My conversation today with Natalie was truly a gift. She ex exhibits a liven and vitality and it was contagious. She speaks to using movement as a path to healing an emotional release. She has deep roots and theater and dance and is a founding teacher and c Ceo of the class. Shiva even offers a surprise for our listeners towards the end of this episode. Her vibrant energy reminded me though of just how beautiful the journey of life can really be. Welcome to Loves everyday radius.
A podcast brought to you by the Hoffman Institute. My name is Liz Sever and on this podcast. We engage in conversation and learn from Hoffman graduates. Will dive deep into their journeys of self discovery and explore how the process transformed their internal at external worlds. They share how their spirit and light now burn brighter in all directions of their lives. Their loves, everyday radius. Welcome, Natalie. Thanks so much, Liz. Yeah. I am beyond excited to have you on today as a
guest. And I'm hoping you can you can fill in. It always sounds better. Coming from from the guest mouth in mind. A little bit on who you are and what you do in the world? Sure thing. Coming I am the c Ceo and a founding teacher of something called the class. The class, is both a method and an organization. The method is a workout that combines fitness and mindfulness and the idea being that you're using physical strengthening to come to understand your mind and your heart a little bit better.
And we, as an organization, offer mindful movement practices, including yoga and meditation digitally, as well as in person in New York and La, and and we're in 71 countries right now. So thrilled to, share a little bit about my experience with the class, and how my hoffman experience really crafted and and shaped the last 10 years in which I've been part of it. I know I can't believe it's been 10 years.
Insane. What is time? Yeah. Well, I'd I'd love to just hear a little bit more about how you even can get started. If we take it back to the class. How you even got started in the class. How this... I mean, it's like, a movement at this point, how it came to be. Sure thing. Yeah. In my twenties, I was a performer, and my performance was always rooted in,
physicality. I studied things like Suzuki and viewpoints in Kat and committed impulse and a bunch of different things that we're all about storytelling coming from the inside out, you know, into the body's full expression and It landed me in this funny niche of dancing for art pop bands. And by that, I mean, David Byrne, and the yay, folks who were looking for movement that had nothing to do with Baller Bun heads.
That really had to do with being wild and idiosyncratic and and it taught me so much about music and movement and community and crowds and storytelling, And in between my gigs, I was working at a lulu lemon, folding pants and putting them away. And it was there that I met the founder of what would soon be called the class. Her name is Terrence Tum. And she was developing a practice for her own self in the
gym of her apartment building. She had had 2 kids and she was in the full emotional swing of what that means as a as a woman as a human as a mother, And as a yoga teacher, the fiery feelings just weren't being expressed through that practice. So I joined her in the gym of her apartment building for 2 classes before she asked if, you know, if I had taught anything, and and I said, No. And this was this was before there was a website. This was before there was
a name. There really was no business model because It wasn't intended to be a business. It was something that was helping her, her mind, her heart, strengthening her body, after having kids. It was something she was sharing with her friends. We would drop 20 dollars into her kids trick treat bag, and that was all sent to her mentor in Peru And at the I said... Yeah. Let's let's go. Some little whisper in the back of my mind is saying,
why not? So, I would set up her class and break it down in the morning and go work my Lulu lemon job and go perform off Broadway at night. And I just... Did that for a while until a couple months in. I said, you know, I think I get the hang of what you're doing. Can I teach you a class? That was back in 2013. So it soon had a name. It soon had a website and a couple years into it once we started to figure out what it was.
Myself and the other founding teacher, Jc Go, and tear to me, and I started to bring on other people to help us bring it out of the world. I'm always so fascinated because movement is something that I've always struggled with in the sense that I've never, you know, I've always had had pat... Patterns around dancing and all of that. Some just so drawn to people that are so in touch with that aspect of themselves and patterns So I love to hear a little bit about what movement and music means
to you. Well, you know what, Let me get the controversial statement out of the bag, which is I can't stand fitness. I have never liked working out. I'm not a gym rat, I don't wanna go on run. I just don't like working out. And the difference between fitness and movement for me is the why. I'm not into this idea that you have to look a certain way to fit in. I don't like that. I'm, I I reject it.
