Many of you know that the process has been in existence for more than 50 years. And 1 of the things we've known for years is about intuitively, the ability to change the brain. Today's conversation is with Barbara Era Smith Young. And now we have confirmed based on science and machines that can measure neural pathways that in fact, the brain can be changed. We knew it intuitively, and Barbara Aero Smith Young knows it intuitively in her childhood.
Listen as she takes us into that experience and what she does in the world today in helping people change. Their brain. Welcome to Loves everyday radius. Podcast brought to you by the Hoffman Institute. My name is Drew Horn. And on this podcast, we catch up with graduates of the process.
And have a conversation with them about how their work in the process is informing their life outside of the process, how their spirit and how their love are living in the world around them, their everyday radius side Hey, everybody. Welcome to the Hoffman podcast. My name is Drew Horn and Today, we have Barbara Arr Smith Young with us. Barbara welcome to the program. Thank you for having me.
I'm so looking forward to this conversation about the brain, everybody get ready because Barbara Aero smith Young when she was young experienced many cognitive struggles. Did you know they were cognitive struggles at the time Barber? No. Not not at the time. I just thought I wasn't intelligent. Stated. So... Simply and somewhat painfully, but you go on to write a book, the woman who changed her brain you were featured in a critical book about the brain? What was the title of that
book? The brain that changes itself. By Norman, who's a research, psychiatrist, and it was really a book that kinda of put neuro out on the world stage for people to understand not only the concept, but practical implications in terms of transforming people's lives. Yeah. So neuro is the keyword there and research is the other keyword and Hoffman in 19 96, more than 26 years ago, you did the Hoffman process.
And I guess that's where this conversation maybe be the venn diagram, hoffman and brain neuro. So What else would you add? You've you've started the school and this program and this research base, Methodology around cognitive exercises that help people rewire their brain. Is that how you would describe it? I would. And, you know, my little ambition is. I wanna change the face of education around the world. I really want to put the brain
into the education equation. I mean, you know, we recognize that the brain is critical for learning, And though if we look at a lot of educational practices is kind of like a passive passenger that that comes along, with the educational process, and what I argue is if we can understand the principles of neuro, which simply means our brain is capable of functional and physiological change.
So if if we can recognize that we can actually change the brain in significant ways that enhances the learning process, why not starting in grade 1, include cognitive programs and cognitive exercises along with learning curriculum and, you know, what would that change in terms of humanity. I think it would make people, you know, more critical thinkers, more rational, more self aware, lots of positive benefits would come out of
that. So that's kind of my mission is to, really transform how we think about education and incorporate the brain in that equation. I mean, it feels confusing for a moment there because the brain helps us learn and yet we're not taking the brain into account as part of what you're saying.
In the learning of it. So will you share a bit more about it because it sounds like let's not just teach children about information, but let's also engage their brain in develop so that they can acquire that information more efficiently. You've summarized it really, really well. Like, I mean, a lot of education, and I I know lots of teachers around the world, and and they are passionate and wanna make a difference. So this is not bashing teachers, I always like to look at the pre
under what we do. So if we look at education, still in most cases, the pre deposition is that the learner is a fixed black box. So I'm a little black box, and I have my strengths and weaknesses based on, you know, my cognitive profile, you know, how my brain is working. Nothing is ever working all at the same level. So I'm gonna have some strengths. I'm gonna have some things that are just kind of adequate, and I'm gonna have some areas that are are are challenging.
So currently, the best practices in education will recognize that they're their different learning profiles for each individual. But then what they do is they will adapt the external. So they're gonna adapt the curriculum to match that learners profile. So the profile fixed we're gonna change how we deliver the curriculum to meet that profile so that the learner can engage with the curriculum I'm actually saying, the learner is not a fixed black box. We can actually change that
black box. We can enhance and strengthen the brain, in really fundamental critical ways. So thinking, processing speed, reasoning, working memory, so that we don't have to adapt the external. We can change the learners ability to engage with... What's out there in the external world. So it... It's just a very different way of, of thinking about what is the perfect purpose of education and how we should go about it.
