Hi, Welcome back to the Carol Marcowitch Show on iHeartRadio. Last week I talked about the slew of articles about how women are staying single. The tone is very much you go girl, with quotes on how happy they are and what they're doing instead of getting married and having families. They're traveling, they're building businesses or climbing in their careers. They're going to bed at eight pm snuggling their cat because that's what they want to do and no one
is there to stop them. I've said on this show before, but all of that, even the early bedtime and the cat, could be better and easier in a good relationship. I was a big traveler even before I started dating my husband, but having someone to travel with and combine resources, you know, whether that means money or planning or spending the dull parts of traveling, like they getting their part together. It's better with someone you're into. And I've talked about how
my career took off when I got married. I was able to take chances and opportunities that I couldn't take when I was on my own, and that's a frequently missed angle of the whole career or family non debate, and I say non debate. I know people who listen to the show a lot know that I think this because I don't actually believe that anyone is choosing one.
Or the other.
As I've said, I think people lean into their career more when they haven't met someone to be with, and then it becomes they've quote chosen career over a spouse, when really the choice was kind of made for them.
One of the stats I shared last week is the share of women age eighteen to forty foorse single that is neither married nor cohabitating with a partner was fifty one point four percent in twenty twenty three, according to an analysis of census data by the Aspen Economic Strategy Group, and that numbers up from forty one point eight percent in two thousand. Now, I tried find a similar stat
for men to see what are men up to? And I came across this one from twenty twenty three that I had seen before, and I always find amusing Among those eighteen to twenty nine years of age, sixty three percent of men versus thirty four percent of women consider themselves single. And I remember when this stat came out and a lot of people were confused, How could it be that sixty three percent of men are single but only thirty four percent of women are. But anyone familiar
with the dating world knows exactly how. A woman goes on four dates with a guy and considers him her boyfriend. A man goes on those same four dates and continues dating other people until they specifically have the talk about whether they're going to be exclusive. The man generally assumes they will not be. It's funny because lately I've seen videos of young people in other countries marveling kind of
mocking Americans about the whole talk thing. Apparently, when you go on some dates in France or Italy, you're together and that's it. Of course, those countries are also known for kind of loose standards of monogamy, especially for the men. So while I agree that needing to have that exclusivity talk is silly, at least American couples know where they stand. So I looked, and I looked, and it doesn't seem
that men are getting the same glowy. He just wants to stay single and hang out with his friends, soft pieces that single women do. That's a tell to me that women are being lied to. A number of years ago, my daughter started noticing that there were always shirts for sale that said stuff like girls Rule and girls run the world, and it became obvious to her that boys didn't have similar clothing because the clothing aimed at girls was a lie, or if not a lie, then maybe
a fib to them up. And that's what's happening now with these articles about amazing singlehood that are only aimed at women. They're being lied to, maybe to make them feel better, but it's a lie.
Nevertheless.
Recent show guest Abigail Schreyer had a really good piece on romantic comedies and love in general in the Free Press a few days ago. I'm going to read kind of a longer clip because I really enjoyed it. She writes, quote, every story involves daring, chance, and above all serendipity. Love, we are reminded again and again, is ultimately an act of surrender, Which is perhaps why our Bye with one click era struggles when it comes to romance, why it's
technological wizardry invariably comes up short. We shop for mats online like we shop for clothing, determined to call up precisely and exclusively what we've already decided will please us. But real love can't be prime delivered like toilet paper. The precondition for romance, and especially of marriage, is our willingness to move beyond consumption, to shift our focus from I need a foodie who loves rock climbing to imagining
what you might give to another and create together. Sally, and she's talking about when Harry met Sally would never have matched with Harry on hinge. Height alone would likely have preweeded him. He of slim build and average looks nothing like the boyfriend who couldn't commit to marrying her tall, agreeable, blonde,
newcast handsome Joe. But rom coms exist to remind us that we don't know everything, not even about what we need, and that intimacy, like humor, involves surprise, which also means we must be open to finding someone who isn't simply a reflection of ourselves. End quote. I love that, and that's what women and men need to be told. Love is amazing and you should want.
To find it.
