My guest today is Natalie Van Pump. Towards the end of our podcast, she shares a tier worthy story about letters that she found from a 15 year old love interest. And rather than putting them aside or in storage or throwing them away, she went there. She asked the hard questions. She looked at the patterns that got in the way of her receiving love. And she closed the loop 45 years later.
Her story is a beautiful example of the cost of patterns, but that we can transform them and ultimately find ourselves living open hearted, authentic, and spirit led lives. Enjoy the episode Welcome to Loves everyday radius. A podcast brought to you by the Hoffman Institute. My name is Sharon Moore, and I'm 1 of your hosts. And on this podcast, we talked to hoffman graduates about how their courageous journey inward.
Impacted their personal lives, but also how it impacted their community and the world at large. So tune in and listen in and hear how our graduates authentic selves, how their love, how their spirits are making a positive impact on our world today. In other words, get to know their loves everyday radius. Natalie, welcome to the show. Thank you. Happy to be here. Mh. You know, I think it's interesting how many obstacles you had to go through just even get
to the process itself. So let's start with that. What was your experience of even just getting to the process. Oh, my goodness. I signed out for my process in February before Covid. And then Covid happened, and I was registered from May, which was canceled. And so I ended up doing the first hoffman essentials, which is online for a weekend, which is amazing. And then they opened up for September, to do the process in live. And so I went to that. It was the first 1, and then we had the fire.
Then I had to go back home. And then a month later, it was moved to Petal where you where everything is now in California, and that's when I had my process. So it started in February and didn't ended up I had it in October. So, yeah It a bit of a journey, but it was Yeah. I thought about that. Talk about going through all the all the hiccups signing up, then Covid happens. Okay. Postponing, which was a long... There was a long moment you've between Covid and when we
went back in person. And there was the fire. So for those who don't know our home for many years in Saint. Helena, California did burn down. And our friend Natalie, who's the guest today was in that process when they had to evacuate. And then you came back and you were the first group in our new site in Petal. Right? You were the first in the first group. Yeah. And all through that, there was a conviction in you that this is still the right thing to do.
Can you tell me about what was guiding you to stay the path? When you... When I registered for Hoffman, they sent me this questionnaire. It was like 60 pages. I don't know it was really 60 pages, but it was 60 questions. I can't quite remember. And I remember right before Covid, I happened to been in Hawaii, and I decided to start, you know, I printed it out because I wanted to write out my thoughts.
And it was a jolt to my being because these questions I was asked was taking me back sort of why me through my childhood and who raised me and all these different things. So even in doing that, I was more inspired to get there. And from the time that I submitted my questionnaires or even going through the process of doing the questions, The time I got to hoffman. I was seeing a lot of my life. I had heightened awareness of my life. Just by completing the questionnaire.
So I was really looking forward to having the actual experience, not really knowing what that was going to be like. But I felt confident that somebody was gonna help me make sense of all the stuff that I had been through. As a child. So I was, like, when's the next 1. I wanna be in that first class. You know what and I was just, like ready to go. And when they had half from an essential I'm, like, find me up because I'm gonna do something until, I could actually
have a live experience. So I was pretty focused. And what was happening in your life that made you ready to go back to the core to go back to 1 of these... Some of these foundational patterns and resolve them. What was the... What was the catalyst? So I... When I was 25, I went to my first counselor ever when, you know, I went to psychologist and I said, you know, I'm I've done everything I was supposed to do that was supposed to make me happy. You know, I'm married a house to Car
garage, a husband a kid. I'm educated To have this great engineering role in a company, and, like, life is supposed to be good I'm unhappy. And so I've been on this journey since 25 for that place of peace within myself. And I've... I I've have done like gazillion
things. Right? Before Hoffman, I felt good, but there was a different kind of good or peace that I knew was missing, and I don't know that I could have articulated that before Hof, but I just felt like there was this bigger sense of wholeness that was available to me, and I hadn't quite gotten there yet. So I... That's sort of where I was when I registered stirred, not knowing where I would be today, but I knew there was something else, and I thought well maybe this would
give me it. And I found Hoffman through a friend who name is also Natalie, and she had gone in November the year before Covid and came back, and she was just bursting with this lightness and clarity, and I thought, yeah. That's that thing that I'm looking for. And so it was those things that said, okay. I'm gonna go ahead and register. And so, you know, I know that when we're in the process, even though you know you want to find that light. You know you wanna find that wholeness in that piece.
