S3 Ep. 2 - "The Benadryl Brownie" with Jon Hayman

You can watch the original episode we'll be discussing in every other episode of HBO's Curby Your Enthusiasm, including the new and final season, on Max. You can also watch the video version of the history of Curby Your Enthusiasm podcast on Max and YouTube, as well. Links available in the episode description. We're here today with John Haymen.

Hello. Hello, is a writer on Curby Your Enthusiasm.

Producer, an resulting producer. I consult, but if you have a problem, you come to me and I consult.

By the way you.

Do, he does great, But for our purposes for season three, he was not a producer.

He was an actor.

He was I was.

I was an actor on two episodes, The Rare Opportunity and by the way, having watched it, you're excellent. Okay, character, No, let's get this straight.

No, shut up at Yale. Stop stop stop.

We'll discuss it when we get to your part.

Okay.

But you were young and handsome and you were good.

See I'm not buying into the young and handsome point.

It was he came on in the street. Oh look at the young John.

No, No, he was young, not gonna say handsome, but he wasn't ugly and also was handsome, and also to me, it's more concerned with how great he did.

Yeah.

Can I just introduce for on season three, episode two, the Benadrue Brownie and you are Jeff Garlin and I am Susie Esmond and you.

Are I know this. I know this John Haymon.

And Jeff is with us wearing a red Sox I mean, I'm sorry, a white Sox cap. Yeah, and a Clippers sweatshirt, which is kind of a mixed metaphor.

I don't know here the white Sox hat. You know, I'm a big Sox fan. I like the Socks. I'm you know, the Cubs fans don't hate the socks.

The socks, we don't when.

They're yelling at each other. I love that.

It's pretty Johnny, you'll agree with me. We don't hate the Mets. No, I like the Mets hate us. Yes, we have no reason.

Verse nationally americanly American. Anyhow, this hat represents for me when I was a big Socks fan, which was the very early seventies, and they had a player named Dick Gallen. It was a player named Bill Milton, don't I remember. You can't call it, by the way, Dick Gallen was a badass, just a badass, and our listeners, I'm sure really curious anyhow the clipper shirt is I'm a I'm a Clippers fanc He's holding the clippers.

By the way. I have to say, yeah, no offense. Although this will offend you. I think that's a violation of wearing two teams. I wouldn't wear a Yankee hatta violation of what of you like I'm wearing a black Hawk's shirt. I'm not going to wear a Yankee hat with it. I mean, what is No, you're showing one thing that.

The way I'm wearing crocs today, I have pants on crops, are you Yeah, I'm went crocs and its basically called I threw on what I wanted to throw on, which was easy because I barely slept last night and I'm happy to be here. Let's move on.

And can I just say that Hayman is wearing sunglasses for two reasons. One he forgot his regular glasses and two it's an homage to our dearly departed friend Richard Belzer.

Oh okay, yeah it's not.

I mean, did he wear glasses all the time?

He was very light sensitive, weren't he and Richard Lewis argue about who invented wore the black because they both wore black all the time. Yea, and I think there was a bone of contentent, you know Lewis And yeah, Lewis thinks everybody steals every time.

I know there's a comedian that he thinks stole his rhythms. But Richard, I think was one of the great originals, that's what he was. I think he saw Belzer and went I'm gonna wear black.

I think that I wasn't taking sides.

I think that they could have thought of it simultaneously.

That you enjoy. All Right, So we started, we start away. There's nothing worse than chit chat. It's like when I listen to Howard Stern and the chit chat, I hate it. I don't get what the program. All right, Susie, why are.

You holding it up unless it's entertaining? Okay?

So we start out the episode at the cell.

Depot, dating, dating, dating, and speaking of dating, Richard Lewis tells Larry.

That he thinks he found his soulmate for the five.

Even then it was a ten thousand season two.

Exactly season three, and Larry's like, is this the one, and Richard starts carrying on about how he loves her soul, her looks, or around.

It gives one key piece of information, one of the only downside I think of this color kin like, huh, it's too blue lashy.

Yeah, she's a Christian scientist, and what it's a Christian scientist is a Christian scientist.

And I'm and it's did you say, oh dear, I don't think you've ever said that in your entire No one.

Ever told me any Christian scientists before, if.

Anything, I ever called for an oh dear Christian scientist.