And I'm starting 2 pilot projects, 1 in New Zealand and 1 in Spain, purpose where in grade 01:30 minutes a day, 5 days a week, the students are gonna be doing 1 of my cognitive exercises. That's appropriate you know, for what have to learn in grade 1, then grade 2, the students are doing a different exercise. So all the way from grade 1 to grade 6. They'll be doing different cognitive exercises. And I'm really excited about that. I wrote that in the end of my book. That was my vision
for education. And actually, it was... A good friend of mine who is now a hoffman teacher that said, be bold. Do I put your vision in the end of the book, and I thought, I don't think Can be that bold, but I listen to her and did it. Beautiful. Yeah. This will not happen in my lifetime. Well, here europe's I'm still live, and it's happening. I You know, So it's kind of like, if you don't speak it and put it out into the world, it will never happen. So be bold
and put it out. And is possibility it'll happen. You know, it might be hard for listeners to get that the brain changes that there's neuro that we can rewire the brain that, of course, might seem natural and normal, and well, of course, we can do that, but we we have to provide the context of how the brain has been viewed. For centuries, And this is part of maybe the problem with some of the educational system in that you. The profile is... Fixed. I love that. The profile is fixed.
Let's change the data around it and you're saying No, No. Let's not change the data and it's not a black box. It's not a fixed profile. We can actually... Help the brain grow to integrate information better, quicker, faster. And so part of your work is based on this idea that the brain can change and new neural pathways can be wired in. How did that go from the old story, and the old idea that the bring is fixed to the new 1 what happened? For me, it was a story of desperation and need.
You know, I... As you mentioned, grew up with very significant learning difficulties, very significant. And I was identified in grade 1. And at that time, they didn't even have the idea of a learning difficulty. It was a mental block. So I was diagnosed in grade 1 having a mental block. And of course, I thought I had a piece of wood in my head, like, a
block. And, you know I was basically given a, like, sentence told that I would never learn, like other children, and my whole educational career would be a struggle, and my mother was told don't have high expectations for your daughter because she won't amount too much. So this was grade 1 in the 19 fifties. So this was the time of the fixed brain, basically, you know, the belief was the brain you're born with
is a brain you die with... If there's any difficulty, you know, you just have to learn till to accept it and live within your limitations. And I was really lucky in my father was assigned just in an inventor and he had this belief that he instilled in me. He said if there's a problem in the world, and there's no solution yet. He said, Is our responsibility to go out
and find a solution. And then he said, if the rest of the world tells you you can't do it Said don't be limited by conventional wisdom. Said this is how science goes forward. So I had this kind of mantra in my head. I had no idea. What was possible and I had these struggles. So, you know, the teacher was correct. All of my schooling was incredibly,
challenging and in grade aid. I attempted suicide because I couldn't imagine elementary school was such a struggle, and now I was going to high school, and I just couldn't imagine how I could cope. And thankfully, I didn't get the instructions right. So I'm still here but it was that level of of pain. So I kept hunting, you know, with that idea that my pop father had planted in my brain, and it was in 19 77, somebody handed me a book that changed my life, and this was written by Alexander Lau,
a brilliant russian neuro psychologist. And really interesting, it was in August of 19 77 I was given this book, and I believe it was August of 19 77 he died, So it it just felt kind of prophetic. And as I read this book, the man the shattered world, it was telling the story of a Russian sold. So who in World war 2 had a very localized head wound. And so the book was his journal describing his his challenges, and then Lori explaining what was going on in his brain. And this was
my aha moment. Because as I read this man's journal, I was keeping a journal, explaining and we were describing exactly the same problems. And I knew I didn't have s in my brain, but I was born this way. So now I knew it was my brain, that wasn't working. And before that, I knew I had problems, but I didn't know the source. And to solve a problem, you kinda have to understand its nature. So that was the first
piece of the puzzle. And then the next piece was rose and sc work out of Berkeley, and he was studying neuro in rats, you know, and finding that with rats, if you gave them a really enriched and stimulating environment with lots of toys to play within activities, they became better at learning Maze, which is like a rat intelligence test. And when he looked at the brains, they had changed...
