. It's just it's just pulling the accelerometer is all you know and saying hey, what? What? Right? But if you look at the bottom half of the screen you see, you should see numbers scrolling by, right?

Yep, XLXYZ, right? So there's and you know this and and so I don't know if people can see, but when I jerk the, when I when I twist it one way or another, the numbers change in a certain way and that tells me that the X axis is the one I'm interested in. That's the transient. So, so basically that this, this accelerometer goes on the person's wrist, so does this, The whole thing probably gets sewn onto a kind of a sleeve or a glove, a shooting glove with a

long sleeve. So all the parts can be in one place. But basically this is the beginning of Osiris open shot registration system. And so that is, if I can do this and I can add a mic and I'll show you. I actually bought a miniature. I actually bought a miniature mic. Secure. Let me get your full screen here. There it is. No your full screen. There's your full screen. So this is this is the miniature mic right here. Nice. So right.

So very. Small so you know everything just goes on a glove or a sleeve or what have you. And you again, you pick up the recoil transient. You pick up the Sonic transient. I lost all of them. Hold on, I got to get you back. That's what I get. I tried to hang up on his extra screen. Y'all we'll we'll get at the top back in here again. That's classic. Right when he's telling me his cool invention. In any case, you guys can kind of see what was going on with that little piece of tech, which

is pretty neat. We'll get, we'll get my man Dexter back here just a second and we'll wrap this sucker up because I think that there he is. Hold on. We got to get some audio unmuted. Check, 1-2. There he is. All right, brother. I just yeah, I I disconnected from your share. Screen but it knocked out both you oh. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So. So yeah, this, this plus the accelerometer plus a single board. Computer give and then I I I bought AI bought a Wi-Fi chipset.

So again another very small part you can power the whole thing with like a 9 Volt battery pack or whatever and and then it should be able to transmit those. You know when it when when it does a shot registration, it can just transmit that chunk of data to whatever shooting platform, whatever training platform you have. Like, I don't care what you're using, yeah, but if you're using like Mantis X or something like that, running across a bunch of different people, you can see all these.

Different shooters doing Mantis X on one side, something like that. Yeah, yeah, very cool. So fun stuff. But I mean but but all that by way of saying that. Like you know, sometimes, sometimes you want to burn a lot of you want to burn a lot of CPU to get something done. Other times you're like, no, just brute force it. Like try something simple, you know? Yeah, you know, that's the kind that's the kind of stuff I love and this kind of stuff. If if New York. State.

Wasn't wasn't messing with my life. I'd be doing kind of like all the time, like developing products and and and tech and and yeah, I love this. And what's more American than finding something you love doing your hobby on? It and trying to improve it for the next generation like that's kind of what it's all about.

Let's give people just a an overview of what we're expecting in the next little bit what you guys had in your opening statements and and then we'll wrap the sucker up since we've been going at it for a little bit. But I think people have I think people need to follow this case. So first of all let me, I've been throwing it on the screen left and right. So I'll throw it again. That is your handle on Twitter where people can follow you and

they can see the updates. It's future radiocast, all spelled out Future radiocast. All right, Dexter, give them, give them the lay of the land for this, for this court situation. Yeah. So this was week one, basically. When we've again I was rated in April of 2022. There have been a lot of delays, back and forths for a while. We were waiting on data from the NYPD. We we filed a motion to dismiss on brewing grounds and that required us to get certain data.

We filed A FOIA request. We got that data. I wrote the code to transform that data so my legal team could do analytics on it. That's also open source, by the way. But Long story short, here we are. We did jury selection that that. It took about a week or so for us to get a jury to impanel a full jury. So we finally seated the last juror, the last alternate this week and we started opening arguments was with opening arguments on Thursday I believe.

And I have to say so far, look, I don't want to jinx myself by gloating over the over the mistakes of my adversary, but so far the prosecution has not covered itself in glory. You know the the, the game. The fix is definitely in. It's clear that New York State that the court itself is kind of inclined to put its finger on the excuse me, its thumb on the scale right on the side of the prosecution.

So for example they struck the the prosecution struck every every strong black male figure from the jury panel. My jury panel is is is. My jury is is mostly women and and three white guys now taking nothing away from my white brethren. It's supposed to be a jury of my peers. I, I I would have liked to see one or two working class black guys that would have been nice. One would think there was one guy.

