Many of you know that the process has been in existence for over 50 years committed to Bob Hoffman vision of world peace 1 person at a time, In my conversation today with Tim Lawrence, Hoffman teacher and c founder of the Uk Hoffman Institute in England, Tim takes me back to Bob's early years, the time in which he grew up. And also his early thinking on the process as well as Tim's own origins and his own c founding of the Institute. Please enjoy this amazing conversation with Tim Lawrence.
Welcome to Loves everyday radius. Podcast brought to you by Hoffman Institute. My name is Drew Horn. And on this podcast, we catch up with graduates of the process. And have a conversation with them about how their work in the process is informing their life outside of the process, How their spirit and how their love are living in the world around them their everyday radius. And Hi hey, everybody. Welcome to the Hoffman podcast. My name is Drew Horn. Tim Lawrence is with us. Today. So great
to have you Tim welcome. Thank you. Thank you for having major. Tim founded the hoffman institute in the Uk in 19 95. He's also written a book called the Hoffman process and that's been out for about 20 years and available at most sites for people after they've done the process also on Amazon and other bookstores Tim, what else would you add to that introduction? So good to have you? Yeah. It's happy to be here. I know you've done a lot of podcasts and I've enjoyed hearing
your your voice? I suppose it before I crowded the institute here I was in the lucky position of being able to live in the Usa. And study with Bob Hoffman and having done various of other things. I mean, I moved to Northern California specifically because it felt to me that it was very much a a crucible, you know, a melting pot wonderful ideas about East west psychology, health, etcetera, etcetera, really, you know,
mixing things up. And so I landed there and sort of having having been there for about 8 or 9 years, lots of people started of recommending the process to me. So know, I feel very lucky to have participated in it at a time when well, I needed it. And it was it was very much there and fresh. It only been done residential for about 4 years by then. And you trained with Bob and in fact, as he was winding down some of his work, you were 1 of the last teachers to be trained under him. I was.
Yeah. I know. He very much took me under his wings so I was shadowing him a lot for most of my apprenticeship trainings as it were. You, we do did a lot of training actually being on the site in the process. We, you, taking notes watching observing so I did a lot a lot with him probably more than anybody else just because of the timing, you know, happened to be the time when he wasn't. So when he wasn't traveling and then very soon afterwards because of age, you know, wish to be
at home and so on. He he pretty much gave up, teaching in the Us and abroad. Tim, before you and Bob came together in that formative time in Northern California. So much going on. Take us back a little further about who you were, how you were raised in your childhood and how you came to be the adult that you are. It is hoffman. So we we can we can go to childhood I suppose I came to it because I
was a very curious child. I was, you know, quite introverted, and I think 1 of the big shots of my life was going to boarding school about 7, which is what you know certain aspects of our society. Do over here in the Uk, as you as you know, parents would divorced. So I learned my type of survival was to shut everything down. Now, know, everybody eventually comes off because there's something they wanna unpack in their in their childhood. But I tried to unpack it in many,
many different ways. I was, as I say very curious what I would do and I was also quite good or, I'd work at languages. So I was able to... Travel quite a bit, earn money and then travel more. And that's what I did after university actually before during and after university, and I ended up finding out quite a lot of stuff about how the east taught psychology. But I also had spent 6 months, hitch shaking, finding out living in Northern California when I was Teaching before I went to university.
So I had these... All these instances messed up childhood very introverted, British upbringing, rebelling against my parents living in a lot of alternative couches but specifically, India taught me a couple of things. 1 of them was that eastern ways are excellent, you know, you can get out of your west in mind you can meditate you can see things from a afar, but Western psychology
explained things better to me. So then I was looking for something that, perhaps marry the 2 of them and what I found is that everything that I would come across. Talk about here about read about. We're talking long time before Youtube or ted talks. Seem to m and A from Northern California. So I made a Bee line over there and did lots of different things, you know, mainly to get out of the ins intellect to get out of my own repressed or depressed state, I would do a lot of,
expressive stuff. You know, the training groups and counter groups and so on. I think eventually, still quite jade, people said people who are I knew who like me have done their from different countries or different parts of the Us to feel out what was going on in the personal movement. Said we'll try, try often. So So I I did it was a bit shocked about, you know, the intensity of it.
