We all have pain, and we all have, like, wounds, and they may come from different places, but we're all, like, hurting in a similar way. And so when that happened, like, I feel like the first or second day or something. When that happened, I was like, oh, my gosh. Okay. So look, yeah. I'm not alone. They're not that different from me, all that imagined differences. And to be clear, like, I was still the only black person, but I didn't feel so alone after that.
When I... I started to focus on like, our commonalities and not on our differences. Welcome, everybody. My name is Drew Horn, and this podcast called Lu everyday radius. It's brought to you by the Hoffman Institute and its stories and anecdotes and people we interview about their life post process and how it lives in the world radiating love. Please be aware that this episode references miscarriage. Please use your discretion.
Hey everybody, welcome to the Hoffman podcast, Jessica Kaiser with us. Welcome, Jessica. Thank you much for having, Drew? It is great to have you. Would you introduce yourself to our listeners? Sure. My name is Jessica. I am 36 years old. I work as a professor. And I... Really love teaching. I'm really fun and funny, and I really enjoy connecting with people, and going on adventures with people. That's so good. I I can feel the joy in your voice.
You and I haven't met, but You strike me as someone who loves to have fun and loves to be playful and joyful. We really do. I think that's true about me. So let's just go right there. Tell us a little bit about who you are, Tell us your story. Yeah. So I'm from Southern California. I grew up in torrance in the South Bay area. I'm the oldest of 4 kids, and my parents were in were in a a integration relationship. So my mom is... She's Puerto Rican in indonesian.
And those are 2 groups that are not really present in Southern California. They're present in like, other parts of the country, but southern California. Like, that's not... Like, that's on a big group. I should say to actually that my dad is African American. So I'm so I'm racially mixed. Puerto Rican Indonesian on your mom's side. Yeah. And on your dad's side, African American? Yes. I think as a result of that, I really grew feeling like I didn't belong anywhere.
Like, I was like, not even in my own family, and think in in my family experience, like, the message I got was I didn't belong there, but also, like, I was, like a burden there. The other thing that was significant was that I grew up in a religion that like, that was very separate from the rest of the world. So I grew up as a Jehovah's witness.
And, like, part of the rules of that religion was at, like, you only hung out with other people in the religion and that you stayed very separate from the world and they, cold people outside of the religion worldly people. So I got this sense that, like, I didn't belong in the rest of the world either. Like, I sort of only... But but but often didn't feel real belonging in the religion either. So I kinda just up feel like I
didn't belong anywhere. And, like, and that sense of feeling like, I'm not supposed to be here. And later on, like, this feeling of, like, I'm a mistake. That sort of for me to, like, different parts of my life. I but I would say that was present from the beginning. So, like, racially, sort of religion wise.
And the other thing too is that I attended schools in which, like, me and My siblings were, like, the only black kids we're the only, like, poor kids in the school but also that contribute to that feeling of, like, oh, I don't belong here in the school or with each other kids. I so the like this this sort of separation with other people. Wow. That's stereo pho, not belonging an overdrive. Yeah. Yeah. What happens?
I'm really curious how does I don't belong, reinforce through so many different messages. Growing up. What's the impact on a little girl who doesn't feel like she belongs and that's gets reinforced so many different ways. Well, I let's say, the other thing that reminded me or the that came up for me is also that that I've 80 adhd, but I didn't know that I did. Like,
I didn't know, like, 4 years ago. So it's also was, like, a neuro rich kid growing up and, like, having a hard time, like in school, hard time of, like, pig attention, being very, like, goofy and being like very, like, playful in ways that maybe we're, like, not socially appropriate in certain situations. So I also felt, like, like, the weird kid, like, the kid didn't belong. So but I didn't really know about that until much later, but I would say, like, how did that...
Yeah, how did that manifest? I mean, the other thing is that is that my household was very... Unstable. And since I was the oldest of 4 kids. I had a lot of responsibility to, like, take care of my siblings to, like, do the cooking to do the cleaning to do grocery shopping until, like I took on that responsibility, or I was forced to take on the responsibility very young. Yeah. I felt like I was a burden, but also, like I felt like, was responsible for other people like it was my job to
take care of them. I mean, really, like, I felt like I a kid, like, I Really biting my time until I could leave. That was sort of my feeling was that I just had to, like, stick it out until I was, like, old enough to graduate. I think that, like, 1 thing that changed in my life was that when I was 12, my mom got remarried. So I should say, like, my parents divorced when I was 4, my biological dad suffered from substance abuse disorder, and he also had severe mental illness until he was homeless.