There was one guy that they that they struck that they struck who literally he worked at a law firm. He worked with like a like a man, like copy center guy, copy center technician in a law firm downtown. He had a brother in Homeland Security and another one in the police. We liked him. The prosecution struck him again. Strong black guy. Couldn't have that. Anyway, I like this jury. I actually like the jury we got. Because they're ordinary New Yorkers, like most of they're

working people. They're women who have to, like, get on the subway every day. Do you know what I'm saying? Like, like they're people who understand that people go home every night and like, look at the news and see the craziness happening in our city. And the prosecution has to persuade them to look at me and say, yeah, put this guy away for

18 years. He's dangerous because he was making things right with the opportunity cost is that we're going to waste all of our time running after Dexter. But we're not going to go and fix your subway problems where we got this going on. We're not going to spend our energies doing things that, you know, that are going to really materially affect you. But this guy who was making stuff in his house and never left with him, right? That's real scary. Yeah, so. So that's a tough. Sell.

I got to sell to like, even even the people that think guns are bad. Right, right. That's that's a pretty tough sell. It's like, you're, what, 51? 52 years old, Yeah, yeah, 5353. 53 years on the planet, no real problems. With guns. Guns that Never. Left his house, tinkering on stuff. Has some pretty. Interesting ideas that he wants to. Share with people you don't. Have to agree with him or not and like whatever. Not not causing any problems. He's just your neighbor.

Right. And you got neighbors that that like you, I think. Right? That sounds like neighbors. Yep. My got neighbors that like me. You know my upstairs neighbor he's mad cool. You're you're. Not doing desktops down there in your apartment like being a menace to society. Jesus. No, you're you're looking at buying land in New Hampshire. Like some kind of, you know, radical, but other than that? Don't start with that. How how many people in New York

are thinking? Like, yeah, I'd like to have a place somewhere. Up in the. Whatever's north of New York, they don't really know what's up there. They never leave, but right. But they well, they've gone to the country once or twice on a weekend or something, right? Yeah. Well, my ex-wife, my ex wife's family used to have a place in New Hampshire. And it's like a family vacation place up in here, but that was like further north of New Hampshire. It was a very long drive.

But when I was thinking and it was great up there, you know, and that was one of the times we went up there was was was damn, I lost my strength. I'm sorry. It's it's it's relative freedom up there in New Hampshire it's relative it's relative freedom. It's not Texas. Let's just be real. But it's not Texas. Well, no. No place is. Texas and don't. Remember, I love.

I like Texas, I got to tell. You the last, the last little thing about Texas in New York, because there's a, there's a, there's a connection there there's. A bridge, right? OK, tell me so. My wife's from Brooklyn, all right? And she got friends from New York that would get married. We were going to weddings and stuff. And I I played this game caught called not only but also OK, I made it up. It's a game I made-up with New Yorkers. Only it's only.

New Yorkers, 'cause they're the best, yeah, so New Yorkers would come up to you and they'd go, hey, man. I heard you're from. Texas, I'd go, yeah, that's true. And they would go, man, I heard in Texas everybody's got a gun. And I was like, not only that, but also there's a $50 a year household. Fine if you. Don't own a gun. I'm like, obviously we can't enforce it. We don't go knocking on doors or anything. Crazy. I'm just saying it's on the.

Books, though. And people be like, that's cool, so crazy. And they would get so excited about it. You know, 'cause New Yorkers are real enthusiastic and somebody else will come up later. On they go, they go, hey, Kyle, I heard you're from Texas. Yeah, that's true. I heard people still ride horses to work in Texas. Not only that, but also every single publicly funded. Building has to have a. Hitching post out in front of it.

Now, mostly these things are ornamental at this point, and they're kind of just a thing they do. For show, but I'm just saying. It's out there. It's on the books. You got to have it. And that's crazy. I don't know. New Yorkers are susceptible to the not only, but also Texas myth. But I used to laugh because the things that New York holds true about itself are more or less actually true in Texas. About a lot of the things yeah.

So there's that and and and that's and that's actually a kinship that's not that's not a rivalry there's actually there's a there's an affinity there and and sort of a love. So I I always find that New Yorkers that come to Texas they they fit in more than they think they will because I I there's a sense there of of of belonging. Well, you know, I, I I I wanted to. I'm glad you mentioned this, because I I've wanted. To I've been thinking about this

for a long time. You know, people forget that this supposed schism between city dwellers and country people is a very recent thing. It's in a very artificial thing. I mean in, in other words, put it this way. Remember, I grew up in New York City, right in in the 70s and 80s. I mean, I remember what was, what decade was that Dukes of Hazzard.