Fitness always seemed to be about that. Maybe it was because I was an actor, and there was so much attention on the physical form, and that was always very confusing and frustrating for me. Movement to me has always been about energy, the It's always been about feeling better after my body moves, my mind always feels clearer, whatever he in the heart that I may have had feels set down.
In my theater days, that expression was was about connecting to my cell connecting to storytelling and connecting to others through artistic expression. Now movement, is about connecting to consciousness and connecting to my guides to the unseen to the challenges that I'm facing in my life, and it has found a very accessible form of moving on a yoga mat, through the class and through yoga and through what everybody would call a workout.
I just don't see it that way. I just see it as a way of being healthy and kind for my mind and my heart, and that the the byproduct is that my body stays strong. Over a powerful distinction. I love that separating the 2. Right all about the intention behind it. Yeah. You know, I grew up in La. And I think there was a lot of focus on the way you look. And I was so grateful that I had a mom and a dad, and who weren't really part of the whole Hollywood narrative.
My mom was a school teacher, and before that, she was a a nun. I have all my aunts and on uncles are nuns and priests on that side of things. And then my dad was, it is still, a doctor. So everything was very much rooted in healing and connection and really stayed out of the fray, the Hollywood trap or magnet around Vanity. I think I got lucky there. Yeah. Well, and I'm interested just hearing that tidbit bit about about your mother being a non prior to being a teacher. What was spirituality
like at your home? Was it? Talked about, was it something that we welcomed at the dinner table? Yeah. You know, even though she really was so committed to catholicism. She didn't bring that into the family structure. So we weren't doing church on Sundays or anything like that.
Her belief system and my dad's beliefs around spirituality and religion were very intimate and closely held Not in any kind of secretive way, but in 1 that just felt like that was almost like a lifestyle, the way that they believed and connected to a sunset, or nature or to different challenges and how to overcome them arise again above them. I did go to Ccd. I was back ties I had my first comm.
But on my path toward confirmation, the biblical stories weren't connecting for me, And I ended up using my early teenage rebellious years, instead of taking drugs and doing all the other things that I think kids around me were doing. I decided to, like, reno catholicism and and I had an aunt to introduce me to Buddhism and And so that was my form of, like, really sticking it to the man. I was like, I'm not gonna be catholic. I'm gonna be buddhist. But so wild is so I really tried it
on. My my mom supported me, and I think it's because I was judy choosing buddhism over heroin. Yeah. I was gonna say if only all of ours had been that been so been so delicate our team rebellion. She She was, like, go for it, and my aunt came down from San Francisco. And she was like, well, you know, let me show you some stuff and see if you like it. So I got into Buddhism for a little bit and then right around the time that I started to learn about, you know, minimalism and par
down. I was like, I want my band posters on my wall. I, and then I really dove into teenage teenage them more heavily. But, yeah, It was really grateful that I didn't I didn't receive dogma. I received a a real connection to a sort of artist street. It actually wasn't Buddhism catholicism that connected me to spirituality. It it was my dad's path. I was in biology. And early high school.
The teacher was, like, look, you know, when you get a cut on your arm, your body knows, how to send red blood cells and how to create a sc and how to heal this place of infection, and I just thought that was insane. How does my body have to do that? And that was really the first time where I thought, My mind isn't doing that. So what is it, that's motivating this unseen act. In me, and that was really how I connected to this notion of of spirit for the first time. Well, and also sounding this
appreciation for your body. Yeah. Wow. Just magical what the body knows how to do without your mind having to direct it. In ways that are conscious. You know? Yeah. Well, and you said your dad, he was a physician. Yeah. Yeah. Still going at it. Still going well, natural transition, anything hoffman. Right? From parents to Hoffman, what brought you to Hoffman? Years later I know. But my mother's passing. So she passed in 2014, And at the time, I was a producer
for a class retreat. We call them the retreat. I happened to have, 2 guests. On that retreat, Blake Mic and his then wife Heather, and we got to chatting over dinner about my work not only at the class, but around the grief, I was experiencing around my my mother's unexpected passing, and they told me about Hoffman for the first time. And they said, we'd like to sponsor you to go if you're interested. And if you are interested, you know, take it seriously and and we're happy to,
support you in getting there. And that was my first foray. I took a look at what the process is. I loved the application process ended up at Saint Helena. I think 3 months later. You might be the first that I've heard that said they... That you loved the app application process. You don't know why? The class was already getting me into the notion of of pattern work and trying to dig into my childhood to understand why I am, who I am.