You can still travel and girl boss and have a cat, and all of that will be better with someone. Thanks for listening. Coming up, my interview with Logan Lefkoff. But first, after more than a year of war, terror and pain in Israel, the need for security essentials and support for first responders is still critical. Even in times of ceasefire. Israel must be prepared for the next attack, wherever it may come from. As Israel is surrounded by enemies on
all sides. The International Fellowship of Christians and Jews has supported and will continue to support the people of Israel with life saving security essentials. Your gift today will help save lives by providing bomb shelters, armored security vehicles and ambulances, fire fighting equipment, black jackets and bulletproof vests, and so much more. Your generous donation today will help ensure the people of Israel are safe and secure in the days to come. Give a gift to bless Israel and her
people by visiting SUPPORTIFCJ dot org. That's one word support IFCJ dot org or call eight eight eight for eight eight IFCJ that's eight eight eight for eight eight if CJ eight eight eight four eight eight four three two five.
Welcome back to the Carol Markowitz Show on iHeartRadio. My guest today is Logan Lefkoff, a sexuality educator and host of a show called The Sexy Side of Zionism on Izzy Stream Israel TV.
Hi Logan, so nice to have you on.
Hi Carol, It's so nice to see you sort of in person.
Yeah, that's sort of in person. We've never met in person. But we have to rectify that, I think soon. But I have to start off with what is a sexuality educator?
And does everyone need one? Personally?
I mean, yes, obviously right guarded in this field. I was a fifteen year old peer HIV and AIDS educator. I came of age, you know, I grew up on Long Island at a time when HIV was being talked about as a virus that didn't discriminate, and so for whatever reason, my parents became super involved in HIV and AIDS awareness and fundraising, even though we had no like real.
Personal connection, right.
And I came home after school one day and there were condoms and bananas on my dinner table, and my parents said, Okay, next week you go to become a peer educator and to teach others, and I okay. And what I learned was that I was really good at talking about things that made other people uncomfortable.
And I wound skill.
That's a real skill, Yeah, thank you. I mean, I don't know.
I guess I was just mauthy enough and had a big enough ego to think like I could do anything like that didn't seem to stop that line of thinking, so I wound up. I really I went to college thinking I was going to be a lawyer. I went to the University of Pennsylvania, which you know, I'm so proud of these, so proud. And I found myself watching my friends and I like smart and sophisticated women making eight shittiest decisions about sex. And it wasn't like the no protection question like issue.
It was no equity.
We didn't know how to speak up for ourselves, we didn't understand our own bodies. And I just thought there has to be a better way. And I called my parents and said, I'm not I'm not going to law school. I'm going to get my master's and then eventually a PhD in this field that no one knew existed.
Friend, what are you going.
To do with it?
I said, I don't know, I don't know, but I'm going to do something.
And so really, nowadays, or at least for the last you know, three decades. I design and implement sex SED programs and a lot of schools. I've done a lot of consulting with organizations. I did a lot of work in the media in this space of sexuality and healthy relationships. And now I don't I don't know what I do, but clearly difficult conversations is right wheelhouse.
So it's interesting because normally, if you call your parents and say, I'm really into sex and I'm going to pursue this as as a career path, I don't know, a lot of parents might not be happy with that. But your parents seem like they almost, like, you know, kind of led you in that direction.
I think my parents were. They were definitely blindsided that this was going to work.
Okay, I mean they didn't know the bananas and the condoms that not.
Like, no, I just just not like this what we are in the middle of, like a global health crisis.
And so we're going to do our part in our own that's really nice, Yeah, which amazing. It was.
It was definitely amazing. And I also think that my parents knew, no still, that the person I am today, for all the good and sometimes not good, it's very much a result of being raised to have a voice and to use it and to be fearless. And so I'm sure there are times they think what did we do? And then also they're very proud to.
What do people misunderstand about sex?
Everything they misunderstart at the beginning, tell us everything. So I think that what most people misunderstand is that sexuality is not like a switch that gets flipped on at some magical time.
And shut off at a magical time.