She's a Christian Christian scientist. And it's not about.

Think of a worse thing for Richard the combo. That's why.

It's just the hypochondriac that he is.

Yeah with you and he'll take whatever it takes, which is the premise of this episode.

Right and Larry. When he says she's a Christian scientist, Larry says, oh, dear.

I love that. I didn't even notice that, because I love when I hear something, I either say oh God or oh my, usually oh my.

Well, well, Richard comments on it.

He says, I never, I've never heard you say oh dear in my life, by the way.

I can't. I've never heard I've never heard him say oh dear, except for this moment. I'm not. I don't think he's just used the word deer referring to an animal or as a word of affection.

I don't think he's never said deer in the headlights, for example. I've actually heard him say oh dear. Oh, yeah, he said it before, okay, but I don't know if he said it before this. And then Larry starts discussing the Christian science issues right with him, like she won't bring him medicine if he needs it.

She doesn't even have a medicine cabinet. Lewis says, you know.

Richard's really funny in this episode.

He's really fine, and he looks amazing. He looks so handsome.

Yeah, he's great.

Not as handsome as the young John.

All right, nothing of that, okay.

And then he gets the phone, the XR seventy one. Richard has the same phone, and these these early cell phones, it's just so funny to see the technology and the whole thing, and it goes out on occasion.

It's the only problem with it.

That's and I think Larry did what we all did back then, very excited about the first call your cell phone, the first call, my first sec these phones, these flip phones. What was before flip phones were those giant walkie talking talking Vietnam looking things, you know, like you're calling in an air strike.

I know, I know, all right.

So Richard then brings up to Larry that he wants him to watch his special, and Larry says, come over to our house for dinner with Deborah, your soulmate.

And then Larry then calls Cheryl to see.

Oh it's working, and rich is going to come over for dinner and call Ted and we'll get Randy, the chef played by young handsome John Hayman, to cater the dinner. And then Richard says, she's allergic to peanuts. She's allergic peanuts, and can Jeff come because you're his manager, obviously, And Larry tells Cheryl she's allergic to peanuts.

On the phone, very in a very serious, very serious tone.

And then you know, Larry says, my friends for a change, because you know, we were talking about this on the car right over here, about your ex girlfriend's friends and Jez, well, we've had so many episodes up until this point where you know immediately it's Cheryl's friends. They're out to dinner, you know Meiyl's friends.

Yeah, And let me add this on the bonus thing. My lovely ex wife Marla, I don't recall ever in twenty five years of marriage, and I'm talking about ever where it was a group of my friends that we had done. Now, not to say we didn't go out for dinner sometimes with my friends, but when she had people over.

Not my friends, always her friends, all nice.

People, but not my friend.

Yeah.

And also as comedians, you know, we're Carnie folk. We understand each other and these were all people who were not Carnie folk. So you and I talk about that all the time. You gotta see so is so funny, and it's usually something we hate. And ye, you know the Morty Gunty isn't fun Well, I go pro Morty Gunty. Are you pro Morty Gunty? That's based on the name. Anything he says. Anything he said I was good. He was Mordy Gunty and the Funny Company or something. No, either way, it's funny.

Mordy Gunty was actually a funny guy.

He was Mordy Gunty for those who don't know, which is almost everybody listening.

I brought it. I brought him up.

Porsch Belt comedian.

He used to work the mountains, the Catskills and why Bell used to write for him.

Yes, I used to write jokes. It's seven bucks a pop.

How long did you go out with Bill Bogs? For?

With Bill?

Oh my god, I'm sored.

Then we're at the dinner part, Yeah, and it's Jeff, Richard Lewis, Deborah, Larry and Cheryl and everybody's having fun and they're enjoying themselves there laughing, and Richard and DEBRAA tell them that they're going to the Emmys, and Deborah had a dress made from Armando in Beverly Hills, and Cheryl is having an Emmy party, and everybody's old jolly, And then Jeff asks for ketchup because he can't eat steak without ketchup.

Right, I actually like ketchup with steak.

A lot of people do, but I have to say, look, I really don't eat steak anymore. An occasional skirt steak. You know, I'm primarily a vegetarian. Primarily, you know, I'll have fish, I'll have meat, chicken. But anyhow, no one gives a shit anyhow. The point being is metch.

And I think you're pretty much not vegetat look it up and an occasional misteak, I.