For most of my childhood. Until he wasn't around So I'm mom was like a single parent she ended up going to college when I was 8 and graduated when I was about 12:13, and that's when she had met my step father. And so the person that I called my dad. And so that was such a stabilizing force. I felt like, I had somebody that, like, loved me and cared about me and that, I didn't make me feel like I was a burden. We would do, like, fun things together. Like, we would do...
This doesn't sound like a good thing, But some... Like, some days, he would let us ditch school and made to go on a adventure gather at the beads or do something together, like, once in a while, he let us do that. Having and my myself had come into my left was a huge... Was, like, a huge shift. Like my... I still had difficulties with my mother, but at least I had another parent there that was loving... I made me feel loved.
III didn't really get the other parts of my relationship with my mom or you or am my biological dad And I I think, like, it wasn't until maybe 6 or 7 years ago that I really start to think. About how it impacted me. I kinda felt like I was just biting my time. And then when I went to college, I was like, well, that's in the past. And I didn't really think about it that much. It was like, what's in the past that's over now, and I'm over it. And also, I I had stopped talking to
my mom. So I kinda of was like, I solve that problem few. I just don't have this person and, like, and, like, everything's fine now. So that's what of how Ikea was until more recently. Yeah. So what's happening? On the outside of your life. You're a Phd, you're a professor, at an elite private college. How'd you get there with all of that identity confusion and even that neuro diver Ad that wasn't diagnosed yet.
Well, 1 thing that was, like, really impactful for me was when I got to college, I discovered sociology. I think before I just thought, like, everything was everything that went wrong in my life with my fault. I just thought, like, it just was because, like, I made bad choices or my family made bad choices, and that's where we were. I went to a cal state, which I which I loved. I'm so glad I went there. But at the time, I was like, oh, I'm in this low ranked school. It's
because I didn't study enough. I'm not as good as my peers. Everyone was smarter than me. And so when I found sociology. I was like, oh my gosh. Like, we're individuals but we're in this greater context. And it's just society where there's these invisible forces that impact who we are And so, like, where we're born, who were born too, like, those are not choices I've made, but all those things impact to my life.
And so for me, it was, like, help me understand that everything bad that it happened to wasn't my fault, but there were things that had happened in my life, like, I was born to, like a teenage parent. And so, she was like a single mom. So, like, that was a court reason, like, why we were... Soc economically disadvantaged. Right? It wasn't just, like, we all made bad decisions. And so when I found that I was like, oh my
gosh. It it really, like, lifted this huge burden off me, that was, like, I I think probably the start and, like, my own healing was, like, finding this discipline that helped me understand my life and how me connect the dots. That's really fascinating. So studying the larger themes because sociology is the study of groups of people. Right? Yes. It's 30 groups of people. And there's a there's is idea that, like, we all have agency over our lives. Yes.
We all have, you know, individual choice, but there's so many things that were not chosen for us. Right? Like, I have... I have citizenship rights. As a American citizen. I didn't choose to be a citizen. Like, my mom just happened to give birth to meet in the United States and I've access to all these things. If I didn't my life left be very different. Right? So it's it's studying, like, how the social context impacts people's lives in ways that, like, are beyond their control.
And so in that studying of this larger groups of people and how how things work in large groups of people you saw yourself. Yes. I saw myself and also that everything wasn't my fault that the circumstance of my family that made me feel so different from, like, other kids, like us being poor us being different races. That was just a product of society, not like an individual, you know, failure of mine. Wow.
Today, does Ted feel liberating? Yeah. I felt so freeing and But looking back, like, it... I think I thought, like, oh my gosh. This is, like, this is the answer, and I didn't know yet that, like, there is much more steps to go. There's, like much more places to go after that. By the time I thought, oh, my gosh. Just makes so much sense and and still makes a lot of sense, but made, so my sense, I just felt so relieved. And so, yeah. I just I just felt this huge
relief. I will say like, that sense, like, this is Merit responsibility that not like, now that I'm saying it obviously comes from my upbringing, like, feeling like, all my still picture my responsibility. Everything that bad that happened or family was sort of my fault. I will say, like, my mom had the story about me that she was... Used to say that, like, I was have to get her from the very beginning. Like, she said that, my birth was very traumatic everything I did was, like, against her.