That you know, we have a sexuality from birth to death. It's made up of all of the things that make us who we are. So you know, sure our you know, anatomy and gender, the way we express ourselves, the roles we play in relationships, who were attracted to what we like to do, and we express that differently throughout our
throughout our lives. Uh, And that there is I think the biggest issue becomes in a world where we are so consumed with with what it means to be normal, to realize that there is no one way to be normal when it comes to your sexuality. I think fear of being normal prevents us from feeling fulfilled, whether that's emotionally or sexually, or or intellectually.
Even so, where does Zionism come in. What's the sexy side of Zionism?
How do they how do they intersect?
It's it's really I mean, I think Zionism sexy, but I don't feel like that's necessarily the popular opinion.
Apparently not. But I too, find find it very sexy. So I am a very, very proud Zionist. I am the granddaughter and great daughter of great granddaughter of American
Zionist leaders. The sense of connection to Israel, to our story, to self determination was a huge part of who I was throughout my life, and I would say that, you know, anytime someone like offensively says you should stick to talking about sex, my answer is always my Zionist and Jewish values in form everything I do in my professional life.
I can't separate them. So, you know, as in the last couple of years, and I'm sorry, I don't want this to be long winded, but it might be, so I have to tell us go ahead, Yeah, obviously, you know, in the last you know, I mean decade, sure, but in the last five years, spaces that have been historically progressive, mainly my own field, have let's just say, turned out to be reaching anti Semits. And so what I decided
to do years ago was just be unapologetically Zionist. And it wasn't like I ever hit that part of who I was, but I didn't realize I had to lead with it. And so I've made my platform very much unapologetically Jewish, unapologetically Zionist, and you know, pro Israel as if by the way, there, I've never heard of any other place where you're like pro We're anties.
Right, who's pro France or like pro Italy? You know it just it makes no sense.
Yeah, ridiculous.
And the sexy side of Zionism came about to be honest, because my media life, my TV life, kind of took a well died died in the last couple of years, right around the time I started speaking out very publicly about Israel.
I don't you know, it might be a chicken red question, It might be a very big coincidence. I don't know. But this, this space that I love to play in, was not really calling me anymore.
And I had an opportunity to meet the CEO of Izzy Stream Israel TV Nazi Dinar, and he said, do you.
Want to do something on TV again? And I said yes, And.
He said, you want to like talk about what you love and Israel. I'm like yes, And so we came up with the sexy side of Zionism. It's been amazing because yeh, scientism is sexy, right, As some of my guests have said, moral clarity is sexy, right. Being able to stand up for yourself, to be empowered by your voice and your story.
Is knowing who you are. Yeah, resilience is sexy. So yeah, there seems to be a very nice connection.
So what are the episodes like?
So the episodes are basically a conversation which.
Always starts off with why is Zionism sexy?
You know?
We start with, like to use the sex term, the money shot first that we established okay, start.
And then people get to tell their own story, their own journey, not just about zioni is, but how they found their voice, how they got to where they are. And then the part that I really really love is
every I get everyone's hot takes on Israel. So everything from your favorite Hebrew word, do your favorite you know music, to your favorite place in Israel to what's the best thing about israelis were the one thing that everyone should know about Israel, and for the people who have never been, or the people who haven't been in a long time, it's a way to bring them in and to remind people that there is a world beyond this absurd like sided lens that we we see every day.
So it's been a.
Very sexy place.
Everybody looks really good, and it's just it's you know, warm weather and the beach and it's it's it's really a wonderful, wonderful place.
So, Carol, I have to I would say of the.
Twelve interviews that are that are basically in the Canton, ninety percent of maybe one hundred percent. Everyone says, I don't know if I can see this, it's reelis are just really hot. Yeah, I said, don't be ashamed. Everyone says that.
And it's not untrue.
It's one interesting We're going to take a quick break and be right back on the Carol Marcowitch Show. So I've written about sex in my life.
I mean, you know my columns at the Post, I've written about all kinds of you know, social things, friendship and marriage.
And when I've.
Written about sex, I remember I had one article and this was a big one for me.
But it was because I got a lot of it was passed around a lot. Obviously, anything sexu realated is always going to be kind of popular.
But my argument was that sex is the most important part of a relationship, and I've done monologues on this show about that also, and people hate that because they're like, no, what about honesty, what about connection? What about I'm not saying it's the only important part of a.