Like, There was certain, like, like all of us, of all colors used to get in front of the TV on Friday nights or whenever 'cause we wanted to see him jump the General Lee. That's right, We didn't. We didn't care that there was a Confederate battle flag on the roof. We could not have cared less. We wanted to see him jump, that there's a flying car and we're watching. It's a flying dude. Come on, there's car chases. And cops and looks like there's. Dudes like, you know, a

distilling moonshine. Yeah, they're running liquor. Get it, get it? Running liquor. Getting the better of the cops. What is? Not to and everybody. 'S on burl, right? Come on. And you know, there used to be a comedian named Jerry. Clower the mouth. The mouth of the South. He was this white cat from Liberty, Ms. He used to rock shows all over the country, including in cities like in in New York City, Madden Square Garden. He was immensely popular.

New York City had a country and western music radio station when I was growing up. It's called WHN. So I grew up listening to kind of funk and R&B and country

music. So I know about like Mel Tillis and Merle Haggard and Emmylou Harris and Willie Nelson and like Waylon Jennings and like you know, outlaw country and all that stuff like and and so this I, I, I very much resonate with with what you're saying about you know, there being this not being as much of A chasm between New York City and and Texans for example, as people would think. I mean what's his name? Hank Williams Junior wrote a song called the Country Boys.

Country Boys can't survive. And one of the lyrics is like, I had a good friend in New York City. He never called me by my name, just hillbilly. My grandpa taught me how to live off the land and him his taught him to be a businessman. I he, he used to send me pictures of the Broadway nights and I'd send him some homemade wine. You know. And when I was like, as a kid, I was like, I want to taste some homemade wine. It's like, what is that?

You know? But anyway, everybody's interested in the thing that they don't have near them. But it doesn't mean they fear it or they hate it. There's a natural American curiosity towards the thing that is not. That's why people who live. In the city want to. Have a country house, and that's why people who are from the country want to go hang out and live in the city when they're kids. I mean, how many young people come in and move to Los Angeles?

And New York, when they're young and they're. From somewhere in the middle of nowhere, like they're in the middle of Iowa and they grew up on a farm and they want to go make it as it's something and they realize like, you know what, I'm actually going to raise my kids back where I came from. I like that better. And city people do the same thing. They go, look, I know the city or maybe they don't.

Maybe they say, oh, I resonate here because my values have moved, because the values that I, I believe are not here in the city anymore. It doesn't mean that their values didn't used to be there. So anyway, I don't, I don't think we're all that dissimilar. I think there's a lot more connection in this country than there. It just takes a couple of people talking about it. That's right. And and I think our so-called

leaders are terrified. Of us kind of bridging that gap and just talking to each other and reasoning with each other, I

think. I think that people like me, talking to people like you, talking to people like my my friends from down South or from other red states or what have you, they're terrified that we're going to start kind of reasoning about what's happening to us as Americans and look at each other and be like, wait a minute, hang on a second, Somebody doing something slick, somebody convinced America that they're not the good guys. And you know what?

That's the thing that I. Want to conserve and my buddy said it the other day. Best, My buddy Mark Naughton was like, I want to preserve and conserve, or at least try to regain that sense that we thought we were a moral force for good because we were actually doing good. We believe we are doing good. Even if we were misled, we were still trying to do good. And America always saw itself as an underdog. An underdog is inherently going

against something that's harder. It's like and and even if that that thing that's hard is like just the tide of humanity always going the wrong direction. It's like America was trying to swim upstream. Always has. If we got back to that, we got to the point where we were like we're the bad guy because we had all the things. Well, I think I I mean to be fair, I I think the imperial.

Project is part of that. I think the imperial project corrupts, will corrupt the soul of a country, Do you know what I'm saying? It's like Rome started to go wrong when it became an empire because when the imperative of empire was was to keep expanding and then they had to, they had to like. You know, debase their. Currency and hire mercenaries and doing all this stuff.

So it's like if if we could get back to our logos, our secular logos and our Christian logos, if we could, if we could dispense with the imperial project, I think we could start to really turn things around in this country. And I'm not. I make no warrant as to how long that'll take. Oh, I think it'll take a long time. Yeah, I think you're right. But that's OK. We just, you know you you don't get. Fat overnight. You don't get lean overnight. It takes, it's a process.