Said, mostly. I mean I'm not talking about I have meat every fucking week even all right. Anyhow, meat that sucks or is mediocre, you gotta have a whole fucking bottle of ketchup and smother that thing. But if it's a good piece of meat, that's really insulting to.

This very rarely, but I do like a little ketchup with my steak. Sorry, and playing the chef. Larry says, you can't ask a chef for ketchup.

Right, everybody's not agreement. And it is Chicago. Don't ever say you're putting ketchup on your hot dog.

It's a crime a hot dog.

My mother used to do that and drive me nuts to go. What do you do in Chicago? That's like a Chicago joke. You go to any hot dog stand and you ask for ketchup, you're gonna get ship. There's many, many, hundreds, thousands of hot dog stands in Chicago. You gotta get mustard.

Well, I would only get mustard if I would eat.

By the way, I took a friend of mine and his daughter to a Bears game, and the hot dog guy is coming to you know, and his daughter, and everyone heard this as from they live in North Carolina. Can I have some ketchup? And we all started booing her and I stood up, how dare you with my friend's daughter? Where do you get off? And everyone was screaming at her. It was hilarious.

I really used to put ketchup on spaghetti that so she would give.

It was horrible. It was horrible. It was horrible. Those famous spaghetti places. I forget what it's called.

No, no, it's it's a skyline and it's chili, right, ketchup, But they put ketchup in there too, I believe I know it's chili.

It's crazy anyway, So then ketchup is insulting, Larry says, and enter chef Randy, a young handsome John Hayman, and they all say the food is great, the food is great, and so now tell us about Randy, John.

How'd you get the part?

Okay, well, this is now we know you go way back with Larry's far back for the back than we do. And you wrote on Seinfeld, correct, And for how many seasons did you write?

Just one?

Just one? And uh, I just I knew Larry when we were in his apartment, the real apartment Kenny Kramer lived across.

Across the hall when.

Lived in Manhattan Plaza on in the studio apartment.

You would look and exactly, I know it's not a show about Seinfeld obviously, or a podcast about Seinfeld, but when I look back on it, you know, both doors would be open. They lived across from each other, across the hall, and I'd be sitting there with Larry and I usually bring a sandwich from Carnegey or something, watch the Nick game or whatever, and Kenny Kramer would come across in a bathrobe and not even looking at Larry,

We'll be right back, stay tuned, and we're back.

And so anyhow, yes, we go way back and pre Seinfeld, pre everything, and he said, come in for this part and I went, of course, I come in and I'm sitting outside the office, which is where the auditions were they used to be, and Grant Heslov, who is now a quite well known producer and partner of George Clooney, but was an actor originally, is a really good actor who I knew because he had been on Peter Melman's show.

Really I don't believe you were. I sat quietly witnessing the greatness of John.

Hell anyhow, So it's everyone I know. I didn't know Alison, but everyone I know, it's not really like an audition. Didn't cast then she didn't know whoever it was, and so Allison.

Was cast Alson Jones best comedy casting director in Hollywood, and she came on later. She was my first choice.

What season did Chikima? Do you remember for?

Maybe? Okay, you know she's the best there is.

Right, Well, whoever it was was just sitting there, So it wasn't it was Geene Rayburn's daughter, keep going, Oh that's right, said the long microphone. He wondered about that. So it wasn't almost like I was an audition. I mean, I know all these people, and I said before I started, I said, Larry, you got Grant Heslov out there. That does well. So I said, look, you're going to give him the part. He's much better he chef.

Well, I wonder why you got the part.

Well that's the upshot of it. I mean, I kept saying, just hire him. I'll do something else, and he's right there and I know, and Larry Charleston and I both went, yeah, that's it, that's what we want. I didn't even actually audition.

Did you do an improfit all or no?

No?

All I said was, actually, that's not true. I did a little bit of an improv. Larry set behind his desk and I don't know, he said, just argue with me. I go, oh, it's not the most difficult thing in the world. And I think I maybe did it for twenty seconds, and he just cut it off. He went, yeah, yeah, yeah, you got it. I had to go outside and there's Grant waiting to.

Go on, but knowing damn well, he had no chance.

No chance against the young John, a young chance. So then they are going.