Physiological. So more den some more s connections, more neurotransmitters, more gl cells, and large capillaries, So he argued this concept of activity, dependent, plastic. So, you know, you, you, makes up the activity, and it drives neuro plastic change in the brain. And I thought, you know, if rats have neuro, your surely humans must, Stripe. And so I remember going to my professors at that time. I was studying school psychology at the university of Toronto and doing my masters.
And they all said, and and I started talking about my learning challenges. And they said basically, learning difficulties have nothing to do with the brain. Number 1. So, you know, it's not the brain. And they said, even if they do, your brain is fixed. So there's nothing you can do about it. And I remembered my father's message, don't be limited by conventional wisdom. Right? If the world says you can't do it, go out and try and see. And I had no idea if I could do anything, but I tried,
and I created the first act. Size for myself in 19 78 and went through this whole process, and at a certain point, realized there was human neuro because it was, like, after this, you know, certain level of the the exercise, I could do things that with the best will in the world before I had been unable to do. It it was kinda like, you know, the blind came off, my brain started you know, functioning. And then I had I had multiple learning
difficulty. So then, I I invented another exercise for a spatial problem because I was always getting lost, can now navigate around the world without getting lost, and then I created a third exercise for, a part of my brain, I was really clumsy and awkward and didn't know where the left side of my body was, and saw change there. So that's the beginning of this work. Yeah. So you were able to not just know that your brain that it was your brain that was the
problem. You you kind of put 2 and 2 together there, but then you also developed these exercises for your brain, and you... I imagine you practice them every day. What kinda exercises were they? How long did it? And how long did it take to see the changes? Each 1 was was different. So the... The the 1 that where I couldn't grasp
concepts. Like, for me, it was... I couldn't be having this conversation with you before, because I would listen to people talking to me... I mean, I could recognize the words, but I I struggled to comprehend. Right? So what I would do is I would memorize what somebody said. I would walk away and, like a little taper order because I had a verbatim monetary memory, I would play it over
and over again. It might make take me 2 hours to understand what that person was was saying, but that person hadn't waited for the 2 hours to, you know, for me to figure it out and then have a conversation. So for that problem, which is kind of like attaching meaning to things in process and seeing relationships and connections. I used an exercise with clocks. And it wasn't about learning how to tell time. I was now 26 and I still couldn't read an analog watch. I couldn't tell
time. And Maria talked about if somebody has a problem that part of the brain because they can't fix see connections or relationships, they can't read clocks because a clock is seeing the connection a special connection between an hour and a minute hand and an hour a minute hand and second hand, and they're all relational. So it wasn't that I wanted to learn how to tell time, but I had to figure out how can I force my brain to process
relationships? So that's what I started with several of the beginning development work ended up in the waste basket. Right? Because it didn't do anything. But over time, I started drawing clocks reading clocks until, you know, I couldn't get any more accurate in any quicker, And then I added another hand. Right? Because this idea of cognitive complexity if you master something in a really fast and automatic. It's not gonna drive neuro plastic change. You
you have to kind of... It's like that sweet spot of of, even, like in physical exercise where you have to just sort of push the limits. Then I added another hand and then another hand and eventually, Now we have 10 handed clocks. I mean, there is no 10 handed clock in the world, but it's like processing 10 relationships simultaneously.
And the only 2 people over the last many, many years that have looked at those clocks and been able to figure them out without an explanation was, an astronomer that had been instrumental in discovering Quasars, radio emitting galaxies and the other was a physicist from Harvard. So I thought I'm on to something here. Right? Like, at that level of of complexity. So the idea is to...
You know, in my work is if you understand the nature of that part of the brain, like, which was by reading Gloria over and over and over again, you then intuit what is an activity or a task that is going to make that part of the brain work hard. Right? But but again, you have to calibrate the difficulty because if make it too hard, the brain is not gonna engage. And if you make it too easy, again, the brain won't engage. So you you have to
Yeah. Yeah. I like... I really like this idea of both, as you said, a akin to exercise. You wanna challenge the brain. But not over tax it to the point of shutting it down. But a brain that that grasp something too quickly doesn't act. Actually grow any neural pathways. So it has to be stressed a little bit. Absolutely. Yeah. And and then we all like to go on automatic pile.