She kind of created this, like, ad aerial relationship, like, or like, ad aerial story that she told me. Ever since the beginning, and so looking back at it now. I'm like, 0II took that story. That I was living on in me even then and I didn't realize it. Wow. So what happens next in your life as you move through it in those earlier years? Well, after that, I finished college. So after I... You know, I find social sociology, I decide that I want to just do this full time, and I wanna be a soc.
And I go to graduate school, and those feelings have not belonging. I've really struggling in school Like, followed me there. And my graduate program, I was 1 of, like, very few black students there. Everyone else I thought. And this is actually Jake. Most people Had gone to much more prestigious schools than I had, I was youngest person in my cohort. And so right, as I started, I was feeling like, oh, god. I don't belong here. Like, this is, like, this
is a mistake. Like, I'm a mistake. I'm not supposed to be here. I I mean, I finished my Phd, and I and like, I did well, but, like, I I didn't feel good. I'm throughout it. I kinda just felt, like, I'm struggling on I'm behind. I'm not where I should be... I remember, like, when I first started, I had this professor that I asked a question during an exam. He said to everyone. If you don't know the difference between this and that, then you shouldn't be a social scientist.
Can I just remember, like, just walking back to my seat, like my head down, just, like, feeling so embarrassed? That was my first term in grad school. I feeling so embarrassed, like, oh, my god. I'm so dumb. I can't believe I asked that question. I now, like, that wasn't really about me. But at the time, I just was like, I'm not was, like, this is proof I'm not supposed to be here.
And there was another professor. I remember I wrote an essay and I got it back and she was, like, you should really go read some other students essay essays so you could understand what you're supposed to be writing about. And I was like, oh, man, Again, like, I'm not supposed to be here. Like, this, like, like, this is a huge mistake being here. But I just kept going. I just kept going.
Well, despite those messages, like, I'm I I'm I may think part of the reason I kept going was I I had a lot of social support in school and so, like I was part of these programs and I had friends that were very encouraging us And and so that was really helpful, but like, I didn't really feel throughout. I was there for 7 years. Like, I didn't really feel like this is where I belong. I just kinda felt, like, I'm just gonna stay anyways Like okay. Kinda I felt, like, an unwelcome
guest that just kept staying. That I just didn't know to go home. That I was like, I'm just gonna keep... I'll just be here. Even though I feel uncomfortable, and I don't really feel like you want me here, I'll just keep staying because, like I kinda don't know what else to do. And then I made it. I made it, and I graduated, and then I started my job and I was so grateful to have a job, especially in Southern California.
And again, I I did the same thing I did before was, like, was I was looking to see, like, are there other people like me here. And again, I was sort of feeling, like, okay. Well, I kinda don't belong here again. Like, I'm this like academic who had this, like, who was, like, low income growing up and, like, low income in college. I had, you know, a teen mother and I had a father that was like, headsets substance abuse disorder. Like, I'm so different. Like, my family is so fucked up.
Like, that Feeling like, like, I have a fucked family. Like, That means, I'm fucked up and I'm belong here, like, that that, like, that has been a court theme throughout my, but also, I was feeling it even as an adult as, like, someone had their... Like, their very first job and, like had, like, all these markers of success. Like, I had my graduate degree. Like, I got this, like, job that I always wanted. And, like, I still felt like it
wasn't enough. I remember, like when I got my peach, I was like, happy for a day, and then I was, like, oh, now I have to, like, earn this job. Now I have to prove that I belong at this job. So, like, that joy that I had or, like, I was like, oh my gosh I finished this big thing even when I was celebrating my pitch, I also felt, like, oh, man, like, I fooled everyone. Like, I just, like, went under the radar and like, I just like, I fooled
them into, like, giving this degree. Like, so I was happy, but also part of me felt like, oh my gosh. I got away with something. Sounds like the messages that you would internalize so early on, were almost imp to the the data the evidence that was mounting, getting a Phd, getting a high level job at a private college. None of that was able to penetrate that messages
you don't belong, You're not worthy. I just thought I was like, either, like, really lucky or that, like, Like, I felt, like, super lucky that I just, like, left that I that I fell into this, and then I also felt, like, I was, like, fooling people. Like they... Eventually they were gonna find out, like, that I wasn't supposed to be here. I didn't feel like it was real like I did belong there. Was sort of, like, I'm fooling people they're gonna find out I'm supposed to be
here. And so is that what eventually leads you to the process? Yeah. So a couple things that to the process. So, like, I was in my job, and I had, like, I was doing okay. If I was also struggling And the other thing is that, like, when I was in graduate school, like, I was in these, like, relationships that were not super healthy. Like, the last I was in, Well, he kept breaking up with me. Like... And also, like, I wasn't the right
racial background for him. So that he really wanted to be with someone in his own financial background, and he'd had had pressure from that from his family. So, like, he would break up with me and we get back together again. And we'd break up and then get back together again. And then, finally, we broke up for the last time. Am thinking, like, I never wanna do this again. Like, I never want to be in a relationship like this again. And so I was like, I'm just
gonna take a break. I'm sort of focus on myself. And that break lasted for, like, 4 or 5 years because I was like, well, I know that I was making choices that led to that. Like, I don't know how to do anything differently, And I also don't know why I made those choices. And so at first, I was like, I'll just I'll just take a break, but then I kinda felt stuck and I was like, I know what to do differently. At the time, I heard about this, dating coach. Her name is Mar Pat batista.
