#7 - The $45M Consult Process that Exploded Our Growth

You know , over the past nine years we have grown from zero attorneys to over 25 , doing over $15 million in revenue , and my purpose here is to document what's working and what's not working in our practice so that you can take that , you can recontextualize it to your firm , to your law practice , and shorten your success curve .

My name is Jeff Hughes and I'm your host , and today I'm talking about a very critical , important tool that has transformed our entire law practice , starting with our client experience and our top line , and that is this It is our consult process that we have honed over hundreds of consults over many years , and we have distilled it down into really three phases ,

and I'm going to share all that with you today Now . So what are the results that we have seen from implementing this ? What is the context that we found ourselves in when we found the need to come up with a process that delivered to the clients what they wanted , what they needed , when they came in to see us for the first time ?

First off , from a top line , financial perspective the easy stuff to measure and understand , and that is since 2019 , we have sold over $45 million in service fees and family law with this process . So we know it works And it works because it gives clients an extraordinary experience when they come in to see our attorneys .

It gives them security and stability and a path to work on when they're meeting with the client for that very first time .

So let me share with you some of the context to explain where we were and the dreadfulness that we were in , to where we have come since implementing this process and back , starting at the end of 2018 and into 2019 , and honing it and refining it over the year since 2019 .

So back in 2018 , we were growing as a practice and we had some really , really strong growth years And that was great . But we started to see the client experience begin to fray in that initial , all important first impression meeting with the clients And but that wasn't it .

Okay , in addition to the poor experience with clients , what we started to see was that the volatility of our top line So clients coming into our firm .

It was so inconsistent , year , month by month , year over year , and that's stressful from a financial perspective that you're trying to grow the firm and predict revenue so you can make decisions off of what your expectations should be from a client and take client coming into the firm perspective .

We knew that clients were calling us so we could predict pretty consistently the phone calls and the reach outs from prospective clients into our firm . But what we were having a very difficult time projecting on and making decisions on was the number of clients that we could expect for them to choose us to represent them month over month .

So some months they would be fantastic . The next month they would be half of that stressful . And it wasn't just seasonality And there's seasonality for sure in family law , with different phases of the year like school , summer holidays and so forth , for folks to make decisions around their family legal issues . But it wasn't just that It was .

It came down to that initial consult experience was very volatile And the disparity between one attorney's delivery and one attorney providing experience to the next was so significant in our firm that we knew that we had to come up with a process that provided a consistent experience for our attorneys and for our clients .

And so we came up with this particular process . Now this consult process breaks down into three phases . Okay , we have the pre consult , we have the consult and we have the post consult . So what happens and what should happen in that pre consult phase ?

First off , typically it works like this in most firms A client will reach out and to indicate they want to speak with one of the attorneys in a practice . Typically the phone is answered by a receptionist or a paralegal or legal assistant or something along those lines . In our case it goes into our intake team who focus and specialize on speaking with clients .

That first time they reach out to our firm And what we do is we'll go through , of course , do the conflict check right off the bat . We'll ask them questions about their case , try to understand some of the basic facts like what are they here to see us for ? What's generally , broadly speaking , going on ?

We don't get into any detail , certainly no advice sharing on that first call , but then we'll walk through that process with the client . There's an initial fee that the client pays to meet with one of our attorneys . We take all that information down , we schedule the appointment with our attorney and with that prospective client .

So the attorney gets this notice that hey , i'm meeting with so and so on this day for an initial consult And they also can see all of the notes related to that client their name , obviously , what county they live in , et cetera .

And what we want our team to do is really study that , understand the facts of what has been shared with our intake team And then just to understand , broadly speaking , why that client is coming into our firm . Then we want them to take it a step further , go online and look up anything they can find about that prospective client's case .

A lot of times opposing party has filed something . Maybe in some cases our client has filed something . We want to know what's happened from a court perspective historically regarding that client And maybe they have a long period of litigation related to it . We want to understand that as well . But we don't want to stop there .

Let's take that a step further and let's do some online googling and research for our client to find out what we can about where they're at in life , their family , how they communicate , how they present themselves . We can find out a whole lot of stuff online researching folks to understand what's happening , but also about the opposing party .

So when that client comes in to see us , we already have a general sense of who they are And maybe we have a sense for what needs they have , how they like to be communicated with , how they communicate , their style and so forth . We want to know all of that sort of stuff .

Those give us a little bit of edge in connecting with that client , really being able to understand them and who they are .