And there's so much alignment between our practice, our somatic practice and what, you know, it said you guys were all about, which proved out to be completely true. We'll talk to us about your process. Was there a moment? I always like to ask this questions there a moment that landed did you in the process, where you were, like, looked around and you either were, like, yes. This is where I meant to be or, you know, maybe what am I doing? Yeah. Man, I think even though I had a excitement in the
application process. Once I was accepted, that's when, like, the terror set in. What is it gonna be like without my phone or my computer or moving my body or journal? What is all of this, you know, reduction in my coping mechanism gonna be like, and for anybody who, you know, I'm sure much of your, listeners partnership, is there because they have
been to the hoffman process. But for anybody who hasn't, the idea that you go into retreat with strangers to get to know yourself better in ways that are deeply intimate and, profound So I was nervous about what would I find, what would be uncovered? What did I not know about?
I knew why I was going. But I knew that I was locking horns with grief, but what I didn't know was what I didn't know, and that's what scared me the most So pulling up in a cab and getting out and unpacking in this sort of no frills. Room and sitting down at my first meal. I sat down next to a a man who I still keep in touch with 9 years later, who couldn't have been kinder, and that's when I thought, I think I'll be okay. Even if this 1 person is the only person that you know, opens their
heart to me. I think it'll be alright. Then it turns out all 39 other people did. So... Yeah. It just takes 1 person to be generous with their... With themselves. Right? Yeah. Oh, absolutely. It's... There's a very that brings up very sweet and fond memories of of my first, you know, night arriving there too and and all the fuels. But I'm curious what was it like doing the process, having your mom usage you said your mom passed not even a year. Right? And and you went...
Walk us through what that was like? Well, you know... And for those of you who aren't familiar at the h process, you really go through all of your emotions. Almost systematically. There's a real beauty to the science behind it all. I knew... I I was ready to cry. What I was not ready for was to meet my anger. My mom was an addict, which... It's still hard for me to say or admit because so many of my family members are still alive and that a hard thing for them to reconcile with 2.
She, grapple with pain medication, which, of course, it's a learning from our childhood. It makes utter sense that I've dedicated my professional life to helping others experience the full breadth of difficulty and challenge in the promote, their own selves, come face to face with pain in their own way. But, yeah, she used pain medication to and that's the ties, some of the things that she was going through. And I had no relationship to my anger
about that. I was in deep denial around her grappling, and how that affected our household and my childhood, I just completely idol her and in her passing going through the Hoffman process, it helped me come out of my... Denial and out of the veil of protection that kept her in 1 light 2 dimensional. As I stepped more fully into my anger, it helped me see her as a human and cracking that code was so hard, but ultimately so healing, so that I could understand where in myself.
I was too dimensional and hiding. And coming into relationship with my anger has been so positive in the long run for my romantic relationships for my working relationships. It's really... It was the lock in key that opened up so much for me. Was there a part in the process that really did help you connect or give you permission the permission to be angry? Or allowed you to come out of this fantasy of denial I'm I'm just curious. Was there a part or tool that really helped you
get in in touch with that anger? Yeah. The physical expression of releasing anger was so deep. And only in really getting my body involved and connected to anger, did the rest of the emotions open up. Almost soon after I was bellow and yelling and in the fatigue of that afterwards, Did I finally feel like I could cry? What a release? And what do you think you take forward?