And she actually did the process. I think she's on this on podcast. Yes. We had her on the podcast. So 1 of my other coaches was on her podcast, and my coach shared that with us. And I listened to it, and I was, oh, this is really interesting. I started listening to more of her work. And then I went to this, like, conference that she held. And I was like, oh, my gosh. Like,
this makes so much sense to me. Like, we're talking about patterns that come up and dating and, like, how rather than focusing on, like, oh, these people are these guys are losers or this? But, like, what am I bringing to it? Like, like, why am I making these choices around picking these people. Right? And taking it for, like, responsibility for, like, my 50 percent. Right? Like, but, like, the part that I'm doing. And so I did her coaching program for a year.
And that was so incredibly helpful. So, like, during that process, I was like, oh, my gosh. Like, so actually, these feelings of, like, I'm afraid of, like, rejection I fucking don't belong here. Like, those have come from, like, from my childhood, and that has led to who I was picking. And I was like, thinking about it as ago, The person I picked last time, I picked someone that would, like, reject me over and over again just like I was feeling as a kid.
I just was, like, recreating that in this really weird way that I didn't realize until I had done that program. And so I I did that and and then I I was also afraid to start digging. I was so afraid of, like, being abandoned, being rejected, that I would like literally get so but my body would be super. I'd have to do like a meditation before every date because I was so nervous and anxious. I did meet someone. So like, that was my goal Was like I, I wanna a
boyfriend. So It did, like, meet that goal, and I got married, like, 3 months ago. And it's like the most beautiful loving relationship that I've ever had? And I don't think I would have had it if I hadn't, like, done that work to go through, like, why am I making these dramatic decisions? Like, what sort of driving me to do these things and I really learned how to date differently and to, like, be with myself differently through her coaching, and so, like, that was incredibly helpful.
But then after that, also was feeling like... There's something more here, but I just don't know what it is. So there's some challenges I was having at work I guess is that Anytime someone would ask me to do something that I didn't really wanna do. I would feel so afraid of saying no. Like, the memory that comes to mind is, like, a remember I was gonna go on, like, a paid leave and, like, a dean or something asked me to take on this responsibility during my leave,
and it was like, a small thing. He's was like oh, you could say no. But I remember, like, the idea of saying, no, like I had... I had to call, like, a friend for help because like, my chest felt so tight. Like, it it was, like, hurting, and like, I had trouble breathing. I think I was having a panic attack. Just even thinking about, like, saying no. I was so afraid. He's gonna I think Badly at me. This is gonna impact my career.
And, like, she had I had to color and, like, she had to, like, give me, like, permission to say, no. And encourage me to say, no. And, like I did, but I was, like, something's going on for me that, like, this is so scary for me to say, now to this person. So things like that were happening. I think also, I realized too I would get So now would get, like, so angry. Like, I would feel like, rage.
Like, I wouldn't, like, you know, a Harmony 1, but, like, I would just feel like this intense rage and be like, oh my god, Like, where is this coming from? I would have, like, move it through my body. Like, I wouldn't, like I would, like throw, like, a pillow against the wall or, like, I would just, like, you know, stop my feet I just would feel, like, so angry. And I would just feel like, it kinda scared me because I'm like is just, like, rage coming from and I thought that
meant something bad about me. And actually, the biggest unit brought me the hoffman was that It I was going up for 10, and that brought up... Where so much fear for me. Like, I just felt, like, okay. This is it. Like, I'm gonna get rejected. I'm gonna lose my job, And I just was feeling the level of intense fear and, like, this fear of rejection of abandonment that I was feeling was so intense. I was like, there's something else here. So 1 thing I did do, which was
which was helpful when I did... Like, I did therapy throughout this process, but, like, I had done talk therapy and, like, at first, it was helpful, and then it came to a point where it I wasn't so helpful anymore. And then my dad told me about this kinda of there be called Em. At And he had found it really helpful and I was like, okay. I didn't really know much about it, but I just thought, okay. Well, he found it helpful. So I was trying to find someone else.