And I can tell you in many cases for consults that I've done , where I have indicated or shared something that I saw about them online or about the opposing party online , that really gave our client , that prospective client , a sense of these folks care about me , they're going to do the , they're going to go the extra mile and try to understand more about me

other than than what I shared with that intake individual a few days ago or something . So that's phase one , the pre-consult phase . That's preparing to give that client an experience . That takes some work on the front end and attorneys who do that , they're the pros , they're the ones who who tend to excel in that particular consult .

So doing that work on the front end , that spade work , is vitally important . So now let's get to the console process . This is where the rubber meets the road and that connection is made or it's not made with the client .

In our case , we have broken down our consult into five different phases of of the consult for that client that we're meeting with . So , in our case , our five phases , our five phases works like this We have our roadmap right up front . That that's about 5% of the time . So let's assume that a consult lasts typically somewhere between 50 minutes and an hour .

Okay , so a few minutes of that time is setting expectations for that hour and giving clients a roadmap for what to expect . Then we go into the listening phase and in our console process that's about half the time We want to just listen , shut our mouths , quit giving advice and just listen .

Then we want to get into a transition part of the case or the other console , excuse me where we want to align with that client and understanding what their goals are . And then we move into the feedback phase , that's our , our advice giving phase , and then we go into the options that we are able to present to them .

So that's the five phases Broadly speaking . I'm going to break these down very specifically and walk through each of these in detail So there's clarity in how we do this . Okay , so let's start go back to that very beginning and that roadmap part of the case , that , that expectation setting .

So when the client comes to see us and sit down , a lot of times they are just dying to share their story , to unburden , to tell you what's going on .

And if you're not careful , that time can get real out of hand and it could go for a very long time , which doesn't serve the client well , and certainly we can't do that as attorneys because it blows up our schedule and we're not able to manage our day . So it's important to set those expectations on the front , and here's what it looks like for us .

First off , we want to establish context . So what we start with is like you know , ma'am , what I have I've read the notes from our intake team , i've gone online and I've looked at the court records to try to understand what's happening or what has not happened in your case . And I've read all that and assimilated that and I'm ready to talk with you today .

And so here's what's gonna happen over the next hour . There's gonna be plenty of time to hear your story and that's important . I need to hear that and understand what's happening .

Then I'm gonna share with you some feedback and give you some advice on the next step or two in your case and how things are gonna play out once the court system gets underway , once that process gets underway .

And then we're gonna conclude with the options , if there are any , that we can do for you to serve you as you go through this part of your relationship or your marriage or whatever . So that's setting the expectations . We want that client to understand that A they can relax , they're gonna have time to share their story .

We're gonna be all about being present and listening to them to understand what's happening in their world . Then we're going to transition into a feedback time . We're going to answer their specific questions and give them advice on how the court process works . Then we're gonna conclude what the options are , if any , that we can do for them .

Maybe there isn't , And so we're gonna share all that with them and they know that , coming out of that , that lasts a couple minutes Okay , it's not very long .

Then we move into a real simple question And what I like to do is tell me what's going on And then shut up , be quiet , let them take it from there , and then , if you do that , what you're gonna find is a lot of folks will just start talking and sharing .

And those that are really comfortable sharing can talk for the next long period of time 30 minutes very easily And that's so important for them to be able to share and get that off their chest . Many times clients that come to see us we're the first time they've shared this , especially with men .

They just haven't talked to anyone about it and they're in pain and they need someone they can confide in and share with . And providing a safe , comfortable place for them to do that is really important And it makes or breaks the entire consult , that listening phase .

So what we work on really hard and I encourage everyone doing a consult is work on those empathy skills . Now , that's not what that looks like is identifying with them emotionally where they are at , helping them to understand that , hey , we are present , we're listening your feelings on that , validate those . Okay , you don't have to agree with how they're feeling .

You don't have to agree , as a lawyer , with , maybe , the moves that they've made , but understanding that they've got some feelings , right or wrong , those are there . Identifying those and validating those is an essential part of that listening phase . Now , a lot of times , going through this phase , a client will stop and you may need to prod them further .

Tell me more , what happened next , what else ? That happens quite a bit , especially again with men , who don't sometimes share as much , and of course , with women too . So this goes both ways . But I'm just talking in generalities how this tends to work . A lot of times , many times they'll have they're just dying to ask questions because they need answers .

Right , and they'll start peppering you with questions . It's so important that you don't get dragged off and into the woods , so to speak , and beaten , eaten by a bear chasing all of these different questions .

So the best thing to do is you know what , ma'am , or your sir , i know that you've got a ton of questions and what you just asked is a real important question . I'm gonna get to that , but I need to understand more about your story . I need to understand more about what's going on in your particular life and your scenario .