From your Hoffman experience now, fast forward whether it's in your your work, you know, because when I hear about the class, for me, I just think, oh, my goodness what an incredible way of expression. How did the process shift? You whether it's your life, whether it's work, Well, from a work standpoint, it sort of fast tracked my study of transformational experiences and practices. It fast... Tracked my
study of, you know, somatic and embodiment. But on a very personal level, it reconnected me to my mother, I think I was connected to a version of her, it was 1 version of her. And after the hoffman process and going through all of it. I felt connected to all of her, and I felt empathy for her, and I felt compassion for why it is that she needed to an. And why it is, she had certain moments that I bore witness to in my childhood and really forgiving her for being human.
And that has helped me forgive and love and cherish my father in his living state, while he's alive, And that has helped me understand the patterns that I received from my childhood so that I'm better equipped. In my romantic relationships. I did go through a divorce with my first husband, and I think that was not because of hoffman but it was because I was waking up to myself, and certain things I had ignored and needed to develop.
And now in my relationship and in my engagement to my fiance, I just feel so much more equipped at taking responsibility for my own patterns. Recognizing what isn't mine, really really staying steady in the practice of expressing myself, and I do that through the class, primarily as my weekly daily practice because it helps me speaking of the cycle of transformation, It helps me move my anger my frustration, my stress, my worry,
any grief that might be in there. And then connect to the compassion and alive and joy on the other side, and the lightness on the other side. And, you know, at the class, we do that in, like, 30, 45, 60 minute chunks. Depending on what I have time for, But that dedication and commitment to expression is what I found at Hoffman and what I continue at the class? No. Incredible. What are some ways that you would recommend that we as listeners just we as people try to bring more expression into our
lives. Are there any small or big ways. But you have found over your your years of practice and teaching to be powerful. Yeah. You know. In the last 9 years, I have made so many friends. Oh, you went to Hoffman. Let's talk about it. You know, there's this real community that comes out of the experience. Whether or not you are with that group. Right? You're just connected just by knowing you've all, you know, met yourselves in a pretty intense way.
And I think 1 of the things I hear from people who've been through the process is like, oh, I'm happy. I had that. And for me, it's like, those practices have to be consistent, maybe not in such a, you know, deep 7 day experience consistently, but some regular in moving the body breathing and expressing. That's
what I connect to. And that's what I would suggest for, everybody, no matter whether or not you've gone through the process, having a consistent practice where you allow yourself could to connect to yourself for your worry, your stress, your joy, your life so that you can not only show up for yourself, but show up for your community in
better ways. And by showing up for your community you show up for the, you know, the greater world more positively, So in a pi way, I would say, anything that can connects me to yourself consistently, is my highest recommendation. Yeah. What about any tips for sort of connecting in work with our body. And more of a in the moment type way. I'm always looking for ways to kind of bring me back to presence. Oh, 2
things. Even yesterday, I found myself in a very tense and heated conversation at work with coworkers. And as soon as I recognized, that the temperature was rising. I did 2 things. 1 was check with my naval, my belly button, and If it's tense, I am holding in some form. I either holding back my emotions. I either holding back my thoughts. I'm holding back my tongue, my speech, my expression. Some part of me is not fully in the room.
So I let my belly go. I let my neighbor go, and it's it's something that nobody sees in the room. It's not something I need anybody else. 4, it's just simply bringing my awareness to my naval and taking a deep breath and letting it go. And as soon as I can soften my nave, a whole slew of relaxation comes through my body if I let it. Right? It's my jaw relaxes, my tongue relaxes, and suddenly, some pockets of
space enters my thought process. And there's a little bit more space emotionally for me to respond instead of react. And then the second thing I do is, try to connect to the sense of alive ness in my hands and in my feet.
In these types of challenge, whether it's in the boardroom or in a marital dispute or even just the ways in which we look in the mirror, we can forget that there's whole intelligence below our neck, and connecting to the alive ness in my hands and in my feet, reminds me that I have intelligence running through my body. I can get off the hamster wheel of my mind simply by drawing my attention further deeper into my body.