In the process, there are some tough moments where we go into some of the wounds from our past. Were you able to to go there? What was it like for you to be the process? You know, as you ask me that question, I think about the deep sense of that I have. Or had, rather, it's kinda interesting answering that question because some of the patterns I experienced with people around me who I didn't even know. You know. So someone may not have...
Looked at me a certain way or engage with me, and I would feel un of them even acknowledging my presence kinda of thing. So it was really interesting as you're learning about these patterns to be experiencing in them at the same way, and then you're learning like, hey, it's not about that person. It's you You learn that in childhood. You develop those patterns as a child to cope with what was going on around
you. That was the biggest 1 of the biggest a aha for me is those are my coping mechanisms that I needed to have in order to survive? As a child and to know that I was still carrying those, and those were still running my life that was just huge. Just just... And there were so many ways in the exercises and experiences that we had that brought that out. That's even making me emotional talking about it right now.
Because it's just so sad to think like, at 5 years old, I had to figure out how to survive. And no child should ever have to do that. And so in the process you were able to realize, wow. That was just a coping mechanism. It's not who I am today. Was it easy to separate yourself from the coping mechanism and your identity? How did you do that? It was the whole concept of my true spiritual self. Like, that is the
true essence of who I am. I think that's where I made the separation in that having a heightened awareness of my spiritual self is my whole self. And then there are these patterns and it was, like, closing that gap. Like, what I love at Hoffman was it gave
me the tools. Like, when these patterns... They're never gonna go away, but they get quieter as you get more whole or stronger, whatever the right language it may be my language is the more hole I become the more I'm in my wholeness nest, those patterns get quieter. But if they pop up, which they will, I now have the tools to deal with it and I'm not that triggered. So that was my... That's kinda how I crossed... I began to process it during the process because in the process tell you a lot
of the work happens after you leave. And so, you know, it's like, this is kind of a cool skill, a tool bunch of tools I can use when I go back out in life because at the end of the day, our true self is within us and it's tapping into that and removing the barriers that prevents us from being and seeing our true self. So I'm really grateful for having had that awareness and it and the tools and the experience to carry me through after I left. What are some of the tools that you tend to use in
your day to day life? Quad checks. Just checking in with my body, my intellect, which is really on you know, hyper going a lot of the time. My emotional self, I had this concept in my mind that all the ages of me exist in me at the same time, but in Hoffman, what I learned was yes, That's true, but the emotions of all those ages are within me. Right? So when they when we were... When I did my
first car I was learning about it? It was like, okay, so how old are you and like, what are you talking about? Like, how old is your emotional self today? And what does she want? And so to do that, I I can't say do it every day, but most days, that's pretty powerful. You know? Because I'm may 5 years old or 15 or 25 or 50, you know, whatever. Right? And it's like, you know, and checking in with that. And then my spiritual self, which is my pure
self. So to check in with those 4 aspects myself every day is 1 of the things that I'll do. I do an appreciation and gratitude hardest thing in hoffman for me. 1 of was What do you appreciate about yourself today? Like, why am I appreciating myself? And we need to do more of that you know? So those are 2 things that, you know, I try to keep in my daily and also recycling. Recycling is really powerful. Just flipping the pattern, you know? And now I kinda do it in a little more
automatically. But, yeah, Those are my top 3. That's awesome. So before we move away from the process, I wanna know. I know I know it's 7 days packed. Packed with with things that are happening unfolding, insights, revelations. Are you able to pinpoint a a moment, a pivotal moment for you personally in the process. The 1 that comes to mind is in filling out the questionnaire. I had to write out or who were
all the people that raised me. So my mom and my dad were in my life, on some level, but I had 9 surrogate. And so when I got my name tag, it had my mom and my god, and then it had the names of the 9 story gets that raised me, and I thought it was overwhelming when I fell class a lot of people, you know? Even as I'm seeing it right now, my entire body was build like, ting I could feel my body in a place of true gratitude for these people.