And just pausing that , knowing that , letting them know I'm gonna answer that . There's a time for that in this consult that's coming up , but first keep sharing and unburdening .

So the most important part of this whole listening phase is helping that client unburden what they're sharing , unburden how they're feeling , unburden all of the garbage that's going on in their life so they feel like they have someone that can help carry that with them . That's connecting with them , that unburdening part .

If you do nothing else in this phase of the consult and this half of the consult is helping that client unburden , get it off their chest , couple things mechanically as you go through this . Okay , don't take a ton of notes And , for goodness sake , don't be typing on your computer . Even if it's like a remote consult .

Do not do that as little as possible and preferably none . When you're typing on the computer , especially one-on-one in live action , what you're telling the client generally is this computer is between me and you and I'm more focused on this right now . Don't do that , put it down , just focus and listening .

We want all of our attorneys to record every consult For one major reason is that you can go back and you can rehear that later . You can have your assistant take the notes down . You can put it through some AI tool to transcribe , but you can do a lot of things with that .

But it allows you to just focus and be present and connect , look that client in the eye so you can give them that neurologic feeling that you are there with them and you are connecting with them . You are mirroring them and getting on their same wavelength . So that looks like taking a little to any to no notes .

That looks like deferring questions as often as you can till the feedback portion of the consult And that's asking only the essential questions . So if you're getting into detail like what year was your 401k established or how much money in that 401k right now and all that kind of detail that's for later , don't get distracted with that stuff . It's not important .

What's important is that you help that client unburden and share and that you connect with them during that listening phase . That should be half the consult . Now a couple more things related to this . What I have seen is that attorneys that struggle with listening by and large they really fall into two categories , maybe three .

One is the young , inexperienced , insecure lawyer . Now , we've all been there . I certainly have been there And because you feel so insecure about yourself and about the value that you are eager to deliver to that client , you want to impress the client , so you just give tons of advice , you talk a lot . That's coming from a place of insecurity and naivety .

So recognize that about yourself , zip your lips and be quiet , okay . Second category are attorneys who it's all about them .

Their ego is so massive that they have to stroke that and feed that , and so for them , they want to pontificate , use big words and just basically vomit on the client with how smart and brilliant they are And I have no doubt that they're smart and brilliant . But the client's not there to hear you talk as much as we think they are .

They are not here to do that . They are here to share their story with us and find out if we can help them get out of pain . Okay , using big words and going into this , like all of these strategies and if , then and what , if and over analyzing all that stuff , that , just like it , the eyeballs roll back in the head and it does not help the client .

So getting away from that is so essential to giving clients the experience that they need and that they want and they're there for . And so , listening , listening , listening . So if you're talking more than like 5% of the time , going through this half of the console , this listening phase , you are just talking too much .

You need to check your words and be quiet and listen and ask questions . Now , some clients they can't talk for 30 minutes , they can't talk for 20 minutes , they can't talk for 10 because they don't really want to . They just want to give you the basic facts and move on and see if you can help them , and you got to adjust to those Okay .

So maybe you're only listening for 20 minutes or 10 minutes , that's okay . Let the client dictate that , but not you . Okay , you can't dictate that until it gets kind of to the end of your timeframe And then you got to take control and move , move the conversation on from there .

So for us that's phase two of our console , of that middle phase or middle section , the second part of the console . Now there's a transition period .

That happens here , okay , and we call this in our firm , we call this the big question , or you can call this alignment , you can call this a bunch of things , but what you're doing is you're summarizing where that client's at , that you heard them and that there's alignment on the goals . So what it looks like for us is a simple question .

You know , sir or ma'am , after all of this is over , what does success look like to you ? And it's remarkable the number of clients who don't have an answer for this .

And it's even more remarkable to me that they just gotten to talking for 30 minutes about the pain that they've been in and their definition of success has nothing to do with that pain Nothing , okay . So that just tells me yet again that that they're there to share their story .

More than anything , that's the most important thing getting it off of their chest , unburdening , because when they tell you what they want , a lot of times it's a whole lot different than what they just shared with you for 30 minutes . So that's really really interesting . So , as they define what success looks like , now you know how to give feedback .

You've heard them , you find out what they really really want , okay , and maybe you've helped them with that definition of success , maybe you've guided them a little bit , maybe you've prompted them , whatever . So now you get to that And once you have that definition of success , now you're able to provide that feedback to them on how to get there .

So for us , what that looks like is clarity on the next step

or two . Now this is where attorneys can fall off a cliff here , okay , especially those that are really excellent at analyzing and seeing scenarios and multiple paths , and if then scenarios , clients don't care about all that .