Incredible. I am So I took a class this morning to to prepare so that I could really speak to what it was because I've heard about it and it's... Come into my life in in numerous ways. And so this morning, I did 1. And you first off, were just the most present loving, talented gifted. I mean, I just didn't want it to be over, which is highly unusual for me and any sort of workout setting. I'm usually, like, 5 minutes in.
Are we done. So that spoke so much to it, but 1 thing was the you powered us during, and it was just virtual right, on online, but empowering us to use our voice. And I'm curious is that a part of every class or is that what is... What do you see as the importance of using your voice? First of all, liz, thank you so much for trying the class. I'm just honored to be on the map with you. Thank you. Sound is part of the method, it's part
of every class. And the idea is that when we guide you into using a little bit of sound on the exhale. For some people that might sound just c, Like, what are you doing? But if you relate it to athletes, It's not so crazy. If you think about a boxer or a tennis player, you'll hear them, you know, we say make sound. I think tennis players are off. And associated with, like, grunt, you know, they'll hit the racket and you hear them go, and in athletics,
You don't think twice. It's using sound to power their serve or their strike or their hit, whatever it is. And it is powering energy to move up and out of the body. Sound is vibration. And vibration carries energy. So when we're doing a jumping jack or when we're doing a burp and we're asked asking you to make sound on an exhale. It's not 1 sound. It's any sound. It's the sound of whatever you need to move at that time asking it can be high pitched. It can be low. It can be
a laugh. It can be, gut. It's whatever your... Energies full expression is. And if you have neighbors, and we hear this all at the time because it is both in person and virtual. So if you're working out from home, a strong exhale will do the trick. And it's just about moving energy up and out of your body, and what is what is energy? Well thought is energy. Emotion is energy. Stress is energy. It's all a form of
of energy. So you're using sound helps to activate it, move it, clear it, release it, and shift it I just so appreciate your explanation of that in that way because it's it's something that I hear as a teacher all the time. Oh, everything is going so great post Hoffman, but I'm not, you know, I'm not down with expression, and I haven't found a way to bring that into my life. I don't really think I need it. And for me, I... There was times post
process I could relate to that. And in my years since, I have found expression for me personally to be the thing that has unlocked. The most for me. But I I love the permission because at often we talk about to make anything expression. You have to use your voice the your body and intention, And it just sounds like there could not be more of a of a parallel and almost a 1 from 1 of of exactly the philosophy that you guys teach at
the class in that regard. Yeah. I mean, if you think about what what are the most cath things? A human can experience, a belly laugh, a gut cry and karaoke. Singing at the top of your lungs, you know, roll down the windows and hit a highway and throw your favorite song on. And it's because the sound of your laugh, the sound of your cry the sound of you singing at the top of your lungs, is doing that. It's moving your emotion. It's moving your expression.
And you feel better whether you're on the other side of a laugh or a good cry or a belt, you know, rousing, version of 4 odd blonde or rolling stones or whatever it gets you going But on the other side of that sound is space in your heart in your minds. With a real connection to a felt sense of freedom. And even if you don't think you need it that could just be your mind and your ego saying, I don't wanna be uncomfortable for a second.
But if you try it and you use a little bravery and a little commitment, you might just find... That you did need it, and you didn't know it all along. Yeah. Like I admit. I cried this morning. I didn't know I needed that. Totally caught me off guard, but it was also this reminder for me of permission, allowing myself to try something and give myself the permission to just see what came and it was such a gift, Yeah. Permission to have the full range of our humanity available to us.
And I think that's where a lot of our suffering comes from. I know that's where a lot of the suffering in my childhood came from and still
into my adulthood when I forget. Right? We can even make a career out of these practices and still forget that it is in the permission and the acceptance of the full range of our human experience that we are liberated into this existence liberated into our daily lives, freed from the real incarceration of our minds opinion of everything, softening into our laughter and our tears and our compassion, gives us back the ability to be here in a good way.