Oh, no, I'm sorry. By the way before that scene, I was in another scene that got cut, and it was one I don't know why they even had the scene. It was Cheryl and I in the kitchen, and I think she may have even mentioned, don't put the in the scene. No, she doesn't mention no nuts because Randy doesn't know. I forget what we were doing. But that scene got cut. And also what I remember is Larry. It was Larry Charles first directing job.

No it wasn't. I think it wasn't because he directed season one. No he didn't directed directed Larry. I said to Larry, might have been season two. I said, can we bring Larry Charles on as an executive producer?

Great idea boom, you know?

But he but here, I.

Know he directed. He directed me up.

As aali that I was like, and I also needed somebody a compadre, and he became the.

I thought it was because I remember he.

Thought it was Alison Jones. And you don't know if I was in the room.

Tesla wasn't even the waiting room.

Maybe you're making that ship up.

Yeah, okay, So go to they go to watch the special and Deborah is scarfing down the brownies that Susie made that. Jeff went to pick up Sammy and took the brownies from that. Later, Well, no, you said, you said, I dropped off Sammy and bought the brownies, okay, and she said that the best brownie she's ever had, and she's eating them eating.

Can I direct just for one second because of that scene with the ketchup. I don't know if he was doing it as part of the scene or if he was just doing it, but somehow they were talking about statins, you know, this stuff you take at the table, yeah, for you know, to lower your cholesterol, and Richard is talking about it. Oh, this stuff is great. He goes, look at this, I can eat a thing of butter, and he took a bite of like a slab of butter at the table. I can't believe it wasn't in

I think that had nothing to do with Larry or a conversation. I think he just did it. That's that's Lewis the magician, keep going okay.

So then we there's so many remotes. There's a million, like ten remotes.

And they have this guy Mike who fixes it and he comes in every week to fix it. And Cheryl's like upset that she's got an Emmy party this Sunday and you have to fire Mike.

Larry says, I can't fire Mike. He's black.

And Larry's trying every remote and Cheryl wants one remote.

Oh, by the way, the three women with Cheryl or her actual three friends just you know.

Oh is that true?

Yeah?

Yeah, and the remote's not working. Richard Lewis says, let's play twister, Let's.

Go to my house. And then Dev's like, I don't feel well.

Non is this word that Larry's trying to put in the videotape of Richard Special.

No, they're trying to uh, they're trying to watch It's special. Yeah, they're trying to way, but it's not a tape. It's right, that's for the Emmys.

So then Deborah says she doesn't feel well, and she asked if there's any peanuts in the brownies, you know, any peanuts in the dinner and I told you on the phone, and Cheryl didn't hear it. Then we find out that the call dropped out. Cheryl didn't hear about the peanuts and his dropouts on that prone and Debraah says all she could do is wait it out, and Richard says, can't you take a nap?

And why don't you just drive? Then Richard says, you want to? I don't really fool comfortable driving myself.

She needs you to take her home, you know, I mean, now, all right, we're going.

It's a fucking idiot. How can you do this? She's not, like, yeah, we'll watch it, don't worry.

It's horrible.

I love to play scrabble, I said.

I kind of got in the mood.

Let's get it.

Really you want to play?

I'm all over, absolutely, Okay, you don't need to play.

It's better with two give me milk.

That was fucking well by the way, I'm watching it, and I'm actually kind of angry at his character. And I don't know if he would do that in real life, but it was literally how it affected him was so narcissistic.

Yes, you know that's why she just can't you drive yourself? Take your nap, drive yourself home, and she will not. We we have been rude.

And by the way, for the one time with Larry standing with Ryl and I forget oh and myself, we're all saying go. But Larry is in that moment. It's a rare moment where he's not saying take her home to make his life.

Better, thinking of her.

Yeah, he's like going, this is fucked up.

You know so well.

You could see that she's in distress and she won't take a benadryl. She won't take medication because she's a Christian scientist. Then Jeff and Mike, Mike is the cable fixer guy. They're att O groats and Larry fires Mike, and Mike says, to just be honest.

Man, because I'm black, right right? What we couldn't be crazier? Crazy? Why did I hire you? That was over the phone? Man? You didn't know I was black at the time.

By the way. That's played by Anthony Griffith. Uh huh, a friend of mine, a comedian and actor from Chicago. He was a wonderful stand up I used to see him.

In play, terrific in this also great.

He's a great actor.