Albert but said, okay. Well, I'll give it a I'll give it a give it a try, and did it But but so before you go there, I a question, As you're in this, I see you as such a seeker, Tim. You talked about being a curious child, but so much seeking, turning east, turning west, And if you remember back then, what questions were you trying to get answered? Was it like how does life work? How do people work? The only question I can think of as a general 1 is what's it all about?
You know, there must be more... There must be more to this. So, you know, I would would get some knowledge from learning a different language, and that would give me an access to a different culture, but that wasn't in. And I would learn a bit from this philosophy, but that wasn't enough. And I would learn a bit from an eastern Western religion, but that didn't can give a whole picture. I would look at... Anthropology,
evolutionary psychology and so on. So all the questions were, yeah, how does the system work? You know, how are we as human spiritual beings, meant to look at it, am I missing something, you know, so a lot a lot a lot of synapses is firing off I guess, trying to figure that out. And, you know, it must be said, you know, I would work and travel. I didn't opt for, you know, a steady job or a steady paycheck. I opted for, short burst of of, you know, un unsecured labor until I was sort of in my
mid twenties. So that was how, you know, accrued fair bit of Amateur knowledge without the M or the Phd. You know, speaking of not having a Phd. Part of what made Bob the perfect person was that he didn't have the formal education. He didn't even have a heist school degree. He was just a tailor. And as such, he wasn't obstructed or bogged down. With too much information he had a cleaner palette, which he could receive this download Can you say a bit more about that?
I agree. It was, like, you know, he observed life as a tailor as a poor Jewish kid growing up with immigrant parents. In a way that gave them more generalized or, you know, an ability to see things without all the layers of the interpretation that we would have if he'd been to, you know, a regular university especially if you've been to an iv Ivy league university. 1 of the things before I this is to have too much. I just
sort of an analogy. They say that harvard or even Cambridge university over here have had more Nobel Lau, morn Nobel prizes given to their faculty equity members, than the whole of France, and the thing they say about, French is that, you know, there was a sort of a rote way of learning and so they won't think out of the box. And that's the same way my analogy is that Bob was able to think out of the box.
Now on his own, I don't think he would have been able to achieve much because if they sitting it what he what a you know, but that's where he formed good alliances is because he was able to show people that, hey, I've got something here. But, yeah, It was extraordinary, you know, could he as a tailor observe how a man suit
work to observe how, man's psychology was. But I think he had access to, tuning into other types of wisdom such as Newton when he was looking at actors or the guy who was watching clouds when he figured out the double Helix sometimes we need to kind of flow off out there to get a a more wider and general idea about humans and fireworks works. You share this metaphor story of the wise elder pouring tea into a cup in it overflowing, and the person saying, wait, the hot tea spilling on the floor
and they offer that that's right. The only way we can learn is if the cup is empty. Do I have that? Roughly right? A a zen master pouring the cup of tea overflows, and why you doing it well I can't. You you cannot learn anything until your cup is emptied, you know, you have to empty your cup or at least in part if you're overflowing knowledge, and but that's kind of, you know, an analogy for us going into something that the process and trying to learn something new.
We've got us sort of shell our old systems of relief for a while haven't. But Bob, yeah. He was an he was quite naive in the world. That naive today may have been his gift. Right? Yeah. I mean, sometimes, I think pam is as a genius because he was... He was simple. And his brilliance was in boarding things down to simplicity, and rather than stocking theory on the theory and into theory. He he brought it down very, very simple. If you didn't get enough love.
Emotionally, you learned something that causes you, you know, to behave in a certain way. Throughout the rest of your life. It's a deep emotional deep emotional learning. Bob sort of made it all about love as an essential feature an essential ingredient in survival and thriving. I mean, he puts sort of into... Psychological terms, what a million songs are doing aren't there. You know, we we do need our basic needs, our arts love to be loved to be seen and to be and
to be heard. And, yeah, he was able to see it in a way that people could really understand it and do something about that's financially rather than having to read another 50 books about it? Off the cuff. Is there a song about love that seems to represent that? There are so many, but my problem that my kids are always laughing about this I don't remember the first line of Song. You know, I managed to have thousands of words, use
of words of foreign. Power languages in my head, but I need the first line of song and on the second, I'll get completely. So Tim, you work with Bob, and then Eventually, you head back and founded the Uk Institute. What year was that? So that was 95, It's easy to remember because the same yeah that my eldest son was was born. Bob had retired by then, although we we saw him again at a conference in La 96, and they died the following following year.