Like someone that would do that for me. And so I found a therapy and what she did was it's called brain spotting, and it's a kind of therapy that's, like similar to to Em here, but it's different. But basically, we talk for very little, but instead I'm like, staring at this point on a wall, and I'm like, thinking of a memory and, like, processing the memory. Like, while listening to this, like, music. And so I do that for, like, 6 months before half were I would, like, do that they're.
Once a week, and I'd just be crying the whole hour. Like, just like sobbing, like, crying, And I'm was like where was this coming from that, like, every week, I just have, like, all these tears to cry. So I was grateful for it, but also, I was, like, made me really realize that, like, all that stuff I thought that I had gotten over or that I thought that I had, like, processed I I didn't really. Wasn't really in the past that it was still with me. So I did that. And I remember,
another coach had mentioned the process. And now I it's like, okay. People keep mentioning this process, like, okay. Like, I know that morning Dennis. So Was like, well, let me, just like, look into. I haven't I told my dad about it. And I did was I sign up for the essentials, the 2 day online, and that was so transformative. I remember, like, we were... I was with other people.
We were sharing, you know, intimate things that had happened in our life, but also, like, some of the extras that we were doing I was dressing so much. I remember there was this 1 where we were, like, remembering something that was really difficult. I just, like, tears streaming down my face. And I thought, like, okay. Like, maybe there's more here, like, maybe I could do this, you know, in person at, like, I'm
I'm at the process. So I so I did that 2 day thing, the 2 d essentials, I thought, I think I want more of this. And I wanna say wand... Like, want is, like, a weird way to say it, but Like, I knew I needed it. Like, you know, III want, like, new shoes, but like, I don't think like I wanted to cry more, but, like, there's a part of me that's, like, I think you really need this. And not because there's anything wrong with me. I just felt like there was more I
needed to express and more to explore. There's still lot of, like, unsettled parts of me inside. That needed attending to or need healing, So that's why I signed up. This... But it was after hearing about it from other people. And so take us into your process, what unfolds for you, where are you in your week? When you feel the the changes occurring. Well, I remember when I got there, and I remember being like, okay. It's this the same? Fucking thing. Like, I was I got there.
Everyone's wiped. There are I no black people here. And I was, like, yet again, like, at the same thing over again. Like, I'm gonna be the only black person here. And I remember feeling like so much distance from the other students at first. And I remember thinking like, they just don't get it. Like, no one's had a family like I've had and which is not true. Right? But, like, but that... But that's what I was feeling like, no 1... Like, no 1 understands anything.
I remember... Even when I got my teacher, who I I love. I ever being like, What is this white lady gonna understand about me? Like, I... Like, how is she gonna know anything about, about me? I did listen to her, to the podcast that she did, and and I remember thinking like, after that, like, oh my. I'm so god that she's my teacher. But at first, I was like, oh my
gosh. I can't believe Gosh got this white woman as my teacher nothing against my people, but I was feeling like, I wanna feel understood, and I felt like I could only get that from someone who had the same experience as me. And I remember there's just 1 moment where we were, like, sharing a pattern that we had, and then, like, where did it come from, and I partnered with this person. I remember thinking, like,
We have nothing in common at all. And I remember he shared his pattern, which is the same as mine, but the story around it was completely different than mine. I remember thinking, like, oh my god, Like, we arrived at the same place, like, we had the same pattern. Like, even though it came from somewhere different, and the story was different. The outcome was the same. And then when that happened, I was like, oh, I'm not alone. Like, I'm not alone. We're all working on something. Like, I'm not
uniquely messed up. Like, We all have pain, and we all have, like, wounds, and they may come from different places, but we're all, like, hurting in a similar way. And so when that happened, like, I feel like the first or second day or something. But when that happened, I was like, oh my gosh. Okay. So, yeah. I'm not alone. They're not that different from me. All that Imagine differences. And to be clear, like, I was still the only black person, but I
didn't feel so alone after that. When I I started to focus on, like, our commonalities, and not on our differences. Kristen Ne calls that common humanity. Yes. Yeah. It's our... Common hem humanity, like that we're all suffering. It wasn't just me. And that's how I I used to feel like I'm just the only 1 who's going through this. Common I would tell stories about my life, and people would be like, that's unbelievable. They or they would be like so shocked by the story.