All right, there you go, and let's just discuss that because I'm a black issue.

Well, that's a recurring mode theme with Larry, and it's Fascinating's the same dynamic. He doesn't want to appear bigoted in any way, and he's so overly concerned about out it anytime in the show. We're talking about anytime he has any interaction well a person.

Of color, but yeah, it could be anything that he doesn't want them to feel bad that he's using that reason. And by the way, he's never firing anyone for that reason. And he gets called out because everyone thinks it is that reason.

Right. Larry says, I hired you over the phone.

I didn't know you were black, and he blames it on Cheryl, and Mike says that the check comes that Larry's like, well, I got it, I got it.

Mike says, I'll leave the tip.

I'll leave the tip, and Mike is pissed off and he walks out because Larry just fired him for really no cause, as we find out, but he thinks his cause. And Larry sees the tip and he sees that there's not really enough there, and he goes back and he adds a couple of dollars and he sees Wanda is at another table glaring at him.

Yes, and she has a scowl on her face, glat yes, and there will be a price to pay always. By the way, lake Bell was the other end, okay, and that TV show she was. But the thing is someone at home might be going, oh, I want to know, and they might be upset with you, Susie for dismissing me. Keep going.

When we get the mail from our viewers, I will.

I'm sure there's a lot of male coming from viewers handwritten.

So next next week, Larry Western Union. Larry goes to the door, knocks on the door, and a woman answers, and we find out that that's Deborah's mother, and he's at Deborah's mother's house.

She's with her mother.

I cannot remember the actress's name, but I was excited to have her because she was in Peewee's Big Adventure. They were like sitting in the dinosaur looking at the sky and she was really good in the movie.

Yes, so I was really good in this that she's great, And she says to Larry, are you here for the prayer group?

Which we know he's.

Not Diane Salager as Deborah's mother, and Larry says something about, you know, he's sorry about Deborah and Diane Salagart, Deborah's mother says, we're all responsible for our own lives, which is very profound and very true.

Yes, no, we're not. You got to give up control and.

She she then brings ld into the group, but then he gets out, right, he gets out. So Larry goes into Deborah's room and there's a black man there fixing the cable, which is not Mike. It's a different black man, cable fixer. And then Richard and Deborah in the room, and Deborah's like, you know, I'll be fine to go to the Emmy's.

And now we never see her face.

Which is so much better than prosthetics.

Put prosthetics, and we looked at her horror. I mean to use your imagination of how swollen an man case must look. I just right from the get go, I thought, I remember, we didn't show that that was brilliant.

And whose choice was that? Do you remember?

Well, Larry's Larry's okay, oh yeah.

And also we didn't have a good budget back to budget, so the prosthetics would have been expensive.

That's right, DeBras, I'll be fine, and Larry's I'm so sorry about the peanuts, and Deborah is insistent ongoing to the Emmys, and Larry's like, take a bit of a drill, and Debrah says, it's a betrayal of my faith. And he has if the cable guy is any good and the remotes. He goes off on that, and then Larry leaves and he's drawn into the prayer circle.

This is when he's doing the pinkies.

Well, he's not gonna hold hands, and but not only is he doing the pinkies, he's trying to break free with his pinkys.

Right, and Larry is saying, you know, he can't.

Pray for Deborah because he's got bad calma and she'll end up even sicker, which we fold the scene like that yesterday, and of course yes, and of course he joins hands. He ends up with two men, which is, you know, like he tried to make it boy girl, but he ends up with two men her husband, yeah, yeah, and it's so uncomfortable.

And then his phone goes off and what is the ring tone?

I don't go you know for somebody it's Larry's personal life, but he's not really He's proud to be a Jew, but he's so not religious, do you know what I mean? And so but he uses so much Jewish comedy.

Because that's how he was brought up. Even to me, it's a cultural thing.

But I'm saying, he just he does it. It's so beautiful.

Yeah, we'll be right back, stay tuned.

Okay, we're back.

So there the Havanah gill is going off in the middle of the prayer group, the Christian Science prayer group, and then we see Larry and Richard leave, and Richard's like, I'm going to be humiliated. I can't bring it to the Emmys. I'm going to be humiliated. It's all your fault. And if they go into the whole peanut versus the cell phone, and Larry says, I thought you didn't give a shit about how she looks.

Yeah, you love her soul.