But 95 was it, as I'm often reminded, you know, England was even the Uk was not exactly very open to. Courses such as such as these. It was really radical at the times and took, you know, 5 or 6 years to to build up anything at all. What do you notice about the difference between the process in the Uk and the process in the Us, you just mentioned? Maybe not quite as open to these kinds of things and it was perceived as maybe more radical.
Yeah. That's... There are, you know, obviously gonna be cultural differences This is around with, you know, with the other countries that do do the process. 1 of the fundamental things is and we still have to take this into it. Count. And this is a terrible amortization that is not born out. I can't show any academic papers. But you Drew, and the people around you are the descendants of the ones in the family who said, I've had enough appear, I wanna move on and change the past.
I'm in the middle, so I have tried that, and I've come back. So we often teach people who the descendants of people who stayed here who said, well, you know, you can go up, but I'm gonna stay here. I quite like it this way. That to me when I saw because before, I came toward in England I talk sometimes in in France and and Austria. I but people take longer to forgive here.
So we have to adapt the process to allow more different sessions, to get to the different levels of understanding and forgive that's just sort 1 very particular hoffman often level and are saying you have in your country is the bigger the front, the bigger the back, the British may be very repressed. But when they go, they really go. You know, obviously, if you've stuff it all down when it
comes, it really comes out. So if you put some music on or you let people, you know, have a good old shouting so they'll really go for it. That isn't, you know, true everybody. But if you sit on something long and I think it's gonna explain. I love the idea that so much of how the process is presented and and how didn't show up in the process has its origins back to
the very beginning. Of our country, we left, you stayed, although, on some level you left and then came back again, you and but particular, but those who take it in England are the people who state, and so therefore, that leads to them struggling to forgive? And I didn't see it was a send a simplification. Yeah. You know, we... We're comfortable with the past, and therefore, you know, I think you you will finding and there is there is more irony there is more Sarcasm and there is more
indigenous. You know, there's that mocking that put down that we're very, very good at. Now, again, I'm really hedging my bets on the general generation here, but your country is known as not being so big on irony. Although I would say, people I know in New York and La have plenty of Irony get going for them. So, you know, what use what you say is more, what's understood was he always have to look at what's nail underneath that what's the level underneath underneath that.
I appreciate the... The subtle nuances. So how has the journey been spear? An institute and how have things gone you know, as as time has moved forward I imagine you've grown along with us as well. Yeah. I know at the at the beginning, remember, you know, I say, has a succession group. Very stark. I remember waking out in the middle of night sweating a cold sw. Have I made a huge mistake, you know, giving up a nice life in California a
better climate. First in London and then, outside of London bringing boys in the country. So the first... It was just, you know, 6 students, 8 students 2 process for process, 6 processes the year, and then suddenly something tripped. And it might have been the inertia. You know, we've got the ball rolling. We had no publicity for 5 6 years, and then I think it was 2 2001. So I made it all came together. Also, we had a site which we could just
call our own. So bought it with us in mine and design it basically for us. So we put on many processes. We had a couple of teacher training programs that had gone through so we had more more staff and then we had opening up Ireland, South Africa, And, yeah yeah, suddenly, we were booked 6 months ahead, and, you know, we sort have a good good reputation. And I think, you know, as in the Us, if it's a decent enough product and it's done mainly by word mouse, you know, we don't exactly take out.