That I would be like, yeah, My family just, you know, you uniquely messed up. But, you know, things happen to everyone, And, like, we all have our own story and their own pain. For sure. So that happens at the beginning, then what happens as the week unfolds? Would say the other thing I wanna say is that, like, for my biological dad, you know, he left what I was, like, 4, And like, I didn't really see him that much after that.
I think maybe I saw him maybe like, once or twice when I was like 7 or 8, but then after that, I didn't see him at all. I had, like, contacted him 1 time when I was in grad school I needed to help applying for this, like, fellowship for, like, children of veterans. I didn't have much contact Remember he at the time he asked if he could write me. I never responded. And then he died At this point, I think, I had 2 years ago, but it was, like, a year
before I done the process. And so I I went to his funeral, and it was very odd and weird. Like, I didn't know this person. I kinda... I I went because I was like, well, I really wanna go so that I can at least take a goodbye, like, I think if I don't go and say, a goodbye, I'm gonna feel... I'm gonna regret it so I went, but no 1 really knew him there. Like, his dad was there, His dad didn't know about him until he was 15, and either did his siblings know
about him. I didn't know that action till I went to that funeral and learn more about it. So I went to you, it was, like, very weird. I felt like, sad for me. I felt like, gosh, like, how sad that, like, I don't have, like, a, you know, a regular family or a normal family because he had died of an overdose. And I understood it was part of his disease.
I just felt like, this is just proof that I messed up that, like, you know, even the fact that, like, my dad died up an overdose and the substance abuse disorder, like, I just can't have a normal family. So I just... A them just feeling sad for me, and I, at the time, when I was working on, like, my, like, my pre work I guess for the process, I wrote about my biological dad, but I didn't really understand the impact of that relationship on me.
Until I got to the process. Like, I kinda had felt, like, well, that was in the past. It was good that he wasn't around because when he was around, it was awful, like, there was a domestic violence. Like, I witnessed domestic violence, so when I was a child, like, he had been homeless. He didn't contribute financially. To us, even though get had child support payments like you didn't contribute financially to us. So that's was part the reason my refund,
you know, that we are financially struggling. And it wasn't until I got to the process where I really realized how much anger? I had to how angry I was. Towards to. Like, I couldn't knew I was angry at my mom. Like, that was like, sort of a constant. Like, I I always felt, like, yeah. I don't like they was a shit of my mom. You know, I don't like her we have issues, like, we don't like each other. But for my dad, I really thought
about him. I only thought about, like, my, you know, like, my step dad who I think about my dad, but I didn't think about, my biological dad. So when I got to the process, I realized how angry I was at him. Like, how sad I felt at, like, not having him around. So there was like, a point where we were really, like, expressing ourselves and really, like, expressing all the hurt.
I was expressing the hurt that I experienced for my dad, and I just, like, letting it all out just like being, like, surprised by, like, how much? Rage, but also, like, steep sadness that I was expressing. Because my dad, you know, like, he introduced my brother to, like, drugs and so My my brother also deals with substance abuse disorder. She came domestic violence against my mother. So,
like... And and I saw that. So there's so many things that I I was expressing, but also, I also felt sadness for him. I didn't think of him like, as a person, I just thought of him as, like, this figure that sort of did messed up things. But I did think get... I I didn't think of him and and, like, his sadness. So before he died, I had, like, worked on our family tree.
And I don't know why I did that, but, like, I just was working on it, and I saw that, like, his mother was I was 14 when he was born. Like, he was born like, a month after his mother turned 14, and his dad was, like, 28. Like, growing up, I kinda knew that, like, my grandmother was a young mother, like, I'm not in contact with her either but Knew that she was a young mother, but I actually didn't know what that meant. So, like, when I did that family tree I was like.
So, like, this was like, sexual violence. Like, that's what that relationship was, and I was like, oh, so he was a born to a 14 year old mother. I kinda just, like, intellectually noted that as, like, wow, that must have been hard. But during the process, I really felt for him. And, like, felt for him, like, what it must have been like to have raised by, like, a mother that was so young, that he experience that violence? To meeting your father at 15, what that must have been like.