You know which, even if Richard did love his soul, her soul, yeah, love herself, why does he want to be seen with you?

And also to go it to the Emmys with her head swollen?

Right?

That so unsettling.

And then they get into at no point do either Larry or Richard show any concern for what this woman is suffering.

It's just all about that.

Jo and they do.

They want her to take the Benadryl and get better.

They can't believe it's just he doesn't look like that.

It's primarily for the Emmys. It's all about that.

Even if she just even if it had nothing to do with the Emmies, they would just be like, take a fucking benadrulle.

It'll knock it right out, and it would. I know, I had an.

Allergy attack the other day.

I was sitting under some tree that I was just and I went home and I took a ben adol and I was fine under some tree in an outdoor cafe. Yeah, and I had an analogy attack. Okay, but she's hell bent ongoing. She won't take the benadryl. Richard says a typical Richard.

No, I know, I know, I know.

Yeah.

No, it would match your head address made of you know, turnips and blood. So they're going to try to like give her a shot. Then they come up with the brilliant idea. She loved those brownies. Put it in a brownie, right, She'd never know And Larry says he's going to get the recipe from Susie Sheryl bake it. Next thing, you know, he knocks on our door, Jeff, and I answered the door with a new character introduced.

Oh yeah, Oscar, Yes, you know, I watched it with Sari last night. She goes, you guys had a dog, Yeah, Oscars many seasons.

Yeah, he was a great dog. That was actually two dogs.

It was Hunter and Rhett with the two dogs that played Nperilla. I don't recall that now, but they were beautiful German shepherds, gorgeous dogs.

And I said that I got Oscar because now that can.

Say I never noticed it was, I swear until right now, I had no idea it was two dogs. I thought it was always one dog because they look exact.

Oh that's hilarious, like nine lassies or something like that.

Yeah, somebody, well they have to it's a door.

By the way. They had numerous gentle bends.

Bart the bear who's in this cocaine bear thing. Now there's a bear called I think it's Bart, who's been in every single thing that that involves a real live bear for the last fifteen years. Oh he must be rich by now. Oh, he's loaded.

It's loaded. If you did about a bear.

It's what this movie is based on about. In real life, in nineteen eighty five, a drug plane crashed and a bear found this like ton of cocaine that the movie is based on, right, and I had a joke about it.

I remember that in the old days, I catch a rizing store.

Okay, So Larry comes to our house and I answered the phone looking quite young as well.

I have to no.

I turned to Sari and she read. I said, God, doesn't Susie look beautiful? And I told sariy I go. I was friends with their fifteen years earlier. She was gorgeous, thank you to yeah, but less and less gorgeous over the years. And now I'm fucking with you. Keep going You're so beautiful.

But you know what can I say?

I love you? I tell you yesterday how pretty you look?

Thank you?

But the one thing about TV and you have to admit, you see yourself twenty five years ago and it's like.

You we were young.

Hold on for yet, even young Sarah has a complete disconnect watching me because I am so heavy and what's the word cherubically? I had an angel you a cherubic flip face. Yeah, and when I watch it, I get sad. She watches it, she.

Looks get sad because you think about how sad it must have been that you were that.

That, you know, I remember how I felt, and I feel bad for that guy. Yeah, I feel so bad for that guy. And if that guy only knew the ridiculously horrible things that were on their way. I'm wonderful things, yes, of course, But I'm saying in terms of my health, it's been a festival of shit. I mean, by the way, if you're listening watching whatever, I'm very healthy and I never had cancer. I'm not remits like I'm very healthy. But the amount of times I've been punched in the

That was actually after the stroke. Yeah, that was post stroke. I had a stroke. We've talked about it. Yeah, another bing bang boom. The only one that I'm not strokey is the hour Pilot per Se. That's that's pre stroke. It was shortly that's nineteen ninety nine. Two, yeah, ninety nine.

Okay.

So he comes to a house and I'm like, what are you doing? You don't call and then he tells me about the brownies. And then Jeff stole the brownies from his child's mouth, which bar the wayman and stole his little girl's brownies, and.

You're just there's no thing to calm you at this point. Now it just is building and building to where you're screaming at each other, which is we just filmed some of that yesterday, and by the way, yesterday.

We weren't really screaming though Brownie yesterday.