Ads in in the it called half time of Super Bowl. It's the people word of map. People will come, and and I think people recommend it to more than 1 person there's always, you know, an over demand for it both in our countries. You know, there is a awaiting us to do it. So, yeah, it took a while. And now, you know, because English is a second language and so many people. You, we get know, in an average process, we probably
get 10 or 11 different different national. So now you know, we do take into consideration more other, more than more other couches, of course. And people come from, all parts of Europe and you're part of the country to take it not just England. Is that true? Yeah. No course. Well, all over. I would say it. Because there isn't an including Greece or Turkey or Slovakia quite a few countries of further further east.
So if their level of english is strong enough, and I know in the last 10:20 years, it's really picked up because, you know, if you wanna do business in. Bulgaria or China, Japan, Brazil. You've gotta speak speak english. So, you know, there's a great so speak and good so they can do it over here. But, for some reason, I word got very strong in the Middle East, specifically the gulf, the Persian Iranian gal
depending on which side you are. And they've come over very very regularly and I remember asking them once, you know, do we need to counter adapt it for asia. And they said to actually, when we travel to a place to do a course, we are prepared to to how how it is, because you know they're very used to. Going getting the degree, you know, Georgetown University somewhere. But we have become more sensitive to how it could be perceived. There are certain things we do around, you know, death, for
instance, in and talking about death. We have to take into consideration different cultural. Perspective on that. 1 of the things I appreciate about the processes is that it's always being updated and tweaked. It's not har back to traditional lists in the past and delivered exactly the same way. So how have you noticed how things have adjusted over time. I hear that around death, And and what other ways has the process adapted?
I know you know, there's no such thing as, you know a solid written guide that will that will stay at outrageous my partner Serena always just trying to get it. Down and I said, look, it's constantly a working work in progress that But it's only when somebody comes from outside, like, we had a a south african teacher wasn't able to be here for a couple of years because the pandemic just came back and work with us. This month. She oh my god, things have changed so much in 2 years and I
said, no really. Come on she's area and they have you done this this and this, and I hadn't noticed because I think in my mind, every month or every time I'm teaching, how could we make this better? How could we do this or that? And that's just my perspective. And, of course, being a member of Hoffman international we're always listening to what the best ideas are and actually 1 of my big motivations to be very much a member of
director. An international over the years was to get to gather and to circulate the best best practices. So, you know, what is it that we had an not hearing. What is
it? We're missing oracle or could we do better, And I know that's a huge conversation right now in in the Us, particularly Tim, because I think for people listening to understand the Role Hoffman international plays, it's quite a thing that we have this collective body that supports the work we're doing and that in a way brings us all in alignment, swimming in the same direction. What importance do you hold that the Hoffman international organization does for the brand.
I think it's very important just to shake us each up from instead of just becoming a little too settled in our in our ways. You know, so the Us has all kinds of great ideas. You have a vastly bigger team. The most other countries, but Italy might have a certain way of putting on a ritual that is done with just so much finesse. Or the French may have a particular way with language it be translated that, you know, this can be done in a certain,
way. All the German say, hey, you know, when we go and do the expressive word, we found that this is most most effective. So when you get you know, after 50 plus years we're doing it 15 countries also so getting together and poorly met Helen. You're bound to get some great ideas old people saying, oh, I think I should give up that old idea and and take on this new idea. Because is our strat wire not something like
when you're serious about change. So the Hoffman international make sure that we going to spam. You know, especially countries which have a us a small team that some of them just have 234 teachers that they have access to other others with many, many more ideas. I love that. The different perspectives the countries bring to the larger collective, Are there examples of that? Well, yeah. I mean, I'm just thinking years and years ago. None of us had really
been to Brazil. They started the process there in? 72. I mean, not that much longer after, Bob decided as a group. Actually, maybe in the same year that Bob started as a group in in the Us. Years later, 1 of the Us teachers went went there and saw that they're bashing rounds, so you know, where we get after a couple of days to express all emotions. Were not open and une ended until everybody was exhausted all the or the most thick
person. They're on the room eventually finished, but they timed them and gave them certain themes. So everybody had a focus. I'm like, oh, Why did I ever think of that but that before? Another 1 is that, you know, the the Us has started with a lot of classical music. In accompanying close eye processes. And then the late is when it was taken to Germany, Switzerland and Austria. They had quite a I suppose a connection with people there who did lovely music, but now, you know, we know much
much better. Through different mediums. So they really, you know, shook up the the music. If you're singing us as specific for a a session Yeah. But then I suppose you know, I listeners as if they don't know the process, it might get a bit to too technical. Know when there's things about how we do people's perspectives or trans, you know, people will give different ideas about how that can be done. But 1 very important thing is, you know, time is not always on our side.
