- Hi everyone. This episode is a sweet example of what happens when we let our spirits lead Eleanor Sears Searcy. My guest talks about her brave adventure into the world of play and the impact the play has had on her personally. And I wanna share with you this gem from this interview, something I know I'll be taking into my life with me. Eleanor says this, when there is full presence, there is always more opening. And that is what she's done.
She has given youth her full presence. Enjoy the episode. Welcome to Love's Everyday Radius, a podcast brought to you by the Hoffman Institute. My name is Sharon Moore and I'm one of your hosts. And on this podcast we talk to Hoffman graduates about how their courageous journey inward impacted their personal lives, but also how it impacted their community and the world at large.
So tune in and listen in and hear how our graduates authentic selves, how their love, how their spirits are making a positive impact on our world today. In other words, get to know their loves every day. Radius. Hello Eleanor and welcome to the show. - Hi - . So glad you're here today. Eleanor, I would love to start with play. This is something you have devoted your life to, devoted your career to. How did that happen? How did you discover play to be such a powerful tool?
- I wasn't looking for it for sure. I was pretty much an A type personality and I'd never played very much. And a friend of mine, she must have been devoted to me or some part of me in some way. 'cause she consistently asked me for three years to come to her daycare center and to her class. And I was working a full-time job. And I also wasn't playful and didn't feel comfortable with lots of people at one time, which is classroom is lots of people and lots of kids.
I said no all the time and I was a bit astounded by her suggestion that I come, but eventually I said yes. I don't know why, maybe I could feel her river of love or something, but I was a very shy person. So I finally agreed to go. And when I got there, she had no plans for me and I was horrified that I said, what would you like me to do? And she said, I don't know. What would you like to do? And I was so shocked.
And actually it, it put me in a bit of a panic and she said, well, think about it, because I really felt like, you know, I needed a job. And so I started thinking about it and I remembered when I was a teenager, I used to help very young people whose parents were either on drugs or too busy with their work to care about what was happening with their little ones during the day. And I would just go over there, I didn't even know the parents and help the kids out and do things with them.
And I started also thinking about that and remembering how I was very hurt in school. And so many kids were very hurt in junior high and high school and the cliques and the pain you went through. And I always wish to end violence and aggression and I always wished to end cliques and to end harm to people. And I also wished it to stop towards me. And so I was thinking about that.
And I also thought about, well, Harvard and Yale are pretty fancy schools, but still we have all this abuse in high schools and junior high schools. And, and then as men and women get older, I was mostly concerned about men and boys abusing girls. I realized, well, they haven't solved it, that's what happened in my mind.
And so maybe I'll ask these children because they were holding hands and the boys were rolling down hills together and laying in each other's arms when they were tired and they didn't seem to be hurting each other. So I thought, well, let me just ask them what they need to stay in that place. I didn't ask them with my words, but I thought I'll just make myself available. And what they asked me to do was to play. - And here you are, a person who didn't have a lot
of play being asked to play with kids. What happened then? - Well, it was really embarrassing. It was terrifying because all these teachers were doing exactly what I would have done, which is stand over there and watch and talk to each other. 'cause she had a break. Well, I must have been pretty committed to my friend and to her desire to have me there. And so I started doing what they ask.
But that meant eventually, I'm sure I walked around the playground a little bit, really nervous, you know, know first. And then they would ask me to crawl around on the ground or climb the tree. It was so hard to do and I was really committed. I would go home and cry about it the next day I would go back and maybe it took a week to climb in the tree with them, or maybe it took a month or two to crawl around on the ground with them. Or maybe it took a year, I can't remember.
But every time I went I would try to move closer to doing whatever they asked me. As long as it didn't hurt anyone, that was my goal. I just thought, do whatever they ask me. As long as it doesn't hurt me or them, even if I'm scared, that's the only way I'm gonna find out what they, what they need. - And what was the impact of you doing that? - I think that it was a brave adventure.
I think I was constantly, um, becoming aware of myself, my limitations, but I also, there was no reason to keep those limitations when there was somebody in front of me saying, I want to do this. And you could tell it would help them because they would get happy and you could tell it was lighting them up because they wouldn't been asking if they didn't need it or want it.
- So if I'm hearing you correctly, for you it was a recognition of your limitations but also a breaking those limitations down - Constantly for the benefit? It was very easy to do it because it was a contribution to them. - So by you seeing their light or their lighting up or uh, their response to you, it gave you more reason to continue to break down your own perceived limitations? - Yeah, it was just the request. And I had made a commitment to honor every request.
They asked me if my limitations were getting in the way of their request. I had to get rid of 'em because if I didn't, I wouldn't be learning about what they needed and wanted and what would help them stay so pure and connected to life. So that was my idea anyway. I don't know how I did it really. I don't know how I made that commitment because it really took me a very long time and I was always worried about what the teachers were thinking of me. I wish they couldn't have seen me .
- And so even with the limitations, even with the worry, once you looked at the kids and you saw the reaction, you just continued, continued down this path. I - Just kept trying. Yeah. And it really was a lot of releasing in order to be able to do it because I had never been silly. I had never played, I had never, I, I actually probably had never held a lot of kids except my son. You know, I'd probably never rolled around on the ground with strangers.