And also, like, I think realizing a key also missed out on father. I he didn't get to be a parent. He didn't get to experience all the joys of parenthood because he wasn't around. And so he was also deprived of father. So I really felt for him, and I really, like, mourn the mourn the loss of what could have been. If things have been different because he wasn't around that also means like,
that that my mom struggles even more? Because I was, yeah, what, like, what would it have been like if she had had a partner. Who financially contributed. Who was emotionally there for her. She would have been a different mother as well. So I also warned for her too, like, My mom is still little lie, but I also realized that, like, for since I got for my mother was that she did not
wanna be a mom. Like, she never said that, but that's I felt that, like, we were burdened, like, she never wanted us in the first place, and we were just there and that she had to take care of us. I also felt, like, yeah, I think they're, like, she didn't get to be the mother that she could have been. Just having that empathy for, like, not only my parents, but I also saw how that played out for my grandparents because, like, my mom mother had abandoned her for, like, a year when
she was, like, 3. And then, I... And I know this from stories is that my great grandmother. She abandoned and my grandmother had an orphanage for a year. And so I was like oh my gosh. Like, my great grandmother did that to my grandmother, my grandmother did that time on. And my mom, she's she was there, like, physically, but she wasn't emotionally there for us. Right? And so I finally got to, like, feel sad, It allow myself to feel sad and to feel angry and to fill all these feelings that I
hadn't felt before. And I also... Like, yeah I also I had so much deep empathy and, like, love, like, towards my parents, which I hadn't really had. Like, I remember I used to say, like, yeah. I had parents, but, like, I don't really love them. If they died tomorrow. Like, I probably wouldn't feel that sad. That's why I used to say, which sounds terrible. By... That... And and that... That's what I used to say. I think it was just the
way of protecting myself. But also, I started to feel like love towards them, but also, I felt loved... By them. Because although, like, they couldn't express that. I felt like that there was a part of them that did like, just couldn't express it, so I finally kinda felt loved by my parents and love towards them, which was huge for me, because I never felt loved or accepted by them. Wow. So the process really kind of completed the circle in a way emotionally of...
Of forgiving and feeling compassion for and receiving even compassion and love from your parents and seeing the the generational patterns that go from you to your parents to your grandparents, So let's go post process. You head with all of that expanded heart out into the world. And what happens? While I laughed, I felt really deep laugh for myself. Like, that had stayed. I think 1 thing I thought was that, like, I left was that, like, okay. Like, everything's gonna be, like, happy
which is not true. Right? Like, life has ups and downs, but, like, what I've realized afterward is that, like, I approach life differently? Just for example, like, I had a miscarriage in the fall of last year. And so it was incredibly, like, physically painful, but emotionally painful. But 1 of the beautiful things that came out of it was that I was so there for myself? I was so loving towards myself. And I I was alone because my my partner was attending a funeral out of
state. So I was like, a alone at home, and I was just, like, really just talking to myself kindly, like, taking care of myself, asking for help from my friends, getting support, but I really was, like, there for myself in the way that a mother would be, you know, the mother that I hadn't had. So I was... I was able to be there for myself. 1 thing I've I also realized is that, like, those, like, core wounds, like me feeling like, super afraid of being
abandoned. Like, that doesn't go away, But for me like the dial has been turned down, like, way down. Those spears and those emotions, like, they they, like come up every day, but they're so down to, like, maybe, like, a 3 or 4 where they used to be looking at it. 10. Where something would happen I would feel... Oh my god. Like, overwhelming rage or, like, overwhelming sadness or, like, my chest tightened up and Oh, and I and I couldn't even breathe and so now when those things come up.
It's not as long lasting. I'm able to, like, again, like, be there for myself to talk to myself more kindly. To give myself what I need and not to, like, go down that spiral. So I would say, like, the biggest change for me has been, like, the dialing down. Of those negative voices in my head. And, like, the dialing up of, like, that compassionate voice at loving voice. That's always there with me. That is much louder these days. That helps me through the different parts of
life. Not just like, I'm gonna be happy all the time. I'm just gonna pretend that it's exist. But, like, being there for myself when that inevitably happens. And I'm curious about your relationship to sociology, this thing that helped you in a way, see yourself in a so much more compassionate way and see your childhood that it wasn't all your fault. How did your relationship with sociology in the work
you do change post process. Do you see a connection between what you learned at Hoffman and what you're teaching in sociology? Yeah. I I do see a relationship between what I'm teaching and Hoffman. What way change me is not necessarily, like, the the sociology part, but it's like me as a teacher? So I think for me, I've always wanted to see my students as whole people, but I think I do that so much better now.