Who took me into their home, and they were friends and family of my parents you know, before I went... I went to live at my dad when I was 13 years old, and prior to that, I had been moved 16 times. To different homes, I in different countries. I went to different schools. But what happened because as a little girl, I always felt like, I was a mistake, like, I didn't belong anywhere. That when I went to these different people's
homes, I minimized me. I never allowed myself to speak up I just wanted to disappear because I never felt like I belong the anywhere. They've all transition and only 1 person, 1 of those 9 is alive right now. But I felt, like, oh, my God, you know, they opened their home to me and their heart and they took care of me. But as a little girl, I didn't even know how to receive that because I never felt that. You know? So that was
I was literally I'm shaking. Right now. I was literally standing there shaking, like, It's like, I could feel all their energy and love just run through me in that moment. And that... I mean, I know we had a lot of experiences but that 1 really stayed with me when I left. Was really powerful. Yeah. I got... I'm getting goosebumps just just hearing about it.
When you say, I I actually felt true gratitude for each 1 of these 9 people Was that the first time you were able to feel gratitude for them? Yes. In that way. Right? Because I've always said, oh my god, you know, these people were great. You know, sort of intellectually. There's a lot of things I've done intellectually that when I went to Hoffman became emotionally deepened.
So I've always been grateful. I kept those people near and dear to me my entire life, you know, on some level from a place of I don't wanna say intellectual gratitude, but it feels was more like that, but what I did at hoffman when that felt like emotional connection deep gratitude. And it also made me ask the question when I left are, like, how many people in my life are showing me love that I don't even see that I'm not even aware of, you know?
Because I'm so in this place of un unwillingness and I don't matter and I don't have any value. You know, that that that pattern that that list that vicious cycle of patterns, you know? And so sometimes I stop and need to pay attention because people are around me giving me what I want and need, but it's going back to feeling like I deserve that. You know, But to answer your question, yeah. I always gratitude for all the women that were there because that was a really big need
I had. I would and the mother's day cards, you know, and different things like that. So just kinda keeping them close in that level of gratitude, But in that moment, that was a physical experience. Of gratitude. I so relate this, you know, concept of, I I did the work. I felt compassion I felt gratitude But then when we go through the process at Hoffman,
it is a process. It's a journey, and and through that journey, we get out of the words and only the words and into this place where like you said, suddenly, it's an emotional spiritual, somatic sense of gratitude and compassion. And that's different than all the work we do all leading us to getting to the process.
So that's beautifully said, And I have to say I love that not only did you feel it in that moment, but it led you to start to reflect how many times am I receiving love on my day to day life that my patterns are getting in the way and blocking my own si of the love that is right in front of me. That's a huge connection to make right there? And
and is that not the key? I mean, once you identify that pattern and recycle it suddenly you go back into your world and you get to receive all the love that's right in front of you. I love that. I love that connection you made. You also... You said you had the the C garage and the job and the engineer, and... But today, you are an engineer, but you also work with people tell me what you do in in the area of helping others. I became a Ka kumar kumar consultant just...
For fun. I love organizing people's homes and stuff like that, but I was really drawn to that method because there was a sp component to it. And I did this in 20 19, where there was a a element of mindfulness in her process of decluttering your home. Right? There was this space of how do you connect with things emotionally? And what is your present and what is your future, which I had never really read force. I was curious about it and went and I got trained buy marie condo.