Time is remorse And you know, we've had to compare the best idea so what works with with time too. Fantastic. Tim, you did the process 30 years ago? Even more. I only a bit more. I did it in late 18 9. Yeah. Okay. So what do you remember or something more than 30 years ago, 1 week of your life. What still lives inside you as a memory from that? We... Firstly, I'm gonna answer this.
Insulation before I access the person what side of it is I think the memories are stored in the Limbic system where there's no in time or place. So some of the things When I'm teaching, I remember from my own processes if they were happening at very day. So first, I remember, just the big compassionate eyes and the ability of bob to get me to smile or to laugh or to cry at this at the stroke of a how or just, you know, some words he would
use. I remember the incredibly cleansing sessions, I'd particularly remember that having sort of tough up in an early age, you don't cry. Being able to touch into real subs, real heart opening subs that melted the armor on me And I also remember the huge amount of fun and laughter that I was able to have when old repressed automations come out. So it wasn't just avail tears. It was also a hill of laughter. Just trying working in another metaphor that avail of tears a hill of laughter.
I love it. I have to work on that 1. What else do I remember? I know. Yeah. How that people remember very clearly, I With we'd ask people at at a talk, a a live talk in London. Can I see your hands up those who've done the process? Thank you. You're very welcome here. Click see your hands off of those you haven't done the process. Very welcome. You're very welcome here. Anybody not remember. Always will get laugh because, you should remember whether you don't process or
not. So I remember a huge fear interpretation going in, huge revelations in the middle of it and huge satisfaction at the end. And you said something earlier, which I thought was as a teacher, I really resonated with the memory of your own personal process gets inter at times with your experience of teaching the process. Yeah. It's funny because The last to is especially, I pretty much always had
somebody in training shadowing with me. And so I have to try to explain what works to, you, to be a more in the moment teacher, and I'll say, well, if you can remember your own process and you'll delivering that bit of information about why we're gonna do this next piece, for instance, forgiveness or for instance, you know, expressing old grief or own anger, then the students there in the room were more pretty much more to get it, if you can remember or be in a meditation and
see the images that we're portraying, then you're much more likely to, you know, make a far greater, emotional impression with the the people listening to it. So what's the point there is that the students... Learn in images. Students learn from like an emotional experience. You know, I'm thinking again, you know, an analogy would be it. A ted tool when they broke it down, the people who told stories and used emotional input.
Yes, there are things like teach teaching them something near and valuable. But you have to get across to the audience. This isn't just delivering content. I had a trainee just couple of weeks ago, who said that is so different from corporate work. In corporate the work, you can just deliver content in the process you have to be a real person showing up. With, your total humanity. And for me, that was I didn't really thought it
that way. Yes. I take I take it for granted So I suppose like an actor being in a role run that's performing a role. We have to access something there rather than just... Putting putting it on on. Liza says at times at the end of processes, you know, there's lots of self help books out there. It's a...
Billion dollar industry, and it's not that people really need the personal relationships to change and when you referenced bob's big eyes, is that... I mean, that's part of what you're talking about when you speak to the value of the personal relationship in change. Yeah. Of course. You know, that still continues. A teachers and more than 8 8 students in a process you read read the word. You have that first individual encounter.
You have to feel you have that individual 1 you you have a 1 to 1 experience so that you could be seen and heard by that particular person and so I felt, you know, I was seen and heard and understood by Bob Hoffman just in the time he took, you know, just in being being there, of course, that's huge important in a change isn't it. And so you referenced Bob, and as you have come to understand our founder, Bob Hoffman. Yeah what's important
that people should know about. Well I'm gonna say 1 thing that maybe is a bit bit shocking, And I'm I'm saying this in light of, you know, the current current events and the war on information and what what I hear about what's allowed to be set in in Russia. The Bob was able to create this because he had a light and a dark side. He was no saint. You know, he was there with his human or to human patterns, you know, and knew this, and he could forgive himself and he could move on.