They what they really need and they need to walk out of there with an understanding of , okay , here's what's going to happen next or here's broadly how long this is going to last , but here's the next step in the process . All right , so that's what they really need . The next step or two , not the next 17 steps that will overwhelm them .

They can't grasp all that information , especially being in pain . They can only take in one , maybe two . Stop there , help them understand one foot in front of the other . Let's take our time and let's work through this , all right .

Another important aspect of this feedback phase is only given advice that the client needs , not all of the potential scenarios and how they may work out and what this judge might do and what this opposing council might do and how this could go awry , and all that stuff is . Save that for another day , when it's closer to the event and it matters .

Focusing back on what does the client need today to move forward ? and maybe a lot of it's just hope , maybe a lot of it's just sharing . I heard you . These things are . All these emotions and feelings that you have are all very normal .

Clients come see me and this is a very common set of circumstances that I've seen , and here's how we've handled that in the past , and here's how we're going to handle that in your case , starting with today . Maybe it looks like we're going to file a response with the court . I want you to know that I've got this completely under control .

You don't need to worry about a thing . What you really need to do is go home and just start to get your . You're pulling your financials together , or you need to maybe have that first conversation with your child as to what's happening . Whatever , that is Okay .

It's the next step or two being very clear about that and making sure they understand that there's a lot of uncertainties . We're not going to be able to answer all those questions today . We don't even know if those questions are going to ultimately end up being . We have a good sense based on our experience , but we don't know for sure .

Let's focus on what we have in front of us and let's eat that elephant one bite at a time , so to speak . Another thing here is that where attorneys get way off the rails here is they focus way too much on the facts and on the logic . Of course , the facts and the logic are very important .

That's what we work with , but what's important to that client is the emotion Focusing in on their emotions , identifying them , helping them understand that you understand and focusing on the positivity of how you can help them . And I know that a lot of times we have to set hard expectations with clients and we have to do that .

But if we focus all on the negative , they leave discourage and hopeless . We have to be able to give them hope . I mean , napoleon said leaders are dealers in hope and I'm going to just change that to say attorneys are dealers in hope and we have to be able to give them that when they're here to see us in that feedback phase of the console .

So all right , that's phase four of the actual console . Coming out of that , we get into the options . How can we help that client ? What are the options that we can offer them to serve them ? and that may look like we can't do anything for you today , mr Client , but here's what you need to do to be prepared if something happens in your case .

Maybe it looks like let's just do some coaching and maybe it looks like a full rep We're going to be able to represent you . Here's how this works . Here's the fee , here's what you should expect from that . Here's how we work with our clients and so forth .

In our case , we're a completely 100% fixed fee firm and that's a little different than most of our colleagues in family law that charge by the hour . That's a retainer that they draw against and it needs to be replenished on a pretty regular basis . In our case it's a fee for a portion of their case .

You break it up into roughly thirds and we essentially charge one fee for each one of those thirds of their case , and most clients have never worked with an attorney that handles the fees in that way . So what we have to do that may not be common in most cases is that we have to understand their context . Have they worked with the lawyer before ?

If so , was it hourly ? Here's how they do it . Here's how we do it to help them understand the difference , because it's a totally different way to work with clients that we feel is better . By the way , we feel like it aligns our interest .

It helps open the communication because the clients aren't afraid to call us all the time because they're worried about getting whacked with the bill for 10 minutes or something . So it really works well in our case and I think it works best for clients .

So , but we have to go through that and explain that to them in our phase five of our consult and explaining those options . So that's the consult . That's the five phase of the consult . The first is the roadmap , setting expectations . The second phase , which is about half the consult , is this listening .

Then we have a transition portion of the consult where we align with them , ask them those questions what does success look like ? Then we go into feedback . That's the lawyer's favorite part of the consult , but that's also the part where they lose clients the most because they over advise , they get into stuff they don't need to be getting into .

They don't focus on emotions , they don't focus on positivity and they just basically dump on the client logic . And that's not what the client's here for They remember . They don't remember what they said , what you told them . Okay , i'm going to tell you right now that 95% of whatever you share they're not going to remember an hour later .

But they will remember how you help them feel . That's what they'll remember . They're not going to remember all the great , wonderful , wise advice that you shared . They're going to remember how you help them feel . So , focus on the important thing to them , not the important thing to you . And that's where phase four happens .

In the consult We get into phase five . Phase five is just the options phase , looks like the fee agreement and so forth . That's what happens there . Okay , so now that second stage of the consult process is over , now we go into that third stage was the post consult . So this is important , interesting .