Relationship, that's crazy.
Why would I say that. I'm saying it's.
The most important part of a relationship because it's what separates friendship from relationship.
Is that generally your take as well? Or are you going to argue with me?
No, I'm not going to no argument.
Let's go yeah, yeah.
Have you seen me online? I love to argue. It's my favorite job. I would say this that I think the first thing we everyone needs to establish was what kind of relationship that they want throughout their lives, Like what is important? However, physical intimacy and connection to a partner beyond just friendship is important. Then yes, of course, sexual intimacy and pleasure and good communication so that everyone gets out of sex what they want is critically important.
That being said, great sex cannot sustain a crappy relationship, and the law not just about sex, but sex. If it's not good, if there's not a connection, then it becomes an overwhelmingly big part of your relationship.
So the reverse of that for me is, could crappy sex be okay? Can you live with that in a great relationship? And I think no, I don't know. I think that then you have a really great friendship and you know, not the relationship part.
But I don't think you are wrong. I think that that pleasure.
Are you going become a sex therapist because I'll do it?
I mean, please, please, We.
Need honestly, we need, we need smart, some more ethical people in our field these days.
So the more the merrier.
I do think that it is really hard to be in a relationship where there is bad sexual and physical and maybe not in the beginning like of someone's relationship trajectory where maybe they're deciding on kids and there's a lot of other stressors, but at some point when everyone unloads the baggage of like what it means to live a fairy tale life whatever bs that means, the sexport kicks in and people remember, oh wait, I enjoy that.
Yeah, it's good.
And this is important to need this, and so if I'm not getting it, then we need to figure out how to kind of make all parties fulfilled.
Yeah, what was the plan? B if you didn't go into this.
Field law school? I guess I have a particular like brand.
No, I think that might be a lie.
I didn't and maybe this is maybe this is my m O, which might be a problem.
I don't really ever have a plan B. I just assume the plan it's no work, and and I run with it.
It may not be the most strategic strategy, but I never really thought about what what if it didn't work? And my parents asked me, what are you going to do with this career? And I thought, don't know, but I'll just figure it out. And I was at this moment when in the I guess late nineties, early eighties, there weren't a lot of us in this in the space.
It was the early days of the internet.
Like once you got on a TV show, your voice was out there and other people called in the field wasn't crowded. So I like to think I was am really good at what I do, But also I recognized it was this moment in time too, that that gave me an opportunity to find a to find a public voice. Because there was no career preath. I had no idea
what this career was going to look like. All I know is that I was a grad school student on the Howard Stern Show, and the cat, the taxi driver I was in recognize my voice from the show, and I thought it was the weirdest thing.
Yeah.
Ever, that's awesome is this saying I'll either find a way or make one. It just sounds like you made one for yourself.
I think so.
I think I'm I think I'm continuing to do that as I'm in this weird space now professionally.
Where I'm so.
Angry so many times that the people who I thought were my peers, my professional peers and friends, and now I have this other chapter of my life which I think and I know I find so meaningful that I was kind of made for this moment. So maybe the plan A was always You're going to have lots of difficult conversation. Maybe the conversation the subject matter is just going to change over time.
What do you worry about?
I really worry for for my kids and all of our kids I should say, not not just my own. I have an almost twenty year old and an almost sixteen years old.
I worry that I worry.
Old enough to have a twenty and a sixteen year old.
Oh, thank you, good dear metology.
Right, I'll get that number from you after, Okay.
Any anytime I worry.
There are a few aspects to what I worry about, and not them as individuals, but generationally speaking, I worry that they, because of these weird years in a pandemic, without intimacy, without taking emotional and physical risks, that they that this generation does not have the skills to have emotionally intimates, actually intimate relationships and be able to communicate about them, especially because they're so connected via social media and phones and filters and you know, other ways of
being inauthentic. I worry about that. I worry about the fact that this is a generation of trigger warnings, where we're like warning people like you're about to be uncomfortable, so avoid discomfort. I don't, right, that's a space I don't. I mean, look, as Jews, we've we've never really been afforded a trigger warning.