I mean, you know, let me tell you, I like to go cruise control at times and and do things that are really easy, but that isn't... Going to drive neuro plastic change. And I mean, and if I think about Hoffman, you know, in terms of my experience with it it absolutely drives neuro plastic change because it it gets the individual to kinda go a different way, not respond. Habit obituary. Right? Like, not not kind of that knee jerk reaction or be within patterns.
It's, you know, to sort of break that automatic process, and go a different way. And that absolutely drives neuro plastic change. Yeah. I think. I'm glad you brought a apart because I was gonna have us go there, but I I think part of what and I'm so curious about... This is why I've in a way excited to have you on because I'm the way we hold it and 1 of the ways we hold it is that the week itself creates neuro plastic change just by engaging in the week
your brain will change. And we have a specific exercise, that students engage in many times throughout the course of the week, that does that more specifically and pointed But tell me about neuro plastic change and the hoffman process and why? Your understanding of why it works. Anytime we break habit perpetual routine. Right? Anytime, you know, we we get out of those rut of of habit, which can be patterns, you know, we're kind of unconsciously driving behavior.
Anytime we interrupt that and move in a different direction, we're starting to, drive neuro. Change in the brain. I mean, we're we're starting to create new pathways. We're starting to actually... Like, neuro change doesn't necessarily mean not, just strengthening connectivity. It can also be loosening connectivity. Right? In the brain. Like, it it just means the brain capable of change, whether
it's either direction. So when you're in pattern and doing things repeatedly, you know, you're sort of going down a, like, almost like, on a ski hill. Right? You know, they're rut there and you're in those rut. And there's kinda not really free will choice because you're just, moving in those those pathways. And as soon as you interrupt that, you're... And you continually interrupt that, you're lessen those rut, or reducing them and building strength in other areas.
I think that's that's certainly from my experience, like with all the you know, you alluded to. You do have exercises. And and I did it so long ago 26 years ago, like, Maybe some... I'm sure some of the things have changed, but I think but the recycling, the pre psych, you know, all of the things that I took away, the, you know, the elevator, you know, all all of those techniques, which allowed me to break those habit neural pathways that weren't very constructive or healthy,
and build healthier ones. You know, like so reducing the hold of those negative neural connections and then building up more positive pathways and positive neural connections. I love that. I just wanna highlight that because it feels it feels important to say that there's a double benefit that when you do this, work of re wiring the brain.
You get the... As you said, loosening the hold Barbara that's beautiful loosening the hold as the negative connection and strengthening the neural pathways of the positive connection the way you wanna show up in the world. Absolutely. And I think that for me, the hoffman process was profound you know, in terms of doing that for me in my life. And I really truly believe this work wouldn't be out in the world in the way that it is if I hadn't done the hoffman.
Process. Right? And I I made an active decision because I knew that what I had created needed to be accessible in the world, and I knew that I was kind of not exactly like a zombie, but I I was stuck in my patterns and realized if I stayed stuck in those, I couldn't bring this work fully out into the world. So that that was my impetus,
you know, to... It was a significant impetus to go into Hoffman was so that I could bring this gift that I had created out into the world and and absolutely Hoffman allowed me to do that, and it was the process and then taking the all the tools that I had learned in the process and starting to use them in in my daily life.