But I would in know way said that, you know, he was just an amazing non guru guru who breathe light and a passion to all the world. So in finding out about him. Like, oh, my God. He did this and this and he would row with so and so and he would have a big bust up with so and so and at the same time.
Delivering this incredibly compassionate for giving work, which was designed to spread peace, You know, if he was a mah mc gandhi or, you know, Krishna Mart or someone, you would expect him to be w through very very peacefully being managed to inspire people and piss people off. He was very stubborn. You know, he wasn't an a nasty piece of work or Arrogant or, you know, got rude. But he was very
stubborn. And I suppose that stubborn has held him as somebody who was uneducated and he grew up poor to get things done in the world. You know, he made something of himself as a business when he made something of his his vision in the personal development, development world. But 1 of the big things and sorry, this a very long answer to your question. So in 93, we toured a process in Europe, and then we went for pretend day road trip through wales England Scotland.
And I remember him saying at the time, if I could rename this whole process, I would call it the dog side process. Now, of course, it wasn't called the whole process, then it was called the coronary energy process hopefully we gave in a art. He up died. But what he meant by that was I want people to realize the dark side in our nature is always going be around. It isn't going to go away what we have to do is to keep
empowering our our light side. And if he didn't see him, in know a that he had this big shadow, the light is stronger the shining is stronger. If he didn't seem something had his big shadow, he wouldn't probably be able to create work, that kept on in a sight of transformation digging out what's in in the way, digging it out going deeper and deeper and deeper and saying, hey, it's an internal battle and it's eternal battle. You'd always be doing it. Maybe give up your guide garden and
enjoy the good things of life. It's an internal battle and it's an eternal battle. Maybe the way he showed up is part of what we want for our students too, which is to acknowledge and not ourselves that we all do have that. Dark side as well as our light. Yeah. In that way, you know, he he would make a a balance or he would find a middle way between a spiritual bypass and again, you know, he could be less and actually charming where he would say a
phony holy way of looking at things. Or on the other hand, you have to apologize and think that we're just as sometimes Western psychology has, you know, a massive negative features that we've got to keep keep working on and working on. That balance. This is the way the work goes. Polishing the diamond, but rubbing the model. Polishing the diamond rubbing the mud off. I love it. You know, you actually also earlier in this conversation
brought up something. I thought that was thing, which is that he was stubborn, but he also knew how to bring people together And so in addition to his, like, natural innocence, he also brought in people and was curious enough to engage others early on in the formation. Is that true? Yeah. I mean, He certainly had a social skill a charm as well as having so something so valuable that people wanted to to learn from him. You know, he was always known to be generous to be hospitable.
I knew him when he had you know a nice nice house. He was able to do the entertainment, but I think all is that out like. Probably had that. So he would, you know, invite somebody out to mail invite somebody to his house to mail. They've have a talk about it. They 5 things is in common with networking and would meet so and so and so on and so. And I suppose he was lucky enough to be in in the Bay area where a lot of people where and had collected there at the end of the end of the sixties.
And so he put people together, and he was listened to and they thought, wow. Will include you in our in our thing if we can, but we certainly want to learn more from you. He was a magnet that attracted some other other talents around. Do you feel Bob and your training and his legacy in you when you lead and teach the process you feel like it's a part of you? Yeah. I'm just trying to clean how how I would feel that. I think part of it
is just, yeah. I'm much more of a clear directed, this is the direction we're gonna go personality when I'm teaching the teaching the process. You know, after tell what always like this. And that was Boggling. He just would really go for something, you know, he knew this was it. He didn't have many many doubts. So for instance, if a trainee or somebody is a young just says, oh no. I'm not sure about that. That could really scare
people, that feels a bit weird. I would say it's something like, hey, a lot of it because it's gonna feel weird to them. A lot of it is scary we'll do that because that will get them through and that kind of thing comes from Bob. The sense of, you know, we can do this. We've got permission to take people so far out of their comfort that they can get a real breakthrough. I'm always amazed at how much we take students out of their comfort zone during the process.