Before every class, we, like, check in with each other, we, like, share 2 words that just rad or feeling or they're allowed to pass. So we check in with each other. I'm at the beginning of class of... And that helps me see where they're at. I think the way that I structure my classes is more considerate of their experiences.
So, like, I have flexible due dates for people because I know that people have make may have things going on that they may not wanna share with me, but they may need extra time to complete because I was neuro, but I didn't have accommodations in school. I allow, like, students to ask for combination. So looks so like they don't need a letter from, like, the accommodations office to get, like, a commission for their
learning. So I would have I much more compassionate and empathetic as a teacher, now, post process, And so I think about that more for the learning process because it's not just that, like, where there's stuff bunch of brands, like, learning stuff, but that we're whole people coming to the material, and that we're engaging with it while we're also living our lives, like, outside the classroom and, like, you can't separate the outside of the classroom frame what's happening
inside. So I would say I I integrate that much more now than I used to. I also used to think that that was the end of be, but that was the thing that was gonna help people the most was to help them understand their own position in society. Like, I think that's important. But I don't think it's the most important anymore actually. Like, it's it's just part of the puzzle. It's part of the thing that is helpful people to understand. But I would say social who help me do
this inner healing work. I couldn't have done that like, soc. So I think I see it more as, like, those yogis is 1 part of people's healing. And what about the personal being the political or or seeing countries with patterns You have a sense of applying the patterns we learn in our family as well as the patterns we learn in our culture or in our society? Oh, absolutely. So that is a big part of what I teachers is that, like, how do we, like, know what we know? Like, where does it come from?
Ideas about, like, what we consider good or bad or beautiful or ugly, Like, those are not just, like, natural behaviors are, like natural to us, but they come from somewhere. So in my classes, that's something that we explore, like, they... For a lot of my classes has been, like, focused on, like, a problem like a social problem. And the students pick the social problem. Usually, it's based on their own personal experiences or something that they are passionate about.
And we look to see, like, what how does this problem come into being? What if the causes of this problem? Where did this come from? Because it's not just like, naturally that it always existed. Oftentimes you think like, oh, well, we have poverty and that's just too bad, you know? It's always been like this, but we don't think about, like, well, what's... Causing it. Like, what are the what are the patterns decided that are causing this? So that, I incorporate
a lot. I tried it to have us pretend, like, we're aliens from, like, outer space. Right? We're, like, we have no idea how the world works, and I wanna explore from that perspective. We're because if we're just, like, completely open. Right? Then we can, like, not take things for granted and see it from new eyes. Before we wrap anything else to say. It's been so good. I would say the post process the thing that's been the most helpful for me is, like, is continuing my relationship with myself.
Continuing to, like, do the quad checks and to do the appreciation graduates. So those practices that bring me back to myself, those have been so helpful in strengthening that, like, compassionate voice or that's, you know, the the voice of my spiritual self, whatever you wanna call it. I think also in the past where I was always focusing on, like, what's missing, like, how Not, like other people or what, you know, like, what don't I
have? Like, focusing on not focusing, but, like, also attention to the beautiful things that I do have has been so helpful for me and, like, and not to say that, like I never, you know, walked down my left road, but, like, But staying connected to my right road. Those practice have been so helpful for me and, and
I'm grateful for them. Yeah. Just I'm so glad you're in the world doing the work you're doing and doing the healing you're doing with yourself and all the students who come in contact with Thank you. And that's of things that, like, I also think need to be a good teacher. You have to do that healing because it's really hard to be a teacher. You have to bring so much of yourself to the work and to, like, have whole space for their people.
And so for me, that's been a working on myself and healing myself has has been really important to being a good teacher. I bet your students love you. Thank you. I think some of them do. I don't know about all of them. By I subs you. Thank you for listening to our podcast My name is Liza and in Grass. I'm the Ceo and President of Hoffman Institute Foundation. And I'm Ras Rossi. Often teacher and founder of the Hoffman institute foundation. Our mission is to provide people greater access
to the wisdom and power of love. In themselves in each other and in the world. To find out more, please go to hop institute dot org.