And I really gravitate towards that and went through my entire home myself. Right? And so then I started having clients, and then I would go in their homes and help them and so forth. And then when Covid happened, I kinda switched to doing that online. And what I find is I've done I did online classes at first, but I really love working with people 1 on 1
and getting to know them. I have a client right now in Vegas and he's married has 3 children busy life, and we meet every Friday morning at 05:00. My time, and I'm a morning person, so it's all good. I love the mornings. Yeah. But and it's just getting to know him over time and seeing the transformation and getting these little text messages from him of brad dude of just how easily his life works now that things are in order and how lighter he feels for having dealt with
things emotionally. And I also got an additional certification in wellness coaching, in coaching, in live coaching, but it was focus on wellness because I myself have been pre diabetic. 10 years ago, which was a shock for me. And so... Because I eat healthy. So what do you mean? And I went through a learning process myself, And then with Covid and so many people having comorbidities and things like that, I decided
I'm gonna learn more about this. So oftentimes my Ka, decluttering clients will transition into a wellness coaching because they're now dealing with how they eat and how they feel and that kind of thing. So I've been doing that and it's very rewarding. Because as you get to know people and they get to know you, there's a sense of trust, and I can share and relearn learn from each other. And yeah, that's kind of what I've been doing with that. So I absolutely enjoy it,
though. I love getting to know people 1 on 1. I feel I'm an introvert by nature, and so it's a good way for me to work in that space. Just for terminology, what is a Ka consultant? So a Ka kumar consultant is way a process for decluttering in your home. So oftentimes people will go and I'm gonna tidy it my room, I'm gonna clean up my room or I'm gonna clean out the basement or I'm gonna clean out the pantry or whatever. Well, marie con who created the Ko method said,
we need to do it by category. Right? Instead of doing a room, let's start with all your clothes. So then you get every item of clothing from the sock, the shirt, the scarf, the shoot everything. And you deal with all of that at 1 time. Right? So for example, when I went to it in my house, I have a bed, a second bedroom that has a closet that had all my dresses in it because I love dresses. I have dresses for being in the sun all the way to black tie. Right?
And then in my regular closet, that's in my bedroom, I have like everyday things, work, things workout things, know, whatever. So I pulled all of that together into my room on a bed and piled it high. And then I had to find an item that spark joy for me? That's her thing. Does it spark joy? And then so I found this 1 thing, which was this particular orange dress, which is my favorite color. And I... You hold it on your heart and you're, like, okay, this
part joy. And then that was gonna be my barometer for every single item on that bed about how it feels inside. And that's what drew me to her method. And so you do that for all your clothes, and essentially, you'll end up with These are the things that spark joy and the idea is to only keep yourself surrounded with things that spark joy. So then you do that for all your books. And then all your papers and then all your everything
else, and then your sentimental items. So that's kind of, in a nutshell what that's about But then when I got... When I did my home, I had this freedom, you know? And I'm very organized, and be like, what are you organize? And if you walk into my house, doesn't look... It looks the same as before because I'm pretty organized myself, but it felt lighter because I had touched every single thing in my life? I made a decision as to what sparked joy what was I keeping?
Why was I keeping it? What's the value of my life today or tomorrow? And when I got done amazing and anyone who goes through their process and does their entire home, will tell you that it's just this freeing feeling, not just physically, but emotionally. So that's why I'm... That's a long answer. Sorry. No no. It's beautiful. And and and do you find that too many things spark joy? Like, is there ever ever a... Your... Why are you keeping that? Well, because
in eighth grade, I... You know, is it... Do we end up sometimes assigning joy to things that we shouldn't. So I'll answer that 2 ways. 1 is, I have a lot of cutting boards. Right? I have sticks who needs 6 cutting board, but they're different sizes, and I did a raw food chef's certification at 1 point. And so my cutting boards bring me joy, and I have 6, and that's okay. And if you have 50 pairs of shoes and shoes is what brings you joy.
That's okay because it's about you and what brings you joy. I'll tell you a quick story. I think just happened this week so little kind of nervous about it. But when you go through your sentimental items, that's a really big thing. Right? Like you said, like, this is from eighth grade or whatever. But it's asking those questions. Right? And I had a lot of pictures and a lot of letters from the seventies and eighties when I moved to the United States and people didn't call international.
I'm from Jamaica originally. So you wrote letters. You didn't make phone calls because that would have been really funds in the 70. So I have lots of letters and they were all organized by people. And these letters were not 1 pager. They were like, 2 to 10 pages a letter. I had a whole box of letters and pictures and things like that. And when I went through my Ka process my own process in 20 18 20 19. I either return the letters to the sender because there
were, like, diaries of their lives. In the seventies and eighties. Or if I couldn't find them, I just recycled. But there was 1 set of letters that was from a boy that I liked at 15, and I told myself, well, I'm not sure this is sparking me joy. I don't know what has to do with my present or future, but I'm gonna keep it. Maybe I'll share it with my granddaughter and show her pictures and letters from a boy. You know, for like 15. Just kinda silly at the time.