Okay , we have notes to take down right , any follow up notes , any directions we need to give our staff to follow through with that client , and about roughly probably around two thirds of clients that come see us don't make their decision at that particular time .

They'll do it the next day , later , later the week , maybe a few weeks later , and so it's important that you schedule follow-ups to that client , need some more time to work through and maybe get some questions answered . So scheduling that follow-up maybe your staff is doing the follow-up . Whatever happens , you need to get that schedule and done right there .

So that happens in that third phase and that follow-up is super , super important . I know that attorneys don't love anything that looks and smells like sales A lot of attorneys don't anyway But the clients need that And if you truly are the best option for them .

You have that moral imperative , i believe , to help them work through what they need to , to work with you and your firm versus another one . So that's an important part of the console . Don't overlook that . It's the easiest part to overlook because we get busy , we get moving on with our life And we don't love that part of following back up with clients .

But it's important . Schedule it . Don't leave it open for chance . Don't say I'll talk to you in a week or you call me back in a week . Schedule something So you both are committed to reconvening on on their case . Now , all right , there are a couple of things that are critical to do throughout the entire console , all right . So let me walk through those .

One is talk like a human being , not like a lawyer . So , using big words , using legalese , using terms that you would not use with your , your grandmother or , you know , with friends at the park or something , don't use those big words in the console . Talk and act like a human being , all right , not someone who is super proud of the education they have .

They have to share that with someone and impress them , because that's not impressive to them . Okay , it's just not . They're not going to think I'm going to hire that lawyer because I can't understand the lawyer . They're not going to do that . Don't deceive yourself and delude yourself into believing that Doesn't work like that .

Second thing , and this is vital , because you're building trust with the client through that whole process , and that is speak against your interests when it's appropriate . So if you're not the right fit for them , tell them . If you can't help them , tell them .

If you know that them hiring you is not going to have a good result for them because it's their expectations are out of whack , tell them do the right thing . Build trust by just like being honest , because most , most clients will appreciate that and they'll probably want to work with you more . So speak against your interests .

Don't look at that as like a something that's going to pay your bills . That client . Speak against your interests . Do that liberally , all right , it builds trust , it's the right thing to do And it's counterintuitive to many folks , but do that . It works .

Third is this is where experience matters probably the most , and that is balancing the tension between the client's hopes and expectations and the reality of the court system . Okay , because sometimes those do not sync up and clients want the world . But that is not going to happen because there's two parties and they both want the world .

So the world's going to be split in half likely , or some variation of that . And helping clients understand what's really going to happen , that's tough to do , but don't shy away from it . You have to be able to do that , otherwise you're going to have a whole lot of client control issues down the line .

If you tell them , yes , we're going to go gouge out their eyes and we're going to just going to kick butt and take names . I'm going to give you everything you're asking for . You'll probably get them to sign up , but then you're going to have real difficult client control issues and horrible reviews down the road .

So , having the discipline to work through and balance the tension of setting expectations yet giving hope And that , by the way , that a lot of times is done by you connecting with their emotions because if they , there are a lot of most clients that are high level of emotion underneath that they're reasonable people And as they calm down they understand that there

is their desire and there's reality . So most clients will come down to that and be easier to work with on those expectations as the case goes along , some narcissist people that we all have had those clients . They'll just never do that because the whole world revolves around them . So they're hopeless .

And so you just you know , either don't take them as a client or figure out that you're just going to have a lot of hard conversations through the whole process . Okay , all right , and the last one . I've said this already , but focus on the emotions clients .

Remember how you help them feel , not what you told them , not the great , wonderful , sage advice that you delivered , but how you help them feel . Okay .

So that brings me to the final point , and that is if you want to become a pro , if you want to deliver the best experience , the most incredible experience for clients , you have to do one thing and you have to do it consistently for a long period of time , probably forever And that is record your consults and listen to yourself .

That sounds easy , and it is easy because it's simple as hitting a button on your phone And at the end of the console , hitting that button again , and then putting it in your drive on the way home or something and listening to it , or some other walk that you're doing .

But if you can hear how you're coming across yourself , awareness goes way up And you're able to start working on those little tiny things that you're doing or not doing in your consult . That's providing a poor experience or a poor connection with that perspective client . So I'm going to take this is our one sheet process boiled down .

It's got the three phases of the consult pre-consult consult , post-consult and then the middle consult . We break it down into those five different stages . That's all right here I'm going to put this on my LinkedIn profile . You can go grab it off of there .

You can email me directly if you want me to send you a copy of this And I hope that's helpful as you grow your practice .