Yeah. I appreciate that's such a beautiful sentiment to think about and is there any anything else that we didn't cover or anything else that you that you wanna bring up that... Whether it's about you or Hoffman, There's a couple of threads that I'm pulling into this 1. 1 is sort of my mention of getting divorced. 1 is my mention of, you know, daily practice... This and these kinds of things and something I've... I learned at Hoffman.
I continue at the class. I I study all the time is this idea that 1 doesn't need everybody else to change in order for change to occur. Something I've really learned is that if I change my own state of consciousness, if I become aware and awake to what's alive inside myself, then that's really all that's needed. For a moment for an argument for a room. It's to change shape I think when we're in our relationships, we mirror the state of consciousness,
of the person that we're with. You know, like, at the other day, even... I was crossing... You know, New York City is so crazy. I was walking on the way to work and this, die, slammed on his brakes and hon at a pedestrian and said, hey, you watch it. And the pedestrian goes, hey, you watch it. It was the same tone and the same words, and it was just mirroring.
And I find that that happens all the time at work and it happens all the time at home, and it happens all the time with myself looking at the mirror. And if I can take responsibility for my own state of consciousness, if that driver had said, hey, man, you know, looked 2 ways. That was really scary or the pedestrian it said, oh, gosh. So sorry. I wasn't paying attention. How different would
that interaction have been? If just 1 person becomes aware becomes awake and stops mirroring the consciousness around them, and comes into the alive in their hands and their feet and softening their belly and takes a deep breath and connects to themselves, then there's no way that that momentum is gonna continue and change is inevitable. So I really wanna thank Hoffman for you guys for helping me dive more deeply into my own responsibility and my own accountability.
For my state of consciousness, You know, even though I'm I'm a leader at the class, it's... I wanna also thank the class as a practice that connects me to maturation and the evolution of my own relationship to myself and how I can affect change in the greater world around me because of these tools. Couldn't phrase that in a more loving kind way and I love. I love that story. And I think that it is something that we talk so much about. You know, it's like, after you leave the process. That
it doesn't even matter if it's... Process. Right after you... After exactly as you're saying, you you become, you know, aware of something process You don't know how things are gonna shift when you enter it differently. I love I love that story to to really drive that home. Yeah. You know, it just takes 1 person to come into presence for the charge in the room. To dissipate to change or shift or transform.
That is the whole game. That's what it's all about, whether it is often or the clot or chi gong or yoga or meditation or, what have you? These practices are all meant to bring us back, bring us home. Right? Absolutely. Well, Natalie, I have thoroughly enjoyed this conversation learning more about you and exploring expression and what that means to you. So thank you so much for your vulnerability in your time today. Liz, Thank you. And thank you to everybody that
works at Hoffman. It was such a cat experience for me, and I really owe so much rather... To to you guys for all the scene and unseen work. And and I hope that your listeners, if you've... I happened been in the the process, so I'd like to connect with you, and if you haven't, I encourage you to go. And and I also wanna a gift everybody listening today to a 30 day up free trial of the class. I hope it speaks to you. I hope it helps you practice.
It's the method. It's yoga. It's meditation, and I think you'll recognize a lot of the things we talked about here. So if you go to the class dot com backslash hoffman. The class dot com backslash hoffman, you'll receive 30 days to to hop on the mat with with me and with our other fantastic.
Teachers. So thank you, Liz. Natalie, that is that is very generous, and I I really do hope that the listeners take you up on that because, like I said, this morning, I did it, and it was powerful and it was expression and it was beautiful and thank you so much for that. The pleasure. Thank you, Liz. Thanks, Natalie. Thank you for listening to our podcast. My name is Liza and Rossi. I'm the Ceo
and President of Hoffman Institute Foundation. And I'm Rising Rossi, Often teacher and founder of the Hop Institute Foundation. Our mission is to provide people greater access to the wisdom and power of love. In themselves in each other and in the world. To find out more, please go to hop institute dot org.