Here now this work. You know, we're in a hundred educational organizations, and I think 12 countries and, you know, continuing to develop pilots were working with a group of individuals with addictions, learning difficulties, acquired brain injury, traumatic brain injury, cognitive decline we age, like, you know, so I I will be eternally grateful forever to the hoffman process because it allowed me to really manifest my gifts in the world which I don't... I truly don't believe would have
been possible. You know, and and part of those patterns were developed out of my experience with learning difficulties. Right? You know, I lived in a tremendous amount of fear, what I call Mig deal Hell. I was on high alert all the time, like vigilant because I couldn't understand my world. So it was scary and threatening you know, through what I did in in Hoffman, it allowed me to learn tools and use tools
to kind of reframe my world. And my understanding of my world along with the cognitive work that I did together, and I believe the 2 had to happen the cognitive work that I did was hugely significant. And that was necessary. And then the Hoffman work also was usually significant and necessary. And it sounds like part of it as well was maybe affirming that this also exists outside of your work, you were certainly a learner and a reader and a researcher.
But here's 1 1 venue, the process where it's put into action. And and part of what you're saying too is that it gave you the the gum, the courage to to tell your story and create your vision. I know vision is a big piece of the process, and you mentioned how you're friend, you didn't say her name, but I'll say at Barbara Burke. Tell me a little bit about vision we do so much of that in the process. Endo neuro. What what's the relationship between those?
I'd say, like, again, envisioning, you're imagining a different possibility. Right? Like, you you're imagining something that is you know, you get really clear on it and different than where you are right now. Right? So, again, that's that concept of building new neural pathway.
So so you get clear on the vision and the details of the vision, and then, obviously, you know, the support systems, you you need to bring into play and kind of integrate your, you know, emotional self, your spiritual self, all all all of that in sort of aligning with that vision. And I I believe it changes the... Even the body, probably as well as the brain. Right, at a neuro level to energetically align with that vision. I I don't
know exactly how to put it. I mean, I have this idea of, you know, freeing energy to dance with the universe. I think at at some level, that's what it's doing and it... There's a lot of research showing you create the vision, and you sort of hold to that vision, and then things start to align in in that that direction. So I I think it's... It is creating, you know, new neural pathways and energetically aligning in in a certain direction. I I don't think I can articulate it.
And any better than that. I don't know that and I did such a good job. But it but it's really clear. I mean, they... You know, with athletes, they, you know, athletes that envision, you know, like, a a golf stroke. And what they see is parts of the brain that are actually the same parts of the brain that are involved when you're doing the golf stroke light up, you know, when you're
envisioning it. So it it's kind of like you're you're preparing the brain for the action that is going to take place and in that preparation, it's improving it or making it more possible? Barbara, I've often said to students that this work is powerful but it's also subtle. And so I'm imagining that it's not just a 1 time, exercise vision. It it does have to be done repetitive over the course of a certain amount of time, and then you begin to see the changes.
Will you speak a little bit about the progression of change Yeah. I I think any good neuro plastic program or when you're driving neuro plastic change. Exactly. It's not like, 1 day you wake up, and Aha. You know, you you're there. It it is it it is gradual and subtle, but it it builds on. It's self. So, like, each kind of incremental piece of the change, the next piece builds on that piece then it builds on
that piece. And then, you know, at at a certain point, you're you're significantly along that path or functioning differently than you were when you started the path. But to me, it's a a never ending process. Right? Like, it's as long as we're live, you know? And as long as we do the work, we will always be driving change. Like, I think it's just it's inevitable. And and to me, that's what's really promising. And and, you
know, sometimes we can get stuck. But then, you know, A hoffman, you pull out the tools and you start using them. Or in my work, you know you can kind of go back in and just do a little bit of the exercise and very quickly get back to that point. So I mean to me, what's so promising is that as organisms, we're we're designed to evolve and change. You know, sometimes, we like to stay where we are. But fundamentally, that's how we're designed. We evolve, we adapt. We change...
It's it's just in our nature. And this is what things like my work capitalize on and, you know, what Hoffman does too is that they sit imperative to grow to develop to change to be fully engaged in the world in the best way that we possibly can. Barbara, I was thinking about and in reading your story and remembering the little girl, the emotional child, certainly we'd talk about that in the process. So I I wanna ask about your emotional child and
what it was like for you? And do you still connect with that little girl who was bumping into walls and thought she was stupid and thought she had a wood block in her head What was that? I guess it's a 2 part question. What was it like in the process to connect with her? And do you still hold her in your heart that little girl who struggled so might as a young being in the world? The short answer is Yes. I I still I still do. I'd say, I mean, she's still in my heart. Absolutely.