So I feel like it's just unfair.
Yeah, we just walk right into it over and over and over again. So there's there's that piece of it.
And then of course, realistically from the anti Semitism space, I really feel I feel for our kids who and I speak from personal experience, whom my kids have never had a day where they haven't had to deal with something, And I feel so badly that they wear armor every single day and don't know what it's like to take that off, to always have to be ready for something, for a fight, for to not know if your peers
or your friends are really your friends or not. I just that's that's what I worry about that we are. It is such a sad position for our young people to be in.
That's so tough.
I mean, I guess I knew that that was the case for a lot of people, but it's just hearing that.
It's really a hard place to be.
And I hope you're I hope they're doing okay with it, and I hope you are also.
Yeah, thank you.
I mean, we we've I will say our obviously, our family story at our my son's school was very very public.
It was an opposed two years.
I'm sorry, I don't know it. Tell me, tell me. Yeah, no, oh.
My son graduated from Fieldston in May of twenty three, and so we dealt with an anti semitic incident basically every year of high school that we were very much like all in and my son is this incredible voice and knows how to be a leader and knows how to fight even when the stakes are high. And we just had incident after incidents, So to be honest, he was very very prepared for college like this right ever's happening now?
Yeah, and they should be teaching workshops actually, I mean it's it's I can laugh about it now just because of course I don't think we have another alternative.
But we've we've been we've been down this road before, so so you know, they they get it, and I think they I've always given them a healthy dose of identity and who they are and to keep your head on a swivel.
But that's how I was raised. I don't understand everyone still.
Like fair that they have to deal with it, but I get it.
You're giving them the foundation at home and the basis for everything that they're going to encounter in their lives.
Yes, And I feel badly like that in this day and age college kids. I mean, depending on where you are more or less, but there's I don't think there's any place that's totally immune.
To this stuff that.
They don't ever really get a day of being like a dumb nineteen year old, right, yeah, yeah for fair, Yeah, they really they don't find it fair at all.
What advice would you give your sixteen year old self.
I would tell my sixteen year old self that this is not the best time of your life, not because it was terrible, just because every chapter should be a meaningful chapter, and when the chapter ends, it's time for a new one, and that's a good thing. I think a lot of us spend time in the past thinking that this was the best moment, and it shouldn't be. It shouldn't be the best moment. Every chapter should be meaningful and be a part of your story and add to the to the next story that we tell.
Sixteen is pretty good, though, that was a good chapter.
You're not even worried about that many things.
You're like, you know, living with your parents, that your life is mostly taken care of for you.
It's you know, I get it.
It's only gotten better since then. But I like sixteen, it.
Was no I mean, i'd like sixteen too, although I don't think I would want to.
Well, I know for sure I would not want to be sixteen today.
I think so much had the worst thing ever, I would hate, hate it. I tell my students all the time. I tell my own kids, I made plenty of mistakes, plenty of things.
Like yeah, and you'll never hear about them.
Because there are no pictures.
No, there are no pictures.
And also if someone knew about it, it was because they were there and they weren't saying any right.
Yes, absolutely, well, I love this. Yeah, I've loved this conversation. I think you're just awesome. You do such great work, and you're such an interesting point of view. I think that everything that you say is very unique. End us here with your best tip for my listeners on how they can improve their lives.
I would tell your listeners to get rid of the fairy tale. I am very much a realist. I'm not a romantic. That doesn't mean I don't like romance, but I feel like these stories we were told throughout our lives set us up for failures, so that when the challenge is in our midst, we don't know what to do. With it, and if we veer off a certain path, we think there's something wrong with us, as opposed to maybe thinking that there was something wrong with the story.
And so don't let this idea of what's normal or typical paralyze you emotion the sexually. We should be able to chart our own our own path forward. And who cares if it doesn't look like your neighbor. Who cares if it doesn't look like the book you read?
Those are stories you imagined for yourself. Yeah, yeah, very much, so love it.
She is Logan Lefkoff.
Check her out The Sexy Side of Zionism on Izzy, follow her on X.
Thank you so much for coming on, Logan, Thank you.
Thanks so much for joining us on the Carol Marco Witch Show. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.