- Yeah. So, so that's where I was about to go. You just said rolled around on the ground. What kind of play are we talking about? - Well, I guess I wouldn't really say rolled around on the ground because that came so much later. I was probably way too scared at first, but, and it seemed to me that they wanted somebody to be very involved. It felt to me that they kept asking me to do things that where I was a participant of what they were doing.
Not somebody they came to for support, that I was participating in their play. It seemed important because they kept asking me if I wandered off or wandered off in my mind you could see they're, they're, they're like engaging with you again. And then they would ask me to resolve any issues that they had going on, which was interesting because if you're engaged in the play moment, you actually really do know what's going on.
Versus if the child goes and tells me as a teacher, wow, it's a whole different world than what was really happening. , if they have an internal alon with each other, they would start asking me because I actually knew exactly what happened. - And they would verbally ask you like, Hey, I'm having a Yes, - They would verbally, yeah. - And so would you bring both kids who are in conflict to your presence or would you work with each one individually?
- No, I was just, we would be right there in the middle of some fantastical play moment. Maybe it was imaginary, maybe it was physical and, and it would just be right there and they would just yell or say, Hey, you hit me, or whatever. And turn to me. And I would just engage with them around that at the moment. And that was the only quote, typical adult role I think I had. - And so has there been any bridge between your discovery of play with kids and bringing play into your life as an adult?
- Yes. I really got to know myself during that time. I think that play is actually play that doesn't harm is actually the giving and receiving of love. And I didn't know know that. And I didn't know that unconditional intimacy and emotional connection was something that young people do constantly in order to stay in touch with themselves maybe, or that they're already in touch with it and they wanna stay there. - And so were you able to bring it into your adult life as a result?
- I think, yes, for many years I think I tried to find so many other adults to play with, but it was hard to find. But I became so playful and so playful with myself and the years that I was focusing on that I was very happy and so many people would offer to support my work. I never asked for help, but they would see the effect on the kids and just offer support and it ended up being a great support to me as well. - So you became playful with yourself, you said.
Can you tell me more about that? What does that look like? - I guess when a kid would want me to climb a tree, and that was in, in the presence of everybody else and all the other adults on the playground, it wasn't something I'd ever done with, you know, around people. Then I just go home and keep climbing a tree until I could really feel okay about doing it in the presence of myself, even . And I would try to find what, what would feel good to me.
That was very hard. I was like, oh, so how am I gonna get to the point of doing what they ask me with ease would be to find out what would make me feel playful. So I would attempt to see, oh, okay, I am sitting here right now. What would feel better next ? - So in a way, here you are healing or working with these kids and then you go home and it does the same work on you. - Yeah. - Wow. - And sometimes it would be very painful.
There was a young boy at the school that never played with anyone and he was completely alone. Nobody played with I he had played with anyone and um, I had no idea what his history was, but I knew it was painful. I might go home and cry or I might go home and, and try to move my body the way he moved his body to see how he might feel 'cause he wasn't talking at that point.
And to try to see if I could be as real with him as he was being with me, being really real with someone is real about what's happening is was not something that I knew a lot about, I didn't think. - And so how would you take care of yourself? I mean, it sounds like you're almost walking a thin line of taking on their problems. So how, how did you make sure you did not? - I never felt that. It's like, I don't really believe in that. I don't have those thoughts in my mind for some reason.
It's like, I don't even know that I could take on, I don't think, I'm not sure those words are even real for me. What I think what it was is, is that the presence, if I was really present with them, there was always one more opening to give them one more place to open my heart one more place. Because young people want connection and presence and play. And so their goal is always to move in that direction. So I think there's always that, what, what would you call it?
Um, balance of attention or there's always a stream pulling you into something light, no matter how dark it is for them. That is also true even with inner city teenagers that I've spent time with. - And so speak more. Well first of all, I love what you just said. When there is true presence, there is always more opening. That is beautiful.
And, and I do wonder if, you know, you said they're always looking for connection, presence and play, and you said young people are, but I wonder if all people are looking for connection, presence and play. - I wouldn't know anything about that actually. I'm really good with kids, but I don't think I have much capacity with adults, . - So you tell me more about, so first you went to a preschool that your friend invited you to, and now you speak of inner city kids.
So, uh, or middle school, did you say middle school kids or teenagers? - Teenagers. I was speaking of them in reference to the concept of being able to connect even in the greatest sadness and horror of the life of an inner city kid who doesn't have the resources for food or, you know, even in that situation, through experiencing that in a challenge day, you can see so much light and so much desire for connection. - And so you worked with this age group as well?
- Yes. Not through my play, through innate play, but through a program called Challenge Day. I got to spend a lot of time, I did work with this group of kids through some inner city work, but it wasn't usually teenagers, maybe up to 12. - Does it shift when you go from a preschool age to a teenage age? Does it shift when you go from different level of trauma or is it similar? - There's so many answers. So many things come to my mind.