Though I would say that much less fear. You know, Like I mean, she she was terrified. Like I I don't know how to describe her. I mean, she she grew up living in terror, and I believe it's a result of, you know, all that, you know, cortisol and, you know, then the attack on the endo system because, you know, if you're constantly living in stress and there's no way to relieve that stress.
It takes a toll on the body. So I developed an autoimmune disorder, and there's research now to show that individuals with learning difficulties are more likely to have disease or physical illness, and it it makes sense. And we've done research with my work to show that as the students move through this, cortisol reduces in the body. It's a byproduct of the stress. I mean, imagine, you know, our brain
media our relationship with the world. So it's through our brain that we, you know, understand kind of come to understand ourselves. We understand other people, our relationship to them, our relationship to the world. So if there's a central problem in that. It has a huge impact on one's mental health. I mean, I struggled with anxiety disorder depression, had a lot of different diagnoses none of them that were right because they weren't looking at it was my brain that was driving
the... These challenges. I was described as rigid and stubborn, and I was rigid and stubborn, but it wasn't emotional. It was cognitive. Because for me, understanding things was so hard that if I finally came to understand something, I was gonna hold on for dear life. And if you came to me and said, well, Barbara, maybe you should think about it from this angle.
It actually felt like a physical attack because I'd have to let go of what I'd struggle so hard to come to understand to try to integrate this other perspective, and then I'd have to fight really hard to do that. So So I was rigid, and I was stubborn. Almost as if you were doing it on purpose, you're being will Barbara, just stop it. Like, Exactly. I got the strap in grade 1 because they they did things like that. And I think it was because I frustrated my teacher so much. Right? Like, I wrote
everything backwards. I read backwards. She thought I was doing this deliberately. And, you know, it's just the way I saw. Right? I mean, I wasn't trying to make her life difficult. And I would have meltdown downs. I I would just, like, break down so uncontrollable billy she'd have to dismiss the whole class. You know, for early recess, you know, it it was... And then end my strategy. I realized, okay, if I spend half of my day in the washroom.
The teacher's happy and I'm happy. Right? Because I'm not in the class, so, you know, we kinda had this little silent packed that she just let me go off and hide out in the washroom. So it... Yeah. So I say I grew up living in terror. Like, I would be afraid if somebody said something to me because I didn't know if I'd I understand it.
Like, I had this image that, you know, there was a a banquet, you know, people having a wonderful time and there was a thick plate glass window, and my face was pressed against that window wanting to participate, but I couldn't because I couldn't understand. And then another image I had was, you know, living in AAA constant fog where meaning was just a ep and it would just disappear. I couldn't grasp, but it was just
trying... And social relations are were incredibly difficult because I couldn't trust people. 1 of the ways you know, you're being con is you hear logical inconsistencies and what somebody says to you. And you say oh, this doesn't quite... You know you know, match up. Well, for me, there was no logic in my world, no understanding. So, obviously, there were neurological inconsistencies, So, you know, I was very vulnerable to being taken advantage of.
Yeah. So it wasn't... It was not a happy time, for me. Growing up. Like, so, you know, I I couldn't excel at sports because of my kin set a clumsy problem. I I couldn't excel academically because... And I wasn't good in social
relations. So, like, you know, there was every door felt like it was closed you know, for me, and I joked that I became a work and grade 1 because I've come home at lunch, and my mother would have flash cards because she was determined her daughter was gonna learn how to read and write and do mathematics. I come home after school and I do flashcards.
And you know, wasn't fun at the time, but I'm grateful because I did learn how to read, and I did learn how to write, but it didn't address the underlying learning difficulty. Yeah. Life was was challenging, difficult, unpleasant, and that's what, you know, by grade aid where I thought, you know, I just need to end this. Barbara, you have really used your need to, understand the world differently, understand yourself differently.