Yesterday. No, it's just like its own art form, its own thing. Yesterday. I thought that was the best argument you've ever had with Larry, Oh, I said to Jeff Shaeffer. I go, I think this is Susie and Larry at their best in terms of arguing. And Jeff Shaeffer said, yeah, I think. So he walked away, and at the end of the day he goes it was he goes, I.

Think I thought it was a little too hot.

Okay, but in this scene he says, well, it's a testament to the brownies.

You know, he's buttering me up. In that way that he likes to do, which never really works.

No, no, forget, it never really works.

It doesn't.

Here are the two things. He will say things to you that you feel good about. Oh, really like he'll compliment you whatever, but that last three seconds three second, yes, but you do react post.

Then he asked me for the recipe and I tell him I can't give it. It's a secret family recipe. And he says, well, I'm known for keeping a secret, which we know is bullshit. And then he tells me that he said, I'll tell.

You, by the way in real life, by the way, he's one of the best people. He is the best.

He's a very good secret keeper in.

Terms of my friends. He is number one on the.

Secret that he is. I love it when he when he does stuff like that, and he goes, I'm known for and it's some obscure it's trade, you know, I'm known for being on time, and then goes Ask anyone. They will tell you that Larry David is always on time. It's no matter what the thing is. If he's in an argument, he's known for whatever the thing is.

By the way, can I say I don't recall him ever being late, you know, for anything? Yeah, some for work.

So he decides to tell me a secret to gain my trust.

A delicious sun and he tells me, I'll tell you a secret.

How about that nobody knows, not even Cheryl. Well, if he'd like to tell me, I might. I might be losing a testicle. Yeah, it's not definite. The point is I'm telling you. I'm sharing something with you because I trust you, just the way I know you could trust me.

Larry, I cannot give you the recume.

No, I can't.

I can't.

My grandmother okay, makes you rest in peace and trusted that brownie recipe to me, And you're asking me to break a sacred confidence.

It's not a Manhattan project, you know. It's just a little recipe.

Go get a mix or something. You're asking too much, You ask way too much. I can't ask her.

Con I just told you I'm going to lose a ball.

Which, by the way, early on we saw where he's desperate to have Cheryl not go but he's trying to hold her to like have sex with her.

What episode is that? Oh that was the massage.

Massage And then he tells her he has a lump, he has to say, where he just goes, I have a lump. I have a lump. You don't want to go when I have a lump. And so here Ray go right to the things be.

Losing your testicle, and I find that very interesting.

But he's asking me to break a sacred confidence and I can't.

Well, by the way, here's the thing about it. Get a mix, yes, But the point being is when he presents his case the way you're acting, you think you're gonna give him the recipe, and then when we get to you, you just go off on at your grandma's recipe. He has getting it, which makes it funnier because you.

Think because he says, I just told you I'm going to lose a ball, and I'm like.

I don't give a shit.

You make it.

Ask me to break a sacred confidence. Go get a mix. And then we cut to Larry and Cheryl and Richard and they're begging Cheryl to put the benadryll in the brownie mix.

And Cheryl, she plays this great.

Cheryl says, you don't.

Want to take her and Richard says, I wanted to get better, which is, you know, bullshit.

But Bobby, Cheryl does the perfect amount of pushing.

That's right, yeah, perfect, like it's her.

Her performance on the show is so subtle and perfect.

And Jeff and I have said in the past, she's really the only person that could do this with Larry right with one word.

When she's fed up, she says, all right.

All right, yeah.

The other day and I said to her, how many times have you said that?

All right, another actress, Michael, that's enough?

But she said, and by the way, playing against all these insane that's bo's perfect, She's completely perfect. All right, went over this.

No, don't you know anything about tampering? Huh do you know anything about tampering? Well, you can't do that because the brownie will fall apart.

And she says, well, why don't you bacon? I don't know how to bacon?

What was tampering? What was his meaning of tampering?

Well, because he's putting the he's tampering, she's saying the benefit.

She knows nothing of tampering. I didn't pick it up.

Doesn't good? Doesn't Lewis? I think it's Lewis. Maybe it's Larry appeal to her because it's a humanitarian.

They both do.

And Richard says, my heart is breaking for her big head, and Cheryl's reluctant, and.

Oh, he says something about it. It's a carnival.

She looks like a carnival show. And Cheryl gives in, and Larry says, can you bake?