So I go through Hoffman and fast forward literally 2 months ago. Well, sorry. So back then, you know, I got the letters and I found a lot of pictures of that time in my life, and I loaded them up on Facebook. And people started connecting with each other from that time, and he then connected with me. But it was very sort of high. How are you, you know, that kind of thing. Just very generic. Right? Because in my mind, he never really saw me. And, you know, all my patterns. Right?
So that was in 20 19. So 2 months ago, I went back and I I was drawn to pick up those letters because 1 of the things in going through Hoffman is, like you walk out with a sense of wow and a sense of wholeness on some level. But when you... As life goes on, you... Things pop up and you are inspired I was. Inspired to dig a little deeper, you know? And then when I went to q2, which is like, hoffman on steroids. Weekend can after hoffman.
That kinda got a little deeper for me, and I started going into things like, looking at my 5 year old self and how do I love her and grow her up and kinda getting through that. And then a couple months ago, I was drawn to go back to those letters and I picked them up, and I read them as me today. Natalie today. Natalie, who received those letters at 15 and 16. I didn't
see what was in them. And so when I read those letters 2 months ago literally, I started crying because he did like me and it was on the page, but I had so many patterns that I couldn't see it, and I started crying. I'm like, this again is another story of someone showing up to love me that I couldn't see. And I just, like, started crying. So I stopped to him. I sent him my notes. Like, hey. How are you doing? That or whatever, and I don't want anything from him.
It was just I'm not quite sure what I wanted more than closure for myself. So I just started with a very sort of generic email. How are you? How are the kids, the family, you know that kind of thing and share about my family and all that. But at the end of his note, he said, when I came back from college in 19 80, you were just not there, and I never knew what happened. And so that was my opening to then share my story. With him. And so I... It took me like, all of last weekend
to write this. Literally this past weekend. And on Sunday night, I mailed it. I emailed it off. But I said, you know, you never you never knew that when I met you that I had just come to live with my father for the first time that I had been moved around 17 times before and, you know, had all this trauma and sexual abuse and just any and everything. You just gotta wrap it
into there, You know? I just wrote that I said, I never shared any of that because I didn't know how to, and it was just my life, which was is my ordinary life. And I never thought that I saw you you represented strength and kindness and something safe. And I saw you and your family as having everything I wanted. You know, the mom, the dad, the brother the sister. You sit at the table every day and you have a meal and there's connection.
And he has a brother and the brothers girl friend, I even referenced, you know, she was beautiful and she fit into that picture, and I never saw any way that I could fit into that picture. No. I didn't use language in my email to him to say, I didn't feel any sense of worthiness or whatever because he might
thought I was crazy. But that's what I was thinking because at 15, I just didn't feel worthy to be much as to be in what looked like what I really wanted and that I deserved, you know, to have that. And so towards I end of the letter I said, you know, I'm I really struggled in writing this because I didn't... Because it's closure for me, and I wanted to share, but I didn't want to be selfish, and I don't want... I didn't want to be
disrespectful of your family. So so I just sent that off Sunday night. So Monday morning. At an email from him, and I just started ba because he was like, oh my God, I had no idea. You never shared. You were always happy you know, and all of this. And he said, you know, no. I really did like when he kinda talked about a few things, and he had these specific memories. And so it was just closure for me, 45 years later.