I have a little more anxiety with teenagers that I've not ever worked with before. So that's my own personal experience. I don't know that the state of play is really any different. I know that for young, young kids they have a lot more access. It's easier to get to that place. There's less embarrassment that comes in with older kids more and more, or how to look cool to your friends or I think the state when you get in it is the same.
So I worked, uh, for a while with kids, some maybe 11, 12, 13. And there was one young young man the first time I played with these young people, I guess there was about 25 of them. And they were big kids, you know, kids are tall and one young person looked like a 26-year-old man, just, he was 13 and he was a class bully and was always cool and always, you know, everybody liked him, but he was rough and cool and you know, you'd never see him do anything soft or sweet.
And it was, uh, hard for teachers. And the first time I played on the mats with that group of young people, I waited until last to play with him last because he was sitting on the side of the mask going even while the other kids were playing, you know, and, and, and he was glaring at me like he was just gonna eat me alive. And I remember thinking, wow, I should say a prayer for myself, .
And, and I said this prayer, you know, let me be present enough to play with him and to have the courage to invite him on the mats because it was, it was scary. And if you're in the state of fear, you can't really play. You're not in the state of play. And with young people, I can play with them for any length of time as long as I can keep us both safe. So maybe I thought I'd play with him for 30 seconds, that might be all I could do, maybe a minute.
So he came on the mat and he was, you know, boy, I was having a hard time. He had me, he was rolling me over and upside down and, and all of a sudden I started making frog noises and hopping around and he was going like he was gonna, he said, I'm gonna kill you and stuff like that. And then he started hopping around like a frog and making frog noises and being silly. And I could see one of the teachers was just crying and so moved. And I was so moved. I was amazed.
And they hadn't seen him do that before and I know it's not me, it's that state. - Yeah. I love this idea of, of feeling intimidated, recognizing, oh, oh, I feel anxiety here, pausing, praying, let me be present enough to be in this state of play of connection with this other human. And it sounds like there was a continued surrender, continued trust in Hoffman terms as, you know, continued kind of spirit led behavior. And look what happened as a, as a result. It's really powerful - Tonight.
It's wonderful to be remembering. It's, it's, it's wonderful. - I can't help but want to say that, you know, you, I've heard you say on this recording and in other conversations, oh, I don't know about adults. I, I just work with kids and I can't help but think, wow, this is applicable to all interactions.
You know, if you have this moment, just like with this teenage boy where you feel anxious, having that moment of pause, of prayer, of saying, let me be present enough to connect wholeheartedly. Have you ever tried that in the presence of other adults? - I think I try that, uh, maybe I'd like to try that again more when I'm with young people and doing this innate play, there's a huge difference between hanging out with the intellect and being, uh, physically engaged there.
The transformation, it's like a whole different world. For example, I remember at one point a, a parent came and sat down around the Mets and at that time a lot of grant money had been donated to me, this woman who had seen my work and I was getting paid maybe $60 an hour through, through the grant that she had set up. And the parent looked at what I was doing on the mat and said, you get paid for this. Like, what are you doing? You're getting paid to do that.
And I was like, wow. Yes. I said, I'm getting paid. But I would never tell them how much I was being, I, I was just astounded that I could consider doing what I was doing as some value and get paid based on what they were saying. But actually when you're doing it, it's so different than when you're watching it. Once the physical contact happens, so much changes. So I'm not sure with adults because there's not any kind of physical, there's very little physical connection.
- If I heard you correctly, put the intellect aside for a minute. Let the spirit lead through physical, through contact, through movement. - That's what I learned from the kids. It was all very physical. - So Eleanor, if I recall, you said that initially you had a full-time job when your friend invited you and encouraged you and obviously believed in you. At what point did you switch gears away from your full-time job and into this line of work?
- Well, one time I was standing in the middle of the playground at, on this daycare center and something happened to me. I'd never experienced anything like it in my life. It was almost like when they say the earth move under your feet, it felt like something moved and it felt like the earth and everything was moving maybe in my soul or my spirit or my body. And all of a sudden I had these thoughts and it wasn't unpleasant. It was just unusual.
And this thought was, I'll never go back to that job. No, it wasn't. I had a great job. It was more I will always do this. Why would I ever go and work on computers or do these things when I could make this kind of contribution? - And you listened to that voice. - Yeah. I couldn't not listen to it. That was the funny thing. I could not, I wish I'd had more of a choice than I could've said, well, I'll work half time and make money rather than devoting all my time.
- Wow. You're such a beautiful example of what happens when you listen, when you let spirit lead. That is you. Let's end on that beautiful note of, uh, here is a woman that you have just listened to who has surrendered to spirit and as a result had an impact on youth, as a result has allowed youth to impact her and as a result has a life full of purpose and impact. So Eleanor, thank you so much for sharing with us. Thank you for being here today.
And, um, I hope that all you listeners enjoy and feel the inspiration that I feel in this very moment. - Thank you for listening to our podcast. My name is Liza Insi. I'm the CEO and President of Hoffman Institute Foundation. - And I'm Rasi Rossi Hoffman, teacher and founder of the Hoffman Institute Foundation. - Our mission is to provide people greater access to the wisdom and power of love - In themselves, in each other, and in the world. To find out more, please go to hoffman institute.org.