She's never done it up until then, which, by the way, Larry David, that would never be a qualification that someone could cook or bake. I can't see that being on his list. I gotta find a woman that cooks and bakes now.

And then they go back to Deborah's mother's house with the brownies Richard and Larry, and Larry says, my wife got the recipe, and Deborah takes a bite. They're not the same because they they're the mix and they're just not as good, and she's like, adamant, they are definitely not the same.

Brain but forget the same brownies. They had to have tasted good. She is adamant that she's not going to eat them. So the guys are do.

You think she's suspicious at all?

No?

No, she really doesn't like them.

She really doesn't like the other one who.

Says they are horrible.

Give them back you no, I know, But Larry says, here I'll leave them, and she sayes, what do you want me to do? And she actually hands them back to him.

Yeah, she was disgusted by the Brownies and then she saw something then there. Well, then she says, what time are you picking me up tomorrow for the Emmys? And then we see Cheryl on the sofa with her three friends and Wanda the three people. You said, I'm not that one to sell her friend, but Wanda was a hired actress at that point, a hired friend, a hired friend.

Business I saw you yesterday at the coffee shop? Business?

The business with the black guy?

You fix the tip?

What happened ship? You don't know?

Larry's a Larry's a tip profiler, fixed the black mask tip?

What are you trying to get the NAACP.

I know.

It wasn't a racial thing.

Why you do the tip? But then watch your tiptoe behind his back. It becomes a whole causal love between them. And then Larry storms out in the huff I fired him, and she's watch you fire the black man. Arrys like, oh, the black man can't do anything wrong, can't get fired, can't get fired. And then Wanda gets up and turns on the satellite on the TV exactly and that was all that was wrong with it the whole time. And then we see Joan, which was a little startling to me.

Stuff, I love Joan Rivers so much. Yeah, and by the way, what I loved her as a person. She's just so nice. And I actually did her show. She had a podcast with a video podcast of in Bed with Joan Rivers and it's actually in her room. You get in bed, wow, and you enter from her, which is really funny. And then we had the best conversation.

She just as lovely, you know John.

As we've been doing this show now we're on season three, it's like we're this is from you know, two thousand and one, two three, and people keep coming up who are dead.

You know, And it's like it's startling to us. I think it's so. There was Joan and.

She's talking about Chelsey Grammar and she calls.

It, oh, Richard Lewis, and she calls over Richard.

Richard.

Yeah, And she calls over Richard and she's Chelsey.

Gramma, ladies and gentlemen, one of the.

Rights of our community.

Oh my god, there's Richard Lewis.

Richard, don't we Richard Richard, come out.

Swear, just get it's so good to say, Oh my god, I've seen better faces on a hemorrhoid.

When he called home, did you pick up the phone? How are things a love nest?

And there we go.

That's the end, the end of the end.

No, I mean, and by the way, very unusual for it to end on Richard Lewis and or any of us, for us to be the end of the show. I remember doing one thing once that it was the end of the show. I don't remember what that was, but that's rare. It usually ends on Larry Ye.

Where was that film, the Joan Rivers thing?

Oh, it was a parking lot. It was a parking lot near the beach. It was a parking lot literally right by the ocean. It was actually it was one of those parking lots.

That's off probably by over there because we filmed there before.

Yes, but but south of Casta del Mar and one of the parking lots over there, and we set up all around it. That looked good. Yeah.

I was wondering though, because it's obviously cut off, like and I guess what we did that scene? Now with one of those theaters in Westwood, we probably would have done it. You don't like a real movie theater. I don't know if you were there. Were you there to make it look like an Awards?

I love how I'm giving you a look and you keep selling it to me.

Well, that's why I keep telling it, because he.

Went, Jeffrey, are you there that day?

What's the Joan Rivers? Actually I had to have been because I know where we filmed.

Okay, so those must have been her lines. Oh, they're typically right lines.

And by the way, I'm sure she improvised those lines in the moment.

Yeah, they're very Joe, very very We're done here. We're done here, Johnny, thank you so much.

But for this episode what was you?

Thank them both episodes. Yes, all right, John for this episode. Your effort up until now delightful. Well, thank you for can an effort be delightful? Hey? Can I come back ya hoop? On next week We're going to be back with more with Jihan Hayman. Please tune in.

You could come every week as far as I'm concerned.

We love you so please all right.

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