Talk about a self starter and a self learner, you've been the canvas on which you've experimented to then turn around and and help. Those children who are struggling with the same thing. What a story? What's it like to look back? Now and see this journey over the course of your years. It feels some you know, somewhat satisfying. Like, I often, you know, if you're on an airplane and they say if it gets into trouble, those lights are gonna come on and guide your path.
So like, it kind of if I look back, I feel like you know, those lights were on. Like, III think about nature and nurture. Right? You know, my my mother had won an award for his con... Contributions to education in the province of Ontario. My father with his belief system, and, you know, he had 40 patents to his name, that creative process. So I had the, kind of the crucible within which this cooked, you know, in my family. And then
you know, I... The nature of the difficulties I had, and I did have some strengths in my brain, like, you know, my prefrontal cortex, the executive functioning, which was the drive, was was strong. So I was driven, but, you know, given that I got lost all the time. I wasn't sure exactly where I was driving, and I struggled with meaning. So you, for me you know, to try to understand Lori. I might have to read a passage 75 times,
right? Too... But but I was so driven, you and I knew there was something of value here. And then when I saw the results, I thought, I need to take this out of the world to help other people. And I always think about... Really not... This is just me personally, not resting on what I have done, but what is the future horizon that where I where I want
this work to go. There's a R poem, Dish, which she talks about lumber through that, which is not done you know, I have gratitude for all of the experiences that led to where I am now, even my learning difficulties, because sometimes people say what I've preferred to have been born without those. Well, I can't imagine that because that wasn't the case. And if I was, I wouldn't be where I am now, and I wouldn't
have created this work. But it is always thinking, but how can I make this more accessible? How can I reach more people? How can I help groups that because of their challenges or difficulties are going to be marginalized somehow? That's my real passion. I mean, obviously, it can help somebody that just wants to to, you know, get stronger I've worked with a Jazz musician who wanted to enhance the cognitive ability to become a better performer, and that's great.
However, you know, my heart is really with that student with the learning difficulties that really gonna struggle if they can't, you know, enhance and strengthen that that cognitive function. So I will be like, I'm never retiring. I I'm gonna be continuing, you know, to work in this area until I'm no longer here. Wow. Barbara Aero smith Young. Thank you so
much. As you said somewhat satisfying, I see that you are continuing to do this work and even collaborating now, as you said earlier, you are on some Zoom calls and with people in the Ukraine, collaborating in the work. It's ongoing and said not? It is. You know, it's always looking at you know,
what's... As I said, the next horizon our next frontier and, you know, constantly, we're doing, you know, pilot checks we're doing 1 in In Queensland in Australia, with young adults with addiction, and because addiction rewire the brain in a negative way. Right? To support the addiction, and we're seeing we've trial this now for 1 year. We're just going into the second year of the project. Just looked at some of the data and seeing really significant changes,
you know, for these individuals. Again, along with you know, the therapeutic process. It needs to be in combination, but you, you know, start to re rewire the brain back in positive directions you know, then they can even benefit from the therapy more, the work we're doing with
the, you know, acquired brain injury. They're, we're looking at setting up research study at, B Women's hospital in Boston associated with Harvard to look at 1 of my cognitive exercises with people with acquired brain injury, you know, even the long haul cognitive impact of Covid. I believe 1 of my exercises could benefit some of the cognitive challenges around that. So, yes. It's just really to see, you know, who and how can this work be of
benefit. Like, it's... You, I say a prayer, most mornings. May this work go out into the world with ease, grace, and heart integrity, and it may... It reach those who it can be of benefit too. And then I surrender it. So that that will always be my prayer. Ease, grace and heart integrity. Thank you very much. For your story and for the work that you do. And for this conversation, Barbara. Thank you. It has been an absolute pleasure drew. Thank you. Thank you for listening to our podcast My
name is Liza and Grass. I'm the Ceo and President of Hoffman Institute Foundation. And I'm Ras Rossi. Often teacher and founder of the Hop institute Foundation. Our mission is to provide people greater access to the wisdom and power of love. In themselves in each other and in the world. To find out more, please go to Hop institute dot org.