And we have gotten to the point where this country is addicted to comfort. But that is to say that we are cursed with abundance. Yes. And so that and that's that the Imperial project you're talking about that that abundance. Comes from and then. Once you do that, once you chase in abundance because that's what you think is standard. Yeah, that's OK. Seven lean years. We can we can make that happen. That's right. We might be in that. We might be seeing that whether we like it or not.

All right. I hope you will keep updating us about the the court thing where can people follow the, the best place to follow the updates on the court case. Well, I mean I I try to do a a a space. They got to sign up for Twitter. They got to they they they got to be on Twitter, unfortunately. But I try to do a space. Every night or so, just saying how things went in court this next week is not going to be very interesting. The prosecution is going to be bringing the evidence, right.

Like all my my weapons that I built, you know, my weapons parts on and entering them into evidence that's going to sting a little bit. Well, yeah. Like, see, it's stung. They they started doing that. Yesterday and that did sting. Seeing all my babies up there I'm like because you know they they bring the bailiff would bring the exhibit over to our table and I'd be like that's that's alpha. OK that's Diana. That's the rifle I built for my daughter that epoch.

That's the experimental polymer carbine I built to try to because I was interested in certain design characteristics of polymer lowers. And it's like, damn, like the state's got them, you know, and I and I might have to sue them to get them to get them back. You know, that's assuming I stay out of prison. But it is what it is. You know, we are where we are and you know that. Put it this way, I'm, I'm reconciled to this fight.

Whichever way this goes, whichever way this trial goes like this, this is going to change things And and I'm as you know, I'm I'm in it to win it. I mean you know that the state offered me a plea deal for eight years instead of 18. I turned it down, you know, so, so it's like let's go. By the way, before we go. What was funny, in the opening, in the pre trial festivities, the prosecution had a big problem, had big problems with a lot of stuff.

They had a problem with the fact that I was doing so for me, I was talking about the case. They tried to get the judge to admonish the defense. She slapped them down twice. They told a big hairy lie in open court that me and my lawyer got into an elevator with two prospective jurors and I guess, I guess they forgot that the elevators have cameras in them. So that was that was interesting. And you know, they even, they even they didn't even like the fact that I interacted with my family.

You know, the first day this week, like my my parents came. My upstairs neighbor came, his girlfriend, their friends. You know, when I was I, I was greeting my people in the hallway. And we're just, you know, loving on each other what have you. And the prosecution did not like that at all. Well, you're you're supposed to act guilty is what they want. I'm supposed to act guilty. That's correct. Yeah. So again, I'm again, I'm not going to.

Exult in whatever errors they make, because that's bad juju. But I will say that, you know, we we so far we have no 'cause to be particularly uneasy, aside from the fact that we're in this mess in the 1st place. Yeah, horrible fight for all, for a lot of the marbles. Maybe not all of them. Yeah, a lot of them, yeah. A lot of them, yeah. Yeah, so, so, yeah, follow my, follow my. Twitter you know Future Radio cast on Twitter and yeah, that's it. Dexter.

Oh, I I do have, I do have a give, send go. Yeah, I don't really. I think. Hold on. Do I have that saved? I had it. I grabbed. It. I know I did. Oh, you know what? It's in the show notes, folks. So the link link, yeah, the link is in the show notes and also the link for the Twitter. So you could find both of them there. And I know it's in your Twitter bio. People could find it there. Yeah, Link 2 is in my Twitter bio. I'm like, I know I was like, I wouldn't gather that.

I know. I grabbed it. Yeah, Yeah. But I I don't. I try not to push that too hard, because I'm not. I'm broke, but I also know that a lot of other people are struggling as well. I'm grateful to everyone. I'm grateful to people who just pray for me or just send good vibes out for me. And yeah, we'll see. We'll see what happens. Amen. Yes, Sir. All right, brother. We'll talk again real soon. And thanks for spending.

The next the last two and a. Half hours with me kind of kind of cutting it up on all the topics that people can see. You get a good sense of what it is. Make sure you guys are following Dexter and we will see you again on Monday morning for the next non Saturday night special version. This has been a pretty special offering. And Dex, thanks for thanks for being on it Bud. Thanks, brother. All right, ladies and gentlemen, we're going to wrap it all up.

I hope you. Guys have a wonderful Sunday. I will see you again Monday morning. First thing, no ads, no, no commercialization of this story. It's just an important story for you guys to hear. And we'll see you again. God bless. See you soon. Thanks for listening to The Kyle Seraphin Show, streamed live weekdays on Rumble. Dot com. Slash Kyle Seraphin Bobble Kyle on Twitter, Truth, social and Instagram at Kyle Seraphin.