For both of us because his first paragraph said, I have I've had this question for 45 years and now I am at peace. And so I was just... I, like, cried, like, all day. I'm working, you know what I'm crying and then that night, I was just journal in such a place of gratitude because not gone through Hoffman. I don't know that I would have had... I know I would not have had the guts or the tools to be in the place I am today to write fat know with my full authentic self to just have the universe
line it all all up. You know? Yeah. I'm so grateful. That's just been on my heart all week. And I'm... I'm I can't tell you how grateful. I am for that. And so In my letter, I also said to him, now I'm gonna keep your letters in your picture to share with my girlfriend from with not my girlfriend my granddaughter. About a boy who was in my life that impacted my life all the way through adulthood. Right? Unknowingly. And so now I have a reason for keeping it, that is about joy, which circles
back to Marie condo. Right? Like things you have should spark joy for you. There's a lot I hear in that story. I mean, first of all, I have tears. That's that's soap... There there's something about time that is also just so beautiful that, you, you know, those 45 years were long, but also a blink of an eye. But, you know, a, you trusted something beyond your mind that said, keep these letters. You don't know why. Keep them. To me I hear spiritual self, but something happened where
you kept those letters. And because you kept those letters and because you had the courage to really go to deep places and continue to listen near spiritual self this unravel. And and you named it too. It's this embodiment of Okay. I'm gonna now live with this question of how are my patterns getting in the way of me receiving love, and I'm gonna hold myself accountable to working on those patterns. And boom this happens. This is a beautiful expression of that.
It's such a full circle. It's such a you showing that little girl that you talked about, who was you that you are ready now that you're not gonna let the patterns do that anymore. What a beautiful story? Yeah. Wow. You summarize it. So wow. I just wanna cry. I might hang up and do my own cry just such a beautiful story of surrender of spirit of, the cost of patterns, but the beauty of
doing the work. Yeah. And I think for me, you know, as we're having this conversation, you know, and I was telling about my surrogate and that whole experience. I just never felt, like, I belonged. I told myself a story and I even wrote this in the email to him last weekend that I used to literally say out loud. I wasn't meant to be born. I am a mistake. You know, my parents were both married to their own spouses. So I disrupted 2 families. I was not supposed to be. I
no 1 ever corrected me. Nobody ever said Nelly. That's not true or, you know, whatever. So that was literally my core belief. So if you feel like you don't belong, there is nothing anyone can do or say that you're gonna hear or receive until you either go through a process like Hoffman or somebody in your life says, hey, No you do matter, but can you even hear it? You know?
And so I love that little girl, and I'm very grateful for where I am today because I'm truly authentically genuinely feel like I am deserving. And as I grow into a deeper me, and I have boundaries, and I'm clear on what I want which has been, like, another amazing. We could talk about that for another hour. You know, just, like, how I show up and I don't pressure
myself and expectations and obligations. It's about who am I and how do I serve and show up from a true authentic shop, you know, going forward? It's a full circle. It's taken me a really long time, but I'm really grateful. Yeah, gratitude for everything. And this past week has just been phenomenal and it's amazing that we're I just got it just happened. You know,
It literally just happened. Yeah. I wanna pause and maybe even close on this because I think it's a really power an important point that you lived with with I don't belong. You you lived with that and some people never undo that belief and live with it their whole lives. It's a big 1. It's a hard 1 to undo as you know. And you and you did it and and
no matter how long it took. You have arrived in a place where you have the tools to answer the question what is getting in the way of me receiving love. And then not only that you now do that for others. Beautiful. What what an inspiration? Thank you. Hadn't thought of it that way. Yes. Thank you. Natalie, thank you so much for sharing your
story. I I can't wait to hang up and cry a little bit because it was so moving, but what a beautiful reminder of the power we ourselves have to get those patterns so that we can receive love and then be able to even go back 45 years and speak to somebody who was wanting to give us love, but our patterns gotten in the way, But, we're able to close it now. Beautiful. Yes. Yes. Thank you. Now you're making me cry. I can't wait to do the cry. I can't wait to do the cry. Well thank
you, Natalie. I'm I'm sure many will appreciate hearing such a beautiful story and such inspiration and will include your website. So, I don't know if you're taking new clients, but I know I'm interested in this Ka kumar consulting. That's for sure. So we'll include your website as well. Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Thank you for listening to our podcast My name is Liza and Grass. I'm the Ceo
and President of Hoffman Institute Foundation. And I'm Ras Grass, Hoffman teacher and founder of the Hoffman to foundation. Our mission is to provide people greater access to the wisdom and power of love. In themselves in each other and in the world, To find out more, please go to hop institute dot org.