Yeah. No. We take we take risks, but people know that they're a good very good intentions behind them. Yeah. And they're held and they're safe and everything's well thought out, and someone they know really recommended the process or the book they read, Yeah. Your they survived it, it has to be okay. I'm not enjoying it right now, but it they came out looking great. There is that faith in their fellow friends and colleagues who've...
Who swear by it enough that they hang in there in the middle of it. Yeah. Of course, it's an, you know, Someone's going ask somebody. So who was it... You know, if I may ask who recommended this, and what did they say about? Because it also helps them anchor the, oh, yes. That's true. There was there was a recommendation before I came and did this crazy thing. Tim, why why do you like teaching and leading your
institute in the Uk? What wakes you up in the morning quicken your pulse about being associated and leading this thing called the Hoffman process. To make it better to take what's already quite acute and interest experience and refine it even more. You know, if I was an engineer, which I'm not like I do, you know, drill a hole in the wall, you know, I might be refining a car engine or a piece account from machinery or designing this or that.
What I love doing is design... And redesigning this word so that it can land with people better, and that's... You know, I can say that subjective and objectively because finding that's the feedback I get whenever we have a a session with my colleagues and you always look like you're trying to make it better. That's what excites. Me. And that's what excited me about, you know, shaking the other languages and being able to speak to people in Brazil or or wherever about their process how
can we make it better? Make it interesting for us to teach and for the students to go wow. This is good stuff. I know you've taught a bunch in the Us. You and I have never taught together. You're gonna come back so we can meet in person and teach together. Well, I had a good 1 of it in the 5 years before the pandemic actually so that we missed each other. We missed each other then. I'm just reassess travel now. I was back there in in January, but I decided not to teach at
the moment. I'm really needed here. So to even take 1 in the Us would be leaving 1 here, which sort of delays the training for for people and so on. So 1 day. Yes because it it is a lot of there's a lot of fun there. I don't have the... Oh, you're the guy who runs the institute soda there. I can just be in another members the truth. I imagine you are back up and running fully and wait did post pandemic in your Institute. Yeah. No. I think all of us have
have that were in great demand. But only vast No. Only this week have we gone full capacity because of social distancing and masks and everything. We've been sort and 75 percent we could get because of the our rooms are smaller than yours. But just this week we've gone back to full capacity, which allows us to put more people through. But, yeah, where I'm still still wait wait listed. And hopefully, yeah, we'll train more people and cut this put this on for more more people. If...
Now what is it? When the teachers there student appear through the other way around? When the students are ready, the teacher appears. I was getting mixed up with Kevin Customers film, a field of field of dreams. Build the field and they will and they will come. And they will come right. It does. It is the opposite there. Yeah. Tim, what it been like to reflect all the way back to your childhood as curious boy on up to your career leading the institute and D, Bob and his work and his history.
What's it been light to do it? Yeah. What's a like to to reflect on all those things. What do you notice? I noticed it's a sort of a sense of walked with history, you know, in the same way you asked about, you know, how do I feel Bob. I I feel a warm glow that I'm a member of a tradition at the same time, it's been very useful in helping me overcome, you know, if I look back at my child and just went were overcome that to integrate that as a part as a part
of me, rather than the... Oh, I don't ever wanna, you know, go back there again. It's traumatic or dark or or whatever memory. So, yeah, it's been interesting. It definitely you know, it follows it follows a thread. In then I did the process 32 years ago. I would never imagine even having the same job for more than about 2 years. I've actually been teach for, yeah, 3 decades. It's it's it's stunning. So it gives me a warm glow to be part of this.
Tradition. Tim, I'm grateful for your time in this conversation. Thank you. Craig good talking with you, Drew and thank you could teasing out some of the that when you would like to know. Thank you for listening to our podcast. My name is Liza And Grass. I'm this Ceo and President of Hoffman Institute Foundation. And I'm Ras Rossi, Often teacher and founder of the Hop institute Foundation. Our mission is to provide people greater access
to the wisdom and power of love. In themselves in each other and in the world to find out more. Please go to hop institute dot org.